[Rhodes22-list] Boom Vang Mast Attachment

Thu Aug 3 14:06:14 EDT 2017

All the ideas sound pretty basic to what I had in mind. Does anyone have more details to David Culp’s solution from 2010?

Found under "Fwd: [Rhodes22-list] Was Sails Now Boom Vangs” but no photo or any additional details-

Jay

> Begin forwarded message:
> 
> From: David Culp <dculp at hsbtx.com>
> Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Was Sails Now Boom Vangs
> Date: January 13, 2010 at 1:20:02 PM EST
> To: rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org
> Reply-To: The Rhodes 22 Email List <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
> 
> OK... I will get some good pictures of the parts, the operation and how to
> build it.  I have to take the operational pictures out on the water and if
> it warms up a little more today, I may do it.
> 
> In the meantime, to answer Lee's question:  Yes, it will work on any point
> of sail.  Most effective when the boom is swung out over the water to the
> farthest point and has its greatest tendency to rise.  The closer the boom
> is to the centerline of the boat, the less effective the device is until it
> is nil when the boom reaches centerline.  With boom end sheeting and a loose
> footed main in the case of the IMF, you would bend the boom before being
> able to noticeably tighten the sail when close to the wind.  I use it on all
> points of sail other then close-hauled and I have noticed it makes my tales
> fly better even on a close reach.  This appears more efficient, but it has
> not translated into any performance increases that I can see.  So anytime
> the boom is completely over the boat, I don't worry about using it.  Only
> when the boom starts rising, do I deploy it depending on conditions; keeping
> in mind that sometimes you want some belly in the sail downwind or to spill
> some wind in high wind conditions and the boom rising up helps that.
> 
> This is not rocket science by any means.  I got the idea from reading about
> how some off shore sailors disconnect their boom vangs from the mast base
> and attach them to the rail to use as a preventer.  That got me to wondering
> if I could build a small boom vang with a purchase, attach it mid-boom on
> the Rhodes and then fasten it to the rail in some manner.  The trick was
> finding the right rail attach point which would allow enough leverage on the
> boom when downwind and still not interfere with the pop top arrangement.  So
> I experimented with several positions until I found a good compromise.
> 
> To demonstrate the simplicity of it:  Initially, I tied a loop of line
> around the boom at about mid point and then treaded the other end through
> the forward bimini attachment eye and played with that out on the water....
> Hey... it works and I don't have to hold the boom down by hand anymore.
> 
> After that, it was just a matter of building something that could be easily
> adjusted and quickly released to safely allow a tack or gybe and then able
> to quickly attach the device to the other rail for the new point of sail.
> The normal cleat/block combination found on a boom vang and a snap shackle
> took care of that.  If you are tacking a lot working upwind, you don't want
> to use it.  Requires more effort then it is worth because you must
> disconnect it from the windward side and reconnect on the leeward side after
> taking up the line that runs out when the boom crosses the boat.  Running
> downwind, broad or beam reaching, it's great!
> 
> Todd and others:  This is more of a home remedy then an invention.   I know
> you are kidding but the idea of patenting or selling anything is the last
> thing on my mind.  I am about 100 years too late and the parts are all
> available at your favorite boat supply.  My real hope is that someone else
> may find it useful and/or improve upon it.  If someone really wanted to
> build something unique, they would figure out how to install a boom vang
> from ABOVE the boom on the IMF that was adjustable for the different boom
> positions.  Sort of along the lines of what the Viper has.  I would be
> willing to pay for that.  If the Rhodes was anything other then an
> occasional weekend racer, Stan would have probably already figured that one
> out.  Those of us who have done a little racing know that 1/2 a knot is huge
> when your hull speed is only 6.  That's a 12% increase in speed downwind.
> When just out cruising, if you are trying to cover a longer distance more
> efficiently, then you may find this useful and that's my hope.
> 
> David
> 
> 
> From: r22rumrunner at aol.com
> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Was Sails Now Boom Vangs
> To: rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org
> Message-ID: <f71a.4445681d.387e3353 at aol.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
> 
> David,
> Rhodies are always interested in inventions. Any information you want to
> share with the list would be greatly appreciated.
> 
> Rummy
> 
> 
> In a message dated 1/12/2010 3:01:01 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,
> dculp at hsbtx.com writes:
> 
> Since  you guys brought this up and not me.... I will tell you that there is
> a way  to have a "boom vang/preventer" type apparatus on the Rhodes 22 that
> works  with the pop top up or down and the boom up or down.  I have  been
> reluctant to mention it on this forum because it is an  experimental,
> personal project.  However, like Mark McQuire I have  decided to "come
> clean"
> with my Rhodes buds and budettes.   I  built it this last summer for about $
> 150.00 dollars and have been testing  it since then with good results.  It
> is
> not a true boom vang, but it  does accomplish the three main things that I
> wanted:
> 
> 1.  Keep  the boom down and parallel to the deck running downwind with a
> possible  performance gain.
> 
> 2.  Prevent an accidental gybe.
> 
> 3.   Not interfere with the pop top or ingress/egress from the cabin and
> works  in either boom position.
> 
> An unintended result of having it installed is  my new ability to sail the
> boat backwards.  I did this initially to  test
> the structural integrity of the setup.  Then it became a  joke.  You get
> some
> very interesting reactions from power boaters as  you go by them sailing
> your
> Rhodes backwards.  Perhaps even a few have  given up drinking as a result
> .... nah!  Anyway, I was going to video  it and put it up on YouTube. Still
> coming, but my videographer who also  participated in some of the testing is
> very sick right now and I wanted to  give him a shot a being a part of it.
> 
> Issues:
> 
> True boom vangs  can be tightened and swing the full 180 degree travel of
> the
> boom.  My  system has two attach points and the tensioning line must be
> released to  run in the blocks in either a tack or gybe and then you have to
> move the  snap shackle to the other side and re-tension.  However, it does
> a
> great job of controlling boom rise working downwind and really the  Rhodes
> doesn't need a boom vang except downwind in my opinion.  In  other words,
> with a small, end-sheeted main, you really can't depower with  a vang close
> to the wind for a noticeable result.  The traveler is  much more effective
> in
> that regard.
> 
> Accidental gybes have been  tested up to wind speeds of approximately 12-13
> kts with good results but I  wouldn't go much higher then that.  My target
> is
> 15 kts., but so far  haven't gotten to test in a known steady 15 kt wind.
> The perfect system and  there are some on the market, would allow a slow
> release of the boom to  gybe the boat.  Otherwise, there are some huge
> transitional loads put  on the rig, tensioning lines and hardware of this
> system or any system for  that matter.  Accidental gybes in a sailboat are
> dangerous and never  good for the rig regardless of what system is in place.
> This preventer will  prevent an accidental gybe, but even better, it gives
> you more time to  recognize that possibility and recover your course before
> it  happens.
> 
> Should the normal Rhodes owner run out and put this on his/her  boat?
> Leaving it up to you, but most probably don't care.  Would the  manufacturer
> of the boat recommend it? Probably not as presently  designed.  Has it
> worked
> well for me and been convincing to other  sailors who have witnessed its
> operation?  Yes!   Could you  hurt yourself or damage your boat with it?
> Maybe, if you are not paying  attention and do stupid things in high winds.
> Of course, that holds true in  any sailing situation; so it is not
> inherently dangerous.
> 
> Now the  most important thing:  Did it increase the speed of the boat?
> Yes.
> My knot-meter tells me about .5 kts in winds 12-13 knots in  relatively
> smooth water.
> 
> Someone wrote on this forum sometime time  back that when they manually held
> their boom down by hand going downwind...  that it was worth about 1/2 a
> knot.      $ 150.00 dollars  later, I can confirm that observation as being
> pretty much true.   There are a lot of factors that control boat speed and
> your results may  vary.
> 
> In the final analysis; for most people, there are better ways to  spend your
> money for 1/2 a knot.  For instance, a whisker pole for the  Rhodes costs
> about $ 150.00 dollars.  If you want real performance  downwind, put a
> spinnaker on the boat.  I was more interested in  increasing efficiency with
> the sails I have.  I never have a crew and  don't want a spinnaker, so this
> is what I did. IT DOES WHAT I WANTED IT TO  DO. Which is my definition of a
> successful home project. If others are  interested, post your comments and I
> will build a webpage with photos fully  explaining how to build it.  It's
> actually fairly simple.  You  will have to decide if it is worth it to you.
> 
> David Culp
> 
> Date:  Tue, 12 Jan 2010 07:09:19 -0800 (PST)
> From: Leland  <LKUHN at cnmc.org>
> Subject: [Rhodes22-list]  Was Sails Now Boom  Vangs
> To: rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org
> Message-ID:  <27128980.post at talk.nabble.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain;  charset=us-ascii
> 
> 
> Rummy,
> 
> Since you brought up the winter  topic and unlike you I won't be able to
> sail
> until the ice melts, how about  them boom vangs?
> 
> Someone on this list has a removable vang that can be  used with the poptop
> down but I normally sail with the poptop up and am too  lazy to take a vang
> on and off.
> 
> I assume there is no practical means  of keeping the boom down when the
> poptop is up or Stan would have figured  it out by now.  A reverse rigid
> vang-like apparatus installed higher  up on the mast could push the boom
> down
> but would probably interfere with  the sail.  You could tie the end of the
> boom down using strategically  placed cleats but that could involve a lot of
> cleats and a safety  issue.  Even less safe would be a bag of weights
> hanging
> off the end  of the boom--might be exciting during tacks and jibes.
> 
> Until someone  comes up with a workable solution I guess I'll just keep
> using
> Boomer to  hold things down, but my wife doesn't particularly like the title
> or the  job.
> 
> Lee
> 1986 Rhodes22  At Ease
> Kent Island,  MD
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