[Rhodes22-list] Partial Mainsail
Leland
LKUHN at cnmc.org
Tue Jul 28 10:33:02 EDT 2009
Chris,
Below is a picture of my sliding pulley, although I'm sure it probably has a
nautical term.
If you allow the sail to slide the pulley back it might keep the sail from
flapping around, however I pull the pulley to the back of the boom before I
unfurl the mainsail to prevent it from jamming.
To get the sail tight on the boom, I find it's easy to pull down on the
outhaul with my right hand while lifting the boom up to the sail with my
left hand.
I guess the real purpose of the pulley is to help keep the sail tight when
reefed, but it also works great to control mainsail shape when you're
loose-footing it.
Lee
cowie wrote:
>
> Ben:
>
> I agree, the R22 is very forgiving and will bring herself back into the
> wind and level off when the wind gets to be too much. My "fear" is not
> being able to get the main sail back in and ruining an otherwise perfectly
> new sail and my "stupid" acts include surfing wildly in seas that are a
> bit too much for a 22' boat. Each time out I learn more and build
> confidence. I notice this weekend that the blue line that pulls the main
> sail out has a pully that should slide with the end of the main. The
> pully was not sliding properly and the blue line was getting jambed in the
> pully. Correcting both of these conditions allows the main to come in and
> out more reliably. I am still learning and enjoying it.
>
>
>
> Ben Schultz wrote:
>>
>> As one who has sailed in wind and chop that many of you would find
>> "stupid,"
>> I'll suggest that the risk of an R22 knockdown with board up or board
>> down
>> is next to nothing. Suppose you're sailing along under a stiff breeze,
>> and
>> you're heeled to the point where water is licking the tops of the
>> gunnels.
>> All of a sudden, you get a huge gust. You'll find that that boat
>> simultaneously rounds into the wind, and starts to level off and slow
>> down.
>> It's just the way it is.
>>
>> The only way I think you could knock it down would be to catch just the
>> right combination of wind and largish waves hitting the boat broadside.
>> Even then, the R22 is going to bounce right up and turn into the wind.
>>
>> I actually have a harder time bringing water over the gunnel in the
>> really
>> heavy stuff. I find it easier in 15-17 kts with a moderate chop to catch
>> that point where the boat really wants to heel. I can't keep her over
>> that
>> far for a long time without a little bit of weight on the lee side
>> either.
>>
>> Take it from me, your boat protects us stupid/fearless skippers.
>>
>> Ben
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org
>> [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf Of John Lock
>> Sent: Monday, July 27, 2009 13:32
>> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List
>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Partial Mainsail
>>
>> Actually I think it is the opposite. With the board up, a gust will
>> tend to push the hull sideways more easily and expend some energy
>> doing so, producing less heel. But with the board down, it will offer
>> resistance to the sideways push of the gust at a very low angle. The
>> results will be more heel above the waterline.
>>
>> Cheers!
>> John Lock
>> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>> s/v Pandion - '79 Rhodes 22
>> Lake Sinclair, GA
>> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
>>
>> On Jul 27, 2009, at 13:41, MichaelT wrote:
>>> I'll have to balance the compromises here w/ needing to get
>>> somewhere vs a
>>> relaxing time.
>>>
>>> Btw, how real is the risk of a knockdown w/ the board up?
>>> Has there been any reported knockdowns with the board up?
>>> I suppose if a BIG gust came across and the board was up that the
>>> boat will
>>> react and heel much easier.
>>>
>>> Michael
>>>
>>>
>>> Arthur H. Czerwonky wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Michael,
>>>>
>>>> These 'board up' options are a new one to me, partly because I began
>>>> serious sailing in a racing mode. I do not know of anyone who
>>>> would beat
>>>> into the wind with the board up in competition, certainly due to
>>>> slippage,
>>>> which Hank emphasizes so well, but also the risk of knockdown. I
>>>> have
>>>> never tried it, Michael, but I'd approach this technique with
>>>> caution,
>>>> especially if your wife is aboard.
>>>>
>>>> Happy sailing,
>>>>
>>>> Art
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>> From: MichaelT <mticse at gmail.com>
>>>>> Sent: Jul 27, 2009 9:56 AM
>>>>> To: rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org
>>>>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Partial Mainsail
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks for the first hand knowledge wrt the centerboard.
>>>>> You've certainly changed the fundamentals of my logic. Womehow my
>>>>> flawed
>>>>> thinking was that with the board up that the Rhodes would heel
>>>>> more and
>>>>> difficult to turn. On the contrary, the Rhodes actually sails
>>>>> better (i.e.
>>>>> less heel, easy to to turn) with the board up. Definitely
>>>>> something I will
>>>>> do this week.
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks Lee!
>>>>> Michael
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Leland wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Michael,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> With the board down it will allow you to sail closer to the wind
>>>>>> and
>>>>>> make
>>>>>> better headway (less drifting).
>>>>>>
>>>>>> However, the faster you go the less impact the board will have on
>>>>>> both
>>>>>> sailing close to the wind and headway. The board is most useful
>>>>>> if you
>>>>>> want to make headway in light wind.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I'm a daysailor so the only time I need to make better headway is
>>>>>> if
>>>>>> it's
>>>>>> necessary to get back to my marina at the end of the day. With
>>>>>> yesterday's high wind and the current and chop pushing me away
>>>>>> from the
>>>>>> wind, I never once lowered my board and sailed part of the time
>>>>>> on broad
>>>>>> reaches and runs. On tacks the boat turned like a sports car.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> With the board down it will act as a pivot point and allow you to
>>>>>> turn
>>>>>> easier whether you are tacking or motoring around your slip. I
>>>>>> don't
>>>>>> use
>>>>>> if for either one.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I've measured my speed countless times with the board up and down
>>>>>> and it
>>>>>> has always had a negative impact on speed. I think the term is VMG
>>>>>> (velocity made good?) which measures how much headway you're
>>>>>> actually
>>>>>> making. If I could figure out how to measure it on my GPS I'm
>>>>>> sure it
>>>>>> would show that the board helps, but with the reduction in speed
>>>>>> it sure
>>>>>> doesn't seem that way.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Lee
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> MichaelT wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Lee,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I was just thinking about bringing the centerboard up as you
>>>>>>> suggested,
>>>>>>> but have concerns.
>>>>>>> Did you flip bringing the centerboard up and down. Down when
>>>>>>> tacking
>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>> up after the tack?
>>>>>>> I remember when I forgot to let the centerboard down and all I
>>>>>>> could
>>>>>>> remember was going sideways and difficulty in making headway. In
>>>>>>> essence
>>>>>>> the boat was slipping and pushed sideways by the wind when the
>>>>>>> centerboard is up. I suppose as long as we don't need to be
>>>>>>> anywhere
>>>>>>> soon
>>>>>>> this is all fine.
>>>>>>> At the end I'll have to let my wife judge!
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Great suggestion!
>>>>>>> Michael
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Leland wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Michael,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> You're getting lots of good advice.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> You'll have a little less heel with the board up. From the
>>>>>>>> Rhodes
>>>>>>>> Owners' Site under FAQs under Rhodes vs. Com-Pac vs.
>>>>>>>> Precisions: 5.
>>>>>>>> Retract the centerboard part way in a big breeze. The board is
>>>>>>>> intentionally modest in weight, and does not contribute
>>>>>>>> significantly
>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>> stability up or down. Raising the board part way will reduce
>>>>>>>> both heel
>>>>>>>> and weather helm.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The quote refers to Precisions. If I raise the board all the
>>>>>>>> way on
>>>>>>>> my
>>>>>>>> Rhodes it usually only reduces heel by about 3 degrees but your
>>>>>>>> wife
>>>>>>>> may
>>>>>>>> appreciate it.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> In an 8-10 knot wind, lowering the boom will reduce heel also.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> As Dave mentioned the boat sails better with two sails. For the
>>>>>>>> amount
>>>>>>>> of wind you described you probably weren't going fast enough to
>>>>>>>> tack.
>>>>>>>> Come off the wind enough to get up some speed and you'll then
>>>>>>>> be able
>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>> turn her sharply into the wind.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> When I first got my Rhodes I typically had too much sail out.
>>>>>>>> You
>>>>>>>> were
>>>>>>>> wise to be conservative in your sail plan, but without any
>>>>>>>> headsail
>>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>>> so little main you probably couldn't get enough speed to tack
>>>>>>>> even if
>>>>>>>> you had come off the wind. Last week I was in a 12 knot wind.
>>>>>>>> On a
>>>>>>>> close reach with balanced sails with the board up and my 190
>>>>>>>> lbs of
>>>>>>>> rail
>>>>>>>> meat, I had less than 20 degrees of heel with the boom up and
>>>>>>>> the main
>>>>>>>> reefed to 80%. With the boom down I had the same heel with
>>>>>>>> 100% main.
>>>>>>>> I have my mainsail furling line marked for reefs at 60% and
>>>>>>>> 80%. If I
>>>>>>>> have to reef the tiny little main beyond 60%, it's too windy
>>>>>>>> for me
>>>>>>>> (over 20 knots) and I go home.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Good luck!
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Lee
>>>>>>>> 1986 Rhodes22 At Ease
>>>>>>>> Kent Island, MD
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> david.walker5 wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Stephen,
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Tacking with the jib, especially very light or heavy wind can be
>>>>>>>>> challenging
>>>>>>>>> too. The problem is the jib is very powerfull and it wants to
>>>>>>>>> push
>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>> boat
>>>>>>>>> away from the tack. One technique that has worked for me is
>>>>>>>>> something
>>>>>>>>> I
>>>>>>>>> borrowed from sailing a square rigger. When you push the
>>>>>>>>> tiller to
>>>>>>>>> lee,
>>>>>>>>> loosen the jibe immediately, but do not let the sheet fly.(for
>>>>>>>>> those
>>>>>>>>> interested its called scandalizing the jib) This reduces the
>>>>>>>>> drive
>>>>>>>>> of
>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>> sail and allows it to turn up wind. Just as the bow comes
>>>>>>>>> into the
>>>>>>>>> wind,
>>>>>>>>> tighten the sheet a little. The wind will then backwind the
>>>>>>>>> jib and
>>>>>>>>> push the
>>>>>>>>> bow the rest of the way onto the new tack. As you come through
>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>> wind, the
>>>>>>>>> wind on the new tack will push the sail across to the new
>>>>>>>>> tack. In
>>>>>>>>> really
>>>>>>>>> heavy wind you may end up "in stays" or headed into the wind and
>>>>>>>>> start
>>>>>>>>> to be
>>>>>>>>> pushed backwards. In that case as I said in an earlier post,
>>>>>>>>> shift
>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>> rudder (tiller to windward) and the boat will back onto the
>>>>>>>>> new tack
>>>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>>>> start to sail.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> David Walker
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> www.davidwalkerphotography.com
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Event Specialists
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> 781-639-2707 Office
>>>>>>>>> 781-718-8690 Cell
>>>>>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>>>>>> From: "Stephen Staum" <staum at earthlink.net>
>>>>>>>>> To: "The Rhodes 22 Email List" <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
>>>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, July 24, 2009 3:32 PM
>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Partial Mainsail
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Michael,
>>>>>>>>>> I too have a wife who likes to sail flat. I have an '87 w a
>>>>>>>>>> 184 per
>>>>>>>>>> cent genoa. I usually start w 1/2 of the genny as the jib
>>>>>>>>>> really
>>>>>>>>>> powers this boat. Even w the full main out (alone) u will
>>>>>>>>>> struggle
>>>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>>> come about. Also, if u have the full jib out in light winds,
>>>>>>>>>> it can
>>>>>>>>>> be
>>>>>>>>>> very difficult 2 get the jib 2 come across when coming about.
>>>>>>>>>> It is
>>>>>>>>>> often easier 2 jibe or roll up 1/2 the jib b4 come about is
>>>>>>>>>> started.
>>>>>>>>>> Enjoy!
>>>>>>>>>> Stephen Staum
>>>>>>>>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> On Jul 24, 2009, at 12:47 PM, MichaelT <mticse at gmail.com>
>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Went out with the family on Sunday and wanted to play it safe.
>>>>>>>>>>> Drew the IMF mainsail approx halfway on the boom (the letter
>>>>>>>>>>> R on
>>>>>>>>>>> the sail
>>>>>>>>>>> wasn't showing).
>>>>>>>>>>> Wanted to keep things simple and used no jib. Centerboard
>>>>>>>>>>> was down
>>>>>>>>>>> all the
>>>>>>>>>>> way.
>>>>>>>>>>> The boat stayed flat as a pancake which was the desired
>>>>>>>>>>> effect.
>>>>>>>>>>> My wife wants no heeling whatsoever. Problem I had was I
>>>>>>>>>>> couldn't
>>>>>>>>>>> tack.
>>>>>>>>>>> It even had a hard time getting into irons and just couldn't
>>>>>>>>>>> cutover.
>>>>>>>>>>> The only way I could change direction was to spin 2/3's
>>>>>>>>>>> around in a
>>>>>>>>>>> jibe.
>>>>>>>>>>> I didn't want to experiment and let out more sail so we just
>>>>>>>>>>> enjoyed
>>>>>>>>>>> sailing
>>>>>>>>>>> the next hour like this.
>>>>>>>>>>> Is this normal behaviour? What am I doing wrong?
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>>>>>>> Michael
>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>> View this message in context:
>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.nabble.com/Partial-Mainsail-
>>>>>>>>>>> tp24647946p24647946.html
>>>>>>>>>>> Sent from the Rhodes 22 mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> __________________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>>> To subscribe/unsubscribe or for help with using the mailing
>>>>>>>>>>> list go
>>>>>>>>>>> to http://www.rhodes22.org/list
>>>>>>>>>>> __________________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>> __________________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>> To subscribe/unsubscribe or for help with using the mailing
>>>>>>>>>> list go
>>>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>>> http://www.rhodes22.org/list
>>>>>>>>>> __________________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> __________________________________________________
>>>>>>>>> To subscribe/unsubscribe or for help with using the mailing
>>>>>>>>> list go
>>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>> http://www.rhodes22.org/list
>>>>>>>>> __________________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> View this message in context:
>>> http://www.nabble.com/Partial-Mainsail-tp24647946p24681160.html
>>>>> Sent from the Rhodes 22 mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
>>>>>
>>>>> __________________________________________________
>>>>> To subscribe/unsubscribe or for help with using the mailing list
>>>>> go to
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>>>>> __________________________________________________
>>>>
>>>> __________________________________________________
>>>> To subscribe/unsubscribe or for help with using the mailing list go
>>>> to
>>>> http://www.rhodes22.org/list
>>>> __________________________________________________
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> View this message in context:
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>>>
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>>
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>
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