[Rhodes22-list] Combination Of Sharp Turn To Port + SingleHan dedDocking

[Keyes, David]

Thanks, again!  Your answers are always excellent.  You have been
unbelievably helpful and instructive, with great experience.

Once I get my motor operative (with some solution to getting a motor handle)
and some repairs finished--this is a good time also to haul the boat and
check and probably repaint the bottom--I will let you know how some of this
works for me.  Clearly, the procedures other than dock lines call for
practice out in open waters.  Otherwise, the prospect is daunting of briskly
heading down the "alley" between the two lines of docked boats and getting
to the turning point at, say, 3 knots, with the rocks about two or three
boat lengths ahead and not many "second chances" if I find myself coming
straight at something in front having turned to port into the wrong place or
swinging the stern wide into the opposite line of boats while attempting a
sharp swing with the motor in reverse at full lock position opposite the
tiller direction.  Perhaps instead of going down the alley 2/3 to 3/4 of the
way over towards the dock to starboard, to create a wider area for the port
turn, I will come in right down the middle or no more than 2/3 of the way
over towards the boats that will be at my stern during the port turn.  I'll
get a better idea for this in practice.

Speaking of approaching the turn at about three knots (or some other rate of
speed to make the turn successful using your technique), in light weather I
have found that the idle speed on the Yamaha 9.9 is too fast for simply
going down the alley between the long lines of boats and turning 90 degrees
to port (not having learned about your technique).  So what I have been
doing where wind is not a factor or is coming from a favorable direction
(given the absence of currents), is (once in the alley between the boats)
putting the motor at forward idle for a moment, then coasting in neutral
until the boat is going so slowly that it is about to lose its forward
momentum entirely with the loss of steering control, and then re-engaging
the motor at forward idle momentarily, and so on, until I am very, very
slowly approaching the slip and going through the turn.  A short engagement
of the motor at forward idle in the middle of the turn might help to
complete it; rarely is reverse called for, but sometimes.  Usually, I am
able to stop the boat right in the slip without bumping into anything in
these easy conditions--but sometimes the results are okay but not great.  So
I will also practice to see if your suggested method is also helpful in easy
weather conditions, or whether it is primarily a tool for the challenging
conditions we have been talking about.  In any event, using your single dock
line technique may be helpful irrespective of motor and steering techniques.

David Keyes

-----Original Message-----
From: Roger Pihlaja [mailto:cen09402@centurytel.net]
Sent: Monday, January 13, 2003 10:12 AM
To: The Rhodes 22 mail list
Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Combination Of Sharp Turn To Port +
SingleHandedDocking


David,

You're very welcome!  I've added my responses to your questions down below
in the text of your document.

Roger Pihlaja
S/V Dynamic Equilibrium

----- Original Message -----
From: "David Keyes" <dkeyes@houston.rr.com>
To: "The Rhodes 22 mail list" <rhodes22-list@rhodes22.org>
Sent: Monday, January 13, 2003 9:48 AM
Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Combination Of Sharp Turn To Port +
SingleHandedDocking


> Thanks, Roger.  That was a great answer.  There was a lot in there that I
> didn't know.  I have printed your explanation and will keep it for
reference
> and as a reminder.  (I ought to paste it inside the cover of my college
> physics book! :))
>
> In your last paragraph, you say (in regard to making a tight turn to port
in
> limited space with brisk wind astern):
>
> > But, if we put the engine into reverse, turn it to full lock in the
> opposite
> > direction, & now apply full throttle; everything is different.  With
> reverse
> > thrust, the port offset engine location is tending to assist a port
turn.
> > Full reverse throttle will tend to slow the boat down, not speed it up.
> So,
> > you get up a good velocity before starting the turn, use the reverse
> engine
> > thrust to spin you around + burn off your speed.  With a little
practice,
> > you will find you can pull a sharp 90 deg turn to port  . . .
>
> Is this what you were referring to in an earlier email when you
recommended
> de-linking the motor and tiller, pushing the boat tiller hard to starboard
> (for a port turn) and putting the motor in reverse with its tiller hard to
> port (i.e., the opposite direction)? (This would be after verifying that
the
> rudder, all the way down, will not hit the prop of the motor.)

This is exactly correct!

>
> If the previous paragraph is correct, then I will have to think about how
to
> do this with Stan's Yamaha 9.9 linked motor arrangement.  The motor can
> easily be de-linked, but the motor does not have its own handle for
steering
> and forcing it over with one's hand on top of the cowl seems awkward and
> unsafe.

As you can probably tell by now, I'm not a big proponent of GBI's linked
rudder/motor arrangement.  It tends to limit the skipper's ability to use
the motor & rudder to their individual best advantages.  As you can see from
the situation we have been discussing, syncronized rudder & motor movement
is not always the right answer.  It usually is, but not always, & the
exceptions to the rule can be fairly critical situations.

You are quite correct in that you need a good handle on the motor in this
situation.  You need to be able to turn the motor smartly over not only at
the beginning of the turn, but also at the end of the turn.  This is because
you may need the motor in the normal position for minor maneuvering as you
move toward & into your slip after the turn.  Perhaps your Yamaha dealer
could supply you with the pieces/parts to put the motor tiller back into
place?  You wouldn't need all the pieces/parts for the throttle twist grip,
the throttle U-joint at the base of the tiller, kill switch, etc - just the
basic tiller arm casting.  So, it probably wouldn't be too expensive.
Another possibility would be to build your own motor tiller.  Possibly a
simple piece of wood could be thru-bolted to the top of the motor cowling to
serve as a tiller?

>
> What do you think of the other recent suggestions on the list to (i) keep
> the rudder horizontal (above the motor prop) during the docking maneuver
and

Your R-22 may be set up differently than Dynamic Equilibrium.  But, my
rudder blade will interfere with the prop at full lock if the rudder blade
is fully raised.

In light air, I can scull the boat forward slowly with the raised rudder
blade & tiller.  I can even turn reasonably well in either direction.
However, I find the feel of the helm gets very heavy & sluggish while
motoring with the rudder blade raised.  I doubt it would work very well in
the heavy air situation we have been discussing.  But, by all means, go out
& experiment for yourself on your own boat.

WARNING: Never try to back up with the rudder blade raised.  The forces
which will be put on the rudder blade will cause it slam over to one side or
the other.  Even if you are holding onto the tiller, the forces could rip it
right out of your hand!  This could damage the grudgeons & pintles, the
rudder head, transom, & tiller.  You could also slam the rudder blade over
into the prop, thus damaging both.

> (ii) keep the board down?

Here's a reprint of the answer I gave to Saroj on Friday, January 10, 2003,
@ 10:25 AM re this subject:

The boat always turns around the hull's Center of Lateral Resistance (CR for
short).  The CR on an R-22 is located on the boat's centerline usually just
slightly aft of the mast.  So yes, in effect, the boat seems to pivot on its
centerboard!

I've never experimented with the effect of having the centerboard up vs.
down while doing this manuever.  In the crowded confines where such a
manuever is usually necessary, I've always had the centerboard up.  However,
if the water were sufficiently deep to permit the centerboard to be left
down, I suspect the boat would turn even faster because the increased deep
draft wetted surface area would prevent side slippage while permitting
rotation.  Having the centerboard down would probably cause the boat to heel
more during the turn, thus heightening the excitment of the moment.

As long as the boat doesn't heel so much during the turn that the prop is
lifted near the surface of the water & cavitates, having the centerboard
down should assist with either a port or starboard turn.

I also warned Saroj to kneel on the cockpit seat & hang onto something.  Are
you starting to get a feel for how fast the boat can turn to port during
this maneuver?


I can see how a horizontal rudder (as long as
> water chop doesn't have the rudder out of the water) would give more
> steering torque.  As to the board down, I would have thought that this
would
> be an extra force for the rudder/motor to have to contend with, but maybe
> instead the board acts as a pivot to make turning easier.
>
> David Keyes
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Roger Pihlaja" <cen09402@centurytel.net>
> To: "The Rhodes 22 mail list" <rhodes22-list@rhodes22.org>
> Sent: Monday, January 13, 2003 7:44 AM
> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Combination Of Sharp Turn To Port + Single
> HandedDocking
>
>
> > David,
> >
> > I pasted your questions in below & added my comments:
> >
> > "Interestingly, much larger sailboats in the larger slips opposite me
(the
> > ones I back toward as I back out of my slip) seem to have no problem, at
> > least when I seen them come and go on normal days.  One skipper with two
> > small sons repeatedly brings his 35-foot sailboat to a dead stop
centered
> in
> > his slip with no lines whatsoever.  The only differences I can see are:"
> >
> > "(i)they are headed towards a larger opening"
> >
> > The degree of difficulty (DoD) of entering a given slip can be thought
of
> in
> > terms of the ratio of the
> > slip width/max boat beam.  If your slip is only 10' wide & your R-22 has
> an
> > 8' beam; then, your
> > DoD = 10/8 = 1.25   That 35' LOA sailboat probably has a 12' beam.  If
his
> > slip is 50% wider than yours,
> > or 15'; then your friend faces a challenge of: DoD = 15/12 = 1.25 or
> > proportionately the same as you.  On the Great Lakes, where boats tend
to
> be
> > larger, slips in recreational marinas are rarely more than 20' wide.  I
> know
> > this max slip dimension from sailing on my friend's 42' sailing
catamaran,
> > which has a 23' beam - we anchor out a lot.  But, on a small inland lake
> > like yours, a 15' wide slip wouldn't surprise me, especially if the rest
> of
> > the marina is laid out small & cramped as per your description.
> >
> > "(ii) they are turning to starboard, if that makes any difference--is
that
> > what people talk about when they refer
> > to a right-hand prop?"
> >
> > Prop side thrust or "prop walk" is caused because the prop is operating
in
> > water that is less dense on the top of the prop vs. the bottom of the
prop
> > because of the weight of the water above the prop. A right handed prop
has
> > the blades arranged such that; when viewed from astern, the prop rotates
> > clockwise when generating forward thrust.  The density difference of the
> > water across the vertical diameter of the prop causes a side thrust to
be
> > created.  In the case of a right handed prop, this side thrust is
directed
> > to starboard.  A side thrust to starboard at the stern of the boat
causes
> > the stern of the boat to be pushed to starboard.  Pushing the stern to
> > starboard causes the boat to rotate about its CR in a counterclockwise
> > direction - in other words it turns to port.  Large diameter, slow
turning
> > props tend to produce proportionately more side thrust vs. small
diameter,
> > fast turning props.  For a left handed prop, all of the above arguments
> are
> > reversed.  In reverse gear, the right handed prop turns
counterclockwise,
> > the stern of the boat is pushed to port, & the boat tends to turn to
> > starboard.
> >
> > "(iii) their prop is inboard and at the centerline of their boat, giving
> > better steering control."
> >
> > On an R-22, having the prop mounted to port of the boat's centerline
> > generates a torque about the CR in forward gear that tends to rotate the
> > boat in a clockwise direction.  In other words, in forward gear, the
port
> > offset location of the prop tends to make the boat turn to starboard.
In
> > reverse gear, the offset thrust tends to make the boat turn to port.
Note
> > that this has nothing to do with whether the prop is right handed or
left
> > handed.  This phenomenon is simply a side-effect of mounting the prop
off
> > the boat's centerline.
> >
> > So why is it so hard to turn sharply to port with a strong wind from
> astern?
> > Well, the hull presents much less surface area to the wind when it is
> > oriented stern-on vs. side-on to the wind.  So, energy is required to
turn
> > the hull from stern to the wind around to side to the wind.  Energy is
> also
> > required to hold the hull in the side to the wind orientation as the
wind
> > tends to rotate the hull back to the stern to the wind orientation.
Where
> > does this energy come from?  There are two potential sources, the
kinetic
> > energy of the boat itself & from the motor.  In a crowded marina
> situation,
> > the boat is going to be moving slowly.  So, you don't have very much
> kinetic
> > energy to start off with.  But, suppose you start the turn anyway?  As
the
> > boat turns, the viscous drag of the hull in the water + the windage work
> > together to use up your kinetic energy.  You will likely end up turned
> > side-to-the-wind, but stopped dead in the water.  When the water stops
> > flowing across the rudder blade, it stops generating any steering
forces.
> > The wind keeps blowing.  The boat is blown out of control back downwind
&
> > tends to rotate back to the stern-to-the-wind orientation!  So far,
these
> > effects are pretty much the same for a port or a starboard turn.  OK,
> > suppose we add some power from the port offset mounted prop?  In forward
> > gear, even with the motor turned full lock to help the port turn, a
> > substantial fraction of the thrust is acting against the turn.  This is
> the
> > difference between a port turn & a starboard turn.  You can't use too
much
> > throttle because a substantial fraction of the thrust is also pushing
the
> > boat forward.  Using too much throttle will result in the boat finishing
> the
> > turn & entering the slip going much too fast.  Now, when you put the
> engine
> > into reverse & apply full throttle to stop, the prop side thrust tries
to
> > turn you back in the direction you came from.  Arggg!  Overall, this
> > technique simply has everything working against it.  It's a delicate
> > balancing act that requires good eye/hand coordination & a good sense of
> > speed & distance all performed in real time under stress with dire
> > consequences for failure!
> >
> > But, if we put the engine into reverse, turn it to full lock in the
> opposite
> > direction, & now apply full throttle; everything is different.  With
> reverse
> > thrust, the port offset engine location is tending to assist a port
turn.
> > Full reverse throttle will tend to slow the boat down, not speed it up.
> So,
> > you get up a good velocity before starting the turn, use the reverse
> engine
> > thrust to spin you around + burn off your speed.  With a little
practice,
> > you will find you can pull a sharp 90 deg turn to port, finishing the
turn
> > with the bow at the entrance to your slip, with the boat moving slowly
> > forward at just the right speed for docking.  Then, you shift into
> neutral,
> > slip your single dock line over a piling or cleat, stop parallel to the
> > dock, quickly attach your bow line, & then your stern line.  Then,
briefly
> > stop to acknowledge the applause from your fellow boaters!  I know this
> > technique sounds radical, but I guarantee it really really works.
> >
> > Roger Pihlaja
> > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "David Keyes" <dkeyes@houston.rr.com>
> > To: "The Rhodes 22 mail list" <rhodes22-list@rhodes22.org>
> > Sent: Sunday, January 12, 2003 12:35 PM
> > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Combination Of Sharp Turn To Port +
> > SingleHandedDocking
> >
> >
> > > Roger, I will try your single dock line.  But the challenge with a
brisk
> > > wind astern has been even to get that far (to where one is entering
the
> > slip
> > > between the finger piers), where you could get to the dock line.  I
have
> > to
> > > think about coming in close on my port side to the sterns of the
upwind,
> > > docked boats just before my slip and fetching the dock line for a
pivot
> > into
> > > the dock, but this couldn't work single-handed due to the protruding
> > > outboard motors of the other boats.  I have been coming down the
"alley"
> > > between the adjacent piers with my boat about 2/3 to 3/4 of the way
> > towards
> > > the opposite pier to allow for turning room but without my stern
getting
> > too
> > > close the the sterns of the boats to starboard as I make my turn to
> port.
> > >
> > > As to your question:  Of course the wind is not always that strong.  I
> > have
> > > since found out, talking to the marina personnel and some other boat
> > owners,
> > > that (virtually) no one goes out on days where there is a strong
onshore
> > > wind (northerly wind--we are on a southern shore), which would be rare
> in
> > > the summer but is common in the winter.  They don't go out because of
> the
> > > same problem of returning to docks.  But I am going to ask a few of
the
> > > owners who seem to use their boats frequently, year around.
> > >
> > > Even on the November day of my docking accident when mine may have
been
> > the
> > > only boat out, I and my crew of two thought we were successfully
turning
> > > into the slip without incident after a great sail when at the last
> instant
> > I
> > > decided that the wind had caught the bow so that it was going to be
> pushed
> > > too hard into the entering edge of the starboard finger pier.  I hit
> > reverse
> > > on the engine to soften the blow (and one crew member jumped onto the
> pier
> > > at that point) to try to push the boat off, when my motor jammed in
> > reverse
> > > and we went rocketing back into the boats in their slips behind me.
(It
> > was
> > > when I forced the gear shift into forward just missing a collision
with
> > > those boats but permanently jamming  the gear into forward).
> > >
> > >  Interestingly, much larger sailboats in the larger slips opposite me
> (the
> > > ones I back toward as I back out of my slip) seem to have no problem,
at
> > > least when I seen them come and go on normal days.  One skipper with
two
> > > small sons repeatedly brings his 35-foot sailboat to a dead stop
> centered
> > in
> > > his slip with no lines whatsoever.  The only differences I can see are
> (i)
> > > they are headed towards a larger opening, (ii) they are turning to
> > starboard
> > > if that makes any difference--is that what people talk about when they
> > refer
> > > to a right-hand prop?, and (iii) their prop is inboard and at the
center
> > > line of their boat, giving better steering control.
> > >
> > > Lastly, even on relatively calm days, the approach to the slip
requires
> > > skill, paying complete attention, good anticipation and decisions and
> > > sometimes a little luck.  Many years ago, I had boats at marinas in
> lakes
> > > and bays where this was not the case, within the limits of prudent
> > > seamanship.  For five years at one lake, I just sailed to the dock
with
> no
> > > motor at all (boats of 17 and 19 feet).  In Biscayne Bay in Miami, I
> > docked
> > > regularly a 34-foot motor sailer in many kinds of weather and never
any
> > > problem.  However, in the present case, for one thing, I usually have
to
> > > start my hard turn to port as if I were going to head into the
(already
> > > occupied) third slip out from me.  If one were driving a car doing
this
> on
> > > dry land, one would crash into the motor at the back of that boat.  I
> have
> > > to "slide" out to starboard during the turn to actually come in,
> > hopefully,
> > > right in the middle of my slip without touching anything.
Surprisingly,
> > > this works at least half the time, and over the past 1-1/2 years until
> > > November, the rest of the time involved a bump into a fender or the
> like,
> > so
> > > no big deal--at worst a rubbing of the gel coat alongside the white
> rubber
> > > strip at the edge of the finger pier, or against the small turning
wheel
> > at
> > > the entrance to the port finger pier.  But there should be a way to
make
> > > this virtually 100% successful in all but emergency weather conditions
> and
> > > where you could even explain to a guest skipper what he or she needs
to
> do
> > > as the best technique for this particular slip.  My success rate had
> gone
> > up
> > > significantly after the first few months of owning the boat when I
> started
> > > the practice of, if needed,  momentarily engaging the engine in
forward
> > > during the turn, with the motor linked to the tiller.  Then, if I
> weren't
> > > going to complete the turn in time (i.e., coming in too far too
> > starboard),
> > > I would change the tiller/linked motor  steering direction bringing
the
> > > tiller hard to port and momentarily hitting reverse to straighten the
> boat
> > > out before proceeding (hopefully) straight into the slip.  This
appears
> to
> > > have been hard on the engine, as you said in an earlier email.
> > >
> > > Roger, I really like your earlier suggestions, which I quote below:
> > >
> > > "You might consider finding a different slip for next season. For
> example,
> > a
> > >
> > > slip right across from you would be better. A tight turn to starboard
in
> > >
> > > this situation is much easier than to port.
> > >
> > > "If it were my boat & I were being more cautious, I think I would pull
> up
> > to
> > >
> > > the end of the finger pier, port side to the pier. I would either put
> out
> > >
> > > fenders on the port side amidships or mount a suitable bumper on the
> > corner
> > >
> > > of my pier. I would loosely tie off amidships & use a bow line to warp
> the
> > >
> > > bow around into the slip. No muss - no fuss."
> > >
> > > There is not alot of room to do this at my slip, but it should be
> > feasible.
> > > The finger pier at the port is only one foot wide, and their is a long
> > boat
> > > with a motor protruding to port.  Likewise there is a boat and
> protruding
> > > motor on the starboard side of my slip (mine being the last full one
> with
> > a
> > > finger pier on both sides to make an enclosure), and which of course
one
> > > would not want to "warp around" outside the edge of the slip and into
> that
> > > motor.  The slip is 10 feet side.  So what you say should work with a
> > > practiced technique, and I am going to try it.  Using your single dock
> > line
> > > idea  in your article quoted below, this could also be the line that I
> > fetch
> > > at the end of the port finger pier.
> > >
> > >
> > > David Keyes
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "Roger Pihlaja" <cen09402@centurytel.net>
> > > To: "The Rhodes 22 mail list" <rhodes22-list@rhodes22.org>
> > > Sent: Sunday, January 12, 2003 5:53 AM
> > > Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Combination Of Sharp Turn To Port + Single
> > > HandedDocking
> > >
> > >
> > > > Thank you Steve & Mark!  This was the article on single handed
docking
> I
> > > was
> > > > refering to.
> > > >
> > > > So, David, what do you think?  Wouldn't executing a sharp 90 deg
turn
> to
> > > > port & throwing a single dock line over a piling or cleat on the end
> of
> > > your
> > > > finger pier be more graceful & less taxing on your equipment than
what
> > you
> > > > do now?
> > > >
> > > > By the way, if your marina is so tight & the wind blows like you
say,
> > how
> > > do
> > > > the boats around you get into their slips?
> > > >
> > > > Roger Pihlaja
> > > > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium
> > > >
> > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > From: "Steve Alm" <salm@mn.rr.com>
> > > > To: <rhodes22-list@rhodes22.org>
> > > > Sent: Friday, January 10, 2003 5:41 PM
> > > > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Single Handed Docking Article
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > > Here it is:
> > > > >
> > > > > All boats have a point along both sides, usually just aft of
> > amidships,
> > > > > wherein a single dock line will cause the boat to stop parallel to
a
> > > dock.
> > > > > To find this point, pick a place along the side.  It's helpful to
> use
> > > the
> > > > > sliding cars on the genoa tracks for this purpose.  Attach a
mooring
> > > line
> > > > to
> > > > > this point & pull on it from behind.  If the bow pulls towards you
> > > faster
> > > > > than the stern, then slide the attachment point aft.  If the stern
> is
> > > > > favored, then move the attachment point forward.  When the boat
> crabs
> > > > > sideways towards you, then you have found the approximate sweet
> spot.
> > > The
> > > > > actual sweet spot will shift slightly when the boat has forward
> > > momentum.
> > > > > However, this approximate location will be sufficiently close to
> allow
> > > you
> > > > > to go out & try to pull up to a dock with a single line.  Try to
> stop
> > > the
> > > > > boat with a single mooring line using your approximate sweet spot.
> If
> > > the
> > > > > bow or stern tend to crab towards the dock faster, then adjust the
> > > > position
> > > > > of the line fore or aft as before & try again.  When you have
found
> > the
> > > > > correct location, you should at least mark it.  You may even wish
to
> > > > install
> > > > > permanent mooring cleats there port & starboard.
> > > > >
> > > > > With a single mooring line, simply motor up to the dock, slip your
> > loop
> > > > over
> > > > > the piling near the end of the dock, & shift into neutral.  The
> > mooring
> > > > line
> > > > > attached to the sweet spot will snub the boat's forward momentum &
> the
> > > > boat
> > > > > will almost magically "crab" sideways up against the dock.  This
> > > sideways
> > > > > crabbing involves a tremendous amount of drag, which uses up the
> > boat's
> > > > > forward momentum in a matter of inches, thus making it almost
> > impossible
> > > > to
> > > > > hit the dock.  The boat will stop at a convenient distance away
from
> > the
> > > > > dock for you to go around attaching your bow & stern lines at your
> > > > leisure.
> > > > > Try this technique.  I guarantee it will make you look like a boat
> > > > handling
> > > > > genius!
> > > > >
> > > > > Roger Pihlaja
> > > > > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium
> > > > >
> > > > > On 1/10/03 12:50 PM, "Roger Pihlaja" <cen09402@centurytel.net>
> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > > Hey Everyone,
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Did anyone happen to save a copy of an article I wrote several
> > months
> > > > ago re a
> > > > > > foolproof single line docking procedure?  I can't find it in the
> > > SailNet
> > > > > > archives or on the FAQ page & I don't know how to search the new
> > > > archives.
> > > > > > I'd really rather not retype the whole thing if someone has a
copy
> > > they
> > > > could
> > > > > > repost.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I'd like to forward it along to David Keyes.  The combination of
> the
> > > > technique
> > > > > > for making a sharp turn to port which I described in my previous
> > post
> > > > along
> > > > > > with this single line docking technique might work very well in
> his
> > > > situation.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Roger Pihlaja
> > > > > > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium
> > > > > > _________________________________________________
> > > > > > Use Rhodes22-list@rhodes22.org, Help? www.rhodes22.org/list
> > > > >
> > > > > _________________________________________________
> > > > > Use Rhodes22-list@rhodes22.org, Help? www.rhodes22.org/list
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > > _________________________________________________
> > > > Use Rhodes22-list@rhodes22.org, Help? www.rhodes22.org/list
> > >
> > > _________________________________________________
> > > Use Rhodes22-list@rhodes22.org, Help? www.rhodes22.org/list
> > >
> >
> > _________________________________________________
> > Use Rhodes22-list@rhodes22.org, Help? www.rhodes22.org/list
> >
>
>
> _________________________________________________
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>

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