R 22	Rhodes 22

Anchoring from the cockpit

I will still be anchoring from the bow. When I am done I will have a line, about 25+ feet long, that runs from the bow cleat through the chocks, down through the bow eye, then back up through the chock backwards and finally leading back (outside the shrouds) to either the aft rail or the aft cleat where it will be tied off. I'll call this the "anchor painter" for lack of a better word.

I will also have a second line with a snatch block on one end, this will be my "control" line for the anchor, it will also be about 25 feet long. When I want to deploy the anchor, I will snap the control line snatch block onto the painter and attach the anchor rode (in 75 ft. lengths) to an eye on the end of the painter. Pitch the anchor over the side and when the anchor snugs up, just let the control line out until the snatch block is out in front of the bow eye. Then cleat off the control line to the aft cleat.

When I'm ready to retrieve, all I have to do is pull the control line w/snatch block back until the painter is back to the cockpit again and I can retrieve my anchor, also from the cockpit. I figure in an emergency situation, I can just deploy the anchor directly and cleat off at the aft cleat to get the boat stopped and worry about getting her bow to wind/waves after the emergency is past if I still want to be anchored.

This setup will also give me a choice of whether I want to have the bow facing straight into the wind/waves or have it off to one side. This may be nice on days when wind and waves are not from the same direction. I can accomplish this by not letting the snatch block all the way to the front.

I will be able to chose any position from straight off the bow to almost all the way back to the aft quarter. When doing this the painter and the control line will form a v-shape off to the side of the boat and the anchor line will extend from the V at an angle that should roughly bi-sect the v angle.

Any of this make sense????

Rik

#1) How the Anchor Painter (for lack of a better word) looks when on the road. It is led aft to the clam cleat (pic #4) and secured.

#2) How I rig it at the ramp. It is led from the bow cleat to the starboard chock, through the bow eye and back up the port chock and aft to the clam cleat (pic #4) and secured.

#3) Please bear in mind that EVERYTHING now takes place in the cockpit of my boat. NOTHING is done up by the bow. When I get ready to deploy my anchor painter, I bend on the snatch block shown. Then I tie the anchor painter to my anchor rode, which is stored in the cockpit locker. Anchor goes over the side and starts paying out. Line on the end of pic #3 snatch block needs to be secured. Hey! I know! There's a Perfectly Good clam cleat (pic #4) on the side of the boat by the stern that I can secure that line to!

#4) See?

#5) Pic showing how the line goes from the bow cleat to the starboard chock and through the bow eye.

#6) What if I want to retrieve my anchor rode? What if I want to bend on another 100 feet or so? Well, WITHOUT LEAVING THE COCKPIT! I simply grab onto that line sitting in that clam cleat and 25 feet later, there is my anchor painter bent on to my anchor rode, ready to either be retrieved or modified.

What ELSE can I do with that handy snatch block and line? Well, if the current is running strong Out There and the boat is trying to "sail" up the rode on it's freeboard, I can pull in a little to effectively "heave-to". Or, I can pull it way in and anchor the boat 90º to the rode when fishing, so that EVERYONE has an equal chance to fish along the length of the boat.

To respond to specific concerns:

"It could complicate things to a point where it reduces your options; and if there is one thing I don't like to do in a hard chance, it's reduce my options." I agree. I feel this lets me do whatever I want to without going forward. If you've ever been in 4-6 foot seas in an 18 foot boat (jacklines and harnesses, or not!), you can appreciate anything that eliminates the need for the trip forward.
"I can see us letting out more scope with the rode running down through the bow eye from the cleat, but I cna't see hauling it in without a high friction load adding to the weight of anchor and entrained mud, seaweed, etc." Your observation is true, but since the anchor rode is tied on past the anchor painter no friction is involved in letting out more scope. I let my scope out in 100 foot increments by bending on more rode. I use scope calculations, to determine HOW MANY rodes to bend on!
"To reach down over the bow in order to grab the rode below the bow eye is quite a stretch on my boat. As it is, Gayle is willing and able to handle our anchor. If the idea of reaching down over the bow doesn't appeal to me, then I'm certainly not going to ask her to do it." Again, I agree with that statement, but with my system, I NEVER GO FORWARD IN THE FIRST PLACE! I deal with the bow only at the ramp, when I'm rigging to go out, and when I'm rigging to go home.
"I just don't want to have to reach WWAAAAAYYYYY down there every time I want to fool with my anchor." I couldn't agree more, hence the system I devised. I don't, and I don't think anyone else should, either!
"From your post it sounds like your bow eye is built strong and is intergrated into the bow. I guess something like that would take a better pounding than a run of the mill bow eye. Mine is a single bolt, relitivly new (I broke the one that came with the boat) mine is backed with a section of treated 4X4 with the edges trimmed to fit in the V."OK, that scares me to death. I could not imagine having a single bolt boat bow eye. I would keep running off the road, from checking the rear view mirror so much! If you get up and down bouncing while trailering, two things are liable to happen; neither of them good. 1) The bolt will wear up and down until it has sawed a pretty good slot in your bow, or 2) The bolt will stay rigid until the bow eye fatigues off and breaks. I would strongly recommend you replace that sucker with a stainless steel U-bolt.
"Your anchoring lines sounds interesting I may need to play with the idea. Short of somekind of windlass I have yet to devise a good way of retrieving and anchor in storm conditions other than using the bow pulpit and waves to get the line cinched up." My method certainly may not be to everyone's liking but it DOES keep me off the bow, a major PLUS, when offshore!
"I have a 22' so it is not far to go forward but less trips forward the better, Chafing gear in the bow eye would be a concern. The rubber hose is the usuall fix for most of us along with a few other odds & ends. For a short duration storm situation you may be right the hose may hold up before wearing thru. I may be overkill but what happens if the hose fails before the storm abates."OK, you'll notice from the pics that I show no abrasion gear at all. This is because my last anchor painter was used to extricate my son-in-law's truck from the sand and we tore it up getting him un-stuck! I have not had a chance to put abrasion resistance on the new one. I have used two types over the past 25 years: Garden hose and a braided nylon chafe guard. The hose does not really wear that much but is greatly affected by UV from our south Florida sun, and falls apart just sitting in the driveway.The braided nylon chafe guard holds up very well, but tends to get mildewed during rainy season. I have a replacement chafe guard that I have not gotten around to installing just yet.
"With a line thru the bow eye you will get abraision on all sides of the line. Most bow chocks only impact the line on one side. I am not trying to say you are wrong but rather to understand (I just might learn something)." Theoretically true, but my experience over a few decades is, that I get more wear where the line goes from the bow chock to the bow eye, than I get at the bow eye itself.
"Most bow winches never take the full weight of the boat, unless you have somekind of rollers. Usually you are floating the boat on the trailer so some of the weight of the boat is still supported by water. Also from what I see (no engineer) the pull is more horizontal than vertical" The operative word here is MOST! I once watched in horror as my boat was dangling from the bow eye at a hoist being run by an idiot who let the back straps slip off. No harm whatever to the boat, as I found out when my heart started beating again and I got aboard to check it out. That happened in 1980, IIRC.
"The anchor rode should not be connected directly to bow eye." OK, but I sure do LIKE my system of anchoring! Ya mean I been doing it wrong, for 25 years now? Amazing, I keep making it back to shore, without all the expert TSBBers to show me the error of my ways! Actually, my anchor rode ISN'T connected directly to the bow eye. It's still attached to the bow cleat. The bow eye could possibly be thought of as a waterline fair lead, if you will. Another interesting point with this method: Anchored in 8 feet of water with a 7:1 scope, how much line is needed? 56 feet? Not if your bow cleat, is 4 feet above the water line! You now require 84 feet of rode. (8 feet plus 4 feet times 7.) Snubbing down lower by the waterline, either increases your scope, or reduces your line length requirements for a given depth. I never sweat the small stuff, though. I run it out in 100 foot lengths.
"A snubber (used to reduce the shock on the rode) may be connected to the bow eye and rode, but when fully stretched, the majority of the load should still be on the the normal rode cleating method and not the bow eye. The snubber is only there to help reduce the shock, not to take the full load." Actually, I used to tie a snubber between the anchor painter and the anchor rode, but found out that my guests who were prone to motion sickness, simply HATED it! That slight give on the end of the dips would set them off, in a way that did not occur with the bang-bang-bang of an unsnubbed line. I could never tell the difference myself, of what they were talking about, but I am not inclined to argue with someone who "ralphs" all over the boat one weekend, and is fine the next weekend in similar conditions. When the rubber oxidized, I simply failed to replace it. I found that a double-braided painter 25 foot long, provided just enough shock absorption to keep my guests happy, and not make me nuts, from mentally calculating the shock force loads, with every wave.
"While some bow eyes may be able to take substantial load, I have seen many boats that have had the bow eye pulled out, (even when just used to winch the boat onto the trailer)." Yeah, me too. That's why I looked for a U-bolt arrangement, in the first place, when I bought the boat. Keen observers will notice that in pic #2, the line goes from the bow eye up to the port chock and then is led aft along the toe-rail. Since it is going BACKWARDS through the chock compared to the normal angle (bow cleat to chock), it pops right off, when I deploy from the cockpit.

OK, Charles, so how do you get it back up there, when you're done for the day and headed for home? Easy. I don't. I just pull the painter as tight as I can and secure it in the clam cleat. The line is going from the bow eye down the side of the boat until it reaches the cleat near the cockpit. When I get back to the ramp, then I rig it as shown in pic #1, for the trip home.

Boy! Am I glad I didn't raise something COMPLICATED, like using my anchor ball to retrieve my anchor! (ALSO without once leaving the cockpit!)

Hope this clarifies, Charles Brennan

"My question to though is, how are you attaching the actual anchor rode to the line you call the "painter"??? I hope I have gotten this right and the "painter" is the line going up through the bow eye, chock and up to the bow cleat." My anchor rode is ordinary ½-inch tri-laid nylon with an eyesplice in the end of it. I tie an ordinary bow-line from the anchor painter to the eye-splice of the anchor rode.
"Also, how far do you normally (in reasonably calm conditions) let out the aft control line? Do you like the boat turned off the wind a little or do you find it better to just let the aft line go all the way slack?" I normally leave the aft line slack, so the boat heads into the current or the wind, whichever is having the greatest effect. I only have to cock it over a little when the current and the wind are at odds. I also bring it up snug a little if we're fishing, since somebody INVARIABLY will snag it, otherwise!
"Just wish those snatch blocks weren't so gosh darn expensive." I have a couple snatch blocks that I use for everything such as anchoring the boat on a trolley arrangement, when I am beach camping and need the boat off the beach to clear the tides at night and still be able to pull it back to the beach the next morning without swimming out to the boat. (Which would REALLY confuse everybody!). But there is no reason why you couldn't use an ordinary block to put over the painter. In fact, I only use the block so that I can use my 20 foot stern lines for more than one function. If you want to avoid the blocks all together, simply use a 50 foot line (25 feet to get to the front of the boat, and another 25 feet to get to where the 25 foot anchor painter tied to the anchor rode, has paid out) for the aft control line. Tie a bow-line on that line to the anchor rode eyesplice, as well.

The real key to the whole thing, is simply a painter led aft previously, and a clam cleat to keep it fast for road travel and for keeping the painter, then keeping the control line at hand, in the cockpit. You could even use your stern cleat, if you wanted to. Don't really need a whole lot of high-tech stuff, just a little line and a little forethought.

Hope this clarifies, Charles Brennan

I will also have a second line with a snatch block on one end, this will be my "control" line for the anchor, it will also be about 25 feet long. When I want to deploy the anchor, I will snap the control line snatch block onto the painter and attach the anchor rode (in 75 ft. lengths) to an eye on the end of the painter. Pitch the anchor over the side and when the anchor snugs up, just let the control line out until the snatch block is out in front of the bow eye. Then cleat off the control line to the aft cleat. When I'm ready to retrieve, all I have to do is pull the control line w/snatch block back until the painter is back to the cockpit again and I can retrieve my anchor, also from the cockpit. I figure in an emergency situation, I can just deploy the anchor directly and cleat off at the aft cleat to get the boat stopped and worry about getting her bow to wind/waves after the emergency is past if I still want to be anchored.

This setup will also give me a choice of whether I want to have the bow facing straight into the wind/waves or have it off to one side. This may be nice on days when wind and waves are not from the same direction. I can accomplish this by not letting the snatch block all the way to the front. I will be able to chose any position from straight off the bow to almost all the way back to the aft quarter. When doing this the painter and the control line will form a v-shape off to the side of the boat and the anchor line will extend from the V at an angle that should roughly bi-sect the v angle.

Rik

The anchor rode setup you're contemplating sounds like it'll work ok, and it sounds like CB uses it regularly. But you might find it to be overly complicated for your needs. CB's boat is quite a bit smaller than a Rhodes, and the foredeck doesn't have much room at all. Walking around on the foredeck on an 18' boat will cause the boat to bob around quite a bit. I'm pretty familiar with his stomping grounds down there; I lived in Miami for about 5 years in the early 80's. He frequently anchors in pretty treacherous conditions. Around coral reefs in the open ocean, in cuts between barrier islands with fast tidal currents, etc. IMHO it's the size of his boat and these conditions that he anchors in that make the system desirable for him. Just something to ponder while the water's softening up!

Brian

It would seem that you are making a "bridle" out of the anchor painter, which would work as long as you plan to deploy from the same side of the boat each time you anchor. I can see how a snatch block with a control line would work much the same as people rig a snatch block onto the jib sheet to pull the jib in when beating to windward. As I see it, you would need two anchor painters, one for each side, but the concept sounds like a good plan. Some people accomplish the same thing by using an anchor snubbing line attached to the regular anchor rhode. your plan would allow you to do that from the cockpit. I just don't get the part about running the anchor painter through the bow eye and then up thru the chock "backwards". I don't know if I am not following your train of thought or not.

Another thought comes to mind that your plan has the advantage of allowing the use of any type anchor. We have a danforth type anchor hanging from the bow pulpit. The "backup" anchor is a Delta plow which cannot easily be hung off the bow without major modifications to add a self launching bow roller and making provisions to attach the jib/forestay to the deck over the bow roller. This has been done, and it works well from what I was told, but there is a very real cost for the bow roller and misc. parts in the neighborhood of $300.

This does make sense, but I need clarification on the bow anchor painter setup.

Alex

Rik I am not sure I like what I am seeing.

1) That 1/2 double brad will not sketch right for the boat, it to strong. The rode needs to absorb the varying load otherwise all the force will be transferred to the anchor breakings it hold in low winds than it should. Not Good. This is one case that heavier is not better. 3/8 3 strand works the best on the boat,
2)May be in your area you have nice clean bottoms with no rock, gravel, "junk", coral or the Sharpe stuff, but around me you need chain. 6 feet minimum with most people using about 1 foot for each LOA, the anchor bury themselves so the beginning of the rode gets allot of abuse, along with the part that get dragged around the bottom as wind/tide shift. the idea is the is their enough chain so the pull of the boat lifts the chain/rope splice off the bottom. Also the weight of the chain pull dampen the force on the anchor(as it weight is lifted it absorbers it) and to keep the pull horizontal(the finial angle will becloser to horizontal due to it weight, that does break down in high winds but not completly, that strech thing from above)
3)I think you have a chaff problem with that bow eye, remember the line will be moving in wind/wave even that short distance, plus you have a number of falurial points in the rig that I would loose sleep over, I would trust a simple bow cleat, chooks with chaff gruad much better.
4) For what it is worth, I simply keep the anchor under the seats and a second in the lasserret, when I anchor I simple overshoot the spot, weight for the wind to start to push me off (want the rode out of the prop)and drop the anchor from the cockpit playing out the chain/rope. I then take the rope forward and cleat it off. Now in high wind I will go forward with it.........

MJM

I will probably keep all the rodes in a milk crate or something similar that can breath well, under the seat. That way, any water that comes in with the anchor rode will be able to drain through the cockpit drain. Don't want a bunch of wet stuff in the lazerrette to sponge up after all the time.

I sent some pics and a bunch of text to Mark K. and he posted it on his site. Unfortunately I am now at work and the address for this is at home, so I can't tell you what it is right at the minute.

When I deploy the anchor, it will be from the starboard side. Right now, the anchor is in a hanger on the starboard aft rail. The "painter" will be attached to the fore deck cleat, then go through the port toe rail chock, down through the bow eye and finally up through the starboard chock and back to the cockpit on the starboard side. Since the painter on the starboard side is going through the chock "backwards", when I let the rode go out, it will just "peel" the painter out of the chock since it will be pulling at the chock from the wrong side and it will be free to extend out in front of the boat. The chock will hold the painter up out of the way well enough while it is not in use though.

I also have two anchors a 13# Danforth and a 17# Bulwagga, the Bulwagga being intended for more serious situations. I have the same storage challenge as you, maybe worse. I would like to keep the Bulwagga up on the fore deck out of the way and the extra weight up there would be better, but it kind of goes against the whole idea of being able to anchor from the cockpit. Don't know for sure what I'll do with that yet.

Rik

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