[Rhodes22-list] Monty was Mark's political

Rik Sandberg sanderico at earthlink.net
Fri Apr 23 17:15:49 EDT 2004 

Wally,

M-15 is coming pretty good. Didn't really have too much to do to get 
sailable. Mostly just a good scrubbing, a little polish, a little tung 
oil...I'm sure you know the drill. :-). I got a new rudder from Bob Eeg 
that I still need to put on, but that's not going to take long, just one 
bolt and a couple screws. Probably take about 20 minutes, once I finally 
get to it. :-)

It may be a bit before I can make the boat really pretty though. I have to 
do some serious fairing on the port side, where it appears to have been 
tied up against something pretty rough on a windy day. The PO smeared some 
stuff on it and painted over it and I guess, from a distance it isn't real 
obvious if you don't know it's there. Up close though, that patch of hull 
(about 1 foot high and 2 feet long) looks like hell. But then, I guess 
that's why it was cheap, eh??? That'll wait till I get ambitious in the 
winter. "Course, once I do that, I'll have to paint the whole hull. Other 
than that, she's a pretty cool little boat.

Rik


At 03:35 PM 4/23/2004, you wrote:
>Rik, I agree we need to finish the job. No doubt that both sides are full 
>of it.  I also agree that this is a perfect example of the pot calling the 
>kettle black. I don't respect many on either side.
>
>Previous post (from Ed I think) indicated he thought Clinton's scandals 
>were worse than Bush leading us to war. I just don't get this line of thinking.
>
>By the way how is that M15 coming along?
>
>Wally
>
>>From: Rik Sandberg <sanderico at earthlink.net>
>>Reply-To: The Rhodes 22 mail list <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
>>To: The Rhodes 22 mail list <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
>>Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Mark's political instigation aggravated
>>Date: Fri, 23 Apr 2004 11:04:28 -0500
>>
>>Wally,
>>
>>Excuse me, but there are many Democrats here and elsewhere that have 
>>accused our President of lying about the situation with WMD in Iraq. I 
>>posted those quotes, all from Democrats BTW, to show that there were 
>>plenty of liars out there from both sides,,,,,or not. The Democrats all 
>>jumping up to call the President a liar now is a perfect example of the 
>>pot calling the kettle black.
>>
>>
>>Whether we should have gone there or not, it seems to me, is a moot point 
>>now. We are there, we need to finish the job as best we can.
>>
>>
>>Rik
>>
>>
>>At 09:23 AM 4/23/2004, you wrote:
>>>I for one felt the attack on Iraq was wrong regardless of WMD. I agree 
>>>that they had them at one time. However we don't know if they still 
>>>exist or not inspite of our attack. The below quotes don't sway my opinion.
>>>
>>>Times are tough when the conservatives have to use quotes from the 
>>>liberals to help make their case. :-)
>>>
>>>Wally
>>>
>>>>From: Rik Sandberg <sanderico at earthlink.net>
>>>>Reply-To: The Rhodes 22 mail list <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
>>>>To: The Rhodes 22 mail list <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
>>>>Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Mark's political instigation aggravated
>>>>Date: Thu, 22 Apr 2004 20:44:12 -0500
>>>>
>>>>Take a read here guys, then maybe talk about who is BSing who in regards to
>>>>WMDs.
>>>>
>>>>Rik
>>>>______________________________________________________
>>>>I ran across this recently and found it very good reading.
>>>>
>>>>If you really believe that President BUSH lied,THAT THERE NEVER WERE ANY
>>>>WEAPONS OF MASS DESTRUCTION IN IRAQ AND HE TOOK US TO WAR SOLELY FOR 
>>>>HIS OIL
>>>>BUDDIES -- The truth and nothing but the truth should be known!!!
>>>>
>>>>"One way or the other, we are determined to deny Iraq the capacity to 
>>>>develop
>>>>weapons of mass destruction and the missiles to deliver them. That is our
>>>>bottom line." - President Clinton, Feb. 4, 1998
>>>>
>>>>"If Saddam rejects peace and we have to use force, our purpose is clear. We
>>>>want to seriously diminish the threat posed by Iraq's weapons of mass
>>>>destruction program." - President Clinton, Feb. 17, 1998
>>>>
>>>>"Iraq is a long way from [the USA], but what happens there matters a great
>>>>deal here. For the risks that the leaders of a rogue state will use 
>>>>nuclear,
>>>>chemical or biological weapons against us or our allies is the greatest
>>>>security threat we face." -Madeline Albright, Feb 18, 1998
>>>>
>>>>"He will use those weapons of mass destruction again, as he has ten times
>>>>since 1983." -Sandy Berger, Clinton National Security Adviser, Feb, 18,1998
>>>>
>>>>"We urge you, after consulting with Congress, and consistent with the U.S.
>>>>Constitution and laws, to take necessary actions (including, if
>>>>appropriate,air and missile strikes on suspect Iraqi sites) to respond
>>>>effectively to the threat posed by Iraq's refusal to end its weapons of 
>>>>mass
>>>>destruction programs." -Letter to President Clinton, signed by Sens. Carl
>>>>Levin, Tom Daschle, John Kerry, and others Oct. 9, 1998
>>>>
>>>>"Saddam Hussein has been engaged in the development of weapons of mass
>>>>destruction technology which is a threat to countries in the region and he
>>>>has made a mockery of the weapons inspection process." -Rep. Nancy 
>>>>Pelosi (D,
>>>>CA), Dec. 16, 1998
>>>>
>>>>"Hussein has .. chosen to spend his money on building weapons of mass
>>>>destruction and palaces for his cronies." - Madeline Albright, Clinton
>>>>Secretary of State, Nov. 10, 1999
>>>>
>>>>"There is no doubt that ... Saddam Hussein has invigorated his weapons
>>>>programs. Reports indicate that biological, chemical and nuclear programs
>>>>continue apace and may be back to pre-Gulf War status. In addition, Saddam
>>>>continues to redefine delivery systems and is doubtless using the cover 
>>>>of a
>>>>licit missile program to develop longer-range missiles that will 
>>>>threaten the
>>>>United States and our allies." - Letter to President Bush, Signed by 
>>>>Sen. Bob
>>>>Graham (D, FL,) and others, December 5, 2001
>>>>
>>>>"We begin with the common belief that Saddam Hussein is a tyrant and a 
>>>>threat
>>>>to the peace and stability of the region. He has ignored the mandated 
>>>>of the
>>>>United Nations and is building weapons of mass destruction and the means of
>>>>delivering them." - Sen. Carl Levin (D, MI), Sept. 19, 2002
>>>>
>>>>"We know that he has stored secret supplies of biological and chemical 
>>>>weapons
>>>>throughout his country." - Al Gore, Sept. 23, 2002
>>>>
>>>>"Iraq's search for weapons of mass destruction has proven impossible to 
>>>>deter
>>>>and we should assume that it will continue for as long as Saddam is in
>>>>power." - Al Gore, Sept. 23, 2002
>>>>
>>>>"We have known for many years that Saddam Hussein is seeking and developing
>>>>weapons of mass destruction."- Sen. Ted Kennedy (D, MA), Sept. 27, 2002
>>>>
>>>>"The last UN weapons inspectors left Iraq in October of 1998. We are 
>>>>confident
>>>>that Saddam Hussein retains some stockpiles of chemical and biological
>>>>weapons, and that he has since embarked on a crash course to build up his
>>>>chemical and biological warfare capabilities. Intelligence reports indicate
>>>>that he is seeking nuclear weapons..." -Sen. Robert Byrd (D, WV), Oct. 3,
>>>>2002
>>>>
>>>>"I will be voting to give the President of the United States the 
>>>>authority to
>>>>use force-- if necessary-- to disarm Saddam Hussein because I believe 
>>>>that a
>>>>deadly arsenal of weapons of mass destruction in his hands is a real and
>>>>grave threat to our security." -Sen. John F. Kerry (D, MA), Oct. 9, 2002
>>>>
>>>>"There is unmistakable evidence that Saddam Hussein is working 
>>>>aggressively to
>>>>develop nuclear weapons an d will likely have nuclear weapons within 
>>>>the next
>>>>five years ... We also should remember we have always underestimated the
>>>>progress Saddam has made in development of weapons of mass destruction." -
>>>>Sen. Jay Rockefeller (D, WV), Oct 10, 2002
>>>>
>>>>"He has systematically violated, over the course of the past 11 years, 
>>>>every
>>>>significant UN resolution that has demanded that he disarm and destroy his
>>>>chemical and biological weapons, and any nuclear capacity. This he has
>>>>refused to do" Rep.- Henry Waxman (D, CA) , Oct. 10, 2002
>>>>
>>>>"In the four years since the inspectors left, intelligence reports show 
>>>>that
>>>>Saddam Hussein has worked to rebuild his chemical and biological weapons
>>>>stock, his missile delivery capability, and his nuclear program. He has 
>>>>also
>>>>given aid, comfort, and sanctuary to terrorists, including al Qaeda
>>>>members .. It is clear, however, that if left unchecked, Saddam Hussein 
>>>>will
>>>>continue to increase his capacity to wage biological and chemical warfare,
>>>>and will keep trying to develop nuclear weapons." - Sen. Hillary 
>>>>Clinton (D,
>>>>NY), Oct 10, 2002
>>>>
>>>>"We are in possession of what I think to be compelling evidence that Saddam
>>>>Hussein has, and has had for a number of years, a developing capacity 
>>>>for the
>>>>production and storage of weapons of mass destruction." - Sen. Bob 
>>>>Graham (D,
>>>>FL), Dec. 8, 2002
>>>>
>>>>"Without question, we need to disarm Saddam Hussein. He is a brutal, 
>>>>murderous
>>>>dictator, leading an oppressive regime .. He presents a particularly 
>>>>grievous
>>>>threat because he is so consistently prone to miscalculation ... And now he
>>>>is is cal culating America's response to his continued deceit and his
>>>>consistent grasp for weapons of mass destruction... So the threat of Saddam
>>>>Hussein with weapons of mass destruction is real - Sen. John F. Kerry (D,
>>>>MA), Jan. 23. 2003
>>>>
>>>>SO NOW THE DEMOCRATS SAY PRESIDENT BUSH LIED, THAT THERE NEVER WERE ANY
>>>>WEAPONS OF MASS DESTRUCTION AND HE TOOK US TO WAR FOR HIS OIL BUDDIES???
>>>>
>>>>So who's bullshitting who here????
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>On Thu, Apr 22 2004 10:18 am, Steve wrote:
>>>> > I still find it funny that the below comments still
>>>> > come up.  We still don't know what happen to Iraq
>>>> > WMDs.  We know he made missles that were cabible of
>>>> > going past the UN limit.  Warheads were cabable of
>>>> > carring chemical agents. That 20+ tons of Mustard gas
>>>> > that Libia gave up may be Irag.  We are still finding
>>>> > Jets & all other kinds of stuff hid under the sand in
>>>> > Irag.  UN thought Iraq had WMDs, Briton, US and most
>>>> > of the free world thought Irag had them.  I believe
>>>> > the real question is not whether Iraq had WMDs but
>>>> > WHERE are the WMDs!  Sylia, Iran? Two very good
>>>> > possibities!!!!!!!!!!!
>>>> >
>>>> > As for Nation Building, when a country such as our
>>>> > looses 3,000 people; a President must change, policy
>>>> > must change; to protect the people that are still
>>>> > alive.  Otherwise, the US would have had more Deaths
>>>> > on it hands.  And the President would have been blamed
>>>> > for NOT changeing policies to protect this country.
>>>> >
>>>> > I had a great weekend sailing last weekend also.
>>>> > Perfect wind, some fairly good wave action.  It was
>>>> > even white capping most of the day Saturday.
>>>> > Steve
>>>> >
>>>> > --- Wally Buck <tnrhodey at hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>> > > Ed,
>>>> > >
>>>> > > The answer to your questions are easy, I am just not
>>>> > > sure why people care so
>>>> > > much. Yes there is a sucker born every minute! It is
>>>> > > clear that Clinton lied
>>>> > > to cover up his sucker. The guy got caught messing
>>>> > > around and lied about it.
>>>> > > Not exactly uncommon in our society or from our
>>>> > > elected officials. Please
>>>> > > note I did not vote for Clinton and agree the guy
>>>> > > was sleezy.
>>>> > >
>>>> > > On the other hand we have a sitting president that
>>>> > > claimed while running for
>>>> > > office that he was against Nation Building. Once
>>>> > > elected he spread around a
>>>> > > bunch of rumors as facts leading us into war against
>>>> > > a nation that posed no
>>>> > > real threat to our National Security. This pisses me
>>>> > > off much more.
>>>> > >
>>>> > > Regarding the Baker's, they are clowns and are only
>>>> > > here for us to make fun
>>>> > > of. :-)
>>>> > >
>>>> > > We had an awesome weekend last week! More of the
>>>> > > same coming this weekend. I
>>>> > > hope someone else besides me is going sailing.
>>>> > >
>>>> > > Wally
>>>> > >
>>>> > > >From: "ed kroposki" <ekroposki at charter.net>
>>>> > > >Reply-To: The Rhodes 22 mail list
>>>> > >
>>>> > > <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
>>>> > >
>>>> > > >To: "'The Rhodes 22 mail list'"
>>>> > >
>>>> > > <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
>>>> > >
>>>> > > >Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Mark's political
>>>> > >
>>>> > > instigation aggravated Date: Wed,
>>>> > >
>>>> > > >21 Apr 2004 15:10:16 -0400
>>>> > > >
>>>> > > >
>>>> > > >Mark,
>>>> > > >   If you like the what she says then surely you
>>>> > >
>>>> > > believed Bill when he
>>>> > >
>>>> > > >said "I did not ................................."
>>>> > > >   What did that famous circus guy say, "one born
>>>> > >
>>>> > > every day and two to
>>>> > >
>>>> > > >take him."  You have found your two.  And I bet you
>>>> > >
>>>> > > sat in the front row of
>>>> > >
>>>> > > >Jim Baker's audiences.
>>>> > > >   And if Bill is as smart as Rummy's email says he
>>>> > >
>>>> > > is, how come he
>>>> > >
>>>> > > >does not know right from wrong?  Or the complete
>>>> > >
>>>> > > definitions of everyday
>>>> > >
>>>> > > >terms.  Why is it acceptable for him to define
>>>> > >
>>>> > > words to suit himself and
>>>> > >
>>>> > > >then all the national news media accepts his
>>>> > >
>>>> > > definition as correct?  Is
>>>> > >
>>>> > > >that
>>>> > > >intelligence or an old fashion 'con job'.
>>>> > > >   And, according to Rummy's email, Bush is not smart
>>>> > >
>>>> > > enough to 'con'
>>>> > >
>>>> > > >us :-) :-(
>>>> > > >
>>>> > > >~~~~~ _/) ~~~~~~ ~~~~~~ ~~~~~~ ~~~~~
>>>> > > >
>>>> > > >                               Ed K
>>>> > > >
>>>> > > >
>>>> > > >-----Original Message-----
>>>> > > >From: rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org
>>>> > > >[mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On
>>>> > >
>>>> > > Behalf Of Mark Kaynor
>>>> > >
>>>> > > >Sent: Tuesday, April 20, 2004 9:37 PM
>>>> > > >To: The Rhodes 22 mail list
>>>> > > >Subject: RE: [Rhodes22-list] Rummy's political
>>>> > >
>>>> > > instigation aggravated
>>>> > >
>>>> > > >This oughtta do it. I just watched Hillary Clinton
>>>> > >
>>>> > > on Larry King Live. I
>>>> > >
>>>> > > >keep finding that I like what she has to say.
>>>> > > >
>>>> > > >
>>>> > > >
>>>> > > >-----Original Message-----
>>>> > > >From: rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org
>>>> > > >[mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org]On
>>>> > >
>>>> > > Behalf Of Michael Meltzer
>>>> > >
>>>> > > >Sent: Tuesday, April 20, 2004 8:35 PM
>>>> > > >To: The Rhodes 22 mail list
>>>> > > >Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Rummy's political
>>>> > >
>>>> > > instigation aggravated
>>>> > >
>>>> > > >good point, I am not getting any, so why not bring
>>>> > >
>>>> > > up sex, thats different.
>>>> > >
>>>> > > >MJM
>>>> > > >
>>>> > > >----- Original Message -----
>>>> > > >From: "Mark Kaynor" <mark at kaynor.org>
>>>> > > >To: "The Rhodes 22 mail list"
>>>> > >
>>>> > > <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
>>>> > >
>>>> > > >Sent: Tuesday, April 20, 2004 8:35 PM
>>>> > > >Subject: RE: [Rhodes22-list] Rummy's political
>>>> > >
>>>> > > instigation aggravated
>>>> > >
>>>> > > > > Ed, Rummy,
>>>> > > > >
>>>> > > > > <Yawn> <Ho hum> How about bringing up something
>>>> > >
>>>> > > controversial? <g>
>>>> > >
>>>> > > > > Mark
>>>> > > > >
>>>> > > > > -----Original Message-----
>>>> > > > > From: rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org
>>>> > > > > [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org]On
>>>> > >
>>>> > > Behalf Of ed kroposki
>>>> > >
>>>> > > > > Sent: Tuesday, April 20, 2004 6:41 PM
>>>> > > > > To: 'The Rhodes 22 mail list'
>>>> > > > > Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Rummy's political
>>>> > >
>>>> > > instigation aggravated
>>>> > >
>>>> > > > > Rummy,
>>>> > > > >
>>>> > > > >
>>>> > > > >
>>>> > > > >     I would suggest that your data is biased.
>>>> > >
>>>> > > Let me change the subject
>>>> > >
>>>> > > >to
>>>> > > >
>>>> > > > > a more controversial one, Religion:
>>>> > > > >
>>>> > > > >
>>>> > > > >
>>>> > > > > DID YOU KNOW
>>>> > > > >
>>>> > > > > As you walk up the steps to the
>>>> > > > > building which houses the
>>>> > > > > U.S.  Supreme Court you can see
>>>> > > > > near the top of the building a row of the
>>>> > > > > world's law givers and each one
>>>> > > > > is facing one in the middle who
>>>> > > > > is facing forward with a full frontal
>>>> > > > > view - it is Moses and he is holding the Ten
>>>> > >
>>>> > > Commandments!
>>>> > >
>>>> > > > > DID YOU KNOW?
>>>> > > > >
>>>> > > > > As you enter the Supreme Court
>>>> > > > > courtroom, the two huge oak doors
>>>> > > > > have the Ten Commandments engraved
>>>> > > > > on each lower portion of each door.
>>>> > > > >
>>>> > > > > DID YOU KNOW?
>>>> > > > >
>>>> > > > > As you sit inside the courtroom, you can
>>>> > > > > see the wall, right above where the
>>>> > > > > Supreme Court judges sit, a display of the Ten
>>>> > >
>>>> > > Commandments!
>>>> > >
>>>> > > > > DID YOU KNOW?
>>>> > > > >
>>>> > > > > There are Bible verses etched in stone
>>>> > > > > all over the Federal Buildings
>>>> > > > > and Monuments in Washington, D.C.
>>>> > > > >
>>>> > > > >
>>>> > > > > DID YOU KNOW?
>>>> > > > >
>>>> > > > > James Madison, the fourth president,
>>>> > > > > known as "The Father of Our Constitution"
>>>> > > > > made the following statement
>>>> > > > > "We have staked the whole of
>>>> > > > > all our political institutions upon the
>>>> > > > > capacity of mankind for self-government,
>>>> > > > > upon the capacity of each and all of us
>>>> > > > > to govern ourselves, to control ourselves,
>>>> > > > > to sustain ourselves according to the Ten
>>>> > >
>>>> > > Commandments of God."
>>>> > >
>>>> > > > > DID YOU KNOW?
>>>> > > > >
>>>> > > > >
>>>> > > > > Patrick Henry, that patriot and
>>>> > > > > Founding Father of our country said,
>>>> > > > > "It cannot be emphasized too strongly
>>>> > > > > or too often that this great nation was
>>>> > > > > founded not by religionists but by Christians,
>>>> > > > > not on religions but on the
>>>> > > > > Gospel of Jesus Christ."
>>>> > > > >
>>>> > > > >
>>>> > > > > DID YOU KNOW?
>>>> > > > >
>>>> > > > > Every session of Congress begins with
>>>> > > > > a prayer by a paid preacher,  whose
>>>> > > > > salary has been paid by the
>>>> > > > > taxpayer since 1777.
>>>> > > > >
>>>> > > > >
>>>> > > > > DID YOU KNOW?
>>>> > > > >
>>>> > > > >
>>>> > > > > Fifty-two of the 55 founders of the
>>>> > > > > Constitution were members of
>>>> > > > > the established orthodox churches
>>>> > > > > in the colonies.
>>>> > > > >
>>>> > > > > DID YOU KNOW?
>>>> > > > >
>>>> > > > > Thomas Jefferson worried that
>>>> > > > > the Courts would overstep their
>>>> > > > > authority and instead of interpreting
>>>> > > > > the law would begin making
>>>> > > > > law....an oligarchy....the rule of few over
>>>> > >
>>>> > > many.
>>>> > >
>>>> > > > > Ed K (throwing gas on Rummy's wood fire)
>>>> > >
>>>> > > __________________________________________________
>>>> > >
>>>> > > > > Use Rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org, Help?
>>>> > >
>>>> > > www.rhodes22.org/list
>>>> > >
>>>> > > __________________________________________________
>>>> > >
>>>> > > > > Use Rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org, Help?
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