[Rhodes22-list] Social Security Tax

Mon Oct 27 12:33:19 EDT 2008

Bill, do you have a source for your information below?

Here is what the Obama site has to say on social security taxes:

This tax calculator assumes the continuation of current law for Social
Security taxes. Barack Obama has said that he would like to work with
members of Congress from both parties to strengthen Social Security
and prevent privatization while protecting middle class families from
tax increases or benefit cuts. As part of a bipartisan plan that would
be phased in over many years, he would ask those making over $250,000
to contribute a bit more to Social Security to keep it sound. Despite
the smears of his opponents, Obama does not support uncapping the
payroll tax at the full 12.4 percent rate. Instead, he is considering
plans that would ask those making over $250,000 to pay in the range of
2 to 4 percentage points more in total (combined employer and
employee). This change to Social Security would start a decade or more
from now and is similar to the rate increases floated by McCain's
close adviser Senator Lindsey Graham and that McCain has previously
said he "could" support.

Dave

On Sun, Oct 26, 2008 at 7:50 AM, Bill Effros <bill at effros.com> wrote:
> Dave,
>
> What do you know about the impending Social Security Tax hike?
>
> As I understand it, the idea is to uncap maximum social security taxes
> which now stop at $90,000.  That will add 15% to the tax bill of
> everyone who earns more than $90,000 a year.  I believe that is now
> middle class.
>
> For people in the 28% tax bracket, their incremental tax on amounts over
> $90,000 will be 43%.  People in the 35% tax bracket will pay 50% tax on
> money they earn over 90%. (Before city and state taxes.)
>
> In theory this only hits the self-employed at 15%, but somebody is going
> to have to pay 15% more, no matter who is credited with the payment, so
> everyone will be effected.
>
> Of course, the really rich pay nothing, because they don't earn their
> money as ordinary income.
>
> It looks to me like the middle class is going to take a real whack on
> the side of the head.
>
> Do you understand it any differently?
>
> Bill Effros
>
>
>
> David Bradley wrote:
>> Brad,
>>
>> We share many of the same values, if not most.  We probably share a
>> tax bracket.  We do stand on different sides of how to view a few
>> percentage point change in tax rates.  I view it as more of the same,
>> you seem to view it as a fundamental shift.  The Bush tax breaks gave
>> more back to the middle class than the higher tax brackets.
>>
>> I did read your atricle from Fred Smith.  He's a great leader.  I've
>> worked for some great leaders too.  They are divided on this election.
>>
>> More to the point.  What I guess you are saying is that you see Sarah
>> Palin as having a better shot at swinging the vote with her message
>> than staying on message with McCain.  More power to you and yours.  I
>> would be more worried about the "real" John McCain I saw at the Alfred
>> Smith dinner closing the gap than I am the divisive Sarah Palin.
>>
>> T-minus 10 days and counting.  I'll be glad when this is over.  Or at
>> least, when we get to the next chapter.
>>
>> Dave
>>
>>
>> On Sat, Oct 25, 2008 at 6:51 PM, Brad Haslett <flybrad at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Dave,
>>>
>>> No, I haven't written it off.  Kerry was leading in the polls at this
>>> same point.  Obama polled a lot higher going into the late primaries
>>> than the vote he actually got, hence, a consistent ass-kicking by
>>> Hillary in the closing days.  But, I'm a realist.
>>>
>>> The middle?  I skipped the middle.  I grew up working poor, spent the
>>> first ten years of my adult life working poor, and poof! overnight
>>> became so called "upper middle class".
>>>
>>> My wife and I have a bulls eye on our backs.  We already max out the
>>> limits on what we can save tax-free, we already have our tax
>>> deductions reduced, we can't participate in Roth IRA's,  we can't
>>> contribute to Coverdale ESA for our daughter's college - we're rich!
>>>
>>> The truth is, we're not rich.  My wife and I both have above average
>>> jobs that we both worked our asses off for and now find ourselves
>>> defined as "rich". Most people don't realize just how close to being
>>> "rich" they are, and trust me, this $250,000 threshold is an illusion.
>>>
>>> Am I in the "middle" philosophically?  If "in the middle" means I how
>>> I raised my boys, ie,
>>> "work hard, study in school, pay your bills, show-up on time", etc.,
>>> then I'm in the middle.
>>>
>>> Part of what being a conservative means to me is to help others get
>>> ahead.  I'm very proud of what our little company has donated on the
>>> Mississippi Gulf Coast after Katrina to help people get back on their
>>> feet.
>>>
>>> Hold a gun to my head and demand that I contribute, I quickly develop
>>> a different attitude.
>>>
>>> Did you read the article I posted earlier about my boss?  Fred has
>>> educated more people, moved more people into the middle and upper
>>> classes, helped buy more homes and educate more kids than a thousand
>>> 'community organizers'.
>>>
>>> Call me a radical for believing in free enterprise. An yes, Sarah
>>> Palin speaks to my sensibilities!
>>>
>>> Brad
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Sat, Oct 25, 2008 at 8:28 PM, David Bradley <dwbrad at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Sure, I get that.  Only trouble is, she's not running for president.
>>>> Have you written off the election?  I think it's going to be close.
>>>>
>>>> What you don't seem to "get" is that more people in the middle are put
>>>> off by her persona and message than not, and the middle is what
>>>> carries every election.  Do you still see yourself as representing a
>>>> middle (i.e., moderate) view?
>>>>
>>>> Dave
>>>>
>>>> On Sat, Oct 25, 2008 at 5:59 PM, Brad Haslett <flybrad at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Dave,
>>>>>
>>>>> You don't get it do you?  Palin is the only conservative (actually
>>>>> more libertarian) in this race.  She isn't driving ANY conservatives
>>>>> away.  McCain has already done that, as well as some Republicans.
>>>>>
>>>>> You are smart enough to figure this all out on your own aren't you?
>>>>>
>>>>> Brad
>>>>>
>>>>> On Sat, Oct 25, 2008 at 7:49 PM, David Bradley <dwbrad at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Oh I saw it.  That's why I bothered to post this article.  She's a
>>>>>> loose cannon, playing a material role in driving conserviatve
>>>>>> comentators and undecided voters to Obama.  Yep, you go girl.  Drive
>>>>>> that wedge, nice and deep at about the 45th percentile.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Dave
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Sat, Oct 25, 2008 at 5:38 PM, Brad Haslett <flybrad at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Herb,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Dave didn't pay attention to my earlier post today.  He didn't listen
>>>>>>> to our excitement when Palin was named to the ticket.  He obviously
>>>>>>> missed the "Free Sarah Palin" movement early in the campaign.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The longer they misunderstand Sarah Palin the better!
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Frankly, I'm not sure if Sarah can save John McCain from John McCain,
>>>>>>> but she's taken the gloves and is fighting for herself now.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> You go Girl!
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Brad
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Sat, Oct 25, 2008 at 7:34 PM, Herb Parsons <hparsons at parsonsys.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Some of us don't care if she makes McCain's aides happy.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> David Bradley wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> It looks like the McCain camp thinks Palin has turned rogue candidate.
>>>>>>>>>  Another example to me of lack of experience in the majors.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Dave
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/10/25/palin.tension/index.html
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Palin's 'going rogue,' McCain aide says
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Story Highlights
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Sources say there is brewing tension between McCain aides and Palin
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Palin aide says she is trying to take control of her message
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> "She is a diva. She takes no advice from anyone," says a McCain adviser
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> >From Dana Bash, Peter Hamby and John King CNN
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ALBUQUERQUE, New Mexico (CNN) -- With 10 days until Election Day,
>>>>>>>>> long-brewing tensions between GOP vice presidential candidate Gov.
>>>>>>>>> Sarah Palin and key aides to Sen. John McCain have become so intense,
>>>>>>>>> they are spilling out in public, sources say.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Several McCain advisers have suggested to CNN that they have become
>>>>>>>>> increasingly frustrated with what one aide described as Palin "going
>>>>>>>>> rogue."
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> A Palin associate, however, said the candidate is simply trying to
>>>>>>>>> "bust free" of what she believes was a damaging and mismanaged
>>>>>>>>> roll-out.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> McCain sources say Palin has gone off-message several times, and they
>>>>>>>>> privately wonder whether the incidents were deliberate. They cited an
>>>>>>>>> instance in which she labeled robocalls -- recorded messages often
>>>>>>>>> used to attack a candidate's opponent -- "irritating" even as the
>>>>>>>>> campaign defended their use. Also, they pointed to her telling
>>>>>>>>> reporters she disagreed with the campaign's decision to pull out of
>>>>>>>>> Michigan.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> A second McCain source says she appears to be looking out for herself
>>>>>>>>> more than the McCain campaign.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> "She is a diva. She takes no advice from anyone," said this McCain
>>>>>>>>> adviser. "She does not have any relationships of trust with any of us,
>>>>>>>>> her family or anyone else.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> "Also, she is playing for her own future and sees herself as the next
>>>>>>>>> leader of the party. Remember: Divas trust only unto themselves, as
>>>>>>>>> they see themselves as the beginning and end of all wisdom."
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> A Palin associate defended her, saying that she is "not good at
>>>>>>>>> process questions" and that her comments on Michigan and the robocalls
>>>>>>>>> were answers to process questions.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Don't Miss
>>>>>>>>> Palin details plan for special-needs kids
>>>>>>>>> Election Center 2008
>>>>>>>>> But this Palin source acknowledged that Palin is trying to take more
>>>>>>>>> control of her message, pointing to last week's impromptu news
>>>>>>>>> conference on a Colorado tarmac.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Tracey Schmitt, Palin's press secretary, was urgently called over
>>>>>>>>> after Palin wandered over to the press and started talking. Schmitt
>>>>>>>>> tried several times to end the unscheduled session.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> "We acknowledge that perhaps she should have been out there doing
>>>>>>>>> more," a different Palin adviser recently said, arguing that "it's not
>>>>>>>>> fair to judge her off one or two sound bites" from the network
>>>>>>>>> interviews.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> The Politico reported Saturday on Palin's frustration, specifically
>>>>>>>>> with McCain advisers Nicolle Wallace and Steve Schmidt. They helped
>>>>>>>>> decide to limit Palin's initial press contact to high-profile
>>>>>>>>> interviews with Charlie Gibson of ABC and Katie Couric of CBS, which
>>>>>>>>> all McCain sources admit were highly damaging.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> In response, Wallace e-mailed CNN the same quote she gave the
>>>>>>>>> Politico: "If people want to throw me under the bus, my personal
>>>>>>>>> belief is that the most honorable thing to do is to lie there."
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> But two sources, one Palin associate and one McCain adviser, defended
>>>>>>>>> the decision to keep her press interaction limited after she was
>>>>>>>>> picked, both saying flatly that she was not ready and that the
>>>>>>>>> missteps could have been a lot worse.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> They insisted that she needed time to be briefed on national and
>>>>>>>>> international issues and on McCain's record.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> "Her lack of fundamental understanding of some key issues was
>>>>>>>>> dramatic," said another McCain source with direct knowledge of the
>>>>>>>>> process to prepare Palin after she was picked. The source said it was
>>>>>>>>> probably the "hardest" to get her "up to speed than any candidate in
>>>>>>>>> history."
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Schmitt came to the back of the plane Saturday to deliver a statement
>>>>>>>>> to traveling reporters: "Unnamed sources with their own agenda will
>>>>>>>>> say what they want, but from Gov. Palin down, we have one agenda, and
>>>>>>>>> that's to win on Election Day."
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Yet another senior McCain adviser lamented the public recriminations.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> "This is what happens with a campaign that's behind; it brings out the
>>>>>>>>> worst in people, finger-pointing and scapegoating," this senior
>>>>>>>>> adviser said.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> This adviser also decried the double standard, noting that Democratic
>>>>>>>>> nominee Sen. Barack Obama's running mate, Sen. Joe Biden, has gone off
>>>>>>>>> the reservation as well, most recently by telling donors at a
>>>>>>>>> fundraiser that America's enemies will try to "test" Obama.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Tensions like those within the McCain-Palin campaign are not unusual;
>>>>>>>>> vice presidential candidates also have a history of butting heads with
>>>>>>>>> the top of the ticket.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> John Edwards and his inner circle repeatedly questioned Sen. John
>>>>>>>>> Kerry's strategy in 2004, and Kerry loyalists repeatedly aired in
>>>>>>>>> public their view that Edwards would not play the traditional attack
>>>>>>>>> dog role with relish because he wanted to protect his future political
>>>>>>>>> interests.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Even in a winning campaign like Bill Clinton's, some of Al Gore's
>>>>>>>>> aides in 1992 and again in 1996 questioned how Gore was being
>>>>>>>>> scheduled for campaign events.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Jack Kemp's aides distrusted the Bob Dole camp and vice versa, and Dan
>>>>>>>>> Quayle loyalists had a list of gripes remarkably similar to those now
>>>>>>>>> being aired by Gov. Palin's aides.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> With the presidential race in its final days and polls suggesting that
>>>>>>>>> McCain's chances of pulling out a win are growing slim, Palin may be
>>>>>>>>> looking after her own future.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> "She's no longer playing for 2008; she's playing 2012," Democratic
>>>>>>>>> pollster Peter Hart said. "And the difficulty is, when she went on
>>>>>>>>> 'Saturday Night Live,' she became a reinforcement of her caricature.
>>>>>>>>> She never allowed herself to be vetted, and at the end of the day,
>>>>>>>>> voters turned against her both in terms of qualifications and
>>>>>>>>> personally
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>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
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>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
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>>>>>>> __________________________________________________
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> David Bradley
>>>>>> +1.206.234.3977
>>>>>> dwbrad at gmail.com
>>>>>> __________________________________________________
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>>>>>> __________________________________________________
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
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>>>>> __________________________________________________
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> David Bradley
>>>> +1.206.234.3977
>>>> dwbrad at gmail.com
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>>>> __________________________________________________
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>>
>>
>>
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-- 
David Bradley
+1.206.234.3977
dwbrad at gmail.com