[Rhodes22-list] Subject: Re: Re design of RhodesInteriorandelimination of compressi...

Sat Jun 6 07:32:07 EDT 2009

When I was sailing with Stan a couple of years ago on the demo boat, I had 
commented that the stays appeared to be loose.  Stan.s reply was a shrug and 
he indicated that's the way the Rhodes is adjusted.

>>ron<<
S/V Serenity

--- Original Message ----- 
From: "Michael D. Weisner" <mweisner at ebsmed.com>
To: "The Rhodes 22 Email List" <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
Sent: Friday, June 05, 2009 10:30 PM
Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Subject: Re: Re design of 
RhodesInteriorandelimination of compressi...

> Al,
>
> That's funny, 'cause it was just what I was thinkin'.  I never tighten the
> stays more than enough to take out the slack - I worry more that they are
> evenly tensioned and that the mast is properly aligned vertically.  I 
> always
> felt that if they were too tight they started to sing when under sail.  I
> never thought that they could cause damage to the deck or cabin roof.  One
> thing to consider is that I do not have IMF (the mast is much lighter.)
>
> Loosen them when at anchor? No way!  A loose rig could actually develop 
> some
> inertial moment and cause damage if the weather turns rough and the boat
> bounces about.
>
> Twenty eight years without problems and I don't want to start now.
>
> Mike
> s/v Shanghaid'd Summer ('81)
>       Nissequogue River, NY
>
> From: "Alan Robertson" Friday, June 05, 2009 8:30 PM
>> Huh!  We never loosened any stays when not in use and after 25 years no
>> signs of any kind of deflection or any other problem. Maybe Stan "don't
>> build them like he useta?"
>>
>> THOR IV NY
>>  ----- Original Message ----- 
>>  From: David Culp<mailto:dculp at hsbtx.com>
>>  To: rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org<mailto:rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
>>  Sent: Thursday, June 04, 2009 2:27 PM
>>  Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Subject: Re: Re design of Rhodes Interior
>> andelimination of compressi...
>>
>>
>>  John:
>>
>>  Email is impersonal sometimes-just don't want anyone I don't know in
>> person
>>  to get the wrong impression.  We are all just trying to have fun here 
>> and
>>  learn something.
>>
>>  Communication is key and I just picked up on something in your last post
>> and
>>  that was that you had compression problems on the port side of the boat.
>> My
>>  problem was also on the port side.  The port side is also where the aft
>> stay
>>  tensioner line is tightened and secured on my boat.  Is it the same on
>> your
>>  boat?
>>
>>  That port aft stay has a lot of tension on it when in use.  I have been
>>  guessing that the aft stays were over-tighten on my boat and left that
>> way
>>  which caused the cabin top to start bending over the top of the support
>>  bulkhead.  Roger tuned his boat very tightly but cautioned that he 
>> always
>>  released the aft stay tension when the boat was not in use.  Maybe now 
>> we
>>  know why.  There is a huge mechanical advantage with the aft stays that
>> you
>>  don't have with the sides.  Rodger's example was tying both ends of a
>>   "banana" but this boat is no banana.   In my simple mind it is more 
>> like
>> a
>>  crossbow and arrow... and the mast is the arrow.
>>
>>  I checked the upper side shrouds yesterday and I am carrying 180 lbs on
>> the
>>  Loos gauge so closer to your numbers then I thought but well below
>> Rodger's.
>>   What I should have checked is how much tension I have on the aft stays
>> when
>>  they are tightened.  Just by feel, I am guessing 240 but it may be more.
>>
>>  The lesson here MAY BE and I caution it's only a MAYBE is that you must
>>  always make sure to release the aft stay tension when the boat is not in
>> use
>>  or you may face a compression problem over time.   Boats get pounded by
>> chop
>>  even in the slip and I can see something is eventually going to flex
>> under
>>  constant high tension.   I would assume that everyone is already doing
>> that.
>>   I always have.
>>
>>  David
>>
>>
>>  Date: Wed, 3 Jun 2009 18:50:18 -0700 (PDT)
>>  From: John Shulick <jsbudda at verizon.net<mailto:jsbudda at verizon.net>>
>>  Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Subject: Re: Re design of Rhodes Interior
>>         and elimination of compressi...
>>  To: rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org<mailto:rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
>>  Message-ID:
>> <23862507.post at talk.nabble.com<mailto:23862507.post at talk.nabble.com>>
>>  Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>>
>>
>>  Dave,
>>
>>  You have nothing to apologize for, I came to this forum to learn from
>> others
>>  and to report my observations about how my boat responds to various
>> settings
>>  and configurations in the hope of increasing the pool of knowledge about
>> our
>>  boat. I would like to see your settings and would encourage others
>> familiar
>>  with a loos gauge to chime in with their numbers as well. The Roger 
>> piece
>>  was the only writing I had found that had any numbers to go on when it
>> came
>>  time rig my boat last year so at first I duplicated his settings and did
>> not
>>  like what I saw inside the cabin so I backed them down to what I have 
>> now
>>  and the cabin eased up some. My boat also had the port side of the cabin
>>  compressed due to probable over tension by previous owners. In the
>>  companionway on the port side the fiberglas has buckled. When I 
>> installed
>>  the port side bulkhead I jacked up the ceiling to force fit the bulkhead
>> in
>>  place and that straightened out the buckling in the companionway by a
>> large
>>  degree. The first week the boat was in the water the rigging had the
>> slack
>>  taken out but was loose otherwise. We got hit at night by a cold front
>> with
>>  30 mph wind gusting to 50 the inside of the cabin creaked and groaned 
>> and
>> I
>>  wondered if my modifications were a mistake. Week 2 I snugged the 
>> rigging
>> up
>>  some more relying on feel and not using the gauge yet. Then went out in
>> 10
>>  to 15 mph with gusts. Boat seemed fine. Week 3
>>  brought the rigging to present tension checking with gauge. Sailing in
>> same
>>  conditions boat has no problems. Over night we were hit again with 30 
>> mph
>> +
>>  winds and the cabin noise was much less. I will continue to monitor the
>>  situation and will chime in on this if something happens.
>>
>>  John Shulick
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