[Rhodes22-list] How Much for the White House?

[David Bradley]

Brad, I went in through the McCain official site, just like the woman
quoted in the article.  I used my real name and an incorrect address.

The NYT article you attached doesn't do anything to convince me there
is a conspiracy.  It says they found a tiny percentage of incorrect
names.  Tell me, if you were trying to illegally contribute to Obama,
would you use the name Osama bin Laden?  Sounds more like mischief
from detractors.  How many incorrect registrations did this little
list generate?

I really don't care if the Obama national campaign told the states to
play hardball.  If he directly told his campaign managers to commit
fraud then there should be consequences, but until proven guilty, I
say let the games go on.

Whatever lines of judgement are being crossed will come home to roost
at some point, but I haven't seen anything as offensive as the narrow
definition of being a "real" American put forth by Palin/McCain.

Dave



On Fri, Oct 24, 2008 at 5:50 PM, Brad Haslett <flybrad at gmail.com> wrote:
> Dave,
>
> What McCain website did you use?  McCain is not allowed to take
> donations so it must have been the RNC committee fund you contributed
> to.
>
> The speculation is that the AVS system was turned off largely to
> accept foreign money.
>
> Again, Pam Geller has been the lead on this for months and I can send
> you dozens of links and Obama FEC documents if you like. You'd have to
> be incompetent or crooked to allow what has happened with their
> donation records.  You decide.
>
> The New York Times couldn't ignore it any longer (article attached).
>
> Brad
>
> -----------------
>
> October 23, 2008, 6:02 pm
> Donor Patrol: Obama's Online Site Accepts More Fakes
> By Michael Luo
>
> Erika Franzi, a 36-year-old mother of four, had been following recent
> news reports examining how people using obviously fake names had made
> thousands of dollars in contributions to Senator Barack Obama's
> presidential campaign without being detected.
>
> So this afternoon, sitting in her family room at her home in
> Weaverville, N.C., while her two-year-old was watching "Sesame
> Street," Ms. Franzi got on her laptop to conduct an experiment. She
> used her debit card to make a $15 donation to Mr. Obama's campaign.
>
> Ms. Franzi, who described herself as conservative and preferring
> Senator John McCain over Mr. Obama, used the name "Della Ware" and
> entered an address of 12345 No Way in Far Far Away, DE 78954. Under
> employer, she listed: Americans Against Obama; for occupation, she
> typed in: Founder.
>
> To her surprise, she said, her contribution went through in "fewer
> than three seconds." Then, in order to be fair, she repeated the
> experiment on Mr. McCain's Web site, entering the exact same
> information. Three times, she said, she received the message: "We have
> found errors in the information that you submitted. Please review the
> information below and try again."
>
> Ms. Franzi's experiment would not necessarily be notable, except it
> appears that many others are doing the same thing. Power Line, a
> conservative political blog, reported a reader had successfully made
> donations under the names Osama bin Laden, Saddam Hussein and Bill
> Ayers. While those experiences could not be immediately verified, Ms.
> Franzi sent The Caucus a screenshot from her bank account that showed
> a contribution to Obama for America going through at 1:02 p.m.
>
> To be fair to the Obama campaign, officials there have said much of
> their checking for fraud occurs after the transactions have already
> occurred. When they find something wrong, they then refund the amount.
>
> But a New York Times analysis of campaign finance records looking for
> obvious anomalies in donor information quickly found more than a dozen
> contributors to Mr. Obama using obviously fictitious name. This was a
> tiny fraction of Mr. Obama's donor pool, but it appeared from the
> analysis that Mr. McCain had far fewer apparent fake names among his
> donors.
>
> Unlike Mr. Obama, Mr. McCain provides on his Web site a searchable
> database of all of his donors, including those who fall below the $200
> threshold that the Federal Election Commission requires campaigns to
> itemize in their reports. The political blogger Marc Ambinder recently
> reported that searches of this database turned up seven contributions
> from someone named Jesus II of Las Vegas giving a total of $851 to Mr.
> McCain.
>
> The Obama campaign pointed out that a search of the name "Anonymous,
> Anonymous" also turns up pages of contributions to the McCain
> campaign, including more than two dozen that exceed $200 but for some
> reason do not appear in F.E.C. records. It should be pointed out that
> campaigns are permitted to accept donations of up to $50 in cash or
> anonymously. There are other odd donors that appear in searches of the
> McCain database but fall below the $200 threshold, including "The Gun
> Shop" from Hood River, Oregon., who contributed $100 and "Adorable
> Manabat" from Winnetka, Calif., who gave $200.
>
> Other news reports have surfaced recently of people discovering credit
> card charges they had not made to the Obama campaign. And The
> Washington Post reported this week the tale of Mary T. Biskup of
> Manchester, Missouri, who received a call recently from the Obama
> campaign asking if she had donated $174,800 to the campaign. Ms.
> Biskup said she had not and told the Post it appeared someone had used
> her name but not her credit card number, because nothing had showed up
> on her own bills.
>
> The Obama campaign said it quickly spotted the donations ostensibly
> made by Ms. Biskup and began looking into it right away, contacting
> her and then charging back the money to the credit card.
>
> The main problem, according to Ms. Franzi, seems to be that Mr.
> Obama's Web site apparently does not require that the donor's
> information match the information on the credit card making the
> contribution, while Mr. McCain's seems to have stricter standards.
>
> Ms. Franzi insisted her experiment had nothing to do with her being a
> McCain supporter. "Nothing that I did today would have turned out any
> different if I were an Obama supporter. I would be equally disgusted
> with my own candidate for doing the same thing."
>
> Nevertheless, a half hour after her "fake" contribution to Mr. Obama
> went through, Ms. Franzi, who had made no donations to either
> candidate, felt compelled to perform her ablutions. She contributed
> $15 to Mr. McCain.
>
>
> On Fri, Oct 24, 2008 at 6:54 PM, David Bradley <dwbrad at gmail.com> wrote:
>> I made a contriubtion to the McCain site with an improper address and
>> it went through just fine.  We'll see if it hits my credit card.
>>
>> The Obama site asked people to certify that I was authorized to give
>> the money, as did the McCain site.  It didn't ask for the secuirty
>> code on my card, but it's not the only e-commerce site that doesn't.
>>
>> Is it your contention that this is a conspiracy of Obama and/or his
>> campaign, to allow foreign interests to contribute and that he will
>> somehow be indebted?
>>
>> If true, throw him in jail and throw away the key. But I don't believe
>> it's true.  I don't believe in the conspiracy theory.
>>
>> I have no problem at all with Obama forgoing public financing and
>> raising a ton of money.  I have no problem with him changing his mind
>> on that topic. I think it's interesting to see people voting with
>> their wallets.
>>
>> Dave
>>
>>
>>
>> On Fri, Oct 24, 2008 at 10:44 AM,  <pdgrand at nospam.wmis.net> wrote:
>>> Brad,
>>>
>>> I've intentionally waited awhile before posting on this subject.  I wanted
>>> to hear specifically what the Obama supporters had to say on the subject.
>>> Is it just me or have they been strangely silent about this?  I think this
>>> is a major issue because it speaks of the character of the man and his
>>> campaign (along with other issues he prefers to skirt or not respond to).
>>> Why is no one on this list from the left leaning persuasion addressing or
>>> speaking up about this?  Is it a non-issue for them?
>>>
>>> Ben C., you're a thoughtful voice for that side.  If I've missed one of
>>> your or other's posts on this subject, please forgive me.  If you would,
>>> please re-send it.  If not, please let me hear your opinion on this.
>>> Specifically, how can this not matter to you?
>>>
>>> Even though I won't vote for him, I honestly and respectfully want to
>>> believe in him because he may be my next President.  So far, I'm having a
>>> hard time believing he is anything but a dirty, sleazy, smooth-talking,
>>> corupt politician.  I think Brad's right.  He's got a lot of people in
>>> this country fooled.
>>>
>>> Paul
>>>
>>>> The 2008 Presidential campaign will go down in history as the most
>>>> corrupt in our nation, ever. What we're witnessing here is something
>>>> you'd expect in some third-world banana republic. Remember the pledge
>>>> to take public campaign funds?  Vanished down the memory hole like so
>>>> many incriminating characters from the past.  Here's the latest
>>>> example-
>>>>
>>>> ------------------------
>>>>
>>>> October 23, 2008  Posted by Scott at 6:52 AM
>>>>
>>>> We've previously noted the gusher of illegal campaign contributions
>>>> flowing into the Obama campaign from contributors such as "Doodad Pro"
>>>> and "Good Will." More recently, incidents have been reported in which
>>>> people have seen credit card charges surface suggesting they donated
>>>> to Barack Obama when they did not. Matthew Mosk and Sarah Cohen noted
>>>> one such incident earlier this week:
>>>>
>>>>     Now comes the story of Mary T. Biskup, of Manchester, Missouri.
>>>> Biskup got a call recently from the Obama campaign, which was trying
>>>> to figure out why she donated $174,800 to the campaign -- well over
>>>> the contribution limit of $2,300.
>>>>
>>>>     The answer she gave them was simple. "That's an error."
>>>>
>>>> Is the Obama campaign knowingly receiving illegal contributions?
>>>> Yesterday one of our readers reported the results of an experiment he
>>>> conducted:
>>>>
>>>>     I've read recent reports of the Obama campaign receiving donations
>>>> from dubious names and foreign locales and it got me wondering: How is
>>>> this possible?
>>>>
>>>>     I run a small Internet business and when I process credit cards
>>>> I'm required to make sure the name on the card exactly matches the
>>>> name of the customer making the purchase. Also, the purchaser's
>>>> address must match that of the cardholders. If these don't match, then
>>>> the payment isn't approved. Period. So how is it possible that the
>>>> Obama campaign could receive donations from fictional people and
>>>> places? Well, I decided to do a little experiment. I went to the Obama
>>>> campaign website and entered the following:
>>>>
>>>>     Name: John Galt
>>>>     Address: 1957 Ayn Rand Lane
>>>>     City: Galts Gulch
>>>>     State: CO
>>>>     Zip: 99999
>>>>
>>>>     Then I checked the box next to $15 and entered my actual credit
>>>> card number and expiration date (it didn't ask for the 3-didgit code
>>>> on the back of the card) and it took me to the next page and... "Your
>>>> donation has been processed. Thank you for your generous gift."
>>>>
>>>>     This simply should not, and could not, happen in any business or
>>>> any campaign that is honestly trying to vet it's donors. Also, I don't
>>>> see how this could possibly happen without the collusion of the credit
>>>> card companies. They simply wouldn't allow any business to process,
>>>> potentially, hundreds of millions in credit card transactions where
>>>> the name on the card doesn't match the purchasers name.
>>>>
>>>>     In short, with the system set up as it is by the Obama camp, an
>>>> individual could donate unlimited amounts of money by simply making up
>>>> fake names and addresses. And Obama is doing his best to facilitate
>>>> this fraud. This is truly scandalous.
>>>>
>>>> Our reader was not yet done. He tried the experiment on the McCain
>>>> site: "I tried the exact same thing at the McCain site and it didn't
>>>> allow the transaction." He then repeated the experiment at the Obama
>>>> site:
>>>>
>>>>     I went back to the Obama site and made three additional donations
>>>> using the names Osama Bin Laden, Saddam Hussein and Bill Ayers, all
>>>> with different addresses. All the transactions went through using the
>>>> same credit card. I saved screenshots of the transactions.
>>>>
>>>> Our reader reports, incidentally, that he was using his MasterCard for
>>>> the contributions. We submit this report in the spirit of inquiry and
>>>> would especially appreciate hearing from readers who can illuminate
>>>> how credit card procedures might (or might not) allow this to happen.
>>>>
>>>> UPDATE: Readers have replicated the experiment reported in this post.
>>>> We will have to revisit the issue tonight or tomorrow and appreciate
>>>> any information you can provide in the meantime.
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>>>>
>>>
>>>
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>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> David Bradley
>> +1.206.234.3977
>> dwbrad at gmail.com
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-- 
David Bradley
+1.206.234.3977
dwbrad at gmail.com