[Rhodes22-list] Toad's WHOLE story as if anybody cares
David Rasberry
rhodes22-list@rhodes22.org
Wed, 4 Sep 2002 19:40:58 -0400
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Todd,
>From your posts you seem to be an intelligent, good humored, and generally
well intentioned person. Yes the regulars who hang out on this list do goof
around a bit. Part of what makes it an interesting community. Personally I
think you will (eventually) fit in well with this bunch of miscreants,
especially since you own a Rhodes, and hopefully will have sailing stories
and practical solutions of your own to contribute. If you hang out much on
other sailboat forums or mailing lists, you will find that this one is
unusual in its enthusiasm for this particular boat and respect for the
exceptional efforts the Spitzers put forth to build a good product and
please their customers. Sometimes it may seem like we treat newbies like the
New Guinea tribe where visitors must suffer being whacked with bamboo sticks
by the women and children before they are socially accepted. It is a sort of
defense against the occasional newbie who really doesn't respect the boat or
the community that supports it and only comes to stir up trouble.
That said, the beatings will continue until morale improves. :o)
Razz
-----Original Message-----
From: rhodes22-list-admin@rhodes22.org
[mailto:rhodes22-list-admin@rhodes22.org]On Behalf Of Toad the Wet Sprocket
Sent: Wednesday, September 04, 2002 9:10 AM
To: rhodes22-list@rhodes22.org
Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Toad's WHOLE story as if anybody cares
What started with a post I made out if frustration about the secret
handshake and infomercial I admitted was premature and out of line and
offered an apology. Sort of a handshake to say I was sorry. It was made
with no malicious intent but some have mistook it as such. I am not
trying to start a peeing match. I thought this banter was just goofing
around. So to all who may have taken offense and to all of the fine people
of the list, I apologize again.
From: "Michael Meltzer"
Reply-To: rhodes22-list@rhodes22.org
To:
Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Toad's WHOLE story as if anybody cares
Date: Wed, 4 Sep 2002 03:20:46 -0400
I see you figured out you been had :-),
You seem to be a fan of straight talk or "I call them as I see them", it
my turn for that.
The list has a collative history:
1)The only people who matter on the list are the posters, In particular
the who one answer the questions, the luckers(lowest life form), the ones
who only answer off list(a little higher) the ones who only here to answer
their questions(a littler higher) then at the top of the food chain are the
people here day in and day out. extra credit for built up a history of doing
so. The list would not be here if it was not for them.
2)We are in the USA(some Canada) and have a right to free association,
which also includes execution, Just because some body breathes, has the
money to buy a computer and was able to connect to the internet does not
mean we have to deal with them or have them on the list. It is a privilege
not a right. we are all volunteers, unpaid to be here. We are also not
General Boat, their repair force or sales force, even though we care deeply
about them.
3)Sailors are a social group, they have to be, You sail from place to
place counting on the kindness of strangers, it can be a real challenge to
find a shower, something to eat or parts to fix your boat in a strange
place, many time you go out of your way to help people you know you never
see again. You never take a payment for any of it even knowing the rules of
salvage mean you might own that boat for the help you gave.
4)because we a social we try to keep the tone light, tell jokes, tell
story about the family, arrange get to get-together and be friends. We also
try to stay away from pissing contest or "flamewars" with each other, in the
end their are always hurt feeling and people leave the group, Allot of
people will think ahead to how their post will be responded to and will hold
off if they think it will be a problem or turn it into a joke, I.e. let is
slide.
5)We sometime get "strange" people here, I think it something about
sailboats that attracts "loners". It a sport that they think they need no
one else and is "cool". The are aloof, paranoid, hostile, overbearing,
conspiracy theory and just not people you want to spend the day with.
Now for you. Right now you are TFNG(The F**king New Guy). it is ok we all
have to start somewhere, people are glad to help, it is assumed that you
will help others in the future, but you are not at the top of the pecking
order now(see #1). "what ever you want to call the last set of post over
that last few days"straight talk", "like I see them", "the last word", "top
dog", whatever, the net effect has been creating a hostel atmosphere(see
#4), the executes does not matter, it happened. The post to rummy and ed
could have only lead to a pissing contest(again see #4 and #1, I know I
defussed it with my post).
Now remember #5, you are showing some signs, like a simple question "where
do you live" and this is not a conspiracy again you not buying a boat from
gb or that it is a older boat.
Now the choice is yours, you are a big boy.
1)You can blow this off with "Who The F*** does this Meltzer guy think he
is" or igore it, it a common reaction, Expert option/prediction the group
will demand your remove when a pissing contest breaks out. Remember you not
the first one.
2)Realize That I might have better things to do right now(like sleep),
Maybe he think is really the joke/or the way I communicate that's causing
the fiction, might be trying to help, And must think that you might be a ok
guy otherwise why did he bother. My hope is you have the self realization
that once you know the problem your be able to correct/adjust for it.
BTW is has only pissed you off or your feel the need to debate this with
me, Spare us both and just sign off, I am who I am, The list is what it is,
And believe it or not I am being gentle and patient here. Thier have been
other who I have not tryied to help so hard and built the repuation for
simply blowing them out of the water.
MJM
----- Original Message -----
From: Toad the Wet Sprocket
To: rhodes22-list@rhodes22.org
Sent: Tuesday, September 03, 2002 11:25 PM
Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Toad's WHOLE story as if anybody cares
Furthermore, recent troubling developments prompt me to revisit a subject
I've discussed in the past: MJM and his plan to spew forth ignorance and
prejudice. Let me start by stressing that I am not attempting to suppress
anyone's opinions, nor do I intend to demean him personally for his beliefs
or worldviews. But I do think that I must comment on a phenomenon that has
and will continue to create a mudslinging world of guilt and shame. Despite
the obvious (which is something he chooses to ignore) he is eager to shrink
the so-called marketplace of ideas down to convenience- store size. There is
something inherently wrong with a man who wants, more than anything else, to
force us to do things or take stands against our will, pure and simple.
Cannibalism has its stronghold among the worst sorts of impudent
obstinate-types I've ever seen. And I can say that with a clear conscience,
because one of his favorite tricks is to create a problem and then to offer
the solution . Naturally, it's always his solutions that grant him the
freedom to hammer a few more nails into the coffin of freedom of speech,
never the original problem. A real fight against directionless separatism
can be undertaken only if a basic change in social conditions makes it
possible to do something about the continuing -- make that the escalating --
effort on MJM's part to let advanced verbal weaponry fall into the hands of
a few predatory, raandy wimps on the list. Here, too, the exception proves
the rule: The baneful nature of MJM's shell games is not just a rumor. It is
a fact to which I can testify.
I don't mean to scare you, but I am entirely shocked and angered by MJM's
loud, amoral improprieties. Such shameful conduct should never be repeated.
Although I agree with those who feel that MJM will go to almost any extreme
to prevent my message of truth from getting out, nevertheless, I cannot
agree with the subject matter and attitude that is woven into every one of
his intrusive utterances. He likes thinking thoughts that aren't burdensome
and that feel good. That's why some of the facts I'm about to present may
seem shocking. This they certainly are. However, he has been trying for some
time to convince people that we should all bear the brunt of his actions.
Don't believe his hype! MJM has just been offering that line as a means to
sanctify his depravity. The bulk of mindless, soulless smut peddlers are at
least marginally tolerable, but not MJM. Maybe quicker than you can
double-check the spelling of "sphygmomanometric", he will shred the basic
compact betw een the people and the list.. Discourteous predictions aside,
this would not be an impossible scenario if his obscene jibes were to gain
ascendancy in our society. Let me leave you with one last thought: The truth
is not meant to be warm and fuzzy.
Long enough?
Please respond to sprocket80@hotmail.com
From: "Toad the Wet Sprocket"
Reply-To: rhodes22-list@rhodes22.org
To: rhodes22-list@rhodes22.org
Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Toad's WHOLE story as if anybody cares
Date: Tue, 03 Sep 2002 21:45:54 -0400
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<DIV><SPAN class=3D770341022-04092002><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =
size=3D2>Todd,</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D770341022-04092002><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =
size=3D2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D770341022-04092002><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =
size=3D2>From=20
your posts you seem to be an intelligent, good humored, and generally =
well=20
intentioned person. Yes the regulars who hang out on this =
list do=20
goof around a bit. Part of what makes it an interesting community. =
Personally I=20
think you will (eventually) fit in well with this bunch of miscreants,=20
especially since you own a Rhodes, and hopefully will have sailing=20
stories and practical solutions of your own to contribute. If =
you hang=20
out much on other sailboat forums or mailing lists, you will find that =
this one=20
is unusual in its enthusiasm for this particular boat and =
respect for=20
the exceptional efforts the Spitzers put forth to build a good product =
and=20
please their customers. Sometimes it may seem like we treat newbies like =
the New=20
Guinea tribe where visitors must suffer being whacked with bamboo sticks =
by the=20
women and children before they are socially accepted. It is a sort of =
defense=20
against the occasional newbie who really doesn't respect the boat or the =
community that supports it and only comes to stir up=20
trouble. </FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D770341022-04092002><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =
size=3D2>That=20
said, the beatings will continue until morale improves. =
:o)</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D770341022-04092002><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =
size=3D2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D770341022-04092002><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =
size=3D2>Razz</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D770341022-04092002></SPAN><FONT face=3DTahoma=20
size=3D2>-----Original Message-----<BR><B>From:</B>=20
rhodes22-list-admin@rhodes22.org =
[mailto:rhodes22-list-admin@rhodes22.org]<B>On=20
Behalf Of </B>Toad the Wet Sprocket<BR><B>Sent:</B> Wednesday, September =
04,=20
2002 9:10 AM<BR><B>To:</B> rhodes22-list@rhodes22.org<BR><B>Subject:</B> =
Re:=20
[Rhodes22-list] Toad's WHOLE story as if anybody =
cares<BR><BR></DIV></FONT>
<BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV>
<DIV>
<P> What started with a post I made out if frustration about the =
secret=20
handshake and infomercial I admitted was premature and out of line and =
offered=20
an apology. Sort of a handshake to say I was sorry. It was =
made=20
with no malicious intent but some have mistook it as such. =
I=20
am not trying to start a peeing match. I thought =
this banter=20
was just goofing around. So to all who may have taken offense =
and to all=20
of the fine people of the list, I apologize again.</P>
<P> </P>
<P> </P></DIV>From: "Michael Meltzer" <MJM@MICHAELMELTZER.COM>
<DIV></DIV>Reply-To: rhodes22-list@rhodes22.org=20
<DIV></DIV>To: <RHODES22-LIST@RHODES22.ORG>
<DIV></DIV>Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Toad's WHOLE story as if =
anybody cares=20
<DIV></DIV>Date: Wed, 4 Sep 2002 03:20:46 -0400=20
<DIV></DIV>
<DIV></DIV>I see you figured out you been had :-),=20
<DIV></DIV>
<DIV></DIV>You seem to be a fan of straight talk or "I call them as I =
see=20
them", it my turn for that.=20
<DIV></DIV>
<DIV></DIV>The list has a collative history:=20
<DIV></DIV>1)The only people who matter on the list are the posters, =
In=20
particular the who one answer the questions, the luckers(lowest life =
form),=20
the ones who only answer off list(a little higher) the ones who only =
here to=20
answer their questions(a littler higher) then at the top of the food =
chain are=20
the people here day in and day out. extra credit for built up a =
history of=20
doing so. The list would not be here if it was not for them.=20
<DIV></DIV>2)We are in the USA(some Canada) and have a right to free=20
association, which also includes execution, Just because some body =
breathes,=20
has the money to buy a computer and was able to connect to the =
internet does=20
not mean we have to deal with them or have them on the list. It is a =
privilege=20
not a right. we are all volunteers, unpaid to be here. We are also not =
General=20
Boat, their repair force or sales force, even though we care deeply =
about=20
them.=20
<DIV></DIV>3)Sailors are a social group, they have to be, You sail =
from place=20
to place counting on the kindness of strangers, it can be a real =
challenge to=20
find a shower, something to eat or parts to fix your boat in a strange =
place,=20
many time you go out of your way to help people you know you never see =
again.=20
You never take a payment for any of it even knowing the rules of =
salvage mean=20
you might own that boat for the help you gave.=20
<DIV></DIV>4)because we a social we try to keep the tone light, tell =
jokes,=20
tell story about the family, arrange get to get-together and be =
friends. We=20
also try to stay away from pissing contest or "flamewars" with each =
other, in=20
the end their are always hurt feeling and people leave the group, =
Allot of=20
people will think ahead to how their post will be responded to and =
will hold=20
off if they think it will be a problem or turn it into a joke, I.e. =
let is=20
slide.=20
<DIV></DIV>5)We sometime get "strange" people here, I think it =
something about=20
sailboats that attracts "loners". It a sport that they think they need =
no one=20
else and is "cool". The are aloof, paranoid, hostile, overbearing, =
conspiracy=20
theory and just not people you want to spend the day with.=20
<DIV></DIV>
<DIV></DIV>Now for you. Right now you are TFNG(The F**king New Guy). =
it is ok=20
we all have to start somewhere, people are glad to help, it is assumed =
that=20
you will help others in the future, but you are not at the top of the =
pecking=20
order now(see #1). "what ever you want to call the last set of post =
over that=20
last few days"straight talk", "like I see them", "the last word", "top =
dog",=20
whatever, the net effect has been creating a hostel atmosphere(see =
#4), the=20
executes does not matter, it happened. The post to rummy and ed could =
have=20
only lead to a pissing contest(again see #4 and #1, I know I defussed =
it with=20
my post).=20
<DIV></DIV>Now remember #5, you are showing some signs, like a simple =
question=20
"where do you live" and this is not a conspiracy again you not buying =
a boat=20
from gb or that it is a older boat.=20
<DIV></DIV>
<DIV></DIV>
<DIV></DIV>Now the choice is yours, you are a big boy.=20
<DIV></DIV>1)You can blow this off with "Who The F*** does this =
Meltzer guy=20
think he is" or igore it, it a common reaction, Expert =
option/prediction the=20
group will demand your remove when a pissing contest breaks out. =
Remember you=20
not the first one.=20
<DIV></DIV>2)Realize That I might have better things to do right =
now(like=20
sleep), Maybe he think is really the joke/or the way I communicate =
that's=20
causing the fiction, might be trying to help, And must think that you =
might be=20
a ok guy otherwise why did he bother. My hope is you have the self =
realization=20
that once you know the problem your be able to correct/adjust for it.=20
<DIV></DIV>
<DIV></DIV>BTW is has only pissed you off or your feel the need to =
debate this=20
with me, Spare us both and just sign off, I am who I am, The list is =
what it=20
is, And believe it or not I am being gentle and patient here. Thier =
have been=20
other who I have not tryied to help so hard and built the repuation =
for simply=20
blowing them out of the water.=20
<DIV></DIV>
<DIV></DIV>MJM=20
<DIV></DIV>
<DIV></DIV>
<DIV></DIV>
<DIV></DIV>
<DIV></DIV>
<DIV></DIV>----- Original Message -----=20
<DIV></DIV>From: Toad the Wet Sprocket=20
<DIV></DIV>To: rhodes22-list@rhodes22.org=20
<DIV></DIV>Sent: Tuesday, September 03, 2002 11:25 PM=20
<DIV></DIV>Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Toad's WHOLE story as if =
anybody cares=20
<DIV></DIV>
<DIV></DIV>
<DIV></DIV>Furthermore, recent troubling developments prompt me to =
revisit a=20
subject I've discussed in the past: MJM and his plan to spew forth =
ignorance=20
and prejudice. Let me start by stressing that I am not attempting to =
suppress=20
anyone's opinions, nor do I intend to demean him personally for his =
beliefs or=20
worldviews. But I do think that I must comment on a phenomenon that =
has and=20
will continue to create a mudslinging world of guilt and shame. =
Despite the=20
obvious (which is something he chooses to ignore) he is eager to =
shrink the=20
so-called marketplace of ideas down to convenience- store size. There =
is=20
something inherently wrong with a man who wants, more than anything =
else, to=20
force us to do things or take stands against our will, pure and =
simple.=20
Cannibalism has its stronghold among the worst sorts of impudent=20
obstinate-types I've ever seen. And I can say that with a clear =
conscience,=20
because one of his favorite tricks is to create a problem and then to =
offer=20
the solution . Naturally, it's always his solutions that grant him the =
freedom=20
to hammer a few more nails into the coffin of freedom of speech, never =
the=20
original problem. A real fight against directionless separatism can be =
undertaken only if a basic change in social conditions makes it =
possible to do=20
something about the continuing -- make that the escalating -- effort =
on MJM's=20
part to let advanced verbal weaponry fall into the hands of a few =
predatory,=20
raandy wimps on the list. Here, too, the exception proves the rule: =
The=20
baneful nature of MJM's shell games is not just a rumor. It is a fact =
to which=20
I can testify.=20
<DIV></DIV>
<DIV></DIV>I don't mean to scare you, but I am entirely shocked and =
angered by=20
MJM's loud, amoral improprieties. Such shameful conduct should never =
be=20
repeated. Although I agree with those who feel that MJM will go to =
almost any=20
extreme to prevent my message of truth from getting out, nevertheless, =
I=20
cannot agree with the subject matter and attitude that is woven into =
every one=20
of his intrusive utterances. He likes thinking thoughts that aren't =
burdensome=20
and that feel good. That's why some of the facts I'm about to present =
may seem=20
shocking. This they certainly are. However, he has been trying for =
some time=20
to convince people that we should all bear the brunt of his actions. =
Don't=20
believe his hype! MJM has just been offering that line as a means to =
sanctify=20
his depravity. The bulk of mindless, soulless smut peddlers are at =
least=20
marginally tolerable, but not MJM. Maybe quicker than you can =
double-check the=20
spelling of "sphygmomanometric", he will shred the basic compact betw =
een the=20
people and the list.. Discourteous predictions aside, this would not =
be an=20
impossible scenario if his obscene jibes were to gain ascendancy in =
our=20
society. Let me leave you with one last thought: The truth is not =
meant to be=20
warm and fuzzy.=20
<DIV></DIV>
<DIV></DIV>
<DIV></DIV>
<DIV></DIV>
<DIV></DIV>Long enough?=20
<DIV></DIV>
<DIV></DIV>
<DIV></DIV>Please respond to sprocket80@hotmail.com=20
<DIV></DIV>
<DIV></DIV>From: "Toad the Wet Sprocket"=20
<DIV></DIV>Reply-To: rhodes22-list@rhodes22.org=20
<DIV></DIV>To: rhodes22-list@rhodes22.org=20
<DIV></DIV>Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Toad's WHOLE story as if =
anybody cares=20
<DIV></DIV>Date: Tue, 03 Sep 2002 21:45:54 -0400=20
<DIV></DIV>
<DIV></DIV>
=
<DIV></DIV>--------------------------------------------------------------=
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<DIV></DIV>Join the world's largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. =
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Join the world’s largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. <A=20
href=3D"http://g.msn.com/1HM1ENUS/c157??PI=3D44364">Click=20
Here</A><BR>_______________________________________ Subscribers, send =
mail to=20
this address Rhodes22-list@rhodes22.org To change your options or =
unsubscribe=20
from the list click on this link=20
http://www.rhodes22.org/mailman/listinfo/rhodes22-list Check out our =
FAQ pages=20
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