[Rhodes22-list] Economics and Health Care

[stan]

good

we all agree on this one

spend lots and lots of money on education instead and we all can take of 
ourselves (we call it preventative medicine)

rose (85) and I (I no longer give my age) do and that is why We are still 
alive and bitching.

ss

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Herb Parsons" <hparsons at parsonsys.com>
To: "The Rhodes 22 mail list" <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
Sent: Friday, January 11, 2008 4:18 PM
Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Economics and Health Care


> Don't you love it when people that are opposed to something use phrases
> that are guaranteed to arouse the populist population? "
>
> "Allowing retailers to make money off of sick people is wrong."
>
> So, are we to assume that the honorable Mayor thinks anyone "making
> money off sick people is wrong", or only those evil retailers?
>
> Brad Haslett wrote:
>> Herb,
>>
>> What people seem to miss (because they want to miss it) is the rate of
>> growth in the various sectors.  Clearly, as Moody's points out, the 
>> highest
>> rate of growth in public spending is in the social welfare area and the
>> problem is growing bigger even if we don't add new programs to it. 
>> Provide
>> health care for everyone and the problem gets worse.  Hey, I like the
>> concept.  I'd love for my brother and other employees to have health care 
>> as
>> well as my son employed in the private sector.  But someones got to pay. 
>> As
>> you pointed out, wars come and go, these entitlements go on forever.  We
>> need to figure out a solution to what we've already started before we add
>> more to the problem.
>>
>> Now here's some timely news just out of Boston.  To quote Ronald Reagan,
>> "government is not the solution to the problem, government IS the 
>> problem".
>> Who are we protecting here?  WalMart has gotten in the walk-in clinic
>> business and from the reviews I've read are quite good for the limited
>> services they provide.  I've been accomplishing the same thing for years 
>> by
>> buying drugs in China and self-medicating when needed (I think I know my
>> body as well as any doctor).  A good nurse-practitioner is all most 
>> people
>> need for eighty-plus percent of what ails them.  But NO, not in Boston. 
>> The
>> nanny government knows your needs better than you!
>>
>> Brad
>>
>> --------------------
>>
>> Menino decries clinics in retailers Urges health council to bar 
>> infirmaries
>> from opening in city
>>
>> By Stephen Smith, Globe Staff  |  January 11, 2008
>>
>> Mayor Thomas M. Menino embarked on a highly public campaign yesterday to
>> block CVS Corp. and other retailers from opening medical clinics inside
>> their stores, an effort that exposed a rift between Menino and the 
>> state's
>> public health commissioner, a longtime ally.
>>
>> Menino blasted state regulators for paving the way Wednesday for the
>> in-store clinics, which are designed to provide treatment for sore 
>> throats,
>> poison ivy, and other minor illnesses.
>>
>> The decision by the state Public Health Council, "jeopardizes patient
>> safety," Menino said in a written statement. "Limited service medical
>> clinics run by merchants in for-profit corporations will seriously
>> compromise quality of care and hygiene. Allowing retailers to make money 
>> off
>> of sick people is wrong."
>>
>> In a separate letter, Menino urged members of the city's Public Health
>> Commission to consider barring the clinics from Boston. CVS executives 
>> said
>> they plan to open 25 to 30 MinuteClinics in Greater Boston before the end 
>> of
>> the year, although they have not specified how many of those will be 
>> within
>> the city's limits.
>>
>> The Boston Public Health Commission spent nearly an hour discussing the
>> impending arrival of the clinics and ways they could potentially be 
>> stopped.
>>
>> The panel took no action, but instructed the health agency's attorney to
>> investigate whether it could adopt regulations forbidding stores with
>> clinics from selling tobacco products, forcing them to make an untenable
>> financial choice. The city says 31 CVS stores and 56 other pharmacies in
>> Boston have city-issued licenses to sell tobacco.
>>
>> In a statement issued last night, executives of MinuteClinics said they
>> "would be happy to talk to Mayor Menino about any of his concerns."
>>
>> "We at MinuteClinic are committed to providing convenient, affordable 
>> access
>> to quality health care," the statement said.
>>
>> By issuing a broadside against the clinics and the state's approval of 
>> them,
>> Menino placed himself squarely in opposition to a former longtime deputy,
>> John Auerbach. Before becoming the state's public health commissioner 
>> last
>> year, Auerbach spent nine years as executive director of the Boston 
>> Public
>> Health Commission.
>>
>> Auerbach's state agency yesterday released a statement defending its
>> decision on the clincs: "The members of the Public Health Council were
>> deliberative and thoughtful in their review of the limited service clinic
>> regulation. We believe these types of clinics, operated either as part of 
>> a
>> retail operation or in a nonprofit setting, can provide the public access 
>> to
>> safe, convenient, and quality care for minor health issues."
>>
>> The clinics are not designed to treat chronic diseases such as cancer or
>> diabetes or serious emergencies. The facilities will be staffed with
>> nurse-practitioners who are trained to spot patients with more severe
>> illnesses or in need of specialized care and send them to a doctor or an
>> emergency room.
>>
>> The regulations apply to any retail company, hospital, or community 
>> health
>> center that wants to open a limited-service clinic outside traditional
>> settings.
>>
>> Members of the Public Health Commission acknowledged many of the mayor's
>> concerns yesterday, but they also said a solution needs to be found for
>> patients who can't get easy access to primary-care doctors or who spend
>> hours waiting to have routine illnesses treated in emergency rooms.
>>
>> Commission member Hortensia Amaro, a Northeastern University professor, 
>> said
>> her own experience trying to make an appointment illustrates the crisis.
>>
>> "It's almost impossible to get a primary-care doctor in Boston," she 
>> said.
>> "I've waited nine months to get an appointment, and I have great 
>> insurance."
>>
>> Still, members of the commission said clinics inside retail stores might
>> only exacerbate long-standing problems in the healthcare system. Dr. 
>> Paula
>> Johnson, a board member and physician at Brigham and Women's Hospital, 
>> said
>> episodic visits to a drug store clinic could defeat efforts to provide
>> patients with a reliable continuum of care.
>>
>> "We could be setting ourselves up for some real problems," she said.
>>
>>
>> On Jan 11, 2008 1:02 PM, Herb Parsons <hparsons at parsonsys.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>> Rob,
>>>
>>> You understand that Moody is NOT a news agency. It's a financial
>>> advisor. Thus, ANYTHING they say cannot be an example of "biased
>>> reporting" of any kind, conservative or otherwise. They're not 
>>> reporters.
>>> On the other hand, they ARE financial advisors. If they feel that a war
>>> (which never last as long as medicaid and medicare have) has less
>>> influence on the US credit rating, then they should say so. They're
>>> trying to solve a problem, they're giving a financial forcast. That's
>>> what financial advisors do.
>>>
>>> Rob Lowe wrote:
>>>
>>>> Herb,
>>>> My point is if Moody's is going to suggest that the credit rating of 
>>>> the
>>>>
>>> US
>>>
>>>> is in danger of being lowered due to an imbalance of current and
>>>>
>>> perceived
>>>
>>>> incomes vs. outgoes, then say so.  While health care costs have and are
>>>> rising, so is the Pentagon's budget and the wars have cost a trillion
>>>> dollars so far.  If they are worried about the credit worthiness of the
>>>>
>>> US,
>>>
>>>> just say so and let the politicians solve the problem (not that they
>>>>
>>> will).
>>>
>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>> From: "Herb Parsons" <hparsons at parsonsys.com>
>>>> To: "The Rhodes 22 mail list" <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
>>>> Sent: Friday, January 11, 2008 11:47 AM
>>>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Economics and Health Care
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> I want to see if I understand your point correctly - when reporting 
>>>>> the
>>>>> news that the Moody credit rating was risked being lowered because of
>>>>> their (Moody's) concern over the costs of Medicare and Medicaid, that
>>>>> the reporter should have also inserted concerns (that Moody didn't
>>>>> state) about two wars, borrowing money to pay for them, interest on 
>>>>> the
>>>>> national debt, etc?
>>>>>
>>>>> Or is it your point that reporting Moody's concerns was "one sided
>>>>> conservative press"?
>>>>>
>>>>> Rob Lowe wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> Man, talk about a one sided conservative press.  No mention of all
>>>>>>
>>> about
>>>
>>>>>> starting two wars and paying for them by borrowing money.  No mention
>>>>>>
>>> of
>>>
>>>> tax
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>> cuts (mostly for the rich) paid for with borrowed money.  No mention
>>>>>>
>>> of
>>>
>>>> the
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>> interest on the national debt eating up all discretionary spending in
>>>>>> another decade.  No mention that most of the national debt occurred
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>> during
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>> the Regan and Bush years.  Sure health care spending is a problem.
>>>>>>
>>>  But
>>>
>>>> tell
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>> the whole story. - rob
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>>> From: "Brad Haslett" <flybrad at gmail.com>
>>>>>> To: "The Rhodes 22 mail list" <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
>>>>>> Sent: Friday, January 11, 2008 8:46 AM
>>>>>> Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Economics and Health Care
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Here is the 900 pound elephant in the room that refuses to go away.
>>>>>>> "Elephant?  What elephant?" When a candidate promises you a new
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>> benefit,
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>> the
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> question you should be asking is, "how are we going to pay for that
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>> when
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>> we
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> can't pay for what we've already promised?" Happy talk and wishful
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> thinking
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> is not going to solve this!  Brad
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> --------------------------------
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> from the Financial Times
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> US's triple-A credit rating 'under threat'
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> By Francesco Guerrera, Aline van Duyn and Daniel Pimlott,in New York
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Published: January 11 2008 02:00 | Last updated: January 11 2008
>>>>>>>
>>> 02:00
>>>
>>>>>>> The US is at risk of losing its top-notch triple-A credit rating
>>>>>>>
>>> within
>>>
>>>> a
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>> decade unless it takes radical action to curb soaring healthcare and
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> social
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> security spending, Moody's, the credit rating agency, said 
>>>>>>> yesterday.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The warning over the future of the triple-A rating - granted to US
>>>>>>> government debt since it was first assessed in 1917 - reflects
>>>>>>>
>>> growing
>>>
>>>>>>> concerns over the country's ability to retain its financial and
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>> economic
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>> supremacy.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> It could also put further pressure on candidates from both the
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>> Republican
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>> and Democratic parties to sharpen their focus on healthcare and
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>> pensions
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>> in
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> the run-up to November's presidential election.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Most analysts expect future administrations to deal with the costs 
>>>>>>> of
>>>>>>> healthcare and social security and there is no reflection of any
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>> long-term
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>> concern about the US's financial health in the value of its debt.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> But Moody's warning comes at a time when US confidence in its
>>>>>>>
>>> economic
>>>
>>>>>>> prowess has been challenged by the rising threat of a recession, a
>>>>>>>
>>> weak
>>>
>>>>>>> dollar and the credit crunch.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> In its annual report on the US, Moody's signalled increased concern
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>> that
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>> rapid rises in Medicare and Medicaid - the government-funded
>>>>>>>
>>> healthcare
>>>
>>>>>>> programmes for the old and the poor - would "cause major fiscal
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>> pressures"
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>> in years to come.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Unlike Moody's previous assessment of US government debt in 2005,
>>>>>>> yesterday's report specifically links rises in healthcare and social
>>>>>>> security spending to the credit rating.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> "The combination of the medical programmes and social security is 
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>> most
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>> important threat to the triple-A rating over the long term," it 
>>>>>>> said.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Steven Hess, Moody's lead analyst for the US, told the Financial
>>>>>>>
>>> Times
>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> that
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> in order to protect the country's top rating, future administrations
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>> would
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>> have to rein in healthcare and social security costs.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> "If no policy changes are made, in 10 years from now we would have 
>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>> look
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>> very seriously at whether the US is still a triple-A credit," he
>>>>>>>
>>> said.
>>>
>>>>>>> Mr Hess said any downgrade in the US rating would have serious
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> consequences
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> for the global economy. "The US rating is the anchor of the world's
>>>>>>> financial system. If you have a downgrade, you have a problem," he
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>> said.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>> Moody's did once threaten to cut the rating of some of the US
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>> Treasury's
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>> debt when Congress refused to pass the president's budget in the
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> mid-1990s.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Other large economies, notably Japan in the 1990s, have had to 
>>>>>>> suffer
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>> the
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>> symbolic blow of losing their top-notch credit rating.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Last year, David Walker, comptroller general of the US, caused
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>> controversy
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>> when he compared America's current situation with the dying days of
>>>>>>>
>>> the
>>>
>>>>>>> Roman empire and warned the country was on "a burning platform" of
>>>>>>> unsustainable policies.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Medicare and Medicaid spending, which has risen sharply over the 
>>>>>>> past
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>> few
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>> decades and now accounts for about 45 per cent of total federal
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>> spending,
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>> up
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> from about 25 per cent in 1975, has long been a source of concern.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Last month, Peter Orszag, director of the Congressional Budget
>>>>>>>
>>> Office,
>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> which
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> advises Congress on the federal budget, said the issue was "the
>>>>>>>
>>> central
>>>
>>>>>>> fiscal challenge" facing the US.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Most presidential candidates have vowed to reform the healthcare
>>>>>>>
>>> system
>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> but
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> many of them, especially on the Democratic side, have focused on
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>> extending
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>> coverage to the 40m-plus uninsured Americans rather than on cutting
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>> costs
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>> __________________________________________________
>>>>>>> Use Rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org, Help? www.rhodes22.org/list
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> __________________________________________________
>>>>>> Use Rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org, Help? www.rhodes22.org/list
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> Herb Parsons
>>>>> S/V O'Jure - O'Day 25
>>>>> S/V Reve de Pappa - Coronado 35
>>>>>
>>>>> __________________________________________________
>>>>> Use Rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org, Help? www.rhodes22.org/list
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> __________________________________________________
>>>> Use Rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org, Help? www.rhodes22.org/list
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>> --
>>> Herb Parsons
>>> S/V O'Jure - O'Day 25
>>> S/V Reve de Pappa - Coronado 35
>>>
>>> __________________________________________________
>>> Use Rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org, Help? www.rhodes22.org/list
>>>
>>>
>> __________________________________________________
>> Use Rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org, Help? www.rhodes22.org/list
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
> -- 
> Herb Parsons
> S/V O'Jure - O'Day 25
> S/V Reve de Pappa - Coronado 35
>
> __________________________________________________
> Use Rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org, Help? www.rhodes22.org/list