[Rhodes22-list] Whisker Pole Questions

Mon Apr 28 15:51:34 EDT 2003

Thanks for the Great sailing lesson.

Bob
S/V knot Necessary

>>> cen09402 at centurytel.net 04/28/03 01:21PM >>>
Bob,

Those are not dumb questions at all.  Let's take them one at a time:

Clip the outboard end of the whisker pole onto the sheet or the clew of the
sail?

Sailors run into the same question with spinnaker poles.  Personally, I like
to clip the fitting onto the sheet.  It's a safety issue.  Whisker &
spinnaker pole end fittings have been known to jam & sieze up under load or
due to corrosion.  With the pole clipped onto the sheet, the sheet can be
released & the pole will slide away from the sail, thus allowing the sail to
be safely furled or dropped without unclipping the pole.  But, if the pole
is clipped onto the clew of the sail & the fitting cannot be released; now,
you've got a potential problem!  It won't make any difference if the sheet
is released because the pole will be holding the sail in powered-up mode.

How high should the pole be set?

The pole height on the mast should always be set such that the pole is level
with the clew of the sail.  Check out the following photo link:

http://www.rhodes22.org/rhodes/pics/spinnaker.jpg 

This picture shows Dynamic Equilibrium on a light air close reach while
flying a tri-radial spinnaker.  Note how the spinnaker pole is level.  The
principle is the same with a genoa & a whisker pole.  In the above photo,
note the use of the spinnaker pole topping lift to take the weight of the
pole off the sail.  In light air, the topping lift makes the difference
between being able to get useful thrust from the sail & having it collapse
under its own weight.  Thus, the best setup for the inboard end of the
whisker or spinnaker pole is to have a track on the front of the mast:

http://www.rhodes22.org/rhodes/pics/spintrack.jpg 

I don't recommend it, but if you are going to go with a fixed fitting on the
mast; then, it should be mounted just above the height of the lifelines.

Where does the pole go?  In front of the shrouds?  Between the shrouds?  How
long should the pole be?

All of the above!  Seriously, depending upon the point of sail, wind
strength, sea state, and % of genoa furled out; the whisker pole needs to be
set in a wide variety of positions & overall lengths.  That's why they make
adjustable length whisker poles.  The best guide I can give you is to always
keep in mind what the whisker pole is for.  The purpose of the whisker pole
is allow the headsail to maintain the desirable aerodynamic sailshape
despite shifty winds, insufficient wind velocity, poor helmsmanship, &/or
the boat wallowing around due to wave action.  Thus, imagine where you want
the clew of the headsail to be & what sailshape you want & then adjust the
length & position of the whisker pole to make it so.  Keep in mind that on
any point of sail more downwind than a beam reach, sails change their mode
of operation from behaving sort of like an airfoil to behaving more like a
parachute.

Hope this explanation helps, Bob.  Good luck!

Roger Pihlaja
S/V Dynamic Equilibrium

----- Original Message -----
From: "Robert Dilk" <Robert.Dilk at TRW.COM>
To: <r22yankeeclipper at hotmail.com>; <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
Sent: Monday, April 28, 2003 9:00 AM
Subject: RE: [Rhodes22-list] Lloyd don't duck for cover yet

> Dumb question time.
> To pole out the Genoa, do you clip the out board end onto the sheet or the
sail?
> Were do you place the pole? In front of the shrouds, between the shrouds?
> How high on the mast is the ring for the inboard end of the pole?
>
>
> thanks much.
>
> Bob
> S/V Knot Necessary
>
> >>> r22yankeeclipper at hotmail.com 04/27/03 12:29PM >>>
> The best thing about the downwind sail home was that, despite Rummy's
> objections, I rigged a preventer and then used the new whisker pole for
the
> genoa and pulled up the CB and it was a great, relaxing wing-on-wing sail
> all the way back (about 8-10 miles).  Hit some good speeds, but am a
little
> foggy on exactly what they were...
> Bob K
> 'Yankee Clipper'
>
>
>
>
>
>
> >From: "John Tonjes" <johntonjes at earthlink.net>
> >Reply-To: johntonjes at earthlink.net,The Rhodes 22 mail list
> ><rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
> >To: "kroposki at innova.net, The Rhodes 22 mail list"
> ><rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
> >Subject: RE: [Rhodes22-list] Lloyd don't duck for cover yet
> >Date: Sat, 26 Apr 2003 20:00:32 -0400
> >
> >Lloyd,
> >You know nothing on this list ever gets personal. Captain Bob and I were
> >already three sheets to the wind when we ran across Ed and Admiral
heading
> >for their birth at the marina. We simply stopped to use the facilities
and
> >shoot the breeze and went about our way. It was a great day, but the
winds
> >were sporadic and we were grateful to have wind behind us all the way
home
> >listening to a little Jimmy to make the mood. We arrived back at Bob's
> >cottage  just as the sun set and the temps cooled down. Looking forward
to
> >another great day tomorrow.
> >
> >Rummy
> >
> >
> > > [Original Message]
> > > From: Kroposki <kroposki at innova.net>
> > > To: The Rhodes 22 mail list <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
> > > Date: 4/26/2003 5:39:33 PM
> > > Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Lloyd don't duck for cover yet
> > >
> > > Lloyd,
> > > Rummy and shipmate just left me at the dock.  You have not made
> > > any enemies here.  Just the south end of the lake sniping at the north
> > > end.  Now if we could get some other rhodies on the lake we would be
> > > doing something.
> > > Ed K
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > >
> > > From: rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org 
> > > [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf Of lcrowther
> > > Sent: Saturday, April 26, 2003 12:38 PM
> > > To: The Rhodes 22 mail list
> > > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Leaving the dock under sail
> > >
> > > This is an unusual exchange of messages that seems to be becoming a
> > > little
> > > personal so I thought I would muddy the waters a little bit more.
> > >
> > > Rummy - How do you know Ed K. was sitting on the dock and not sailing
> > > somewhere in the vicinity?
> > >
> > > Ed - Did you ever hear the saying 'different strokes for different
> > > folks'?
> > > What did you hope to prove other than one definition of gratuitous ?
> > >
> > > There, now I've made two enemies for life!
> > >
> > > Lloyd
> > > s/v Uhuru II
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "John Tonjes" <johntonjes at earthlink.net>
> > > To: "kroposki at innova.net, The Rhodes 22 mail list"
> > > <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
> > > Sent: Saturday, April 26, 2003 9:39 AM
> > > Subject: RE: [Rhodes22-list] Leaving the dock under sail
> > >
> > >
> > > > Ed,
> > > > Those two list members were trying to get home before the sun set.
We
> > > > motored out until we were able to go downwind, wing on wing.....all
> > > the
> > > way
> > > > home. We even had enough free time to finish a wonderful bottle of
> > > rum.
> > > > Let's see if I got this right.....we were out sailing, and you were
> > > sitting
> > > > on the dock. Which is more fun?
> > > >
> > > > Rummy.......some people just gotta have fun. :)
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > > [Original Message]
> > > > > From: Kroposki <kroposki at innova.net>
> > > > > To: The Rhodes 22 mail list <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
> > > > > Date: 4/26/2003 3:18:39 AM
> > > > > Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Leaving the dock under sail
> > > > >
> > > > > Russ,
> > > > > I used to like to depart and dock under sail.  I got a lot of
> > > > > hooraws, and comments like you don't know if your motor works. Now
> > > just
> > > > > to be sure the motor works, I leave the dock under motor.
However,
> > > I
> > > > > still tack out under sail once I clear the docks, unless I am
facing
> > > a
> > > > > stiff west wind.  It wasn't too long ago that I watched a Rhode22
> > > with
> > > > > two of our illustrious list members on board motor way out instead
> > > of
> > > > > tacking their way out.  I thought a sailboat was to be sailed.
> > > Sounds
> > > > > like Will is correct.
> > > > >
> > > > > Ed K
> > > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > > From: rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org 
> > > > > [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf Of Russell
> > > Miller
> > > > > Sent: Friday, April 25, 2003 4:36 PM
> > > > > To: The Rhodes 22 mail list
> > > > > Subject: Re: [ham] Re: [Rhodes22-list] Rock Hall & Rhodes
> > > Rhendezvous
> > > > >
> > > > > JUst returned home from St. Pete, FL where Will attened the
Colgate
> > > > > Sailing
> > > > > School; this week.  Now he is too smart for us "old" folks,  likes
> > > to
> > > > > depsart & return to the dock under sail alone, no motor, wise
a--!!!
> > > > > Any
> > > > > how MJM you are welcome eorher or both with us.  We will be going
> > > across
> > > > > the
> > > > > bay from Rocky Point to Rock Hall Sat AM along with the others
from
> > > the
> > > > > Western side.
> > > > >
> > > > > Russ
> > > > >
> > > > > s/v Bulldog----- Original Message -----
> > > > > From: "Michael Meltzer" <mjm at michaelmeltzer.com>
> > > > > To: "The Rhodes 22 mail list" <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
> > > > > Sent: Friday, April 18, 2003 11:14 PM
> > > > > Subject: Re: [ham] Re: [Rhodes22-list] Rock Hall & Rhodes
> > > Rhendezvous
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > > sorry it took so long to get back to you, had to check with the
> > > > > family, it
> > > > > looking like my sister wants to do some over Memorial
> > > > > > Day weekend, that will put use either in Bethany, de or Potomac
Md
> > > > > close
> > > > > enough for get-together(and some coverage on baby-sitting),
> > > > > > figuring I had one mooring/afternoon or evening on Saturday or
> > > Sunday,
> > > > > what would the group recommend.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > MJM
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > > > From: "Mary Lou Troy" <mltroy at netreach.net>
> > > > > > To: "The Rhodes 22 mail list" <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
> > > > > > Sent: Friday, April 18, 2003 5:55 PM
> > > > > > Subject: [ham] Re: [Rhodes22-list] Rock Hall & Rhodes
Rhendezvous
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > Alice (and everyone else within range of Rock Hall),
> > > > > > > Don't forget the 2nd annual Upper Chesapeake Rhodes
Rhendezvous
> > > > > Memorial
> > > > > > > Day weekend. Rock Hall is a day's sail from anywhere from St.
> > > > > Michael's
> > > > > or
> > > > > > > the Rhode River to Havre de Grace or the Sassafras. There are
> > > good
> > > > > ramps
> > > > > > > nearby and trailer storage can be arranged. There are nice
B&Bs
> > > and
> > > > > couple
> > > > > > > of Mom & Pop motels in town. there is additional info on the
web
> > > > > about
> > > > > Rock
> > > > > > > hall at http://www.rockhallmd.com 
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Plans are to anchor out Sat. night and take a marina slip (or
> > > > > mooring)
> > > > > Sun.
> > > > > > > night. The anchorages and the marina are close enough that
> > > > > participants
> > > > > > > could choose slips both night or anchor out both nights and
> > > still be
> > > > > close
> > > > > > > by. Other plans are still up in the air so now is a good time
to
> > > > > make
> > > > > your
> > > > > > > preferences known. Potential dinghy race entrants should be
> > > > > forewarned
> > > > > that
> > > > > > > we now have new oars for the dinghy and expect it to be (not
> > > much
> > > > > of) a
> > > > > > > contender.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Alice, You can see a map of Kent County on the web at
> > > > > > > http://www.kentcounty.com/driving/Tour%20Map.htm 
> > > > > > > Rock Hall is about 10 - 12 miles from Chestertown. Of course
> > > it's
> > > > > not
> > > > > that
> > > > > > > far from Kent Island by water. We often get down near Love
Point
> > > > > Light
> > > > > on
> > > > > > > afternoon daysails.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Mary Lou
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > At 04:36 PM 4/18/2003 -0400, you wrote:
> > > > > > > >Gil, the map is great and full of great ideas in the making!
I
> > > > > think I
> > > > > have
> > > > > > > >one of Kent and can see how far you are.
> > > > > > > >I had planned to call the boat "Sweet Solitude" and probably
> > > still
> > > > > might,
> > > > > > > >however, "Wonderland" has also entered the competition.  The
> > > former
> > > > > still
> > > > > > > >makes me think of that beautiful feeling when the world is
> > > quiet,
> > > > > the
> > > > > wind is
> > > > > > > >running through your hair, the boat is sailing well, you
taste
> > > of
> > > > > salt,
> > > > > the
> > > > > > > >sun is shining, and everything is good on God's earth.
> > > > > > > >Yep, think I'll keep that choice (as I'm off daydreaming of
the
> > > > > water).
> > > > > > > >Alice
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > __________________________________________________
> > > > > Use Rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org, Help? www.rhodes22.org/list 
> > > > >
> > > > > __________________________________________________
> > > > > Use Rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org, Help? www.rhodes22.org/list 
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > __________________________________________________
> > > > Use Rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org, Help? www.rhodes22.org/list 
> > >
> > >
> > > __________________________________________________
> > > Use Rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org, Help? www.rhodes22.org/list 
> > >
> > > __________________________________________________
> > > Use Rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org, Help? www.rhodes22.org/list 
> >
> >
> >__________________________________________________
> >Use Rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org, Help? www.rhodes22.org/list r C
>
>
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