[Rhodes22-list] speaking of solar panels
Bill Effros
bill at effros.com
Sun Jan 28 12:39:38 EST 2007
L.
I am not making those assumptions, you are making those inferences.
I have owned an R-22 for 10 years. Every day I have been on board--well
over 500--I have noted the electrical consumption. I have hooked up
single batteries and dual batteries. I have used flooded, gel, and
AGM. I have used motors with and without alternators. I have used
solar panels, and I have covered them. I know what I am talking about
from experience.
You have not yet used your boat. You are using tables and graphs that
are wrong for the boats for which they are written--and are even more
wrong for R-22s with Solar Panels.
I have purchased additional Folding Solar Panels which I now use to
recharge all the appliance batteries on board. I recharge all radios,
flashlights, cd players, etc -- including my VHF radio using solar
power. I run a laptop off my batteries. I run my cell phone off the
house batteries.
My boat has never needed to be recharged from house current. It is on a
mooring all summer and in a boatyard all winter. I never remove the
batteries from the boat even though I live near NYC. I could not do
that without the solar charger, since the motor does not run all
winter. My boat batteries have never even come close to being fully
discharged.
I accidentally shorted one of my batteries one year. It did not short
out the other, even though the 2 batteries were connected in parallel.
When I realized what had happened, I disconnected the bad battery and
just used a single battery for the rest of the summer. I never got
close to discharging the one, not as good as it used to be, battery.
I am in the process of changing over all of my lights to LEDs. I
suspect that I could leave the LEDs on 24/7 and that my batteries would
never run down with the solar cells on them. But I haven't tested that
theory yet.
Bill Effros
elle wrote:
> Bill,
>
> You are making two assumptions:
> . that the R-22's have LED's rather than the installed
> incandescent lights; and
> 2) that the engine battery is 2a) the only battery,
> and 2b) that it is b=connected to the house lights.
>
> NOT!
>
> Each may be very different from what i described. I
> based my comments on my own configuration.
>
> Your mileage may vary.
>
> elle
>
>
>
> --- Bill Effros <bill at effros.com> wrote:
>
>
>> Hadz,
>>
>> Power consumption meters will do all the
>> calculations for you. While
>> they are expensive, they answer a lot of questions,
>> and bring peace of
>> mind. They will ultimately save you a lot of money.
>>
>> Solar panels actually do bring a lot to the party.
>> The consumption
>> figures L. and Art are using--which you will see
>> widely used
>> elsewhere--are incorrect in real life.
>>
>> The starter motors on large boats draw far more
>> electricity out of
>> batteries than an equivalent number of LEDs left
>> burning for the same
>> calculated number of Amp-Hours.
>>
>> On our boats, motors with starters will put more
>> electricity back into
>> the battery than they consume. Solar cells are all
>> that are required to
>> put electricity back into the batteries for lights,
>> stereos, and other
>> incidental uses. When you are cruising you will
>> inevitably wind up
>> using your motor a lot. This will provide plenty of
>> electricity for
>> auto-pilots and lights. Should the battery fail,
>> all you need to do is
>> pull the cord on our little motors to start
>> them--you can't do that with
>> big boats which is why they factor in so much for
>> idiots--the running
>> motor will provide the electricity you need for
>> lights/autopilot/and
>> bringing the batteries back up to fully charged
>> levels.
>>
>> One battery is all you really need on our boats
>> almost all of the time.
>> 2 batteries are over-kill. Top them off with solar
>> panels most of the
>> time. Get an electric starting motor. Your
>> batteries should never run
>> down if they are constantly topped off by solar
>> panels. Properly
>> maintained batteries that are never fully discharged
>> will last for more
>> than 6 years.
>>
>> Bill Effros
>>
>> Joseph Hadzima wrote:
>>
>>> Thanks elle & Art!
>>>
>>> I had assumed the pannel utilitiy was related both
>>>
>> to
>>
>>> consumpson, and latitude; and since you're also
>>>
>> just above
>>
>>> the 37th latitude, I appreciate your calculations.
>>>
>>
>>
>>>
>>> --- "Arthur H. Czerwonky"
>>>
>> <czerwonky at earthlink.net> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> Elle,
>>>>
>>>> Excellent perspective on the panels. They don't
>>>>
>> bring
>>
>>>> much to the party. I bought one of the LED
>>>>
>> utility
>>
>>>> lights from Boaters World at the Annapolis - not
>>>>
>> bad at
>>
>>>> all, and low power consumption. I bought LED
>>>>
>> Xmas lights
>>
>>>> before the holidays, for next year's boat parade
>>>>
>> in
>>
>>>> Savannah possibly. Five strings powered thru a
>>>>
>> 70 watt
>>
>>>> inverter (the lights were a/c because the DC were
>>>>
>> sold
>>
>>>> out) were no problem at all, plenty for 80' of
>>>>
>> big LED
>>
>>>> bulbs. The mfg will not comment on amp draw, but
>>>>
>> it must
>>
>>>> be minescule.
>>>>
>>>> I really think the stability questions about the
>>>>
>> Rhodes
>>
>>>> have been overdone, therefore of concern to you,
>>>>
>> Hadz,
>>
>>>> and others. Each of us skipper has our own
>>>>
>> comfort
>>
>>>> boundaries, and this remarkable craft has the
>>>>
>> ability to
>>
>>>> adjust accordingly. If you find the boat
>>>>
>> sensitive to
>>
>>>> particular winds, it is so simple to trim either
>>>>
>> main or
>>
>>>> genny. Bill likes to stay level on the water in
>>>>
>> the LI
>>
>>>> area, even with the ability to steer with weight
>>>> distribution. Match that...
>>>>
>>>> I really don't think there is a boat to compare
>>>>
>> with
>>
>>>> our's in any catagory except maybe competitive
>>>>
>> racing
>>
>>>> with IMF.
>>>>
>>>> I can't wait to read your first postings after
>>>>
>> you
>>
>>>> receive yours. We will hear the Oh's! and Ah's
>>>>
>> in
>>
>>>> Atlanta, at Hartwell, and at Edenton without
>>>>
>> fail! I can
>>
>>>> bet you're ready to get underway. If you are a
>>>>
>> little
>>
>>>> short to see the bow, nary a problem because you
>>>>
>> will
>>
>>>> just levitate.
>>>>
>>>> Many cheers,
>>>> Art
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> From: elle <watermusic38 at yahoo.com>
>>>>> Sent: Jan 27, 2007 12:41 PM
>>>>> To: The Rhodes 22 mail list
>>>>>
>> <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
>>
>>>>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] speaking of solar
>>>>>
>> panels
>>
>>>>> Hadz,
>>>>>
>>>>> Whether the solar panels can keep the batteries
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> charged is a function of the no. of amp hours
>>>>
>> used by
>>
>>>> the goodies below.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I don't have my estimated numbers with me (I'm
>>>>>
>> at the
>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> marina working...!) but, for example, if you have
>>>>
>> 5
>>
>>>> interior lights below and if each interior light
>>>>
>> pulls
>>
>>>> 1.5 amps/hr , you are using 7.5 amps per hour
>>>>
>> using all
>>
>>>> lights. Or you could use 1 light for 7.5 hours.
>>>>
>> The solar
>>
>>>> panels may provide approx. 1-2 amp hrs/day each
>>>>
>> in this
>>
>>>> latitude (maybe a bit more when the days are
>>>>
>> longer &
>>
>>>> fewer when the days become shorter)...so
>>>>
>> estimating
>>
>>>> usage, and the knowing the % you can draw your
>>>>
>> batteries
>>
>>>> down, I'd say don't count on the solar panels
>>>>
>> doing more
>>
>>>> than to top 'em off.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> When I did some estimates the other day, I
>>>>>
>> figured I
>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> could stay out 2-3 days (if sunny), bieng
>>>>
>> conservative in
>>
>>>> use, and have to go in to recharge from shore
>>>>
>> power on
>>
>>>> the 3rd day...more or less.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> elle
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Joseph Hadzima <josef508 at yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> I was under the impression that solar panels
>>>>>
>> worked best
>>
>>>>> when they are set 90 degrees to the Sun. With
>>>>>
>> the panels
>>
>>>>> statically mounted on the Rhodes, are they
>>>>>
>> sufficient at
>>
>>>>> keeping the batteries charged during a typical
>>>>>
>> weekend
>>
>>>>> cruise, or are they more for: charging when you
>>>>>
>> leave
>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> your
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> boat tied at a mooring / slip during the week
>>>>>
>> and sail
>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> on
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> the weekend?
>>>>>
>>>>> I assume the latitude where you sail may affect
>>>>>
>> the
>>
>>>>> efficiency.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>> HADZ (a.k.a. joe)
>>>
>>> "That's what a ship is, you know. It's not just a
>>>
>> keel and hull and a deck and sails. That's what a
>> ship needs. But what a ship is... is freedom."
>>
>>> -- Captain Jack Sparrow
>>> __________________________________________________
>>> Use Rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org, Help?
>>>
>> www.rhodes22.org/list
>>
>>>
>>>
>> __________________________________________________
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>> www.rhodes22.org/list
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
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