[Rhodes22-list] Mark's political instigation aggravated
Bill Effros
bill at effros.com
Fri Apr 23 10:23:48 EDT 2004
Rick,
Great quotes! I'll check them out, but I have every reason to believe they are accurate.
The point is that the UN weapons inspectors, who were on the ground just prior to the start of the war, said unequivocally that they had been given access to everything they needed to be sure that Saddam Hussein no longer had WMD. The Bush administration claimed to have evidence that Saddam Hussein currently had WMD in staggering quantities, and they claimed to know exactly where it was hidden, how and where it had been made, and who made it.
They told the world they could not trust the UN weapons inspectors with this information, or anyone else for that matter. It was a matter of national security. They said Saddam Hussein was continuing to manufacture this stuff, and it was urgently necessary for the world to invade Iraq to rid him of these weapons.
The world told the Bush administration they did not believe our intelligence, our assessment of it, or our remedy to the problem if one actually existed. Bush invaded Iraq.
I have the exact quotes to back up all of the above statements, and will publish them shortly.
If you still believe Saddam Hussein had WMD in 2003, and they vanished without a trace despite our campaign of "shock and awe" and "decapitation" then you must agree that the method used by the Bush Administration to rid the world of this threat has failed. We still don't know where they are, and we still don't know who has them. If they exist, they are a greater threat to us now than they were when we knew where they were.
Similarly with Afghanistan. As you may remember, I opposed the invasion of Afghanistan as well. The entire rational for that invasion was to capture Osama. He is still making tapes and bombing all over the world. We failed in the mission. Meanwhile Afghanistan has descended back into total anarchy--it has again become a narco-terrorist state, and has regained its status as the leading producer of opium in the world--with our help. Meanwhile Americans continue to die in that country for no understandable reason.
If you come across more quotes of the type you posted, I would appreciate your sending them along. You have saved me a lot of work.
Thanks,
Bill Effros
----- Original Message -----
From: Rik Sandberg
To: The Rhodes 22 mail list
Sent: Thursday, April 22, 2004 9:44 PM
Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Mark's political instigation aggravated
Take a read here guys, then maybe talk about who is BSing who in regards to
WMDs.
Rik
______________________________________________________
I ran across this recently and found it very good reading.
If you really believe that President BUSH lied,THAT THERE NEVER WERE ANY
WEAPONS OF MASS DESTRUCTION IN IRAQ AND HE TOOK US TO WAR SOLELY FOR HIS OIL
BUDDIES -- The truth and nothing but the truth should be known!!!
"One way or the other, we are determined to deny Iraq the capacity to develop
weapons of mass destruction and the missiles to deliver them. That is our
bottom line." - President Clinton, Feb. 4, 1998
"If Saddam rejects peace and we have to use force, our purpose is clear. We
want to seriously diminish the threat posed by Iraq's weapons of mass
destruction program." - President Clinton, Feb. 17, 1998
"Iraq is a long way from [the USA], but what happens there matters a great
deal here. For the risks that the leaders of a rogue state will use nuclear,
chemical or biological weapons against us or our allies is the greatest
security threat we face." -Madeline Albright, Feb 18, 1998
"He will use those weapons of mass destruction again, as he has ten times
since 1983." -Sandy Berger, Clinton National Security Adviser, Feb, 18,1998
"We urge you, after consulting with Congress, and consistent with the U.S.
Constitution and laws, to take necessary actions (including, if
appropriate,air and missile strikes on suspect Iraqi sites) to respond
effectively to the threat posed by Iraq's refusal to end its weapons of mass
destruction programs." -Letter to President Clinton, signed by Sens. Carl
Levin, Tom Daschle, John Kerry, and others Oct. 9, 1998
"Saddam Hussein has been engaged in the development of weapons of mass
destruction technology which is a threat to countries in the region and he
has made a mockery of the weapons inspection process." -Rep. Nancy Pelosi (D,
CA), Dec. 16, 1998
"Hussein has .. chosen to spend his money on building weapons of mass
destruction and palaces for his cronies." - Madeline Albright, Clinton
Secretary of State, Nov. 10, 1999
"There is no doubt that ... Saddam Hussein has invigorated his weapons
programs. Reports indicate that biological, chemical and nuclear programs
continue apace and may be back to pre-Gulf War status. In addition, Saddam
continues to redefine delivery systems and is doubtless using the cover of a
licit missile program to develop longer-range missiles that will threaten the
United States and our allies." - Letter to President Bush, Signed by Sen. Bob
Graham (D, FL,) and others, December 5, 2001
"We begin with the common belief that Saddam Hussein is a tyrant and a threat
to the peace and stability of the region. He has ignored the mandated of the
United Nations and is building weapons of mass destruction and the means of
delivering them." - Sen. Carl Levin (D, MI), Sept. 19, 2002
"We know that he has stored secret supplies of biological and chemical weapons
throughout his country." - Al Gore, Sept. 23, 2002
"Iraq's search for weapons of mass destruction has proven impossible to deter
and we should assume that it will continue for as long as Saddam is in
power." - Al Gore, Sept. 23, 2002
"We have known for many years that Saddam Hussein is seeking and developing
weapons of mass destruction."- Sen. Ted Kennedy (D, MA), Sept. 27, 2002
"The last UN weapons inspectors left Iraq in October of 1998. We are confident
that Saddam Hussein retains some stockpiles of chemical and biological
weapons, and that he has since embarked on a crash course to build up his
chemical and biological warfare capabilities. Intelligence reports indicate
that he is seeking nuclear weapons..." -Sen. Robert Byrd (D, WV), Oct. 3,
2002
"I will be voting to give the President of the United States the authority to
use force-- if necessary-- to disarm Saddam Hussein because I believe that a
deadly arsenal of weapons of mass destruction in his hands is a real and
grave threat to our security." -Sen. John F. Kerry (D, MA), Oct. 9, 2002
"There is unmistakable evidence that Saddam Hussein is working aggressively to
develop nuclear weapons an d will likely have nuclear weapons within the next
five years ... We also should remember we have always underestimated the
progress Saddam has made in development of weapons of mass destruction." -
Sen. Jay Rockefeller (D, WV), Oct 10, 2002
"He has systematically violated, over the course of the past 11 years, every
significant UN resolution that has demanded that he disarm and destroy his
chemical and biological weapons, and any nuclear capacity. This he has
refused to do" Rep.- Henry Waxman (D, CA) , Oct. 10, 2002
"In the four years since the inspectors left, intelligence reports show that
Saddam Hussein has worked to rebuild his chemical and biological weapons
stock, his missile delivery capability, and his nuclear program. He has also
given aid, comfort, and sanctuary to terrorists, including al Qaeda
members .. It is clear, however, that if left unchecked, Saddam Hussein will
continue to increase his capacity to wage biological and chemical warfare,
and will keep trying to develop nuclear weapons." - Sen. Hillary Clinton (D,
NY), Oct 10, 2002
"We are in possession of what I think to be compelling evidence that Saddam
Hussein has, and has had for a number of years, a developing capacity for the
production and storage of weapons of mass destruction." - Sen. Bob Graham (D,
FL), Dec. 8, 2002
"Without question, we need to disarm Saddam Hussein. He is a brutal, murderous
dictator, leading an oppressive regime .. He presents a particularly grievous
threat because he is so consistently prone to miscalculation ... And now he
is is cal culating America's response to his continued deceit and his
consistent grasp for weapons of mass destruction... So the threat of Saddam
Hussein with weapons of mass destruction is real - Sen. John F. Kerry (D,
MA), Jan. 23. 2003
SO NOW THE DEMOCRATS SAY PRESIDENT BUSH LIED, THAT THERE NEVER WERE ANY
WEAPONS OF MASS DESTRUCTION AND HE TOOK US TO WAR FOR HIS OIL BUDDIES???
So who's bullshitting who here????
On Thu, Apr 22 2004 10:18 am, Steve wrote:
> I still find it funny that the below comments still
> come up. We still don't know what happen to Iraq
> WMDs. We know he made missles that were cabible of
> going past the UN limit. Warheads were cabable of
> carring chemical agents. That 20+ tons of Mustard gas
> that Libia gave up may be Irag. We are still finding
> Jets & all other kinds of stuff hid under the sand in
> Irag. UN thought Iraq had WMDs, Briton, US and most
> of the free world thought Irag had them. I believe
> the real question is not whether Iraq had WMDs but
> WHERE are the WMDs! Sylia, Iran? Two very good
> possibities!!!!!!!!!!!
>
> As for Nation Building, when a country such as our
> looses 3,000 people; a President must change, policy
> must change; to protect the people that are still
> alive. Otherwise, the US would have had more Deaths
> on it hands. And the President would have been blamed
> for NOT changeing policies to protect this country.
>
> I had a great weekend sailing last weekend also.
> Perfect wind, some fairly good wave action. It was
> even white capping most of the day Saturday.
> Steve
>
> --- Wally Buck <tnrhodey at hotmail.com> wrote:
> > Ed,
> >
> > The answer to your questions are easy, I am just not
> > sure why people care so
> > much. Yes there is a sucker born every minute! It is
> > clear that Clinton lied
> > to cover up his sucker. The guy got caught messing
> > around and lied about it.
> > Not exactly uncommon in our society or from our
> > elected officials. Please
> > note I did not vote for Clinton and agree the guy
> > was sleezy.
> >
> > On the other hand we have a sitting president that
> > claimed while running for
> > office that he was against Nation Building. Once
> > elected he spread around a
> > bunch of rumors as facts leading us into war against
> > a nation that posed no
> > real threat to our National Security. This pisses me
> > off much more.
> >
> > Regarding the Baker's, they are clowns and are only
> > here for us to make fun
> > of. :-)
> >
> > We had an awesome weekend last week! More of the
> > same coming this weekend. I
> > hope someone else besides me is going sailing.
> >
> > Wally
> >
> > >From: "ed kroposki" <ekroposki at charter.net>
> > >Reply-To: The Rhodes 22 mail list
> >
> > <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
> >
> > >To: "'The Rhodes 22 mail list'"
> >
> > <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
> >
> > >Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Mark's political
> >
> > instigation aggravated Date: Wed,
> >
> > >21 Apr 2004 15:10:16 -0400
> > >
> > >
> > >Mark,
> > > If you like the what she says then surely you
> >
> > believed Bill when he
> >
> > >said "I did not ................................."
> > > What did that famous circus guy say, "one born
> >
> > every day and two to
> >
> > >take him." You have found your two. And I bet you
> >
> > sat in the front row of
> >
> > >Jim Baker's audiences.
> > > And if Bill is as smart as Rummy's email says he
> >
> > is, how come he
> >
> > >does not know right from wrong? Or the complete
> >
> > definitions of everyday
> >
> > >terms. Why is it acceptable for him to define
> >
> > words to suit himself and
> >
> > >then all the national news media accepts his
> >
> > definition as correct? Is
> >
> > >that
> > >intelligence or an old fashion 'con job'.
> > > And, according to Rummy's email, Bush is not smart
> >
> > enough to 'con'
> >
> > >us :-) :-(
> > >
> > >~~~~~ _/) ~~~~~~ ~~~~~~ ~~~~~~ ~~~~~
> > >
> > > Ed K
> > >
> > >
> > >-----Original Message-----
> > >From: rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org
> > >[mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On
> >
> > Behalf Of Mark Kaynor
> >
> > >Sent: Tuesday, April 20, 2004 9:37 PM
> > >To: The Rhodes 22 mail list
> > >Subject: RE: [Rhodes22-list] Rummy's political
> >
> > instigation aggravated
> >
> > >This oughtta do it. I just watched Hillary Clinton
> >
> > on Larry King Live. I
> >
> > >keep finding that I like what she has to say.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >-----Original Message-----
> > >From: rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org
> > >[mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org]On
> >
> > Behalf Of Michael Meltzer
> >
> > >Sent: Tuesday, April 20, 2004 8:35 PM
> > >To: The Rhodes 22 mail list
> > >Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Rummy's political
> >
> > instigation aggravated
> >
> > >good point, I am not getting any, so why not bring
> >
> > up sex, thats different.
> >
> > >MJM
> > >
> > >----- Original Message -----
> > >From: "Mark Kaynor" <mark at kaynor.org>
> > >To: "The Rhodes 22 mail list"
> >
> > <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
> >
> > >Sent: Tuesday, April 20, 2004 8:35 PM
> > >Subject: RE: [Rhodes22-list] Rummy's political
> >
> > instigation aggravated
> >
> > > > Ed, Rummy,
> > > >
> > > > <Yawn> <Ho hum> How about bringing up something
> >
> > controversial? <g>
> >
> > > > Mark
> > > >
> > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > From: rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org
> > > > [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org]On
> >
> > Behalf Of ed kroposki
> >
> > > > Sent: Tuesday, April 20, 2004 6:41 PM
> > > > To: 'The Rhodes 22 mail list'
> > > > Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Rummy's political
> >
> > instigation aggravated
> >
> > > > Rummy,
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > I would suggest that your data is biased.
> >
> > Let me change the subject
> >
> > >to
> > >
> > > > a more controversial one, Religion:
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > DID YOU KNOW
> > > >
> > > > As you walk up the steps to the
> > > > building which houses the
> > > > U.S. Supreme Court you can see
> > > > near the top of the building a row of the
> > > > world's law givers and each one
> > > > is facing one in the middle who
> > > > is facing forward with a full frontal
> > > > view - it is Moses and he is holding the Ten
> >
> > Commandments!
> >
> > > > DID YOU KNOW?
> > > >
> > > > As you enter the Supreme Court
> > > > courtroom, the two huge oak doors
> > > > have the Ten Commandments engraved
> > > > on each lower portion of each door.
> > > >
> > > > DID YOU KNOW?
> > > >
> > > > As you sit inside the courtroom, you can
> > > > see the wall, right above where the
> > > > Supreme Court judges sit, a display of the Ten
> >
> > Commandments!
> >
> > > > DID YOU KNOW?
> > > >
> > > > There are Bible verses etched in stone
> > > > all over the Federal Buildings
> > > > and Monuments in Washington, D.C.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > DID YOU KNOW?
> > > >
> > > > James Madison, the fourth president,
> > > > known as "The Father of Our Constitution"
> > > > made the following statement
> > > > "We have staked the whole of
> > > > all our political institutions upon the
> > > > capacity of mankind for self-government,
> > > > upon the capacity of each and all of us
> > > > to govern ourselves, to control ourselves,
> > > > to sustain ourselves according to the Ten
> >
> > Commandments of God."
> >
> > > > DID YOU KNOW?
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Patrick Henry, that patriot and
> > > > Founding Father of our country said,
> > > > "It cannot be emphasized too strongly
> > > > or too often that this great nation was
> > > > founded not by religionists but by Christians,
> > > > not on religions but on the
> > > > Gospel of Jesus Christ."
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > DID YOU KNOW?
> > > >
> > > > Every session of Congress begins with
> > > > a prayer by a paid preacher, whose
> > > > salary has been paid by the
> > > > taxpayer since 1777.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > DID YOU KNOW?
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Fifty-two of the 55 founders of the
> > > > Constitution were members of
> > > > the established orthodox churches
> > > > in the colonies.
> > > >
> > > > DID YOU KNOW?
> > > >
> > > > Thomas Jefferson worried that
> > > > the Courts would overstep their
> > > > authority and instead of interpreting
> > > > the law would begin making
> > > > law....an oligarchy....the rule of few over
> >
> > many.
> >
> > > > Ed K (throwing gas on Rummy's wood fire)
> >
> > __________________________________________________
> >
> > > > Use Rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org, Help?
> >
> > www.rhodes22.org/list
> >
> > __________________________________________________
> >
> > > > Use Rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org, Help?
> >
> > www.rhodes22.org/list
> >
> > >__________________________________________________
> > >Use Rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org, Help?
> >
> > www.rhodes22.org/list
> >
> > >__________________________________________________
> > >Use Rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org, Help?
> >
> > www.rhodes22.org/list
> >
> > >Name:
> >
> > !cid_008701c343d6$e7c781e0$6402a8c0 at desktop.gif
> >
> > Type: image/gif Size:
> > >5747 bytes Desc: not available
> > >Url:
> >
> >http://www.rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attch/200404/21/cid_008701
> >c343d6e7c781e06402a8c0desktop.gif
> >
> > >__________________________________________________
> > >Use Rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org, Help?
> >
> > www.rhodes22.org/list
>
> _________________________________________________________________
>
> > FREE pop-up blocking with the new MSN Toolbar - get
> > it now!
> > http://toolbar.msn.com/go/onm00200415ave/direct/01/
> >
> > __________________________________________________
> > Use Rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org, Help?
>
> www.rhodes22.org/list
>
>
>
>
>
> __________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Photos: High-quality 4x6 digital prints for 25¢
> http://photos.yahoo.com/ph/print_splash
> __________________________________________________
> Use Rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org, Help? www.rhodes22.org/list
__________________________________________________
Use Rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org, Help? www.rhodes22.org/list
More information about the Rhodes22-list
mailing list