[Rhodes22-list] Praise Jesus, the "evolutionists" are going to save us from the Republicans

Herb Parsons hparsons at parsonsys.com
Wed Sep 10 14:17:02 EDT 2008


I'd say that'd be a bit extreme. Akin to telling a woman asking for an 
abortion that she'd need to be sterilized first, after having her eggs 
harvested.

However, I wouldn't be a bit opposed to sterilization of men that refuse 
to pay child support.


elle wrote:
> Forced semen storage and then mass castration could end the abortion debate once and for all.
>
> elle
>
> We can't change the angle of the wind....but we can adjust our sails.
>
> 1992 Rhodes 22   Recyc '06  "WaterMusic"   (Lady in Red)
>
>
> --- On Wed, 9/10/08, Ben Cittadino <bcittadino at dcs-law.com> wrote:
>
>   
>> From: Ben Cittadino <bcittadino at dcs-law.com>
>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Praise Jesus, the "evolutionists" are going to save us from the Republicans
>> To: rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org
>> Date: Wednesday, September 10, 2008, 12:05 PM
>> Herb,
>>
>> You raise an interesting legal point.  Did you know that
>> the right to use
>> deadly force to defend one's property is different in
>> the different states?
>> In fact it changes in direct proportion to one's
>> movement from northeast to
>> southwest.  In most northeastern states a person has a duty
>> to retreat and
>> not use deadly force to defend one's property, but as
>> one moves southwest a
>> person has more legal right to stand their ground and even
>> use deadly force
>> to defend their property. It's actually a fascinating
>> study of the whole
>> macho "code of the west" thing. 
>>
>> I just can't do the abortion debate. Nobody ever
>> changes anybody's mind on
>> it. I think it just comes down to a society balancing very
>> impotant
>> competing interests. So far our society has decided that a
>> woman's privacy
>> right trumps the government's interest in protecting
>> the life (or potential
>> for life) of the not yet born up to the point of about
>> 2/3rds of the way
>> through the pregnancy. It's a judgment call. It seems
>> reasonable enough to
>> me.
>>
>> Ben, s/v Susan Kay, Highlands, NJ 
>>
>>
>>
>> Psssst, Brad, don't tell anyone on here that already
>> knows differently, 
>> but in spite of my personal religious beliefs, I believe
>> that the issue 
>> should be left up to the states.
>>
>> Further, I think that local cities should be allowed to
>> further 
>> restrict, within the confines of their state's charter
>> and constitution, 
>> the matter. I believe that to be how we should operate on a
>> lot of 
>> different issues.
>>
>> Did you know that in some states it's illegal to own a
>> handgun, but in 
>> the GST (Great State of Texas), you not only can legally
>> own one, you 
>> can shoot, and kill, someone who's stupid enough to try
>> to take what is 
>> your property when you've got one of them handy.
>>
>> Brad Haslett wrote:
>>     
>>> Herb,
>>>
>>> The nut cuttin' of the conversation is how much
>>>       
>> should the federal
>>     
>>> government be involved in personal decisions of
>>>       
>> morality.  I say, not
>>     
>>> much.  That should be left up to the states and the
>>>       
>> locals.  I grew up
>>     
>>> in a dry township.  Other people with other ideas
>>>       
>> about that moved six
>>     
>>> miles away. Everything is a trade-off.  Roe v Wade was
>>>       
>> an unnecessary
>>     
>>> invasion of states rights. What certain groups
>>>       
>> can't get legislated,
>>     
>>> they try and get decided from the bench. The issue
>>>       
>> that started this
>>     
>>> thread was Gov. Palin's religious convictions. 
>>>       
>> The first bill she
>>     
>>> vetoed was one that would strip health care benefits
>>>       
>> from the gay
>>     
>>> partners of Alaskan state employees.  Her reasoning
>>>       
>> and statements at
>>     
>>> the time of the veto was that is was unconstitutional.
>>>       
>>  What greater
>>     
>>> litmus test is there?  The far lefts poster child yard
>>>       
>> sign is molding
>>     
>>> and wilting in the sunshine.  We'll have this
>>>       
>> argument another day
>>     
>>> under another banner and with a different cheerleader.
>>>       
>>  This one
>>     
>>> turned out to be an empty suit on too many other
>>>       
>> issues.
>>     
>>> Brad
>>>
>>> On Tue, Sep 9, 2008 at 4:34 PM, Herb Parsons
>>>       
>> <hparsons at parsonsys.com>
>>     
>>> wrote:
>>>   
>>>       
>>>> There is nothing wrong with society determining
>>>>         
>> the "moral boundries"
>>     
>>>> they wish to maintain. There is also nothing wrong
>>>>         
>> with those moral
>>     
>>>> boundries being subject to change as said society
>>>>         
>> changes. In spite of
>>     
>>>> my religious beliefs, I do not now want a
>>>>         
>> theocracy, no have I ever.
>>     
>>>> However, the notion that 5 men can forever dictate
>>>>         
>> to a nation of
>>     
>>>> millions what their moral boundry should be is
>>>>         
>> tyranny. I do not want
>>     
>>>> the feds pushing any agenda one way or the other,
>>>>         
>> and that includes the
>>     
>>>> federal judicial branch. I want the citizenry to
>>>>         
>> make that choice.
>>     
>>>> I know, I know, it kinda blows your "Herb
>>>>         
>> wants his religion for
>>     
>>>> everyone" nonsense, huh Michael?
>>>>
>>>> BTW, all of the above reflects my personal
>>>>         
>> opinion. None of it intended
>>     
>>>> to be perceived by an reader or observer as any
>>>>         
>> type of fact, implied or
>>     
>>>> otherwise. They are worth at least as much as the
>>>>         
>> durability of the
>>     
>>>> media in which they are made, and their only
>>>>         
>> asserted value is that. All
>>     
>>>> readers and/or observers are free, and even
>>>>         
>> welcome, to ascribe to said
>>     
>>>> beliefs, or simply write them off as so much
>>>>         
>> bullshit.
>>     
>>>> Oh, and Michael, you flatter yourself. I
>>>>         
>> didn't just recently "realize"
>>     
>>>> all of that. I DID make the absurd assumption that
>>>>         
>> you recognized
>>     
>>>> opinion when you saw it. Silly me.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Michael D. Weisner wrote:
>>>>     
>>>>         
>>>>> Todd,
>>>>>
>>>>> I certainly never wanted to remove God from my
>>>>>           
>> life.  I, like Ben C.,
>>     
>>>>> have
>>>>> no problem with the coexistence of God and
>>>>>           
>> science.  I cannot understand
>>     
>>>>> why
>>>>> every group in this country (religious or
>>>>>           
>> non-religious) feels that the
>>     
>>>>> separation of church and state means that we
>>>>>           
>> need to remove all traces
>>     
>>>>> of
>>>>> religion and culture from public places. 
>>>>>           
>> Since we can't offend anyone
>>     
>>>>> by
>>>>> celebrating our religious rituals, we must
>>>>>           
>> remove all religion from
>>     
>>>>> schools,
>>>>> government and the public.  I think that if we
>>>>>           
>> remove all holidays,
>>     
>>>>> ethnic
>>>>> traditions, religious symbols, etc. the world
>>>>>           
>> will be a pretty ugly
>>     
>>>>> place.
>>>>>
>>>>>  I do, however, feel that religious beliefs
>>>>>           
>> are very personal and no one
>>     
>>>>> has
>>>>> the right to impose them on others.  I think
>>>>>           
>> that this is what was meant
>>     
>>>>> by
>>>>> the separation of church and state, to
>>>>>           
>> eliminate religious persecution. 
>>     
>>>>> How
>>>>> is one to deal with the concept put forth by
>>>>>           
>> some faiths that place the
>>     
>>>>> responsibility for misdeeds by one on all of
>>>>>           
>> society?  What is the basis
>>     
>>>>> for
>>>>> the following statement from Todd: "Each
>>>>>           
>> draws his line of good
>>     
>>>>> conscience
>>>>> to justify acts past, present, or future in
>>>>>           
>> his or her own life (or
>>     
>>>>> afterlife) - not to protect the legal
>>>>>           
>> reproductive rights of every
>>     
>>>>> random
>>>>> Jane Doe."  What, exactly, does it mean?
>>>>>
>>>>> Mike
>>>>> s/v Shanghai'd Summer ('81)
>>>>> Nissequogue River, NY
>>>>>
>>>>> From: "Todd Tavares"
>>>>>           
>> <sprocket80 at mail.com>Sent: Tuesday, September 09,
>>     
>>>>> 2008
>>>>> 4:43 PM
>>>>>
>>>>>       
>>>>>           
>>>>>> Michael, It is just another example of
>>>>>>             
>> taking God OR religion out of
>>     
>>>>>> the
>>>>>> equation to ease our conscience. Excluding
>>>>>>             
>> cases of rape, incest, etc.,
>>     
>>>>>> the parents of the developing fetus;
>>>>>>             
>> whether you consider it alive or
>>     
>>>>>> not, had a choice and responsibility they
>>>>>>             
>> chose not to exercise.  Is
>>     
>>>>>> the
>>>>>> knowledge and ability to perform surgical
>>>>>>             
>> abortion the only thing that
>>     
>>>>>> separates us from our animal urges and the
>>>>>>             
>> apes we evolved from?
>>     
>>>>>> Religious, Christian, Atheist, or Pagan;
>>>>>>             
>> view videos and pictures of a
>>     
>>>>>> "partial birth abortion"-- which
>>>>>>             
>> the legal rights of the mother to
>>     
>>>>>> choose, Clinton initially fought to try to
>>>>>>             
>> preserve and even a
>>     
>>>>>> civilized
>>>>>> atheist would exclaim OH MY F'ing GOD
>>>>>>             
>> and start thinking
>>     
>>>>>> differently...even if they'd never
>>>>>>             
>> admit it openly and risk
>>     
>>>>>> contradicting
>>>>>> their publicly espoused views.   Each
>>>>>>             
>> draws his line of good conscience
>>     
>>>>>> to justify acts past, present, or future
>>>>>>             
>> in his or her own life (or
>>     
>>>>>> afterlife) - not to protect the legal
>>>>>>             
>> reproductive rights of every
>>     
>>>>>> random
>>>>>> Jane Doe.   Let's look in the mirror
>>>>>>             
>> and stop lying to ourselves and
>>     
>>>>>> each
>>>>>> other here. (not a fact....just a thought)
>>>>>>             
>> Todd T
>>     
>>>>>>  ----- Original Message -----
>>>>>>  From: "Michael D. Weisner"
>>>>>>  To: "The Rhodes 22 Email List"
>>>>>>  Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Praise
>>>>>>             
>> Jesus, the "evolutionists" are
>>     
>>>>>>  going to save us from the Republicans
>>>>>>  Date: Tue, 9 Sep 2008 15:54:12 -0400
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>  Herb,
>>>>>>
>>>>>>  You state as fact:
>>>>>>  "... the individual's religious
>>>>>>             
>> belifs (sic) involve yet another
>>     
>>>>>>  individual."
>>>>>>
>>>>>>  You conclude:
>>>>>>  "You are advocating that a woman be
>>>>>>             
>> allowed to kill another living
>>     
>>>>>>  human
>>>>>>  based on HER religious beliefs, not those
>>>>>>             
>> of that living human."
>>     
>>>>>>  The "fact" is actually your
>>>>>>             
>> opinion according to your religious
>>     
>>>>>>  beliefs that
>>>>>>  this is another human being. You then
>>>>>>             
>> employ your religious beliefs
>>     
>>>>>>  to
>>>>>>  close the argument in restating the
>>>>>>             
>> premise "... of that living
>>     
>>>>>>  human."
>>>>>>  There is no logic to the argument. It is
>>>>>>             
>> so only because you say it
>>     
>>>>>>  is so,
>>>>>>  and that is according to your religious
>>>>>>             
>> beliefs. This is circular, at
>>     
>>>>>>  best.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>  I know that you can do better ...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>  Mike
>>>>>>  s/v Shanghai'd Summer ('81)
>>>>>>  Nissequogue River, NY
>>>>>>
>>>>>>  From: "Herb Parsons" Sent:
>>>>>>             
>> Tuesday, September 09,
>>     
>>>>>>  2008 3:06 PM
>>>>>>  > Resent away Michael, but what did I
>>>>>>             
>> "present as fact"?
>>     
>>>>>>  >
>>>>>>  > And, beliefs aside, my reasoning is
>>>>>>             
>> not "circular". I believe very
>>     
>>>>>>  much
>>>>>>  > in an individual's right to
>>>>>>             
>> decide for themselves what they will
>>     
>>>>>>  and
>>>>>>  > will not do. However, when that
>>>>>>             
>> decision directly affects another,
>>     
>>>>>>  > especially the life of another, than
>>>>>>             
>> it is not the one individual's
>>     
>>>>>>  > choice to make.
>>>>>>  >
>>>>>>  >
>>>>>>  > Michael D. Weisner wrote:
>>>>>>  >> Herb,
>>>>>>  >>
>>>>>>  >> It always amazes me that you
>>>>>>             
>> have no problem putting your beliefs
>>     
>>>>>>  and
>>>>>>  >> opinions in the form of fact in
>>>>>>             
>> your arguments. The interesting
>>     
>>>>>>  thing is
>>>>>>  >> that the more I agree with the
>>>>>>             
>> basic principles of these
>>     
>>>>>>  discussions, the
>>>>>>  >> more I resent your reasoning.
>>>>>>             
>> While we may reach the same
>>     
>>>>>>  conclusion, the
>>>>>>  >> paths are significantly diverse.
>>>>>>  >>
>>>>>>  >> My opinions and beliefs aside, I
>>>>>>             
>> think that in order to state "I
>>     
>>>>>>  would
>>>>>>  >> agree, except in this case, the
>>>>>>             
>> individual's religious belifs
>>     
>>>>>>  (sic) involve
>>>>>>  >> yet another individual,"
>>>>>>             
>> one must employ circular reasoning, thus
>>     
>>>>>>  defeating
>>>>>>  >> the value of the statement.
>>>>>>  >>
>>>>>>  >> Mike
>>>>>>  >> s/v Shanghai'd Summer
>>>>>>             
>> ('81)
>>     
>>>>>>  >> Nissequogue River, NY
>>>>>>  >>
>>>>>>  >> From: "Herb Parsons"
>>>>>>             
>> Sent: Tuesday, September 09,
>>     
>>>>>>  >> 2008 1:58 PM
>>>>>>  >>
>>>>>>  >>> I would agree, except in
>>>>>>             
>> this case, the individual's religious
>>     
>>>>>>  belifs
>>>>>>  >>> involve yet another
>>>>>>             
>> individual. You are advocating that a woman
>>     
>>>>>>  be
>>>>>>  >>> allowed to kill another
>>>>>>             
>> living human based on HER religious
>>     
>>>>>>  beliefs, not
>>>>>>  >>> those of that living human.
>>>>>>  >>>
>>>>>>  >>> Rik Sandberg wrote:
>>>>>>  >>>
>>>>>>  >>>> Herb,
>>>>>>  >>>>
>>>>>>  >>>> Well, here you go my
>>>>>>             
>> friend. War is a terrible analogy.
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>
>>>>>>  >>>> IF we are going to have
>>>>>>             
>> freedom OF religion, which would also
>>     
>>>>>>  include
>>>>>>  >>>> freedom FROM religion
>>>>>>             
>> and the abortion issue is mostly decided
>>     
>>>>>>  on a
>>>>>>  >>>> religious (or
>>>>>>             
>> non-religious, choice again) basis, it is not our
>>     
>>>>>>  place to
>>>>>>  >>>> expect anyone else to
>>>>>>             
>> assume our religious beliefs.
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>
>>>>>>  >>>> Which leads us right
>>>>>>             
>> back to; the gov't should have no voice in
>>     
>>>>>>  this at
>>>>>>  >>>> all.
>>>>>>  >>>>
>>>>>>  >>>> Rik
>>>>>>  >>>>
>>>>>>  >>>> Ayn Rand was a prophet -
>>>>>>             
>> - it isn't my fault
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>
>>>>>>  >>>> Herb Parsons wrote:
>>>>>>  >>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>> I like your honest
>>>>>>             
>> assessment on Palin, but I disagree about
>>     
>>>>>>  your
>>>>>>  >>>>> labeling of the
>>>>>>             
>> position.
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>> If I say I'm not
>>>>>>             
>> going to fight in a war, but it's OK if my
>>     
>>>>>>  government
>>>>>>  >>>>> attacks another, am
>>>>>>             
>> I anti-war, or pro-war?
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>> Obviously,
>>>>>>             
>> you'll not have an abortion, that would mean a male
>>     
>>>>>>  could be
>>>>>>  >>>>> neither pro or anti;
>>>>>>             
>> however, anyone that believes the issue
>>     
>>>>>>  does not
>>>>>>  >>>>> affect me is wearing
>>>>>>             
>> blinders.
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>> Rik Sandberg wrote:
>>>>>>  >>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>> Herb,
>>>>>>  >>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>> Agreed. Palin
>>>>>>             
>> claims no more religiousity (is that a word,
>>     
>>>>>>  sounds good)
>>>>>>  >>>>>> than either of
>>>>>>             
>> the other three candidates involved. She has
>>     
>>>>>>  also shown
>>>>>>  >>>>>> that she can
>>>>>>             
>> govern without forcing forcing those beliefs on
>>     
>>>>>>  her
>>>>>>  >>>>>> constituents.
>>>>>>  >>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>> On the abortion
>>>>>>             
>> issue: Yep, she's against them, for her. So am
>>     
>>>>>>  I, for
>>>>>>  >>>>>> me. I am
>>>>>>             
>> pro-choice. People just can't seem to get a handle on
>>     
>>>>>>  the idea
>>>>>>  >>>>>> that pro-choice
>>>>>>             
>> doesn't mean anti or pro abortion. It means
>>     
>>>>>>  you should
>>>>>>  >>>>>> be able to make
>>>>>>             
>> your own choice and let others make theirs,
>>     
>>>>>>  ie, mind
>>>>>>  >>>>>> your own
>>>>>>             
>> business.
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>> From what
>>>>>>             
>> I've seen Palin, as governor of Alaska has been
>>     
>>>>>>  doing this
>>>>>>  >>>>>> too.
>>>>>>  >>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>> If I had my way,
>>>>>>             
>> the federal gov't wouldn't be involved in
>>     
>>>>>>  abortion at
>>>>>>  >>>>>> all.
>>>>>>  >>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>> Rik
>>>>>>  >>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>> Ayn Rand was a
>>>>>>             
>> prophet - - it isn't my fault
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>> Herb Parsons
>>>>>>             
>> wrote:
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>> Stan,
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>> What
>>>>>>             
>> evidence do you have that would lead you to believe that
>>     
>>>>>>  Palin
>>>>>>  >>>>>>> would force
>>>>>>             
>> her religious belief on anyone? My understanding
>>     
>>>>>>  is that
>>>>>>  >>>>>>> she's
>>>>>>             
>> all for allowing the individual states to set the
>>     
>>>>>>  standard.
>>>>>>  >>>>>>> However,
>>>>>>             
>> that's really beside the point. As you said,
>>     
>>>>>>  anyone's
>>>>>>  >>>>>>> pinpoint
>>>>>>  >>>>>>> of the exact
>>>>>>             
>> time is a "religious" matter, or a matter of
>>     
>>>>>>  fath, thus
>>>>>>  >>>>>>> ANYONE
>>>>>>             
>> setting pinpointed time would be them foisting their
>>     
>>>>>>  beliefs on
>>>>>>  >>>>>>> others.
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>> Surely
>>>>>>             
>> you're not advocating allowing the parents to decide
>>     
>>>>>>  at any
>>>>>>  >>>>>>> time
>>>>>>  >>>>>>> they choose,
>>>>>>             
>> up to and including while the "fetus" is still
>>     
>>>>>>  in
>>>>>>  >>>>>>> college?
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>> stan wrote:
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>> Slim,
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>> As a
>>>>>>             
>> member of your religious faith, and an ardent fan, if
>>     
>>>>>>  you really
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>> plan
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>> to skip
>>>>>>             
>> voting (in effect voting for those whose direct
>>     
>>>>>>  religious
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> instructions got us into such a waste of our wealth and
>>     
>>>>>>  blood) I
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>> would be
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>> truly
>>>>>>             
>> saddened. I don't think poorly of John's and
>> Palin's
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> inability to
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>> live up
>>>>>>             
>> to their own family values, relying on their gods to
>>     
>>>>>>  forgive
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>> them -
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>> I worry
>>>>>>             
>> about their health; a topic that seems to be
>>     
>>>>>>  forbidden to
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>> address.
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> John's cheek is not like that from his prisoner days and
>> his
>>     
>>>>>>  vp could
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>> be our
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>> leader
>>>>>>             
>> without notice. Then where would this country's
>>     
>>>>>>  founding
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>> desire
>>>>>>             
>> for
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> religious freedom end up? The first example is already on
>>     
>>>>>>  the table
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>> Catholic
>>>>>>             
>> Joe has it right: When life starts is a religious
>>     
>>>>>>  opinion
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>> should
>>>>>>             
>> not be one decided by government. You may feel life
>>     
>>>>>>  does not
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>> start
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>> until a
>>>>>>             
>> breath is taken, the Jews count a number of months
>>     
>>>>>>  before the
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>> start,
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>             
>> Christens count from the moment the cells begin
>>     
>>>>>>  dividing.
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> Personally I
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> don't think it starts until after college. If we allow a
>>     
>>>>>>  Palin to
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>> call
>>>>>>             
>> such
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>> shots we
>>>>>>             
>> are on a path Jefferson and all those other smart
>>     
>>>>>>  guys
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>> insisted
>>>>>>             
>> on
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> avoiding. McCain told the TV interviewer that if he had his
>>     
>>>>>>  way the
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>> first
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>> judge he
>>>>>>             
>> would get rid of is Ginsberg and than went down the
>>     
>>>>>>  list of
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>> her
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>> kind.
>>>>>>             
>> Once this is allowed to start (we already have allowed
>>     
>>>>>>  god
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>> onto our
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>> coins),
>>>>>>             
>> god (hypocritically speaking) help us - or we will
>>     
>>>>>>  all,
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> eventually,
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>> become
>>>>>>             
>> strong advocates of the second amendment.
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>> John, at
>>>>>>             
>> least is a flip flopper so, if elected, would
>>     
>>>>>>  probably
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>> revert
>>>>>>             
>> to
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>> many of
>>>>>>             
>> his reasonable positions. It is Palin I am fearful
>>     
>>>>>>  will give
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>> us
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>> even
>>>>>>             
>> worse than another 8 years. (And this from a confessed
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> womanizer.)
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>> stan/ec
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>> .
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>> -----
>>>>>>             
>> Original Message ----- From: "Steven Alm"
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>> To:
>>>>>>             
>> "The Rhodes 22 Email List"
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>> Sent:
>>>>>>             
>> Tuesday, September 09, 2008 2:02 AM
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>> Subject:
>>>>>>             
>> Re: [Rhodes22-list] Praise Jesus,the
>>     
>>>>>>  "evolutionists" are
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>> going to
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>> save us
>>>>>>             
>> from the Republicans
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> Todd,
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> I'm an atheist and I think Palin's a religious kook.
>> And
>>     
>>>>>>  you're
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> right, I
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> won't vote for a religious kook. I haven't studied
>> Darwin
>>     
>>>>>>  very much
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>> (and
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>> I
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> applaud your research and quotes) but I don't think
>> that's
>>     
>>>>>>  the only
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> rebuke
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>             
>> creationism. Since most of the species of plant and
>>     
>>>>>>  animal life
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>> on
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>> this
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> earth are in fact extinct, I'd call that
>> "unintelligent
>>     
>>>>>>  design."
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>> You
>>>>>>             
>> said there are only two possibilities as to how life
>>     
>>>>>>  started.
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>> Are
>>>>>>             
>> you
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> sure? How do you know this? What I know is that all
>>     
>>>>>>  religions
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> serve in
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> answering three questions: Where did we come from, how do
>>     
>>>>>>  we live
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>> what
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> happens when we die? Myself, I've answered those
>> questions
>>     
>>>>>>  to my
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>> own
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> satisfaction and I don't need the church to tell me
>>     
>>>>>>  anything.
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>> Slim
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>> On
>>>>>>             
>> Mon, Sep 8, 2008 at 5:32 PM, Todd Tavares
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> wrote:
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> Slim, Wow! are you are going to vote for Obama because he
>>     
>>>>>>  is a
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> Marxist
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> or not vote for McCain just because Palin is a religious
>>     
>>>>>>  extremist?
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> :^D
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> Glad you mentioned carbon dating. Carbon has been proven
>>     
>>>>>>  by many
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> scientists to be a wholly inaccurate method of dating. I
>>     
>>>>>>  am far
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> from
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> being a scientist...or a religious kook thinking the earth
>>     
>>>>>>  is only
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> a
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> couple of thousand of years old, but there is just as much
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> scientific
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> information out there to; while not proving creation is
>>     
>>>>>>  the truth,
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> surely
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> proves evolution is improbable if not impossible. You
>>     
>>>>>>  are/were an
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> educator and were taught evolution from a text book, like
>>     
>>>>>>  we all
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> were.
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> Just because you read something in a text book does not
>>     
>>>>>>  make it
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> truth.
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> http://www.darwins-theory-of-evolution.com/ Maybe we could
>>     
>>>>>>  all
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> stomach
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> creationism if we called it a theory too. After all that
>>     
>>>>>>  is what
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> evolution is...just an unproven theory. There are equally
>>     
>>>>>>  as many
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> scientists out there who believe they have proven
>>     
>>>>>>  evolution is
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> myth. It
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> was not Darwin's brainstorm anyway. He thought he could
>>     
>>>>>>  further
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> explain
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> a centuries old belief; that life arose from non life and
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> everything
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> sprang from a common ancestor. Modern scientists say it
>>     
>>>>>>  was that
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> first
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> amino acid or protein chain in the pool of "primordial
>>     
>>>>>>  ooze." I
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> like how
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> one Nobel prize winner (Biology 1967?) put it:
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> "There are only two possibilities as to how life arose;
>>     
>>>>>>  one is
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> spontaneous generation arising to evolution, the other is
>>     
>>>>>>  a
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> supernatural
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> creative act of God, there is no third possibility.
>>     
>>>>>>  Spontaneous
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> generation that life arose from non-living matter was
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> scientifically
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> disproved 120 years ago by Louis Pasteur and others. That
>>     
>>>>>>  leaves us
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> with
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> only one possible conclusion, that life arose as a
>>     
>>>>>>  creative act of
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> God. I
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> will not accept that philosophically because I do not want
>>     
>>>>>>  to
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> believe in
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> God, therefore I choose to believe in that which I know is
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> scientifically
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> impossible, spontaneous generation arising to
>> evolution."
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> (Dr. George Wald, evolutionist, Professor Emeritus of
>>     
>>>>>>  Biology at
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> the
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> University at Harvard, Nobel Prize winner in Biology.)
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> But the most interesting fact is that even Darwin himself
>>     
>>>>>>  realized
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> evolution was not workable.
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> "To suppose that the eye, with all its inimitable
>>     
>>>>>>  contrivances for
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> adjusting the focus to different distances, for admitting
>>     
>>>>>>  different
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> amounts of light, and for the correction of spherical and
>>     
>>>>>>  chromatic
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> aberration, could have formed by natural selection, seems,
>>     
>>>>>>  I freely
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> confess, absurd in the highest degree possible."
>> (Charles
>>     
>>>>>>  Darwin,
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> "The
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> origin of species by means of natural selection")
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> "If it could be demonstrated that any complex organ
>>     
>>>>>>  existed which
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> could
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> not possibly have been formed by numerous, successive,
>>     
>>>>>>  slight
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> modifications, my theory would absolutely break down."
>>     
>>>>>>  (Charles
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> Darwin,
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> "The Origin of Species")
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> "Often a cold shudder has run through me, and I have
>> asked
>>     
>>>>>>  myself
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> whether
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> I may have not devoted myself to a fantasy." (Charles
>>     
>>>>>>  Darwin, Life
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> and
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> Letters, 1887, Vol. 2, p. 229)
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> I could post a few hundred quotes from noted doctors and
>>     
>>>>>>  scientists
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> to
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> try to "prove" evolution wrong or creation right.
>> I could
>>     
>>>>>>  "do my
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> homework" as we say here on the list and cite actual
>>     
>>>>>>  findings, but
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> that
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> is not necessary. Because to dismiss the possibility of
>>     
>>>>>>  God or some
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> other
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> Intelligent Designer makes it easier to accept our notions
>>     
>>>>>>  that it
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> is ok
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> to be a homosexual (and not allow me a choice when the
>>     
>>>>>>  schools
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> teach this
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> gargage to my kids while denying the right to learn about
>>     
>>>>>>  the
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> theory of
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> creation along with evolution) or that it should be a
>>     
>>>>>>  crime to kill
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> a
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> tree, but ok to kill an unborn baby. Not to say everyone
>>     
>>>>>>  believing
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> in
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> evolution is an athiest (or a Democrat), but you have made
>>     
>>>>>>  me see
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> this as
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> a hinge factor in how I will vote....real issues aside.
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> Todd T
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> Besides, it is not very PC to say we evolved (were
>>     
>>>>>>  "selected") from
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> apes.
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> We don't want any of the apes that were not selected to
>> be
>>     
>>>>>>  made to
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> feel
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> inferior.
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> ----- Original Message -----
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> From: "Steven Alm"
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> To: "The Rhodes 22 Email List"
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Praise Jesus, the Republicans
>>     
>>>>>>  are
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> going to
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> save us from the Republicans
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> Date: Mon, 8 Sep 2008 13:11:17 -0500
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> "Ahh, so the "tolerant" lefty has a litmus
>> test for
>>     
>>>>>>  religious
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> beliefs."
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> Yes, I require that the candidates be sane, critical
>>     
>>>>>>  thinkers.
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> Palin is
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> obviously not. I wouldn't say that if she were a
>> Catholic
>>     
>>>>>>  or a
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> Lutheran
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> but
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> here's a woman who wants to stare down the whole
>>     
>>>>>>  scientific
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> community and
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> deny things like carbon 14 dating and declare that the
>>     
>>>>>>  heavens and
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> earth
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> are
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> only a few thousand years old. You didn't just call ME
>> an
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> extremist, did
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> you?
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> Brad, you left out the part of Kroon saying that his
>>     
>>>>>>  parishioners
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> should
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> pray for the completion of the pipeline because at the end
>>     
>>>>>>  of the
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> world,
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> folks will flock to Alaska as their final refuge.
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> I can't believe that was you quoting all that God stuff.
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> Slim
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> On Mon, Sep 8, 2008 at 12:18 PM, Steven Alm wrote:
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>>>>>>>>>>>>> "She's
>>>>>>>>>>>>>                           
>> already demonstrated that she is fully capable of
>>     
>>>>>>>>>>>>> separating her
>>>>>>>>>>>>>                           
>>>>>>>>>>>>> personal
>>>>>>>>>>>>>                           
>> beliefs from her duties."
>>     
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Wouldn't it
>>>>>>>>>>>>>                           
>> be better if she didn't have to?
>>     
>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Mon, Sep 8,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>                           
>> 2008 at 6:18 AM, Herb Parsons wrote:
>>     
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Ahh, so the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>                             
>> "tolerant" lefty has a litmus test for
>>     
>>>>>>  religious
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> beliefs.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>                             
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> She's
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>                             
>> already demonstrated that she is fully capable of
>>     
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> separating
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>                             
>> her
>>     
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> personal
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>                             
>> beliefs from her duties. She vetoed a bill that
>>     
>>>>>>  would
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> have
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>                             
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> denied
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>                             
>> benefits to gay couples.
>>     
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> But, you
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>                             
>> extremists keep it up, I'm sure you'll find (or
>>     
>>>>>>  make up)
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> SOMETHING
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>                             
>> on her.
>>     
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Steven Alm
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>                             
>> wrote:
>>     
>> She's a creationist. Her Assembly of God stuff is a
>>     
>>>>>>  deal breaker
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>                               
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> me.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>                             
>> Religious extremism cannot be tolerated.
>>     
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>                               
>> most important legacy the president leaves is the
>>     
>> appointment of
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> the
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> supreme
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>                               
>> court.
>>     
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>                               
>> next pres might appoint as many as three. If
>>     
>>>>>>  Sarabaracuda
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> has
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>                               
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> her
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> way,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>                             
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> say
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>                               
>> goodbye to Roe V. Wade and hello to back-ally coat
>>     
>>>>>>  hanger
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> abortions.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>                             
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Slim
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>                               
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Sun,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>                               
>> Sep 7, 2008 at 6:14 PM, Herb Parsons
>>     
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>                             
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>                                 
>> think it's funny that the candidate that was
>>     
>>>>>>  considered as a
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> running
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> mate for the Democratic choice a few years back, is
>>     
>>>>>>  now being
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> touted as
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> "more of the same". Keep trying though, you guys
>> may
>>     
>>>>>>  find
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> something
>>     
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> that
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>                             
>> works.
>>     
>> What exactly makes Palin a "religious kook", that
>> fact
>>     
>>>>>>  that's
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> she
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>                                 
>> religious? I think your colors are beginning to show.
>>     
>> petelargo wrote:
>>     
>> Ben, thanks for your post. As you may have noticed,
>>     
>>>>>>  there is
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> no
>>     
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> dialogue
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>                             
>> with
>>     
>> the right-wing extremists. You are wrong, end of
>>     
>>>>>>  discussion
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> and
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> your
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> an
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>                             
>> idiot to boot.
>>     
>> When John McCain won the nomination, Bush disappears
>>     
>>>>>>  overseas.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> At
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> the
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> RNC,
>>     
>> no Bush, no Cheney (and no mention of them). They
>>     
>>>>>>  know it's a
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> failed
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> administration. Where were the solutions. Once again,
>>     
>>>>>>  they are
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> trying
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>                             
>> frame the campaign as an ideology argument rather
>>     
>>>>>>  than an
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> issues
>>     
>> discussion.
>>     
>> Today on Face the Nation, "Sis Cum Ba and
>> WHA-LAA",
>>     
>>>>>>  McCain is
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> now
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> the
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> change
>>     
>> candidate and stated that he will end the incredible
>>     
>> corruption in
>>     
>> Washington and the failed policies. John McCain has
>>     
>>>>>>  re-defined
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> a
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> whole
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> new
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>                                 
>> level of flip-flopping on over two dozen key issues
>>     
>>>>>>  within the
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> last
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> eight
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>                             
>> years including his own authored bill that he was for
>>     
>>>>>>  and now
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> against.
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> I couldn't give a poop about the experience argument
>>     
>>>>>>  of Palin
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> vs
>>     
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Obama.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>                             
>> It's
>>     
>> a waste of time. The entire
>>     
>>>>>>  Bush-Cheney-Rumsfeld-Rice-Rove,
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> etc
>>     
>> administration could be argued to be the most
>>     
>>>>>>  experienced
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> administration
>>     
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> in
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>                                 
>> the history of the White House. A huge amount of
>>     
>>>>>>  prior
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> "executive
>>     
>> experience". For the first time in recent politics
>>     
>>>>>>  the
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> Republicans
>>     
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> had
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>                             
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>                                 
>> power in the white house, judicial, house and senate.
>>     
>>>>>>  How was
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> it
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> for
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> you?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>                             
>> It's one thing to drive a tractor trailer up our
>>     
>>>>>>  butts, but
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> when
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> they
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> start
>>     
>> blowing on the horn while there're doing it, it's
>>     
>>>>>>  really gone
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> too
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> far.
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> A big thank you for the memories: the debt, the dead,
>>     
>>>>>>  the
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> twisting
>>     
>> intelligence to "sell" us a war on a country that
>> did
>>     
>>>>>>  not
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> attack
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> us,
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>                             
>> good ol boy ineffectual cronyism, and finally the
>>     
>>>>>>  shredding of
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> the
>>     
>> constitution. With Palin we now we get to have
>>     
>>>>>>  another
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> religious
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> kook
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>                             
>> satisfy the so-called conservative extremist
>>     
>>>>>>  religious right
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> to
>>     
>> 'bridge'
>>     
>> them into this administration and get money.
>>     
>> Spending 5-10 billion dollars a month on Iraq and
>>     
>>>>>>  kissing
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> chinese
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> ass
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> (borrowing the money) of the most Marxist suppressive
>>     
>> government
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> on
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>                             
>> planet at this time is a conservative value?
>>     
>> Finally, the biggest hypocrisy of all . That these
>>     
>>>>>>  extremists
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> actually
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> think
>>     
>> that they and the republicans are the vanguards of
>>     
>> conservatism?
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> The
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> two
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>                             
>> top key pillars of conservatism are less government
>>     
>>>>>>  and
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> government
>>     
>> intrusion
>>     
>> and fiscal responsibility. The only administration
>>     
>>>>>>  that walked
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> that
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> talk
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>                             
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> in
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>                                 
>> 50 years was a Democrat that left Bush a 500 billion
>>     
>>>>>>  dollar
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> surplus.
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> He
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>                             
>> blew
>>     
>> threw that in one year and it was prior to 9-11. And
>>     
>>>>>>  there is
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> no
>>     
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> greater
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>                             
>> government intrusion that being told what you can or
>>     
>>>>>>  cannot do
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> with or
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> put
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>                                 
>> into your body. Palin wants privacy for her family
>>     
>>>>>>  decisions,
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> but
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> she
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> wants
>>     
>> to legislate publicly what you should do with yours.
>>     
>>>>>>  No
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> thanks.
>>     
>> Ben Cittadino-2 wrote:
>>     
>> My Dear Culture Warriors;
>>     
>> So....are we having fun yet?
>>     
>> First, I'd like to thank Richard and Slim for
>>     
>>>>>>  stepping up to
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> join
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> the
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> "Assault on the Citadel".
>>     
>> The bullets don't sting as much when the adversary's
>>     
>>>>>>  fire is
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> spread
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> out
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>                             
>> among more than one target.
>>     
>> In the words first uttered by Gen. "Vinegar Joe"
>>     
>>>>>>  Stillwell,
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> "illegitimi
>>     
>> non carborundum".
>>     
>> As for Tootle, Brad, and Herb, you guys crack me up.
>>     
>>>>>>  I posted
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> about
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> Obama
>>     
>> only because I saw Tootle's post that
>>     
>> suggested anybody supporting Obama was either a
>>     
>>>>>>  marxist, or a
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> farm
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> animal.
>>     
>> What did he expect when he said that?
>>     
>> Herb, where was your outrage that Tootle would refer
>>     
>>>>>>  to some
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> of
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> his
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> fellow
>>     
>> "Rhodies" in such derogatry terms? Supporting
>> Obama
>>     
>>>>>>  or McCain
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> may turn out to be right or wrong, but if we debate
>>     
>>>>>>  policy
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> and
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> don't
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> engage in mere name-calling this "sailor's
>> bar"
>>     
>>>>>>  could be an
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> interesting
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>                             
>> place.
>>     
>> Richard's "geezer" remarks are defensible on
>> several
>>     
>>>>>>  grounds.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> First,
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> he
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>                             
>> was provoked. Second, he was defending ME.
>>     
>> Third, it was funny. Calling someone a "marxist"
>> as
>>     
>>>>>>  Tootle
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> did is
>>     
>> several
>>     
>> magnitudes worse than gentle kidding of the
>>     
>> "old fart" kind. Surely you see the difference.
>>     
>> The positions I tried to lay out as reasons some
>>     
>>>>>>  people
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> support
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> Obama
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> were
>>     
>> intended as an outline of ideology (as Slim noted),
>>     
>> not an argument supporting any position. For
>>     
>>>>>>  example, Herb,
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> you
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> are
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> pro-life and will probably vote for McCain/Palin in
>>     
>>>>>>  part for
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> that
>>     
>> reason.
>>     
>> I am pro-choice, pro-embryonic stem cell research
>>     
>>>>>>  and so I
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> will
>>     
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> support
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>                             
>> Obama/Biden in part for that reason. It is not
>>     
>>>>>>  hyperbole to
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> point
>>     
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> out
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>                             
>> the policy differences that explain my choice. What
>>     
>>>>>>  I know
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> for
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> sure
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> is
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>                             
>> that marxism and "sheepiness" have nothing to do
>>     
>>>>>>  with it. I
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> have
>>     
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> thought
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>                             
>> about all of my positions on the issues I mentioned
>>     
>>>>>>  and am
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> completely
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> prepared to explain and justify them. In Brad's oft'
>>     
>>>>>>  repeated
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> mantra
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>                             
>> know I have "done my homework".
>>     
>> Enough for today. The games will be on soon.
>>     
>> Cheers!
>>     
>> Ben C. , s/v Susan Kay, Highlands, NJ
>>     
>> __________________________________________________
>>     
>> To subscribe/unsubscribe or for help with using the
>>     
>>>>>>  mailing
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> list
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> go
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>                             
>> http://www.rhodes22.org/list
>>     
>> __________________________________________________
>>     
>> __________________________________________________
>>     
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> To
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>                                 
>> subscribe/unsubscribe or for help with using the
>>     
>>>>>>  mailing
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> list go
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> to
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> http://www.rhodes22.org/list
>>     
>> __________________________________________________
>>     
>> __________________________________________________
>>     
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> To
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>                               
>> subscribe/unsubscribe or for help with using the
>>     
>>>>>>  mailing list
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> go
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>                               
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> to
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> http://www.rhodes22.org/list
>>     
>> __________________________________________________
>>     
>> __________________________________________________
>>     
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> To
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>                             
>> subscribe/unsubscribe or for help with using the
>>     
>>>>>>  mailing list
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> go to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>                             
>> http://www.rhodes22.org/list
>>     
>> __________________________________________________
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> __________________________________________________
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> To subscribe/unsubscribe or for help with using the
>>     
>>>>>>  mailing list go
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> to http://www.rhodes22.org/list
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> __________________________________________________
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> --
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> Be Yourself @ mail.com!
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> Choose From 200+ Email Addresses
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> Get a Free Account at www.mail.com
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> __________________________________________________
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> To subscribe/unsubscribe or for help with using the
>>     
>>>>>>  mailing list go
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> to
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> http://www.rhodes22.org/list
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> __________________________________________________
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> __________________________________________________
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>> To
>>>>>>             
>> subscribe/unsubscribe or for help with using the mailing
>>     
>>>>>>  list go
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> http://www.rhodes22.org/list
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> __________________________________________________
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> __________________________________________________
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>> To
>>>>>>             
>> subscribe/unsubscribe or for help with using the mailing
>>     
>>>>>>  list go
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>             
>> http://www.rhodes22.org/list
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> __________________________________________________
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> __________________________________________________
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>> To
>>>>>>             
>> subscribe/unsubscribe or for help with using the mailing
>>     
>>>>>>  list go to
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> http://www.rhodes22.org/list
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> __________________________________________________
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> __________________________________________________
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>> To
>>>>>>             
>> subscribe/unsubscribe or for help with using the mailing
>>     
>>>>>>  list go to
>>>>>>  >>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> http://www.rhodes22.org/list
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> __________________________________________________
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> __________________________________________________
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>> To
>>>>>>             
>> subscribe/unsubscribe or for help with using the mailing
>>     
>>>>>>  list go to
>>>>>>  >>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> http://www.rhodes22.org/list
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> __________________________________________________
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>
>>>>>>             
>> __________________________________________________
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>> To subscribe/unsubscribe
>>>>>>             
>> or for help with using the mailing list
>>     
>>>>>>  go to
>>>>>>  >>>>
>>>>>>             
>> http://www.rhodes22.org/list
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>
>>>>>>             
>> __________________________________________________
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>
>>>>>>  >>>>
>>>>>>  >>>
>>>>>>             
>> __________________________________________________
>>     
>>>>>>  >>> To subscribe/unsubscribe or
>>>>>>             
>> for help with using the mailing list
>>     
>>>>>>  go to
>>>>>>  >>> http://www.rhodes22.org/list
>>>>>>  >>>
>>>>>>             
>> __________________________________________________
>>     
>>>>>>  >>>
>>>>>>  >>>
>>>>>>  >>>
>>>>>>  >>
>>>>>>  >>
>>>>>>             
>> __________________________________________________
>>     
>>>>>>  >> To subscribe/unsubscribe or for
>>>>>>             
>> help with using the mailing list
>>     
>>>>>>  >> go to
>>>>>>             
>> http://www.rhodes22.org/list
>>     
>>>>>>  >>
>>>>>>             
>> __________________________________________________
>>     
>>>>>>  >>
>>>>>>  >>
>>>>>>  >>
>>>>>>  >
>>>>>>             
>> __________________________________________________
>>     
>>>>>>  > To subscribe/unsubscribe or for help
>>>>>>             
>> with using the mailing list
>>     
>>>>>>  > go to http://www.rhodes22.org/list
>>>>>>  >
>>>>>>             
>> __________________________________________________
>>     
>>>>>>  >
>>>>>>  >
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> __________________________________________________
>>     
>>>>>>  To subscribe/unsubscribe or for help with
>>>>>>             
>> using the mailing list go
>>     
>>>>>>  to http://www.rhodes22.org/list
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> __________________________________________________
>>     
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> Be Yourself @ mail.com!
>>>>>> Choose From 200+ Email Addresses
>>>>>> Get a Free Account at www.mail.com
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> __________________________________________________
>>     
>>>>>> To subscribe/unsubscribe or for help with
>>>>>>             
>> using the mailing list go to
>>     
>>>>>> http://www.rhodes22.org/list
>>>>>>
>>>>>>             
>> __________________________________________________
>>     
>>>>>>
>>>>>>         
>>>>>>             
>> __________________________________________________
>>     
>>>>> To subscribe/unsubscribe or for help with
>>>>>           
>> using the mailing list go to
>>     
>>>>> http://www.rhodes22.org/list
>>>>>
>>>>>           
>> __________________________________________________
>>     
>>>>>
>>>>>       
>>>>>           
>>>> __________________________________________________
>>>> To subscribe/unsubscribe or for help with using
>>>>         
>> the mailing list go to
>>     
>>>> http://www.rhodes22.org/list
>>>> __________________________________________________
>>>>
>>>>     
>>>>         
>>> __________________________________________________
>>> To subscribe/unsubscribe or for help with using the
>>>       
>> mailing list go to
>>     
>>> http://www.rhodes22.org/list
>>> __________________________________________________
>>>
>>>
>>>   
>>>       
>> __________________________________________________
>> To subscribe/unsubscribe or for help with using the mailing
>> list go to
>> http://www.rhodes22.org/list
>> __________________________________________________
>>
>>
>>
>> -- 
>> View this message in context:
>> http://www.nabble.com/Praise-Jesus%2C-the-%22evolutionists%22-are-going-to-save-us-from-the-Republicans-tp19382633p19414836.html
>> Sent from the Rhodes 22 mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
>>
>> __________________________________________________
>> To subscribe/unsubscribe or for help with using the mailing
>> list go to http://www.rhodes22.org/list
>> __________________________________________________
>>     
>
>
>       
> __________________________________________________
> To subscribe/unsubscribe or for help with using the mailing list go to http://www.rhodes22.org/list
> __________________________________________________
>
>
>   


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