From joedempsey at hughes.net Mon Mar 1 13:33:45 2021 From: joedempsey at hughes.net (Joe Dempsey) Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2021 11:33:45 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes Continental Sails In-Reply-To: <408F9401-E24B-4554-826E-DD98BFC0E1F3@stottarchitecture.com> References: <1613761250989-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <408F9401-E24B-4554-826E-DD98BFC0E1F3@stottarchitecture.com> Message-ID: <1614623625839-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Then I'm confused. It is my understanding that the Continental was only built for a few years. My question, therefore is what is the difference in sail plan from a Continental and any other Rhodes 22? ----- Joe Dempsey s/v Respite Rhodes 22 1989/2005 Deltaville,VA -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From chrisgeankoplis at gmail.com Mon Mar 1 13:46:28 2021 From: chrisgeankoplis at gmail.com (Chris Geankoplis) Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2021 13:46:28 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes Continental Sails In-Reply-To: <1614623625839-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1613761250989-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <408F9401-E24B-4554-826E-DD98BFC0E1F3@stottarchitecture.com> <1614623625839-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: Hey Joe, The 1st Rhodes I owned was a new 1976 Rhodes Continental. It had a traditional main and the Rhodes tube furler. The boom could be turned to roll up the main but proved to be a pia. The traveler was just a wire attached to the aft chain plates. There were a few differences on the moulds , just minor compared to the ?83 that is now in Greece with in mast furling and bar traveler. More differences, both interior and exterior including a CDI furler on the Kansas 1986/2015 boat. I was never clear what made a ?Continental ? other than vintage. Chris Geankoplis Enosis On Mon, Mar 1, 2021 at 1:33 PM Joe Dempsey wrote: > Then I'm confused. It is my understanding that the Continental was only > built > for a few years. My question, therefore is what is the difference in sail > plan from a Continental and any other Rhodes 22? > > > > ----- > Joe Dempsey > s/v Respite > Rhodes 22 1989/2005 > Deltaville,VA > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > From roger_pihlaja at msn.com Mon Mar 1 13:51:03 2021 From: roger_pihlaja at msn.com (Roger Pihlaja Home) Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2021 13:51:03 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes Continental Sails In-Reply-To: <1614623625839-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1613761250989-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <408F9401-E24B-4554-826E-DD98BFC0E1F3@stottarchitecture.com> <1614623625839-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: Joe, It is my understanding that Stan changed the name from Rhodes Continental 22 to Rhodes 22 around the time he took over production of the boat. Other than the in house production line, I think all the hull lines and sail plan were unchanged. The hull molds were literally the same. The Rhodes Continental 22 was not offered with the inner mast furling mainsail. That came later. Stan, if I?ve gotten something wrong here, please jump into this discussion. Roger Pihlaja S/V Dynamic Equilibrium Sent from my iPad > On Mar 1, 2021, at 1:33 PM, Joe Dempsey wrote: > > Then I'm confused. It is my understanding that the Continental was only built > for a few years. My question, therefore is what is the difference in sail > plan from a Continental and any other Rhodes 22? > > > > ----- > Joe Dempsey > s/v Respite > Rhodes 22 1989/2005 > Deltaville,VA > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From mweisner at ebsmed.com Mon Mar 1 14:45:07 2021 From: mweisner at ebsmed.com (Michael D. Weisner) Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2021 14:45:07 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes Continental Sails In-Reply-To: References: <1613761250989-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <408F9401-E24B-4554-826E-DD98BFC0E1F3@stottarchitecture.com> <1614623625839-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <005601d70ed3$6283eba0$278bc2e0$@ebsmed.com> I bought my first Rhodes 22, an RC - that's what they were called back then (1980) from Stan in Rose's kitchen, after our test sail. I attached 2 pdf files of the sales materials distributed to potential buyers in 1980 at shows, including the price list and a narrative on the Rhodes Continental. Sheryl and I loved the RC, first seen at the Stamford in the Water Boat Show in the autumn of 1980. Stan had promised a test sail when I gave him the $25 REFUNDABLE DEPOSIT. Unfortunately, he was too busy taking orders at the show so we met him one very cold late October day at the house in Amityville. The wind was howling at a good 15-20 knots and we had a heck of a sail. Stan just sat on the cockpit seat with his back up against the cabin bulkhead facing the stern. He zipped his parka up and smiled as I sailed her hard. He didn't care what I tried because he had faith in the design. We came about and even jibed with all the cloth flying (150 Genoa). I asked him if we needed to reef the main (roller reefing) and he just shrugged, so we didn't. With a crew of 4 twenty somethings and the master, we were invincible. When we finally go back to the canal behind the house, Stan took the helm, showing me how to propel the RC with just the rudder. It was then that I realized, we didn't have an engine on the mount. Who needed a stinking motor? Stan wanted us to be among the first to try out his IMF design but he was unable to give us a firm delivery date so we took delivery of the RC in March 1981. Stan set it up with us and we sailed for about an hour. He only told me how to retrieve her, no practice attempt. I dropped him at our dock and we went out for more sailing. The two of us were finally able to get on the trailer and dropped the mast in the dark. What a day! What a boat! In those days, we sailed from March 1st through Thanksgiving, as trailer sailors! Now, we are on a mooring and I am happy to sail May 15th to October 15, but, we do sail a '91 Rhodes 22 w/IMF and lots of creature comforts. One thing hasn?t changed: I still love to sail my Rhodes 22 fully rigged in lots of wind. But, I must confess, I do furl the main and the huge Genoa well before we hit 15-20 kts. Mike s/v Wind Lass ('91) Nissequogue River, NY I?d rather be sailing :~) -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of Roger Pihlaja Home Sent: Monday, March 1, 2021 1:51 PM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes Continental Sails Joe, It is my understanding that Stan changed the name from Rhodes Continental 22 to Rhodes 22 around the time he took over production of the boat. Other than the in house production line, I think all the hull lines and sail plan were unchanged. The hull molds were literally the same. The Rhodes Continental 22 was not offered with the inner mast furling mainsail. That came later. Stan, if I?ve gotten something wrong here, please jump into this discussion. Roger Pihlaja S/V Dynamic Equilibrium Sent from my iPad > On Mar 1, 2021, at 1:33 PM, Joe Dempsey wrote: > > Then I'm confused. It is my understanding that the Continental was > only built for a few years. My question, therefore is what is the > difference in sail plan from a Continental and any other Rhodes 22? > > > > ----- > Joe Dempsey > s/v Respite > Rhodes 22 1989/2005 > Deltaville,VA > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Rhodes Sales Literature, circa 1980.pdf Type: application/pdf Size: 2084509 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Report on the Rhodes Continental, circa 1980.pdf Type: application/pdf Size: 687656 bytes Desc: not available URL: From stan at generalboats.com Mon Mar 1 15:32:06 2021 From: stan at generalboats.com (stan) Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2021 15:32:06 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes Continental Sails In-Reply-To: <005601d70ed3$6283eba0$278bc2e0$@ebsmed.com> References: <1613761250989-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <408F9401-E24B-4554-826E-DD98BFC0E1F3@stottarchitecture.com> <1614623625839-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <005601d70ed3$6283eba0$278bc2e0$@ebsmed.com> Message-ID: <916d9b93-9604-8b3a-c9d5-5c84c1acadb8@generalboats.com> It is a good thing one of us has a good memory.? No motor and we made it all the way to the dead end of that long narrow canal?? If I knew the boats were that good I would have kept them all.? What did you say your name was. Roger, this guy knows more about the boat than I do.? Ask Him. He has owned two; I never could afford one.? But lately been considering it since they now come with a great surprise benefit: Free burial at sea for a neat net savings. stan Mike, thanks for those wonderful memories. On 3/1/21 2:45 PM, Michael D. Weisner wrote: > I bought my first Rhodes 22, an RC - that's what they were called back then (1980) from Stan in Rose's kitchen, after our test sail. I attached 2 pdf files of the sales materials distributed to potential buyers in 1980 at shows, including the price list and a narrative on the Rhodes Continental. > > Sheryl and I loved the RC, first seen at the Stamford in the Water Boat Show in the autumn of 1980. Stan had promised a test sail when I gave him the $25 REFUNDABLE DEPOSIT. Unfortunately, he was too busy taking orders at the show so we met him one very cold late October day at the house in Amityville. The wind was howling at a good 15-20 knots and we had a heck of a sail. Stan just sat on the cockpit seat with his back up against the cabin bulkhead facing the stern. He zipped his parka up and smiled as I sailed her hard. He didn't care what I tried because he had faith in the design. We came about and even jibed with all the cloth flying (150 Genoa). I asked him if we needed to reef the main (roller reefing) and he just shrugged, so we didn't. With a crew of 4 twenty somethings and the master, we were invincible. When we finally go back to the canal behind the house, Stan took the helm, showing me how to propel the RC with just the rudder. It was then that I realized, we didn't have an engine on the mount. Who needed a stinking motor? > > Stan wanted us to be among the first to try out his IMF design but he was unable to give us a firm delivery date so we took delivery of the RC in March 1981. Stan set it up with us and we sailed for about an hour. He only told me how to retrieve her, no practice attempt. I dropped him at our dock and we went out for more sailing. The two of us were finally able to get on the trailer and dropped the mast in the dark. What a day! What a boat! > > In those days, we sailed from March 1st through Thanksgiving, as trailer sailors! Now, we are on a mooring and I am happy to sail May 15th to October 15, but, we do sail a '91 Rhodes 22 w/IMF and lots of creature comforts. One thing hasn?t changed: I still love to sail my Rhodes 22 fully rigged in lots of wind. But, I must confess, I do furl the main and the huge Genoa well before we hit 15-20 kts. > > Mike > s/v Wind Lass ('91) > Nissequogue River, NY > I?d rather be sailing :~) > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of Roger Pihlaja Home > Sent: Monday, March 1, 2021 1:51 PM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes Continental Sails > > Joe, > > It is my understanding that Stan changed the name from Rhodes Continental 22 to Rhodes 22 around the time he took over production of the boat. Other than the in house production line, I think all the hull lines and sail plan were unchanged. The hull molds were literally the same. The Rhodes Continental 22 was not offered with the inner mast furling mainsail. That came later. Stan, if I?ve gotten something wrong here, please jump into this discussion. > > Roger Pihlaja > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > Sent from my iPad > >> On Mar 1, 2021, at 1:33 PM, Joe Dempsey wrote: >> >> Then I'm confused. It is my understanding that the Continental was >> only built for a few years. My question, therefore is what is the >> difference in sail plan from a Continental and any other Rhodes 22? >> >> >> >> ----- >> Joe Dempsey >> s/v Respite >> Rhodes 22 1989/2005 >> Deltaville,VA >> -- >> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: Rhodes Sales Literature, circa 1980.pdf > Type: application/pdf > Size: 2084509 bytes > Desc: not available > URL: > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: Report on the Rhodes Continental, circa 1980.pdf > Type: application/pdf > Size: 687656 bytes > Desc: not available > URL: From ric at stottarchitecture.com Mon Mar 1 15:59:24 2021 From: ric at stottarchitecture.com (Ric Stott) Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2021 15:59:24 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes Continental Sails In-Reply-To: <916d9b93-9604-8b3a-c9d5-5c84c1acadb8@generalboats.com> References: <1613761250989-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <408F9401-E24B-4554-826E-DD98BFC0E1F3@stottarchitecture.com> <1614623625839-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <005601d70ed3$6283eba0$278bc2e0$@ebsmed.com> <916d9b93-9604-8b3a-c9d5-5c84c1acadb8@generalboats.com> Message-ID: Stan et al This is a difficult subject but since you brought it up. Rhodies - If you plan to use your boat as the coffin - it will not work! I shouldn?t have to remind you that the Rhodes 22 does not sink. I know Stan?s sense of humor is talking and so is mine. But we have joked about how to send off our race captain on the C&C 35 I?ve been sailing on for 30 years. He?s 85, bought his boat new and is still racing, but hey, ya never know. Far off-shore and out-of-sight, a thru-hull fitting comes loose - - - The C&C disappears, the Rhodes becomes part of the Plastic waste island floating forever mid ocean. Long live Stan and the Rhodes 22 - may we float forever. Ric sv Dadventure Hampton Bays, NY Richard Stott, AIA, LEED AP www.stottarchitecture.com Office 631-283-1777 Cell 516-965-3164 > On Mar 1, 2021, at 3:32 PM, stan wrote: > > It is a good thing one of us has a good memory. No motor and we made it all the way to the dead end of that long narrow canal? If I knew the boats were that good I would have kept them all. What did you say your name was. > > Roger, this guy knows more about the boat than I do. Ask Him. He has owned two; I never could afford one. But lately been considering it since they now come with a great surprise benefit: Free burial at sea for a neat net savings. > > stan > > Mike, thanks for those wonderful memories. > > > > On 3/1/21 2:45 PM, Michael D. Weisner wrote: >> I bought my first Rhodes 22, an RC - that's what they were called back then (1980) from Stan in Rose's kitchen, after our test sail. I attached 2 pdf files of the sales materials distributed to potential buyers in 1980 at shows, including the price list and a narrative on the Rhodes Continental. >> >> Sheryl and I loved the RC, first seen at the Stamford in the Water Boat Show in the autumn of 1980. Stan had promised a test sail when I gave him the $25 REFUNDABLE DEPOSIT. Unfortunately, he was too busy taking orders at the show so we met him one very cold late October day at the house in Amityville. The wind was howling at a good 15-20 knots and we had a heck of a sail. Stan just sat on the cockpit seat with his back up against the cabin bulkhead facing the stern. He zipped his parka up and smiled as I sailed her hard. He didn't care what I tried because he had faith in the design. We came about and even jibed with all the cloth flying (150 Genoa). I asked him if we needed to reef the main (roller reefing) and he just shrugged, so we didn't. With a crew of 4 twenty somethings and the master, we were invincible. When we finally go back to the canal behind the house, Stan took the helm, showing me how to propel the RC with just the rudder. It was then that I realized, we didn't have an engine on the mount. Who needed a stinking motor? >> >> Stan wanted us to be among the first to try out his IMF design but he was unable to give us a firm delivery date so we took delivery of the RC in March 1981. Stan set it up with us and we sailed for about an hour. He only told me how to retrieve her, no practice attempt. I dropped him at our dock and we went out for more sailing. The two of us were finally able to get on the trailer and dropped the mast in the dark. What a day! What a boat! >> >> In those days, we sailed from March 1st through Thanksgiving, as trailer sailors! Now, we are on a mooring and I am happy to sail May 15th to October 15, but, we do sail a '91 Rhodes 22 w/IMF and lots of creature comforts. One thing hasn?t changed: I still love to sail my Rhodes 22 fully rigged in lots of wind. But, I must confess, I do furl the main and the huge Genoa well before we hit 15-20 kts. >> >> Mike >> s/v Wind Lass ('91) >> Nissequogue River, NY >> I?d rather be sailing :~) >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of Roger Pihlaja Home >> Sent: Monday, March 1, 2021 1:51 PM >> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List >> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes Continental Sails >> >> Joe, >> >> It is my understanding that Stan changed the name from Rhodes Continental 22 to Rhodes 22 around the time he took over production of the boat. Other than the in house production line, I think all the hull lines and sail plan were unchanged. The hull molds were literally the same. The Rhodes Continental 22 was not offered with the inner mast furling mainsail. That came later. Stan, if I?ve gotten something wrong here, please jump into this discussion. >> >> Roger Pihlaja >> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >> >> Sent from my iPad >> >>> On Mar 1, 2021, at 1:33 PM, Joe Dempsey wrote: >>> >>> Then I'm confused. It is my understanding that the Continental was >>> only built for a few years. My question, therefore is what is the >>> difference in sail plan from a Continental and any other Rhodes 22? >>> >>> >>> >>> ----- >>> Joe Dempsey >>> s/v Respite >>> Rhodes 22 1989/2005 >>> Deltaville,VA >>> -- >>> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ >> -------------- next part -------------- >> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... >> Name: Rhodes Sales Literature, circa 1980.pdf >> Type: application/pdf >> Size: 2084509 bytes >> Desc: not available >> URL: >> -------------- next part -------------- >> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... >> Name: Report on the Rhodes Continental, circa 1980.pdf >> Type: application/pdf >> Size: 687656 bytes >> Desc: not available >> URL: > > From rlowe at vt.edu Mon Mar 1 16:03:29 2021 From: rlowe at vt.edu (Lowe, Rob) Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2021 21:03:29 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes Continental Sails In-Reply-To: References: <1613761250989-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <408F9401-E24B-4554-826E-DD98BFC0E1F3@stottarchitecture.com> <1614623625839-0.post@n5.nabble.com>, Message-ID: My first Rhodes was also a 1976 RC. It had standard main and a hank on jib. The jib was such a pain to rig that we hardly used it. We had sailed with friends that had a Rhodes with IMF and furling jib and that's what we wanted. So when I had enough money, we bought one, which we still have. I had the two boats for one week. I gave the 1976 away, with the trailer, as long as they bought the motor for $1500. It was a good way to advertise the sale. - Rob ________________________________ From: Rhodes22-list on behalf of Chris Geankoplis Sent: Monday, March 1, 2021 1:46 PM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes Continental Sails Hey Joe, The 1st Rhodes I owned was a new 1976 Rhodes Continental. It had a traditional main and the Rhodes tube furler. The boom could be turned to roll up the main but proved to be a pia. The traveler was just a wire attached to the aft chain plates. There were a few differences on the moulds , just minor compared to the ?83 that is now in Greece with in mast furling and bar traveler. More differences, both interior and exterior including a CDI furler on the Kansas 1986/2015 boat. I was never clear what made a ?Continental ? other than vintage. Chris Geankoplis Enosis On Mon, Mar 1, 2021 at 1:33 PM Joe Dempsey wrote: > Then I'm confused. It is my understanding that the Continental was only > built > for a few years. My question, therefore is what is the difference in sail > plan from a Continental and any other Rhodes 22? > > > > ----- > Joe Dempsey > s/v Respite > Rhodes 22 1989/2005 > Deltaville,VA > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > From retiredtoby at gmail.com Mon Mar 1 16:07:39 2021 From: retiredtoby at gmail.com (Cary Tolbert) Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2021 16:07:39 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes Continental Sails In-Reply-To: References: <1613761250989-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <408F9401-E24B-4554-826E-DD98BFC0E1F3@stottarchitecture.com> <1614623625839-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <005601d70ed3$6283eba0$278bc2e0$@ebsmed.com> <916d9b93-9604-8b3a-c9d5-5c84c1acadb8@generalboats.com> Message-ID: It could be like the Anglo-Saxon burial at Sutton Hoo. A Saxon king buried in his boat in England Google it. Cary Tolbert SV Whisper 86 On Mon, Mar 1, 2021, 3:59 PM Ric Stott wrote: > Stan et al > This is a difficult subject but since you brought it up. > Rhodies - > If you plan to use your boat as the coffin - it will not work! > I shouldn?t have to remind you that the Rhodes 22 does not sink. > I know Stan?s sense of humor is talking and so is mine. > But we have joked about how to send off our race captain on the C&C 35 > I?ve been sailing on for 30 years. > He?s 85, bought his boat new and is still racing, but hey, ya never know. > > Far off-shore and out-of-sight, a thru-hull fitting comes loose - - - > The C&C disappears, the Rhodes becomes part of the Plastic waste island > floating forever mid ocean. > Long live Stan and the Rhodes 22 - may we float forever. > Ric > sv Dadventure > Hampton Bays, NY > > Richard Stott, AIA, LEED AP > www.stottarchitecture.com > Office 631-283-1777 > Cell 516-965-3164 > > > > > > > On Mar 1, 2021, at 3:32 PM, stan wrote: > > > > It is a good thing one of us has a good memory. No motor and we made it > all the way to the dead end of that long narrow canal? If I knew the boats > were that good I would have kept them all. What did you say your name was. > > > > Roger, this guy knows more about the boat than I do. Ask Him. He has > owned two; I never could afford one. But lately been considering it since > they now come with a great surprise benefit: Free burial at sea for a neat > net savings. > > > > stan > > > > Mike, thanks for those wonderful memories. > > > > > > > > On 3/1/21 2:45 PM, Michael D. Weisner wrote: > >> I bought my first Rhodes 22, an RC - that's what they were called back > then (1980) from Stan in Rose's kitchen, after our test sail. I attached 2 > pdf files of the sales materials distributed to potential buyers in 1980 at > shows, including the price list and a narrative on the Rhodes Continental. > >> > >> Sheryl and I loved the RC, first seen at the Stamford in the Water Boat > Show in the autumn of 1980. Stan had promised a test sail when I gave him > the $25 REFUNDABLE DEPOSIT. Unfortunately, he was too busy taking orders at > the show so we met him one very cold late October day at the house in > Amityville. The wind was howling at a good 15-20 knots and we had a heck of > a sail. Stan just sat on the cockpit seat with his back up against the > cabin bulkhead facing the stern. He zipped his parka up and smiled as I > sailed her hard. He didn't care what I tried because he had faith in the > design. We came about and even jibed with all the cloth flying (150 Genoa). > I asked him if we needed to reef the main (roller reefing) and he just > shrugged, so we didn't. With a crew of 4 twenty somethings and the master, > we were invincible. When we finally go back to the canal behind the house, > Stan took the helm, showing me how to propel the RC with just the rudder. > It was then that I realized, we didn't have an engine on the mount. Who > needed a stinking motor? > >> > >> Stan wanted us to be among the first to try out his IMF design but he > was unable to give us a firm delivery date so we took delivery of the RC in > March 1981. Stan set it up with us and we sailed for about an hour. He only > told me how to retrieve her, no practice attempt. I dropped him at our dock > and we went out for more sailing. The two of us were finally able to get on > the trailer and dropped the mast in the dark. What a day! What a boat! > >> > >> In those days, we sailed from March 1st through Thanksgiving, as > trailer sailors! Now, we are on a mooring and I am happy to sail May 15th > to October 15, but, we do sail a '91 Rhodes 22 w/IMF and lots of creature > comforts. One thing hasn?t changed: I still love to sail my Rhodes 22 fully > rigged in lots of wind. But, I must confess, I do furl the main and the > huge Genoa well before we hit 15-20 kts. > >> > >> Mike > >> s/v Wind Lass ('91) > >> Nissequogue River, NY > >> I?d rather be sailing :~) > >> > >> -----Original Message----- > >> From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of > Roger Pihlaja Home > >> Sent: Monday, March 1, 2021 1:51 PM > >> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > >> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes Continental Sails > >> > >> Joe, > >> > >> It is my understanding that Stan changed the name from Rhodes > Continental 22 to Rhodes 22 around the time he took over production of the > boat. Other than the in house production line, I think all the hull lines > and sail plan were unchanged. The hull molds were literally the same. The > Rhodes Continental 22 was not offered with the inner mast furling > mainsail. That came later. Stan, if I?ve gotten something wrong here, > please jump into this discussion. > >> > >> Roger Pihlaja > >> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > >> > >> Sent from my iPad > >> > >>> On Mar 1, 2021, at 1:33 PM, Joe Dempsey wrote: > >>> > >>> Then I'm confused. It is my understanding that the Continental was > >>> only built for a few years. My question, therefore is what is the > >>> difference in sail plan from a Continental and any other Rhodes 22? > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> ----- > >>> Joe Dempsey > >>> s/v Respite > >>> Rhodes 22 1989/2005 > >>> Deltaville,VA > >>> -- > >>> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > >> -------------- next part -------------- > >> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > >> Name: Rhodes Sales Literature, circa 1980.pdf > >> Type: application/pdf > >> Size: 2084509 bytes > >> Desc: not available > >> URL: < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210301/83808c7b/attachment.pdf > > > >> -------------- next part -------------- > >> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > >> Name: Report on the Rhodes Continental, circa 1980.pdf > >> Type: application/pdf > >> Size: 687656 bytes > >> Desc: not available > >> URL: < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210301/83808c7b/attachment-0001.pdf > > > > > > > > From reuben.mezrich at gmail.com Mon Mar 1 16:07:43 2021 From: reuben.mezrich at gmail.com (Reuben Mezrich) Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2021 16:07:43 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first In-Reply-To: <916d9b93-9604-8b3a-c9d5-5c84c1acadb8@generalboats.com> References: <1613761250989-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <408F9401-E24B-4554-826E-DD98BFC0E1F3@stottarchitecture.com> <1614623625839-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <005601d70ed3$6283eba0$278bc2e0$@ebsmed.com> <916d9b93-9604-8b3a-c9d5-5c84c1acadb8@generalboats.com> Message-ID: As I mentioned a week or two ago, I installed a Marinco 3" Day/night solar vent at the bow, using the hole already in place for the anchor locker. It installed easily, seemed to work fine but a few days later we had a heavy rain and the next day the forward tips of the forward cabin cushions were wet. I removed the vent, replaced the deck plate, installed a new gasket under the deck plate, applied a generous amount of RTV silicone to both sides of the gasket and reinstalled the solar vent. The next day (yesterday actually) I used a hose to rain water on the forward deck, aiming at the solar vent for about 6 minutes and when I checked below everything was dry. I checked again in an hour and it was still dry. This morning there was about a cup of water, maybe two cups of water at the bow. There was no water in the tray that serves as the anchor locker and which is directly under the solar vent. The vent itself was dry as was the ceiling around the vent. The walls were also dry. I dried the water with a towel and a few hours later a small amount of water seemed to be seeping under a triangular piece of wood at the very bow of the boat (see attached photo). I haven't removed that piece of wood yet but I'm pretty sure I'll find the bolts from the chain plate at the bow for the jib stay. My feeling now is that the solar vent was never the source of the leak but I've had a small leak for a while but never noticed because I never had a reason to go up to the very front of the forward cabin. As it turns out the bottom of the cushions, which are rubberized are stained, giving evidence that the leak is likely long standing. Those bolts would be my best guess as the source of the leak but I'd look forward to suggestions as to where else I might look. Its always something --Reuben Reuben Mezrich Pelican Cove in Sarasota Cell: 410-499-8922 > > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Screen Shot 2021-03-01 at 4.02.36 PM.png Type: image/png Size: 1826288 bytes Desc: not available URL: From hnw555 at gmail.com Mon Mar 1 16:13:38 2021 From: hnw555 at gmail.com (Hank) Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2021 16:13:38 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes Continental Sails In-Reply-To: References: <1613761250989-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <408F9401-E24B-4554-826E-DD98BFC0E1F3@stottarchitecture.com> <1614623625839-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <005601d70ed3$6283eba0$278bc2e0$@ebsmed.com> <916d9b93-9604-8b3a-c9d5-5c84c1acadb8@generalboats.com> Message-ID: Netflix has a good movie on that called "The Dig". Very interesting! Hank On Mon, Mar 1, 2021 at 4:07 PM Cary Tolbert wrote: > It could be like the Anglo-Saxon burial at Sutton Hoo. A Saxon king buried > in his boat in England > Google it. > Cary Tolbert > SV Whisper 86 > > On Mon, Mar 1, 2021, 3:59 PM Ric Stott wrote: > > > Stan et al > > This is a difficult subject but since you brought it up. > > Rhodies - > > If you plan to use your boat as the coffin - it will not work! > > I shouldn?t have to remind you that the Rhodes 22 does not sink. > > I know Stan?s sense of humor is talking and so is mine. > > But we have joked about how to send off our race captain on the C&C 35 > > I?ve been sailing on for 30 years. > > He?s 85, bought his boat new and is still racing, but hey, ya never know. > > > > Far off-shore and out-of-sight, a thru-hull fitting comes loose - - - > > The C&C disappears, the Rhodes becomes part of the Plastic waste island > > floating forever mid ocean. > > Long live Stan and the Rhodes 22 - may we float forever. > > Ric > > sv Dadventure > > Hampton Bays, NY > > > > Richard Stott, AIA, LEED AP > > www.stottarchitecture.com > > Office 631-283-1777 > > Cell 516-965-3164 > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Mar 1, 2021, at 3:32 PM, stan wrote: > > > > > > It is a good thing one of us has a good memory. No motor and we made > it > > all the way to the dead end of that long narrow canal? If I knew the > boats > > were that good I would have kept them all. What did you say your name > was. > > > > > > Roger, this guy knows more about the boat than I do. Ask Him. He has > > owned two; I never could afford one. But lately been considering it > since > > they now come with a great surprise benefit: Free burial at sea for a > neat > > net savings. > > > > > > stan > > > > > > Mike, thanks for those wonderful memories. > > > > > > > > > > > > On 3/1/21 2:45 PM, Michael D. Weisner wrote: > > >> I bought my first Rhodes 22, an RC - that's what they were called back > > then (1980) from Stan in Rose's kitchen, after our test sail. I attached > 2 > > pdf files of the sales materials distributed to potential buyers in 1980 > at > > shows, including the price list and a narrative on the Rhodes > Continental. > > >> > > >> Sheryl and I loved the RC, first seen at the Stamford in the Water > Boat > > Show in the autumn of 1980. Stan had promised a test sail when I gave him > > the $25 REFUNDABLE DEPOSIT. Unfortunately, he was too busy taking orders > at > > the show so we met him one very cold late October day at the house in > > Amityville. The wind was howling at a good 15-20 knots and we had a heck > of > > a sail. Stan just sat on the cockpit seat with his back up against the > > cabin bulkhead facing the stern. He zipped his parka up and smiled as I > > sailed her hard. He didn't care what I tried because he had faith in the > > design. We came about and even jibed with all the cloth flying (150 > Genoa). > > I asked him if we needed to reef the main (roller reefing) and he just > > shrugged, so we didn't. With a crew of 4 twenty somethings and the > master, > > we were invincible. When we finally go back to the canal behind the > house, > > Stan took the helm, showing me how to propel the RC with just the rudder. > > It was then that I realized, we didn't have an engine on the mount. Who > > needed a stinking motor? > > >> > > >> Stan wanted us to be among the first to try out his IMF design but he > > was unable to give us a firm delivery date so we took delivery of the RC > in > > March 1981. Stan set it up with us and we sailed for about an hour. He > only > > told me how to retrieve her, no practice attempt. I dropped him at our > dock > > and we went out for more sailing. The two of us were finally able to get > on > > the trailer and dropped the mast in the dark. What a day! What a boat! > > >> > > >> In those days, we sailed from March 1st through Thanksgiving, as > > trailer sailors! Now, we are on a mooring and I am happy to sail May 15th > > to October 15, but, we do sail a '91 Rhodes 22 w/IMF and lots of creature > > comforts. One thing hasn?t changed: I still love to sail my Rhodes 22 > fully > > rigged in lots of wind. But, I must confess, I do furl the main and the > > huge Genoa well before we hit 15-20 kts. > > >> > > >> Mike > > >> s/v Wind Lass ('91) > > >> Nissequogue River, NY > > >> I?d rather be sailing :~) > > >> > > >> -----Original Message----- > > >> From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of > > Roger Pihlaja Home > > >> Sent: Monday, March 1, 2021 1:51 PM > > >> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > > >> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes Continental Sails > > >> > > >> Joe, > > >> > > >> It is my understanding that Stan changed the name from Rhodes > > Continental 22 to Rhodes 22 around the time he took over production of > the > > boat. Other than the in house production line, I think all the hull > lines > > and sail plan were unchanged. The hull molds were literally the same. > The > > Rhodes Continental 22 was not offered with the inner mast furling > > mainsail. That came later. Stan, if I?ve gotten something wrong here, > > please jump into this discussion. > > >> > > >> Roger Pihlaja > > >> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > >> > > >> Sent from my iPad > > >> > > >>> On Mar 1, 2021, at 1:33 PM, Joe Dempsey > wrote: > > >>> > > >>> Then I'm confused. It is my understanding that the Continental was > > >>> only built for a few years. My question, therefore is what is the > > >>> difference in sail plan from a Continental and any other Rhodes 22? > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> ----- > > >>> Joe Dempsey > > >>> s/v Respite > > >>> Rhodes 22 1989/2005 > > >>> Deltaville,VA > > >>> -- > > >>> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > > >> -------------- next part -------------- > > >> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > > >> Name: Rhodes Sales Literature, circa 1980.pdf > > >> Type: application/pdf > > >> Size: 2084509 bytes > > >> Desc: not available > > >> URL: < > > > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210301/83808c7b/attachment.pdf > > > > > >> -------------- next part -------------- > > >> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > > >> Name: Report on the Rhodes Continental, circa 1980.pdf > > >> Type: application/pdf > > >> Size: 687656 bytes > > >> Desc: not available > > >> URL: < > > > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210301/83808c7b/attachment-0001.pdf > > > > > > > > > > > > > > From rlowe at vt.edu Mon Mar 1 16:29:01 2021 From: rlowe at vt.edu (Lowe, Rob) Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2021 21:29:01 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Public Service Announcement - Security and personal info on 'da list' In-Reply-To: <01dc01d70d28$1eec1400$5cc43c00$@ebsmed.com> References: <006201d70c8f$ee4fe8f0$caefbad0$@ebsmed.com> , <01dc01d70d28$1eec1400$5cc43c00$@ebsmed.com> Message-ID: Is there a way to have the email list overlooked by Google and Nabble? Although it's probably too late for that now. I'll go with Mike's advice and not post anything private. - rob ________________________________ From: Rhodes22-list on behalf of Michael D. Weisner Sent: Saturday, February 27, 2021 11:46 AM To: 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Public Service Announcement - Security and personal info on 'da list' Tom, I have been looking into SSL. It appears that the free certificates (self-certify) may not provide any real security. I would appreciate further education. Since everything on the email list is indexed by Google, I do not understand what additional security SSL brings other than to authenticate the source of the webpages themselves. I was merely cautioning list members not to place personal info in emails that are bound for the list. The Google maps are not run by our rhodes22.org website. I do not understand your reluctance to add your name to the map. Mike s/v Wind Lass ('91) Nissequogue River, NY -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of Tom Van Heule Sent: Saturday, February 27, 2021 10:53 AM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Public Service Announcement - Security and personal info on 'da list' I was going to keep my.mouth shut about it all let's say I won't be adding my name to the map. (And part of why I wanted SSL (let's encypt is free) to at least limit some of the boys from finding us) On Fri, Feb 26, 2021, 4:37 PM Michael D. Weisner wrote: > I just wanted to caution all about the fact that the Rhodes22 email > list is indexed by Nabble and Google. All information on the list is > publicly available. Please be careful about including personal info > such as phone numbers (they may be in your automatic signatures). If > you need to exchange personal info with a trusted list member, please > email the individual directly and do not copy 'da list'. > > > > Mike > > s/v Wind Lass ('91) > > Nissequogue River, NY > > I'd rather be sailing :~) > > > > > > From roger_pihlaja at msn.com Mon Mar 1 16:40:51 2021 From: roger_pihlaja at msn.com (ROGER PIHLAJA) Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2021 21:40:51 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first In-Reply-To: References: <1613761250989-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <408F9401-E24B-4554-826E-DD98BFC0E1F3@stottarchitecture.com> <1614623625839-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <005601d70ed3$6283eba0$278bc2e0$@ebsmed.com> <916d9b93-9604-8b3a-c9d5-5c84c1acadb8@generalboats.com>, Message-ID: Reuben, The two most likely candidates are the thru bolts for the forestay chainplate and the thru bolts for the bow eye. Less likely; but, still possible are the thru bolts for the bow pulpit, bow cleats, and bow chocks. Roger Pihlaja S/V Dynamic Equilibrium Sent from my iPhone > On Mar 1, 2021, at 4:08 PM, Reuben Mezrich wrote: > > ?As I mentioned a week or two ago, I installed a Marinco 3" Day/night solar > vent at the bow, using the hole already in place for the anchor locker. It > installed easily, seemed to work fine but a few days later we had a heavy > rain and the next day the forward tips of the forward cabin cushions were > wet. I removed the vent, replaced the deck plate, installed a new gasket > under the deck plate, applied a generous amount of RTV silicone to both > sides of the gasket and reinstalled the solar vent. The next day (yesterday > actually) I used a hose to rain water on the forward deck, aiming at the > solar vent for about 6 minutes and when I checked below everything was dry. > I checked again in an hour and it was still dry. > This morning there was about a cup of water, maybe two cups of water at the > bow. There was no water in the tray that serves as the anchor locker and > which is directly under the solar vent. The vent itself was dry as was the > ceiling around the vent. The walls were also dry. I dried the water with a > towel and a few hours later a small amount of water seemed to be seeping > under a triangular piece of wood at the very bow of the boat (see attached > photo). I haven't removed that piece of wood yet but I'm pretty sure I'll > find the bolts from the chain plate at the bow for the jib stay. > My feeling now is that the solar vent was never the source of the leak but > I've had a small leak for a while but never noticed because I never had a > reason to go up to the very front of the forward cabin. As it turns out the > bottom of the cushions, which are rubberized are stained, giving evidence > that the leak is likely long standing. > Those bolts would be my best guess as the source of the leak but I'd look > forward to suggestions as to where else I might look. > > Its always something > > --Reuben > > > Reuben Mezrich > Pelican Cove in Sarasota > Cell: 410-499-8922 > >> >> > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: Screen Shot 2021-03-01 at 4.02.36 PM.png > Type: image/png > Size: 1826288 bytes > Desc: not available > URL: From rlowe at vt.edu Mon Mar 1 16:41:58 2021 From: rlowe at vt.edu (Lowe, Rob) Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2021 21:41:58 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first In-Reply-To: References: <1613761250989-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <408F9401-E24B-4554-826E-DD98BFC0E1F3@stottarchitecture.com> <1614623625839-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <005601d70ed3$6283eba0$278bc2e0$@ebsmed.com> <916d9b93-9604-8b3a-c9d5-5c84c1acadb8@generalboats.com>, Message-ID: Reuben, I expect that piece of wood is just cosmetic and is covering up where your bow eye is bolted through. Is the bow eye loose from outside the boat? Might have some water seeping around the eye. I'd take the wood off and make sur the bolts are tight from the inside of the boat. - Rob ________________________________ From: Rhodes22-list on behalf of Reuben Mezrich Sent: Monday, March 1, 2021 4:07 PM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first As I mentioned a week or two ago, I installed a Marinco 3" Day/night solar vent at the bow, using the hole already in place for the anchor locker. It installed easily, seemed to work fine but a few days later we had a heavy rain and the next day the forward tips of the forward cabin cushions were wet. I removed the vent, replaced the deck plate, installed a new gasket under the deck plate, applied a generous amount of RTV silicone to both sides of the gasket and reinstalled the solar vent. The next day (yesterday actually) I used a hose to rain water on the forward deck, aiming at the solar vent for about 6 minutes and when I checked below everything was dry. I checked again in an hour and it was still dry. This morning there was about a cup of water, maybe two cups of water at the bow. There was no water in the tray that serves as the anchor locker and which is directly under the solar vent. The vent itself was dry as was the ceiling around the vent. The walls were also dry. I dried the water with a towel and a few hours later a small amount of water seemed to be seeping under a triangular piece of wood at the very bow of the boat (see attached photo). I haven't removed that piece of wood yet but I'm pretty sure I'll find the bolts from the chain plate at the bow for the jib stay. My feeling now is that the solar vent was never the source of the leak but I've had a small leak for a while but never noticed because I never had a reason to go up to the very front of the forward cabin. As it turns out the bottom of the cushions, which are rubberized are stained, giving evidence that the leak is likely long standing. Those bolts would be my best guess as the source of the leak but I'd look forward to suggestions as to where else I might look. Its always something --Reuben Reuben Mezrich Pelican Cove in Sarasota Cell: 410-499-8922 > > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Screen Shot 2021-03-01 at 4.02.36 PM.png Type: image/png Size: 1826288 bytes Desc: not available URL: From lvjkuhn at gmail.com Mon Mar 1 16:55:34 2021 From: lvjkuhn at gmail.com (Lee) Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2021 14:55:34 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] New Website In-Reply-To: <012c01d70b3e$e2eed5e0$a8cc81a0$@ebsmed.com> References: <012c01d70b3e$e2eed5e0$a8cc81a0$@ebsmed.com> Message-ID: <1614635734384-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Peter and Mike, Very impressive--thanks! Lee Claytor Lake, VA -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From chrisgeankoplis at gmail.com Mon Mar 1 17:02:14 2021 From: chrisgeankoplis at gmail.com (Chris Geankoplis) Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2021 17:02:14 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes Continental Sails In-Reply-To: <005601d70ed3$6283eba0$278bc2e0$@ebsmed.com> References: <1613761250989-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <408F9401-E24B-4554-826E-DD98BFC0E1F3@stottarchitecture.com> <1614623625839-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <005601d70ed3$6283eba0$278bc2e0$@ebsmed.com> Message-ID: What a delightful recollection, thanks for sharing. It makes me feel young again. Chris Geankoplis Enosis On Mon, Mar 1, 2021 at 2:45 PM Michael D. Weisner wrote: > I bought my first Rhodes 22, an RC - that's what they were called back > then (1980) from Stan in Rose's kitchen, after our test sail. I attached 2 > pdf files of the sales materials distributed to potential buyers in 1980 at > shows, including the price list and a narrative on the Rhodes Continental. > > Sheryl and I loved the RC, first seen at the Stamford in the Water Boat > Show in the autumn of 1980. Stan had promised a test sail when I gave him > the $25 REFUNDABLE DEPOSIT. Unfortunately, he was too busy taking orders at > the show so we met him one very cold late October day at the house in > Amityville. The wind was howling at a good 15-20 knots and we had a heck of > a sail. Stan just sat on the cockpit seat with his back up against the > cabin bulkhead facing the stern. He zipped his parka up and smiled as I > sailed her hard. He didn't care what I tried because he had faith in the > design. We came about and even jibed with all the cloth flying (150 Genoa). > I asked him if we needed to reef the main (roller reefing) and he just > shrugged, so we didn't. With a crew of 4 twenty somethings and the master, > we were invincible. When we finally go back to the canal behind the house, > Stan took the helm, showing me how to propel the RC with just the rudder. > It was then that I realized, we didn't have an engine on the mount. Who > needed a stinking motor? > > Stan wanted us to be among the first to try out his IMF design but he was > unable to give us a firm delivery date so we took delivery of the RC in > March 1981. Stan set it up with us and we sailed for about an hour. He only > told me how to retrieve her, no practice attempt. I dropped him at our dock > and we went out for more sailing. The two of us were finally able to get on > the trailer and dropped the mast in the dark. What a day! What a boat! > > In those days, we sailed from March 1st through Thanksgiving, as trailer > sailors! Now, we are on a mooring and I am happy to sail May 15th to > October 15, but, we do sail a '91 Rhodes 22 w/IMF and lots of creature > comforts. One thing hasn?t changed: I still love to sail my Rhodes 22 fully > rigged in lots of wind. But, I must confess, I do furl the main and the > huge Genoa well before we hit 15-20 kts. > > Mike > s/v Wind Lass ('91) > Nissequogue River, NY > I?d rather be sailing :~) > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of > Roger Pihlaja Home > Sent: Monday, March 1, 2021 1:51 PM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes Continental Sails > > Joe, > > It is my understanding that Stan changed the name from Rhodes Continental > 22 to Rhodes 22 around the time he took over production of the boat. Other > than the in house production line, I think all the hull lines and sail plan > were unchanged. The hull molds were literally the same. The Rhodes > Continental 22 was not offered with the inner mast furling mainsail. That > came later. Stan, if I?ve gotten something wrong here, please jump into > this discussion. > > Roger Pihlaja > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > Sent from my iPad > > > On Mar 1, 2021, at 1:33 PM, Joe Dempsey wrote: > > > > Then I'm confused. It is my understanding that the Continental was > > only built for a few years. My question, therefore is what is the > > difference in sail plan from a Continental and any other Rhodes 22? > > > > > > > > ----- > > Joe Dempsey > > s/v Respite > > Rhodes 22 1989/2005 > > Deltaville,VA > > -- > > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: Rhodes Sales Literature, circa 1980.pdf > Type: application/pdf > Size: 2084509 bytes > Desc: not available > URL: < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210301/83808c7b/attachment.pdf > > > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: Report on the Rhodes Continental, circa 1980.pdf > Type: application/pdf > Size: 687656 bytes > Desc: not available > URL: < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210301/83808c7b/attachment-0001.pdf > > > From mweisner at ebsmed.com Mon Mar 1 17:07:39 2021 From: mweisner at ebsmed.com (Michael D. Weisner) Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2021 17:07:39 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Public Service Announcement - Security and personal info on 'da list' In-Reply-To: References: <006201d70c8f$ee4fe8f0$caefbad0$@ebsmed.com> , <01dc01d70d28$1eec1400$5cc43c00$@ebsmed.com> Message-ID: <007401d70ee7$4c5d5be0$e51813a0$@ebsmed.com> Rob, Please define "overlooked" Mike s/v Wind Lass ('91) Nissequogue River, NY I'd rather be sailing :~) -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of Lowe, Rob Sent: Monday, March 1, 2021 4:29 PM To: 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Public Service Announcement - Security and personal info on 'da list' Is there a way to have the email list overlooked by Google and Nabble? Although it's probably too late for that now. I'll go with Mike's advice and not post anything private. - rob ________________________________ From: Rhodes22-list on behalf of Michael D. Weisner Sent: Saturday, February 27, 2021 11:46 AM To: 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Public Service Announcement - Security and personal info on 'da list' Tom, I have been looking into SSL. It appears that the free certificates (self-certify) may not provide any real security. I would appreciate further education. Since everything on the email list is indexed by Google, I do not understand what additional security SSL brings other than to authenticate the source of the webpages themselves. I was merely cautioning list members not to place personal info in emails that are bound for the list. The Google maps are not run by our rhodes22.org website. I do not understand your reluctance to add your name to the map. Mike s/v Wind Lass ('91) Nissequogue River, NY -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of Tom Van Heule Sent: Saturday, February 27, 2021 10:53 AM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Public Service Announcement - Security and personal info on 'da list' I was going to keep my.mouth shut about it all let's say I won't be adding my name to the map. (And part of why I wanted SSL (let's encypt is free) to at least limit some of the boys from finding us) On Fri, Feb 26, 2021, 4:37 PM Michael D. Weisner wrote: > I just wanted to caution all about the fact that the Rhodes22 email > list is indexed by Nabble and Google. All information on the list is > publicly available. Please be careful about including personal info > such as phone numbers (they may be in your automatic signatures). If > you need to exchange personal info with a trusted list member, please > email the individual directly and do not copy 'da list'. > > > > Mike > > s/v Wind Lass ('91) > > Nissequogue River, NY > > I'd rather be sailing :~) > > > > > > From tom.vanheule at intrinsicprograms.com Mon Mar 1 17:12:21 2021 From: tom.vanheule at intrinsicprograms.com (Tom Van Heule) Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2021 16:12:21 -0600 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Public Service Announcement - Security and personal info on 'da list' In-Reply-To: <007401d70ee7$4c5d5be0$e51813a0$@ebsmed.com> References: <006201d70c8f$ee4fe8f0$caefbad0$@ebsmed.com> <01dc01d70d28$1eec1400$5cc43c00$@ebsmed.com> <007401d70ee7$4c5d5be0$e51813a0$@ebsmed.com> Message-ID: Bot/spider/crawler avoidance. Short answer is no, until we archive and encrypt the whole list, take down the hooks to nabble etc. (potentially lose a lot of folks in the transition) and make it a closed community. That speaks volumes to both sides of our community. We want an open and involved group, we want to remain vigilant in protecting our livelihoods in the 2020+ cyber aware world. Thanks for listening, On Mon, Mar 1, 2021, 4:07 PM Michael D. Weisner wrote: > Rob, > > Please define "overlooked" > > Mike > s/v Wind Lass ('91) > Nissequogue River, NY > I'd rather be sailing :~) > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of > Lowe, > Rob > Sent: Monday, March 1, 2021 4:29 PM > To: 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Public Service Announcement - Security and > personal info on 'da list' > > Is there a way to have the email list overlooked by Google and Nabble? > Although it's probably too late for that now. I'll go with Mike's advice > and not post anything private. - rob > > ________________________________ > From: Rhodes22-list on behalf of > Michael D. Weisner > Sent: Saturday, February 27, 2021 11:46 AM > To: 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Public Service Announcement - Security and > personal info on 'da list' > > Tom, > > I have been looking into SSL. It appears that the free certificates > (self-certify) may not provide any real security. I would appreciate > further > education. > > Since everything on the email list is indexed by Google, I do not > understand > what additional security SSL brings other than to authenticate the source > of > the webpages themselves. I was merely cautioning list members not to place > personal info in emails that are bound for the list. > > The Google maps are not run by our rhodes22.org website. I do not > understand > your reluctance to add your name to the map. > > Mike > s/v Wind Lass ('91) > Nissequogue River, NY > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of Tom > Van Heule > Sent: Saturday, February 27, 2021 10:53 AM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Public Service Announcement - Security and > personal info on 'da list' > > I was going to keep my.mouth shut about it all let's say I won't be adding > my name to the map. > (And part of why I wanted SSL (let's encypt is free) to at least limit some > of the boys from finding us) > > On Fri, Feb 26, 2021, 4:37 PM Michael D. Weisner > wrote: > > > I just wanted to caution all about the fact that the Rhodes22 email > > list is indexed by Nabble and Google. All information on the list is > > publicly available. Please be careful about including personal info > > such as phone numbers (they may be in your automatic signatures). If > > you need to exchange personal info with a trusted list member, please > > email the individual directly and do not copy 'da list'. > > > > > > > > Mike > > > > s/v Wind Lass ('91) > > > > Nissequogue River, NY > > > > I'd rather be sailing :~) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > From mweisner at ebsmed.com Mon Mar 1 17:15:47 2021 From: mweisner at ebsmed.com (Michael D. Weisner) Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2021 17:15:47 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first In-Reply-To: References: <1613761250989-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <408F9401-E24B-4554-826E-DD98BFC0E1F3@stottarchitecture.com> <1614623625839-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <005601d70ed3$6283eba0$278bc2e0$@ebsmed.com> <916d9b93-9604-8b3a-c9d5-5c84c1acadb8@generalboats.com> Message-ID: <007501d70ee8$6edeb690$4c9c23b0$@ebsmed.com> Reuben, I would check the bow eye. The wood backing block usually rots and the eye loosens up. Sometimes just lifting the boat using the bow eye will cause the eye to loosen as the wood compresses. Also, you may want to re-bed the bow pulpit rail deck fittings, chocks, etc. Mike s/v Wind Lass ('91) Nissequogue River, NY I?d rather be sailing :~) -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of Reuben Mezrich Sent: Monday, March 1, 2021 4:08 PM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first As I mentioned a week or two ago, I installed a Marinco 3" Day/night solar vent at the bow, using the hole already in place for the anchor locker. It installed easily, seemed to work fine but a few days later we had a heavy rain and the next day the forward tips of the forward cabin cushions were wet. I removed the vent, replaced the deck plate, installed a new gasket under the deck plate, applied a generous amount of RTV silicone to both sides of the gasket and reinstalled the solar vent. The next day (yesterday actually) I used a hose to rain water on the forward deck, aiming at the solar vent for about 6 minutes and when I checked below everything was dry. I checked again in an hour and it was still dry. This morning there was about a cup of water, maybe two cups of water at the bow. There was no water in the tray that serves as the anchor locker and which is directly under the solar vent. The vent itself was dry as was the ceiling around the vent. The walls were also dry. I dried the water with a towel and a few hours later a small amount of water seemed to be seeping under a triangular piece of wood at the very bow of the boat (see attached photo). I haven't removed that piece of wood yet but I'm pretty sure I'll find the bolts from the chain plate at the bow for the jib stay. My feeling now is that the solar vent was never the source of the leak but I've had a small leak for a while but never noticed because I never had a reason to go up to the very front of the forward cabin. As it turns out the bottom of the cushions, which are rubberized are stained, giving evidence that the leak is likely long standing. Those bolts would be my best guess as the source of the leak but I'd look forward to suggestions as to where else I might look. Its always something --Reuben Reuben Mezrich Pelican Cove in Sarasota Cell: 410-499-8922 > > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Screen Shot 2021-03-01 at 4.02.36 PM.png Type: image/png Size: 1826288 bytes Desc: not available URL: From lvjkuhn at gmail.com Mon Mar 1 17:22:26 2021 From: lvjkuhn at gmail.com (Lee) Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2021 15:22:26 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Lake Superior Cruise Weather Planning In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1614637346941-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Hey Jesse, As the Scandinavians say, there is no such thing as bad weather, only bad clothing. Can't add much to Roger's advice to keep your extremities warm, especially balaclavas. Fingers, toes, and ears are the first to suffer on me. I swear by a good pair of ski mittens. If you have to take them off for a moment to tie a knot or pick your nose your hands will still stay warmer than with gloves. Ear muffs are good but I haven't found a pair that's real comfortable. I like neck gators--easy to pull on and off your face as needed. After reading how fast hypothermia happens in cold water, a tether might be the first thing on my list. Lee Claytor Lake, VA -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From jesse.laten.shumaker at gmail.com Mon Mar 1 17:28:12 2021 From: jesse.laten.shumaker at gmail.com (Jesse Shumaker) Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2021 16:28:12 -0600 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Lake Superior Cruise Weather Planning In-Reply-To: <1614637346941-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1614637346941-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: Hi Lee, good call on the tether. I'm a fan of the neck gator as well. It makes a world of difference for staying warm when paired with a good hat. Jesse Shumaker S/V Zephyr On Mon, Mar 1, 2021 at 4:22 PM Lee wrote: > Hey Jesse, > > As the Scandinavians say, there is no such thing as bad weather, only bad > clothing. > > Can't add much to Roger's advice to keep your extremities warm, especially > balaclavas. Fingers, toes, and ears are the first to suffer on me. I > swear > by a good pair of ski mittens. If you have to take them off for a moment > to tie a knot or pick your nose your hands will still stay warmer than > with > gloves. Ear muffs are good but I haven't found a pair that's real > comfortable. I like neck gators--easy to pull on and off your face as > needed. > > After reading how fast hypothermia happens in cold water, a tether might be > the first thing on my list. > > Lee > Claytor Lake, VA > > > > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > From jesse.laten.shumaker at gmail.com Mon Mar 1 17:39:59 2021 From: jesse.laten.shumaker at gmail.com (Jesse Shumaker) Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2021 16:39:59 -0600 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes Continental Sails In-Reply-To: References: <1613761250989-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <408F9401-E24B-4554-826E-DD98BFC0E1F3@stottarchitecture.com> <1614623625839-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <005601d70ed3$6283eba0$278bc2e0$@ebsmed.com> <916d9b93-9604-8b3a-c9d5-5c84c1acadb8@generalboats.com> Message-ID: Ric, your C&C 35 captain reminds me of a guy at our local sailing club. George will be 85 this year and still regularly wins races on a Snipe, which is a 14' racing dinghy which makes for athletic sailing. He was commodore at our sailing club for over 20 years and is a bit of a hero to the local sailors. I picked up a Snipe for next to nothing last year since we have a fleet that we're trying to rebuild and it is fun one design racing. My wife took one look at the Snipe and said "That's your boat, I'll never go on that tippy thing. I'll stick with the Rhodes and your friends can crew on the Snipe." Jesse Shumaker S/V Zephyr On Mon, Mar 1, 2021 at 2:59 PM Ric Stott wrote: > Stan et al > This is a difficult subject but since you brought it up. > Rhodies - > If you plan to use your boat as the coffin - it will not work! > I shouldn?t have to remind you that the Rhodes 22 does not sink. > I know Stan?s sense of humor is talking and so is mine. > But we have joked about how to send off our race captain on the C&C 35 > I?ve been sailing on for 30 years. > He?s 85, bought his boat new and is still racing, but hey, ya never know. > > Far off-shore and out-of-sight, a thru-hull fitting comes loose - - - > The C&C disappears, the Rhodes becomes part of the Plastic waste island > floating forever mid ocean. > Long live Stan and the Rhodes 22 - may we float forever. > Ric > sv Dadventure > Hampton Bays, NY > > Richard Stott, AIA, LEED AP > www.stottarchitecture.com > Office 631-283-1777 > Cell 516-965-3164 > > > > > > > On Mar 1, 2021, at 3:32 PM, stan wrote: > > > > It is a good thing one of us has a good memory. No motor and we made it > all the way to the dead end of that long narrow canal? If I knew the boats > were that good I would have kept them all. What did you say your name was. > > > > Roger, this guy knows more about the boat than I do. Ask Him. He has > owned two; I never could afford one. But lately been considering it since > they now come with a great surprise benefit: Free burial at sea for a neat > net savings. > > > > stan > > > > Mike, thanks for those wonderful memories. > > > > > > > > On 3/1/21 2:45 PM, Michael D. Weisner wrote: > >> I bought my first Rhodes 22, an RC - that's what they were called back > then (1980) from Stan in Rose's kitchen, after our test sail. I attached 2 > pdf files of the sales materials distributed to potential buyers in 1980 at > shows, including the price list and a narrative on the Rhodes Continental. > >> > >> Sheryl and I loved the RC, first seen at the Stamford in the Water Boat > Show in the autumn of 1980. Stan had promised a test sail when I gave him > the $25 REFUNDABLE DEPOSIT. Unfortunately, he was too busy taking orders at > the show so we met him one very cold late October day at the house in > Amityville. The wind was howling at a good 15-20 knots and we had a heck of > a sail. Stan just sat on the cockpit seat with his back up against the > cabin bulkhead facing the stern. He zipped his parka up and smiled as I > sailed her hard. He didn't care what I tried because he had faith in the > design. We came about and even jibed with all the cloth flying (150 Genoa). > I asked him if we needed to reef the main (roller reefing) and he just > shrugged, so we didn't. With a crew of 4 twenty somethings and the master, > we were invincible. When we finally go back to the canal behind the house, > Stan took the helm, showing me how to propel the RC with just the rudder. > It was then that I realized, we didn't have an engine on the mount. Who > needed a stinking motor? > >> > >> Stan wanted us to be among the first to try out his IMF design but he > was unable to give us a firm delivery date so we took delivery of the RC in > March 1981. Stan set it up with us and we sailed for about an hour. He only > told me how to retrieve her, no practice attempt. I dropped him at our dock > and we went out for more sailing. The two of us were finally able to get on > the trailer and dropped the mast in the dark. What a day! What a boat! > >> > >> In those days, we sailed from March 1st through Thanksgiving, as > trailer sailors! Now, we are on a mooring and I am happy to sail May 15th > to October 15, but, we do sail a '91 Rhodes 22 w/IMF and lots of creature > comforts. One thing hasn?t changed: I still love to sail my Rhodes 22 fully > rigged in lots of wind. But, I must confess, I do furl the main and the > huge Genoa well before we hit 15-20 kts. > >> > >> Mike > >> s/v Wind Lass ('91) > >> Nissequogue River, NY > >> I?d rather be sailing :~) > >> > >> -----Original Message----- > >> From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of > Roger Pihlaja Home > >> Sent: Monday, March 1, 2021 1:51 PM > >> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > >> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes Continental Sails > >> > >> Joe, > >> > >> It is my understanding that Stan changed the name from Rhodes > Continental 22 to Rhodes 22 around the time he took over production of the > boat. Other than the in house production line, I think all the hull lines > and sail plan were unchanged. The hull molds were literally the same. The > Rhodes Continental 22 was not offered with the inner mast furling > mainsail. That came later. Stan, if I?ve gotten something wrong here, > please jump into this discussion. > >> > >> Roger Pihlaja > >> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > >> > >> Sent from my iPad > >> > >>> On Mar 1, 2021, at 1:33 PM, Joe Dempsey wrote: > >>> > >>> Then I'm confused. It is my understanding that the Continental was > >>> only built for a few years. My question, therefore is what is the > >>> difference in sail plan from a Continental and any other Rhodes 22? > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> ----- > >>> Joe Dempsey > >>> s/v Respite > >>> Rhodes 22 1989/2005 > >>> Deltaville,VA > >>> -- > >>> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > >> -------------- next part -------------- > >> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > >> Name: Rhodes Sales Literature, circa 1980.pdf > >> Type: application/pdf > >> Size: 2084509 bytes > >> Desc: not available > >> URL: < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210301/83808c7b/attachment.pdf > > > >> -------------- next part -------------- > >> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > >> Name: Report on the Rhodes Continental, circa 1980.pdf > >> Type: application/pdf > >> Size: 687656 bytes > >> Desc: not available > >> URL: < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210301/83808c7b/attachment-0001.pdf > > > > > > > > From jschroll at msn.com Mon Mar 1 21:48:33 2021 From: jschroll at msn.com (James Schroll) Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2021 21:48:33 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] 1990 Rhodes 22 For Sale Message-ID: With a great deal of reluctance, we have decided to sell our 1990 (refurbished by Stan in 2016) Rhodes. Dark blue hull, electric motor lift, captain?s chairs, main and 130 genoa, tiller and chair covers. It comes with a 2016 Triad trailer and 2016 Yamaha 9.9 engine, all located between Baltimore and Annapolis. Asking $16000. Email me directly (jschroll at msn.com ) if interested. From reuben.mezrich at gmail.com Tue Mar 2 05:26:10 2021 From: reuben.mezrich at gmail.com (Reuben Mezrich) Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2021 05:26:10 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first In-Reply-To: <007501d70ee8$6edeb690$4c9c23b0$@ebsmed.com> References: <1613761250989-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <408F9401-E24B-4554-826E-DD98BFC0E1F3@stottarchitecture.com> <1614623625839-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <005601d70ed3$6283eba0$278bc2e0$@ebsmed.com> <916d9b93-9604-8b3a-c9d5-5c84c1acadb8@generalboats.com> <007501d70ee8$6edeb690$4c9c23b0$@ebsmed.com> Message-ID: Roger, Rob and Mike Thanks for the good suggestions. I'll start by taking off that cosmetic piece of wood at the bow and see what's behind. If nothing is loose I"ll have someone aim a hose at the bow while I"m inside watching in the hope that I might actually see where the water is getting in. I really do hope I don't have to rebed everything. Probably won't be able to do this till the weekend..I"ll report back on what I find Reuben Mezrich Pelican Cove in Sarasota Cell: 410-499-8922 On Mon, Mar 1, 2021 at 5:15 PM Michael D. Weisner wrote: > Reuben, > > I would check the bow eye. The wood backing block usually rots and the eye > loosens up. Sometimes just lifting the boat using the bow eye will cause > the eye to loosen as the wood compresses. > > Also, you may want to re-bed the bow pulpit rail deck fittings, chocks, > etc. > > Mike > s/v Wind Lass ('91) > Nissequogue River, NY > I?d rather be sailing :~) > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of > Reuben Mezrich > Sent: Monday, March 1, 2021 4:08 PM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first > > As I mentioned a week or two ago, I installed a Marinco 3" Day/night solar > vent at the bow, using the hole already in place for the anchor locker. It > installed easily, seemed to work fine but a few days later we had a heavy > rain and the next day the forward tips of the forward cabin cushions were > wet. I removed the vent, replaced the deck plate, installed a new gasket > under the deck plate, applied a generous amount of RTV silicone to both > sides of the gasket and reinstalled the solar vent. The next day (yesterday > actually) I used a hose to rain water on the forward deck, aiming at the > solar vent for about 6 minutes and when I checked below everything was dry. > I checked again in an hour and it was still dry. > This morning there was about a cup of water, maybe two cups of water at > the bow. There was no water in the tray that serves as the anchor locker > and which is directly under the solar vent. The vent itself was dry as was > the ceiling around the vent. The walls were also dry. I dried the water > with a towel and a few hours later a small amount of water seemed to be > seeping under a triangular piece of wood at the very bow of the boat (see > attached photo). I haven't removed that piece of wood yet but I'm pretty > sure I'll find the bolts from the chain plate at the bow for the jib stay. > My feeling now is that the solar vent was never the source of the leak but > I've had a small leak for a while but never noticed because I never had a > reason to go up to the very front of the forward cabin. As it turns out the > bottom of the cushions, which are rubberized are stained, giving evidence > that the leak is likely long standing. > Those bolts would be my best guess as the source of the leak but I'd look > forward to suggestions as to where else I might look. > > Its always something > > --Reuben > > > Reuben Mezrich > Pelican Cove in Sarasota > Cell: 410-499-8922 > > > > > > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: Screen Shot 2021-03-01 at 4.02.36 PM.png > Type: image/png > Size: 1826288 bytes > Desc: not available > URL: < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210301/6a1cf705/attachment.png > > > > From ric at stottarchitecture.com Tue Mar 2 09:24:00 2021 From: ric at stottarchitecture.com (Ric Stott) Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2021 09:24:00 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes Continental Sails In-Reply-To: References: <1613761250989-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <408F9401-E24B-4554-826E-DD98BFC0E1F3@stottarchitecture.com> <1614623625839-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <005601d70ed3$6283eba0$278bc2e0$@ebsmed.com> <916d9b93-9604-8b3a-c9d5-5c84c1acadb8@generalboats.com> Message-ID: <4790B272-9DFB-4906-9552-E7D367C84C04@stottarchitecture.com> Amazing right? Racing a Snipe is not for old men, so your local hero, like mine, is an anomaly. My Captain, George Martin, bought his C&C in 1972 and started racing right away. He upgraded the keel and rig in ?89, a year before I found my way onto the boat. George martin was the Senior Master Lazer Champ about 10 years ago - he beat Rodney Johnstone (the same age) to do it, and also raced JY 15s very successfully. He stopped polishing the bottom of ?Osprey? for Wednesday night racing a couple of years ago because he couldn?t haul himself out of the water and into the dingy anymore and the scuba gear got to be too much. He gets younger crew to do it now, but he?s there with them every minute. We sail with 8, & 10 if its windy - - - the youngest crew is 51. We have had quite a run and the new main sail George just ordered means he?s still got his mojo for the 2021 season. Richard Stott, AIA, LEED AP www.stottarchitecture.com Office 631-283-1777 Cell 516-965-3164 > On Mar 1, 2021, at 5:39 PM, Jesse Shumaker wrote: > > Ric, your C&C 35 captain reminds me of a guy at our local sailing club. > George will be 85 this year and still regularly wins races on a > Snipe, which is a 14' racing dinghy which makes for athletic sailing. He > was commodore at our sailing club for over 20 years and is a bit of a hero > to the local sailors. I picked up a Snipe for next to nothing last year > since we have a fleet that we're trying to rebuild and it is fun one design > racing. My wife took one look at the Snipe and said "That's your boat, > I'll never go on that tippy thing. I'll stick with the Rhodes and your > friends can crew on the Snipe." > > Jesse Shumaker > S/V Zephyr > > On Mon, Mar 1, 2021 at 2:59 PM Ric Stott wrote: > >> Stan et al >> This is a difficult subject but since you brought it up. >> Rhodies - >> If you plan to use your boat as the coffin - it will not work! >> I shouldn?t have to remind you that the Rhodes 22 does not sink. >> I know Stan?s sense of humor is talking and so is mine. >> But we have joked about how to send off our race captain on the C&C 35 >> I?ve been sailing on for 30 years. >> He?s 85, bought his boat new and is still racing, but hey, ya never know. >> >> Far off-shore and out-of-sight, a thru-hull fitting comes loose - - - >> The C&C disappears, the Rhodes becomes part of the Plastic waste island >> floating forever mid ocean. >> Long live Stan and the Rhodes 22 - may we float forever. >> Ric >> sv Dadventure >> Hampton Bays, NY >> >> Richard Stott, AIA, LEED AP >> www.stottarchitecture.com >> Office 631-283-1777 >> Cell 516-965-3164 >> >> >> >> >> >>> On Mar 1, 2021, at 3:32 PM, stan wrote: >>> >>> It is a good thing one of us has a good memory. No motor and we made it >> all the way to the dead end of that long narrow canal? If I knew the boats >> were that good I would have kept them all. What did you say your name was. >>> >>> Roger, this guy knows more about the boat than I do. Ask Him. He has >> owned two; I never could afford one. But lately been considering it since >> they now come with a great surprise benefit: Free burial at sea for a neat >> net savings. >>> >>> stan >>> >>> Mike, thanks for those wonderful memories. >>> >>> >>> >>> On 3/1/21 2:45 PM, Michael D. Weisner wrote: >>>> I bought my first Rhodes 22, an RC - that's what they were called back >> then (1980) from Stan in Rose's kitchen, after our test sail. I attached 2 >> pdf files of the sales materials distributed to potential buyers in 1980 at >> shows, including the price list and a narrative on the Rhodes Continental. >>>> >>>> Sheryl and I loved the RC, first seen at the Stamford in the Water Boat >> Show in the autumn of 1980. Stan had promised a test sail when I gave him >> the $25 REFUNDABLE DEPOSIT. Unfortunately, he was too busy taking orders at >> the show so we met him one very cold late October day at the house in >> Amityville. The wind was howling at a good 15-20 knots and we had a heck of >> a sail. Stan just sat on the cockpit seat with his back up against the >> cabin bulkhead facing the stern. He zipped his parka up and smiled as I >> sailed her hard. He didn't care what I tried because he had faith in the >> design. We came about and even jibed with all the cloth flying (150 Genoa). >> I asked him if we needed to reef the main (roller reefing) and he just >> shrugged, so we didn't. With a crew of 4 twenty somethings and the master, >> we were invincible. When we finally go back to the canal behind the house, >> Stan took the helm, showing me how to propel the RC with just the rudder. >> It was then that I realized, we didn't have an engine on the mount. Who >> needed a stinking motor? >>>> >>>> Stan wanted us to be among the first to try out his IMF design but he >> was unable to give us a firm delivery date so we took delivery of the RC in >> March 1981. Stan set it up with us and we sailed for about an hour. He only >> told me how to retrieve her, no practice attempt. I dropped him at our dock >> and we went out for more sailing. The two of us were finally able to get on >> the trailer and dropped the mast in the dark. What a day! What a boat! >>>> >>>> In those days, we sailed from March 1st through Thanksgiving, as >> trailer sailors! Now, we are on a mooring and I am happy to sail May 15th >> to October 15, but, we do sail a '91 Rhodes 22 w/IMF and lots of creature >> comforts. One thing hasn?t changed: I still love to sail my Rhodes 22 fully >> rigged in lots of wind. But, I must confess, I do furl the main and the >> huge Genoa well before we hit 15-20 kts. >>>> >>>> Mike >>>> s/v Wind Lass ('91) >>>> Nissequogue River, NY >>>> I?d rather be sailing :~) >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of >> Roger Pihlaja Home >>>> Sent: Monday, March 1, 2021 1:51 PM >>>> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List >>>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes Continental Sails >>>> >>>> Joe, >>>> >>>> It is my understanding that Stan changed the name from Rhodes >> Continental 22 to Rhodes 22 around the time he took over production of the >> boat. Other than the in house production line, I think all the hull lines >> and sail plan were unchanged. The hull molds were literally the same. The >> Rhodes Continental 22 was not offered with the inner mast furling >> mainsail. That came later. Stan, if I?ve gotten something wrong here, >> please jump into this discussion. >>>> >>>> Roger Pihlaja >>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPad >>>> >>>>> On Mar 1, 2021, at 1:33 PM, Joe Dempsey wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Then I'm confused. It is my understanding that the Continental was >>>>> only built for a few years. My question, therefore is what is the >>>>> difference in sail plan from a Continental and any other Rhodes 22? >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> ----- >>>>> Joe Dempsey >>>>> s/v Respite >>>>> Rhodes 22 1989/2005 >>>>> Deltaville,VA >>>>> -- >>>>> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ >>>> -------------- next part -------------- >>>> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... >>>> Name: Rhodes Sales Literature, circa 1980.pdf >>>> Type: application/pdf >>>> Size: 2084509 bytes >>>> Desc: not available >>>> URL: < >> http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210301/83808c7b/attachment.pdf >>> >>>> -------------- next part -------------- >>>> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... >>>> Name: Report on the Rhodes Continental, circa 1980.pdf >>>> Type: application/pdf >>>> Size: 687656 bytes >>>> Desc: not available >>>> URL: < >> http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210301/83808c7b/attachment-0001.pdf >>> >>> >>> >> >> From gstewart8 at cogeco.ca Tue Mar 2 09:47:07 2021 From: gstewart8 at cogeco.ca (Graham Stewart) Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2021 09:47:07 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first In-Reply-To: References: <1613761250989-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <408F9401-E24B-4554-826E-DD98BFC0E1F3@stottarchitecture.com> <1614623625839-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <005601d70ed3$6283eba0$278bc2e0$@ebsmed.com> <916d9b93-9604-8b3a-c9d5-5c84c1acadb8@generalboats.com> <007501d70ee8$6edeb690$4c9c23b0$@ebsmed.com> Message-ID: <008701d70f72$ec713710$c553a530$@ca> Reuben: Finding leaks is a PITA. The best way I found was to tape paper towel around any areas that are suspect. Any leaks will show on the towel. Graham Stewart gstewart8 at cogeco.ca -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf Of Reuben Mezrich Sent: Tuesday, March 2, 2021 5:26 AM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first Roger, Rob and Mike Thanks for the good suggestions. I'll start by taking off that cosmetic piece of wood at the bow and see what's behind. If nothing is loose I"ll have someone aim a hose at the bow while I"m inside watching in the hope that I might actually see where the water is getting in. I really do hope I don't have to rebed everything. Probably won't be able to do this till the weekend..I"ll report back on what I find Reuben Mezrich Pelican Cove in Sarasota Cell: 410-499-8922 On Mon, Mar 1, 2021 at 5:15 PM Michael D. Weisner wrote: > Reuben, > > I would check the bow eye. The wood backing block usually rots and the eye > loosens up. Sometimes just lifting the boat using the bow eye will cause > the eye to loosen as the wood compresses. > > Also, you may want to re-bed the bow pulpit rail deck fittings, chocks, > etc. > > Mike > s/v Wind Lass ('91) > Nissequogue River, NY > I?d rather be sailing :~) > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of > Reuben Mezrich > Sent: Monday, March 1, 2021 4:08 PM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first > > As I mentioned a week or two ago, I installed a Marinco 3" Day/night solar > vent at the bow, using the hole already in place for the anchor locker. It > installed easily, seemed to work fine but a few days later we had a heavy > rain and the next day the forward tips of the forward cabin cushions were > wet. I removed the vent, replaced the deck plate, installed a new gasket > under the deck plate, applied a generous amount of RTV silicone to both > sides of the gasket and reinstalled the solar vent. The next day (yesterday > actually) I used a hose to rain water on the forward deck, aiming at the > solar vent for about 6 minutes and when I checked below everything was dry. > I checked again in an hour and it was still dry. > This morning there was about a cup of water, maybe two cups of water at > the bow. There was no water in the tray that serves as the anchor locker > and which is directly under the solar vent. The vent itself was dry as was > the ceiling around the vent. The walls were also dry. I dried the water > with a towel and a few hours later a small amount of water seemed to be > seeping under a triangular piece of wood at the very bow of the boat (see > attached photo). I haven't removed that piece of wood yet but I'm pretty > sure I'll find the bolts from the chain plate at the bow for the jib stay. > My feeling now is that the solar vent was never the source of the leak but > I've had a small leak for a while but never noticed because I never had a > reason to go up to the very front of the forward cabin. As it turns out the > bottom of the cushions, which are rubberized are stained, giving evidence > that the leak is likely long standing. > Those bolts would be my best guess as the source of the leak but I'd look > forward to suggestions as to where else I might look. > > Its always something > > --Reuben > > > Reuben Mezrich > Pelican Cove in Sarasota > Cell: 410-499-8922 > > > > > > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: Screen Shot 2021-03-01 at 4.02.36 PM.png > Type: image/png > Size: 1826288 bytes > Desc: not available > URL: < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210301/6a1cf705/attachment.png > > > > From rlowe at vt.edu Tue Mar 2 10:20:00 2021 From: rlowe at vt.edu (Lowe, Rob) Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2021 15:20:00 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Public Service Announcement - Security and personal info on 'da list' In-Reply-To: References: <006201d70c8f$ee4fe8f0$caefbad0$@ebsmed.com> <01dc01d70d28$1eec1400$5cc43c00$@ebsmed.com> <007401d70ee7$4c5d5be0$e51813a0$@ebsmed.com>, Message-ID: Thanks Tom for the clarification. Wasn?t sure, so thought I would ask. Rob ________________________________ From: Rhodes22-list on behalf of Tom Van Heule Sent: Monday, March 1, 2021 5:12 PM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Public Service Announcement - Security and personal info on 'da list' Bot/spider/crawler avoidance. Short answer is no, until we archive and encrypt the whole list, take down the hooks to nabble etc. (potentially lose a lot of folks in the transition) and make it a closed community. That speaks volumes to both sides of our community. We want an open and involved group, we want to remain vigilant in protecting our livelihoods in the 2020+ cyber aware world. Thanks for listening, On Mon, Mar 1, 2021, 4:07 PM Michael D. Weisner wrote: > Rob, > > Please define "overlooked" > > Mike > s/v Wind Lass ('91) > Nissequogue River, NY > I'd rather be sailing :~) > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of > Lowe, > Rob > Sent: Monday, March 1, 2021 4:29 PM > To: 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Public Service Announcement - Security and > personal info on 'da list' > > Is there a way to have the email list overlooked by Google and Nabble? > Although it's probably too late for that now. I'll go with Mike's advice > and not post anything private. - rob > > ________________________________ > From: Rhodes22-list on behalf of > Michael D. Weisner > Sent: Saturday, February 27, 2021 11:46 AM > To: 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Public Service Announcement - Security and > personal info on 'da list' > > Tom, > > I have been looking into SSL. It appears that the free certificates > (self-certify) may not provide any real security. I would appreciate > further > education. > > Since everything on the email list is indexed by Google, I do not > understand > what additional security SSL brings other than to authenticate the source > of > the webpages themselves. I was merely cautioning list members not to place > personal info in emails that are bound for the list. > > The Google maps are not run by our rhodes22.org website. I do not > understand > your reluctance to add your name to the map. > > Mike > s/v Wind Lass ('91) > Nissequogue River, NY > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of Tom > Van Heule > Sent: Saturday, February 27, 2021 10:53 AM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Public Service Announcement - Security and > personal info on 'da list' > > I was going to keep my.mouth shut about it all let's say I won't be adding > my name to the map. > (And part of why I wanted SSL (let's encypt is free) to at least limit some > of the boys from finding us) > > On Fri, Feb 26, 2021, 4:37 PM Michael D. Weisner > wrote: > > > I just wanted to caution all about the fact that the Rhodes22 email > > list is indexed by Nabble and Google. All information on the list is > > publicly available. Please be careful about including personal info > > such as phone numbers (they may be in your automatic signatures). If > > you need to exchange personal info with a trusted list member, please > > email the individual directly and do not copy 'da list'. > > > > > > > > Mike > > > > s/v Wind Lass ('91) > > > > Nissequogue River, NY > > > > I'd rather be sailing :~) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > From jesse.laten.shumaker at gmail.com Tue Mar 2 10:34:59 2021 From: jesse.laten.shumaker at gmail.com (Jesse Shumaker) Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2021 09:34:59 -0600 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes Continental Sails In-Reply-To: <4790B272-9DFB-4906-9552-E7D367C84C04@stottarchitecture.com> References: <1613761250989-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <408F9401-E24B-4554-826E-DD98BFC0E1F3@stottarchitecture.com> <1614623625839-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <005601d70ed3$6283eba0$278bc2e0$@ebsmed.com> <916d9b93-9604-8b3a-c9d5-5c84c1acadb8@generalboats.com> <4790B272-9DFB-4906-9552-E7D367C84C04@stottarchitecture.com> Message-ID: That's great to hear Ric. It sounds like a lot of fun! The guys who just keep on sailing give us something to aspire to. The biggest boats for racing on our small lake are 22'. We have a match racing league on Santana 20s with a 3 person crew. I'll be the bow man for some experienced racers on their Capri 22' this year. I don't have much spinnaker experience and figured this is a great opportunity to learn from experienced racers. Fortunately, I get the opportunity to sail on a variety of boats which keeps things interesting. I find that racing is a good way to improve sailing skills and I have a lot to learn. Good luck with your racing this season! Jesse On Tue, Mar 2, 2021 at 8:24 AM Ric Stott wrote: > Amazing right? Racing a Snipe is not for old men, so your local hero, like > mine, is an anomaly. > My Captain, George Martin, bought his C&C in 1972 and started racing right > away. > He upgraded the keel and rig in ?89, a year before I found my way onto the > boat. > George martin was the Senior Master Lazer Champ about 10 years ago - he > beat Rodney Johnstone (the same age) to do it, and also raced JY 15s very > successfully. > He stopped polishing the bottom of ?Osprey? for Wednesday night racing a > couple of years ago because he couldn?t haul himself out of the water and > into the dingy anymore and the scuba gear got to be too much. He gets > younger crew to do it now, but he?s there with them every minute. > We sail with 8, & 10 if its windy - - - the youngest crew is 51. > We have had quite a run and the new main sail George just ordered means > he?s still got his mojo for the 2021 season. > > Richard Stott, AIA, LEED AP > www.stottarchitecture.com > Office 631-283-1777 > Cell 516-965-3164 > > > > > > > On Mar 1, 2021, at 5:39 PM, Jesse Shumaker < > jesse.laten.shumaker at gmail.com> wrote: > > > > Ric, your C&C 35 captain reminds me of a guy at our local sailing club. > > George will be 85 this year and still regularly wins races on a > > Snipe, which is a 14' racing dinghy which makes for athletic sailing. He > > was commodore at our sailing club for over 20 years and is a bit of a > hero > > to the local sailors. I picked up a Snipe for next to nothing last year > > since we have a fleet that we're trying to rebuild and it is fun one > design > > racing. My wife took one look at the Snipe and said "That's your boat, > > I'll never go on that tippy thing. I'll stick with the Rhodes and your > > friends can crew on the Snipe." > > > > Jesse Shumaker > > S/V Zephyr > > > > On Mon, Mar 1, 2021 at 2:59 PM Ric Stott > wrote: > > > >> Stan et al > >> This is a difficult subject but since you brought it up. > >> Rhodies - > >> If you plan to use your boat as the coffin - it will not work! > >> I shouldn?t have to remind you that the Rhodes 22 does not sink. > >> I know Stan?s sense of humor is talking and so is mine. > >> But we have joked about how to send off our race captain on the C&C 35 > >> I?ve been sailing on for 30 years. > >> He?s 85, bought his boat new and is still racing, but hey, ya never > know. > >> > >> Far off-shore and out-of-sight, a thru-hull fitting comes loose - - - > >> The C&C disappears, the Rhodes becomes part of the Plastic waste island > >> floating forever mid ocean. > >> Long live Stan and the Rhodes 22 - may we float forever. > >> Ric > >> sv Dadventure > >> Hampton Bays, NY > >> > >> Richard Stott, AIA, LEED AP > >> www.stottarchitecture.com > >> Office 631-283-1777 > >> Cell 516-965-3164 > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >>> On Mar 1, 2021, at 3:32 PM, stan wrote: > >>> > >>> It is a good thing one of us has a good memory. No motor and we made > it > >> all the way to the dead end of that long narrow canal? If I knew the > boats > >> were that good I would have kept them all. What did you say your name > was. > >>> > >>> Roger, this guy knows more about the boat than I do. Ask Him. He has > >> owned two; I never could afford one. But lately been considering it > since > >> they now come with a great surprise benefit: Free burial at sea for a > neat > >> net savings. > >>> > >>> stan > >>> > >>> Mike, thanks for those wonderful memories. > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> On 3/1/21 2:45 PM, Michael D. Weisner wrote: > >>>> I bought my first Rhodes 22, an RC - that's what they were called back > >> then (1980) from Stan in Rose's kitchen, after our test sail. I > attached 2 > >> pdf files of the sales materials distributed to potential buyers in > 1980 at > >> shows, including the price list and a narrative on the Rhodes > Continental. > >>>> > >>>> Sheryl and I loved the RC, first seen at the Stamford in the Water > Boat > >> Show in the autumn of 1980. Stan had promised a test sail when I gave > him > >> the $25 REFUNDABLE DEPOSIT. Unfortunately, he was too busy taking > orders at > >> the show so we met him one very cold late October day at the house in > >> Amityville. The wind was howling at a good 15-20 knots and we had a > heck of > >> a sail. Stan just sat on the cockpit seat with his back up against the > >> cabin bulkhead facing the stern. He zipped his parka up and smiled as I > >> sailed her hard. He didn't care what I tried because he had faith in the > >> design. We came about and even jibed with all the cloth flying (150 > Genoa). > >> I asked him if we needed to reef the main (roller reefing) and he just > >> shrugged, so we didn't. With a crew of 4 twenty somethings and the > master, > >> we were invincible. When we finally go back to the canal behind the > house, > >> Stan took the helm, showing me how to propel the RC with just the > rudder. > >> It was then that I realized, we didn't have an engine on the mount. Who > >> needed a stinking motor? > >>>> > >>>> Stan wanted us to be among the first to try out his IMF design but he > >> was unable to give us a firm delivery date so we took delivery of the > RC in > >> March 1981. Stan set it up with us and we sailed for about an hour. He > only > >> told me how to retrieve her, no practice attempt. I dropped him at our > dock > >> and we went out for more sailing. The two of us were finally able to > get on > >> the trailer and dropped the mast in the dark. What a day! What a boat! > >>>> > >>>> In those days, we sailed from March 1st through Thanksgiving, as > >> trailer sailors! Now, we are on a mooring and I am happy to sail May > 15th > >> to October 15, but, we do sail a '91 Rhodes 22 w/IMF and lots of > creature > >> comforts. One thing hasn?t changed: I still love to sail my Rhodes 22 > fully > >> rigged in lots of wind. But, I must confess, I do furl the main and the > >> huge Genoa well before we hit 15-20 kts. > >>>> > >>>> Mike > >>>> s/v Wind Lass ('91) > >>>> Nissequogue River, NY > >>>> I?d rather be sailing :~) > >>>> > >>>> -----Original Message----- > >>>> From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of > >> Roger Pihlaja Home > >>>> Sent: Monday, March 1, 2021 1:51 PM > >>>> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > >>>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes Continental Sails > >>>> > >>>> Joe, > >>>> > >>>> It is my understanding that Stan changed the name from Rhodes > >> Continental 22 to Rhodes 22 around the time he took over production of > the > >> boat. Other than the in house production line, I think all the hull > lines > >> and sail plan were unchanged. The hull molds were literally the same. > The > >> Rhodes Continental 22 was not offered with the inner mast furling > >> mainsail. That came later. Stan, if I?ve gotten something wrong here, > >> please jump into this discussion. > >>>> > >>>> Roger Pihlaja > >>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > >>>> > >>>> Sent from my iPad > >>>> > >>>>> On Mar 1, 2021, at 1:33 PM, Joe Dempsey > wrote: > >>>>> > >>>>> Then I'm confused. It is my understanding that the Continental was > >>>>> only built for a few years. My question, therefore is what is the > >>>>> difference in sail plan from a Continental and any other Rhodes 22? > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> ----- > >>>>> Joe Dempsey > >>>>> s/v Respite > >>>>> Rhodes 22 1989/2005 > >>>>> Deltaville,VA > >>>>> -- > >>>>> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > >>>> -------------- next part -------------- > >>>> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > >>>> Name: Rhodes Sales Literature, circa 1980.pdf > >>>> Type: application/pdf > >>>> Size: 2084509 bytes > >>>> Desc: not available > >>>> URL: < > >> > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210301/83808c7b/attachment.pdf > >>> > >>>> -------------- next part -------------- > >>>> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > >>>> Name: Report on the Rhodes Continental, circa 1980.pdf > >>>> Type: application/pdf > >>>> Size: 687656 bytes > >>>> Desc: not available > >>>> URL: < > >> > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210301/83808c7b/attachment-0001.pdf > >>> > >>> > >>> > >> > >> > > From reuben.mezrich at gmail.com Tue Mar 2 10:53:36 2021 From: reuben.mezrich at gmail.com (Reuben Mezrich) Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2021 10:53:36 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first In-Reply-To: <008701d70f72$ec713710$c553a530$@ca> References: <1613761250989-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <408F9401-E24B-4554-826E-DD98BFC0E1F3@stottarchitecture.com> <1614623625839-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <005601d70ed3$6283eba0$278bc2e0$@ebsmed.com> <916d9b93-9604-8b3a-c9d5-5c84c1acadb8@generalboats.com> <007501d70ee8$6edeb690$4c9c23b0$@ebsmed.com> <008701d70f72$ec713710$c553a530$@ca> Message-ID: Graham Stan suggested that as well..my first hope is that I'll be able to see it by looking for a leak while someone sprays water at the bow with a hose...when that doesn't work I"ll fall back to the paper towel approach -Reuben Reuben Mezrich Pelican Cove in Sarasota Cell: 410-499-8922 On Tue, Mar 2, 2021 at 9:47 AM Graham Stewart wrote: > Reuben: > > Finding leaks is a PITA. The best way I found was to tape paper towel > around any areas that are suspect. Any leaks will show on the towel. > > Graham Stewart > gstewart8 at cogeco.ca > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf > Of Reuben Mezrich > Sent: Tuesday, March 2, 2021 5:26 AM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first > > Roger, Rob and Mike > Thanks for the good suggestions. I'll start by taking off that cosmetic > piece of wood at the bow and see what's behind. If nothing is loose I"ll > have someone aim a hose at the bow while I"m inside watching in the hope > that I might actually see where the water is getting in. > I really do hope I don't have to rebed everything. > Probably won't be able to do this till the weekend..I"ll report back on > what I find > > Reuben Mezrich > Pelican Cove in Sarasota > Cell: 410-499-8922 > > > On Mon, Mar 1, 2021 at 5:15 PM Michael D. Weisner > wrote: > > > Reuben, > > > > I would check the bow eye. The wood backing block usually rots and the > eye > > loosens up. Sometimes just lifting the boat using the bow eye will cause > > the eye to loosen as the wood compresses. > > > > Also, you may want to re-bed the bow pulpit rail deck fittings, chocks, > > etc. > > > > Mike > > s/v Wind Lass ('91) > > Nissequogue River, NY > > I?d rather be sailing :~) > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of > > Reuben Mezrich > > Sent: Monday, March 1, 2021 4:08 PM > > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > > Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first > > > > As I mentioned a week or two ago, I installed a Marinco 3" Day/night > solar > > vent at the bow, using the hole already in place for the anchor locker. > It > > installed easily, seemed to work fine but a few days later we had a heavy > > rain and the next day the forward tips of the forward cabin cushions were > > wet. I removed the vent, replaced the deck plate, installed a new gasket > > under the deck plate, applied a generous amount of RTV silicone to both > > sides of the gasket and reinstalled the solar vent. The next day > (yesterday > > actually) I used a hose to rain water on the forward deck, aiming at the > > solar vent for about 6 minutes and when I checked below everything was > dry. > > I checked again in an hour and it was still dry. > > This morning there was about a cup of water, maybe two cups of water at > > the bow. There was no water in the tray that serves as the anchor locker > > and which is directly under the solar vent. The vent itself was dry as > was > > the ceiling around the vent. The walls were also dry. I dried the water > > with a towel and a few hours later a small amount of water seemed to be > > seeping under a triangular piece of wood at the very bow of the boat > (see > > attached photo). I haven't removed that piece of wood yet but I'm pretty > > sure I'll find the bolts from the chain plate at the bow for the jib > stay. > > My feeling now is that the solar vent was never the source of the leak > but > > I've had a small leak for a while but never noticed because I never had a > > reason to go up to the very front of the forward cabin. As it turns out > the > > bottom of the cushions, which are rubberized are stained, giving evidence > > that the leak is likely long standing. > > Those bolts would be my best guess as the source of the leak but I'd look > > forward to suggestions as to where else I might look. > > > > Its always something > > > > --Reuben > > > > > > Reuben Mezrich > > Pelican Cove in Sarasota > > Cell: 410-499-8922 > > > > > > > > > > -------------- next part -------------- > > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > > Name: Screen Shot 2021-03-01 at 4.02.36 PM.png > > Type: image/png > > Size: 1826288 bytes > > Desc: not available > > URL: < > > > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210301/6a1cf705/attachment.png > > > > > > > > > From ric at stottarchitecture.com Tue Mar 2 10:57:45 2021 From: ric at stottarchitecture.com (Richard Stott) Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2021 10:57:45 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes Continental Sails In-Reply-To: References: <1613761250989-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <408F9401-E24B-4554-826E-DD98BFC0E1F3@stottarchitecture.com> <1614623625839-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <005601d70ed3$6283eba0$278bc2e0$@ebsmed.com> <916d9b93-9604-8b3a-c9d5-5c84c1acadb8@generalboats.com> <4790B272-9DFB-4906-9552-E7D367C84C04@stottarchitecture.com> Message-ID: <752F69A4-B75A-4FA9-B00A-D2AE335D245F@stottarchitecture.com> Jesse Racing is not for everyone. Some seasoned sailors I know say racing brings to the worse in people. Clearly, there are those who race seriously and those who use it for entertainment or whatever. I have learned a lot from racing, mostly about sailing, but also about people. Personally, I like it the best when conditions are the worse - I don?t really know why. I?ve had plenty of experience in-shore and off-shore and enjoy the tough conditions best when I know there?s a hot shower, a good meal and cozy dry bed at the end of the day - or two. A post-race party helps too. Sail-on Ric Dadventure Richard Stott, AIA, LEED AP www.stottarchitecture.com Office 631-283-1777 Cell 516-965-3164 > On Mar 2, 2021, at 10:34 AM, Jesse Shumaker wrote: > > That's great to hear Ric. It sounds like a lot of fun! The guys who just > keep on sailing give us something to aspire to. The biggest boats for > racing on our small lake are 22'. We have a match racing league on Santana > 20s with a 3 person crew. I'll be the bow man for some experienced racers > on their Capri 22' this year. I don't have much spinnaker experience and > figured this is a great opportunity to learn from experienced racers. > Fortunately, I get the opportunity to sail on a variety of boats > which keeps things interesting. I find that racing is a good way to > improve sailing skills and I have a lot to learn. Good luck with your > racing this season! > > Jesse > > On Tue, Mar 2, 2021 at 8:24 AM Ric Stott wrote: > >> Amazing right? Racing a Snipe is not for old men, so your local hero, like >> mine, is an anomaly. >> My Captain, George Martin, bought his C&C in 1972 and started racing right >> away. >> He upgraded the keel and rig in ?89, a year before I found my way onto the >> boat. >> George martin was the Senior Master Lazer Champ about 10 years ago - he >> beat Rodney Johnstone (the same age) to do it, and also raced JY 15s very >> successfully. >> He stopped polishing the bottom of ?Osprey? for Wednesday night racing a >> couple of years ago because he couldn?t haul himself out of the water and >> into the dingy anymore and the scuba gear got to be too much. He gets >> younger crew to do it now, but he?s there with them every minute. >> We sail with 8, & 10 if its windy - - - the youngest crew is 51. >> We have had quite a run and the new main sail George just ordered means >> he?s still got his mojo for the 2021 season. >> >> Richard Stott, AIA, LEED AP >> www.stottarchitecture.com >> Office 631-283-1777 >> Cell 516-965-3164 >> >> >> >> >> >>> On Mar 1, 2021, at 5:39 PM, Jesse Shumaker < >> jesse.laten.shumaker at gmail.com> wrote: >>> >>> Ric, your C&C 35 captain reminds me of a guy at our local sailing club. >>> George will be 85 this year and still regularly wins races on a >>> Snipe, which is a 14' racing dinghy which makes for athletic sailing. He >>> was commodore at our sailing club for over 20 years and is a bit of a >> hero >>> to the local sailors. I picked up a Snipe for next to nothing last year >>> since we have a fleet that we're trying to rebuild and it is fun one >> design >>> racing. My wife took one look at the Snipe and said "That's your boat, >>> I'll never go on that tippy thing. I'll stick with the Rhodes and your >>> friends can crew on the Snipe." >>> >>> Jesse Shumaker >>> S/V Zephyr >>> >>> On Mon, Mar 1, 2021 at 2:59 PM Ric Stott >> wrote: >>> >>>> Stan et al >>>> This is a difficult subject but since you brought it up. >>>> Rhodies - >>>> If you plan to use your boat as the coffin - it will not work! >>>> I shouldn?t have to remind you that the Rhodes 22 does not sink. >>>> I know Stan?s sense of humor is talking and so is mine. >>>> But we have joked about how to send off our race captain on the C&C 35 >>>> I?ve been sailing on for 30 years. >>>> He?s 85, bought his boat new and is still racing, but hey, ya never >> know. >>>> >>>> Far off-shore and out-of-sight, a thru-hull fitting comes loose - - - >>>> The C&C disappears, the Rhodes becomes part of the Plastic waste island >>>> floating forever mid ocean. >>>> Long live Stan and the Rhodes 22 - may we float forever. >>>> Ric >>>> sv Dadventure >>>> Hampton Bays, NY >>>> >>>> Richard Stott, AIA, LEED AP >>>> www.stottarchitecture.com >>>> Office 631-283-1777 >>>> Cell 516-965-3164 >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>> On Mar 1, 2021, at 3:32 PM, stan wrote: >>>>> >>>>> It is a good thing one of us has a good memory. No motor and we made >> it >>>> all the way to the dead end of that long narrow canal? If I knew the >> boats >>>> were that good I would have kept them all. What did you say your name >> was. >>>>> >>>>> Roger, this guy knows more about the boat than I do. Ask Him. He has >>>> owned two; I never could afford one. But lately been considering it >> since >>>> they now come with a great surprise benefit: Free burial at sea for a >> neat >>>> net savings. >>>>> >>>>> stan >>>>> >>>>> Mike, thanks for those wonderful memories. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On 3/1/21 2:45 PM, Michael D. Weisner wrote: >>>>>> I bought my first Rhodes 22, an RC - that's what they were called back >>>> then (1980) from Stan in Rose's kitchen, after our test sail. I >> attached 2 >>>> pdf files of the sales materials distributed to potential buyers in >> 1980 at >>>> shows, including the price list and a narrative on the Rhodes >> Continental. >>>>>> >>>>>> Sheryl and I loved the RC, first seen at the Stamford in the Water >> Boat >>>> Show in the autumn of 1980. Stan had promised a test sail when I gave >> him >>>> the $25 REFUNDABLE DEPOSIT. Unfortunately, he was too busy taking >> orders at >>>> the show so we met him one very cold late October day at the house in >>>> Amityville. The wind was howling at a good 15-20 knots and we had a >> heck of >>>> a sail. Stan just sat on the cockpit seat with his back up against the >>>> cabin bulkhead facing the stern. He zipped his parka up and smiled as I >>>> sailed her hard. He didn't care what I tried because he had faith in the >>>> design. We came about and even jibed with all the cloth flying (150 >> Genoa). >>>> I asked him if we needed to reef the main (roller reefing) and he just >>>> shrugged, so we didn't. With a crew of 4 twenty somethings and the >> master, >>>> we were invincible. When we finally go back to the canal behind the >> house, >>>> Stan took the helm, showing me how to propel the RC with just the >> rudder. >>>> It was then that I realized, we didn't have an engine on the mount. Who >>>> needed a stinking motor? >>>>>> >>>>>> Stan wanted us to be among the first to try out his IMF design but he >>>> was unable to give us a firm delivery date so we took delivery of the >> RC in >>>> March 1981. Stan set it up with us and we sailed for about an hour. He >> only >>>> told me how to retrieve her, no practice attempt. I dropped him at our >> dock >>>> and we went out for more sailing. The two of us were finally able to >> get on >>>> the trailer and dropped the mast in the dark. What a day! What a boat! >>>>>> >>>>>> In those days, we sailed from March 1st through Thanksgiving, as >>>> trailer sailors! Now, we are on a mooring and I am happy to sail May >> 15th >>>> to October 15, but, we do sail a '91 Rhodes 22 w/IMF and lots of >> creature >>>> comforts. One thing hasn?t changed: I still love to sail my Rhodes 22 >> fully >>>> rigged in lots of wind. But, I must confess, I do furl the main and the >>>> huge Genoa well before we hit 15-20 kts. >>>>>> >>>>>> Mike >>>>>> s/v Wind Lass ('91) >>>>>> Nissequogue River, NY >>>>>> I?d rather be sailing :~) >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of >>>> Roger Pihlaja Home >>>>>> Sent: Monday, March 1, 2021 1:51 PM >>>>>> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List >>>>>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes Continental Sails >>>>>> >>>>>> Joe, >>>>>> >>>>>> It is my understanding that Stan changed the name from Rhodes >>>> Continental 22 to Rhodes 22 around the time he took over production of >> the >>>> boat. Other than the in house production line, I think all the hull >> lines >>>> and sail plan were unchanged. The hull molds were literally the same. >> The >>>> Rhodes Continental 22 was not offered with the inner mast furling >>>> mainsail. That came later. Stan, if I?ve gotten something wrong here, >>>> please jump into this discussion. >>>>>> >>>>>> Roger Pihlaja >>>>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>>>>> >>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>> >>>>>>> On Mar 1, 2021, at 1:33 PM, Joe Dempsey >> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Then I'm confused. It is my understanding that the Continental was >>>>>>> only built for a few years. My question, therefore is what is the >>>>>>> difference in sail plan from a Continental and any other Rhodes 22? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> ----- >>>>>>> Joe Dempsey >>>>>>> s/v Respite >>>>>>> Rhodes 22 1989/2005 >>>>>>> Deltaville,VA >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ >>>>>> -------------- next part -------------- >>>>>> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... >>>>>> Name: Rhodes Sales Literature, circa 1980.pdf >>>>>> Type: application/pdf >>>>>> Size: 2084509 bytes >>>>>> Desc: not available >>>>>> URL: < >>>> >> http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210301/83808c7b/attachment.pdf >>>>> >>>>>> -------------- next part -------------- >>>>>> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... >>>>>> Name: Report on the Rhodes Continental, circa 1980.pdf >>>>>> Type: application/pdf >>>>>> Size: 687656 bytes >>>>>> Desc: not available >>>>>> URL: < >>>> >> http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210301/83808c7b/attachment-0001.pdf >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >> >> From cjlowe at sssnet.com Tue Mar 2 12:49:51 2021 From: cjlowe at sssnet.com (cjlowe at sssnet.com) Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2021 12:49:51 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first In-Reply-To: References: <1613761250989-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <408F9401-E24B-4554-826E-DD98BFC0E1F3@stottarchitecture.com> <1614623625839-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <005601d70ed3$6283eba0$278bc2e0$@ebsmed.com> <916d9b93-9604-8b3a-c9d5-5c84c1acadb8@generalboats.com> <007501d70ee8$6edeb690$4c9c23b0$@ebsmed.com> Message-ID: <54709.24.140.30.102.1614707391.squirrel@quickpop.sssnet.com> I like to tape paper towels around the suspected areas and see which ones show moisture first, then investigate further from there . Jerry Lowe S/V Country Rhodes '86 > Roger, Rob and Mike > Thanks for the good suggestions. I'll start by taking off that cosmeticsus > piece of wood at the bow and see what's behind. If nothing is loose I"ll > have someone aim a hose at the bow while I"m inside watching in the hope > that I might actually see where the water is getting in. > I really do hope I don't have to rebed everything. > Probably won't be able to do this till the weekend..I"ll report back on > what I find > > Reuben Mezrich > Pelican Cove in Sarasota > Cell: 410-499-8922 > > > On Mon, Mar 1, 2021 at 5:15 PM Michael D. Weisner > wrote: > >> Reuben, >> >> I would check the bow eye. The wood backing block usually rots and the >> eye >> loosens up. Sometimes just lifting the boat using the bow eye will cause >> the eye to loosen as the wood compresses. >> >> Also, you may want to re-bed the bow pulpit rail deck fittings, chocks, >> etc. >> >> Mike >> s/v Wind Lass ('91) >> Nissequogue River, NY >> I???d rather be sailing :~) >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of >> Reuben Mezrich >> Sent: Monday, March 1, 2021 4:08 PM >> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List >> Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first >> >> As I mentioned a week or two ago, I installed a Marinco 3" Day/night >> solar >> vent at the bow, using the hole already in place for the anchor locker. >> It >> installed easily, seemed to work fine but a few days later we had a >> heavy >> rain and the next day the forward tips of the forward cabin cushions >> were >> wet. I removed the vent, replaced the deck plate, installed a new gasket >> under the deck plate, applied a generous amount of RTV silicone to both >> sides of the gasket and reinstalled the solar vent. The next day >> (yesterday >> actually) I used a hose to rain water on the forward deck, aiming at the >> solar vent for about 6 minutes and when I checked below everything was >> dry. >> I checked again in an hour and it was still dry. >> This morning there was about a cup of water, maybe two cups of water at >> the bow. There was no water in the tray that serves as the anchor locker >> and which is directly under the solar vent. The vent itself was dry as >> was >> the ceiling around the vent. The walls were also dry. I dried the water >> with a towel and a few hours later a small amount of water seemed to be >> seeping under a triangular piece of wood at the very bow of the boat >> (see >> attached photo). I haven't removed that piece of wood yet but I'm pretty >> sure I'll find the bolts from the chain plate at the bow for the jib >> stay. >> My feeling now is that the solar vent was never the source of the leak >> but >> I've had a small leak for a while but never noticed because I never had >> a >> reason to go up to the very front of the forward cabin. As it turns out >> the >> bottom of the cushions, which are rubberized are stained, giving >> evidence >> that the leak is likely long standing. >> Those bolts would be my best guess as the source of the leak but I'd >> look >> forward to suggestions as to where else I might look. >> >> Its always something >> >> --Reuben >> >> >> Reuben Mezrich >> Pelican Cove in Sarasota >> Cell: 410-499-8922 >> >> > >> > >> -------------- next part -------------- >> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... >> Name: Screen Shot 2021-03-01 at 4.02.36 PM.png >> Type: image/png >> Size: 1826288 bytes >> Desc: not available >> URL: < >> http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210301/6a1cf705/attachment.png >> > >> >> > From sloopblueheron at gmail.com Tue Mar 2 15:30:10 2021 From: sloopblueheron at gmail.com (Rick Lange) Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2021 15:30:10 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Public Service Announcement - Security and personal info on 'da list' In-Reply-To: <007401d70ee7$4c5d5be0$e51813a0$@ebsmed.com> References: <006201d70c8f$ee4fe8f0$caefbad0$@ebsmed.com> <01dc01d70d28$1eec1400$5cc43c00$@ebsmed.com> <007401d70ee7$4c5d5be0$e51813a0$@ebsmed.com> Message-ID: Mike, It is critical that you use SSL. Without it, Google will demote the domain and many virus protection tools will block it from viewing. SSL effectiveness is dependent on the quality of your ISP, whoever that is. Nevertheless, go with what you got, maybe taking advantage of an upgrade. Regards, Rick Lange On Mon, Mar 1, 2021 at 5:07 PM Michael D. Weisner wrote: > Rob, > > Please define "overlooked" > > Mike > s/v Wind Lass ('91) > Nissequogue River, NY > I'd rather be sailing :~) > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of > Lowe, > Rob > Sent: Monday, March 1, 2021 4:29 PM > To: 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Public Service Announcement - Security and > personal info on 'da list' > > Is there a way to have the email list overlooked by Google and Nabble? > Although it's probably too late for that now. I'll go with Mike's advice > and not post anything private. - rob > > ________________________________ > From: Rhodes22-list on behalf of > Michael D. Weisner > Sent: Saturday, February 27, 2021 11:46 AM > To: 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Public Service Announcement - Security and > personal info on 'da list' > > Tom, > > I have been looking into SSL. It appears that the free certificates > (self-certify) may not provide any real security. I would appreciate > further > education. > > Since everything on the email list is indexed by Google, I do not > understand > what additional security SSL brings other than to authenticate the source > of > the webpages themselves. I was merely cautioning list members not to place > personal info in emails that are bound for the list. > > The Google maps are not run by our rhodes22.org website. I do not > understand > your reluctance to add your name to the map. > > Mike > s/v Wind Lass ('91) > Nissequogue River, NY > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of Tom > Van Heule > Sent: Saturday, February 27, 2021 10:53 AM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Public Service Announcement - Security and > personal info on 'da list' > > I was going to keep my.mouth shut about it all let's say I won't be adding > my name to the map. > (And part of why I wanted SSL (let's encypt is free) to at least limit some > of the boys from finding us) > > On Fri, Feb 26, 2021, 4:37 PM Michael D. Weisner > wrote: > > > I just wanted to caution all about the fact that the Rhodes22 email > > list is indexed by Nabble and Google. All information on the list is > > publicly available. Please be careful about including personal info > > such as phone numbers (they may be in your automatic signatures). If > > you need to exchange personal info with a trusted list member, please > > email the individual directly and do not copy 'da list'. > > > > > > > > Mike > > > > s/v Wind Lass ('91) > > > > Nissequogue River, NY > > > > I'd rather be sailing :~) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > From jesse.laten.shumaker at gmail.com Tue Mar 2 20:55:23 2021 From: jesse.laten.shumaker at gmail.com (Jesse Shumaker) Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2021 19:55:23 -0600 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes Continental Sails In-Reply-To: <752F69A4-B75A-4FA9-B00A-D2AE335D245F@stottarchitecture.com> References: <1613761250989-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <408F9401-E24B-4554-826E-DD98BFC0E1F3@stottarchitecture.com> <1614623625839-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <005601d70ed3$6283eba0$278bc2e0$@ebsmed.com> <916d9b93-9604-8b3a-c9d5-5c84c1acadb8@generalboats.com> <4790B272-9DFB-4906-9552-E7D367C84C04@stottarchitecture.com> <752F69A4-B75A-4FA9-B00A-D2AE335D245F@stottarchitecture.com> Message-ID: We have a competitive group that can be vocal on the water but everyone is friendly back at the dock. The experienced sailors are big on helping out newer sailors like me since they like to pass on knowledge and it's more fun when there is good competition. In the end, I view it as a sort of measuring stick and set of goals to improve my own sailing skills in a variety of conditions. My racing experience is limited to our lake as well as a Snipe regatta at another lake in Nebraska. Now that I have a Snipe, I might start to go to some of the other regional regattas. The Snipe sailors seem to be a friendly bunch with camaraderie. Of course, that seems to be the case with most sailors, especially if they have something in common like the same type of boat (as evidenced by the helpful group of people on this list.) An often told local story is that a group of sailors from our club formed a team for the NOOD regatta in Miami a few years ago and won their class. When they were asked where on the coast they were from, they chuckled and replied that a lake in Iowa was their humble home sailing grounds. Jesse On Tue, Mar 2, 2021 at 9:57 AM Richard Stott wrote: > Jesse > Racing is not for everyone. Some seasoned sailors I know say racing brings > to the worse in people. > Clearly, there are those who race seriously and those who use it for > entertainment or whatever. > I have learned a lot from racing, mostly about sailing, but also about > people. > Personally, I like it the best when conditions are the worse - I don?t > really know why. > I?ve had plenty of experience in-shore and off-shore and enjoy the tough > conditions best when I know there?s a hot shower, a good meal and cozy dry > bed at the end of the day - or two. > A post-race party helps too. > Sail-on > Ric > Dadventure > > Richard Stott, AIA, LEED AP > www.stottarchitecture.com > Office 631-283-1777 > Cell 516-965-3164 > > > > > > > On Mar 2, 2021, at 10:34 AM, Jesse Shumaker < > jesse.laten.shumaker at gmail.com> wrote: > > > > That's great to hear Ric. It sounds like a lot of fun! The guys who > just > > keep on sailing give us something to aspire to. The biggest boats for > > racing on our small lake are 22'. We have a match racing league on > Santana > > 20s with a 3 person crew. I'll be the bow man for some experienced > racers > > on their Capri 22' this year. I don't have much spinnaker experience and > > figured this is a great opportunity to learn from experienced racers. > > Fortunately, I get the opportunity to sail on a variety of boats > > which keeps things interesting. I find that racing is a good way to > > improve sailing skills and I have a lot to learn. Good luck with your > > racing this season! > > > > Jesse > > > > On Tue, Mar 2, 2021 at 8:24 AM Ric Stott > wrote: > > > >> Amazing right? Racing a Snipe is not for old men, so your local hero, > like > >> mine, is an anomaly. > >> My Captain, George Martin, bought his C&C in 1972 and started racing > right > >> away. > >> He upgraded the keel and rig in ?89, a year before I found my way onto > the > >> boat. > >> George martin was the Senior Master Lazer Champ about 10 years ago - he > >> beat Rodney Johnstone (the same age) to do it, and also raced JY 15s > very > >> successfully. > >> He stopped polishing the bottom of ?Osprey? for Wednesday night racing a > >> couple of years ago because he couldn?t haul himself out of the water > and > >> into the dingy anymore and the scuba gear got to be too much. He gets > >> younger crew to do it now, but he?s there with them every minute. > >> We sail with 8, & 10 if its windy - - - the youngest crew is 51. > >> We have had quite a run and the new main sail George just ordered means > >> he?s still got his mojo for the 2021 season. > >> > >> Richard Stott, AIA, LEED AP > >> www.stottarchitecture.com > >> Office 631-283-1777 > >> Cell 516-965-3164 > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >>> On Mar 1, 2021, at 5:39 PM, Jesse Shumaker < > >> jesse.laten.shumaker at gmail.com> wrote: > >>> > >>> Ric, your C&C 35 captain reminds me of a guy at our local sailing club. > >>> George will be 85 this year and still regularly wins races on a > >>> Snipe, which is a 14' racing dinghy which makes for athletic sailing. > He > >>> was commodore at our sailing club for over 20 years and is a bit of a > >> hero > >>> to the local sailors. I picked up a Snipe for next to nothing last > year > >>> since we have a fleet that we're trying to rebuild and it is fun one > >> design > >>> racing. My wife took one look at the Snipe and said "That's your boat, > >>> I'll never go on that tippy thing. I'll stick with the Rhodes and your > >>> friends can crew on the Snipe." > >>> > >>> Jesse Shumaker > >>> S/V Zephyr > >>> > >>> On Mon, Mar 1, 2021 at 2:59 PM Ric Stott > >> wrote: > >>> > >>>> Stan et al > >>>> This is a difficult subject but since you brought it up. > >>>> Rhodies - > >>>> If you plan to use your boat as the coffin - it will not work! > >>>> I shouldn?t have to remind you that the Rhodes 22 does not sink. > >>>> I know Stan?s sense of humor is talking and so is mine. > >>>> But we have joked about how to send off our race captain on the C&C 35 > >>>> I?ve been sailing on for 30 years. > >>>> He?s 85, bought his boat new and is still racing, but hey, ya never > >> know. > >>>> > >>>> Far off-shore and out-of-sight, a thru-hull fitting comes loose - - - > >>>> The C&C disappears, the Rhodes becomes part of the Plastic waste > island > >>>> floating forever mid ocean. > >>>> Long live Stan and the Rhodes 22 - may we float forever. > >>>> Ric > >>>> sv Dadventure > >>>> Hampton Bays, NY > >>>> > >>>> Richard Stott, AIA, LEED AP > >>>> www.stottarchitecture.com > >>>> Office 631-283-1777 > >>>> Cell 516-965-3164 > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>> On Mar 1, 2021, at 3:32 PM, stan wrote: > >>>>> > >>>>> It is a good thing one of us has a good memory. No motor and we made > >> it > >>>> all the way to the dead end of that long narrow canal? If I knew the > >> boats > >>>> were that good I would have kept them all. What did you say your name > >> was. > >>>>> > >>>>> Roger, this guy knows more about the boat than I do. Ask Him. He has > >>>> owned two; I never could afford one. But lately been considering it > >> since > >>>> they now come with a great surprise benefit: Free burial at sea for a > >> neat > >>>> net savings. > >>>>> > >>>>> stan > >>>>> > >>>>> Mike, thanks for those wonderful memories. > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> On 3/1/21 2:45 PM, Michael D. Weisner wrote: > >>>>>> I bought my first Rhodes 22, an RC - that's what they were called > back > >>>> then (1980) from Stan in Rose's kitchen, after our test sail. I > >> attached 2 > >>>> pdf files of the sales materials distributed to potential buyers in > >> 1980 at > >>>> shows, including the price list and a narrative on the Rhodes > >> Continental. > >>>>>> > >>>>>> Sheryl and I loved the RC, first seen at the Stamford in the Water > >> Boat > >>>> Show in the autumn of 1980. Stan had promised a test sail when I gave > >> him > >>>> the $25 REFUNDABLE DEPOSIT. Unfortunately, he was too busy taking > >> orders at > >>>> the show so we met him one very cold late October day at the house in > >>>> Amityville. The wind was howling at a good 15-20 knots and we had a > >> heck of > >>>> a sail. Stan just sat on the cockpit seat with his back up against the > >>>> cabin bulkhead facing the stern. He zipped his parka up and smiled as > I > >>>> sailed her hard. He didn't care what I tried because he had faith in > the > >>>> design. We came about and even jibed with all the cloth flying (150 > >> Genoa). > >>>> I asked him if we needed to reef the main (roller reefing) and he just > >>>> shrugged, so we didn't. With a crew of 4 twenty somethings and the > >> master, > >>>> we were invincible. When we finally go back to the canal behind the > >> house, > >>>> Stan took the helm, showing me how to propel the RC with just the > >> rudder. > >>>> It was then that I realized, we didn't have an engine on the mount. > Who > >>>> needed a stinking motor? > >>>>>> > >>>>>> Stan wanted us to be among the first to try out his IMF design but > he > >>>> was unable to give us a firm delivery date so we took delivery of the > >> RC in > >>>> March 1981. Stan set it up with us and we sailed for about an hour. He > >> only > >>>> told me how to retrieve her, no practice attempt. I dropped him at our > >> dock > >>>> and we went out for more sailing. The two of us were finally able to > >> get on > >>>> the trailer and dropped the mast in the dark. What a day! What a boat! > >>>>>> > >>>>>> In those days, we sailed from March 1st through Thanksgiving, as > >>>> trailer sailors! Now, we are on a mooring and I am happy to sail May > >> 15th > >>>> to October 15, but, we do sail a '91 Rhodes 22 w/IMF and lots of > >> creature > >>>> comforts. One thing hasn?t changed: I still love to sail my Rhodes 22 > >> fully > >>>> rigged in lots of wind. But, I must confess, I do furl the main and > the > >>>> huge Genoa well before we hit 15-20 kts. > >>>>>> > >>>>>> Mike > >>>>>> s/v Wind Lass ('91) > >>>>>> Nissequogue River, NY > >>>>>> I?d rather be sailing :~) > >>>>>> > >>>>>> -----Original Message----- > >>>>>> From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf > Of > >>>> Roger Pihlaja Home > >>>>>> Sent: Monday, March 1, 2021 1:51 PM > >>>>>> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > >>>>>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes Continental Sails > >>>>>> > >>>>>> Joe, > >>>>>> > >>>>>> It is my understanding that Stan changed the name from Rhodes > >>>> Continental 22 to Rhodes 22 around the time he took over production of > >> the > >>>> boat. Other than the in house production line, I think all the hull > >> lines > >>>> and sail plan were unchanged. The hull molds were literally the same. > >> The > >>>> Rhodes Continental 22 was not offered with the inner mast furling > >>>> mainsail. That came later. Stan, if I?ve gotten something wrong > here, > >>>> please jump into this discussion. > >>>>>> > >>>>>> Roger Pihlaja > >>>>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > >>>>>> > >>>>>> Sent from my iPad > >>>>>> > >>>>>>> On Mar 1, 2021, at 1:33 PM, Joe Dempsey > >> wrote: > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Then I'm confused. It is my understanding that the Continental was > >>>>>>> only built for a few years. My question, therefore is what is the > >>>>>>> difference in sail plan from a Continental and any other Rhodes 22? > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> ----- > >>>>>>> Joe Dempsey > >>>>>>> s/v Respite > >>>>>>> Rhodes 22 1989/2005 > >>>>>>> Deltaville,VA > >>>>>>> -- > >>>>>>> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > >>>>>> -------------- next part -------------- > >>>>>> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > >>>>>> Name: Rhodes Sales Literature, circa 1980.pdf > >>>>>> Type: application/pdf > >>>>>> Size: 2084509 bytes > >>>>>> Desc: not available > >>>>>> URL: < > >>>> > >> > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210301/83808c7b/attachment.pdf > >>>>> > >>>>>> -------------- next part -------------- > >>>>>> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > >>>>>> Name: Report on the Rhodes Continental, circa 1980.pdf > >>>>>> Type: application/pdf > >>>>>> Size: 687656 bytes > >>>>>> Desc: not available > >>>>>> URL: < > >>>> > >> > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210301/83808c7b/attachment-0001.pdf > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >> > >> > > From ric at stottarchitecture.com Wed Mar 3 09:16:25 2021 From: ric at stottarchitecture.com (Richard Stott) Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2021 09:16:25 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes Continental Sails In-Reply-To: References: <1613761250989-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <408F9401-E24B-4554-826E-DD98BFC0E1F3@stottarchitecture.com> <1614623625839-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <005601d70ed3$6283eba0$278bc2e0$@ebsmed.com> <916d9b93-9604-8b3a-c9d5-5c84c1acadb8@generalboats.com> <4790B272-9DFB-4906-9552-E7D367C84C04@stottarchitecture.com> <752F69A4-B75A-4FA9-B00A-D2AE335D245F@stottarchitecture.com> Message-ID: Racing: Dingy sailors are in general, more laid-back and congenial. I used to race Lightnings, Lasers and JY15s, also Sunfish and Hobie Cat 16s, Those gangs were always more fun and willing to let race course infractions go at party time. Again, in general, Big Boat and keel boat - handicap racers - are more full of themselves and their boats, they are much more dangerous, more arrogant and MUCH less experienced than dingy sailors. All those short races and close-encounters make dingy sailors quicker and smarter - better at anticipating situations and taking action before the crisis. They know the rules much better and respect both the rules and their fellow competitors. Let?s face it, the Rhodes 22 is not a race boat, nor is it an off-shore sailboat. But it is a great family boat that is the most versatile 22 available. With some practice, one can even get it going pretty fast. There is only one other Rhodes 22 in my waters - if I?m not in the flats clamming, or backed up to the beach with an umbrella, a cocktail and two anchors out - I'll take on any challenger in any boat. We?ll race for rum and share the victors' prize. Ric Dadventure Richard Stott, AIA, LEED AP www.stottarchitecture.com Office 631-283-1777 Cell 516-965-3164 > On Mar 2, 2021, at 8:55 PM, Jesse Shumaker wrote: > > We have a competitive group that can be vocal on the water but everyone is > friendly back at the dock. The experienced sailors are big on helping out > newer sailors like me since they like to pass on knowledge and it's more > fun when there is good competition. In the end, I view it as a sort of > measuring stick and set of goals to improve my own sailing skills in a > variety of conditions. My racing experience is limited to our lake as well > as a Snipe regatta at another lake in Nebraska. Now that I have a Snipe, I > might start to go to some of the other regional regattas. The Snipe > sailors seem to be a friendly bunch with camaraderie. Of course, that > seems to be the case with most sailors, especially if they have something > in common like the same type of boat (as evidenced by the helpful group of > people on this list.) > > An often told local story is that a group of sailors from our club formed a > team for the NOOD regatta in Miami a few years ago and won their class. > When they were asked where on the coast they were from, they chuckled and > replied that a lake in Iowa was their humble home sailing grounds. > > Jesse > > On Tue, Mar 2, 2021 at 9:57 AM Richard Stott > wrote: > >> Jesse >> Racing is not for everyone. Some seasoned sailors I know say racing brings >> to the worse in people. >> Clearly, there are those who race seriously and those who use it for >> entertainment or whatever. >> I have learned a lot from racing, mostly about sailing, but also about >> people. >> Personally, I like it the best when conditions are the worse - I don?t >> really know why. >> I?ve had plenty of experience in-shore and off-shore and enjoy the tough >> conditions best when I know there?s a hot shower, a good meal and cozy dry >> bed at the end of the day - or two. >> A post-race party helps too. >> Sail-on >> Ric >> Dadventure >> >> Richard Stott, AIA, LEED AP >> www.stottarchitecture.com >> Office 631-283-1777 >> Cell 516-965-3164 >> >> >> >> >> >>> On Mar 2, 2021, at 10:34 AM, Jesse Shumaker < >> jesse.laten.shumaker at gmail.com> wrote: >>> >>> That's great to hear Ric. It sounds like a lot of fun! The guys who >> just >>> keep on sailing give us something to aspire to. The biggest boats for >>> racing on our small lake are 22'. We have a match racing league on >> Santana >>> 20s with a 3 person crew. I'll be the bow man for some experienced >> racers >>> on their Capri 22' this year. I don't have much spinnaker experience and >>> figured this is a great opportunity to learn from experienced racers. >>> Fortunately, I get the opportunity to sail on a variety of boats >>> which keeps things interesting. I find that racing is a good way to >>> improve sailing skills and I have a lot to learn. Good luck with your >>> racing this season! >>> >>> Jesse >>> >>> On Tue, Mar 2, 2021 at 8:24 AM Ric Stott >> wrote: >>> >>>> Amazing right? Racing a Snipe is not for old men, so your local hero, >> like >>>> mine, is an anomaly. >>>> My Captain, George Martin, bought his C&C in 1972 and started racing >> right >>>> away. >>>> He upgraded the keel and rig in ?89, a year before I found my way onto >> the >>>> boat. >>>> George martin was the Senior Master Lazer Champ about 10 years ago - he >>>> beat Rodney Johnstone (the same age) to do it, and also raced JY 15s >> very >>>> successfully. >>>> He stopped polishing the bottom of ?Osprey? for Wednesday night racing a >>>> couple of years ago because he couldn?t haul himself out of the water >> and >>>> into the dingy anymore and the scuba gear got to be too much. He gets >>>> younger crew to do it now, but he?s there with them every minute. >>>> We sail with 8, & 10 if its windy - - - the youngest crew is 51. >>>> We have had quite a run and the new main sail George just ordered means >>>> he?s still got his mojo for the 2021 season. >>>> >>>> Richard Stott, AIA, LEED AP >>>> www.stottarchitecture.com >>>> Office 631-283-1777 >>>> Cell 516-965-3164 >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>> On Mar 1, 2021, at 5:39 PM, Jesse Shumaker < >>>> jesse.laten.shumaker at gmail.com> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Ric, your C&C 35 captain reminds me of a guy at our local sailing club. >>>>> George will be 85 this year and still regularly wins races on a >>>>> Snipe, which is a 14' racing dinghy which makes for athletic sailing. >> He >>>>> was commodore at our sailing club for over 20 years and is a bit of a >>>> hero >>>>> to the local sailors. I picked up a Snipe for next to nothing last >> year >>>>> since we have a fleet that we're trying to rebuild and it is fun one >>>> design >>>>> racing. My wife took one look at the Snipe and said "That's your boat, >>>>> I'll never go on that tippy thing. I'll stick with the Rhodes and your >>>>> friends can crew on the Snipe." >>>>> >>>>> Jesse Shumaker >>>>> S/V Zephyr >>>>> >>>>> On Mon, Mar 1, 2021 at 2:59 PM Ric Stott >>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Stan et al >>>>>> This is a difficult subject but since you brought it up. >>>>>> Rhodies - >>>>>> If you plan to use your boat as the coffin - it will not work! >>>>>> I shouldn?t have to remind you that the Rhodes 22 does not sink. >>>>>> I know Stan?s sense of humor is talking and so is mine. >>>>>> But we have joked about how to send off our race captain on the C&C 35 >>>>>> I?ve been sailing on for 30 years. >>>>>> He?s 85, bought his boat new and is still racing, but hey, ya never >>>> know. >>>>>> >>>>>> Far off-shore and out-of-sight, a thru-hull fitting comes loose - - - >>>>>> The C&C disappears, the Rhodes becomes part of the Plastic waste >> island >>>>>> floating forever mid ocean. >>>>>> Long live Stan and the Rhodes 22 - may we float forever. >>>>>> Ric >>>>>> sv Dadventure >>>>>> Hampton Bays, NY >>>>>> >>>>>> Richard Stott, AIA, LEED AP >>>>>> www.stottarchitecture.com >>>>>> Office 631-283-1777 >>>>>> Cell 516-965-3164 >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>> On Mar 1, 2021, at 3:32 PM, stan wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> It is a good thing one of us has a good memory. No motor and we made >>>> it >>>>>> all the way to the dead end of that long narrow canal? If I knew the >>>> boats >>>>>> were that good I would have kept them all. What did you say your name >>>> was. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Roger, this guy knows more about the boat than I do. Ask Him. He has >>>>>> owned two; I never could afford one. But lately been considering it >>>> since >>>>>> they now come with a great surprise benefit: Free burial at sea for a >>>> neat >>>>>> net savings. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> stan >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Mike, thanks for those wonderful memories. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On 3/1/21 2:45 PM, Michael D. Weisner wrote: >>>>>>>> I bought my first Rhodes 22, an RC - that's what they were called >> back >>>>>> then (1980) from Stan in Rose's kitchen, after our test sail. I >>>> attached 2 >>>>>> pdf files of the sales materials distributed to potential buyers in >>>> 1980 at >>>>>> shows, including the price list and a narrative on the Rhodes >>>> Continental. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Sheryl and I loved the RC, first seen at the Stamford in the Water >>>> Boat >>>>>> Show in the autumn of 1980. Stan had promised a test sail when I gave >>>> him >>>>>> the $25 REFUNDABLE DEPOSIT. Unfortunately, he was too busy taking >>>> orders at >>>>>> the show so we met him one very cold late October day at the house in >>>>>> Amityville. The wind was howling at a good 15-20 knots and we had a >>>> heck of >>>>>> a sail. Stan just sat on the cockpit seat with his back up against the >>>>>> cabin bulkhead facing the stern. He zipped his parka up and smiled as >> I >>>>>> sailed her hard. He didn't care what I tried because he had faith in >> the >>>>>> design. We came about and even jibed with all the cloth flying (150 >>>> Genoa). >>>>>> I asked him if we needed to reef the main (roller reefing) and he just >>>>>> shrugged, so we didn't. With a crew of 4 twenty somethings and the >>>> master, >>>>>> we were invincible. When we finally go back to the canal behind the >>>> house, >>>>>> Stan took the helm, showing me how to propel the RC with just the >>>> rudder. >>>>>> It was then that I realized, we didn't have an engine on the mount. >> Who >>>>>> needed a stinking motor? >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Stan wanted us to be among the first to try out his IMF design but >> he >>>>>> was unable to give us a firm delivery date so we took delivery of the >>>> RC in >>>>>> March 1981. Stan set it up with us and we sailed for about an hour. He >>>> only >>>>>> told me how to retrieve her, no practice attempt. I dropped him at our >>>> dock >>>>>> and we went out for more sailing. The two of us were finally able to >>>> get on >>>>>> the trailer and dropped the mast in the dark. What a day! What a boat! >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> In those days, we sailed from March 1st through Thanksgiving, as >>>>>> trailer sailors! Now, we are on a mooring and I am happy to sail May >>>> 15th >>>>>> to October 15, but, we do sail a '91 Rhodes 22 w/IMF and lots of >>>> creature >>>>>> comforts. One thing hasn?t changed: I still love to sail my Rhodes 22 >>>> fully >>>>>> rigged in lots of wind. But, I must confess, I do furl the main and >> the >>>>>> huge Genoa well before we hit 15-20 kts. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Mike >>>>>>>> s/v Wind Lass ('91) >>>>>>>> Nissequogue River, NY >>>>>>>> I?d rather be sailing :~) >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>>> From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf >> Of >>>>>> Roger Pihlaja Home >>>>>>>> Sent: Monday, March 1, 2021 1:51 PM >>>>>>>> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List >>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes Continental Sails >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Joe, >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> It is my understanding that Stan changed the name from Rhodes >>>>>> Continental 22 to Rhodes 22 around the time he took over production of >>>> the >>>>>> boat. Other than the in house production line, I think all the hull >>>> lines >>>>>> and sail plan were unchanged. The hull molds were literally the same. >>>> The >>>>>> Rhodes Continental 22 was not offered with the inner mast furling >>>>>> mainsail. That came later. Stan, if I?ve gotten something wrong >> here, >>>>>> please jump into this discussion. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Roger Pihlaja >>>>>>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Sent from my iPad >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On Mar 1, 2021, at 1:33 PM, Joe Dempsey >>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Then I'm confused. It is my understanding that the Continental was >>>>>>>>> only built for a few years. My question, therefore is what is the >>>>>>>>> difference in sail plan from a Continental and any other Rhodes 22? >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> ----- >>>>>>>>> Joe Dempsey >>>>>>>>> s/v Respite >>>>>>>>> Rhodes 22 1989/2005 >>>>>>>>> Deltaville,VA >>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ >>>>>>>> -------------- next part -------------- >>>>>>>> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... >>>>>>>> Name: Rhodes Sales Literature, circa 1980.pdf >>>>>>>> Type: application/pdf >>>>>>>> Size: 2084509 bytes >>>>>>>> Desc: not available >>>>>>>> URL: < >>>>>> >>>> >> http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210301/83808c7b/attachment.pdf >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> -------------- next part -------------- >>>>>>>> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... >>>>>>>> Name: Report on the Rhodes Continental, circa 1980.pdf >>>>>>>> Type: application/pdf >>>>>>>> Size: 687656 bytes >>>>>>>> Desc: not available >>>>>>>> URL: < >>>>>> >>>> >> http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210301/83808c7b/attachment-0001.pdf >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>> >>>> >> >> From sloopblueheron at gmail.com Wed Mar 3 13:01:10 2021 From: sloopblueheron at gmail.com (Rick Lange) Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2021 13:01:10 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes Continental Sails In-Reply-To: References: <1613761250989-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <408F9401-E24B-4554-826E-DD98BFC0E1F3@stottarchitecture.com> <1614623625839-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <005601d70ed3$6283eba0$278bc2e0$@ebsmed.com> <916d9b93-9604-8b3a-c9d5-5c84c1acadb8@generalboats.com> <4790B272-9DFB-4906-9552-E7D367C84C04@stottarchitecture.com> <752F69A4-B75A-4FA9-B00A-D2AE335D245F@stottarchitecture.com> Message-ID: Richard, Congeniality among racers is not dependent on boat size. Whether keel boats, dinghies or model r/c boats, congeniality depends more on the personalities of the skippers in the race and following the "Corinthian Code". That is, follow the rules and if you break one, do your penalty without having to be protested. Regards, Rick Lange On Wed, Mar 3, 2021 at 9:16 AM Richard Stott wrote: > Racing: > Dingy sailors are in general, more laid-back and congenial. I used to race > Lightnings, Lasers and JY15s, also Sunfish and Hobie Cat 16s, > Those gangs were always more fun and willing to let race course > infractions go at party time. > Again, in general, Big Boat and keel boat - handicap racers - are more > full of themselves and their boats, they are much more dangerous, more > arrogant and MUCH less experienced than dingy sailors. > All those short races and close-encounters make dingy sailors quicker and > smarter - better at anticipating situations and taking action before the > crisis. > They know the rules much better and respect both the rules and their > fellow competitors. > Let?s face it, the Rhodes 22 is not a race boat, nor is it an off-shore > sailboat. > But it is a great family boat that is the most versatile 22 available. > With some practice, one can even get it going pretty fast. > There is only one other Rhodes 22 in my waters - if I?m not in the flats > clamming, or backed up to the beach with an umbrella, a cocktail and two > anchors out - I'll take on any challenger in any boat. > We?ll race for rum and share the victors' prize. > > Ric > Dadventure > > Richard Stott, AIA, LEED AP > www.stottarchitecture.com > Office 631-283-1777 > Cell 516-965-3164 > > > > > > > On Mar 2, 2021, at 8:55 PM, Jesse Shumaker < > jesse.laten.shumaker at gmail.com> wrote: > > > > We have a competitive group that can be vocal on the water but everyone > is > > friendly back at the dock. The experienced sailors are big on helping > out > > newer sailors like me since they like to pass on knowledge and it's more > > fun when there is good competition. In the end, I view it as a sort of > > measuring stick and set of goals to improve my own sailing skills in a > > variety of conditions. My racing experience is limited to our lake as > well > > as a Snipe regatta at another lake in Nebraska. Now that I have a > Snipe, I > > might start to go to some of the other regional regattas. The Snipe > > sailors seem to be a friendly bunch with camaraderie. Of course, that > > seems to be the case with most sailors, especially if they have something > > in common like the same type of boat (as evidenced by the helpful group > of > > people on this list.) > > > > An often told local story is that a group of sailors from our club > formed a > > team for the NOOD regatta in Miami a few years ago and won their class. > > When they were asked where on the coast they were from, they chuckled and > > replied that a lake in Iowa was their humble home sailing grounds. > > > > Jesse > > > > On Tue, Mar 2, 2021 at 9:57 AM Richard Stott > > wrote: > > > >> Jesse > >> Racing is not for everyone. Some seasoned sailors I know say racing > brings > >> to the worse in people. > >> Clearly, there are those who race seriously and those who use it for > >> entertainment or whatever. > >> I have learned a lot from racing, mostly about sailing, but also about > >> people. > >> Personally, I like it the best when conditions are the worse - I don?t > >> really know why. > >> I?ve had plenty of experience in-shore and off-shore and enjoy the tough > >> conditions best when I know there?s a hot shower, a good meal and cozy > dry > >> bed at the end of the day - or two. > >> A post-race party helps too. > >> Sail-on > >> Ric > >> Dadventure > >> > >> Richard Stott, AIA, LEED AP > >> www.stottarchitecture.com > >> Office 631-283-1777 > >> Cell 516-965-3164 > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >>> On Mar 2, 2021, at 10:34 AM, Jesse Shumaker < > >> jesse.laten.shumaker at gmail.com> wrote: > >>> > >>> That's great to hear Ric. It sounds like a lot of fun! The guys who > >> just > >>> keep on sailing give us something to aspire to. The biggest boats for > >>> racing on our small lake are 22'. We have a match racing league on > >> Santana > >>> 20s with a 3 person crew. I'll be the bow man for some experienced > >> racers > >>> on their Capri 22' this year. I don't have much spinnaker experience > and > >>> figured this is a great opportunity to learn from experienced racers. > >>> Fortunately, I get the opportunity to sail on a variety of boats > >>> which keeps things interesting. I find that racing is a good way to > >>> improve sailing skills and I have a lot to learn. Good luck with your > >>> racing this season! > >>> > >>> Jesse > >>> > >>> On Tue, Mar 2, 2021 at 8:24 AM Ric Stott > >> wrote: > >>> > >>>> Amazing right? Racing a Snipe is not for old men, so your local hero, > >> like > >>>> mine, is an anomaly. > >>>> My Captain, George Martin, bought his C&C in 1972 and started racing > >> right > >>>> away. > >>>> He upgraded the keel and rig in ?89, a year before I found my way onto > >> the > >>>> boat. > >>>> George martin was the Senior Master Lazer Champ about 10 years ago - > he > >>>> beat Rodney Johnstone (the same age) to do it, and also raced JY 15s > >> very > >>>> successfully. > >>>> He stopped polishing the bottom of ?Osprey? for Wednesday night > racing a > >>>> couple of years ago because he couldn?t haul himself out of the water > >> and > >>>> into the dingy anymore and the scuba gear got to be too much. He gets > >>>> younger crew to do it now, but he?s there with them every minute. > >>>> We sail with 8, & 10 if its windy - - - the youngest crew is 51. > >>>> We have had quite a run and the new main sail George just ordered > means > >>>> he?s still got his mojo for the 2021 season. > >>>> > >>>> Richard Stott, AIA, LEED AP > >>>> www.stottarchitecture.com > >>>> Office 631-283-1777 > >>>> Cell 516-965-3164 > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>> On Mar 1, 2021, at 5:39 PM, Jesse Shumaker < > >>>> jesse.laten.shumaker at gmail.com> wrote: > >>>>> > >>>>> Ric, your C&C 35 captain reminds me of a guy at our local sailing > club. > >>>>> George will be 85 this year and still regularly wins races on a > >>>>> Snipe, which is a 14' racing dinghy which makes for athletic sailing. > >> He > >>>>> was commodore at our sailing club for over 20 years and is a bit of a > >>>> hero > >>>>> to the local sailors. I picked up a Snipe for next to nothing last > >> year > >>>>> since we have a fleet that we're trying to rebuild and it is fun one > >>>> design > >>>>> racing. My wife took one look at the Snipe and said "That's your > boat, > >>>>> I'll never go on that tippy thing. I'll stick with the Rhodes and > your > >>>>> friends can crew on the Snipe." > >>>>> > >>>>> Jesse Shumaker > >>>>> S/V Zephyr > >>>>> > >>>>> On Mon, Mar 1, 2021 at 2:59 PM Ric Stott > >>>> wrote: > >>>>> > >>>>>> Stan et al > >>>>>> This is a difficult subject but since you brought it up. > >>>>>> Rhodies - > >>>>>> If you plan to use your boat as the coffin - it will not work! > >>>>>> I shouldn?t have to remind you that the Rhodes 22 does not sink. > >>>>>> I know Stan?s sense of humor is talking and so is mine. > >>>>>> But we have joked about how to send off our race captain on the C&C > 35 > >>>>>> I?ve been sailing on for 30 years. > >>>>>> He?s 85, bought his boat new and is still racing, but hey, ya never > >>>> know. > >>>>>> > >>>>>> Far off-shore and out-of-sight, a thru-hull fitting comes loose - - > - > >>>>>> The C&C disappears, the Rhodes becomes part of the Plastic waste > >> island > >>>>>> floating forever mid ocean. > >>>>>> Long live Stan and the Rhodes 22 - may we float forever. > >>>>>> Ric > >>>>>> sv Dadventure > >>>>>> Hampton Bays, NY > >>>>>> > >>>>>> Richard Stott, AIA, LEED AP > >>>>>> www.stottarchitecture.com > >>>>>> Office 631-283-1777 > >>>>>> Cell 516-965-3164 > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>>> On Mar 1, 2021, at 3:32 PM, stan wrote: > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> It is a good thing one of us has a good memory. No motor and we > made > >>>> it > >>>>>> all the way to the dead end of that long narrow canal? If I knew > the > >>>> boats > >>>>>> were that good I would have kept them all. What did you say your > name > >>>> was. > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Roger, this guy knows more about the boat than I do. Ask Him. He > has > >>>>>> owned two; I never could afford one. But lately been considering it > >>>> since > >>>>>> they now come with a great surprise benefit: Free burial at sea for > a > >>>> neat > >>>>>> net savings. > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> stan > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Mike, thanks for those wonderful memories. > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> On 3/1/21 2:45 PM, Michael D. Weisner wrote: > >>>>>>>> I bought my first Rhodes 22, an RC - that's what they were called > >> back > >>>>>> then (1980) from Stan in Rose's kitchen, after our test sail. I > >>>> attached 2 > >>>>>> pdf files of the sales materials distributed to potential buyers in > >>>> 1980 at > >>>>>> shows, including the price list and a narrative on the Rhodes > >>>> Continental. > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> Sheryl and I loved the RC, first seen at the Stamford in the Water > >>>> Boat > >>>>>> Show in the autumn of 1980. Stan had promised a test sail when I > gave > >>>> him > >>>>>> the $25 REFUNDABLE DEPOSIT. Unfortunately, he was too busy taking > >>>> orders at > >>>>>> the show so we met him one very cold late October day at the house > in > >>>>>> Amityville. The wind was howling at a good 15-20 knots and we had a > >>>> heck of > >>>>>> a sail. Stan just sat on the cockpit seat with his back up against > the > >>>>>> cabin bulkhead facing the stern. He zipped his parka up and smiled > as > >> I > >>>>>> sailed her hard. He didn't care what I tried because he had faith in > >> the > >>>>>> design. We came about and even jibed with all the cloth flying (150 > >>>> Genoa). > >>>>>> I asked him if we needed to reef the main (roller reefing) and he > just > >>>>>> shrugged, so we didn't. With a crew of 4 twenty somethings and the > >>>> master, > >>>>>> we were invincible. When we finally go back to the canal behind the > >>>> house, > >>>>>> Stan took the helm, showing me how to propel the RC with just the > >>>> rudder. > >>>>>> It was then that I realized, we didn't have an engine on the mount. > >> Who > >>>>>> needed a stinking motor? > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> Stan wanted us to be among the first to try out his IMF design but > >> he > >>>>>> was unable to give us a firm delivery date so we took delivery of > the > >>>> RC in > >>>>>> March 1981. Stan set it up with us and we sailed for about an hour. > He > >>>> only > >>>>>> told me how to retrieve her, no practice attempt. I dropped him at > our > >>>> dock > >>>>>> and we went out for more sailing. The two of us were finally able to > >>>> get on > >>>>>> the trailer and dropped the mast in the dark. What a day! What a > boat! > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> In those days, we sailed from March 1st through Thanksgiving, as > >>>>>> trailer sailors! Now, we are on a mooring and I am happy to sail May > >>>> 15th > >>>>>> to October 15, but, we do sail a '91 Rhodes 22 w/IMF and lots of > >>>> creature > >>>>>> comforts. One thing hasn?t changed: I still love to sail my Rhodes > 22 > >>>> fully > >>>>>> rigged in lots of wind. But, I must confess, I do furl the main and > >> the > >>>>>> huge Genoa well before we hit 15-20 kts. > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> Mike > >>>>>>>> s/v Wind Lass ('91) > >>>>>>>> Nissequogue River, NY > >>>>>>>> I?d rather be sailing :~) > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> -----Original Message----- > >>>>>>>> From: Rhodes22-list On > Behalf > >> Of > >>>>>> Roger Pihlaja Home > >>>>>>>> Sent: Monday, March 1, 2021 1:51 PM > >>>>>>>> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > >>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes Continental Sails > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> Joe, > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> It is my understanding that Stan changed the name from Rhodes > >>>>>> Continental 22 to Rhodes 22 around the time he took over production > of > >>>> the > >>>>>> boat. Other than the in house production line, I think all the hull > >>>> lines > >>>>>> and sail plan were unchanged. The hull molds were literally the > same. > >>>> The > >>>>>> Rhodes Continental 22 was not offered with the inner mast furling > >>>>>> mainsail. That came later. Stan, if I?ve gotten something wrong > >> here, > >>>>>> please jump into this discussion. > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> Roger Pihlaja > >>>>>>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> Sent from my iPad > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> On Mar 1, 2021, at 1:33 PM, Joe Dempsey > >>>> wrote: > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> Then I'm confused. It is my understanding that the Continental > was > >>>>>>>>> only built for a few years. My question, therefore is what is the > >>>>>>>>> difference in sail plan from a Continental and any other Rhodes > 22? > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> ----- > >>>>>>>>> Joe Dempsey > >>>>>>>>> s/v Respite > >>>>>>>>> Rhodes 22 1989/2005 > >>>>>>>>> Deltaville,VA > >>>>>>>>> -- > >>>>>>>>> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > >>>>>>>> -------------- next part -------------- > >>>>>>>> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > >>>>>>>> Name: Rhodes Sales Literature, circa 1980.pdf > >>>>>>>> Type: application/pdf > >>>>>>>> Size: 2084509 bytes > >>>>>>>> Desc: not available > >>>>>>>> URL: < > >>>>>> > >>>> > >> > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210301/83808c7b/attachment.pdf > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> -------------- next part -------------- > >>>>>>>> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > >>>>>>>> Name: Report on the Rhodes Continental, circa 1980.pdf > >>>>>>>> Type: application/pdf > >>>>>>>> Size: 687656 bytes > >>>>>>>> Desc: not available > >>>>>>>> URL: < > >>>>>> > >>>> > >> > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210301/83808c7b/attachment-0001.pdf > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >> > >> > > From mweisner at ebsmed.com Wed Mar 3 13:06:33 2021 From: mweisner at ebsmed.com (Michael D. Weisner) Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2021 13:06:33 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Racing Dinghy Message-ID: <001801d71057$f2c4ec70$d84ec550$@ebsmed.com> Please change the subject line as appropriate :-) Mike s/v Wind Lass ('91) Nissequogue River, NY I?d rather be sailing :~) -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of Rick Lange Sent: Wednesday, March 3, 2021 1:01 PM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes Continental Sails Richard, Congeniality among racers is not dependent on boat size. Whether keel boats, dinghies or model r/c boats, congeniality depends more on the personalities of the skippers in the race and following the "Corinthian Code". That is, follow the rules and if you break one, do your penalty without having to be protested. Regards, Rick Lange On Wed, Mar 3, 2021 at 9:16 AM Richard Stott wrote: > Racing: > Dingy sailors are in general, more laid-back and congenial. I used to > race Lightnings, Lasers and JY15s, also Sunfish and Hobie Cat 16s, > Those gangs were always more fun and willing to let race course > infractions go at party time. > Again, in general, Big Boat and keel boat - handicap racers - are > more full of themselves and their boats, they are much more dangerous, > more arrogant and MUCH less experienced than dingy sailors. > All those short races and close-encounters make dingy sailors quicker > and smarter - better at anticipating situations and taking action > before the crisis. > They know the rules much better and respect both the rules and their > fellow competitors. > Let?s face it, the Rhodes 22 is not a race boat, nor is it an > off-shore sailboat. > But it is a great family boat that is the most versatile 22 available. > With some practice, one can even get it going pretty fast. > There is only one other Rhodes 22 in my waters - if I?m not in the > flats clamming, or backed up to the beach with an umbrella, a cocktail > and two anchors out - I'll take on any challenger in any boat. > We?ll race for rum and share the victors' prize. > > Ric > Dadventure > > Richard Stott, AIA, LEED AP > www.stottarchitecture.com > Office 631-283-1777 > Cell 516-965-3164 > > > > > > > On Mar 2, 2021, at 8:55 PM, Jesse Shumaker < > jesse.laten.shumaker at gmail.com> wrote: > > > > We have a competitive group that can be vocal on the water but > > everyone > is > > friendly back at the dock. The experienced sailors are big on > > helping > out > > newer sailors like me since they like to pass on knowledge and it's > > more fun when there is good competition. In the end, I view it as a > > sort of measuring stick and set of goals to improve my own sailing > > skills in a variety of conditions. My racing experience is limited > > to our lake as > well > > as a Snipe regatta at another lake in Nebraska. Now that I have a > Snipe, I > > might start to go to some of the other regional regattas. The Snipe > > sailors seem to be a friendly bunch with camaraderie. Of course, > > that seems to be the case with most sailors, especially if they have > > something in common like the same type of boat (as evidenced by the > > helpful group > of > > people on this list.) > > > > An often told local story is that a group of sailors from our club > formed a > > team for the NOOD regatta in Miami a few years ago and won their class. > > When they were asked where on the coast they were from, they > > chuckled and replied that a lake in Iowa was their humble home sailing grounds. > > > > Jesse > > > > On Tue, Mar 2, 2021 at 9:57 AM Richard Stott > > > > wrote: > > > >> Jesse > >> Racing is not for everyone. Some seasoned sailors I know say racing > brings > >> to the worse in people. > >> Clearly, there are those who race seriously and those who use it > >> for entertainment or whatever. > >> I have learned a lot from racing, mostly about sailing, but also > >> about people. > >> Personally, I like it the best when conditions are the worse - I > >> don?t really know why. > >> I?ve had plenty of experience in-shore and off-shore and enjoy the > >> tough conditions best when I know there?s a hot shower, a good meal > >> and cozy > dry > >> bed at the end of the day - or two. > >> A post-race party helps too. > >> Sail-on > >> Ric > >> Dadventure > >> > >> Richard Stott, AIA, LEED AP > >> www.stottarchitecture.com > >> Office 631-283-1777 > >> Cell 516-965-3164 > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >>> On Mar 2, 2021, at 10:34 AM, Jesse Shumaker < > >> jesse.laten.shumaker at gmail.com> wrote: > >>> > >>> That's great to hear Ric. It sounds like a lot of fun! The guys > >>> who > >> just > >>> keep on sailing give us something to aspire to. The biggest boats > >>> for racing on our small lake are 22'. We have a match racing > >>> league on > >> Santana > >>> 20s with a 3 person crew. I'll be the bow man for some > >>> experienced > >> racers > >>> on their Capri 22' this year. I don't have much spinnaker > >>> experience > and > >>> figured this is a great opportunity to learn from experienced racers. > >>> Fortunately, I get the opportunity to sail on a variety of boats > >>> which keeps things interesting. I find that racing is a good way > >>> to improve sailing skills and I have a lot to learn. Good luck > >>> with your racing this season! > >>> > >>> Jesse > >>> > >>> On Tue, Mar 2, 2021 at 8:24 AM Ric Stott > >>> > >> wrote: > >>> > >>>> Amazing right? Racing a Snipe is not for old men, so your local > >>>> hero, > >> like > >>>> mine, is an anomaly. > >>>> My Captain, George Martin, bought his C&C in 1972 and started > >>>> racing > >> right > >>>> away. > >>>> He upgraded the keel and rig in ?89, a year before I found my way > >>>> onto > >> the > >>>> boat. > >>>> George martin was the Senior Master Lazer Champ about 10 years > >>>> ago - > he > >>>> beat Rodney Johnstone (the same age) to do it, and also raced JY > >>>> 15s > >> very > >>>> successfully. > >>>> He stopped polishing the bottom of ?Osprey? for Wednesday night > racing a > >>>> couple of years ago because he couldn?t haul himself out of the > >>>> water > >> and > >>>> into the dingy anymore and the scuba gear got to be too much. He > >>>> gets younger crew to do it now, but he?s there with them every minute. > >>>> We sail with 8, & 10 if its windy - - - the youngest crew is 51. > >>>> We have had quite a run and the new main sail George just ordered > means > >>>> he?s still got his mojo for the 2021 season. > >>>> > >>>> Richard Stott, AIA, LEED AP > >>>> www.stottarchitecture.com > >>>> Office 631-283-1777 > >>>> Cell 516-965-3164 > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>> On Mar 1, 2021, at 5:39 PM, Jesse Shumaker < > >>>> jesse.laten.shumaker at gmail.com> wrote: > >>>>> > >>>>> Ric, your C&C 35 captain reminds me of a guy at our local > >>>>> sailing > club. > >>>>> George will be 85 this year and still regularly wins races on a > >>>>> Snipe, which is a 14' racing dinghy which makes for athletic sailing. > >> He > >>>>> was commodore at our sailing club for over 20 years and is a bit > >>>>> of a > >>>> hero > >>>>> to the local sailors. I picked up a Snipe for next to nothing > >>>>> last > >> year > >>>>> since we have a fleet that we're trying to rebuild and it is fun > >>>>> one > >>>> design > >>>>> racing. My wife took one look at the Snipe and said "That's > >>>>> your > boat, > >>>>> I'll never go on that tippy thing. I'll stick with the Rhodes > >>>>> and > your > >>>>> friends can crew on the Snipe." > >>>>> > >>>>> Jesse Shumaker > >>>>> S/V Zephyr > >>>>> > >>>>> On Mon, Mar 1, 2021 at 2:59 PM Ric Stott > >>>>> > >>>> wrote: > >>>>> > >>>>>> Stan et al > >>>>>> This is a difficult subject but since you brought it up. > >>>>>> Rhodies - > >>>>>> If you plan to use your boat as the coffin - it will not work! > >>>>>> I shouldn?t have to remind you that the Rhodes 22 does not sink. > >>>>>> I know Stan?s sense of humor is talking and so is mine. > >>>>>> But we have joked about how to send off our race captain on the > >>>>>> C&C > 35 > >>>>>> I?ve been sailing on for 30 years. > >>>>>> He?s 85, bought his boat new and is still racing, but hey, ya > >>>>>> never > >>>> know. > >>>>>> > >>>>>> Far off-shore and out-of-sight, a thru-hull fitting comes loose > >>>>>> - - > - > >>>>>> The C&C disappears, the Rhodes becomes part of the Plastic > >>>>>> waste > >> island > >>>>>> floating forever mid ocean. > >>>>>> Long live Stan and the Rhodes 22 - may we float forever. > >>>>>> Ric > >>>>>> sv Dadventure > >>>>>> Hampton Bays, NY > >>>>>> > >>>>>> Richard Stott, AIA, LEED AP > >>>>>> www.stottarchitecture.com > >>>>>> Office 631-283-1777 > >>>>>> Cell 516-965-3164 > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>>> On Mar 1, 2021, at 3:32 PM, stan wrote: > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> It is a good thing one of us has a good memory. No motor and > >>>>>>> we > made > >>>> it > >>>>>> all the way to the dead end of that long narrow canal? If I > >>>>>> knew > the > >>>> boats > >>>>>> were that good I would have kept them all. What did you say > >>>>>> your > name > >>>> was. > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Roger, this guy knows more about the boat than I do. Ask Him. > >>>>>>> He > has > >>>>>> owned two; I never could afford one. But lately been > >>>>>> considering it > >>>> since > >>>>>> they now come with a great surprise benefit: Free burial at sea > >>>>>> for > a > >>>> neat > >>>>>> net savings. > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> stan > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Mike, thanks for those wonderful memories. > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> On 3/1/21 2:45 PM, Michael D. Weisner wrote: > >>>>>>>> I bought my first Rhodes 22, an RC - that's what they were > >>>>>>>> called > >> back > >>>>>> then (1980) from Stan in Rose's kitchen, after our test sail. I > >>>> attached 2 > >>>>>> pdf files of the sales materials distributed to potential > >>>>>> buyers in > >>>> 1980 at > >>>>>> shows, including the price list and a narrative on the Rhodes > >>>> Continental. > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> Sheryl and I loved the RC, first seen at the Stamford in the > >>>>>>>> Water > >>>> Boat > >>>>>> Show in the autumn of 1980. Stan had promised a test sail when > >>>>>> I > gave > >>>> him > >>>>>> the $25 REFUNDABLE DEPOSIT. Unfortunately, he was too busy > >>>>>> taking > >>>> orders at > >>>>>> the show so we met him one very cold late October day at the > >>>>>> house > in > >>>>>> Amityville. The wind was howling at a good 15-20 knots and we > >>>>>> had a > >>>> heck of > >>>>>> a sail. Stan just sat on the cockpit seat with his back up > >>>>>> against > the > >>>>>> cabin bulkhead facing the stern. He zipped his parka up and > >>>>>> smiled > as > >> I > >>>>>> sailed her hard. He didn't care what I tried because he had > >>>>>> faith in > >> the > >>>>>> design. We came about and even jibed with all the cloth flying > >>>>>> (150 > >>>> Genoa). > >>>>>> I asked him if we needed to reef the main (roller reefing) and > >>>>>> he > just > >>>>>> shrugged, so we didn't. With a crew of 4 twenty somethings and > >>>>>> the > >>>> master, > >>>>>> we were invincible. When we finally go back to the canal behind > >>>>>> the > >>>> house, > >>>>>> Stan took the helm, showing me how to propel the RC with just > >>>>>> the > >>>> rudder. > >>>>>> It was then that I realized, we didn't have an engine on the mount. > >> Who > >>>>>> needed a stinking motor? > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> Stan wanted us to be among the first to try out his IMF > >>>>>>>> design but > >> he > >>>>>> was unable to give us a firm delivery date so we took delivery > >>>>>> of > the > >>>> RC in > >>>>>> March 1981. Stan set it up with us and we sailed for about an hour. > He > >>>> only > >>>>>> told me how to retrieve her, no practice attempt. I dropped him > >>>>>> at > our > >>>> dock > >>>>>> and we went out for more sailing. The two of us were finally > >>>>>> able to > >>>> get on > >>>>>> the trailer and dropped the mast in the dark. What a day! What > >>>>>> a > boat! > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> In those days, we sailed from March 1st through Thanksgiving, > >>>>>>>> as > >>>>>> trailer sailors! Now, we are on a mooring and I am happy to > >>>>>> sail May > >>>> 15th > >>>>>> to October 15, but, we do sail a '91 Rhodes 22 w/IMF and lots > >>>>>> of > >>>> creature > >>>>>> comforts. One thing hasn?t changed: I still love to sail my > >>>>>> Rhodes > 22 > >>>> fully > >>>>>> rigged in lots of wind. But, I must confess, I do furl the main > >>>>>> and > >> the > >>>>>> huge Genoa well before we hit 15-20 kts. > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> Mike > >>>>>>>> s/v Wind Lass ('91) > >>>>>>>> Nissequogue River, NY > >>>>>>>> I?d rather be sailing :~) > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> -----Original Message----- > >>>>>>>> From: Rhodes22-list On > Behalf > >> Of > >>>>>> Roger Pihlaja Home > >>>>>>>> Sent: Monday, March 1, 2021 1:51 PM > >>>>>>>> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > >>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes Continental Sails > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> Joe, > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> It is my understanding that Stan changed the name from Rhodes > >>>>>> Continental 22 to Rhodes 22 around the time he took over > >>>>>> production > of > >>>> the > >>>>>> boat. Other than the in house production line, I think all the > >>>>>> hull > >>>> lines > >>>>>> and sail plan were unchanged. The hull molds were literally > >>>>>> the > same. > >>>> The > >>>>>> Rhodes Continental 22 was not offered with the inner mast > >>>>>> furling mainsail. That came later. Stan, if I?ve gotten > >>>>>> something wrong > >> here, > >>>>>> please jump into this discussion. > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> Roger Pihlaja > >>>>>>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> Sent from my iPad > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> On Mar 1, 2021, at 1:33 PM, Joe Dempsey > >>>>>>>>> > >>>> wrote: > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> Then I'm confused. It is my understanding that the > >>>>>>>>> Continental > was > >>>>>>>>> only built for a few years. My question, therefore is what > >>>>>>>>> is the difference in sail plan from a Continental and any > >>>>>>>>> other Rhodes > 22? > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> ----- > >>>>>>>>> Joe Dempsey > >>>>>>>>> s/v Respite > >>>>>>>>> Rhodes 22 1989/2005 > >>>>>>>>> Deltaville,VA > >>>>>>>>> -- > >>>>>>>>> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > >>>>>>>> -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment > >>>>>>>> was scrubbed... > >>>>>>>> Name: Rhodes Sales Literature, circa 1980.pdf > >>>>>>>> Type: application/pdf > >>>>>>>> Size: 2084509 bytes > >>>>>>>> Desc: not available > >>>>>>>> URL: < > >>>>>> > >>>> > >> > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210301/83808 > c7b/attachment.pdf > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment > >>>>>>>> was scrubbed... > >>>>>>>> Name: Report on the Rhodes Continental, circa 1980.pdf > >>>>>>>> Type: application/pdf > >>>>>>>> Size: 687656 bytes > >>>>>>>> Desc: not available > >>>>>>>> URL: < > >>>>>> > >>>> > >> > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210301/83808 > c7b/attachment-0001.pdf > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >> > >> > > From joedempsey at hughes.net Thu Mar 4 16:47:08 2021 From: joedempsey at hughes.net (Joe Dempsey) Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2021 14:47:08 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes Burgee Update Message-ID: <1614894428456-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Okay, guys, I need your understanding (and sympathy). In talking with the flag shop, The Burgee Shoppe.com, our choice of design ran into a glitch and I think we should modify the design. The design that we voted on(first picture) had a white border on the perimeter of the blue triangle, showing a bit of blue on the edge. The maker says that the blue edge would have to be one half inch. This would impede on the rest of the flag and need to reduce the size of the "R22" logo/font. I sent them a quick modification that does two things: The original design with the white border looks smaller because the white border blends into the sky background and 2, actually makes the burgee stand out better. The woman on the phone said she actually liked it better. This is the only supplier I found that would let us order individually, but we have to give them a commitment of at least 25. In doing so, a setup fee is waived. They haven't said anything about a deposit (yet!) so we're counting on everybody to step it up. They have quoted us $24.00 per flag but I don't have shipping terms yet. We have commitments from List Members for 38 burgees so far. I notice that a number of you plan to purchase 2 burgees, as I do. I plan to frame one for my den. If anyone wants to increase their order, let me know. My question for The List: Does the new design meet with your approval? Please ONLY RESPOND if you DO NOT approve do not want the new design OR if you want to ADD AN ADDITIONAL BURGEE to your commitment. ----- Joe Dempsey s/v Respite Rhodes 22 1989/2005 Deltaville,VA -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From ric at stottarchitecture.com Thu Mar 4 16:52:30 2021 From: ric at stottarchitecture.com (Ric Stott) Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2021 16:52:30 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes Burgee Update In-Reply-To: <1614894428456-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1614894428456-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <4A90A3BA-00C0-4317-A925-D7BC48A2DDE9@stottarchitecture.com> At $24 - I?ll take two as well. Richard Stott, AIA, LEED AP www.stottarchitecture.com Office 631-283-1777 Cell 516-965-3164 > On Mar 4, 2021, at 4:47 PM, Joe Dempsey wrote: > > Okay, guys, I need your understanding (and sympathy). In talking with the > flag shop, The Burgee Shoppe.com, our choice of design ran into a glitch and > I think we should modify the design. The design that we voted on(first > picture) had a white border on the perimeter of the blue triangle, showing a > bit of blue on the edge. The maker says that the blue edge would have to be > one half inch. This would impede on the rest of the flag and need to reduce > the size of the "R22" logo/font. I sent them a quick modification that does > two things: The original design with the white border looks smaller because > the white border blends into the sky background and 2, actually makes the > burgee stand out better. The woman on the phone said she actually liked it > better. > > This is the only supplier I found that would let us order individually, but > we have to give them a commitment of at least 25. In doing so, a setup fee > is waived. They haven't said anything about a deposit (yet!) so we're > counting on everybody to step it up. They have quoted us $24.00 per flag but > I don't have shipping terms yet. > > We have commitments from List Members for 38 burgees so far. I notice that a > number of you plan to purchase 2 burgees, as I do. I plan to frame one for > my den. If anyone wants to increase their order, let me know. > > My question for The List: Does the new design meet with your approval? > > Please ONLY RESPOND if you DO NOT approve do not want the new design OR if > you want to ADD AN ADDITIONAL BURGEE to your commitment. > > > > > > > > ----- > Joe Dempsey > s/v Respite > Rhodes 22 1989/2005 > Deltaville,VA > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From joedempsey at hughes.net Thu Mar 4 17:27:06 2021 From: joedempsey at hughes.net (Joe Dempsey) Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2021 15:27:06 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] New Website In-Reply-To: <012c01d70b3e$e2eed5e0$a8cc81a0$@ebsmed.com> References: <012c01d70b3e$e2eed5e0$a8cc81a0$@ebsmed.com> Message-ID: <1614896826046-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Hello Mike, Are you the webmaster for the site? When the time is right, can you add a link for our burgee supplier so members can order their flags? ----- Joe Dempsey s/v Respite Rhodes 22 1989/2005 Deltaville,VA -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From chrisgeankoplis at gmail.com Thu Mar 4 17:30:51 2021 From: chrisgeankoplis at gmail.com (Chris Geankoplis) Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2021 17:30:51 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] New Website In-Reply-To: <1614896826046-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <012c01d70b3e$e2eed5e0$a8cc81a0$@ebsmed.com> <1614896826046-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: Still looking for the link to the new website so I can put it in my permanent links. Chris Geankoplis Enosis On Thu, Mar 4, 2021 at 5:27 PM Joe Dempsey wrote: > Hello Mike, > Are you the webmaster for the site? When the time is right, can you add a > link for our burgee supplier so members can order their flags? > > > > ----- > Joe Dempsey > s/v Respite > Rhodes 22 1989/2005 > Deltaville,VA > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > From hnw555 at gmail.com Thu Mar 4 17:38:14 2021 From: hnw555 at gmail.com (Hank) Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2021 17:38:14 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] New Website In-Reply-To: References: <012c01d70b3e$e2eed5e0$a8cc81a0$@ebsmed.com> <1614896826046-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: Rhodes22.org On Thu, Mar 4, 2021, 5:31 PM Chris Geankoplis wrote: > Still looking for the link to the new website so I can put it in my > permanent links. > Chris Geankoplis > Enosis > > On Thu, Mar 4, 2021 at 5:27 PM Joe Dempsey wrote: > > > Hello Mike, > > Are you the webmaster for the site? When the time is right, can you add a > > link for our burgee supplier so members can order their flags? > > > > > > > > ----- > > Joe Dempsey > > s/v Respite > > Rhodes 22 1989/2005 > > Deltaville,VA > > -- > > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > > > From mitchpadl at gmail.com Thu Mar 4 17:39:41 2021 From: mitchpadl at gmail.com (Mitch Mitchell) Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2021 15:39:41 -0700 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes Burgee Update In-Reply-To: <4A90A3BA-00C0-4317-A925-D7BC48A2DDE9@stottarchitecture.com> References: <4A90A3BA-00C0-4317-A925-D7BC48A2DDE9@stottarchitecture.com> Message-ID: <9C41AC2B-DCD8-4F9E-953B-E1E0EBE31B88@gmail.com> I?d like one, any design is fine with me! Thanks! Mitch CoastalKayak.com 302-539-79999 > On Mar 4, 2021, at 2:52 PM, Ric Stott wrote: > > ?At $24 - I?ll take two as well. > > Richard Stott, AIA, LEED AP > www.stottarchitecture.com > Office 631-283-1777 > Cell 516-965-3164 > > > > > >> On Mar 4, 2021, at 4:47 PM, Joe Dempsey wrote: >> >> Okay, guys, I need your understanding (and sympathy). In talking with the >> flag shop, The Burgee Shoppe.com, our choice of design ran into a glitch and >> I think we should modify the design. The design that we voted on(first >> picture) had a white border on the perimeter of the blue triangle, showing a >> bit of blue on the edge. The maker says that the blue edge would have to be >> one half inch. This would impede on the rest of the flag and need to reduce >> the size of the "R22" logo/font. I sent them a quick modification that does >> two things: The original design with the white border looks smaller because >> the white border blends into the sky background and 2, actually makes the >> burgee stand out better. The woman on the phone said she actually liked it >> better. >> >> This is the only supplier I found that would let us order individually, but >> we have to give them a commitment of at least 25. In doing so, a setup fee >> is waived. They haven't said anything about a deposit (yet!) so we're >> counting on everybody to step it up. They have quoted us $24.00 per flag but >> I don't have shipping terms yet. >> >> We have commitments from List Members for 38 burgees so far. I notice that a >> number of you plan to purchase 2 burgees, as I do. I plan to frame one for >> my den. If anyone wants to increase their order, let me know. >> >> My question for The List: Does the new design meet with your approval? >> >> Please ONLY RESPOND if you DO NOT approve do not want the new design OR if >> you want to ADD AN ADDITIONAL BURGEE to your commitment. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> ----- >> Joe Dempsey >> s/v Respite >> Rhodes 22 1989/2005 >> Deltaville,VA >> -- >> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > From stan at generalboats.com Thu Mar 4 17:41:51 2021 From: stan at generalboats.com (stan) Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2021 17:41:51 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] New Website In-Reply-To: References: <012c01d70b3e$e2eed5e0$a8cc81a0$@ebsmed.com> <1614896826046-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: < www.rhodes22.org > On 3/4/21 5:30 PM, Chris Geankoplis wrote: > Still looking for the link to the new website so I can put it in my > permanent links. > Chris Geankoplis > Enosis > > From tom.vanheule at intrinsicprograms.com Thu Mar 4 17:46:45 2021 From: tom.vanheule at intrinsicprograms.com (Tom Van Heule) Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2021 16:46:45 -0600 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes Burgee Update In-Reply-To: <9C41AC2B-DCD8-4F9E-953B-E1E0EBE31B88@gmail.com> References: <4A90A3BA-00C0-4317-A925-D7BC48A2DDE9@stottarchitecture.com> <9C41AC2B-DCD8-4F9E-953B-E1E0EBE31B88@gmail.com> Message-ID: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/file/t752/Rhodes22_Burgee.jpg Two.please. On Thu, Mar 4, 2021, 4:39 PM Mitch Mitchell wrote: > I?d like one, any design is fine with me! Thanks! > > Mitch > CoastalKayak.com > 302-539-79999 > > > On Mar 4, 2021, at 2:52 PM, Ric Stott wrote: > > > > ?At $24 - I?ll take two as well. > > > > Richard Stott, AIA, LEED AP > > www.stottarchitecture.com > > Office 631-283-1777 > > Cell 516-965-3164 > > > > > > > > > > > >> On Mar 4, 2021, at 4:47 PM, Joe Dempsey wrote: > >> > >> Okay, guys, I need your understanding (and sympathy). In talking with > the > >> flag shop, The Burgee Shoppe.com, our choice of design ran into a > glitch and > >> I think we should modify the design. The design that we voted on(first > >> picture) had a white border on the perimeter of the blue triangle, > showing a > >> bit of blue on the edge. The maker says that the blue edge would have > to be > >> one half inch. This would impede on the rest of the flag and need to > reduce > >> the size of the "R22" logo/font. I sent them a quick modification that > does > >> two things: The original design with the white border looks smaller > because > >> the white border blends into the sky background and 2, actually makes > the > >> burgee stand out better. The woman on the phone said she actually liked > it > >> better. > >> > >> This is the only supplier I found that would let us order individually, > but > >> we have to give them a commitment of at least 25. In doing so, a setup > fee > >> is waived. They haven't said anything about a deposit (yet!) so we're > >> counting on everybody to step it up. They have quoted us $24.00 per > flag but > >> I don't have shipping terms yet. > >> > >> We have commitments from List Members for 38 burgees so far. I notice > that a > >> number of you plan to purchase 2 burgees, as I do. I plan to frame one > for > >> my den. If anyone wants to increase their order, let me know. > >> > >> My question for The List: Does the new design meet with your approval? > >> > >> Please ONLY RESPOND if you DO NOT approve do not want the new design OR > if > >> you want to ADD AN ADDITIONAL BURGEE to your commitment. > >> > >> > >> > >> < > http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/file/t752/Rhodes_22_Burgee_Triangle.jpg> > > >> > >> > >> > >> ----- > >> Joe Dempsey > >> s/v Respite > >> Rhodes 22 1989/2005 > >> Deltaville,VA > >> -- > >> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > > > From tom.vanheule at intrinsicprograms.com Thu Mar 4 17:53:17 2021 From: tom.vanheule at intrinsicprograms.com (Tom Van Heule) Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2021 16:53:17 -0600 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] I love our boat, looking forward to dropping Message-ID: I have seen a few larger boats getting towed around (wisco) already. Looking forward to our first year in slip on lake michigan. When is everyone else due for the water, assuming you had to leave... -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: IMG_20210302_074313.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 3537143 bytes Desc: not available URL: From mweisner at ebsmed.com Thu Mar 4 18:35:48 2021 From: mweisner at ebsmed.com (Michael D. Weisner) Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2021 18:35:48 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] New Website In-Reply-To: <1614896826046-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <012c01d70b3e$e2eed5e0$a8cc81a0$@ebsmed.com> <1614896826046-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <007001d7114f$1b9531d0$52bf9570$@ebsmed.com> Hi Joe, Peter Nyberg does most of the "heavy lifting" as the author of the new site. I simply teach the old server new tricks. Please send the link to me, Peter, or "da list" and one of us will put it up on the site. I'm sure that we can add the burgee to the home page as a link to the supplier. Just to be sure, is the burgee that will be produced "Rhodes_22_Burgee_Triangle.jpg"? Mike s/v Wind Lass ('91) Nissequogue River, NY I'd rather be sailing :~) -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of Joe Dempsey Sent: Thursday, March 4, 2021 5:27 PM To: rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] New Website Hello Mike, Are you the webmaster for the site? When the time is right, can you add a link for our burgee supplier so members can order their flags? ----- Joe Dempsey s/v Respite Rhodes 22 1989/2005 Deltaville,VA -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From mweisner at ebsmed.com Thu Mar 4 18:37:25 2021 From: mweisner at ebsmed.com (Michael D. Weisner) Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2021 18:37:25 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] New Website In-Reply-To: References: <012c01d70b3e$e2eed5e0$a8cc81a0$@ebsmed.com> <1614896826046-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <007101d7114f$55bae800$0130b800$@ebsmed.com> Chris, Have you found it (www.rhodes22.org)? Gee, even Stan responded with the URL address! Mike s/v Wind Lass ('91) Nissequogue River, NY I?d rather be sailing :~) -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of Chris Geankoplis Sent: Thursday, March 4, 2021 5:31 PM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] New Website Still looking for the link to the new website so I can put it in my permanent links. Chris Geankoplis Enosis On Thu, Mar 4, 2021 at 5:27 PM Joe Dempsey wrote: > Hello Mike, > Are you the webmaster for the site? When the time is right, can you > add a link for our burgee supplier so members can order their flags? > > > > ----- > Joe Dempsey > s/v Respite > Rhodes 22 1989/2005 > Deltaville,VA > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > From chrisgeankoplis at gmail.com Thu Mar 4 19:57:18 2021 From: chrisgeankoplis at gmail.com (Chris Geankoplis) Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2021 19:57:18 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] New Website In-Reply-To: <007101d7114f$55bae800$0130b800$@ebsmed.com> References: <012c01d70b3e$e2eed5e0$a8cc81a0$@ebsmed.com> <1614896826046-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <007101d7114f$55bae800$0130b800$@ebsmed.com> Message-ID: I think Stan is more adroit than I am. Yup, love it. Thanks Chris Geankoplis On Thu, Mar 4, 2021 at 6:37 PM Michael D. Weisner wrote: > Chris, > > Have you found it (www.rhodes22.org)? Gee, even Stan responded with the > URL address! > > Mike > s/v Wind Lass ('91) > Nissequogue River, NY > I?d rather be sailing :~) > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of > Chris Geankoplis > Sent: Thursday, March 4, 2021 5:31 PM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] New Website > > Still looking for the link to the new website so I can put it in my > permanent links. > Chris Geankoplis > Enosis > > On Thu, Mar 4, 2021 at 5:27 PM Joe Dempsey wrote: > > > Hello Mike, > > Are you the webmaster for the site? When the time is right, can you > > add a link for our burgee supplier so members can order their flags? > > > > > > > > ----- > > Joe Dempsey > > s/v Respite > > Rhodes 22 1989/2005 > > Deltaville,VA > > -- > > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > > > > From montesteen at comcast.net Thu Mar 4 20:15:40 2021 From: montesteen at comcast.net (Monte Steen) Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2021 20:15:40 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes Burgee Update In-Reply-To: <1614894428456-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1614894428456-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <7F0FC468-5D7B-4CD0-8786-0234B3967129@comcast.net> Please put me down for one burgee. Thanks Monte 678-571-0672 > On Mar 4, 2021, at 4:47 PM, Joe Dempsey wrote: > > ?Okay, guys, I need your understanding (and sympathy). In talking with the > flag shop, The Burgee Shoppe.com, our choice of design ran into a glitch and > I think we should modify the design. The design that we voted on(first > picture) had a white border on the perimeter of the blue triangle, showing a > bit of blue on the edge. The maker says that the blue edge would have to be > one half inch. This would impede on the rest of the flag and need to reduce > the size of the "R22" logo/font. I sent them a quick modification that does > two things: The original design with the white border looks smaller because > the white border blends into the sky background and 2, actually makes the > burgee stand out better. The woman on the phone said she actually liked it > better. > > This is the only supplier I found that would let us order individually, but > we have to give them a commitment of at least 25. In doing so, a setup fee > is waived. They haven't said anything about a deposit (yet!) so we're > counting on everybody to step it up. They have quoted us $24.00 per flag but > I don't have shipping terms yet. > > We have commitments from List Members for 38 burgees so far. I notice that a > number of you plan to purchase 2 burgees, as I do. I plan to frame one for > my den. If anyone wants to increase their order, let me know. > > My question for The List: Does the new design meet with your approval? > > Please ONLY RESPOND if you DO NOT approve do not want the new design OR if > you want to ADD AN ADDITIONAL BURGEE to your commitment. > > > > > > > > ----- > Joe Dempsey > s/v Respite > Rhodes 22 1989/2005 > Deltaville,VA > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From tavares0947 at gmail.com Fri Mar 5 06:17:58 2021 From: tavares0947 at gmail.com (Todd Tavares) Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2021 06:17:58 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes Burgee Update In-Reply-To: <1614894428456-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1614894428456-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: I don't like the new design, but I haven't comitted to ordering a burgee yet, because I didn't like any of the designs, so my input may not be welcomed. My thought is that because many of us already have the R 22 on our mainsails in 24"+ characters, (my new main does not) having it again on a small burgee seems repetitious. But a white border, especially if viewed against the backdrop of the sails would surely make the burgee look much smaller. Does it really need a contrasting border? Todd T tavares0947 at gmail.com On Thu, Mar 4, 2021, 4:47 PM Joe Dempsey wrote: > Okay, guys, I need your understanding (and sympathy). In talking with the > flag shop, The Burgee Shoppe.com, our choice of design ran into a glitch > and > I think we should modify the design. The design that we voted on(first > picture) had a white border on the perimeter of the blue triangle, showing > a > bit of blue on the edge. The maker says that the blue edge would have to be > one half inch. This would impede on the rest of the flag and need to reduce > the size of the "R22" logo/font. I sent them a quick modification that does > two things: The original design with the white border looks smaller because > the white border blends into the sky background and 2, actually makes the > burgee stand out better. The woman on the phone said she actually liked it > better. > > This is the only supplier I found that would let us order individually, but > we have to give them a commitment of at least 25. In doing so, a setup fee > is waived. They haven't said anything about a deposit (yet!) so we're > counting on everybody to step it up. They have quoted us $24.00 per flag > but > I don't have shipping terms yet. > > We have commitments from List Members for 38 burgees so far. I notice that > a > number of you plan to purchase 2 burgees, as I do. I plan to frame one for > my den. If anyone wants to increase their order, let me know. > > My question for The List: Does the new design meet with your approval? > > Please ONLY RESPOND if you DO NOT approve do not want the new design OR if > you want to ADD AN ADDITIONAL BURGEE to your commitment. > > > > < > http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/file/t752/Rhodes_22_Burgee_Triangle.jpg> > > > > > ----- > Joe Dempsey > s/v Respite > Rhodes 22 1989/2005 > Deltaville,VA > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > From mark-olson at verizon.net Fri Mar 5 07:05:50 2021 From: mark-olson at verizon.net (Mark Olson) Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2021 07:05:50 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes Burgee Update In-Reply-To: References: <1614894428456-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <38b318be-c3c2-e68c-c8b9-651b61539dcf@verizon.net> I do not like the new design as much as the original. But I want to increase to buying 2 no matter which is chosen. Mark Olson On 3/5/2021 6:17 AM, Todd Tavares wrote: > I don't like the new design, but I haven't comitted to ordering a burgee > yet, because I didn't like any of the designs, so my input may not be > welcomed. > > My thought is that because many of us already have the R 22 on our > mainsails in 24"+ characters, (my new main does not) having it again on a > small burgee seems repetitious. But a white border, especially if viewed > against the backdrop of the sails would surely make the burgee look much > smaller. Does it really need a contrasting border? > > Todd T > > tavares0947 at gmail.com > > On Thu, Mar 4, 2021, 4:47 PM Joe Dempsey wrote: > >> Okay, guys, I need your understanding (and sympathy). In talking with the >> flag shop, The Burgee Shoppe.com, our choice of design ran into a glitch >> and >> I think we should modify the design. The design that we voted on(first >> picture) had a white border on the perimeter of the blue triangle, showing >> a >> bit of blue on the edge. The maker says that the blue edge would have to be >> one half inch. This would impede on the rest of the flag and need to reduce >> the size of the "R22" logo/font. I sent them a quick modification that does >> two things: The original design with the white border looks smaller because >> the white border blends into the sky background and 2, actually makes the >> burgee stand out better. The woman on the phone said she actually liked it >> better. >> >> This is the only supplier I found that would let us order individually, but >> we have to give them a commitment of at least 25. In doing so, a setup fee >> is waived. They haven't said anything about a deposit (yet!) so we're >> counting on everybody to step it up. They have quoted us $24.00 per flag >> but >> I don't have shipping terms yet. >> >> We have commitments from List Members for 38 burgees so far. I notice that >> a >> number of you plan to purchase 2 burgees, as I do. I plan to frame one for >> my den. If anyone wants to increase their order, let me know. >> >> My question for The List: Does the new design meet with your approval? >> >> Please ONLY RESPOND if you DO NOT approve do not want the new design OR if >> you want to ADD AN ADDITIONAL BURGEE to your commitment. >> >> >> >> < >> http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/file/t752/Rhodes_22_Burgee_Triangle.jpg> >> >> >> >> >> ----- >> Joe Dempsey >> s/v Respite >> Rhodes 22 1989/2005 >> Deltaville,VA >> -- >> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ >> From chrisgeankoplis at gmail.com Fri Mar 5 10:08:20 2021 From: chrisgeankoplis at gmail.com (Chris Geankoplis) Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2021 10:08:20 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes Burgee Update In-Reply-To: <1614894428456-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1614894428456-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: I like the new design, I think it is quite fine. I?d like it on my boat I?d like it on a goat. I think it would look nice on anything that would float. Ted Geisel (apologies to) Eno-Seuss On Thu, Mar 4, 2021 at 4:47 PM Joe Dempsey wrote: > Okay, guys, I need your understanding (and sympathy). In talking with the > flag shop, The Burgee Shoppe.com, our choice of design ran into a glitch > and > I think we should modify the design. The design that we voted on(first > picture) had a white border on the perimeter of the blue triangle, showing > a > bit of blue on the edge. The maker says that the blue edge would have to be > one half inch. This would impede on the rest of the flag and need to reduce > the size of the "R22" logo/font. I sent them a quick modification that does > two things: The original design with the white border looks smaller because > the white border blends into the sky background and 2, actually makes the > burgee stand out better. The woman on the phone said she actually liked it > better. > > This is the only supplier I found that would let us order individually, but > we have to give them a commitment of at least 25. In doing so, a setup fee > is waived. They haven't said anything about a deposit (yet!) so we're > counting on everybody to step it up. They have quoted us $24.00 per flag > but > I don't have shipping terms yet. > > We have commitments from List Members for 38 burgees so far. I notice that > a > number of you plan to purchase 2 burgees, as I do. I plan to frame one for > my den. If anyone wants to increase their order, let me know. > > My question for The List: Does the new design meet with your approval? > > Please ONLY RESPOND if you DO NOT approve do not want the new design OR if > you want to ADD AN ADDITIONAL BURGEE to your commitment. > > > > < > http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/file/t752/Rhodes_22_Burgee_Triangle.jpg> > > > > > ----- > Joe Dempsey > s/v Respite > Rhodes 22 1989/2005 > Deltaville,VA > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > From joedempsey at hughes.net Fri Mar 5 10:20:25 2021 From: joedempsey at hughes.net (Joe Dempsey) Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2021 08:20:25 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes Burgee Update In-Reply-To: References: <1614894428456-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <1614957625298-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Todd, Thanks for your comments. They are noted. ----- Joe Dempsey s/v Respite Rhodes 22 1989/2005 Deltaville,VA -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From joedempsey at hughes.net Fri Mar 5 10:22:06 2021 From: joedempsey at hughes.net (Joe Dempsey) Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2021 08:22:06 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes Burgee Update In-Reply-To: <38b318be-c3c2-e68c-c8b9-651b61539dcf@verizon.net> References: <1614894428456-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <38b318be-c3c2-e68c-c8b9-651b61539dcf@verizon.net> Message-ID: <1614957726169-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Mark, Thanks for sharing. ----- Joe Dempsey s/v Respite Rhodes 22 1989/2005 Deltaville,VA -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From joedempsey at hughes.net Fri Mar 5 10:22:46 2021 From: joedempsey at hughes.net (Joe Dempsey) Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2021 08:22:46 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes Burgee Update In-Reply-To: <9C41AC2B-DCD8-4F9E-953B-E1E0EBE31B88@gmail.com> References: <1614894428456-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <4A90A3BA-00C0-4317-A925-D7BC48A2DDE9@stottarchitecture.com> <9C41AC2B-DCD8-4F9E-953B-E1E0EBE31B88@gmail.com> Message-ID: <1614957766532-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Thanks Mitch ----- Joe Dempsey s/v Respite Rhodes 22 1989/2005 Deltaville,VA -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From joedempsey at hughes.net Fri Mar 5 10:23:34 2021 From: joedempsey at hughes.net (Joe Dempsey) Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2021 08:23:34 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes Burgee Update In-Reply-To: References: <1614894428456-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <4A90A3BA-00C0-4317-A925-D7BC48A2DDE9@stottarchitecture.com> <9C41AC2B-DCD8-4F9E-953B-E1E0EBE31B88@gmail.com> Message-ID: <1614957814760-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Great! Thanks Tom. ----- Joe Dempsey s/v Respite Rhodes 22 1989/2005 Deltaville,VA -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From mweisner at ebsmed.com Fri Mar 5 10:54:54 2021 From: mweisner at ebsmed.com (Michael D. Weisner) Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2021 10:54:54 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes Burgee Update In-Reply-To: References: <1614894428456-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <008401d711d7$e3359760$a9a0c620$@ebsmed.com> The estate of Dr. Seuss has recalled all works that reference goats or boats or things that float. -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of Chris Geankoplis Sent: Friday, March 5, 2021 10:08 AM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes Burgee Update I like the new design, I think it is quite fine. I?d like it on my boat I?d like it on a goat. I think it would look nice on anything that would float. Ted Geisel (apologies to) Eno-Seuss On Thu, Mar 4, 2021 at 4:47 PM Joe Dempsey wrote: > Okay, guys, I need your understanding (and sympathy). In talking with > the flag shop, The Burgee Shoppe.com, our choice of design ran into a > glitch and I think we should modify the design. The design that we > voted on(first > picture) had a white border on the perimeter of the blue triangle, > showing a bit of blue on the edge. The maker says that the blue edge > would have to be one half inch. This would impede on the rest of the > flag and need to reduce the size of the "R22" logo/font. I sent them a > quick modification that does two things: The original design with the > white border looks smaller because the white border blends into the > sky background and 2, actually makes the burgee stand out better. The > woman on the phone said she actually liked it better. > > This is the only supplier I found that would let us order > individually, but we have to give them a commitment of at least 25. In > doing so, a setup fee is waived. They haven't said anything about a > deposit (yet!) so we're counting on everybody to step it up. They have > quoted us $24.00 per flag but I don't have shipping terms yet. > > We have commitments from List Members for 38 burgees so far. I notice > that a number of you plan to purchase 2 burgees, as I do. I plan to > frame one for my den. If anyone wants to increase their order, let me > know. > > My question for The List: Does the new design meet with your approval? > > Please ONLY RESPOND if you DO NOT approve do not want the new design > OR if you want to ADD AN ADDITIONAL BURGEE to your commitment. > > > > < > http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/file/t752/Rhodes_22_Burgee_Tria > ngle.jpg> > > > > > ----- > Joe Dempsey > s/v Respite > Rhodes 22 1989/2005 > Deltaville,VA > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > From blue66corvette at hotmail.com Fri Mar 5 11:13:32 2021 From: blue66corvette at hotmail.com (Charles Nieman) Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2021 16:13:32 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes Burgee Update In-Reply-To: <008401d711d7$e3359760$a9a0c620$@ebsmed.com> References: <1614894428456-0.post@n5.nabble.com> , <008401d711d7$e3359760$a9a0c620$@ebsmed.com> Message-ID: I thought the list was NON-POLITICAL > On Mar 5, 2021, at 9:55 AM, Michael D. Weisner wrote: > > ?The estate of Dr. Seuss has recalled all works that reference goats or boats or things that float. > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of Chris Geankoplis > Sent: Friday, March 5, 2021 10:08 AM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes Burgee Update > > I like the new design, I think it is quite fine. I?d like it on my boat I?d like it on a goat. I think it would look nice on anything that would float. > Ted Geisel (apologies to) > Eno-Seuss > >> On Thu, Mar 4, 2021 at 4:47 PM Joe Dempsey wrote: >> >> Okay, guys, I need your understanding (and sympathy). In talking with >> the flag shop, The Burgee Shoppe.com, our choice of design ran into a >> glitch and I think we should modify the design. The design that we >> voted on(first >> picture) had a white border on the perimeter of the blue triangle, >> showing a bit of blue on the edge. The maker says that the blue edge >> would have to be one half inch. This would impede on the rest of the >> flag and need to reduce the size of the "R22" logo/font. I sent them a >> quick modification that does two things: The original design with the >> white border looks smaller because the white border blends into the >> sky background and 2, actually makes the burgee stand out better. The >> woman on the phone said she actually liked it better. >> >> This is the only supplier I found that would let us order >> individually, but we have to give them a commitment of at least 25. In >> doing so, a setup fee is waived. They haven't said anything about a >> deposit (yet!) so we're counting on everybody to step it up. They have >> quoted us $24.00 per flag but I don't have shipping terms yet. >> >> We have commitments from List Members for 38 burgees so far. I notice >> that a number of you plan to purchase 2 burgees, as I do. I plan to >> frame one for my den. If anyone wants to increase their order, let me >> know. >> >> My question for The List: Does the new design meet with your approval? >> >> Please ONLY RESPOND if you DO NOT approve do not want the new design >> OR if you want to ADD AN ADDITIONAL BURGEE to your commitment. >> >> >> >> < >> http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/file/t752/Rhodes_22_Burgee_Tria >> ngle.jpg> >> >> >> >> >> ----- >> Joe Dempsey >> s/v Respite >> Rhodes 22 1989/2005 >> Deltaville,VA >> -- >> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ >> > From dwbrad at gmail.com Fri Mar 5 15:30:44 2021 From: dwbrad at gmail.com (David Bradley) Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2021 15:30:44 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes Burgee Update In-Reply-To: References: <1614894428456-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <021447E9-D63F-482A-87B2-4F26A865FE3F@gmail.com> I like it. I?ll up my order to two. Thank you. Dave B > On Mar 5, 2021, at 10:08 AM, Chris Geankoplis wrote: > > I like the new design, I think it is quite fine. I?d like it on my boat I?d > like it on a goat. I think it would look nice on anything that would float. > Ted Geisel (apologies to) > Eno-Seuss > > On Thu, Mar 4, 2021 at 4:47 PM Joe Dempsey wrote: > >> Okay, guys, I need your understanding (and sympathy). In talking with the >> flag shop, The Burgee Shoppe.com, our choice of design ran into a glitch >> and >> I think we should modify the design. The design that we voted on(first >> picture) had a white border on the perimeter of the blue triangle, showing >> a >> bit of blue on the edge. The maker says that the blue edge would have to be >> one half inch. This would impede on the rest of the flag and need to reduce >> the size of the "R22" logo/font. I sent them a quick modification that does >> two things: The original design with the white border looks smaller because >> the white border blends into the sky background and 2, actually makes the >> burgee stand out better. The woman on the phone said she actually liked it >> better. >> >> This is the only supplier I found that would let us order individually, but >> we have to give them a commitment of at least 25. In doing so, a setup fee >> is waived. They haven't said anything about a deposit (yet!) so we're >> counting on everybody to step it up. They have quoted us $24.00 per flag >> but >> I don't have shipping terms yet. >> >> We have commitments from List Members for 38 burgees so far. I notice that >> a >> number of you plan to purchase 2 burgees, as I do. I plan to frame one for >> my den. If anyone wants to increase their order, let me know. >> >> My question for The List: Does the new design meet with your approval? >> >> Please ONLY RESPOND if you DO NOT approve do not want the new design OR if >> you want to ADD AN ADDITIONAL BURGEE to your commitment. >> >> >> >> < >> http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/file/t752/Rhodes_22_Burgee_Triangle.jpg> >> >> >> >> >> ----- >> Joe Dempsey >> s/v Respite >> Rhodes 22 1989/2005 >> Deltaville,VA >> -- >> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ >> From jesse.laten.shumaker at gmail.com Fri Mar 5 15:55:03 2021 From: jesse.laten.shumaker at gmail.com (Jesse Shumaker) Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2021 14:55:03 -0600 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] I love our boat, looking forward to dropping In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hi Tom, I'm counting down until our floating docks go in at the end of April. I'm sure you will enjoy the slip since it's so convenient to hop in the boat and go sailing that way. Will you be right on Lake Michigan, or on a lake or bay? Jesse Shumaker S/V Zephyr On Thu, Mar 4, 2021 at 4:53 PM Tom Van Heule < tom.vanheule at intrinsicprograms.com> wrote: > I have seen a few larger boats getting towed around (wisco) already. > > Looking forward to our first year in slip on lake michigan. > > When is everyone else due for the water, assuming you had to leave... > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: IMG_20210302_074313.jpg > Type: image/jpeg > Size: 3537143 bytes > Desc: not available > URL: < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210304/951fcd84/attachment.jpg > > > From tom.vanheule at intrinsicprograms.com Fri Mar 5 16:28:02 2021 From: tom.vanheule at intrinsicprograms.com (Tom Van Heule) Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2021 15:28:02 -0600 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] I love our boat, looking forward to dropping In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Lake Michigan. Milwaukee. I've been searching the list, but not seeing any talk of crossing it, anyone? We have friends in muskegon and ludington, am I a fool? Well yes I am, but in this context? On Fri, Mar 5, 2021, 2:55 PM Jesse Shumaker wrote: > Hi Tom, I'm counting down until our floating docks go in at the end of > April. I'm sure you will enjoy the slip since it's so convenient to hop in > the boat and go sailing that way. Will you be right on Lake Michigan, or > on a lake or bay? > > Jesse Shumaker > S/V Zephyr > > On Thu, Mar 4, 2021 at 4:53 PM Tom Van Heule < > tom.vanheule at intrinsicprograms.com> wrote: > > > I have seen a few larger boats getting towed around (wisco) already. > > > > Looking forward to our first year in slip on lake michigan. > > > > When is everyone else due for the water, assuming you had to leave... > > -------------- next part -------------- > > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > > Name: IMG_20210302_074313.jpg > > Type: image/jpeg > > Size: 3537143 bytes > > Desc: not available > > URL: < > > > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210304/951fcd84/attachment.jpg > > > > > > From roger_pihlaja at msn.com Fri Mar 5 18:24:07 2021 From: roger_pihlaja at msn.com (ROGER PIHLAJA) Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2021 23:24:07 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Lake Michigan Crossing? In-Reply-To: References: , Message-ID: Hi Tom, I?ve gone a significant distance out into Lake Michigan starting from north, east, and west in S/V Dynamic Equilibrium. But, I?ve never made a Lake Michigan crossing in S/V Dynamic Equilibrium. Starting from Gill?s Rock, WI on the tip of the Door Peninsula on Green Bay; we?ve sailed thru Death?s Door out to Washington Island, then Rock Island, and back to Gill?s Rock. Starting from Charlevoix, MI; we?ve sailed out to Beaver Island Harbor of Refuge (HoR), then Garden Island, and back to Charlevoix HoR. On the northern end of Lake Michigan, we?ve sailed from Escanaba, MI HoR on Little Bay de Noc over to Fayette HoR near the tip of the Garden peninsula on Big Bay de Noc. Fayette State Park has a cool restored 1870?s iron smelting facility and company town. In the summer, there are costumed reenactors. If I were going to do a Lake Michigan crossing, I would strongly consider doing it in 3 legs; Gill?s Rock to Jackson Harbor on Washington Island, Jackson Harbor to Fayette HoR (NOTE: There are numerous uninhabited islands on this leg ? so you could island hop & beach camp if you are so inclined), Fayette HoR to Beaver Island HoR, and finally Beaver Island HoR to Charlevoix HoR. I would do the crossing west to east because the summer prevailing winds usually favor that strategy. This strategy lets you sail in the daytime and also keeps you mostly out of the commercial shipping lanes. The big ore boats terrify me and they always have the right of weigh! Roger Pihlaja S/V Dynamic Equilibrium Sent from Mail for Windows 10 From: Tom Van Heule Sent: Friday, March 5, 2021 4:28 PM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] I love our boat, looking forward to dropping Lake Michigan. Milwaukee. I've been searching the list, but not seeing any talk of crossing it, anyone? We have friends in muskegon and ludington, am I a fool? Well yes I am, but in this context? On Fri, Mar 5, 2021, 2:55 PM Jesse Shumaker wrote: > Hi Tom, I'm counting down until our floating docks go in at the end of > April. I'm sure you will enjoy the slip since it's so convenient to hop in > the boat and go sailing that way. Will you be right on Lake Michigan, or > on a lake or bay? > > Jesse Shumaker > S/V Zephyr > > On Thu, Mar 4, 2021 at 4:53 PM Tom Van Heule < > tom.vanheule at intrinsicprograms.com> wrote: > > > I have seen a few larger boats getting towed around (wisco) already. > > > > Looking forward to our first year in slip on lake michigan. > > > > When is everyone else due for the water, assuming you had to leave... > > -------------- next part -------------- > > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > > Name: IMG_20210302_074313.jpg > > Type: image/jpeg > > Size: 3537143 bytes > > Desc: not available > > URL: < > > > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210304/951fcd84/attachment.jpg > > > > > > From chrisgeankoplis at gmail.com Fri Mar 5 19:23:46 2021 From: chrisgeankoplis at gmail.com (Chris Geankoplis) Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2021 19:23:46 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes Burgee Update In-Reply-To: <008401d711d7$e3359760$a9a0c620$@ebsmed.com> References: <1614894428456-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <008401d711d7$e3359760$a9a0c620$@ebsmed.com> Message-ID: Surely you jest, that would not be best. No goat, no boat,no things that float? Chris Geankoplis Enosis On Fri, Mar 5, 2021 at 10:55 AM Michael D. Weisner wrote: > The estate of Dr. Seuss has recalled all works that reference goats or > boats or things that float. > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of > Chris Geankoplis > Sent: Friday, March 5, 2021 10:08 AM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes Burgee Update > > I like the new design, I think it is quite fine. I?d like it on my boat > I?d like it on a goat. I think it would look nice on anything that would > float. > Ted Geisel (apologies to) > Eno-Seuss > > On Thu, Mar 4, 2021 at 4:47 PM Joe Dempsey wrote: > > > Okay, guys, I need your understanding (and sympathy). In talking with > > the flag shop, The Burgee Shoppe.com, our choice of design ran into a > > glitch and I think we should modify the design. The design that we > > voted on(first > > picture) had a white border on the perimeter of the blue triangle, > > showing a bit of blue on the edge. The maker says that the blue edge > > would have to be one half inch. This would impede on the rest of the > > flag and need to reduce the size of the "R22" logo/font. I sent them a > > quick modification that does two things: The original design with the > > white border looks smaller because the white border blends into the > > sky background and 2, actually makes the burgee stand out better. The > > woman on the phone said she actually liked it better. > > > > This is the only supplier I found that would let us order > > individually, but we have to give them a commitment of at least 25. In > > doing so, a setup fee is waived. They haven't said anything about a > > deposit (yet!) so we're counting on everybody to step it up. They have > > quoted us $24.00 per flag but I don't have shipping terms yet. > > > > We have commitments from List Members for 38 burgees so far. I notice > > that a number of you plan to purchase 2 burgees, as I do. I plan to > > frame one for my den. If anyone wants to increase their order, let me > > know. > > > > My question for The List: Does the new design meet with your approval? > > > > Please ONLY RESPOND if you DO NOT approve do not want the new design > > OR if you want to ADD AN ADDITIONAL BURGEE to your commitment. > > > > > > > > < > > http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/file/t752/Rhodes_22_Burgee_Tria > > ngle.jpg> > > > > > > > > > > ----- > > Joe Dempsey > > s/v Respite > > Rhodes 22 1989/2005 > > Deltaville,VA > > -- > > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > > > > From mweisner at ebsmed.com Sat Mar 6 09:12:07 2021 From: mweisner at ebsmed.com (Michael Weisner) Date: Sat, 06 Mar 2021 09:12:07 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] test of mailman - ignore message Message-ID: I am continuing to test the ability if the list manager to properly display emails generated on other platforms.Mikes/v Wind Lass ('91)Nissequogue River, NY -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mweisner at ebsmed.com Sat Mar 6 09:15:17 2021 From: mweisner at ebsmed.com (Michael Weisner) Date: Sat, 06 Mar 2021 09:15:17 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] test of mailman - ignore message Message-ID: I am continuing to test the ability if the list manager to properly display emails generated on other platforms.Mikes/v Wind Lass ('91)Nissequogue River, NY -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From Roger_Pihlaja at msn.com Sat Mar 6 09:45:23 2021 From: Roger_Pihlaja at msn.com (ROGER PIHLAJA) Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2021 14:45:23 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Bald Eagle/Canada Geese Standoff Message-ID: Hi All, Spring must be coming because the river in front of my house finally thawed and started flowing again a couple of days ago. Almost as soon as there was flowing water, a flock of Canada geese moved onto the sand bar about 80 yards from my beach. If you?ve spent any time around Canada geese, you know how territorial they can be. Today, an immature bald eagle landed on the sand bar about 50 feet away from the geese. The geese weren?t having any of that. They immediately surrounded the eagle on 3 sides. With its back up against the river, the eagle was in real trouble. The birds kept threatening each other for several minutes. But, it was a standoff and no one was giving ground. Then, another immature bald eagle landed next to the first eagle. Amazingly, the geese weren?t intimidated! They kept both eagles surrounded and all the birds were making threat displays and making lots of noise for several more minutes. Then, a third immature bald eagle landed next to the other two! Now, the Canada geese backed off. They executed an amazingly orderly retreat, keeping their eyes on the eagles the whole time. When the whole flock was in the water, they swam away, leaving the eagles in possession of the sand bar. The whole show probably lasted 15 minutes. I?ve never seen bald eagles work together like that. I thought they were solitary hunters. It was pretty cool! It was also exciting to see 3 immature bald eagles near my house. Roger Pihlaja S/V Dynamic Equilibrium Sent from Mail for Windows 10 From snstaum at gmail.com Sat Mar 6 10:21:18 2021 From: snstaum at gmail.com (Stephen Staum) Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2021 10:21:18 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes Burgee Update In-Reply-To: <1614894428456-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1614894428456-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: Put me down for one please. *Thanks and Stay Well,* *Stephen Staum* *s/v Carol Lee 2* *Needham, MA* On Thu, Mar 4, 2021 at 4:47 PM Joe Dempsey wrote: > Okay, guys, I need your understanding (and sympathy). In talking with the > flag shop, The Burgee Shoppe.com, our choice of design ran into a glitch > and > I think we should modify the design. The design that we voted on(first > picture) had a white border on the perimeter of the blue triangle, showing > a > bit of blue on the edge. The maker says that the blue edge would have to be > one half inch. This would impede on the rest of the flag and need to reduce > the size of the "R22" logo/font. I sent them a quick modification that does > two things: The original design with the white border looks smaller because > the white border blends into the sky background and 2, actually makes the > burgee stand out better. The woman on the phone said she actually liked it > better. > > This is the only supplier I found that would let us order individually, but > we have to give them a commitment of at least 25. In doing so, a setup fee > is waived. They haven't said anything about a deposit (yet!) so we're > counting on everybody to step it up. They have quoted us $24.00 per flag > but > I don't have shipping terms yet. > > We have commitments from List Members for 38 burgees so far. I notice that > a > number of you plan to purchase 2 burgees, as I do. I plan to frame one for > my den. If anyone wants to increase their order, let me know. > > My question for The List: Does the new design meet with your approval? > > Please ONLY RESPOND if you DO NOT approve do not want the new design OR if > you want to ADD AN ADDITIONAL BURGEE to your commitment. > > > > < > http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/file/t752/Rhodes_22_Burgee_Triangle.jpg> > > > > > ----- > Joe Dempsey > s/v Respite > Rhodes 22 1989/2005 > Deltaville,VA > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > From joedempsey at hughes.net Sat Mar 6 11:15:37 2021 From: joedempsey at hughes.net (Joe Dempsey) Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2021 09:15:37 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes Burgee Update In-Reply-To: References: <1614894428456-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <1615047337057-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Chris, it's nice you like design number two, it will look good on your boat and my boat too. Displayed on your boat or goat, on spreader or peak, you should be able to order sometime next week. ----- Joe Dempsey s/v Respite Rhodes 22 1989/2005 Deltaville,VA -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From joedempsey at hughes.net Sat Mar 6 11:28:51 2021 From: joedempsey at hughes.net (Joe Dempsey) Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2021 09:28:51 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Bald Eagle/Canada Geese Standoff In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1615048131470-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Facinating. Here in VA we've got Bald Eagles flying over the farm and flocks of Canadas as well, but never any confrontations. Where are the pictures, Roger? ----- Joe Dempsey s/v Respite Rhodes 22 1989/2005 Deltaville,VA -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From jesse.laten.shumaker at gmail.com Sat Mar 6 11:45:49 2021 From: jesse.laten.shumaker at gmail.com (Jesse Shumaker) Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2021 10:45:49 -0600 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Bald Eagle/Canada Geese Standoff In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Roger, thanks for sharing. You have an abundance of wildlife at your home! We have some bald eagles near where I live along the Missouri River, and we also have quite two different types of geese that like to spend time at nearby ponds. Like you said, the geese can be quite aggressive, but I've never seen them interact with an eagle. Your story made me think of the different groups of ducks at the lake where I sail. There's a group of mallards, a group of some diminutive breed (not sure what kind), and another rag tag bunch which is made up of all different types who banded together so they can hold their own. Some groups are more aggressive than others. Sailors at our lake have learned that if you feed the ducks, they will recognize you and wake you up in the morning by tapping on the hull with their beaks to let you know they are hungry. Jesse Shumaker S/V Zephyr On Sat, Mar 6, 2021 at 8:45 AM ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: > Hi All, > > Spring must be coming because the river in front of my house finally > thawed and started flowing again a couple of days ago. Almost as soon as > there was flowing water, a flock of Canada geese moved onto the sand bar > about 80 yards from my beach. If you?ve spent any time around Canada > geese, you know how territorial they can be. Today, an immature bald eagle > landed on the sand bar about 50 feet away from the geese. The geese > weren?t having any of that. They immediately surrounded the eagle on 3 > sides. With its back up against the river, the eagle was in real trouble. > The birds kept threatening each other for several minutes. But, it was a > standoff and no one was giving ground. Then, another immature bald eagle > landed next to the first eagle. Amazingly, the geese weren?t intimidated! > They kept both eagles surrounded and all the birds were making threat > displays and making lots of noise for several more minutes. Then, a third > immature bald eagle landed next to the other two! Now, the Canada geese > backed off. They executed an amazingly orderly retreat, keeping their eyes > on the eagles the whole time. When the whole flock was in the water, they > swam away, leaving the eagles in possession of the sand bar. The whole > show probably lasted 15 minutes. I?ve never seen bald eagles work together > like that. I thought they were solitary hunters. It was pretty cool! It > was also exciting to see 3 immature bald eagles near my house. > > Roger Pihlaja > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > Sent from Mail for > Windows 10 > > From mtroy at atlanticbb.net Sat Mar 6 13:35:26 2021 From: mtroy at atlanticbb.net (Mary Lou Troy) Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2021 13:35:26 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Bald Eagle/Canada Geese Standoff In-Reply-To: <1615048131470-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1615048131470-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: We have a lot of Bald Eagles and Canada Geese up our way on the Bay but I've never seen a confrontation between them. We've seen some magnificent aerial displays in the summer as Bald Eagles and Osprey fight over a fish. And carrion eaters that they are, we've seen Bad Eagles try to bully the Turkey Vultures and Black Vultures out or a roadkill in the field across the street from us after the corn or soybeans are cut in the fall. Didn't get any pictures though. Mary Lou ex R22 now Rosborough RF-246? Tara Rock Hall, MD On 3/6/2021 11:28 AM, Joe Dempsey wrote: > Facinating. Here in VA we've got Bald Eagles flying over the farm and flocks > of Canadas as well, but never any confrontations. Where are the pictures, > Roger? > > > > ----- > Joe Dempsey > s/v Respite > Rhodes 22 1989/2005 > Deltaville,VA > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ -- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus From ric at stottarchitecture.com Sat Mar 6 16:14:40 2021 From: ric at stottarchitecture.com (Richard Stott) Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2021 16:14:40 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Bald Eagle/Canada Geese Standoff In-Reply-To: References: <1615048131470-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <04D36770-FA0E-43D1-9B97-7DBCD3C7D041@stottarchitecture.com> Great Story Roger - enjoyed the read. I?m sharing it with my aviary friends outside da list Ric Dadventure Richard Stott, AIA, LEED AP www.stottarchitecture.com Office 631-283-1777 Cell 516-965-3164 > On Mar 6, 2021, at 1:35 PM, Mary Lou Troy wrote: > > We have a lot of Bald Eagles and Canada Geese up our way on the Bay but I've never seen a confrontation between them. We've seen some magnificent aerial displays in the summer as Bald Eagles and Osprey fight over a fish. And carrion eaters that they are, we've seen Bad Eagles try to bully the Turkey Vultures and Black Vultures out or a roadkill in the field across the street from us after the corn or soybeans are cut in the fall. Didn't get any pictures though. > > Mary Lou > ex R22 > now Rosborough RF-246 Tara > Rock Hall, MD > > On 3/6/2021 11:28 AM, Joe Dempsey wrote: >> Facinating. Here in VA we've got Bald Eagles flying over the farm and flocks >> of Canadas as well, but never any confrontations. Where are the pictures, >> Roger? >> >> >> >> ----- >> Joe Dempsey >> s/v Respite >> Rhodes 22 1989/2005 >> Deltaville,VA >> -- >> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > > > -- > This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. > https://www.avast.com/antivirus > From chitakcheung at gmail.com Sat Mar 6 17:08:50 2021 From: chitakcheung at gmail.com (Patrick Cheung) Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2021 17:08:50 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Compression Post Message-ID: Dear Rhodies, I am seeking advice from you all. The compression post is sinking approximately half an inch. I removed both floors in the main cabin and in the head area. Both plywood floors clearly sagged with the weight of mast and compression post resting on it. Sitting at the companion way one day, and staring at the mast and compression post, I noticed they don't line up, the compression post is about 2 inches to the starboard. Question 1: Does your mast and compression post line up? Question 2: Compression post is notched, 2/3 sitting on the head floor, 1/3 sitting on the main floor, and there's no support immediately under the compression post. Is it advisable to add support under the compression post, all the way down to the hull? Since I own the boat, the shrouds are always hand tightened. Thank you in advance for your advice, Chi Tak, Duck Lake Simcoe, Ontario From retiredtoby at gmail.com Sat Mar 6 17:31:28 2021 From: retiredtoby at gmail.com (Cary Tolbert) Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2021 17:31:28 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Compression Post In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Patrick, I have an 86. When I purchased the boat I knew I had to replace the head area decking. After I had pulled up the rotten flooring I noticed a block of what appeared to be made from black King Starboard material. I am guessing it was approximately 7 to 8 inch square and the depth was from the hull up to the deck that supported the post that supports the mast area. I also have the old version of the head with no door, just a Portable behind the galley bulkhead. I know not all Rhodes are alike once you get past the fiberglass. Other members can probably help out on some of your other questions. Cary Tolbert S/V Whisper '86 Radford, VA On Sat, Mar 6, 2021 at 5:08 PM Patrick Cheung wrote: > Dear Rhodies, > > I am seeking advice from you all. > > The compression post is sinking approximately half an inch. I removed both > floors in the main cabin and in the head area. Both plywood floors clearly > sagged with the weight of mast and compression post resting on it. Sitting > at the companion way one day, and staring at the mast and compression post, > I noticed they don't line up, the compression post is about 2 inches to the > starboard. > > Question 1: Does your mast and compression post line up? > > Question 2: Compression post is notched, 2/3 sitting on the head floor, 1/3 > sitting on the main floor, and there's no support immediately under the > compression post. Is it advisable to add support under the compression > post, all the way down to the hull? > > Since I own the boat, the shrouds are always hand tightened. > > Thank you in advance for your advice, > > Chi Tak, > Duck > Lake Simcoe, Ontario > From cjlowe at sssnet.com Sat Mar 6 18:55:06 2021 From: cjlowe at sssnet.com (cjlowe at sssnet.com) Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2021 18:55:06 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Bald Eagle/Canada Geese Standoff In-Reply-To: <04D36770-FA0E-43D1-9B97-7DBCD3C7D041@stottarchitecture.com> References: <1615048131470-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <04D36770-FA0E-43D1-9B97-7DBCD3C7D041@stottarchitecture.com> Message-ID: <52586.24.140.30.102.1615074906.squirrel@quickpop.sssnet.com> I'd just got to my boat and a bald eagle took a dive at a blue heron, that was on the opposite shore. When the eagle got about twenty feet from the heron, the heron dove in the water, to live to see another day. The eagle veered off in search of easier prey. When I was in Alaska, a game warden that was giving a presentation on eagles said that when an eagle picks up prey in its claws, they lock closed. They have to put the prey on a surface to release the lock on the claws. He said if a eagle tries to pick up a prey that he can't lift in the water, both usually die, the eagle drowns and the prey has to drag a dead eagle around the rest of its short life. > Great Story Roger - enjoyed the read. > I???m sharing it with my aviary friends outside da list > Ric > Dadventure > > Richard Stott, AIA, LEED AP > www.stottarchitecture.com > Office 631-283-1777 > Cell 516-965-3164 > > > > > >> On Mar 6, 2021, at 1:35 PM, Mary Lou Troy wrote: >> >> We have a lot of Bald Eagles and Canada Geese up our way on the Bay but >> I've never seen a confrontation between them. We've seen some >> magnificent aerial displays in the summer as Bald Eagles and Osprey >> fight over a fish. And carrion eaters that they are, we've seen Bad >> Eagles try to bully the Turkey Vultures and Black Vultures out or a >> roadkill in the field across the street from us after the corn or >> soybeans are cut in the fall. Didn't get any pictures though. >> >> Mary Lou >> ex R22 >> now Rosborough RF-246 Tara >> Rock Hall, MD >> >> On 3/6/2021 11:28 AM, Joe Dempsey wrote: >>> Facinating. Here in VA we've got Bald Eagles flying over the farm and >>> flocks >>> of Canadas as well, but never any confrontations. Where are the >>> pictures, >>> Roger? >>> >>> >>> >>> ----- >>> Joe Dempsey >>> s/v Respite >>> Rhodes 22 1989/2005 >>> Deltaville,VA >>> -- >>> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ >> >> >> -- >> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. >> https://www.avast.com/antivirus >> > > From peter at sunnybeeches.com Sat Mar 6 21:31:22 2021 From: peter at sunnybeeches.com (Peter Nyberg) Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2021 21:31:22 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Compression Post In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Patrick, I?m quite sure that my compression post is not directly under my mast. From recollection, I?d say it?s a couple of inches to port. There should definitely be support directly under the compression post all the way down to the keel. I?m pretty sure that when General Boats recycled my boat in 2016, all of the support structures under the floors were redone. All of the new support material was either fiberglass or pressure treated wood. I think experience has shown that untreated wood will not last in this application. I think the King Starboard material that Cary mentions would be a good choice as well. ?Peter > On Mar 6, 2021, at 5:08 PM, Patrick Cheung wrote: > > Dear Rhodies, > > I am seeking advice from you all. > > The compression post is sinking approximately half an inch. I removed both > floors in the main cabin and in the head area. Both plywood floors clearly > sagged with the weight of mast and compression post resting on it. Sitting > at the companion way one day, and staring at the mast and compression post, > I noticed they don't line up, the compression post is about 2 inches to the > starboard. > > Question 1: Does your mast and compression post line up? > > Question 2: Compression post is notched, 2/3 sitting on the head floor, 1/3 > sitting on the main floor, and there's no support immediately under the > compression post. Is it advisable to add support under the compression > post, all the way down to the hull? > > Since I own the boat, the shrouds are always hand tightened. > > Thank you in advance for your advice, > > Chi Tak, > Duck > Lake Simcoe, Ontario From gstewart8 at cogeco.ca Sat Mar 6 23:18:10 2021 From: gstewart8 at cogeco.ca (Graham Stewart) Date: Sat, 6 Mar 2021 23:18:10 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Compression Post In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <001301d71308$e3623810$aa26a830$@ca> Chi: 1. I have never noticed whether the mast and compression post are exactly lined up and with the mast down I can't check it, but unless you have reason to think the post was moved from its original position or there is some sign of damage to the deck I would not move it. 2, The floor on which the compression post stands should, I think, be supported right through to the hull - otherwise it will likely continue to sag. That small sag might not be a problem in terms of the bulkhead fitting properly so if the floor is still solid you might get away with supporting the floor and leaving the sag as is. Graham Stewart Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 Kingston Ontario -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf Of Patrick Cheung Sent: Saturday, March 6, 2021 5:09 PM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Compression Post Dear Rhodies, I am seeking advice from you all. The compression post is sinking approximately half an inch. I removed both floors in the main cabin and in the head area. Both plywood floors clearly sagged with the weight of mast and compression post resting on it. Sitting at the companion way one day, and staring at the mast and compression post, I noticed they don't line up, the compression post is about 2 inches to the starboard. Question 1: Does your mast and compression post line up? Question 2: Compression post is notched, 2/3 sitting on the head floor, 1/3 sitting on the main floor, and there's no support immediately under the compression post. Is it advisable to add support under the compression post, all the way down to the hull? Since I own the boat, the shrouds are always hand tightened. Thank you in advance for your advice, Chi Tak, Duck Lake Simcoe, Ontario From allynb at adsne.com Sun Mar 7 11:51:10 2021 From: allynb at adsne.com (Allyn Baskerville) Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2021 16:51:10 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Compression Post and Head Door Problems Message-ID: I got my boat out of the water yesterday, and the compression post fell out on the way to the dry slip. I took the wood off the compression post was resting on, and I was in for a surprise. It?s a box mostly made from PRESSED WOOD CHIPS filled with concrete. It?s resting in a fiberglass channel. The center most board provides the bulk of the support, but it wasn?t installed correctly. The front is about 1/4? short of where it should be, and the back is about 1? too low. The concrete is actually covered for about an inch with a mixture that is a bit gooey, hard, and rough. Concrete underneath. The plywood on the right is not marine or exterior - it?s the same as what my cabin is made of. I can see significant water damage on most of the wood. Unfortunately, I have to chip out the concrete to get the screws out and hopefully lift the box out. Anyone have a better idea than just chipping it out? I don?t want to damage the fiberglass. Thanks, all. [cid:C4C840CE-9F94-4812-A11D-205FF2668004] [cid:0679DFCE-E64D-4D47-BBFC-31B4C130F4EA] Sent from my iPhone -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: IMG_1909.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 125931 bytes Desc: IMG_1909.jpg URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: IMG_1912.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 86938 bytes Desc: IMG_1912.jpg URL: From allynb at adsne.com Sun Mar 7 14:05:02 2021 From: allynb at adsne.com (Allyn Baskerville) Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2021 19:05:02 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Compression Post In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Patrick, I?m working in the same area as you are. Q1: I have a 2003, and the mast and compression post are offset as you describe. I?m considering making a compression post that extends to under the mast. Q2: I don?t follow what you say about the notch. Look at my post from earlier today, and they are three pieces of wood that form a box partially filled with concrete to support the compression post. The center piece in is immediately under the compression post but wasn?t mounted correctly (too low) to support the weight of the mast. With no support under the compression post, the plywood decking sagged and started cracking. There needs to be support under the compression post. The OSB (!) wood in my support is not treated in any way. Sent from my iPhone > On Mar 6, 2021, at 4:08 PM, Patrick Cheung wrote: > > ?Dear Rhodies, > > I am seeking advice from you all. > > The compression post is sinking approximately half an inch. I removed both > floors in the main cabin and in the head area. Both plywood floors clearly > sagged with the weight of mast and compression post resting on it. Sitting > at the companion way one day, and staring at the mast and compression post, > I noticed they don't line up, the compression post is about 2 inches to the > starboard. > > Question 1: Does your mast and compression post line up? > > Question 2: Compression post is notched, 2/3 sitting on the head floor, 1/3 > sitting on the main floor, and there's no support immediately under the > compression post. Is it advisable to add support under the compression > post, all the way down to the hull? > > Since I own the boat, the shrouds are always hand tightened. > > Thank you in advance for your advice, > > Chi Tak, > Duck > Lake Simcoe, Ontario From chitakcheung at gmail.com Sun Mar 7 15:50:03 2021 From: chitakcheung at gmail.com (Patrick Cheung) Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2021 15:50:03 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Compression Post In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Thanks to all ye Rhodes for your fine advice. I appreciate you all taking time to advise. Allyn, I am going to leave my mast and compression post offset, it was good for 36 years and it will be good for many more years to come. My head floor is about 3 inches higher than the cabin floor. The compression post straddles both floors, 2/3 on the higher head floor, 1/3 on the cabin floor. I have fresh air immediately underneath the compression post, and the sagged decking. I am going to attach a picture, hopefully successful. I am going to take all the advice, adding vertical support all the way down to the hull. I may lower the head floor to match the cabin floor, inspired by Peter. Allyn, you have a unique situation. The concrete may be for ballast as well. I will be scared to blast the concrete away. I probably will build up from the concrete to support the head floor and the compression post. The OSB was probably for forming the concrete. But stay turned for other fine advice. patrick On Sun, Mar 7, 2021 at 2:05 PM Allyn Baskerville wrote: > Patrick, I?m working in the same area as you are. > > Q1: I have a 2003, and the mast and compression post are offset as you > describe. I?m considering making a compression post that extends to under > the mast. > > Q2: I don?t follow what you say about the notch. Look at my post from > earlier today, and they are three pieces of wood that form a box partially > filled with concrete to support the compression post. The center piece in > is immediately under the compression post but wasn?t mounted correctly (too > low) to support the weight of the mast. With no support under the > compression post, the plywood decking sagged and started cracking. There > needs to be support under the compression post. The OSB (!) wood in my > support is not treated in any way. > > Sent from my iPhone > > > On Mar 6, 2021, at 4:08 PM, Patrick Cheung > wrote: > > > > ?Dear Rhodies, > > > > I am seeking advice from you all. > > > > The compression post is sinking approximately half an inch. I removed > both > > floors in the main cabin and in the head area. Both plywood floors > clearly > > sagged with the weight of mast and compression post resting on it. > Sitting > > at the companion way one day, and staring at the mast and compression > post, > > I noticed they don't line up, the compression post is about 2 inches to > the > > starboard. > > > > Question 1: Does your mast and compression post line up? > > > > Question 2: Compression post is notched, 2/3 sitting on the head floor, > 1/3 > > sitting on the main floor, and there's no support immediately under the > > compression post. Is it advisable to add support under the compression > > post, all the way down to the hull? > > > > Since I own the boat, the shrouds are always hand tightened. > > > > Thank you in advance for your advice, > > > > Chi Tak, > > Duck > > Lake Simcoe, Ontario > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: CompressionPost.jpeg Type: image/jpeg Size: 2792756 bytes Desc: not available URL: From tom.vanheule at intrinsicprograms.com Sun Mar 7 15:50:04 2021 From: tom.vanheule at intrinsicprograms.com (Tom Van Heule) Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2021 14:50:04 -0600 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Compression Post In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Wasaybe it appearing.too lose because you had the mast off? On Sun, Mar 7, 2021, 1:05 PM Allyn Baskerville wrote: > Patrick, I?m working in the same area as you are. > > Q1: I have a 2003, and the mast and compression post are offset as you > describe. I?m considering making a compression post that extends to under > the mast. > > Q2: I don?t follow what you say about the notch. Look at my post from > earlier today, and they are three pieces of wood that form a box partially > filled with concrete to support the compression post. The center piece in > is immediately under the compression post but wasn?t mounted correctly (too > low) to support the weight of the mast. With no support under the > compression post, the plywood decking sagged and started cracking. There > needs to be support under the compression post. The OSB (!) wood in my > support is not treated in any way. > > Sent from my iPhone > > > On Mar 6, 2021, at 4:08 PM, Patrick Cheung > wrote: > > > > ?Dear Rhodies, > > > > I am seeking advice from you all. > > > > The compression post is sinking approximately half an inch. I removed > both > > floors in the main cabin and in the head area. Both plywood floors > clearly > > sagged with the weight of mast and compression post resting on it. > Sitting > > at the companion way one day, and staring at the mast and compression > post, > > I noticed they don't line up, the compression post is about 2 inches to > the > > starboard. > > > > Question 1: Does your mast and compression post line up? > > > > Question 2: Compression post is notched, 2/3 sitting on the head floor, > 1/3 > > sitting on the main floor, and there's no support immediately under the > > compression post. Is it advisable to add support under the compression > > post, all the way down to the hull? > > > > Since I own the boat, the shrouds are always hand tightened. > > > > Thank you in advance for your advice, > > > > Chi Tak, > > Duck > > Lake Simcoe, Ontario > From allynb at adsne.com Sun Mar 7 18:05:18 2021 From: allynb at adsne.com (Allyn Baskerville) Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2021 23:05:18 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Compression Post In-Reply-To: References: , Message-ID: Granted, taking the mask off certainly lighten up the weight on the compression post, but the floor under the compression post had sagged so much there is a significant gap between the top of the compression post and cabin ceiling. Sent from my iPhone > On Mar 7, 2021, at 2:50 PM, Tom Van Heule wrote: > > ?Wasaybe it appearing.too lose because you had the mast off? > >> On Sun, Mar 7, 2021, 1:05 PM Allyn Baskerville wrote: >> >> Patrick, I?m working in the same area as you are. >> >> Q1: I have a 2003, and the mast and compression post are offset as you >> describe. I?m considering making a compression post that extends to under >> the mast. >> >> Q2: I don?t follow what you say about the notch. Look at my post from >> earlier today, and they are three pieces of wood that form a box partially >> filled with concrete to support the compression post. The center piece in >> is immediately under the compression post but wasn?t mounted correctly (too >> low) to support the weight of the mast. With no support under the >> compression post, the plywood decking sagged and started cracking. There >> needs to be support under the compression post. The OSB (!) wood in my >> support is not treated in any way. >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >>> On Mar 6, 2021, at 4:08 PM, Patrick Cheung >> wrote: >>> >>> ?Dear Rhodies, >>> >>> I am seeking advice from you all. >>> >>> The compression post is sinking approximately half an inch. I removed >> both >>> floors in the main cabin and in the head area. Both plywood floors >> clearly >>> sagged with the weight of mast and compression post resting on it. >> Sitting >>> at the companion way one day, and staring at the mast and compression >> post, >>> I noticed they don't line up, the compression post is about 2 inches to >> the >>> starboard. >>> >>> Question 1: Does your mast and compression post line up? >>> >>> Question 2: Compression post is notched, 2/3 sitting on the head floor, >> 1/3 >>> sitting on the main floor, and there's no support immediately under the >>> compression post. Is it advisable to add support under the compression >>> post, all the way down to the hull? >>> >>> Since I own the boat, the shrouds are always hand tightened. >>> >>> Thank you in advance for your advice, >>> >>> Chi Tak, >>> Duck >>> Lake Simcoe, Ontario >> From allynb at adsne.com Sun Mar 7 18:06:47 2021 From: allynb at adsne.com (Allyn Baskerville) Date: Sun, 7 Mar 2021 23:06:47 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Compression Post In-Reply-To: References: , Message-ID: <78463FC7-E54C-414C-9FAB-29A0AEA76C30@adsne.com> Patrick, I think you hit the nail on the head. Thank you, and I will take your advice on this. Sent from my iPhone > On Mar 7, 2021, at 2:50 PM, Patrick Cheung wrote: > > ?Thanks to all ye Rhodes for your fine advice. I appreciate you all taking > time to advise. > > Allyn, I am going to leave my mast and compression post offset, it was good > for 36 years and it will be good for many more years to come. > > My head floor is about 3 inches higher than the cabin floor. The > compression post straddles both floors, 2/3 on the higher head floor, 1/3 > on the cabin floor. I have fresh air immediately underneath the compression > post, and the sagged decking. > I am going to attach a picture, hopefully successful. I am going to take > all the advice, adding vertical support all the way down to the hull. > > I may lower the head floor to match the cabin floor, inspired by Peter. > > Allyn, you have a unique situation. The concrete may be for ballast as > well. I will be scared to blast the concrete away. I probably will build up > from the concrete to support the head floor and the compression post. The > OSB was probably for forming the concrete. But stay turned for other fine > advice. > > patrick > > > >> On Sun, Mar 7, 2021 at 2:05 PM Allyn Baskerville wrote: >> >> Patrick, I?m working in the same area as you are. >> >> Q1: I have a 2003, and the mast and compression post are offset as you >> describe. I?m considering making a compression post that extends to under >> the mast. >> >> Q2: I don?t follow what you say about the notch. Look at my post from >> earlier today, and they are three pieces of wood that form a box partially >> filled with concrete to support the compression post. The center piece in >> is immediately under the compression post but wasn?t mounted correctly (too >> low) to support the weight of the mast. With no support under the >> compression post, the plywood decking sagged and started cracking. There >> needs to be support under the compression post. The OSB (!) wood in my >> support is not treated in any way. >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >>> On Mar 6, 2021, at 4:08 PM, Patrick Cheung >> wrote: >>> >>> ?Dear Rhodies, >>> >>> I am seeking advice from you all. >>> >>> The compression post is sinking approximately half an inch. I removed >> both >>> floors in the main cabin and in the head area. Both plywood floors >> clearly >>> sagged with the weight of mast and compression post resting on it. >> Sitting >>> at the companion way one day, and staring at the mast and compression >> post, >>> I noticed they don't line up, the compression post is about 2 inches to >> the >>> starboard. >>> >>> Question 1: Does your mast and compression post line up? >>> >>> Question 2: Compression post is notched, 2/3 sitting on the head floor, >> 1/3 >>> sitting on the main floor, and there's no support immediately under the >>> compression post. Is it advisable to add support under the compression >>> post, all the way down to the hull? >>> >>> Since I own the boat, the shrouds are always hand tightened. >>> >>> Thank you in advance for your advice, >>> >>> Chi Tak, >>> Duck >>> Lake Simcoe, Ontario >> > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: CompressionPost.jpeg > Type: image/jpeg > Size: 2792756 bytes > Desc: not available > URL: From gstewart8 at cogeco.ca Mon Mar 8 10:09:34 2021 From: gstewart8 at cogeco.ca (Graham Stewart) Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2021 10:09:34 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Compression Post In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <001c01d7142d$0dfb0f00$29f12d00$@ca> Patrick: Your compression post with the notch is the same as mine. The part that extends down is only intended to provide a place to secure it with a screw. On my boat this part of the post does not touch the main cabin floorboards and in my opinion should not touch it. I can't tell from yhe photo if they touch in your case. You want all of the weight on the larger part of the post's base. I would not move the post for the very reasons you articulate. Graham Stewart gstewart8 at cogeco.ca -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf Of Patrick Cheung Sent: Sunday, March 7, 2021 3:50 PM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Compression Post Thanks to all ye Rhodes for your fine advice. I appreciate you all taking time to advise. Allyn, I am going to leave my mast and compression post offset, it was good for 36 years and it will be good for many more years to come. My head floor is about 3 inches higher than the cabin floor. The compression post straddles both floors, 2/3 on the higher head floor, 1/3 on the cabin floor. I have fresh air immediately underneath the compression post, and the sagged decking. I am going to attach a picture, hopefully successful. I am going to take all the advice, adding vertical support all the way down to the hull. I may lower the head floor to match the cabin floor, inspired by Peter. Allyn, you have a unique situation. The concrete may be for ballast as well. I will be scared to blast the concrete away. I probably will build up from the concrete to support the head floor and the compression post. The OSB was probably for forming the concrete. But stay turned for other fine advice. patrick On Sun, Mar 7, 2021 at 2:05 PM Allyn Baskerville wrote: > Patrick, I?m working in the same area as you are. > > Q1: I have a 2003, and the mast and compression post are offset as you > describe. I?m considering making a compression post that extends to under > the mast. > > Q2: I don?t follow what you say about the notch. Look at my post from > earlier today, and they are three pieces of wood that form a box partially > filled with concrete to support the compression post. The center piece in > is immediately under the compression post but wasn?t mounted correctly (too > low) to support the weight of the mast. With no support under the > compression post, the plywood decking sagged and started cracking. There > needs to be support under the compression post. The OSB (!) wood in my > support is not treated in any way. > > Sent from my iPhone > > > On Mar 6, 2021, at 4:08 PM, Patrick Cheung > wrote: > > > > ?Dear Rhodies, > > > > I am seeking advice from you all. > > > > The compression post is sinking approximately half an inch. I removed > both > > floors in the main cabin and in the head area. Both plywood floors > clearly > > sagged with the weight of mast and compression post resting on it. > Sitting > > at the companion way one day, and staring at the mast and compression > post, > > I noticed they don't line up, the compression post is about 2 inches to > the > > starboard. > > > > Question 1: Does your mast and compression post line up? > > > > Question 2: Compression post is notched, 2/3 sitting on the head floor, > 1/3 > > sitting on the main floor, and there's no support immediately under the > > compression post. Is it advisable to add support under the compression > > post, all the way down to the hull? > > > > Since I own the boat, the shrouds are always hand tightened. > > > > Thank you in advance for your advice, > > > > Chi Tak, > > Duck > > Lake Simcoe, Ontario > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: CompressionPost.jpeg Type: image/jpeg Size: 2792756 bytes Desc: not available URL: From gstewart8 at cogeco.ca Mon Mar 8 10:24:57 2021 From: gstewart8 at cogeco.ca (Graham Stewart) Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2021 10:24:57 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Compression Post and Head Door Problems In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <001d01d7142f$34043b70$9c0cb250$@ca> Allyn: I suspect the the compression post is not too short - unless someone shortened it. More likely it appears to be short because the floor under the post has given way. What is giving support to the post under the floor appears to vary considerably from boat to boat. If you do whatever works to support the post with something that is solid and will not deteriorate I think you will be fine. In some the concrete is part of the ballast so I would be reluctant to remove it unless it is breaking up. If possible use pressure-treated or epoxy-coated wood to fill the gap between the solid cement base to the bottom of the floor boards - which might need to be replaced to make them flat and at the correct height. You can check to see whether doing so makes the post fit. It is also possible that some previous owner removed the post with the mast up and had to shorten it to get it back in place. That would be a really dumb thing to do but not something so dumb I might have done it. If the post is still short you might shim it to be snug or replace it altogether. Graham Stewart Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 Kingston Ontario -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf Of Allyn Baskerville Sent: Sunday, March 7, 2021 11:51 AM To: rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Compression Post and Head Door Problems I got my boat out of the water yesterday, and the compression post fell out on the way to the dry slip. I took the wood off the compression post was resting on, and I was in for a surprise. It?s a box mostly made from PRESSED WOOD CHIPS filled with concrete. It?s resting in a fiberglass channel. The center most board provides the bulk of the support, but it wasn?t installed correctly. The front is about 1/4? short of where it should be, and the back is about 1? too low. The concrete is actually covered for about an inch with a mixture that is a bit gooey, hard, and rough. Concrete underneath. The plywood on the right is not marine or exterior - it?s the same as what my cabin is made of. I can see significant water damage on most of the wood. Unfortunately, I have to chip out the concrete to get the screws out and hopefully lift the box out. Anyone have a better idea than just chipping it out? I don?t want to damage the fiberglass. Thanks, all. [cid:C4C840CE-9F94-4812-A11D-205FF2668004] [cid:0679DFCE-E64D-4D47-BBFC-31B4C130F4EA] Sent from my iPhone -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: IMG_1909.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 125931 bytes Desc: IMG_1909.jpg URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: IMG_1912.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 86938 bytes Desc: IMG_1912.jpg URL: From chitakcheung at gmail.com Mon Mar 8 12:01:58 2021 From: chitakcheung at gmail.com (Patrick Cheung) Date: Mon, 8 Mar 2021 12:01:58 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Compression Post In-Reply-To: <001c01d7142d$0dfb0f00$29f12d00$@ca> References: <001c01d7142d$0dfb0f00$29f12d00$@ca> Message-ID: Thanks Graham, I will make sure the larger surface takes all the weight. Previously, both head deck and cabin deck sagged, weight eventually got onto both decs. patrick On Mon, Mar 8, 2021 at 10:09 AM Graham Stewart wrote: > Patrick: > > Your compression post with the notch is the same as mine. The part that > extends down is only intended to provide a place to secure it with a screw. > On my boat this part of the post does not touch the main cabin floorboards > and in my opinion should not touch it. I can't tell from yhe photo if they > touch in your case. You want all of the weight on the larger part of the > post's base. > > I would not move the post for the very reasons you articulate. > > Graham Stewart > gstewart8 at cogeco.ca > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf > Of Patrick Cheung > Sent: Sunday, March 7, 2021 3:50 PM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Compression Post > > Thanks to all ye Rhodes for your fine advice. I appreciate you all taking > time to advise. > > Allyn, I am going to leave my mast and compression post offset, it was good > for 36 years and it will be good for many more years to come. > > My head floor is about 3 inches higher than the cabin floor. The > compression post straddles both floors, 2/3 on the higher head floor, 1/3 > on the cabin floor. I have fresh air immediately underneath the compression > post, and the sagged decking. > I am going to attach a picture, hopefully successful. I am going to take > all the advice, adding vertical support all the way down to the hull. > > I may lower the head floor to match the cabin floor, inspired by Peter. > > Allyn, you have a unique situation. The concrete may be for ballast as > well. I will be scared to blast the concrete away. I probably will build up > from the concrete to support the head floor and the compression post. The > OSB was probably for forming the concrete. But stay turned for other fine > advice. > > patrick > > > > On Sun, Mar 7, 2021 at 2:05 PM Allyn Baskerville wrote: > > > Patrick, I?m working in the same area as you are. > > > > Q1: I have a 2003, and the mast and compression post are offset as you > > describe. I?m considering making a compression post that extends to under > > the mast. > > > > Q2: I don?t follow what you say about the notch. Look at my post from > > earlier today, and they are three pieces of wood that form a box > partially > > filled with concrete to support the compression post. The center piece in > > is immediately under the compression post but wasn?t mounted correctly > (too > > low) to support the weight of the mast. With no support under the > > compression post, the plywood decking sagged and started cracking. There > > needs to be support under the compression post. The OSB (!) wood in my > > support is not treated in any way. > > > > Sent from my iPhone > > > > > On Mar 6, 2021, at 4:08 PM, Patrick Cheung > > wrote: > > > > > > ?Dear Rhodies, > > > > > > I am seeking advice from you all. > > > > > > The compression post is sinking approximately half an inch. I removed > > both > > > floors in the main cabin and in the head area. Both plywood floors > > clearly > > > sagged with the weight of mast and compression post resting on it. > > Sitting > > > at the companion way one day, and staring at the mast and compression > > post, > > > I noticed they don't line up, the compression post is about 2 inches to > > the > > > starboard. > > > > > > Question 1: Does your mast and compression post line up? > > > > > > Question 2: Compression post is notched, 2/3 sitting on the head floor, > > 1/3 > > > sitting on the main floor, and there's no support immediately under the > > > compression post. Is it advisable to add support under the compression > > > post, all the way down to the hull? > > > > > > Since I own the boat, the shrouds are always hand tightened. > > > > > > Thank you in advance for your advice, > > > > > > Chi Tak, > > > Duck > > > Lake Simcoe, Ontario > > > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: CompressionPost.jpeg > Type: image/jpeg > Size: 2792756 bytes > Desc: not available > URL: < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210307/6abe9ba7/attachment.jpeg > > > > From sea20 at verizon.net Tue Mar 9 08:44:24 2021 From: sea20 at verizon.net (sea20 at verizon.net) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2021 13:44:24 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] mooring References: <23869787.1669574.1615297464618.ref@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <23869787.1669574.1615297464618@mail.yahoo.com> Greetings all,? ? I will likely be on a waiting list for a slip next season and will be on a mooring. I have a couple questions regarding painter and pendant attachment. I read MJM"s email regarding use of the bow eye with chocks. Is the any reason not to add a second bow eye? Also, is there a recomended pendant or painter length? Thanks everyone. Scott AndrewsFirst year owner, Wilmington De From mweisner at ebsmed.com Tue Mar 9 10:31:00 2021 From: mweisner at ebsmed.com (Michael Weisner) Date: Tue, 09 Mar 2021 10:31:00 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] mooring In-Reply-To: <23869787.1669574.1615297464618@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Scott,There have been many lively discussions about using the bow eye for mooring. One of the more recent (April 2020) is available at:http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/2020-April/084538.htmlMikes/v Wind Lass ('91)Nissequogue River, NY -------- Original message --------From: Scott E Andrews via Rhodes22-list Date: 3/9/21 8:44 AM (GMT-05:00) To: rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org Subject: [Rhodes22-list] mooring Greetings all,? ? I will likely be on a waiting list for a slip next season and will be on a mooring. I have a couple questions regarding painter and pendant attachment. I read MJM"s email regarding use of the bow eye with chocks. Is the any reason not to add a second bow eye? Also, is there a recomended pendant or painter length? Thanks everyone.Scott AndrewsFirst year owner, Wilmington De From peter at sunnybeeches.com Tue Mar 9 10:57:26 2021 From: peter at sunnybeeches.com (Peter Nyberg) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2021 10:57:26 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] mooring In-Reply-To: <23869787.1669574.1615297464618@mail.yahoo.com> References: <23869787.1669574.1615297464618.ref@mail.yahoo.com> <23869787.1669574.1615297464618@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Scott, I?m not sure what you?re asking, and it may be a terminology issue. Is it possible that when you say ?bow eye? you mean ?bow cleat?? The bow cleat would be attached to the deck, where as the bow eye is attached to the stem of the hull. You could in theory attach your mooring to the bow eye, but I can?t see why you would want a second one. Adding one or two more cleats at the bow is a pretty common project. You would want it through-bolted, and you would want to avoid any possibility of water finding it?s way into the deck core. I?d recommend a drill-fill-drill approach. If you don?t know what that is, I can elaborate. ?Peter > On Mar 9, 2021, at 8:44 AM, Scott E Andrews via Rhodes22-list wrote: > > Greetings all, I will likely be on a waiting list for a slip next season and will be on a mooring. I have a couple questions regarding painter and pendant attachment. I read MJM"s email regarding use of the bow eye with chocks. Is the any reason not to add a second bow eye? Also, is there a recomended pendant or painter length? Thanks everyone. > Scott AndrewsFirst year owner, Wilmington De From reuben.mezrich at gmail.com Tue Mar 9 11:25:07 2021 From: reuben.mezrich at gmail.com (Reuben Mezrich) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2021 11:25:07 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first In-Reply-To: <54709.24.140.30.102.1614707391.squirrel@quickpop.sssnet.com> References: <1613761250989-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <408F9401-E24B-4554-826E-DD98BFC0E1F3@stottarchitecture.com> <1614623625839-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <005601d70ed3$6283eba0$278bc2e0$@ebsmed.com> <916d9b93-9604-8b3a-c9d5-5c84c1acadb8@generalboats.com> <007501d70ee8$6edeb690$4c9c23b0$@ebsmed.com> <54709.24.140.30.102.1614707391.squirrel@quickpop.sssnet.com> Message-ID: After receiving the many excellent suggestions on where to look for leaks I started what ended being a 1 week process to find and ultimately repair the leak. I first removed the cosmetic wood trim inside the forward cabin at the bow to expose the attachments of the Jib chainplate and the Bow eye. I sprayed water at the bow and determined these were not the source of the leaks. I then sprayed water on the foredeck and initially saw no water leaking into the boat but when I came back to the boat the next morning found that some water (about 1 - 2 cups) had collected at the bow (By now I had removed the cushions and so could see the water in a puddle on the floor of the forward bunk at the bow). I had some sort of a slow leak. I then had my wife spray water on the foredeck while I was on my back in the forecabin and was able to see that there were leaks at each of the four legs of the pulpit. The leaks would drip onto the carpeted shelf that is at each side of the forecabin (behind a white fiberglass trim piece) and then the water would slowly make its way forward to trickle down at the bow end of the forecabin. The pulpit is attached by 3/8" bolts that are welded to each of the legs and which extend down through holes in the deck and fastened with a flat washer, lock washer and 9/16" nut. After unfastening the nuts the pulpit lifted up easily. One complication is that the electrical wires that feed the navigation lights at the bow extend through a seperate hole just forward of the hole for the aft-starboard bolt. That wire seems to run back to the distribution panel and has very little slack and so I had to cut it. When I did remove the pulpit I found there was some white sealant that adhered to the deck but not the pulpit leg (which ends in an oval flange at the bottom) as well as an O-ring around the base of the bolt. After consulting with Stan, who told me that his preferred method for keeping water out is to just use an O-ring around the nut (and not to apply sealant), I cleaned off the old sealant (a product called ReMov which was recommended in a Practical Sailor review, worked great for this) I put new O-rings on. Rather than putting an O-ring around the electric wire near the aft-starboard leg I put some wraps of butyl rubber tape abound it. I reattached the pulpit, tightened the nuts and had my wife spray the foredeck again and sadly found that there was again a leak (perhaps even worse than before) at each leg - but not where the electric wire entered the cabin. I removed the pulpit again, removed the o_rings and this time used Butyl tape to form the seal at each leg. Using a technique I found on You Tube I cut a 3 - 4 inch length of the tape, rolled the tape along its length into a tube (or rope) and then wrapped it several times about the base of the bolt. The thickness can be adjusted by adding more or less wraps and I was generous, using the entire 3 - 4 inch tape at each leg. I added more Butyl to the electric wire. After putting the pulpit back in place and only moderately tightening the nuts, my wife sprayed the foredeck again and this time - success - no leaks!! I have become a big fan of Butyl rubber tape, which to be honest I hadn't even heard about till last week! Of course now I have to splice back the electric wire for the navigation light and replace the cosmetic wood trim I removed, but I am much relieved that this problem is solved Thanks for your advice and support --Reuben Reuben Mezrich Pelican Cove in Sarasota Cell: 410-499-8922 On Tue, Mar 2, 2021 at 12:49 PM wrote: > I like to tape paper towels around the suspected areas and see which ones > show moisture first, then investigate further from there . > > > Jerry Lowe > S/V Country Rhodes '86 > > > > > > > Roger, Rob and Mike > > Thanks for the good suggestions. I'll start by taking off that > cosmeticsus > > piece of wood at the bow and see what's behind. If nothing is loose I"ll > > have someone aim a hose at the bow while I"m inside watching in the hope > > that I might actually see where the water is getting in. > > I really do hope I don't have to rebed everything. > > Probably won't be able to do this till the weekend..I"ll report back on > > what I find > > > > Reuben Mezrich > > Pelican Cove in Sarasota > > Cell: 410-499-8922 > > > > > > On Mon, Mar 1, 2021 at 5:15 PM Michael D. Weisner > > wrote: > > > >> Reuben, > >> > >> I would check the bow eye. The wood backing block usually rots and the > >> eye > >> loosens up. Sometimes just lifting the boat using the bow eye will cause > >> the eye to loosen as the wood compresses. > >> > >> Also, you may want to re-bed the bow pulpit rail deck fittings, chocks, > >> etc. > >> > >> Mike > >> s/v Wind Lass ('91) > >> Nissequogue River, NY > >> I?d rather be sailing :~) > >> > >> -----Original Message----- > >> From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of > >> Reuben Mezrich > >> Sent: Monday, March 1, 2021 4:08 PM > >> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > >> Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first > >> > >> As I mentioned a week or two ago, I installed a Marinco 3" Day/night > >> solar > >> vent at the bow, using the hole already in place for the anchor locker. > >> It > >> installed easily, seemed to work fine but a few days later we had a > >> heavy > >> rain and the next day the forward tips of the forward cabin cushions > >> were > >> wet. I removed the vent, replaced the deck plate, installed a new gasket > >> under the deck plate, applied a generous amount of RTV silicone to both > >> sides of the gasket and reinstalled the solar vent. The next day > >> (yesterday > >> actually) I used a hose to rain water on the forward deck, aiming at the > >> solar vent for about 6 minutes and when I checked below everything was > >> dry. > >> I checked again in an hour and it was still dry. > >> This morning there was about a cup of water, maybe two cups of water at > >> the bow. There was no water in the tray that serves as the anchor locker > >> and which is directly under the solar vent. The vent itself was dry as > >> was > >> the ceiling around the vent. The walls were also dry. I dried the water > >> with a towel and a few hours later a small amount of water seemed to be > >> seeping under a triangular piece of wood at the very bow of the boat > >> (see > >> attached photo). I haven't removed that piece of wood yet but I'm pretty > >> sure I'll find the bolts from the chain plate at the bow for the jib > >> stay. > >> My feeling now is that the solar vent was never the source of the leak > >> but > >> I've had a small leak for a while but never noticed because I never had > >> a > >> reason to go up to the very front of the forward cabin. As it turns out > >> the > >> bottom of the cushions, which are rubberized are stained, giving > >> evidence > >> that the leak is likely long standing. > >> Those bolts would be my best guess as the source of the leak but I'd > >> look > >> forward to suggestions as to where else I might look. > >> > >> Its always something > >> > >> --Reuben > >> > >> > >> Reuben Mezrich > >> Pelican Cove in Sarasota > >> Cell: 410-499-8922 > >> > >> > > >> > > >> -------------- next part -------------- > >> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > >> Name: Screen Shot 2021-03-01 at 4.02.36 PM.png > >> Type: image/png > >> Size: 1826288 bytes > >> Desc: not available > >> URL: < > >> > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210301/6a1cf705/attachment.png > >> > > >> > >> > > > > > From gstewart8 at cogeco.ca Tue Mar 9 11:42:00 2021 From: gstewart8 at cogeco.ca (Graham Stewart) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2021 11:42:00 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first In-Reply-To: References: <1613761250989-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <408F9401-E24B-4554-826E-DD98BFC0E1F3@stottarchitecture.com> <1614623625839-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <005601d70ed3$6283eba0$278bc2e0$@ebsmed.com> <916d9b93-9604-8b3a-c9d5-5c84c1acadb8@generalboats.com> <007501d70ee8$6edeb690$4c9c23b0$@ebsmed.com> <54709.24.140.30.102.1614707391.squirrel@quickpop.sssnet.com> Message-ID: <009001d71503$2219f290$664dd7b0$@ca> I love butyl tape and use it everywhere that does not require adhesive properties or below the waterline. It seals beautifully and also allows the removal of the hardware easily. BTW, to clean up squeeze out you can get most of it off by using a small ball of butyl that will stick to the squeeze out and lift most of it. The remaining bits can be cleaned up easily with turpentine. You may find that the squeeze out will continue to flow for a very long time. Did you consider whether there might have been any damage to the core oy your deck from the water? I would be concerned about that especially if the core is wood. Graham Stewart gstewart8 at cogeco.ca -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf Of Reuben Mezrich Sent: Tuesday, March 9, 2021 11:25 AM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first After receiving the many excellent suggestions on where to look for leaks I started what ended being a 1 week process to find and ultimately repair the leak. I first removed the cosmetic wood trim inside the forward cabin at the bow to expose the attachments of the Jib chainplate and the Bow eye. I sprayed water at the bow and determined these were not the source of the leaks. I then sprayed water on the foredeck and initially saw no water leaking into the boat but when I came back to the boat the next morning found that some water (about 1 - 2 cups) had collected at the bow (By now I had removed the cushions and so could see the water in a puddle on the floor of the forward bunk at the bow). I had some sort of a slow leak. I then had my wife spray water on the foredeck while I was on my back in the forecabin and was able to see that there were leaks at each of the four legs of the pulpit. The leaks would drip onto the carpeted shelf that is at each side of the forecabin (behind a white fiberglass trim piece) and then the water would slowly make its way forward to trickle down at the bow end of the forecabin. The pulpit is attached by 3/8" bolts that are welded to each of the legs and which extend down through holes in the deck and fastened with a flat washer, lock washer and 9/16" nut. After unfastening the nuts the pulpit lifted up easily. One complication is that the electrical wires that feed the navigation lights at the bow extend through a seperate hole just forward of the hole for the aft-starboard bolt. That wire seems to run back to the distribution panel and has very little slack and so I had to cut it. When I did remove the pulpit I found there was some white sealant that adhered to the deck but not the pulpit leg (which ends in an oval flange at the bottom) as well as an O-ring around the base of the bolt. After consulting with Stan, who told me that his preferred method for keeping water out is to just use an O-ring around the nut (and not to apply sealant), I cleaned off the old sealant (a product called ReMov which was recommended in a Practical Sailor review, worked great for this) I put new O-rings on. Rather than putting an O-ring around the electric wire near the aft-starboard leg I put some wraps of butyl rubber tape abound it. I reattached the pulpit, tightened the nuts and had my wife spray the foredeck again and sadly found that there was again a leak (perhaps even worse than before) at each leg - but not where the electric wire entered the cabin. I removed the pulpit again, removed the o_rings and this time used Butyl tape to form the seal at each leg. Using a technique I found on You Tube I cut a 3 - 4 inch length of the tape, rolled the tape along its length into a tube (or rope) and then wrapped it several times about the base of the bolt. The thickness can be adjusted by adding more or less wraps and I was generous, using the entire 3 - 4 inch tape at each leg. I added more Butyl to the electric wire. After putting the pulpit back in place and only moderately tightening the nuts, my wife sprayed the foredeck again and this time - success - no leaks!! I have become a big fan of Butyl rubber tape, which to be honest I hadn't even heard about till last week! Of course now I have to splice back the electric wire for the navigation light and replace the cosmetic wood trim I removed, but I am much relieved that this problem is solved Thanks for your advice and support --Reuben Reuben Mezrich Pelican Cove in Sarasota Cell: 410-499-8922 On Tue, Mar 2, 2021 at 12:49 PM wrote: > I like to tape paper towels around the suspected areas and see which ones > show moisture first, then investigate further from there . > > > Jerry Lowe > S/V Country Rhodes '86 > > > > > > > Roger, Rob and Mike > > Thanks for the good suggestions. I'll start by taking off that > cosmeticsus > > piece of wood at the bow and see what's behind. If nothing is loose I"ll > > have someone aim a hose at the bow while I"m inside watching in the hope > > that I might actually see where the water is getting in. > > I really do hope I don't have to rebed everything. > > Probably won't be able to do this till the weekend..I"ll report back on > > what I find > > > > Reuben Mezrich > > Pelican Cove in Sarasota > > Cell: 410-499-8922 > > > > > > On Mon, Mar 1, 2021 at 5:15 PM Michael D. Weisner > > wrote: > > > >> Reuben, > >> > >> I would check the bow eye. The wood backing block usually rots and the > >> eye > >> loosens up. Sometimes just lifting the boat using the bow eye will cause > >> the eye to loosen as the wood compresses. > >> > >> Also, you may want to re-bed the bow pulpit rail deck fittings, chocks, > >> etc. > >> > >> Mike > >> s/v Wind Lass ('91) > >> Nissequogue River, NY > >> I?d rather be sailing :~) > >> > >> -----Original Message----- > >> From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of > >> Reuben Mezrich > >> Sent: Monday, March 1, 2021 4:08 PM > >> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > >> Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first > >> > >> As I mentioned a week or two ago, I installed a Marinco 3" Day/night > >> solar > >> vent at the bow, using the hole already in place for the anchor locker. > >> It > >> installed easily, seemed to work fine but a few days later we had a > >> heavy > >> rain and the next day the forward tips of the forward cabin cushions > >> were > >> wet. I removed the vent, replaced the deck plate, installed a new gasket > >> under the deck plate, applied a generous amount of RTV silicone to both > >> sides of the gasket and reinstalled the solar vent. The next day > >> (yesterday > >> actually) I used a hose to rain water on the forward deck, aiming at the > >> solar vent for about 6 minutes and when I checked below everything was > >> dry. > >> I checked again in an hour and it was still dry. > >> This morning there was about a cup of water, maybe two cups of water at > >> the bow. There was no water in the tray that serves as the anchor locker > >> and which is directly under the solar vent. The vent itself was dry as > >> was > >> the ceiling around the vent. The walls were also dry. I dried the water > >> with a towel and a few hours later a small amount of water seemed to be > >> seeping under a triangular piece of wood at the very bow of the boat > >> (see > >> attached photo). I haven't removed that piece of wood yet but I'm pretty > >> sure I'll find the bolts from the chain plate at the bow for the jib > >> stay. > >> My feeling now is that the solar vent was never the source of the leak > >> but > >> I've had a small leak for a while but never noticed because I never had > >> a > >> reason to go up to the very front of the forward cabin. As it turns out > >> the > >> bottom of the cushions, which are rubberized are stained, giving > >> evidence > >> that the leak is likely long standing. > >> Those bolts would be my best guess as the source of the leak but I'd > >> look > >> forward to suggestions as to where else I might look. > >> > >> Its always something > >> > >> --Reuben > >> > >> > >> Reuben Mezrich > >> Pelican Cove in Sarasota > >> Cell: 410-499-8922 > >> > >> > > >> > > >> -------------- next part -------------- > >> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > >> Name: Screen Shot 2021-03-01 at 4.02.36 PM.png > >> Type: image/png > >> Size: 1826288 bytes > >> Desc: not available > >> URL: < > >> > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210301/6a1cf705/attachment.png > >> > > >> > >> > > > > > From chrisgeankoplis at gmail.com Tue Mar 9 11:42:38 2021 From: chrisgeankoplis at gmail.com (Chris Geankoplis) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2021 11:42:38 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first In-Reply-To: References: <1613761250989-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <408F9401-E24B-4554-826E-DD98BFC0E1F3@stottarchitecture.com> <1614623625839-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <005601d70ed3$6283eba0$278bc2e0$@ebsmed.com> <916d9b93-9604-8b3a-c9d5-5c84c1acadb8@generalboats.com> <007501d70ee8$6edeb690$4c9c23b0$@ebsmed.com> <54709.24.140.30.102.1614707391.squirrel@quickpop.sssnet.com> Message-ID: Wow Ruben, I?m so sorry you had this challenge with your boat. Mostly though I as impressed with your determination to solve the problem. Engineering genes I think. Wish I could have been there to lend a hand. Chris Geankoplis Enosis. On Tue, Mar 9, 2021 at 11:25 AM Reuben Mezrich wrote: > After receiving the many excellent suggestions on where to look for leaks I > started what ended being a 1 week process to find and ultimately repair the > leak. > > I first removed the cosmetic wood trim inside the forward cabin at the bow > to expose the attachments of the Jib chainplate and the Bow eye. I sprayed > water at the bow and determined these were not the source of the leaks. I > then sprayed water on the foredeck and initially saw no water leaking into > the boat but when I came back to the boat the next morning found that some > water (about 1 - 2 cups) had collected at the bow (By now I had removed the > cushions and so could see the water in a puddle on the floor of the forward > bunk at the bow). I had some sort of a slow leak. > > I then had my wife spray water on the foredeck while I was on my back in > the forecabin and was able to see that there were leaks at each of the four > legs of the pulpit. The leaks would drip onto the carpeted shelf that is at > each side of the forecabin (behind a white fiberglass trim piece) and then > the water would slowly make its way forward to trickle down at the bow end > of the forecabin. > > The pulpit is attached by 3/8" bolts that are welded to each of the legs > and which extend down through holes in the deck and fastened with a flat > washer, lock washer and 9/16" nut. After unfastening the nuts the pulpit > lifted up easily. One complication is that the electrical wires that feed > the navigation lights at the bow extend through a seperate hole just > forward of the hole for the aft-starboard bolt. That wire seems to run back > to the distribution panel and has very little slack and so I had to cut > it. When I did remove the pulpit I found there was some white sealant that > adhered to the deck but not the pulpit leg (which ends in an oval flange at > the bottom) as well as an O-ring around the base of the bolt. > > After consulting with Stan, who told me that his preferred method for > keeping water out is to just use an O-ring around the nut (and not to apply > sealant), I cleaned off the old sealant (a product called ReMov which was > recommended in a Practical Sailor review, worked great for this) I put new > O-rings on. Rather than putting an O-ring around the electric wire near the > aft-starboard leg I put some wraps of butyl rubber tape abound it. > I reattached the pulpit, tightened the nuts and had my wife spray the > foredeck again and sadly found that there was again a leak (perhaps even > worse than before) at each leg - but not where the electric wire entered > the cabin. > > I removed the pulpit again, removed the o_rings and this time used Butyl > tape to form the seal at each leg. Using a technique I found on You Tube I > cut a 3 - 4 inch length of the tape, rolled the tape along its length into > a tube (or rope) and then wrapped it several times about the base of the > bolt. The thickness can be adjusted by adding more or less wraps and I was > generous, using the entire 3 - 4 inch tape at each leg. I added more Butyl > to the electric wire. > > After putting the pulpit back in place and only moderately tightening the > nuts, my wife sprayed the foredeck again and this time - success - no > leaks!! > > I have become a big fan of Butyl rubber tape, which to be honest I hadn't > even heard about till last week! > > Of course now I have to splice back the electric wire for the navigation > light and replace the cosmetic wood trim I removed, but I am much relieved > that this problem is solved > > Thanks for your advice and support > > --Reuben > Reuben Mezrich > Pelican Cove in Sarasota > Cell: 410-499-8922 > > > On Tue, Mar 2, 2021 at 12:49 PM wrote: > > > I like to tape paper towels around the suspected areas and see which ones > > show moisture first, then investigate further from there . > > > > > > Jerry Lowe > > S/V Country Rhodes '86 > > > > > > > > > > > > > Roger, Rob and Mike > > > Thanks for the good suggestions. I'll start by taking off that > > cosmeticsus > > > piece of wood at the bow and see what's behind. If nothing is loose > I"ll > > > have someone aim a hose at the bow while I"m inside watching in the > hope > > > that I might actually see where the water is getting in. > > > I really do hope I don't have to rebed everything. > > > Probably won't be able to do this till the weekend..I"ll report back on > > > what I find > > > > > > Reuben Mezrich > > > Pelican Cove in Sarasota > > > Cell: 410-499-8922 > > > > > > > > > On Mon, Mar 1, 2021 at 5:15 PM Michael D. Weisner > > > > wrote: > > > > > >> Reuben, > > >> > > >> I would check the bow eye. The wood backing block usually rots and the > > >> eye > > >> loosens up. Sometimes just lifting the boat using the bow eye will > cause > > >> the eye to loosen as the wood compresses. > > >> > > >> Also, you may want to re-bed the bow pulpit rail deck fittings, > chocks, > > >> etc. > > >> > > >> Mike > > >> s/v Wind Lass ('91) > > >> Nissequogue River, NY > > >> I?d rather be sailing :~) > > >> > > >> -----Original Message----- > > >> From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of > > >> Reuben Mezrich > > >> Sent: Monday, March 1, 2021 4:08 PM > > >> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > > >> Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first > > >> > > >> As I mentioned a week or two ago, I installed a Marinco 3" Day/night > > >> solar > > >> vent at the bow, using the hole already in place for the anchor > locker. > > >> It > > >> installed easily, seemed to work fine but a few days later we had a > > >> heavy > > >> rain and the next day the forward tips of the forward cabin cushions > > >> were > > >> wet. I removed the vent, replaced the deck plate, installed a new > gasket > > >> under the deck plate, applied a generous amount of RTV silicone to > both > > >> sides of the gasket and reinstalled the solar vent. The next day > > >> (yesterday > > >> actually) I used a hose to rain water on the forward deck, aiming at > the > > >> solar vent for about 6 minutes and when I checked below everything was > > >> dry. > > >> I checked again in an hour and it was still dry. > > >> This morning there was about a cup of water, maybe two cups of water > at > > >> the bow. There was no water in the tray that serves as the anchor > locker > > >> and which is directly under the solar vent. The vent itself was dry as > > >> was > > >> the ceiling around the vent. The walls were also dry. I dried the > water > > >> with a towel and a few hours later a small amount of water seemed to > be > > >> seeping under a triangular piece of wood at the very bow of the boat > > >> (see > > >> attached photo). I haven't removed that piece of wood yet but I'm > pretty > > >> sure I'll find the bolts from the chain plate at the bow for the jib > > >> stay. > > >> My feeling now is that the solar vent was never the source of the leak > > >> but > > >> I've had a small leak for a while but never noticed because I never > had > > >> a > > >> reason to go up to the very front of the forward cabin. As it turns > out > > >> the > > >> bottom of the cushions, which are rubberized are stained, giving > > >> evidence > > >> that the leak is likely long standing. > > >> Those bolts would be my best guess as the source of the leak but I'd > > >> look > > >> forward to suggestions as to where else I might look. > > >> > > >> Its always something > > >> > > >> --Reuben > > >> > > >> > > >> Reuben Mezrich > > >> Pelican Cove in Sarasota > > >> Cell: 410-499-8922 > > >> > > >> > > > >> > > > >> -------------- next part -------------- > > >> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > > >> Name: Screen Shot 2021-03-01 at 4.02.36 PM.png > > >> Type: image/png > > >> Size: 1826288 bytes > > >> Desc: not available > > >> URL: < > > >> > > > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210301/6a1cf705/attachment.png > > >> > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > > > > From rlowe at vt.edu Tue Mar 9 11:43:02 2021 From: rlowe at vt.edu (Lowe, Rob) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2021 16:43:02 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first In-Reply-To: References: <1613761250989-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <408F9401-E24B-4554-826E-DD98BFC0E1F3@stottarchitecture.com> <1614623625839-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <005601d70ed3$6283eba0$278bc2e0$@ebsmed.com> <916d9b93-9604-8b3a-c9d5-5c84c1acadb8@generalboats.com> <007501d70ee8$6edeb690$4c9c23b0$@ebsmed.com> <54709.24.140.30.102.1614707391.squirrel@quickpop.sssnet.com>, Message-ID: Reuben, Thanks for reporting back to us. 'Da list' loves to give advice but we like it even better when we hear our advice led to a solution! Now, onto your next issue. - Rob ________________________________ From: Rhodes22-list on behalf of Reuben Mezrich Sent: Tuesday, March 9, 2021 11:25 AM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first After receiving the many excellent suggestions on where to look for leaks I started what ended being a 1 week process to find and ultimately repair the leak. I first removed the cosmetic wood trim inside the forward cabin at the bow to expose the attachments of the Jib chainplate and the Bow eye. I sprayed water at the bow and determined these were not the source of the leaks. I then sprayed water on the foredeck and initially saw no water leaking into the boat but when I came back to the boat the next morning found that some water (about 1 - 2 cups) had collected at the bow (By now I had removed the cushions and so could see the water in a puddle on the floor of the forward bunk at the bow). I had some sort of a slow leak. I then had my wife spray water on the foredeck while I was on my back in the forecabin and was able to see that there were leaks at each of the four legs of the pulpit. The leaks would drip onto the carpeted shelf that is at each side of the forecabin (behind a white fiberglass trim piece) and then the water would slowly make its way forward to trickle down at the bow end of the forecabin. The pulpit is attached by 3/8" bolts that are welded to each of the legs and which extend down through holes in the deck and fastened with a flat washer, lock washer and 9/16" nut. After unfastening the nuts the pulpit lifted up easily. One complication is that the electrical wires that feed the navigation lights at the bow extend through a seperate hole just forward of the hole for the aft-starboard bolt. That wire seems to run back to the distribution panel and has very little slack and so I had to cut it. When I did remove the pulpit I found there was some white sealant that adhered to the deck but not the pulpit leg (which ends in an oval flange at the bottom) as well as an O-ring around the base of the bolt. After consulting with Stan, who told me that his preferred method for keeping water out is to just use an O-ring around the nut (and not to apply sealant), I cleaned off the old sealant (a product called ReMov which was recommended in a Practical Sailor review, worked great for this) I put new O-rings on. Rather than putting an O-ring around the electric wire near the aft-starboard leg I put some wraps of butyl rubber tape abound it. I reattached the pulpit, tightened the nuts and had my wife spray the foredeck again and sadly found that there was again a leak (perhaps even worse than before) at each leg - but not where the electric wire entered the cabin. I removed the pulpit again, removed the o_rings and this time used Butyl tape to form the seal at each leg. Using a technique I found on You Tube I cut a 3 - 4 inch length of the tape, rolled the tape along its length into a tube (or rope) and then wrapped it several times about the base of the bolt. The thickness can be adjusted by adding more or less wraps and I was generous, using the entire 3 - 4 inch tape at each leg. I added more Butyl to the electric wire. After putting the pulpit back in place and only moderately tightening the nuts, my wife sprayed the foredeck again and this time - success - no leaks!! I have become a big fan of Butyl rubber tape, which to be honest I hadn't even heard about till last week! Of course now I have to splice back the electric wire for the navigation light and replace the cosmetic wood trim I removed, but I am much relieved that this problem is solved Thanks for your advice and support --Reuben Reuben Mezrich Pelican Cove in Sarasota Cell: 410-499-8922 On Tue, Mar 2, 2021 at 12:49 PM wrote: > I like to tape paper towels around the suspected areas and see which ones > show moisture first, then investigate further from there . > > > Jerry Lowe > S/V Country Rhodes '86 > > > > > > > Roger, Rob and Mike > > Thanks for the good suggestions. I'll start by taking off that > cosmeticsus > > piece of wood at the bow and see what's behind. If nothing is loose I"ll > > have someone aim a hose at the bow while I"m inside watching in the hope > > that I might actually see where the water is getting in. > > I really do hope I don't have to rebed everything. > > Probably won't be able to do this till the weekend..I"ll report back on > > what I find > > > > Reuben Mezrich > > Pelican Cove in Sarasota > > Cell: 410-499-8922 > > > > > > On Mon, Mar 1, 2021 at 5:15 PM Michael D. Weisner > > wrote: > > > >> Reuben, > >> > >> I would check the bow eye. The wood backing block usually rots and the > >> eye > >> loosens up. Sometimes just lifting the boat using the bow eye will cause > >> the eye to loosen as the wood compresses. > >> > >> Also, you may want to re-bed the bow pulpit rail deck fittings, chocks, > >> etc. > >> > >> Mike > >> s/v Wind Lass ('91) > >> Nissequogue River, NY > >> I?d rather be sailing :~) > >> > >> -----Original Message----- > >> From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of > >> Reuben Mezrich > >> Sent: Monday, March 1, 2021 4:08 PM > >> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > >> Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first > >> > >> As I mentioned a week or two ago, I installed a Marinco 3" Day/night > >> solar > >> vent at the bow, using the hole already in place for the anchor locker. > >> It > >> installed easily, seemed to work fine but a few days later we had a > >> heavy > >> rain and the next day the forward tips of the forward cabin cushions > >> were > >> wet. I removed the vent, replaced the deck plate, installed a new gasket > >> under the deck plate, applied a generous amount of RTV silicone to both > >> sides of the gasket and reinstalled the solar vent. The next day > >> (yesterday > >> actually) I used a hose to rain water on the forward deck, aiming at the > >> solar vent for about 6 minutes and when I checked below everything was > >> dry. > >> I checked again in an hour and it was still dry. > >> This morning there was about a cup of water, maybe two cups of water at > >> the bow. There was no water in the tray that serves as the anchor locker > >> and which is directly under the solar vent. The vent itself was dry as > >> was > >> the ceiling around the vent. The walls were also dry. I dried the water > >> with a towel and a few hours later a small amount of water seemed to be > >> seeping under a triangular piece of wood at the very bow of the boat > >> (see > >> attached photo). I haven't removed that piece of wood yet but I'm pretty > >> sure I'll find the bolts from the chain plate at the bow for the jib > >> stay. > >> My feeling now is that the solar vent was never the source of the leak > >> but > >> I've had a small leak for a while but never noticed because I never had > >> a > >> reason to go up to the very front of the forward cabin. As it turns out > >> the > >> bottom of the cushions, which are rubberized are stained, giving > >> evidence > >> that the leak is likely long standing. > >> Those bolts would be my best guess as the source of the leak but I'd > >> look > >> forward to suggestions as to where else I might look. > >> > >> Its always something > >> > >> --Reuben > >> > >> > >> Reuben Mezrich > >> Pelican Cove in Sarasota > >> Cell: 410-499-8922 > >> > >> > > >> > > >> -------------- next part -------------- > >> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > >> Name: Screen Shot 2021-03-01 at 4.02.36 PM.png > >> Type: image/png > >> Size: 1826288 bytes > >> Desc: not available > >> URL: < > >> > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210301/6a1cf705/attachment.png > >> > > >> > >> > > > > > From john_carlson at mac.com Tue Mar 9 12:00:36 2021 From: john_carlson at mac.com (John Carlson) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2021 11:00:36 -0600 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first In-Reply-To: References: <1613761250989-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <408F9401-E24B-4554-826E-DD98BFC0E1F3@stottarchitecture.com> <1614623625839-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <005601d70ed3$6283eba0$278bc2e0$@ebsmed.com> <916d9b93-9604-8b3a-c9d5-5c84c1acadb8@generalboats.com> <007501d70ee8$6edeb690$4c9c23b0$@ebsmed.com> <54709.24.140.30.102.1614707391.squirrel@quickpop.sssnet.com> Message-ID: <9DCF803D-AB94-466D-9423-D6E6B24F240D@mac.com> My pulpit is leaky as well, so I'm going to have to do this. Many thanks for the detailed description. Any chance you have a link to the video you found useful? Also, now that you've done it, would you have to cut the electrical cords to use the butyl tape? -- John Carlson Lillipelli (2004/2012) > On Mar 9, 2021, at 10:25 AM, Reuben Mezrich wrote: > > After receiving the many excellent suggestions on where to look for leaks I > started what ended being a 1 week process to find and ultimately repair the > leak. > > I first removed the cosmetic wood trim inside the forward cabin at the bow > to expose the attachments of the Jib chainplate and the Bow eye. I sprayed > water at the bow and determined these were not the source of the leaks. I > then sprayed water on the foredeck and initially saw no water leaking into > the boat but when I came back to the boat the next morning found that some > water (about 1 - 2 cups) had collected at the bow (By now I had removed the > cushions and so could see the water in a puddle on the floor of the forward > bunk at the bow). I had some sort of a slow leak. > > I then had my wife spray water on the foredeck while I was on my back in > the forecabin and was able to see that there were leaks at each of the four > legs of the pulpit. The leaks would drip onto the carpeted shelf that is at > each side of the forecabin (behind a white fiberglass trim piece) and then > the water would slowly make its way forward to trickle down at the bow end > of the forecabin. > > The pulpit is attached by 3/8" bolts that are welded to each of the legs > and which extend down through holes in the deck and fastened with a flat > washer, lock washer and 9/16" nut. After unfastening the nuts the pulpit > lifted up easily. One complication is that the electrical wires that feed > the navigation lights at the bow extend through a seperate hole just > forward of the hole for the aft-starboard bolt. That wire seems to run back > to the distribution panel and has very little slack and so I had to cut > it. When I did remove the pulpit I found there was some white sealant that > adhered to the deck but not the pulpit leg (which ends in an oval flange at > the bottom) as well as an O-ring around the base of the bolt. > > After consulting with Stan, who told me that his preferred method for > keeping water out is to just use an O-ring around the nut (and not to apply > sealant), I cleaned off the old sealant (a product called ReMov which was > recommended in a Practical Sailor review, worked great for this) I put new > O-rings on. Rather than putting an O-ring around the electric wire near the > aft-starboard leg I put some wraps of butyl rubber tape abound it. > I reattached the pulpit, tightened the nuts and had my wife spray the > foredeck again and sadly found that there was again a leak (perhaps even > worse than before) at each leg - but not where the electric wire entered > the cabin. > > I removed the pulpit again, removed the o_rings and this time used Butyl > tape to form the seal at each leg. Using a technique I found on You Tube I > cut a 3 - 4 inch length of the tape, rolled the tape along its length into > a tube (or rope) and then wrapped it several times about the base of the > bolt. The thickness can be adjusted by adding more or less wraps and I was > generous, using the entire 3 - 4 inch tape at each leg. I added more Butyl > to the electric wire. > > After putting the pulpit back in place and only moderately tightening the > nuts, my wife sprayed the foredeck again and this time - success - no > leaks!! > > I have become a big fan of Butyl rubber tape, which to be honest I hadn't > even heard about till last week! > > Of course now I have to splice back the electric wire for the navigation > light and replace the cosmetic wood trim I removed, but I am much relieved > that this problem is solved > > Thanks for your advice and support > > --Reuben > Reuben Mezrich > Pelican Cove in Sarasota > Cell: 410-499-8922 > > > On Tue, Mar 2, 2021 at 12:49 PM > wrote: > >> I like to tape paper towels around the suspected areas and see which ones >> show moisture first, then investigate further from there . >> >> >> Jerry Lowe >> S/V Country Rhodes '86 >> >> >> >> >> >>> Roger, Rob and Mike >>> Thanks for the good suggestions. I'll start by taking off that >> cosmeticsus >>> piece of wood at the bow and see what's behind. If nothing is loose I"ll >>> have someone aim a hose at the bow while I"m inside watching in the hope >>> that I might actually see where the water is getting in. >>> I really do hope I don't have to rebed everything. >>> Probably won't be able to do this till the weekend..I"ll report back on >>> what I find >>> >>> Reuben Mezrich >>> Pelican Cove in Sarasota >>> Cell: 410-499-8922 >>> >>> >>> On Mon, Mar 1, 2021 at 5:15 PM Michael D. Weisner >>> wrote: >>> >>>> Reuben, >>>> >>>> I would check the bow eye. The wood backing block usually rots and the >>>> eye >>>> loosens up. Sometimes just lifting the boat using the bow eye will cause >>>> the eye to loosen as the wood compresses. >>>> >>>> Also, you may want to re-bed the bow pulpit rail deck fittings, chocks, >>>> etc. >>>> >>>> Mike >>>> s/v Wind Lass ('91) >>>> Nissequogue River, NY >>>> I?d rather be sailing :~) >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of >>>> Reuben Mezrich >>>> Sent: Monday, March 1, 2021 4:08 PM >>>> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List >>>> Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first >>>> >>>> As I mentioned a week or two ago, I installed a Marinco 3" Day/night >>>> solar >>>> vent at the bow, using the hole already in place for the anchor locker. >>>> It >>>> installed easily, seemed to work fine but a few days later we had a >>>> heavy >>>> rain and the next day the forward tips of the forward cabin cushions >>>> were >>>> wet. I removed the vent, replaced the deck plate, installed a new gasket >>>> under the deck plate, applied a generous amount of RTV silicone to both >>>> sides of the gasket and reinstalled the solar vent. The next day >>>> (yesterday >>>> actually) I used a hose to rain water on the forward deck, aiming at the >>>> solar vent for about 6 minutes and when I checked below everything was >>>> dry. >>>> I checked again in an hour and it was still dry. >>>> This morning there was about a cup of water, maybe two cups of water at >>>> the bow. There was no water in the tray that serves as the anchor locker >>>> and which is directly under the solar vent. The vent itself was dry as >>>> was >>>> the ceiling around the vent. The walls were also dry. I dried the water >>>> with a towel and a few hours later a small amount of water seemed to be >>>> seeping under a triangular piece of wood at the very bow of the boat >>>> (see >>>> attached photo). I haven't removed that piece of wood yet but I'm pretty >>>> sure I'll find the bolts from the chain plate at the bow for the jib >>>> stay. >>>> My feeling now is that the solar vent was never the source of the leak >>>> but >>>> I've had a small leak for a while but never noticed because I never had >>>> a >>>> reason to go up to the very front of the forward cabin. As it turns out >>>> the >>>> bottom of the cushions, which are rubberized are stained, giving >>>> evidence >>>> that the leak is likely long standing. >>>> Those bolts would be my best guess as the source of the leak but I'd >>>> look >>>> forward to suggestions as to where else I might look. >>>> >>>> Its always something >>>> >>>> --Reuben >>>> >>>> >>>> Reuben Mezrich >>>> Pelican Cove in Sarasota >>>> Cell: 410-499-8922 >>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>> -------------- next part -------------- >>>> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... >>>> Name: Screen Shot 2021-03-01 at 4.02.36 PM.png >>>> Type: image/png >>>> Size: 1826288 bytes >>>> Desc: not available >>>> URL: < >>>> >> http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210301/6a1cf705/attachment.png From jbconnolly at comcast.net Tue Mar 9 13:05:18 2021 From: jbconnolly at comcast.net (Jim Connolly) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2021 13:05:18 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] mooring In-Reply-To: References: <23869787.1669574.1615297464618.ref@mail.yahoo.com> <23869787.1669574.1615297464618@mail.yahoo.com>, Message-ID: <8A393BA6-5047-8940-A18E-A6A576FA5D93@hxcore.ol> From borderfolle at yahoo.com Tue Mar 9 13:08:13 2021 From: borderfolle at yahoo.com (Donald Simons) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2021 18:08:13 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first In-Reply-To: References: <1613761250989-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <408F9401-E24B-4554-826E-DD98BFC0E1F3@stottarchitecture.com> <1614623625839-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <005601d70ed3$6283eba0$278bc2e0$@ebsmed.com> <916d9b93-9604-8b3a-c9d5-5c84c1acadb8@generalboats.com> <007501d70ee8$6edeb690$4c9c23b0$@ebsmed.com> <54709.24.140.30.102.1614707391.squirrel@quickpop.sssnet.com> Message-ID: <1960491628.746989.1615313293378@mail.yahoo.com> Great job Reuben!? I agree with Graham and others concerning the use of butyl tape.? It's easy to work with and remains flexible.? Among other uses, I used it successfully around the chainplates. Don Simons,Ithaca, NY On Tuesday, March 9, 2021, 11:25:22 AM EST, Reuben Mezrich wrote: After receiving the many excellent suggestions on where to look for leaks I started what ended being a 1 week process to find and ultimately repair the leak. I first removed the cosmetic wood trim inside the forward cabin at the bow to expose the attachments of the Jib chainplate and the Bow eye. I sprayed water at the bow? and determined these were not the source of the leaks. I then sprayed water on the foredeck and initially saw no water leaking into the boat but when I came back to the boat the next morning found that some water (about 1 - 2 cups) had collected at the bow (By now I had removed the cushions and so could see the water in a puddle on the floor of the forward bunk at the bow). I had some sort of a slow leak. I then had my wife spray water on the foredeck while I was on my back in the forecabin and was able to see that there were leaks at each of the four legs of the pulpit. The leaks would drip onto the carpeted shelf that is at each side of the forecabin (behind a white fiberglass trim piece) and then the water would slowly make its way forward to trickle down at the bow end of the forecabin. The pulpit is attached by 3/8" bolts that are welded to each of the legs and which extend down through holes in the deck and fastened with a flat washer, lock washer and 9/16" nut. After unfastening the nuts the pulpit lifted up easily. One complication is that the electrical wires that feed the navigation lights at the bow extend through a seperate hole just forward of the hole for the aft-starboard bolt. That wire seems to run back to the distribution panel and has very little slack and so I had to cut it.? When I did remove the pulpit I found there was some white sealant that adhered to the deck but not the pulpit leg (which ends in an oval flange at the bottom) as well as an O-ring around the base of the bolt. After consulting with Stan, who told me that his preferred method for keeping water out is to just use an O-ring around the nut (and not to apply sealant), I cleaned off the old sealant (a product called ReMov which was recommended in a Practical Sailor review, worked great for this) I put new O-rings on. Rather than putting an O-ring around the electric wire near the aft-starboard leg I put some wraps of butyl rubber tape abound it. I reattached the pulpit, tightened the nuts and had my wife spray the foredeck again and sadly found that there was again a leak (perhaps even worse than before) at each leg - but not where the electric wire entered the cabin. I removed the pulpit again, removed the o_rings and this time used Butyl tape to form the seal at each leg. Using a technique I found on You Tube I cut a 3 - 4 inch length of the tape, rolled the tape along its length into a tube (or rope) and then wrapped it several times about the base of the bolt. The thickness can be adjusted by adding more or less wraps and I was generous, using the entire 3 - 4 inch tape at each leg. I added more Butyl to the electric wire. After putting the pulpit back in place and only moderately tightening the nuts, my wife sprayed the foredeck again and this time - success - no leaks!! I have become a big fan of Butyl rubber tape, which to be honest I hadn't even heard about till last week! Of course now I have to splice back the electric wire for the navigation light and replace the cosmetic wood trim I removed, but I am much relieved that this problem is solved Thanks for your advice and support --Reuben Reuben Mezrich Pelican Cove in Sarasota Cell: 410-499-8922 On Tue, Mar 2, 2021 at 12:49 PM wrote: > I like to tape paper towels around the suspected areas and see which ones > show moisture first, then investigate further from there . > > > Jerry Lowe > S/V Country Rhodes '86 > > > > > > > Roger, Rob and Mike > > Thanks for the good suggestions. I'll start by taking off that > cosmeticsus > > piece of wood at the bow and see what's behind. If nothing is loose I"ll > > have someone aim a hose at the bow while I"m inside watching in the hope > > that I might actually see where the water is getting in. > > I really do hope I don't have to rebed everything. > > Probably won't be able to do this till the weekend..I"ll report back on > > what I find > > > > Reuben Mezrich > > Pelican Cove in Sarasota > > Cell: 410-499-8922 > > > > > > On Mon, Mar 1, 2021 at 5:15 PM Michael D. Weisner > > wrote: > > > >> Reuben, > >> > >> I would check the bow eye. The wood backing block usually rots and the > >> eye > >> loosens up. Sometimes just lifting the boat using the bow eye will cause > >> the eye to loosen as the wood compresses. > >> > >> Also, you may want to re-bed the bow pulpit rail deck fittings, chocks, > >> etc. > >> > >> Mike > >> s/v Wind Lass ('91) > >> Nissequogue River, NY > >> I?d rather be sailing :~) > >> > >> -----Original Message----- > >> From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of > >> Reuben Mezrich > >> Sent: Monday, March 1, 2021 4:08 PM > >> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > >> Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first > >> > >> As I mentioned a week or two ago, I installed a Marinco 3" Day/night > >> solar > >> vent at the bow, using the hole already in place for the anchor locker. > >> It > >> installed easily, seemed to work fine but a few days later we had a > >> heavy > >> rain and the next day the forward tips of the forward cabin cushions > >> were > >> wet. I removed the vent, replaced the deck plate, installed a new gasket > >> under the deck plate, applied a generous amount of RTV silicone to both > >> sides of the gasket and reinstalled the solar vent. The next day > >> (yesterday > >> actually) I used a hose to rain water on the forward deck, aiming at the > >> solar vent for about 6 minutes and when I checked below everything was > >> dry. > >> I checked again in an hour and it was still dry. > >> This morning there was about a cup of water, maybe two cups of water at > >> the bow. There was no water in the tray that serves as the anchor locker > >> and which is directly under the solar vent. The vent itself was dry as > >> was > >> the ceiling around the vent. The walls were also dry. I dried the water > >> with a towel and a few hours later a small amount of water seemed to be > >> seeping under a triangular piece of wood at the very? bow of the boat > >> (see > >> attached photo). I haven't removed that piece of wood yet but I'm pretty > >> sure I'll find the bolts from the chain plate at the bow for the jib > >> stay. > >> My feeling now is that the solar vent was never the source of the leak > >> but > >> I've had a small leak for a while but never noticed because I never had > >> a > >> reason to go up to the very front of the forward cabin. As it turns out > >> the > >> bottom of the cushions, which are rubberized are stained, giving > >> evidence > >> that the leak is likely long standing. > >> Those bolts would be my best guess as the source of the leak but I'd > >> look > >> forward to suggestions as to where else I might look. > >> > >> Its always something > >> > >> --Reuben > >> > >> > >> Reuben Mezrich > >> Pelican Cove in Sarasota > >> Cell: 410-499-8922 > >> > >> > > >> > > >> -------------- next part -------------- > >> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > >> Name: Screen Shot 2021-03-01 at 4.02.36 PM.png > >> Type: image/png > >> Size: 1826288 bytes > >> Desc: not available > >> URL: < > >> > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210301/6a1cf705/attachment.png > >> > > >> > >> > > > > > From jbconnolly at comcast.net Tue Mar 9 13:13:37 2021 From: jbconnolly at comcast.net (Jim Connolly) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2021 13:13:37 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] mooring In-Reply-To: References: <23869787.1669574.1615297464618.ref@mail.yahoo.com> <23869787.1669574.1615297464618@mail.yahoo.com>, Message-ID: From jesse.laten.shumaker at gmail.com Tue Mar 9 13:25:58 2021 From: jesse.laten.shumaker at gmail.com (Jesse Shumaker) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2021 12:25:58 -0600 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first In-Reply-To: References: <1613761250989-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <408F9401-E24B-4554-826E-DD98BFC0E1F3@stottarchitecture.com> <1614623625839-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <005601d70ed3$6283eba0$278bc2e0$@ebsmed.com> <916d9b93-9604-8b3a-c9d5-5c84c1acadb8@generalboats.com> <007501d70ee8$6edeb690$4c9c23b0$@ebsmed.com> <54709.24.140.30.102.1614707391.squirrel@quickpop.sssnet.com> Message-ID: Rueben, you've quickly gone from a new R22 owner to helpful contributor to the list. Thanks for sharing. Last fall I was rebedding some hardware on the foredeck and figured I would see if the bow pulpit needed to be rebedded as well. I discovered the wiring that you mentioned as well, but the wiring on my boat had couplers so the wires could be disconnected. I discovered that the bolts for my bow pulpit were encased in what appeared to be some sort of epoxy so removal would have been a major operation and I left it in place. I don't think I have any leaks on the bow, but I ran a bead of 3M 4000 UV sealant around the base of the pulpit to be on the safe side. I've used butyl tape in some places. I've heard that butyl that it can further compress or ooze from under the hardware in hot weather so you may need to snug the bolts for the pulpit again in the summer heat. Congrats on solving the leak! Jesse Shumaker S/V Zephyr On Tue, Mar 9, 2021 at 10:25 AM Reuben Mezrich wrote: > After receiving the many excellent suggestions on where to look for leaks I > started what ended being a 1 week process to find and ultimately repair the > leak. > > I first removed the cosmetic wood trim inside the forward cabin at the bow > to expose the attachments of the Jib chainplate and the Bow eye. I sprayed > water at the bow and determined these were not the source of the leaks. I > then sprayed water on the foredeck and initially saw no water leaking into > the boat but when I came back to the boat the next morning found that some > water (about 1 - 2 cups) had collected at the bow (By now I had removed the > cushions and so could see the water in a puddle on the floor of the forward > bunk at the bow). I had some sort of a slow leak. > > I then had my wife spray water on the foredeck while I was on my back in > the forecabin and was able to see that there were leaks at each of the four > legs of the pulpit. The leaks would drip onto the carpeted shelf that is at > each side of the forecabin (behind a white fiberglass trim piece) and then > the water would slowly make its way forward to trickle down at the bow end > of the forecabin. > > The pulpit is attached by 3/8" bolts that are welded to each of the legs > and which extend down through holes in the deck and fastened with a flat > washer, lock washer and 9/16" nut. After unfastening the nuts the pulpit > lifted up easily. One complication is that the electrical wires that feed > the navigation lights at the bow extend through a seperate hole just > forward of the hole for the aft-starboard bolt. That wire seems to run back > to the distribution panel and has very little slack and so I had to cut > it. When I did remove the pulpit I found there was some white sealant that > adhered to the deck but not the pulpit leg (which ends in an oval flange at > the bottom) as well as an O-ring around the base of the bolt. > > After consulting with Stan, who told me that his preferred method for > keeping water out is to just use an O-ring around the nut (and not to apply > sealant), I cleaned off the old sealant (a product called ReMov which was > recommended in a Practical Sailor review, worked great for this) I put new > O-rings on. Rather than putting an O-ring around the electric wire near the > aft-starboard leg I put some wraps of butyl rubber tape abound it. > I reattached the pulpit, tightened the nuts and had my wife spray the > foredeck again and sadly found that there was again a leak (perhaps even > worse than before) at each leg - but not where the electric wire entered > the cabin. > > I removed the pulpit again, removed the o_rings and this time used Butyl > tape to form the seal at each leg. Using a technique I found on You Tube I > cut a 3 - 4 inch length of the tape, rolled the tape along its length into > a tube (or rope) and then wrapped it several times about the base of the > bolt. The thickness can be adjusted by adding more or less wraps and I was > generous, using the entire 3 - 4 inch tape at each leg. I added more Butyl > to the electric wire. > > After putting the pulpit back in place and only moderately tightening the > nuts, my wife sprayed the foredeck again and this time - success - no > leaks!! > > I have become a big fan of Butyl rubber tape, which to be honest I hadn't > even heard about till last week! > > Of course now I have to splice back the electric wire for the navigation > light and replace the cosmetic wood trim I removed, but I am much relieved > that this problem is solved > > Thanks for your advice and support > > --Reuben > Reuben Mezrich > Pelican Cove in Sarasota > Cell: 410-499-8922 > > > On Tue, Mar 2, 2021 at 12:49 PM wrote: > > > I like to tape paper towels around the suspected areas and see which ones > > show moisture first, then investigate further from there . > > > > > > Jerry Lowe > > S/V Country Rhodes '86 > > > > > > > > > > > > > Roger, Rob and Mike > > > Thanks for the good suggestions. I'll start by taking off that > > cosmeticsus > > > piece of wood at the bow and see what's behind. If nothing is loose > I"ll > > > have someone aim a hose at the bow while I"m inside watching in the > hope > > > that I might actually see where the water is getting in. > > > I really do hope I don't have to rebed everything. > > > Probably won't be able to do this till the weekend..I"ll report back on > > > what I find > > > > > > Reuben Mezrich > > > Pelican Cove in Sarasota > > > Cell: 410-499-8922 > > > > > > > > > On Mon, Mar 1, 2021 at 5:15 PM Michael D. Weisner > > > > wrote: > > > > > >> Reuben, > > >> > > >> I would check the bow eye. The wood backing block usually rots and the > > >> eye > > >> loosens up. Sometimes just lifting the boat using the bow eye will > cause > > >> the eye to loosen as the wood compresses. > > >> > > >> Also, you may want to re-bed the bow pulpit rail deck fittings, > chocks, > > >> etc. > > >> > > >> Mike > > >> s/v Wind Lass ('91) > > >> Nissequogue River, NY > > >> I?d rather be sailing :~) > > >> > > >> -----Original Message----- > > >> From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of > > >> Reuben Mezrich > > >> Sent: Monday, March 1, 2021 4:08 PM > > >> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > > >> Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first > > >> > > >> As I mentioned a week or two ago, I installed a Marinco 3" Day/night > > >> solar > > >> vent at the bow, using the hole already in place for the anchor > locker. > > >> It > > >> installed easily, seemed to work fine but a few days later we had a > > >> heavy > > >> rain and the next day the forward tips of the forward cabin cushions > > >> were > > >> wet. I removed the vent, replaced the deck plate, installed a new > gasket > > >> under the deck plate, applied a generous amount of RTV silicone to > both > > >> sides of the gasket and reinstalled the solar vent. The next day > > >> (yesterday > > >> actually) I used a hose to rain water on the forward deck, aiming at > the > > >> solar vent for about 6 minutes and when I checked below everything was > > >> dry. > > >> I checked again in an hour and it was still dry. > > >> This morning there was about a cup of water, maybe two cups of water > at > > >> the bow. There was no water in the tray that serves as the anchor > locker > > >> and which is directly under the solar vent. The vent itself was dry as > > >> was > > >> the ceiling around the vent. The walls were also dry. I dried the > water > > >> with a towel and a few hours later a small amount of water seemed to > be > > >> seeping under a triangular piece of wood at the very bow of the boat > > >> (see > > >> attached photo). I haven't removed that piece of wood yet but I'm > pretty > > >> sure I'll find the bolts from the chain plate at the bow for the jib > > >> stay. > > >> My feeling now is that the solar vent was never the source of the leak > > >> but > > >> I've had a small leak for a while but never noticed because I never > had > > >> a > > >> reason to go up to the very front of the forward cabin. As it turns > out > > >> the > > >> bottom of the cushions, which are rubberized are stained, giving > > >> evidence > > >> that the leak is likely long standing. > > >> Those bolts would be my best guess as the source of the leak but I'd > > >> look > > >> forward to suggestions as to where else I might look. > > >> > > >> Its always something > > >> > > >> --Reuben > > >> > > >> > > >> Reuben Mezrich > > >> Pelican Cove in Sarasota > > >> Cell: 410-499-8922 > > >> > > >> > > > >> > > > >> -------------- next part -------------- > > >> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > > >> Name: Screen Shot 2021-03-01 at 4.02.36 PM.png > > >> Type: image/png > > >> Size: 1826288 bytes > > >> Desc: not available > > >> URL: < > > >> > > > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210301/6a1cf705/attachment.png > > >> > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > > > > From roger_pihlaja at msn.com Tue Mar 9 13:48:59 2021 From: roger_pihlaja at msn.com (ROGER PIHLAJA) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2021 18:48:59 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] mooring In-Reply-To: References: <23869787.1669574.1615297464618.ref@mail.yahoo.com> <23869787.1669574.1615297464618@mail.yahoo.com>, Message-ID: Scott, Assuming you are using Peter?s below attached definitions for bow eye and bow cleat, the only reason you would want to tie off to the bow eye vs the bow cleat would be if you are anchoring on short scope or if the anchor is set into a poor holding bottom. Tying off to the bow eye reduces the vertical distance from the tie off point to the anchor. Remember, the vertical distance is the water depth + height of the tie off point above the water. An example may make this more clear. My bow eye is about 1.5 ft above the water and my bow cleats are about 3.0 ft above the water. Suppose we are anchoring in 7 ft of water using 60 ft of anchor rode. Tying off to the bow eye would yield a scope ratio of [60 ft] / [7 ft + 1.5 ft] = 60 / 8.5 = 7.1 . Tying off to the bow cleat would yield a scope ratio of [60 ft] / [7 ft + 3.0 ft] = 60 / 10 = 6.0 . A scope ratio of 7.1 would probably be OK for anchoring overnight. A scope ratio of 6.0 would be iffy. So, if you are trying to anchor in a situation where there is limited room to swing &/or a poor holding bottom; then, consider using the bow eye vs the bow cleat to slightly improve your scope ratio. Of course, using the bow eye is much more trouble vs using the bow cleat. A typical mooring has a huge deeply set anchor that is unlikely to drag and so there is usually no reason to use the bow eye vs the bow cleat on a mooring. Having said that, I used my bow eye and stern eye at my slip very time I docked at my home slip. But, I was in a situation where I parked sideways to a wharf and the boat was exposed to wave action from the side. Rather than depend upon fenders to absorb the wave action and keep the hull off the dock, I had a pair of mooring whips. Mooring whips look like HD fishing poles attached to the dock. I had my mooring whips setup to attach to the bow eye and stern eye using quick release carabiners. They held the boat about 2 ft off the dock. Of course all that gear was swept away along with my dock during the May 19, 2020 dam failure and flood! Roger Pihlaja S/V Dynamic Equilibrium Sent from Mail for Windows 10 From: Peter Nyberg Sent: Tuesday, March 9, 2021 11:00 AM To: sea20 at verizon.net; The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] mooring Scott, I?m not sure what you?re asking, and it may be a terminology issue. Is it possible that when you say ?bow eye? you mean ?bow cleat?? The bow cleat would be attached to the deck, where as the bow eye is attached to the stem of the hull. You could in theory attach your mooring to the bow eye, but I can?t see why you would want a second one. Adding one or two more cleats at the bow is a pretty common project. You would want it through-bolted, and you would want to avoid any possibility of water finding it?s way into the deck core. I?d recommend a drill-fill-drill approach. If you don?t know what that is, I can elaborate. ?Peter > On Mar 9, 2021, at 8:44 AM, Scott E Andrews via Rhodes22-list wrote: > > Greetings all, I will likely be on a waiting list for a slip next season and will be on a mooring. I have a couple questions regarding painter and pendant attachment. I read MJM"s email regarding use of the bow eye with chocks. Is the any reason not to add a second bow eye? Also, is there a recomended pendant or painter length? Thanks everyone. > Scott AndrewsFirst year owner, Wilmington De From joedempsey at hughes.net Tue Mar 9 14:02:56 2021 From: joedempsey at hughes.net (Joe Dempsey) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2021 12:02:56 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] BURGEE ORDERING INSTRUCTIONS Message-ID: <1615316576867-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Okay, Rhodies, here?s the deal: You?re saying to yourself ?I already ordered!? NO, you committed to order! That gave me a number to give to fabricators in order to get the best price. I originally estimated between $30 and $35 plus shipping. The Burgee Shoppe gave us the best price and the only vendor that would allow individual ordering. It is the same company that makes burgees for the Marine Trawlers Association. The price is $29.95 INCLUDING shipping within the U.S.! There is an additional $7.00 charge for shipments to Canada. HOWEVER, it requires us all to get our orders in right away so they can ?pool? the orders to get required minimum production. All is ready for you to place your orders. It will be a somewhat clumsy process, since the owner of the business recently passed away, and his wife, Cindy is running the show. Although, not ideal from my standpoint, it?s the best we could come up with. From my conversations with her, she is genuinely nice and easy to work with. Although they have a shopping cart system on their website for inventoried products, there is no shopping cart style on-line ordering for custom items. [REFER TO THE INSTRUCTIONS BELOW TO PLACE YOUR ORDERS] Hopefully, once we are established with the initial order, they will be able to add a tab for ?Rhodes 22 Burgees?. Normally, an organization would place the minimum order with a deposit and have it paid for so individuals ?members? could order directly. Cindy is going to let us pool our orders and they won?t start production until those orders reach 25. The good news, is that you guys have committed to 48 and counting! Until she can get IT help to set up a R22 Cart for on-line ordering, we?ll have to order via email or phone. If you order by email, PLEASE cc me: joedempsey at hughes.net so I can monitor the ordering until we?ve got the pool amount. Specifications: The burgee will be made from high quality 400 denier nylon pack cloth, UV treated on both sides; and stitched with extra strong UV resistant thread also treated for mildew resistance. The burgee pattern is sewn on both sides concurrently with the same stitch, called appliqu? and provides the best marine burgee. The two brass star grommets along the polypropylene heading are special design for burgee applications. Burgees are designed to withstand a marine environment and are by far the highest quality burgees available. Pricing: $29.95 including free shipping only to United States. Add $7.00 for Canada. No Europe delivery. Delivery will in 3-4 weeks via US Mail. Ordering Instructions: TYPE THE FOLLOWING: Please send ____ 15? X 18? RHODES 22 Burgee(s) at $29.95 to: NAME, SHIPPING ADDRESS Your phone number (for Cindy to call for your payment information) Email above to Herb at Halling.com or a secondary email Cindy.Halling1 at gmail.com. PLEASE cc: "herroberst at hughes.net" Expect a return call from Cindy Halling : (562) 252-6005. NOTE: Your card statement will show the billing as OPB Entertainment. ----- Joe Dempsey s/v Respite Rhodes 22 1989/2005 Deltaville,VA -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From peter at sunnybeeches.com Tue Mar 9 15:17:39 2021 From: peter at sunnybeeches.com (Peter Nyberg) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2021 15:17:39 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] BURGEE ORDERING INSTRUCTIONS In-Reply-To: <1615316576867-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1615316576867-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <87C25482-3B98-4164-B997-50F5AF4378F8@sunnybeeches.com> Thanks again for all this Joe. Rather than send an email, and then wait for the phone to ring, it would more efficient to just call Cindi. I assume we should call the same (562) 252-6005 number? ?Peter > On Mar 9, 2021, at 2:02 PM, Joe Dempsey wrote: > > Okay, Rhodies, here?s the deal: > You?re saying to yourself ?I already ordered!? NO, you committed to order! > That gave me a number to give to fabricators in order to get the best price. > I originally estimated between $30 and $35 plus shipping. The Burgee Shoppe > gave us the best price and the only vendor that would allow individual > ordering. It is the same company that makes burgees for the Marine Trawlers > Association. The price is $29.95 INCLUDING shipping within the U.S.! There > is an additional $7.00 charge for shipments to Canada. HOWEVER, it requires > us all to get our orders in right away so they can ?pool? the orders to get > required minimum production. All is ready for you to place your orders. It > will be a somewhat clumsy process, since the owner of the business recently > passed away, and his wife, Cindy is running the show. Although, not ideal > from my standpoint, it?s the best we could come up with. From my > conversations with her, she is genuinely nice and easy to work with. > Although they have a shopping cart system on their website for inventoried > products, there is no shopping cart style on-line ordering for custom items. > [REFER TO THE INSTRUCTIONS BELOW TO PLACE YOUR ORDERS] Hopefully, once we > are established with the initial order, they will be able to add a tab for > ?Rhodes 22 Burgees?. Normally, an organization would place the minimum order > with a deposit and have it paid for so individuals ?members? could order > directly. Cindy is going to let us pool our orders and they won?t start > production until those orders reach 25. The good news, is that you guys > have committed to 48 and counting! > Until she can get IT help to set up a R22 Cart for on-line ordering, we?ll > have to order via email or phone. If you order by email, PLEASE cc me: > joedempsey at hughes.net so I can monitor the ordering until we?ve got the pool > amount. > Specifications: The burgee will be made from high quality 400 denier nylon > pack cloth, UV treated on both sides; and stitched with extra strong UV > resistant thread also treated for mildew resistance. The burgee pattern is > sewn on both sides concurrently with the same stitch, called appliqu? and > provides the best marine burgee. The two brass star grommets along the > polypropylene heading are special design for burgee applications. Burgees > are designed to withstand a marine environment and are by far the highest > quality burgees available. > Pricing: $29.95 including free shipping only to United States. Add $7.00 > for Canada. No Europe delivery. > Delivery will in 3-4 weeks via US Mail. > Ordering Instructions: > > TYPE THE FOLLOWING: > > Please send ____ 15? X 18? RHODES 22 Burgee(s) at $29.95 to: > NAME, SHIPPING ADDRESS > Your phone number (for Cindy to call for your payment information) > > Email above to Herb at Halling.com or a secondary email > Cindy.Halling1 at gmail.com. > PLEASE cc: "herroberst at hughes.net" > Expect a return call from Cindy Halling : (562) 252-6005. > > NOTE: Your card statement will show the billing as OPB Entertainment. > > > > > > > ----- > Joe Dempsey > s/v Respite > Rhodes 22 1989/2005 > Deltaville,VA > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From sea20 at verizon.net Tue Mar 9 16:50:44 2021 From: sea20 at verizon.net (Scott Andrews) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2021 16:50:44 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] mooring In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Thanks everyone, I get it now. I was thinking of my experience with smaller boats, thistles & flying Scots when forward crew could clip on the ball. Scott Sent from my iPhone > On Mar 9, 2021, at 1:49 PM, ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: > > ? > Scott, > > Assuming you are using Peter?s below attached definitions for bow eye and bow cleat, the only reason you would want to tie off to the bow eye vs the bow cleat would be if you are anchoring on short scope or if the anchor is set into a poor holding bottom. Tying off to the bow eye reduces the vertical distance from the tie off point to the anchor. Remember, the vertical distance is the water depth + height of the tie off point above the water. An example may make this more clear. My bow eye is about 1.5 ft above the water and my bow cleats are about 3.0 ft above the water. Suppose we are anchoring in 7 ft of water using 60 ft of anchor rode. Tying off to the bow eye would yield a scope ratio of [60 ft] / [7 ft + 1.5 ft] = 60 / 8.5 = 7.1 . Tying off to the bow cleat would yield a scope ratio of > [60 ft] / [7 ft + 3.0 ft] = 60 / 10 = 6.0 . A scope ratio of 7.1 would probably be OK for anchoring overnight. A scope ratio of 6.0 would be iffy. So, if you are trying to anchor in a situation where there is limited room to swing &/or a poor holding bottom; then, consider using the bow eye vs the bow cleat to slightly improve your scope ratio. Of course, using the bow eye is much more trouble vs using the bow cleat. A typical mooring has a huge deeply set anchor that is unlikely to drag and so there is usually no reason to use the bow eye vs the bow cleat on a mooring. > > Having said that, I used my bow eye and stern eye at my slip very time I docked at my home slip. But, I was in a situation where I parked sideways to a wharf and the boat was exposed to wave action from the side. Rather than depend upon fenders to absorb the wave action and keep the hull off the dock, I had a pair of mooring whips. Mooring whips look like HD fishing poles attached to the dock. I had my mooring whips setup to attach to the bow eye and stern eye using quick release carabiners. They held the boat about 2 ft off the dock. Of course all that gear was swept away along with my dock during the May 19, 2020 dam failure and flood! > > Roger Pihlaja > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > Sent from Mail for Windows 10 > > From: Peter Nyberg > Sent: Tuesday, March 9, 2021 11:00 AM > To: sea20 at verizon.net; The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] mooring > > Scott, > > I?m not sure what you?re asking, and it may be a terminology issue. Is it possible that when you say ?bow eye? you mean ?bow cleat?? The bow cleat would be attached to the deck, where as the bow eye is attached to the stem of the hull. You could in theory attach your mooring to the bow eye, but I can?t see why you would want a second one. > > Adding one or two more cleats at the bow is a pretty common project. You would want it through-bolted, and you would want to avoid any possibility of water finding it?s way into the deck core. I?d recommend a drill-fill-drill approach. If you don?t know what that is, I can elaborate. > > ?Peter > > > On Mar 9, 2021, at 8:44 AM, Scott E Andrews via Rhodes22-list wrote: > > > > Greetings all, I will likely be on a waiting list for a slip next season and will be on a mooring. I have a couple questions regarding painter and pendant attachment. I read MJM"s email regarding use of the bow eye with chocks. Is the any reason not to add a second bow eye? Also, is there a recomended pendant or painter length? Thanks everyone. > > Scott AndrewsFirst year owner, Wilmington De > > From allynb at adsne.com Tue Mar 9 18:18:38 2021 From: allynb at adsne.com (Allyn Baskerville) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2021 23:18:38 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Compression Post and Head Door Problems In-Reply-To: <001d01d7142f$34043b70$9c0cb250$@ca> References: , <001d01d7142f$34043b70$9c0cb250$@ca> Message-ID: <64DDEEAB-508B-44B1-9252-21F44232DC24@adsne.com> Graham, you are correct. The floor support was not installed properly, which made the floor sag - the support was at least 1/4? too low under the front of the floor and 1? toward the back. Hence, no support directly under the compression post. I made the unfortunate mistake of attempting to remove the piece of wood (OSB) that was installed improperly. The board just crumbled into pieces. I should have screwed some other pieces on either side of the OSB to support the floor. I have a plan to fix, but it?s more work than just attacking to what was already in place. All wood that is going in is pressure treated and epoxy coated. Sent from my iPhone > On Mar 8, 2021, at 9:25 AM, Graham Stewart wrote: > > ?Allyn: > > I suspect the the compression post is not too short - unless someone shortened it. More likely it appears to be short because the floor under the post has given way. > > What is giving support to the post under the floor appears to vary considerably from boat to boat. If you do whatever works to support the post with something that is solid and will not deteriorate I think you will be fine. > > In some the concrete is part of the ballast so I would be reluctant to remove it unless it is breaking up. If possible use pressure-treated or epoxy-coated wood to fill the gap between the solid cement base to the bottom of the floor boards - which might need to be replaced to make them flat and at the correct height. You can check to see whether doing so makes the post fit. It is also possible that some previous owner removed the post with the mast up and had to shorten it to get it back in place. That would be a really dumb thing to do but not something so dumb I might have done it. If the post is still short you might shim it to be snug or replace it altogether. > > Graham Stewart > Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 > Kingston Ontario > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf Of Allyn Baskerville > Sent: Sunday, March 7, 2021 11:51 AM > To: rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org > Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Compression Post and Head Door Problems > > I got my boat out of the water yesterday, and the compression post fell out on the way to the dry slip. I took the wood off the compression post was resting on, and I was in for a surprise. It?s a box mostly made from PRESSED WOOD CHIPS filled with concrete. It?s resting in a fiberglass channel. > > The center most board provides the bulk of the support, but it wasn?t installed correctly. The front is about 1/4? short of where it should be, and the back is about 1? too low. > > The concrete is actually covered for about an inch with a mixture that is a bit gooey, hard, and rough. Concrete underneath. The plywood on the right is not marine or exterior - it?s the same as what my cabin is made of. I can see significant water damage on most of the wood. > > Unfortunately, I have to chip out the concrete to get the screws out and hopefully lift the box out. Anyone have a better idea than just chipping it out? I don?t want to damage the fiberglass. > > Thanks, all. > > [cid:C4C840CE-9F94-4812-A11D-205FF2668004] > > > [cid:0679DFCE-E64D-4D47-BBFC-31B4C130F4EA] > > > Sent from my iPhone > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: IMG_1909.jpg > Type: image/jpeg > Size: 125931 bytes > Desc: IMG_1909.jpg > URL: > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: IMG_1912.jpg > Type: image/jpeg > Size: 86938 bytes > Desc: IMG_1912.jpg > URL: > From tom.vanheule at intrinsicprograms.com Tue Mar 9 19:15:00 2021 From: tom.vanheule at intrinsicprograms.com (Tom Van Heule) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2021 18:15:00 -0600 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first In-Reply-To: <009001d71503$2219f290$664dd7b0$@ca> References: <1613761250989-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <408F9401-E24B-4554-826E-DD98BFC0E1F3@stottarchitecture.com> <1614623625839-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <005601d70ed3$6283eba0$278bc2e0$@ebsmed.com> <916d9b93-9604-8b3a-c9d5-5c84c1acadb8@generalboats.com> <007501d70ee8$6edeb690$4c9c23b0$@ebsmed.com> <54709.24.140.30.102.1614707391.squirrel@quickpop.sssnet.com> <009001d71503$2219f290$664dd7b0$@ca> Message-ID: One of my.pulpit legs broke free (with the wires) on the 2000+ mile shipment home. I used a buytl gasket (self made) on top and loaded the, since elongated hole, up with epoxy and then a layer of marine goop. Underside a washer to hold it all "up". Tourqued all the pulpit botls and checked again. It's held so far. I don't envy my future going back in there, but should ever have to.... Great info folks! Thank you for sharing your tribulations. On Tue, Mar 9, 2021, 10:42 AM Graham Stewart wrote: > I love butyl tape and use it everywhere that does not require adhesive > properties or below the waterline. It seals beautifully and also allows the > removal of the hardware easily. > > BTW, to clean up squeeze out you can get most of it off by using a small > ball of butyl that will stick to the squeeze out and lift most of it. The > remaining bits can be cleaned up easily with turpentine. You may find that > the squeeze out will continue to flow for a very long time. > > Did you consider whether there might have been any damage to the core oy > your deck from the water? I would be concerned about that especially if the > core is wood. > > Graham Stewart > gstewart8 at cogeco.ca > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf > Of Reuben Mezrich > Sent: Tuesday, March 9, 2021 11:25 AM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first > > After receiving the many excellent suggestions on where to look for leaks I > started what ended being a 1 week process to find and ultimately repair the > leak. > > I first removed the cosmetic wood trim inside the forward cabin at the bow > to expose the attachments of the Jib chainplate and the Bow eye. I sprayed > water at the bow and determined these were not the source of the leaks. I > then sprayed water on the foredeck and initially saw no water leaking into > the boat but when I came back to the boat the next morning found that some > water (about 1 - 2 cups) had collected at the bow (By now I had removed the > cushions and so could see the water in a puddle on the floor of the forward > bunk at the bow). I had some sort of a slow leak. > > I then had my wife spray water on the foredeck while I was on my back in > the forecabin and was able to see that there were leaks at each of the four > legs of the pulpit. The leaks would drip onto the carpeted shelf that is at > each side of the forecabin (behind a white fiberglass trim piece) and then > the water would slowly make its way forward to trickle down at the bow end > of the forecabin. > > The pulpit is attached by 3/8" bolts that are welded to each of the legs > and which extend down through holes in the deck and fastened with a flat > washer, lock washer and 9/16" nut. After unfastening the nuts the pulpit > lifted up easily. One complication is that the electrical wires that feed > the navigation lights at the bow extend through a seperate hole just > forward of the hole for the aft-starboard bolt. That wire seems to run back > to the distribution panel and has very little slack and so I had to cut > it. When I did remove the pulpit I found there was some white sealant that > adhered to the deck but not the pulpit leg (which ends in an oval flange at > the bottom) as well as an O-ring around the base of the bolt. > > After consulting with Stan, who told me that his preferred method for > keeping water out is to just use an O-ring around the nut (and not to apply > sealant), I cleaned off the old sealant (a product called ReMov which was > recommended in a Practical Sailor review, worked great for this) I put new > O-rings on. Rather than putting an O-ring around the electric wire near the > aft-starboard leg I put some wraps of butyl rubber tape abound it. > I reattached the pulpit, tightened the nuts and had my wife spray the > foredeck again and sadly found that there was again a leak (perhaps even > worse than before) at each leg - but not where the electric wire entered > the cabin. > > I removed the pulpit again, removed the o_rings and this time used Butyl > tape to form the seal at each leg. Using a technique I found on You Tube I > cut a 3 - 4 inch length of the tape, rolled the tape along its length into > a tube (or rope) and then wrapped it several times about the base of the > bolt. The thickness can be adjusted by adding more or less wraps and I was > generous, using the entire 3 - 4 inch tape at each leg. I added more Butyl > to the electric wire. > > After putting the pulpit back in place and only moderately tightening the > nuts, my wife sprayed the foredeck again and this time - success - no > leaks!! > > I have become a big fan of Butyl rubber tape, which to be honest I hadn't > even heard about till last week! > > Of course now I have to splice back the electric wire for the navigation > light and replace the cosmetic wood trim I removed, but I am much relieved > that this problem is solved > > Thanks for your advice and support > > --Reuben > Reuben Mezrich > Pelican Cove in Sarasota > Cell: 410-499-8922 > > > On Tue, Mar 2, 2021 at 12:49 PM wrote: > > > I like to tape paper towels around the suspected areas and see which ones > > show moisture first, then investigate further from there . > > > > > > Jerry Lowe > > S/V Country Rhodes '86 > > > > > > > > > > > > > Roger, Rob and Mike > > > Thanks for the good suggestions. I'll start by taking off that > > cosmeticsus > > > piece of wood at the bow and see what's behind. If nothing is loose > I"ll > > > have someone aim a hose at the bow while I"m inside watching in the > hope > > > that I might actually see where the water is getting in. > > > I really do hope I don't have to rebed everything. > > > Probably won't be able to do this till the weekend..I"ll report back on > > > what I find > > > > > > Reuben Mezrich > > > Pelican Cove in Sarasota > > > Cell: 410-499-8922 > > > > > > > > > On Mon, Mar 1, 2021 at 5:15 PM Michael D. Weisner > > > > wrote: > > > > > >> Reuben, > > >> > > >> I would check the bow eye. The wood backing block usually rots and the > > >> eye > > >> loosens up. Sometimes just lifting the boat using the bow eye will > cause > > >> the eye to loosen as the wood compresses. > > >> > > >> Also, you may want to re-bed the bow pulpit rail deck fittings, > chocks, > > >> etc. > > >> > > >> Mike > > >> s/v Wind Lass ('91) > > >> Nissequogue River, NY > > >> I?d rather be sailing :~) > > >> > > >> -----Original Message----- > > >> From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of > > >> Reuben Mezrich > > >> Sent: Monday, March 1, 2021 4:08 PM > > >> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > > >> Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first > > >> > > >> As I mentioned a week or two ago, I installed a Marinco 3" Day/night > > >> solar > > >> vent at the bow, using the hole already in place for the anchor > locker. > > >> It > > >> installed easily, seemed to work fine but a few days later we had a > > >> heavy > > >> rain and the next day the forward tips of the forward cabin cushions > > >> were > > >> wet. I removed the vent, replaced the deck plate, installed a new > gasket > > >> under the deck plate, applied a generous amount of RTV silicone to > both > > >> sides of the gasket and reinstalled the solar vent. The next day > > >> (yesterday > > >> actually) I used a hose to rain water on the forward deck, aiming at > the > > >> solar vent for about 6 minutes and when I checked below everything was > > >> dry. > > >> I checked again in an hour and it was still dry. > > >> This morning there was about a cup of water, maybe two cups of water > at > > >> the bow. There was no water in the tray that serves as the anchor > locker > > >> and which is directly under the solar vent. The vent itself was dry as > > >> was > > >> the ceiling around the vent. The walls were also dry. I dried the > water > > >> with a towel and a few hours later a small amount of water seemed to > be > > >> seeping under a triangular piece of wood at the very bow of the boat > > >> (see > > >> attached photo). I haven't removed that piece of wood yet but I'm > pretty > > >> sure I'll find the bolts from the chain plate at the bow for the jib > > >> stay. > > >> My feeling now is that the solar vent was never the source of the leak > > >> but > > >> I've had a small leak for a while but never noticed because I never > had > > >> a > > >> reason to go up to the very front of the forward cabin. As it turns > out > > >> the > > >> bottom of the cushions, which are rubberized are stained, giving > > >> evidence > > >> that the leak is likely long standing. > > >> Those bolts would be my best guess as the source of the leak but I'd > > >> look > > >> forward to suggestions as to where else I might look. > > >> > > >> Its always something > > >> > > >> --Reuben > > >> > > >> > > >> Reuben Mezrich > > >> Pelican Cove in Sarasota > > >> Cell: 410-499-8922 > > >> > > >> > > > >> > > > >> -------------- next part -------------- > > >> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > > >> Name: Screen Shot 2021-03-01 at 4.02.36 PM.png > > >> Type: image/png > > >> Size: 1826288 bytes > > >> Desc: not available > > >> URL: < > > >> > > > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210301/6a1cf705/attachment.png > > >> > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > From retro53 at msn.com Tue Mar 9 20:04:59 2021 From: retro53 at msn.com (John Keyser) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2021 01:04:59 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first In-Reply-To: References: <1613761250989-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <408F9401-E24B-4554-826E-DD98BFC0E1F3@stottarchitecture.com> <1614623625839-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <005601d70ed3$6283eba0$278bc2e0$@ebsmed.com> <916d9b93-9604-8b3a-c9d5-5c84c1acadb8@generalboats.com> <007501d70ee8$6edeb690$4c9c23b0$@ebsmed.com> <54709.24.140.30.102.1614707391.squirrel@quickpop.sssnet.com>, Message-ID: Great reporting, Reuber! You have motivated me to once again this year try to locate the source of my mysterious bow compartment leak. John Keyser Deci-Belle '80 R-22 ________________________________ From: Rhodes22-list on behalf of Reuben Mezrich Sent: Tuesday, March 9, 2021 11:25 AM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first After receiving the many excellent suggestions on where to look for leaks I started what ended being a 1 week process to find and ultimately repair the leak. I first removed the cosmetic wood trim inside the forward cabin at the bow to expose the attachments of the Jib chainplate and the Bow eye. I sprayed water at the bow and determined these were not the source of the leaks. I then sprayed water on the foredeck and initially saw no water leaking into the boat but when I came back to the boat the next morning found that some water (about 1 - 2 cups) had collected at the bow (By now I had removed the cushions and so could see the water in a puddle on the floor of the forward bunk at the bow). I had some sort of a slow leak. I then had my wife spray water on the foredeck while I was on my back in the forecabin and was able to see that there were leaks at each of the four legs of the pulpit. The leaks would drip onto the carpeted shelf that is at each side of the forecabin (behind a white fiberglass trim piece) and then the water would slowly make its way forward to trickle down at the bow end of the forecabin. The pulpit is attached by 3/8" bolts that are welded to each of the legs and which extend down through holes in the deck and fastened with a flat washer, lock washer and 9/16" nut. After unfastening the nuts the pulpit lifted up easily. One complication is that the electrical wires that feed the navigation lights at the bow extend through a seperate hole just forward of the hole for the aft-starboard bolt. That wire seems to run back to the distribution panel and has very little slack and so I had to cut it. When I did remove the pulpit I found there was some white sealant that adhered to the deck but not the pulpit leg (which ends in an oval flange at the bottom) as well as an O-ring around the base of the bolt. After consulting with Stan, who told me that his preferred method for keeping water out is to just use an O-ring around the nut (and not to apply sealant), I cleaned off the old sealant (a product called ReMov which was recommended in a Practical Sailor review, worked great for this) I put new O-rings on. Rather than putting an O-ring around the electric wire near the aft-starboard leg I put some wraps of butyl rubber tape abound it. I reattached the pulpit, tightened the nuts and had my wife spray the foredeck again and sadly found that there was again a leak (perhaps even worse than before) at each leg - but not where the electric wire entered the cabin. I removed the pulpit again, removed the o_rings and this time used Butyl tape to form the seal at each leg. Using a technique I found on You Tube I cut a 3 - 4 inch length of the tape, rolled the tape along its length into a tube (or rope) and then wrapped it several times about the base of the bolt. The thickness can be adjusted by adding more or less wraps and I was generous, using the entire 3 - 4 inch tape at each leg. I added more Butyl to the electric wire. After putting the pulpit back in place and only moderately tightening the nuts, my wife sprayed the foredeck again and this time - success - no leaks!! I have become a big fan of Butyl rubber tape, which to be honest I hadn't even heard about till last week! Of course now I have to splice back the electric wire for the navigation light and replace the cosmetic wood trim I removed, but I am much relieved that this problem is solved Thanks for your advice and support --Reuben Reuben Mezrich Pelican Cove in Sarasota Cell: 410-499-8922 On Tue, Mar 2, 2021 at 12:49 PM wrote: > I like to tape paper towels around the suspected areas and see which ones > show moisture first, then investigate further from there . > > > Jerry Lowe > S/V Country Rhodes '86 > > > > > > > Roger, Rob and Mike > > Thanks for the good suggestions. I'll start by taking off that > cosmeticsus > > piece of wood at the bow and see what's behind. If nothing is loose I"ll > > have someone aim a hose at the bow while I"m inside watching in the hope > > that I might actually see where the water is getting in. > > I really do hope I don't have to rebed everything. > > Probably won't be able to do this till the weekend..I"ll report back on > > what I find > > > > Reuben Mezrich > > Pelican Cove in Sarasota > > Cell: 410-499-8922 > > > > > > On Mon, Mar 1, 2021 at 5:15 PM Michael D. Weisner > > wrote: > > > >> Reuben, > >> > >> I would check the bow eye. The wood backing block usually rots and the > >> eye > >> loosens up. Sometimes just lifting the boat using the bow eye will cause > >> the eye to loosen as the wood compresses. > >> > >> Also, you may want to re-bed the bow pulpit rail deck fittings, chocks, > >> etc. > >> > >> Mike > >> s/v Wind Lass ('91) > >> Nissequogue River, NY > >> I?d rather be sailing :~) > >> > >> -----Original Message----- > >> From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of > >> Reuben Mezrich > >> Sent: Monday, March 1, 2021 4:08 PM > >> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > >> Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first > >> > >> As I mentioned a week or two ago, I installed a Marinco 3" Day/night > >> solar > >> vent at the bow, using the hole already in place for the anchor locker. > >> It > >> installed easily, seemed to work fine but a few days later we had a > >> heavy > >> rain and the next day the forward tips of the forward cabin cushions > >> were > >> wet. I removed the vent, replaced the deck plate, installed a new gasket > >> under the deck plate, applied a generous amount of RTV silicone to both > >> sides of the gasket and reinstalled the solar vent. The next day > >> (yesterday > >> actually) I used a hose to rain water on the forward deck, aiming at the > >> solar vent for about 6 minutes and when I checked below everything was > >> dry. > >> I checked again in an hour and it was still dry. > >> This morning there was about a cup of water, maybe two cups of water at > >> the bow. There was no water in the tray that serves as the anchor locker > >> and which is directly under the solar vent. The vent itself was dry as > >> was > >> the ceiling around the vent. The walls were also dry. I dried the water > >> with a towel and a few hours later a small amount of water seemed to be > >> seeping under a triangular piece of wood at the very bow of the boat > >> (see > >> attached photo). I haven't removed that piece of wood yet but I'm pretty > >> sure I'll find the bolts from the chain plate at the bow for the jib > >> stay. > >> My feeling now is that the solar vent was never the source of the leak > >> but > >> I've had a small leak for a while but never noticed because I never had > >> a > >> reason to go up to the very front of the forward cabin. As it turns out > >> the > >> bottom of the cushions, which are rubberized are stained, giving > >> evidence > >> that the leak is likely long standing. > >> Those bolts would be my best guess as the source of the leak but I'd > >> look > >> forward to suggestions as to where else I might look. > >> > >> Its always something > >> > >> --Reuben > >> > >> > >> Reuben Mezrich > >> Pelican Cove in Sarasota > >> Cell: 410-499-8922 > >> > >> > > >> > > >> -------------- next part -------------- > >> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > >> Name: Screen Shot 2021-03-01 at 4.02.36 PM.png > >> Type: image/png > >> Size: 1826288 bytes > >> Desc: not available > >> URL: < > >> > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210301/6a1cf705/attachment.png > >> > > >> > >> > > > > > From gstewart8 at cogeco.ca Tue Mar 9 21:21:56 2021 From: gstewart8 at cogeco.ca (Graham Stewart) Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2021 21:21:56 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Compression Post and Head Door Problems In-Reply-To: <64DDEEAB-508B-44B1-9252-21F44232DC24@adsne.com> References: <001d01d7142f$34043b70$9c0cb250$@ca> <64DDEEAB-508B-44B1-9252-21F44232DC24@adsne.com> Message-ID: <001b01d71554$261bc7f0$725357d0$@ca> Allyn: Good for you. These problems have a nasty habit of unfolding into bigger problems as you dig deeper. I ended up having to replace everything - floors, struts, bulkheads right fown to the bare hull. Hopefully you will not need to do that. In my case a previous owner had attempted the same repair but did a very poor job si I had to replace it all. Graham Stewart Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 Kingston Ontario -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf Of Allyn Baskerville Sent: Tuesday, March 9, 2021 6:19 PM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Compression Post and Head Door Problems Graham, you are correct. The floor support was not installed properly, which made the floor sag - the support was at least 1/4? too low under the front of the floor and 1? toward the back. Hence, no support directly under the compression post. I made the unfortunate mistake of attempting to remove the piece of wood (OSB) that was installed improperly. The board just crumbled into pieces. I should have screwed some other pieces on either side of the OSB to support the floor. I have a plan to fix, but it?s more work than just attacking to what was already in place. All wood that is going in is pressure treated and epoxy coated. Sent from my iPhone > On Mar 8, 2021, at 9:25 AM, Graham Stewart wrote: > > ?Allyn: > > I suspect the the compression post is not too short - unless someone shortened it. More likely it appears to be short because the floor under the post has given way. > > What is giving support to the post under the floor appears to vary considerably from boat to boat. If you do whatever works to support the post with something that is solid and will not deteriorate I think you will be fine. > > In some the concrete is part of the ballast so I would be reluctant to remove it unless it is breaking up. If possible use pressure-treated or epoxy-coated wood to fill the gap between the solid cement base to the bottom of the floor boards - which might need to be replaced to make them flat and at the correct height. You can check to see whether doing so makes the post fit. It is also possible that some previous owner removed the post with the mast up and had to shorten it to get it back in place. That would be a really dumb thing to do but not something so dumb I might have done it. If the post is still short you might shim it to be snug or replace it altogether. > > Graham Stewart > Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 > Kingston Ontario > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf Of Allyn Baskerville > Sent: Sunday, March 7, 2021 11:51 AM > To: rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org > Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Compression Post and Head Door Problems > > I got my boat out of the water yesterday, and the compression post fell out on the way to the dry slip. I took the wood off the compression post was resting on, and I was in for a surprise. It?s a box mostly made from PRESSED WOOD CHIPS filled with concrete. It?s resting in a fiberglass channel. > > The center most board provides the bulk of the support, but it wasn?t installed correctly. The front is about 1/4? short of where it should be, and the back is about 1? too low. > > The concrete is actually covered for about an inch with a mixture that is a bit gooey, hard, and rough. Concrete underneath. The plywood on the right is not marine or exterior - it?s the same as what my cabin is made of. I can see significant water damage on most of the wood. > > Unfortunately, I have to chip out the concrete to get the screws out and hopefully lift the box out. Anyone have a better idea than just chipping it out? I don?t want to damage the fiberglass. > > Thanks, all. > > [cid:C4C840CE-9F94-4812-A11D-205FF2668004] > > > [cid:0679DFCE-E64D-4D47-BBFC-31B4C130F4EA] > > > Sent from my iPhone > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: IMG_1909.jpg > Type: image/jpeg > Size: 125931 bytes > Desc: IMG_1909.jpg > URL: > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: IMG_1912.jpg > Type: image/jpeg > Size: 86938 bytes > Desc: IMG_1912.jpg > URL: > From reuben.mezrich at gmail.com Wed Mar 10 06:04:22 2021 From: reuben.mezrich at gmail.com (Reuben Mezrich) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2021 06:04:22 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first In-Reply-To: <9DCF803D-AB94-466D-9423-D6E6B24F240D@mac.com> References: <1613761250989-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <408F9401-E24B-4554-826E-DD98BFC0E1F3@stottarchitecture.com> <1614623625839-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <005601d70ed3$6283eba0$278bc2e0$@ebsmed.com> <916d9b93-9604-8b3a-c9d5-5c84c1acadb8@generalboats.com> <007501d70ee8$6edeb690$4c9c23b0$@ebsmed.com> <54709.24.140.30.102.1614707391.squirrel@quickpop.sssnet.com> <9DCF803D-AB94-466D-9423-D6E6B24F240D@mac.com> Message-ID: John The youtube video on using Butyl Tape to rebed stanchions is at : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Upksj19lyU Reuben Mezrich Pelican Cove in Sarasota Cell: 410-499-8922 On Tue, Mar 9, 2021 at 12:00 PM John Carlson via Rhodes22-list < rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org> wrote: > My pulpit is leaky as well, so I'm going to have to do this. Many thanks > for the detailed description. Any chance you have a link to the video you > found useful? Also, now that you've done it, would you have to cut the > electrical cords to use the butyl tape? > > -- > John Carlson > Lillipelli (2004/2012) > > > On Mar 9, 2021, at 10:25 AM, Reuben Mezrich > wrote: > > > > After receiving the many excellent suggestions on where to look for > leaks I > > started what ended being a 1 week process to find and ultimately repair > the > > leak. > > > > I first removed the cosmetic wood trim inside the forward cabin at the > bow > > to expose the attachments of the Jib chainplate and the Bow eye. I > sprayed > > water at the bow and determined these were not the source of the leaks. > I > > then sprayed water on the foredeck and initially saw no water leaking > into > > the boat but when I came back to the boat the next morning found that > some > > water (about 1 - 2 cups) had collected at the bow (By now I had removed > the > > cushions and so could see the water in a puddle on the floor of the > forward > > bunk at the bow). I had some sort of a slow leak. > > > > I then had my wife spray water on the foredeck while I was on my back in > > the forecabin and was able to see that there were leaks at each of the > four > > legs of the pulpit. The leaks would drip onto the carpeted shelf that is > at > > each side of the forecabin (behind a white fiberglass trim piece) and > then > > the water would slowly make its way forward to trickle down at the bow > end > > of the forecabin. > > > > The pulpit is attached by 3/8" bolts that are welded to each of the legs > > and which extend down through holes in the deck and fastened with a flat > > washer, lock washer and 9/16" nut. After unfastening the nuts the pulpit > > lifted up easily. One complication is that the electrical wires that feed > > the navigation lights at the bow extend through a seperate hole just > > forward of the hole for the aft-starboard bolt. That wire seems to run > back > > to the distribution panel and has very little slack and so I had to cut > > it. When I did remove the pulpit I found there was some white sealant > that > > adhered to the deck but not the pulpit leg (which ends in an oval flange > at > > the bottom) as well as an O-ring around the base of the bolt. > > > > After consulting with Stan, who told me that his preferred method for > > keeping water out is to just use an O-ring around the nut (and not to > apply > > sealant), I cleaned off the old sealant (a product called ReMov which was > > recommended in a Practical Sailor review, worked great for this) I put > new > > O-rings on. Rather than putting an O-ring around the electric wire near > the > > aft-starboard leg I put some wraps of butyl rubber tape abound it. > > I reattached the pulpit, tightened the nuts and had my wife spray the > > foredeck again and sadly found that there was again a leak (perhaps even > > worse than before) at each leg - but not where the electric wire entered > > the cabin. > > > > I removed the pulpit again, removed the o_rings and this time used Butyl > > tape to form the seal at each leg. Using a technique I found on You Tube > I > > cut a 3 - 4 inch length of the tape, rolled the tape along its length > into > > a tube (or rope) and then wrapped it several times about the base of the > > bolt. The thickness can be adjusted by adding more or less wraps and I > was > > generous, using the entire 3 - 4 inch tape at each leg. I added more > Butyl > > to the electric wire. > > > > After putting the pulpit back in place and only moderately tightening the > > nuts, my wife sprayed the foredeck again and this time - success - no > > leaks!! > > > > I have become a big fan of Butyl rubber tape, which to be honest I hadn't > > even heard about till last week! > > > > Of course now I have to splice back the electric wire for the navigation > > light and replace the cosmetic wood trim I removed, but I am much > relieved > > that this problem is solved > > > > Thanks for your advice and support > > > > --Reuben > > Reuben Mezrich > > Pelican Cove in Sarasota > > Cell: 410-499-8922 > > > > > > On Tue, Mar 2, 2021 at 12:49 PM cjlowe at sssnet.com>> wrote: > > > >> I like to tape paper towels around the suspected areas and see which > ones > >> show moisture first, then investigate further from there . > >> > >> > >> Jerry Lowe > >> S/V Country Rhodes '86 > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >>> Roger, Rob and Mike > >>> Thanks for the good suggestions. I'll start by taking off that > >> cosmeticsus > >>> piece of wood at the bow and see what's behind. If nothing is loose > I"ll > >>> have someone aim a hose at the bow while I"m inside watching in the > hope > >>> that I might actually see where the water is getting in. > >>> I really do hope I don't have to rebed everything. > >>> Probably won't be able to do this till the weekend..I"ll report back on > >>> what I find > >>> > >>> Reuben Mezrich > >>> Pelican Cove in Sarasota > >>> Cell: 410-499-8922 > >>> > >>> > >>> On Mon, Mar 1, 2021 at 5:15 PM Michael D. Weisner > > >>> wrote: > >>> > >>>> Reuben, > >>>> > >>>> I would check the bow eye. The wood backing block usually rots and the > >>>> eye > >>>> loosens up. Sometimes just lifting the boat using the bow eye will > cause > >>>> the eye to loosen as the wood compresses. > >>>> > >>>> Also, you may want to re-bed the bow pulpit rail deck fittings, > chocks, > >>>> etc. > >>>> > >>>> Mike > >>>> s/v Wind Lass ('91) > >>>> Nissequogue River, NY > >>>> I?d rather be sailing :~) > >>>> > >>>> -----Original Message----- > >>>> From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of > >>>> Reuben Mezrich > >>>> Sent: Monday, March 1, 2021 4:08 PM > >>>> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > >>>> Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first > >>>> > >>>> As I mentioned a week or two ago, I installed a Marinco 3" Day/night > >>>> solar > >>>> vent at the bow, using the hole already in place for the anchor > locker. > >>>> It > >>>> installed easily, seemed to work fine but a few days later we had a > >>>> heavy > >>>> rain and the next day the forward tips of the forward cabin cushions > >>>> were > >>>> wet. I removed the vent, replaced the deck plate, installed a new > gasket > >>>> under the deck plate, applied a generous amount of RTV silicone to > both > >>>> sides of the gasket and reinstalled the solar vent. The next day > >>>> (yesterday > >>>> actually) I used a hose to rain water on the forward deck, aiming at > the > >>>> solar vent for about 6 minutes and when I checked below everything was > >>>> dry. > >>>> I checked again in an hour and it was still dry. > >>>> This morning there was about a cup of water, maybe two cups of water > at > >>>> the bow. There was no water in the tray that serves as the anchor > locker > >>>> and which is directly under the solar vent. The vent itself was dry as > >>>> was > >>>> the ceiling around the vent. The walls were also dry. I dried the > water > >>>> with a towel and a few hours later a small amount of water seemed to > be > >>>> seeping under a triangular piece of wood at the very bow of the boat > >>>> (see > >>>> attached photo). I haven't removed that piece of wood yet but I'm > pretty > >>>> sure I'll find the bolts from the chain plate at the bow for the jib > >>>> stay. > >>>> My feeling now is that the solar vent was never the source of the leak > >>>> but > >>>> I've had a small leak for a while but never noticed because I never > had > >>>> a > >>>> reason to go up to the very front of the forward cabin. As it turns > out > >>>> the > >>>> bottom of the cushions, which are rubberized are stained, giving > >>>> evidence > >>>> that the leak is likely long standing. > >>>> Those bolts would be my best guess as the source of the leak but I'd > >>>> look > >>>> forward to suggestions as to where else I might look. > >>>> > >>>> Its always something > >>>> > >>>> --Reuben > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> Reuben Mezrich > >>>> Pelican Cove in Sarasota > >>>> Cell: 410-499-8922 > >>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>> -------------- next part -------------- > >>>> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > >>>> Name: Screen Shot 2021-03-01 at 4.02.36 PM.png > >>>> Type: image/png > >>>> Size: 1826288 bytes > >>>> Desc: not available > >>>> URL: < > >>>> > >> > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210301/6a1cf705/attachment.png > > From reuben.mezrich at gmail.com Wed Mar 10 06:09:15 2021 From: reuben.mezrich at gmail.com (Reuben Mezrich) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2021 06:09:15 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first In-Reply-To: <9DCF803D-AB94-466D-9423-D6E6B24F240D@mac.com> References: <1613761250989-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <408F9401-E24B-4554-826E-DD98BFC0E1F3@stottarchitecture.com> <1614623625839-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <005601d70ed3$6283eba0$278bc2e0$@ebsmed.com> <916d9b93-9604-8b3a-c9d5-5c84c1acadb8@generalboats.com> <007501d70ee8$6edeb690$4c9c23b0$@ebsmed.com> <54709.24.140.30.102.1614707391.squirrel@quickpop.sssnet.com> <9DCF803D-AB94-466D-9423-D6E6B24F240D@mac.com> Message-ID: John Cutting the electrical cord was necessary because it was one continuous cord from the distribution panel to the navigation light with almost no slack. Jesse's boat had connectors that let him avoid the need to cut. I had no such luck. But even with connectors I would have used Butyl tape around the wire at the point where it entered the deck (which is just forward of the bolt and under the leg's flange) --Reuben Reuben Mezrich Pelican Cove in Sarasota Cell: 410-499-8922 On Tue, Mar 9, 2021 at 12:00 PM John Carlson via Rhodes22-list < rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org> wrote: > My pulpit is leaky as well, so I'm going to have to do this. Many thanks > for the detailed description. Any chance you have a link to the video you > found useful? Also, now that you've done it, would you have to cut the > electrical cords to use the butyl tape? > > -- > John Carlson > Lillipelli (2004/2012) > > > On Mar 9, 2021, at 10:25 AM, Reuben Mezrich > wrote: > > > > After receiving the many excellent suggestions on where to look for > leaks I > > started what ended being a 1 week process to find and ultimately repair > the > > leak. > > > > I first removed the cosmetic wood trim inside the forward cabin at the > bow > > to expose the attachments of the Jib chainplate and the Bow eye. I > sprayed > > water at the bow and determined these were not the source of the leaks. > I > > then sprayed water on the foredeck and initially saw no water leaking > into > > the boat but when I came back to the boat the next morning found that > some > > water (about 1 - 2 cups) had collected at the bow (By now I had removed > the > > cushions and so could see the water in a puddle on the floor of the > forward > > bunk at the bow). I had some sort of a slow leak. > > > > I then had my wife spray water on the foredeck while I was on my back in > > the forecabin and was able to see that there were leaks at each of the > four > > legs of the pulpit. The leaks would drip onto the carpeted shelf that is > at > > each side of the forecabin (behind a white fiberglass trim piece) and > then > > the water would slowly make its way forward to trickle down at the bow > end > > of the forecabin. > > > > The pulpit is attached by 3/8" bolts that are welded to each of the legs > > and which extend down through holes in the deck and fastened with a flat > > washer, lock washer and 9/16" nut. After unfastening the nuts the pulpit > > lifted up easily. One complication is that the electrical wires that feed > > the navigation lights at the bow extend through a seperate hole just > > forward of the hole for the aft-starboard bolt. That wire seems to run > back > > to the distribution panel and has very little slack and so I had to cut > > it. When I did remove the pulpit I found there was some white sealant > that > > adhered to the deck but not the pulpit leg (which ends in an oval flange > at > > the bottom) as well as an O-ring around the base of the bolt. > > > > After consulting with Stan, who told me that his preferred method for > > keeping water out is to just use an O-ring around the nut (and not to > apply > > sealant), I cleaned off the old sealant (a product called ReMov which was > > recommended in a Practical Sailor review, worked great for this) I put > new > > O-rings on. Rather than putting an O-ring around the electric wire near > the > > aft-starboard leg I put some wraps of butyl rubber tape abound it. > > I reattached the pulpit, tightened the nuts and had my wife spray the > > foredeck again and sadly found that there was again a leak (perhaps even > > worse than before) at each leg - but not where the electric wire entered > > the cabin. > > > > I removed the pulpit again, removed the o_rings and this time used Butyl > > tape to form the seal at each leg. Using a technique I found on You Tube > I > > cut a 3 - 4 inch length of the tape, rolled the tape along its length > into > > a tube (or rope) and then wrapped it several times about the base of the > > bolt. The thickness can be adjusted by adding more or less wraps and I > was > > generous, using the entire 3 - 4 inch tape at each leg. I added more > Butyl > > to the electric wire. > > > > After putting the pulpit back in place and only moderately tightening the > > nuts, my wife sprayed the foredeck again and this time - success - no > > leaks!! > > > > I have become a big fan of Butyl rubber tape, which to be honest I hadn't > > even heard about till last week! > > > > Of course now I have to splice back the electric wire for the navigation > > light and replace the cosmetic wood trim I removed, but I am much > relieved > > that this problem is solved > > > > Thanks for your advice and support > > > > --Reuben > > Reuben Mezrich > > Pelican Cove in Sarasota > > Cell: 410-499-8922 > > > > > > On Tue, Mar 2, 2021 at 12:49 PM cjlowe at sssnet.com>> wrote: > > > >> I like to tape paper towels around the suspected areas and see which > ones > >> show moisture first, then investigate further from there . > >> > >> > >> Jerry Lowe > >> S/V Country Rhodes '86 > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >>> Roger, Rob and Mike > >>> Thanks for the good suggestions. I'll start by taking off that > >> cosmeticsus > >>> piece of wood at the bow and see what's behind. If nothing is loose > I"ll > >>> have someone aim a hose at the bow while I"m inside watching in the > hope > >>> that I might actually see where the water is getting in. > >>> I really do hope I don't have to rebed everything. > >>> Probably won't be able to do this till the weekend..I"ll report back on > >>> what I find > >>> > >>> Reuben Mezrich > >>> Pelican Cove in Sarasota > >>> Cell: 410-499-8922 > >>> > >>> > >>> On Mon, Mar 1, 2021 at 5:15 PM Michael D. Weisner > > >>> wrote: > >>> > >>>> Reuben, > >>>> > >>>> I would check the bow eye. The wood backing block usually rots and the > >>>> eye > >>>> loosens up. Sometimes just lifting the boat using the bow eye will > cause > >>>> the eye to loosen as the wood compresses. > >>>> > >>>> Also, you may want to re-bed the bow pulpit rail deck fittings, > chocks, > >>>> etc. > >>>> > >>>> Mike > >>>> s/v Wind Lass ('91) > >>>> Nissequogue River, NY > >>>> I?d rather be sailing :~) > >>>> > >>>> -----Original Message----- > >>>> From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of > >>>> Reuben Mezrich > >>>> Sent: Monday, March 1, 2021 4:08 PM > >>>> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > >>>> Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first > >>>> > >>>> As I mentioned a week or two ago, I installed a Marinco 3" Day/night > >>>> solar > >>>> vent at the bow, using the hole already in place for the anchor > locker. > >>>> It > >>>> installed easily, seemed to work fine but a few days later we had a > >>>> heavy > >>>> rain and the next day the forward tips of the forward cabin cushions > >>>> were > >>>> wet. I removed the vent, replaced the deck plate, installed a new > gasket > >>>> under the deck plate, applied a generous amount of RTV silicone to > both > >>>> sides of the gasket and reinstalled the solar vent. The next day > >>>> (yesterday > >>>> actually) I used a hose to rain water on the forward deck, aiming at > the > >>>> solar vent for about 6 minutes and when I checked below everything was > >>>> dry. > >>>> I checked again in an hour and it was still dry. > >>>> This morning there was about a cup of water, maybe two cups of water > at > >>>> the bow. There was no water in the tray that serves as the anchor > locker > >>>> and which is directly under the solar vent. The vent itself was dry as > >>>> was > >>>> the ceiling around the vent. The walls were also dry. I dried the > water > >>>> with a towel and a few hours later a small amount of water seemed to > be > >>>> seeping under a triangular piece of wood at the very bow of the boat > >>>> (see > >>>> attached photo). I haven't removed that piece of wood yet but I'm > pretty > >>>> sure I'll find the bolts from the chain plate at the bow for the jib > >>>> stay. > >>>> My feeling now is that the solar vent was never the source of the leak > >>>> but > >>>> I've had a small leak for a while but never noticed because I never > had > >>>> a > >>>> reason to go up to the very front of the forward cabin. As it turns > out > >>>> the > >>>> bottom of the cushions, which are rubberized are stained, giving > >>>> evidence > >>>> that the leak is likely long standing. > >>>> Those bolts would be my best guess as the source of the leak but I'd > >>>> look > >>>> forward to suggestions as to where else I might look. > >>>> > >>>> Its always something > >>>> > >>>> --Reuben > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> Reuben Mezrich > >>>> Pelican Cove in Sarasota > >>>> Cell: 410-499-8922 > >>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>> -------------- next part -------------- > >>>> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > >>>> Name: Screen Shot 2021-03-01 at 4.02.36 PM.png > >>>> Type: image/png > >>>> Size: 1826288 bytes > >>>> Desc: not available > >>>> URL: < > >>>> > >> > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210301/6a1cf705/attachment.png > > From reuben.mezrich at gmail.com Wed Mar 10 06:15:18 2021 From: reuben.mezrich at gmail.com (Reuben Mezrich) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2021 06:15:18 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first In-Reply-To: <009001d71503$2219f290$664dd7b0$@ca> References: <1613761250989-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <408F9401-E24B-4554-826E-DD98BFC0E1F3@stottarchitecture.com> <1614623625839-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <005601d70ed3$6283eba0$278bc2e0$@ebsmed.com> <916d9b93-9604-8b3a-c9d5-5c84c1acadb8@generalboats.com> <007501d70ee8$6edeb690$4c9c23b0$@ebsmed.com> <54709.24.140.30.102.1614707391.squirrel@quickpop.sssnet.com> <009001d71503$2219f290$664dd7b0$@ca> Message-ID: Graham thanks for the suggestions on watching for creep and cleaning up the butyl...haven't seen it yet but I'll look as it gets warmer down here in Sarasota. As to the deck, to be honest I didn't think to look for damage. I don't know what the deck is made of...it looks and feels solid. At the hole for the solar vent I could see the deck in cross-section and it sure looks like solid fiberglass nearly one inch thick...is that possible? --Reuben Reuben Mezrich Pelican Cove in Sarasota Cell: 410-499-8922 On Tue, Mar 9, 2021 at 11:42 AM Graham Stewart wrote: > I love butyl tape and use it everywhere that does not require adhesive > properties or below the waterline. It seals beautifully and also allows the > removal of the hardware easily. > > BTW, to clean up squeeze out you can get most of it off by using a small > ball of butyl that will stick to the squeeze out and lift most of it. The > remaining bits can be cleaned up easily with turpentine. You may find that > the squeeze out will continue to flow for a very long time. > > Did you consider whether there might have been any damage to the core oy > your deck from the water? I would be concerned about that especially if the > core is wood. > > Graham Stewart > gstewart8 at cogeco.ca > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf > Of Reuben Mezrich > Sent: Tuesday, March 9, 2021 11:25 AM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first > > After receiving the many excellent suggestions on where to look for leaks I > started what ended being a 1 week process to find and ultimately repair the > leak. > > I first removed the cosmetic wood trim inside the forward cabin at the bow > to expose the attachments of the Jib chainplate and the Bow eye. I sprayed > water at the bow and determined these were not the source of the leaks. I > then sprayed water on the foredeck and initially saw no water leaking into > the boat but when I came back to the boat the next morning found that some > water (about 1 - 2 cups) had collected at the bow (By now I had removed the > cushions and so could see the water in a puddle on the floor of the forward > bunk at the bow). I had some sort of a slow leak. > > I then had my wife spray water on the foredeck while I was on my back in > the forecabin and was able to see that there were leaks at each of the four > legs of the pulpit. The leaks would drip onto the carpeted shelf that is at > each side of the forecabin (behind a white fiberglass trim piece) and then > the water would slowly make its way forward to trickle down at the bow end > of the forecabin. > > The pulpit is attached by 3/8" bolts that are welded to each of the legs > and which extend down through holes in the deck and fastened with a flat > washer, lock washer and 9/16" nut. After unfastening the nuts the pulpit > lifted up easily. One complication is that the electrical wires that feed > the navigation lights at the bow extend through a seperate hole just > forward of the hole for the aft-starboard bolt. That wire seems to run back > to the distribution panel and has very little slack and so I had to cut > it. When I did remove the pulpit I found there was some white sealant that > adhered to the deck but not the pulpit leg (which ends in an oval flange at > the bottom) as well as an O-ring around the base of the bolt. > > After consulting with Stan, who told me that his preferred method for > keeping water out is to just use an O-ring around the nut (and not to apply > sealant), I cleaned off the old sealant (a product called ReMov which was > recommended in a Practical Sailor review, worked great for this) I put new > O-rings on. Rather than putting an O-ring around the electric wire near the > aft-starboard leg I put some wraps of butyl rubber tape abound it. > I reattached the pulpit, tightened the nuts and had my wife spray the > foredeck again and sadly found that there was again a leak (perhaps even > worse than before) at each leg - but not where the electric wire entered > the cabin. > > I removed the pulpit again, removed the o_rings and this time used Butyl > tape to form the seal at each leg. Using a technique I found on You Tube I > cut a 3 - 4 inch length of the tape, rolled the tape along its length into > a tube (or rope) and then wrapped it several times about the base of the > bolt. The thickness can be adjusted by adding more or less wraps and I was > generous, using the entire 3 - 4 inch tape at each leg. I added more Butyl > to the electric wire. > > After putting the pulpit back in place and only moderately tightening the > nuts, my wife sprayed the foredeck again and this time - success - no > leaks!! > > I have become a big fan of Butyl rubber tape, which to be honest I hadn't > even heard about till last week! > > Of course now I have to splice back the electric wire for the navigation > light and replace the cosmetic wood trim I removed, but I am much relieved > that this problem is solved > > Thanks for your advice and support > > --Reuben > Reuben Mezrich > Pelican Cove in Sarasota > Cell: 410-499-8922 > > > On Tue, Mar 2, 2021 at 12:49 PM wrote: > > > I like to tape paper towels around the suspected areas and see which ones > > show moisture first, then investigate further from there . > > > > > > Jerry Lowe > > S/V Country Rhodes '86 > > > > > > > > > > > > > Roger, Rob and Mike > > > Thanks for the good suggestions. I'll start by taking off that > > cosmeticsus > > > piece of wood at the bow and see what's behind. If nothing is loose > I"ll > > > have someone aim a hose at the bow while I"m inside watching in the > hope > > > that I might actually see where the water is getting in. > > > I really do hope I don't have to rebed everything. > > > Probably won't be able to do this till the weekend..I"ll report back on > > > what I find > > > > > > Reuben Mezrich > > > Pelican Cove in Sarasota > > > Cell: 410-499-8922 > > > > > > > > > On Mon, Mar 1, 2021 at 5:15 PM Michael D. Weisner > > > > wrote: > > > > > >> Reuben, > > >> > > >> I would check the bow eye. The wood backing block usually rots and the > > >> eye > > >> loosens up. Sometimes just lifting the boat using the bow eye will > cause > > >> the eye to loosen as the wood compresses. > > >> > > >> Also, you may want to re-bed the bow pulpit rail deck fittings, > chocks, > > >> etc. > > >> > > >> Mike > > >> s/v Wind Lass ('91) > > >> Nissequogue River, NY > > >> I?d rather be sailing :~) > > >> > > >> -----Original Message----- > > >> From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of > > >> Reuben Mezrich > > >> Sent: Monday, March 1, 2021 4:08 PM > > >> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > > >> Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first > > >> > > >> As I mentioned a week or two ago, I installed a Marinco 3" Day/night > > >> solar > > >> vent at the bow, using the hole already in place for the anchor > locker. > > >> It > > >> installed easily, seemed to work fine but a few days later we had a > > >> heavy > > >> rain and the next day the forward tips of the forward cabin cushions > > >> were > > >> wet. I removed the vent, replaced the deck plate, installed a new > gasket > > >> under the deck plate, applied a generous amount of RTV silicone to > both > > >> sides of the gasket and reinstalled the solar vent. The next day > > >> (yesterday > > >> actually) I used a hose to rain water on the forward deck, aiming at > the > > >> solar vent for about 6 minutes and when I checked below everything was > > >> dry. > > >> I checked again in an hour and it was still dry. > > >> This morning there was about a cup of water, maybe two cups of water > at > > >> the bow. There was no water in the tray that serves as the anchor > locker > > >> and which is directly under the solar vent. The vent itself was dry as > > >> was > > >> the ceiling around the vent. The walls were also dry. I dried the > water > > >> with a towel and a few hours later a small amount of water seemed to > be > > >> seeping under a triangular piece of wood at the very bow of the boat > > >> (see > > >> attached photo). I haven't removed that piece of wood yet but I'm > pretty > > >> sure I'll find the bolts from the chain plate at the bow for the jib > > >> stay. > > >> My feeling now is that the solar vent was never the source of the leak > > >> but > > >> I've had a small leak for a while but never noticed because I never > had > > >> a > > >> reason to go up to the very front of the forward cabin. As it turns > out > > >> the > > >> bottom of the cushions, which are rubberized are stained, giving > > >> evidence > > >> that the leak is likely long standing. > > >> Those bolts would be my best guess as the source of the leak but I'd > > >> look > > >> forward to suggestions as to where else I might look. > > >> > > >> Its always something > > >> > > >> --Reuben > > >> > > >> > > >> Reuben Mezrich > > >> Pelican Cove in Sarasota > > >> Cell: 410-499-8922 > > >> > > >> > > > >> > > > >> -------------- next part -------------- > > >> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > > >> Name: Screen Shot 2021-03-01 at 4.02.36 PM.png > > >> Type: image/png > > >> Size: 1826288 bytes > > >> Desc: not available > > >> URL: < > > >> > > > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210301/6a1cf705/attachment.png > > >> > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > From gstewart8 at cogeco.ca Wed Mar 10 09:22:21 2021 From: gstewart8 at cogeco.ca (Graham Stewart) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2021 09:22:21 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first In-Reply-To: References: <1613761250989-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <408F9401-E24B-4554-826E-DD98BFC0E1F3@stottarchitecture.com> <1614623625839-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <005601d70ed3$6283eba0$278bc2e0$@ebsmed.com> <916d9b93-9604-8b3a-c9d5-5c84c1acadb8@generalboats.com> <007501d70ee8$6edeb690$4c9c23b0$@ebsmed.com> <54709.24.140.30.102.1614707391.squirrel@quickpop.sssnet.com> <009001d71503$2219f290$664dd7b0$@ca> Message-ID: <003501d715b8$ca4256f0$5ec704d0$@ca> Reuben: No, the deck is not solid fiberglass. In most cases it is comprised of a sandwich construction with plywood between a heavier fiberglass deck and thin inside liner. I understand that later models of the boat utilized a foam core which would not have the problem of core rot but I don't know when that change occurred. What year is your boat? In my case the plywood separated from the deck skin resulting in a soft deck that would flex when you walked on it. I thought that the soft deck was due to rot in the core so I cut the duck in half immediately in front of the cabin, removed the bow section of the deck entirely, separated the liner, removed the core and replaced it with marine plywood encased in epoxy and then reinstalled the unit. This gave me the chance to examine the core construction in detail. What I had is not necessarily what you would have. My boat is a 1976 and clearly boats of that vintage were not built to the standards of later boats. Apparently these early boats were built by contractors who I can attest cut many corners. In my case the core was the cheapest plywood (i.e., not even exterior) with large voids. The layers of the plywood had separated and the plywood itself was attached to the deck skin with occasional strips of some sort of sealant which had long past let go. I could remove the core with my hands. Except for one area of about 1' square where the head air vent came through the deck there was no rot so the extreme measures I took turned out to be unnecessary. Carefully injecting epoxy into the core might have been sufficient. The problem was that until you look inside the deck, you it is difficult to know what is wrong or how well the injection process is working. Knowing what I learned from the deck reconstruction I was able to use the injection method quite successfully on the side deck - so far as I can tell. By looking at the core from where the deck was removed I could tell that delimitation had occurred there as well but without any sign of rot. Knowing what the problem was I was able to inject thickened epoxy into the core without going through the core - in which case the injected epoxy would have simply pooled in the space between the core and the liner. The liner is solidly attached to the core on the cabin top but not the side decks. By avoiding this problem I could inject the epoxy into one hole until it came up through the next hole giving me a pretty good indication that most of the voids in the plywood and the space between the core and the deck skin were filled. By removing the solar vent in the cabin top I was able to see that the core, at least in that area, appeared to be solid. Certainly there was not flex in the deck there so I concluded that I could leave the cabin top as is. I am not telling you this because I think that this is something you should do - quite the contrary - it is simply to describe what the core was like for my vintage of boat. I have posted pictures of the process and the state of the core in previous times but if you or anyone would like to see them and can't find those pictures in the archive I would be happy to post them again. Whenever a bolt is removed from a deck it is a very good idea to determine whether water has made its way into the core and to also ensure that the hole is property sealed with epoxy before the bolt is replaced. If water is coming into the boat there is an excellent chance that it was also making its way into the core unless the hole was previously prepared properly. The best way to prepare the hole that I have seen is to enlarge the hole going through the core without enlarging the hole in the fiberglass deck and liner skins. I did this using a dremmel bit that looks like this: https://www.leevalley.com/en-ca/shop/tools/power-tool-accessories/burrs/31016-hss-carvers-burrs . It has a shank that is about 1/8" and a cutter cylinder that is about 1/4". The bit will fit through the deck hole and then by moving it around you remove wood creating a hole below thr surface that is about 5/8". Check the wood dust that is removed to see if it is wet or appears rotted. If there are signs of rot/water, try remove more of the core to get back to good wood. If you still have signs of rot you might need to consider a more extensive fix. Put tape over the hole on the inside liner and then coat the hole with un-thickened epoxy and then pack it with thickened epoxy. Once the epoxy is set re-drill the hole for the bolt. In my experience it is MUCH easier to drill the hole when the epoxy is set - solid but not sticky - but before it cures completely. In this semi-cured state drilling straight through is much easier. Once cured, the epoxy is much harder than the surrounding material and the drill bit will want to wander. Using a brad point bit also helps. This gives a solid and waterproof plug between the deck and inner skins. All this is a bit fussy but not difficult to do and gives you reasonable assurance that the deck core is protected. You really really want to avoid having to replace sections of the core. Graham Stewart Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 Kingston Ontario -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf Of Reuben Mezrich Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 2021 6:15 AM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first Graham thanks for the suggestions on watching for creep and cleaning up the butyl...haven't seen it yet but I'll look as it gets warmer down here in Sarasota. As to the deck, to be honest I didn't think to look for damage. I don't know what the deck is made of...it looks and feels solid. At the hole for the solar vent I could see the deck in cross-section and it sure looks like solid fiberglass nearly one inch thick...is that possible? --Reuben Reuben Mezrich Pelican Cove in Sarasota Cell: 410-499-8922 On Tue, Mar 9, 2021 at 11:42 AM Graham Stewart wrote: > I love butyl tape and use it everywhere that does not require adhesive > properties or below the waterline. It seals beautifully and also allows the > removal of the hardware easily. > > BTW, to clean up squeeze out you can get most of it off by using a small > ball of butyl that will stick to the squeeze out and lift most of it. The > remaining bits can be cleaned up easily with turpentine. You may find that > the squeeze out will continue to flow for a very long time. > > Did you consider whether there might have been any damage to the core oy > your deck from the water? I would be concerned about that especially if the > core is wood. > > Graham Stewart > gstewart8 at cogeco.ca > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf > Of Reuben Mezrich > Sent: Tuesday, March 9, 2021 11:25 AM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first > > After receiving the many excellent suggestions on where to look for leaks I > started what ended being a 1 week process to find and ultimately repair the > leak. > > I first removed the cosmetic wood trim inside the forward cabin at the bow > to expose the attachments of the Jib chainplate and the Bow eye. I sprayed > water at the bow and determined these were not the source of the leaks. I > then sprayed water on the foredeck and initially saw no water leaking into > the boat but when I came back to the boat the next morning found that some > water (about 1 - 2 cups) had collected at the bow (By now I had removed the > cushions and so could see the water in a puddle on the floor of the forward > bunk at the bow). I had some sort of a slow leak. > > I then had my wife spray water on the foredeck while I was on my back in > the forecabin and was able to see that there were leaks at each of the four > legs of the pulpit. The leaks would drip onto the carpeted shelf that is at > each side of the forecabin (behind a white fiberglass trim piece) and then > the water would slowly make its way forward to trickle down at the bow end > of the forecabin. > > The pulpit is attached by 3/8" bolts that are welded to each of the legs > and which extend down through holes in the deck and fastened with a flat > washer, lock washer and 9/16" nut. After unfastening the nuts the pulpit > lifted up easily. One complication is that the electrical wires that feed > the navigation lights at the bow extend through a seperate hole just > forward of the hole for the aft-starboard bolt. That wire seems to run back > to the distribution panel and has very little slack and so I had to cut > it. When I did remove the pulpit I found there was some white sealant that > adhered to the deck but not the pulpit leg (which ends in an oval flange at > the bottom) as well as an O-ring around the base of the bolt. > > After consulting with Stan, who told me that his preferred method for > keeping water out is to just use an O-ring around the nut (and not to apply > sealant), I cleaned off the old sealant (a product called ReMov which was > recommended in a Practical Sailor review, worked great for this) I put new > O-rings on. Rather than putting an O-ring around the electric wire near the > aft-starboard leg I put some wraps of butyl rubber tape abound it. > I reattached the pulpit, tightened the nuts and had my wife spray the > foredeck again and sadly found that there was again a leak (perhaps even > worse than before) at each leg - but not where the electric wire entered > the cabin. > > I removed the pulpit again, removed the o_rings and this time used Butyl > tape to form the seal at each leg. Using a technique I found on You Tube I > cut a 3 - 4 inch length of the tape, rolled the tape along its length into > a tube (or rope) and then wrapped it several times about the base of the > bolt. The thickness can be adjusted by adding more or less wraps and I was > generous, using the entire 3 - 4 inch tape at each leg. I added more Butyl > to the electric wire. > > After putting the pulpit back in place and only moderately tightening the > nuts, my wife sprayed the foredeck again and this time - success - no > leaks!! > > I have become a big fan of Butyl rubber tape, which to be honest I hadn't > even heard about till last week! > > Of course now I have to splice back the electric wire for the navigation > light and replace the cosmetic wood trim I removed, but I am much relieved > that this problem is solved > > Thanks for your advice and support > > --Reuben > Reuben Mezrich > Pelican Cove in Sarasota > Cell: 410-499-8922 > > > On Tue, Mar 2, 2021 at 12:49 PM wrote: > > > I like to tape paper towels around the suspected areas and see which ones > > show moisture first, then investigate further from there . > > > > > > Jerry Lowe > > S/V Country Rhodes '86 > > > > > > > > > > > > > Roger, Rob and Mike > > > Thanks for the good suggestions. I'll start by taking off that > > cosmeticsus > > > piece of wood at the bow and see what's behind. If nothing is loose > I"ll > > > have someone aim a hose at the bow while I"m inside watching in the > hope > > > that I might actually see where the water is getting in. > > > I really do hope I don't have to rebed everything. > > > Probably won't be able to do this till the weekend..I"ll report back on > > > what I find > > > > > > Reuben Mezrich > > > Pelican Cove in Sarasota > > > Cell: 410-499-8922 > > > > > > > > > On Mon, Mar 1, 2021 at 5:15 PM Michael D. Weisner > > > > wrote: > > > > > >> Reuben, > > >> > > >> I would check the bow eye. The wood backing block usually rots and the > > >> eye > > >> loosens up. Sometimes just lifting the boat using the bow eye will > cause > > >> the eye to loosen as the wood compresses. > > >> > > >> Also, you may want to re-bed the bow pulpit rail deck fittings, > chocks, > > >> etc. > > >> > > >> Mike > > >> s/v Wind Lass ('91) > > >> Nissequogue River, NY > > >> I?d rather be sailing :~) > > >> > > >> -----Original Message----- > > >> From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of > > >> Reuben Mezrich > > >> Sent: Monday, March 1, 2021 4:08 PM > > >> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > > >> Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first > > >> > > >> As I mentioned a week or two ago, I installed a Marinco 3" Day/night > > >> solar > > >> vent at the bow, using the hole already in place for the anchor > locker. > > >> It > > >> installed easily, seemed to work fine but a few days later we had a > > >> heavy > > >> rain and the next day the forward tips of the forward cabin cushions > > >> were > > >> wet. I removed the vent, replaced the deck plate, installed a new > gasket > > >> under the deck plate, applied a generous amount of RTV silicone to > both > > >> sides of the gasket and reinstalled the solar vent. The next day > > >> (yesterday > > >> actually) I used a hose to rain water on the forward deck, aiming at > the > > >> solar vent for about 6 minutes and when I checked below everything was > > >> dry. > > >> I checked again in an hour and it was still dry. > > >> This morning there was about a cup of water, maybe two cups of water > at > > >> the bow. There was no water in the tray that serves as the anchor > locker > > >> and which is directly under the solar vent. The vent itself was dry as > > >> was > > >> the ceiling around the vent. The walls were also dry. I dried the > water > > >> with a towel and a few hours later a small amount of water seemed to > be > > >> seeping under a triangular piece of wood at the very bow of the boat > > >> (see > > >> attached photo). I haven't removed that piece of wood yet but I'm > pretty > > >> sure I'll find the bolts from the chain plate at the bow for the jib > > >> stay. > > >> My feeling now is that the solar vent was never the source of the leak > > >> but > > >> I've had a small leak for a while but never noticed because I never > had > > >> a > > >> reason to go up to the very front of the forward cabin. As it turns > out > > >> the > > >> bottom of the cushions, which are rubberized are stained, giving > > >> evidence > > >> that the leak is likely long standing. > > >> Those bolts would be my best guess as the source of the leak but I'd > > >> look > > >> forward to suggestions as to where else I might look. > > >> > > >> Its always something > > >> > > >> --Reuben > > >> > > >> > > >> Reuben Mezrich > > >> Pelican Cove in Sarasota > > >> Cell: 410-499-8922 > > >> > > >> > > > >> > > > >> -------------- next part -------------- > > >> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > > >> Name: Screen Shot 2021-03-01 at 4.02.36 PM.png > > >> Type: image/png > > >> Size: 1826288 bytes > > >> Desc: not available > > >> URL: < > > >> > > > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210301/6a1cf705/attachment.png > > >> > > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > From reuben.mezrich at gmail.com Wed Mar 10 10:01:39 2021 From: reuben.mezrich at gmail.com (Reuben Mezrich) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2021 10:01:39 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first In-Reply-To: <003501d715b8$ca4256f0$5ec704d0$@ca> References: <1613761250989-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <408F9401-E24B-4554-826E-DD98BFC0E1F3@stottarchitecture.com> <1614623625839-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <005601d70ed3$6283eba0$278bc2e0$@ebsmed.com> <916d9b93-9604-8b3a-c9d5-5c84c1acadb8@generalboats.com> <007501d70ee8$6edeb690$4c9c23b0$@ebsmed.com> <54709.24.140.30.102.1614707391.squirrel@quickpop.sssnet.com> <009001d71503$2219f290$664dd7b0$@ca> <003501d715b8$ca4256f0$5ec704d0$@ca> Message-ID: Graham Thank you for this fantastic, detailed, discussion of how the boat (at least the deck) is built and how to repair any damage. So far my deck seems solid without any flex but I'll keep on the lookout. As to when my boat was initially built, I'm not sure. I ordered the rebuilt boat in the spring of 2020 and received it in December, 2020. The HIN indicates it was built (or rebuilt) in 2018. I've asked Stan when it was initially built but haven't heard back yet. Again, I thank you and the rest of da list, for your advice and support. I know I'll be calling on your help often going forward. --Reuben Reuben Mezrich Pelican Cove in Sarasota Cell: 410-499-8922 On Wed, Mar 10, 2021 at 9:22 AM Graham Stewart wrote: > Reuben: > > No, the deck is not solid fiberglass. In most cases it is comprised of a > sandwich construction with plywood between a heavier fiberglass deck and > thin inside liner. I understand that later models of the boat utilized a > foam core which would not have the problem of core rot but I don't know > when that change occurred. What year is your boat? > > In my case the plywood separated from the deck skin resulting in a soft > deck that would flex when you walked on it. I thought that the soft deck > was due to rot in the core so I cut the duck in half immediately in front > of the cabin, removed the bow section of the deck entirely, separated the > liner, removed the core and replaced it with marine plywood encased in > epoxy and then reinstalled the unit. This gave me the chance to examine the > core construction in detail. What I had is not necessarily what you would > have. My boat is a 1976 and clearly boats of that vintage were not built to > the standards of later boats. Apparently these early boats were built by > contractors who I can attest cut many corners. > > In my case the core was the cheapest plywood (i.e., not even exterior) > with large voids. The layers of the plywood had separated and the plywood > itself was attached to the deck skin with occasional strips of some sort of > sealant which had long past let go. I could remove the core with my hands. > > Except for one area of about 1' square where the head air vent came > through the deck there was no rot so the extreme measures I took turned out > to be unnecessary. Carefully injecting epoxy into the core might have been > sufficient. The problem was that until you look inside the deck, you it is > difficult to know what is wrong or how well the injection process is > working. > > Knowing what I learned from the deck reconstruction I was able to use the > injection method quite successfully on the side deck - so far as I can > tell. By looking at the core from where the deck was removed I could tell > that delimitation had occurred there as well but without any sign of rot. > Knowing what the problem was I was able to inject thickened epoxy into the > core without going through the core - in which case the injected epoxy > would have simply pooled in the space between the core and the liner. The > liner is solidly attached to the core on the cabin top but not the side > decks. By avoiding this problem I could inject the epoxy into one hole > until it came up through the next hole giving me a pretty good indication > that most of the voids in the plywood and the space between the core and > the deck skin were filled. > > By removing the solar vent in the cabin top I was able to see that the > core, at least in that area, appeared to be solid. Certainly there was not > flex in the deck there so I concluded that I could leave the cabin top as > is. > > I am not telling you this because I think that this is something you > should do - quite the contrary - it is simply to describe what the core was > like for my vintage of boat. I have posted pictures of the process and the > state of the core in previous times but if you or anyone would like to see > them and can't find those pictures in the archive I would be happy to post > them again. > > Whenever a bolt is removed from a deck it is a very good idea to determine > whether water has made its way into the core and to also ensure that the > hole is property sealed with epoxy before the bolt is replaced. If water is > coming into the boat there is an excellent chance that it was also making > its way into the core unless the hole was previously prepared properly. > > The best way to prepare the hole that I have seen is to enlarge the hole > going through the core without enlarging the hole in the fiberglass deck > and liner skins. I did this using a dremmel bit that looks like this: > https://www.leevalley.com/en-ca/shop/tools/power-tool-accessories/burrs/31016-hss-carvers-burrs > . It has a shank that is about 1/8" and a cutter cylinder that is about > 1/4". The bit will fit through the deck hole and then by moving it around > you remove wood creating a hole below thr surface that is about 5/8". Check > the wood dust that is removed to see if it is wet or appears rotted. If > there are signs of rot/water, try remove more of the core to get back to > good wood. If you still have signs of rot you might need to consider a more > extensive fix. > > Put tape over the hole on the inside liner and then coat the hole with > un-thickened epoxy and then pack it with thickened epoxy. Once the epoxy is > set re-drill the hole for the bolt. In my experience it is MUCH easier to > drill the hole when the epoxy is set - solid but not sticky - but before it > cures completely. In this semi-cured state drilling straight through is > much easier. Once cured, the epoxy is much harder than the surrounding > material and the drill bit will want to wander. Using a brad point bit also > helps. This gives a solid and waterproof plug between the deck and inner > skins. > > All this is a bit fussy but not difficult to do and gives you reasonable > assurance that the deck core is protected. You really really want to avoid > having to replace sections of the core. > > > > Graham Stewart > Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 > Kingston Ontario > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf > Of Reuben Mezrich > Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 2021 6:15 AM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first > > Graham > thanks for the suggestions on watching for creep and cleaning up the > butyl...haven't seen it yet but I'll look as it gets warmer down here in > Sarasota. > As to the deck, to be honest I didn't think to look for damage. I don't > know what the deck is made of...it looks and feels solid. At the hole for > the solar vent I could see the deck in cross-section and it sure looks like > solid fiberglass nearly one inch thick...is that possible? > --Reuben > Reuben Mezrich > Pelican Cove in Sarasota > Cell: 410-499-8922 > > > On Tue, Mar 9, 2021 at 11:42 AM Graham Stewart > wrote: > > > I love butyl tape and use it everywhere that does not require adhesive > > properties or below the waterline. It seals beautifully and also allows > the > > removal of the hardware easily. > > > > BTW, to clean up squeeze out you can get most of it off by using a small > > ball of butyl that will stick to the squeeze out and lift most of it. The > > remaining bits can be cleaned up easily with turpentine. You may find > that > > the squeeze out will continue to flow for a very long time. > > > > Did you consider whether there might have been any damage to the core oy > > your deck from the water? I would be concerned about that especially if > the > > core is wood. > > > > Graham Stewart > > gstewart8 at cogeco.ca > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On > Behalf > > Of Reuben Mezrich > > Sent: Tuesday, March 9, 2021 11:25 AM > > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first > > > > After receiving the many excellent suggestions on where to look for > leaks I > > started what ended being a 1 week process to find and ultimately repair > the > > leak. > > > > I first removed the cosmetic wood trim inside the forward cabin at the > bow > > to expose the attachments of the Jib chainplate and the Bow eye. I > sprayed > > water at the bow and determined these were not the source of the leaks. > I > > then sprayed water on the foredeck and initially saw no water leaking > into > > the boat but when I came back to the boat the next morning found that > some > > water (about 1 - 2 cups) had collected at the bow (By now I had removed > the > > cushions and so could see the water in a puddle on the floor of the > forward > > bunk at the bow). I had some sort of a slow leak. > > > > I then had my wife spray water on the foredeck while I was on my back in > > the forecabin and was able to see that there were leaks at each of the > four > > legs of the pulpit. The leaks would drip onto the carpeted shelf that is > at > > each side of the forecabin (behind a white fiberglass trim piece) and > then > > the water would slowly make its way forward to trickle down at the bow > end > > of the forecabin. > > > > The pulpit is attached by 3/8" bolts that are welded to each of the legs > > and which extend down through holes in the deck and fastened with a flat > > washer, lock washer and 9/16" nut. After unfastening the nuts the pulpit > > lifted up easily. One complication is that the electrical wires that feed > > the navigation lights at the bow extend through a seperate hole just > > forward of the hole for the aft-starboard bolt. That wire seems to run > back > > to the distribution panel and has very little slack and so I had to cut > > it. When I did remove the pulpit I found there was some white sealant > that > > adhered to the deck but not the pulpit leg (which ends in an oval flange > at > > the bottom) as well as an O-ring around the base of the bolt. > > > > After consulting with Stan, who told me that his preferred method for > > keeping water out is to just use an O-ring around the nut (and not to > apply > > sealant), I cleaned off the old sealant (a product called ReMov which was > > recommended in a Practical Sailor review, worked great for this) I put > new > > O-rings on. Rather than putting an O-ring around the electric wire near > the > > aft-starboard leg I put some wraps of butyl rubber tape abound it. > > I reattached the pulpit, tightened the nuts and had my wife spray the > > foredeck again and sadly found that there was again a leak (perhaps even > > worse than before) at each leg - but not where the electric wire entered > > the cabin. > > > > I removed the pulpit again, removed the o_rings and this time used Butyl > > tape to form the seal at each leg. Using a technique I found on You Tube > I > > cut a 3 - 4 inch length of the tape, rolled the tape along its length > into > > a tube (or rope) and then wrapped it several times about the base of the > > bolt. The thickness can be adjusted by adding more or less wraps and I > was > > generous, using the entire 3 - 4 inch tape at each leg. I added more > Butyl > > to the electric wire. > > > > After putting the pulpit back in place and only moderately tightening the > > nuts, my wife sprayed the foredeck again and this time - success - no > > leaks!! > > > > I have become a big fan of Butyl rubber tape, which to be honest I hadn't > > even heard about till last week! > > > > Of course now I have to splice back the electric wire for the navigation > > light and replace the cosmetic wood trim I removed, but I am much > relieved > > that this problem is solved > > > > Thanks for your advice and support > > > > --Reuben > > Reuben Mezrich > > Pelican Cove in Sarasota > > Cell: 410-499-8922 > > > > > > On Tue, Mar 2, 2021 at 12:49 PM wrote: > > > > > I like to tape paper towels around the suspected areas and see which > ones > > > show moisture first, then investigate further from there . > > > > > > > > > Jerry Lowe > > > S/V Country Rhodes '86 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Roger, Rob and Mike > > > > Thanks for the good suggestions. I'll start by taking off that > > > cosmeticsus > > > > piece of wood at the bow and see what's behind. If nothing is loose > > I"ll > > > > have someone aim a hose at the bow while I"m inside watching in the > > hope > > > > that I might actually see where the water is getting in. > > > > I really do hope I don't have to rebed everything. > > > > Probably won't be able to do this till the weekend..I"ll report back > on > > > > what I find > > > > > > > > Reuben Mezrich > > > > Pelican Cove in Sarasota > > > > Cell: 410-499-8922 > > > > > > > > > > > > On Mon, Mar 1, 2021 at 5:15 PM Michael D. Weisner < > mweisner at ebsmed.com > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > >> Reuben, > > > >> > > > >> I would check the bow eye. The wood backing block usually rots and > the > > > >> eye > > > >> loosens up. Sometimes just lifting the boat using the bow eye will > > cause > > > >> the eye to loosen as the wood compresses. > > > >> > > > >> Also, you may want to re-bed the bow pulpit rail deck fittings, > > chocks, > > > >> etc. > > > >> > > > >> Mike > > > >> s/v Wind Lass ('91) > > > >> Nissequogue River, NY > > > >> I?d rather be sailing :~) > > > >> > > > >> -----Original Message----- > > > >> From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf > Of > > > >> Reuben Mezrich > > > >> Sent: Monday, March 1, 2021 4:08 PM > > > >> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > > > >> Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first > > > >> > > > >> As I mentioned a week or two ago, I installed a Marinco 3" Day/night > > > >> solar > > > >> vent at the bow, using the hole already in place for the anchor > > locker. > > > >> It > > > >> installed easily, seemed to work fine but a few days later we had a > > > >> heavy > > > >> rain and the next day the forward tips of the forward cabin cushions > > > >> were > > > >> wet. I removed the vent, replaced the deck plate, installed a new > > gasket > > > >> under the deck plate, applied a generous amount of RTV silicone to > > both > > > >> sides of the gasket and reinstalled the solar vent. The next day > > > >> (yesterday > > > >> actually) I used a hose to rain water on the forward deck, aiming at > > the > > > >> solar vent for about 6 minutes and when I checked below everything > was > > > >> dry. > > > >> I checked again in an hour and it was still dry. > > > >> This morning there was about a cup of water, maybe two cups of water > > at > > > >> the bow. There was no water in the tray that serves as the anchor > > locker > > > >> and which is directly under the solar vent. The vent itself was dry > as > > > >> was > > > >> the ceiling around the vent. The walls were also dry. I dried the > > water > > > >> with a towel and a few hours later a small amount of water seemed to > > be > > > >> seeping under a triangular piece of wood at the very bow of the > boat > > > >> (see > > > >> attached photo). I haven't removed that piece of wood yet but I'm > > pretty > > > >> sure I'll find the bolts from the chain plate at the bow for the jib > > > >> stay. > > > >> My feeling now is that the solar vent was never the source of the > leak > > > >> but > > > >> I've had a small leak for a while but never noticed because I never > > had > > > >> a > > > >> reason to go up to the very front of the forward cabin. As it turns > > out > > > >> the > > > >> bottom of the cushions, which are rubberized are stained, giving > > > >> evidence > > > >> that the leak is likely long standing. > > > >> Those bolts would be my best guess as the source of the leak but I'd > > > >> look > > > >> forward to suggestions as to where else I might look. > > > >> > > > >> Its always something > > > >> > > > >> --Reuben > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> Reuben Mezrich > > > >> Pelican Cove in Sarasota > > > >> Cell: 410-499-8922 > > > >> > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> -------------- next part -------------- > > > >> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > > > >> Name: Screen Shot 2021-03-01 at 4.02.36 PM.png > > > >> Type: image/png > > > >> Size: 1826288 bytes > > > >> Desc: not available > > > >> URL: < > > > >> > > > > > > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210301/6a1cf705/attachment.png > > > >> > > > > >> > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > From joedempsey at hughes.net Wed Mar 10 10:18:29 2021 From: joedempsey at hughes.net (Joe Dempsey) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2021 08:18:29 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] BURGEE ORDERING INSTRUCTIONS In-Reply-To: <87C25482-3B98-4164-B997-50F5AF4378F8@sunnybeeches.com> References: <1615316576867-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <87C25482-3B98-4164-B997-50F5AF4378F8@sunnybeeches.com> Message-ID: <1615389509838-0.post@n5.nabble.com> You can certainly do that, but due to time differential and she's using a cell phone not always at her desk, this was the best I could do and have some sort of paper trail. ----- Joe Dempsey s/v Respite Rhodes 22 1989/2005 Deltaville,VA -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From gstewart8 at cogeco.ca Wed Mar 10 11:13:19 2021 From: gstewart8 at cogeco.ca (Graham Stewart) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2021 11:13:19 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first In-Reply-To: References: <1613761250989-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <408F9401-E24B-4554-826E-DD98BFC0E1F3@stottarchitecture.com> <1614623625839-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <005601d70ed3$6283eba0$278bc2e0$@ebsmed.com> <916d9b93-9604-8b3a-c9d5-5c84c1acadb8@generalboats.com> <007501d70ee8$6edeb690$4c9c23b0$@ebsmed.com> <54709.24.140.30.102.1614707391.squirrel@quickpop.sssnet.com> <009001d71503$2219f290$664dd7b0$@ca> <003501d715b8$ca4256f0$5ec704d0$@ca> Message-ID: <004e01d715c8$4abad640$e03082c0$@ca> I expect that the HIN would not change when the boat was rebuilt but could well be wrong about that. At the same time it seems odd to me that the boat was built in 2018 and rebuilt in 2020. Why not post your HIN and I am sure someone can figure it out. Graham Stewart Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 Kingston Ontario -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf Of Reuben Mezrich Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 2021 10:02 AM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first Graham Thank you for this fantastic, detailed, discussion of how the boat (at least the deck) is built and how to repair any damage. So far my deck seems solid without any flex but I'll keep on the lookout. As to when my boat was initially built, I'm not sure. I ordered the rebuilt boat in the spring of 2020 and received it in December, 2020. The HIN indicates it was built (or rebuilt) in 2018. I've asked Stan when it was initially built but haven't heard back yet. Again, I thank you and the rest of da list, for your advice and support. I know I'll be calling on your help often going forward. --Reuben Reuben Mezrich Pelican Cove in Sarasota Cell: 410-499-8922 On Wed, Mar 10, 2021 at 9:22 AM Graham Stewart wrote: > Reuben: > > No, the deck is not solid fiberglass. In most cases it is comprised of a > sandwich construction with plywood between a heavier fiberglass deck and > thin inside liner. I understand that later models of the boat utilized a > foam core which would not have the problem of core rot but I don't know > when that change occurred. What year is your boat? > > In my case the plywood separated from the deck skin resulting in a soft > deck that would flex when you walked on it. I thought that the soft deck > was due to rot in the core so I cut the duck in half immediately in front > of the cabin, removed the bow section of the deck entirely, separated the > liner, removed the core and replaced it with marine plywood encased in > epoxy and then reinstalled the unit. This gave me the chance to examine the > core construction in detail. What I had is not necessarily what you would > have. My boat is a 1976 and clearly boats of that vintage were not built to > the standards of later boats. Apparently these early boats were built by > contractors who I can attest cut many corners. > > In my case the core was the cheapest plywood (i.e., not even exterior) > with large voids. The layers of the plywood had separated and the plywood > itself was attached to the deck skin with occasional strips of some sort of > sealant which had long past let go. I could remove the core with my hands. > > Except for one area of about 1' square where the head air vent came > through the deck there was no rot so the extreme measures I took turned out > to be unnecessary. Carefully injecting epoxy into the core might have been > sufficient. The problem was that until you look inside the deck, you it is > difficult to know what is wrong or how well the injection process is > working. > > Knowing what I learned from the deck reconstruction I was able to use the > injection method quite successfully on the side deck - so far as I can > tell. By looking at the core from where the deck was removed I could tell > that delimitation had occurred there as well but without any sign of rot. > Knowing what the problem was I was able to inject thickened epoxy into the > core without going through the core - in which case the injected epoxy > would have simply pooled in the space between the core and the liner. The > liner is solidly attached to the core on the cabin top but not the side > decks. By avoiding this problem I could inject the epoxy into one hole > until it came up through the next hole giving me a pretty good indication > that most of the voids in the plywood and the space between the core and > the deck skin were filled. > > By removing the solar vent in the cabin top I was able to see that the > core, at least in that area, appeared to be solid. Certainly there was not > flex in the deck there so I concluded that I could leave the cabin top as > is. > > I am not telling you this because I think that this is something you > should do - quite the contrary - it is simply to describe what the core was > like for my vintage of boat. I have posted pictures of the process and the > state of the core in previous times but if you or anyone would like to see > them and can't find those pictures in the archive I would be happy to post > them again. > > Whenever a bolt is removed from a deck it is a very good idea to determine > whether water has made its way into the core and to also ensure that the > hole is property sealed with epoxy before the bolt is replaced. If water is > coming into the boat there is an excellent chance that it was also making > its way into the core unless the hole was previously prepared properly. > > The best way to prepare the hole that I have seen is to enlarge the hole > going through the core without enlarging the hole in the fiberglass deck > and liner skins. I did this using a dremmel bit that looks like this: > https://www.leevalley.com/en-ca/shop/tools/power-tool-accessories/burrs/31016-hss-carvers-burrs > . It has a shank that is about 1/8" and a cutter cylinder that is about > 1/4". The bit will fit through the deck hole and then by moving it around > you remove wood creating a hole below thr surface that is about 5/8". Check > the wood dust that is removed to see if it is wet or appears rotted. If > there are signs of rot/water, try remove more of the core to get back to > good wood. If you still have signs of rot you might need to consider a more > extensive fix. > > Put tape over the hole on the inside liner and then coat the hole with > un-thickened epoxy and then pack it with thickened epoxy. Once the epoxy is > set re-drill the hole for the bolt. In my experience it is MUCH easier to > drill the hole when the epoxy is set - solid but not sticky - but before it > cures completely. In this semi-cured state drilling straight through is > much easier. Once cured, the epoxy is much harder than the surrounding > material and the drill bit will want to wander. Using a brad point bit also > helps. This gives a solid and waterproof plug between the deck and inner > skins. > > All this is a bit fussy but not difficult to do and gives you reasonable > assurance that the deck core is protected. You really really want to avoid > having to replace sections of the core. > > > > Graham Stewart > Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 > Kingston Ontario > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf > Of Reuben Mezrich > Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 2021 6:15 AM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first > > Graham > thanks for the suggestions on watching for creep and cleaning up the > butyl...haven't seen it yet but I'll look as it gets warmer down here in > Sarasota. > As to the deck, to be honest I didn't think to look for damage. I don't > know what the deck is made of...it looks and feels solid. At the hole for > the solar vent I could see the deck in cross-section and it sure looks like > solid fiberglass nearly one inch thick...is that possible? > --Reuben > Reuben Mezrich > Pelican Cove in Sarasota > Cell: 410-499-8922 > > > On Tue, Mar 9, 2021 at 11:42 AM Graham Stewart > wrote: > > > I love butyl tape and use it everywhere that does not require adhesive > > properties or below the waterline. It seals beautifully and also allows > the > > removal of the hardware easily. > > > > BTW, to clean up squeeze out you can get most of it off by using a small > > ball of butyl that will stick to the squeeze out and lift most of it. The > > remaining bits can be cleaned up easily with turpentine. You may find > that > > the squeeze out will continue to flow for a very long time. > > > > Did you consider whether there might have been any damage to the core oy > > your deck from the water? I would be concerned about that especially if > the > > core is wood. > > > > Graham Stewart > > gstewart8 at cogeco.ca > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On > Behalf > > Of Reuben Mezrich > > Sent: Tuesday, March 9, 2021 11:25 AM > > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first > > > > After receiving the many excellent suggestions on where to look for > leaks I > > started what ended being a 1 week process to find and ultimately repair > the > > leak. > > > > I first removed the cosmetic wood trim inside the forward cabin at the > bow > > to expose the attachments of the Jib chainplate and the Bow eye. I > sprayed > > water at the bow and determined these were not the source of the leaks. > I > > then sprayed water on the foredeck and initially saw no water leaking > into > > the boat but when I came back to the boat the next morning found that > some > > water (about 1 - 2 cups) had collected at the bow (By now I had removed > the > > cushions and so could see the water in a puddle on the floor of the > forward > > bunk at the bow). I had some sort of a slow leak. > > > > I then had my wife spray water on the foredeck while I was on my back in > > the forecabin and was able to see that there were leaks at each of the > four > > legs of the pulpit. The leaks would drip onto the carpeted shelf that is > at > > each side of the forecabin (behind a white fiberglass trim piece) and > then > > the water would slowly make its way forward to trickle down at the bow > end > > of the forecabin. > > > > The pulpit is attached by 3/8" bolts that are welded to each of the legs > > and which extend down through holes in the deck and fastened with a flat > > washer, lock washer and 9/16" nut. After unfastening the nuts the pulpit > > lifted up easily. One complication is that the electrical wires that feed > > the navigation lights at the bow extend through a seperate hole just > > forward of the hole for the aft-starboard bolt. That wire seems to run > back > > to the distribution panel and has very little slack and so I had to cut > > it. When I did remove the pulpit I found there was some white sealant > that > > adhered to the deck but not the pulpit leg (which ends in an oval flange > at > > the bottom) as well as an O-ring around the base of the bolt. > > > > After consulting with Stan, who told me that his preferred method for > > keeping water out is to just use an O-ring around the nut (and not to > apply > > sealant), I cleaned off the old sealant (a product called ReMov which was > > recommended in a Practical Sailor review, worked great for this) I put > new > > O-rings on. Rather than putting an O-ring around the electric wire near > the > > aft-starboard leg I put some wraps of butyl rubber tape abound it. > > I reattached the pulpit, tightened the nuts and had my wife spray the > > foredeck again and sadly found that there was again a leak (perhaps even > > worse than before) at each leg - but not where the electric wire entered > > the cabin. > > > > I removed the pulpit again, removed the o_rings and this time used Butyl > > tape to form the seal at each leg. Using a technique I found on You Tube > I > > cut a 3 - 4 inch length of the tape, rolled the tape along its length > into > > a tube (or rope) and then wrapped it several times about the base of the > > bolt. The thickness can be adjusted by adding more or less wraps and I > was > > generous, using the entire 3 - 4 inch tape at each leg. I added more > Butyl > > to the electric wire. > > > > After putting the pulpit back in place and only moderately tightening the > > nuts, my wife sprayed the foredeck again and this time - success - no > > leaks!! > > > > I have become a big fan of Butyl rubber tape, which to be honest I hadn't > > even heard about till last week! > > > > Of course now I have to splice back the electric wire for the navigation > > light and replace the cosmetic wood trim I removed, but I am much > relieved > > that this problem is solved > > > > Thanks for your advice and support > > > > --Reuben > > Reuben Mezrich > > Pelican Cove in Sarasota > > Cell: 410-499-8922 > > > > > > On Tue, Mar 2, 2021 at 12:49 PM wrote: > > > > > I like to tape paper towels around the suspected areas and see which > ones > > > show moisture first, then investigate further from there . > > > > > > > > > Jerry Lowe > > > S/V Country Rhodes '86 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Roger, Rob and Mike > > > > Thanks for the good suggestions. I'll start by taking off that > > > cosmeticsus > > > > piece of wood at the bow and see what's behind. If nothing is loose > > I"ll > > > > have someone aim a hose at the bow while I"m inside watching in the > > hope > > > > that I might actually see where the water is getting in. > > > > I really do hope I don't have to rebed everything. > > > > Probably won't be able to do this till the weekend..I"ll report back > on > > > > what I find > > > > > > > > Reuben Mezrich > > > > Pelican Cove in Sarasota > > > > Cell: 410-499-8922 > > > > > > > > > > > > On Mon, Mar 1, 2021 at 5:15 PM Michael D. Weisner < > mweisner at ebsmed.com > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > >> Reuben, > > > >> > > > >> I would check the bow eye. The wood backing block usually rots and > the > > > >> eye > > > >> loosens up. Sometimes just lifting the boat using the bow eye will > > cause > > > >> the eye to loosen as the wood compresses. > > > >> > > > >> Also, you may want to re-bed the bow pulpit rail deck fittings, > > chocks, > > > >> etc. > > > >> > > > >> Mike > > > >> s/v Wind Lass ('91) > > > >> Nissequogue River, NY > > > >> I?d rather be sailing :~) > > > >> > > > >> -----Original Message----- > > > >> From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf > Of > > > >> Reuben Mezrich > > > >> Sent: Monday, March 1, 2021 4:08 PM > > > >> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > > > >> Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first > > > >> > > > >> As I mentioned a week or two ago, I installed a Marinco 3" Day/night > > > >> solar > > > >> vent at the bow, using the hole already in place for the anchor > > locker. > > > >> It > > > >> installed easily, seemed to work fine but a few days later we had a > > > >> heavy > > > >> rain and the next day the forward tips of the forward cabin cushions > > > >> were > > > >> wet. I removed the vent, replaced the deck plate, installed a new > > gasket > > > >> under the deck plate, applied a generous amount of RTV silicone to > > both > > > >> sides of the gasket and reinstalled the solar vent. The next day > > > >> (yesterday > > > >> actually) I used a hose to rain water on the forward deck, aiming at > > the > > > >> solar vent for about 6 minutes and when I checked below everything > was > > > >> dry. > > > >> I checked again in an hour and it was still dry. > > > >> This morning there was about a cup of water, maybe two cups of water > > at > > > >> the bow. There was no water in the tray that serves as the anchor > > locker > > > >> and which is directly under the solar vent. The vent itself was dry > as > > > >> was > > > >> the ceiling around the vent. The walls were also dry. I dried the > > water > > > >> with a towel and a few hours later a small amount of water seemed to > > be > > > >> seeping under a triangular piece of wood at the very bow of the > boat > > > >> (see > > > >> attached photo). I haven't removed that piece of wood yet but I'm > > pretty > > > >> sure I'll find the bolts from the chain plate at the bow for the jib > > > >> stay. > > > >> My feeling now is that the solar vent was never the source of the > leak > > > >> but > > > >> I've had a small leak for a while but never noticed because I never > > had > > > >> a > > > >> reason to go up to the very front of the forward cabin. As it turns > > out > > > >> the > > > >> bottom of the cushions, which are rubberized are stained, giving > > > >> evidence > > > >> that the leak is likely long standing. > > > >> Those bolts would be my best guess as the source of the leak but I'd > > > >> look > > > >> forward to suggestions as to where else I might look. > > > >> > > > >> Its always something > > > >> > > > >> --Reuben > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> Reuben Mezrich > > > >> Pelican Cove in Sarasota > > > >> Cell: 410-499-8922 > > > >> > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> -------------- next part -------------- > > > >> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > > > >> Name: Screen Shot 2021-03-01 at 4.02.36 PM.png > > > >> Type: image/png > > > >> Size: 1826288 bytes > > > >> Desc: not available > > > >> URL: < > > > >> > > > > > > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210301/6a1cf705/attachment.png > > > >> > > > > >> > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > From mweisner at ebsmed.com Wed Mar 10 11:22:48 2021 From: mweisner at ebsmed.com (Michael D. Weisner) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2021 11:22:48 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Website News Message-ID: <016801d715c9$9cfa2d10$d6ee8730$@ebsmed.com> Hi Fellow Rhodies, Please take a look around the www.rhodes22.org website. It is my hope that this website and the associated Mailman email forum will be the center of all things Rhodes 22. The website maintains records, pictures, documents, email exchanges of the Rhodes 22 Owners' Group for more than 20 years! If you are looking to purchase, own a Rhodes 22 or have owned one in the past, this website is for you. I just refreshed the web server with Peter's latest changes. Peter and I talked about many new items for the site and he has made them "pop" both in terms of appearance and speed of implementation. Another well deserved round of applause, and a beer, for Peter! Checkout the "Community News" webpage for the latest Rhodie events. The Rhodes 22 Burgee is currently featured on the page with a link to Joe's purchasing instructions email posting. Kudos to Joe Demsey for all his hard work in making this happen for our community. Let's go buy them! We now have a "Video and More" webpage to organize many of the fine videos that have been posted to youtube and other websites, showing Rhodies sailing and documenting technical projects associated with owning a Rhodes 22 sailboat. Don't forget to review Peter's invaluable Silverheels videos on youtube for project ideas. In addition, we added a "Contact the Webmaster" button at the bottom of every webpage. Please use this for website suggestions, submissions (new videos or documents) and other feedback that you do not wish to post to "da List". I would like to update some of the picture gallery with more recent Rhodie gatherings and pictures of Rhodie families. The latest that I have, I think, are some pictures from the party at the 2017 Annapolis show. Please send images to webmaster at rhodes22.org . Thank you to all of the Rhodies who have made this community a success! Fair winds, Mike s/v Wind Lass ('91) Nissequogue River, NY List/Web Admin I'd rather be sailing :-) From reuben.mezrich at gmail.com Wed Mar 10 11:34:20 2021 From: reuben.mezrich at gmail.com (Reuben Mezrich) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2021 11:34:20 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first In-Reply-To: <004e01d715c8$4abad640$e03082c0$@ca> References: <1613761250989-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <408F9401-E24B-4554-826E-DD98BFC0E1F3@stottarchitecture.com> <1614623625839-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <005601d70ed3$6283eba0$278bc2e0$@ebsmed.com> <916d9b93-9604-8b3a-c9d5-5c84c1acadb8@generalboats.com> <007501d70ee8$6edeb690$4c9c23b0$@ebsmed.com> <54709.24.140.30.102.1614707391.squirrel@quickpop.sssnet.com> <009001d71503$2219f290$664dd7b0$@ca> <003501d715b8$ca4256f0$5ec704d0$@ca> <004e01d715c8$4abad640$e03082c0$@ca> Message-ID: OK This is the HIN as it appears on my Certificate of Origin [image: image.png] My secret ring HIN decoder suggests it was built (I"m not sure if that means started or finished) on May, 7, 2018. The serial number is 22XX5 and of course the builder is GBX I don't think the HIN system was designed for rebuilt boats so I can't tell from this when the boat was initially built I do know it was delivered to me in December, 2020. --Reuben Reuben Mezrich Pelican Cove in Sarasota Cell: 410-499-8922 On Wed, Mar 10, 2021 at 11:13 AM Graham Stewart wrote: > I expect that the HIN would not change when the boat was rebuilt but could > well be wrong about that. At the same time it seems odd to me that the boat > was built in 2018 and rebuilt in 2020. Why not post your HIN and I am sure > someone can figure it out. > > Graham Stewart > Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 > Kingston Ontario > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf > Of Reuben Mezrich > Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 2021 10:02 AM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first > > Graham > Thank you for this fantastic, detailed, discussion of how the boat (at > least the deck) is built and how to repair any damage. So far my deck seems > solid without any flex but I'll keep on the lookout. > > As to when my boat was initially built, I'm not sure. I ordered the rebuilt > boat in the spring of 2020 and received it in December, 2020. The HIN > indicates it was built (or rebuilt) in 2018. I've asked Stan when it was > initially built but haven't heard back yet. > > Again, I thank you and the rest of da list, for your advice and support. I > know I'll be calling on your help often going forward. > --Reuben > > Reuben Mezrich > Pelican Cove in Sarasota > Cell: 410-499-8922 > > > On Wed, Mar 10, 2021 at 9:22 AM Graham Stewart > wrote: > > > Reuben: > > > > No, the deck is not solid fiberglass. In most cases it is comprised of a > > sandwich construction with plywood between a heavier fiberglass deck and > > thin inside liner. I understand that later models of the boat utilized a > > foam core which would not have the problem of core rot but I don't know > > when that change occurred. What year is your boat? > > > > In my case the plywood separated from the deck skin resulting in a soft > > deck that would flex when you walked on it. I thought that the soft deck > > was due to rot in the core so I cut the duck in half immediately in front > > of the cabin, removed the bow section of the deck entirely, separated the > > liner, removed the core and replaced it with marine plywood encased in > > epoxy and then reinstalled the unit. This gave me the chance to examine > the > > core construction in detail. What I had is not necessarily what you would > > have. My boat is a 1976 and clearly boats of that vintage were not built > to > > the standards of later boats. Apparently these early boats were built by > > contractors who I can attest cut many corners. > > > > In my case the core was the cheapest plywood (i.e., not even exterior) > > with large voids. The layers of the plywood had separated and the plywood > > itself was attached to the deck skin with occasional strips of some sort > of > > sealant which had long past let go. I could remove the core with my > hands. > > > > Except for one area of about 1' square where the head air vent came > > through the deck there was no rot so the extreme measures I took turned > out > > to be unnecessary. Carefully injecting epoxy into the core might have > been > > sufficient. The problem was that until you look inside the deck, you it > is > > difficult to know what is wrong or how well the injection process is > > working. > > > > Knowing what I learned from the deck reconstruction I was able to use the > > injection method quite successfully on the side deck - so far as I can > > tell. By looking at the core from where the deck was removed I could tell > > that delimitation had occurred there as well but without any sign of rot. > > Knowing what the problem was I was able to inject thickened epoxy into > the > > core without going through the core - in which case the injected epoxy > > would have simply pooled in the space between the core and the liner. The > > liner is solidly attached to the core on the cabin top but not the side > > decks. By avoiding this problem I could inject the epoxy into one hole > > until it came up through the next hole giving me a pretty good indication > > that most of the voids in the plywood and the space between the core and > > the deck skin were filled. > > > > By removing the solar vent in the cabin top I was able to see that the > > core, at least in that area, appeared to be solid. Certainly there was > not > > flex in the deck there so I concluded that I could leave the cabin top as > > is. > > > > I am not telling you this because I think that this is something you > > should do - quite the contrary - it is simply to describe what the core > was > > like for my vintage of boat. I have posted pictures of the process and > the > > state of the core in previous times but if you or anyone would like to > see > > them and can't find those pictures in the archive I would be happy to > post > > them again. > > > > Whenever a bolt is removed from a deck it is a very good idea to > determine > > whether water has made its way into the core and to also ensure that the > > hole is property sealed with epoxy before the bolt is replaced. If water > is > > coming into the boat there is an excellent chance that it was also making > > its way into the core unless the hole was previously prepared properly. > > > > The best way to prepare the hole that I have seen is to enlarge the hole > > going through the core without enlarging the hole in the fiberglass deck > > and liner skins. I did this using a dremmel bit that looks like this: > > > https://www.leevalley.com/en-ca/shop/tools/power-tool-accessories/burrs/31016-hss-carvers-burrs > > . It has a shank that is about 1/8" and a cutter cylinder that is about > > 1/4". The bit will fit through the deck hole and then by moving it around > > you remove wood creating a hole below thr surface that is about 5/8". > Check > > the wood dust that is removed to see if it is wet or appears rotted. If > > there are signs of rot/water, try remove more of the core to get back to > > good wood. If you still have signs of rot you might need to consider a > more > > extensive fix. > > > > Put tape over the hole on the inside liner and then coat the hole with > > un-thickened epoxy and then pack it with thickened epoxy. Once the epoxy > is > > set re-drill the hole for the bolt. In my experience it is MUCH easier to > > drill the hole when the epoxy is set - solid but not sticky - but before > it > > cures completely. In this semi-cured state drilling straight through is > > much easier. Once cured, the epoxy is much harder than the surrounding > > material and the drill bit will want to wander. Using a brad point bit > also > > helps. This gives a solid and waterproof plug between the deck and inner > > skins. > > > > All this is a bit fussy but not difficult to do and gives you reasonable > > assurance that the deck core is protected. You really really want to > avoid > > having to replace sections of the core. > > > > > > > > Graham Stewart > > Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 > > Kingston Ontario > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On > Behalf > > Of Reuben Mezrich > > Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 2021 6:15 AM > > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first > > > > Graham > > thanks for the suggestions on watching for creep and cleaning up the > > butyl...haven't seen it yet but I'll look as it gets warmer down here in > > Sarasota. > > As to the deck, to be honest I didn't think to look for damage. I don't > > know what the deck is made of...it looks and feels solid. At the hole for > > the solar vent I could see the deck in cross-section and it sure looks > like > > solid fiberglass nearly one inch thick...is that possible? > > --Reuben > > Reuben Mezrich > > Pelican Cove in Sarasota > > Cell: 410-499-8922 > > > > > > On Tue, Mar 9, 2021 at 11:42 AM Graham Stewart > > wrote: > > > > > I love butyl tape and use it everywhere that does not require adhesive > > > properties or below the waterline. It seals beautifully and also allows > > the > > > removal of the hardware easily. > > > > > > BTW, to clean up squeeze out you can get most of it off by using a > small > > > ball of butyl that will stick to the squeeze out and lift most of it. > The > > > remaining bits can be cleaned up easily with turpentine. You may find > > that > > > the squeeze out will continue to flow for a very long time. > > > > > > Did you consider whether there might have been any damage to the core > oy > > > your deck from the water? I would be concerned about that especially if > > the > > > core is wood. > > > > > > Graham Stewart > > > gstewart8 at cogeco.ca > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On > > Behalf > > > Of Reuben Mezrich > > > Sent: Tuesday, March 9, 2021 11:25 AM > > > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > > > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first > > > > > > After receiving the many excellent suggestions on where to look for > > leaks I > > > started what ended being a 1 week process to find and ultimately repair > > the > > > leak. > > > > > > I first removed the cosmetic wood trim inside the forward cabin at the > > bow > > > to expose the attachments of the Jib chainplate and the Bow eye. I > > sprayed > > > water at the bow and determined these were not the source of the > leaks. > > I > > > then sprayed water on the foredeck and initially saw no water leaking > > into > > > the boat but when I came back to the boat the next morning found that > > some > > > water (about 1 - 2 cups) had collected at the bow (By now I had removed > > the > > > cushions and so could see the water in a puddle on the floor of the > > forward > > > bunk at the bow). I had some sort of a slow leak. > > > > > > I then had my wife spray water on the foredeck while I was on my back > in > > > the forecabin and was able to see that there were leaks at each of the > > four > > > legs of the pulpit. The leaks would drip onto the carpeted shelf that > is > > at > > > each side of the forecabin (behind a white fiberglass trim piece) and > > then > > > the water would slowly make its way forward to trickle down at the bow > > end > > > of the forecabin. > > > > > > The pulpit is attached by 3/8" bolts that are welded to each of the > legs > > > and which extend down through holes in the deck and fastened with a > flat > > > washer, lock washer and 9/16" nut. After unfastening the nuts the > pulpit > > > lifted up easily. One complication is that the electrical wires that > feed > > > the navigation lights at the bow extend through a seperate hole just > > > forward of the hole for the aft-starboard bolt. That wire seems to run > > back > > > to the distribution panel and has very little slack and so I had to cut > > > it. When I did remove the pulpit I found there was some white sealant > > that > > > adhered to the deck but not the pulpit leg (which ends in an oval > flange > > at > > > the bottom) as well as an O-ring around the base of the bolt. > > > > > > After consulting with Stan, who told me that his preferred method for > > > keeping water out is to just use an O-ring around the nut (and not to > > apply > > > sealant), I cleaned off the old sealant (a product called ReMov which > was > > > recommended in a Practical Sailor review, worked great for this) I put > > new > > > O-rings on. Rather than putting an O-ring around the electric wire near > > the > > > aft-starboard leg I put some wraps of butyl rubber tape abound it. > > > I reattached the pulpit, tightened the nuts and had my wife spray the > > > foredeck again and sadly found that there was again a leak (perhaps > even > > > worse than before) at each leg - but not where the electric wire > entered > > > the cabin. > > > > > > I removed the pulpit again, removed the o_rings and this time used > Butyl > > > tape to form the seal at each leg. Using a technique I found on You > Tube > > I > > > cut a 3 - 4 inch length of the tape, rolled the tape along its length > > into > > > a tube (or rope) and then wrapped it several times about the base of > the > > > bolt. The thickness can be adjusted by adding more or less wraps and I > > was > > > generous, using the entire 3 - 4 inch tape at each leg. I added more > > Butyl > > > to the electric wire. > > > > > > After putting the pulpit back in place and only moderately tightening > the > > > nuts, my wife sprayed the foredeck again and this time - success - no > > > leaks!! > > > > > > I have become a big fan of Butyl rubber tape, which to be honest I > hadn't > > > even heard about till last week! > > > > > > Of course now I have to splice back the electric wire for the > navigation > > > light and replace the cosmetic wood trim I removed, but I am much > > relieved > > > that this problem is solved > > > > > > Thanks for your advice and support > > > > > > --Reuben > > > Reuben Mezrich > > > Pelican Cove in Sarasota > > > Cell: 410-499-8922 > > > > > > > > > On Tue, Mar 2, 2021 at 12:49 PM wrote: > > > > > > > I like to tape paper towels around the suspected areas and see which > > ones > > > > show moisture first, then investigate further from there . > > > > > > > > > > > > Jerry Lowe > > > > S/V Country Rhodes '86 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Roger, Rob and Mike > > > > > Thanks for the good suggestions. I'll start by taking off that > > > > cosmeticsus > > > > > piece of wood at the bow and see what's behind. If nothing is loose > > > I"ll > > > > > have someone aim a hose at the bow while I"m inside watching in the > > > hope > > > > > that I might actually see where the water is getting in. > > > > > I really do hope I don't have to rebed everything. > > > > > Probably won't be able to do this till the weekend..I"ll report > back > > on > > > > > what I find > > > > > > > > > > Reuben Mezrich > > > > > Pelican Cove in Sarasota > > > > > Cell: 410-499-8922 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Mon, Mar 1, 2021 at 5:15 PM Michael D. Weisner < > > mweisner at ebsmed.com > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > >> Reuben, > > > > >> > > > > >> I would check the bow eye. The wood backing block usually rots and > > the > > > > >> eye > > > > >> loosens up. Sometimes just lifting the boat using the bow eye will > > > cause > > > > >> the eye to loosen as the wood compresses. > > > > >> > > > > >> Also, you may want to re-bed the bow pulpit rail deck fittings, > > > chocks, > > > > >> etc. > > > > >> > > > > >> Mike > > > > >> s/v Wind Lass ('91) > > > > >> Nissequogue River, NY > > > > >> I?d rather be sailing :~) > > > > >> > > > > >> -----Original Message----- > > > > >> From: Rhodes22-list On > Behalf > > Of > > > > >> Reuben Mezrich > > > > >> Sent: Monday, March 1, 2021 4:08 PM > > > > >> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > > > > >> Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first > > > > >> > > > > >> As I mentioned a week or two ago, I installed a Marinco 3" > Day/night > > > > >> solar > > > > >> vent at the bow, using the hole already in place for the anchor > > > locker. > > > > >> It > > > > >> installed easily, seemed to work fine but a few days later we had > a > > > > >> heavy > > > > >> rain and the next day the forward tips of the forward cabin > cushions > > > > >> were > > > > >> wet. I removed the vent, replaced the deck plate, installed a new > > > gasket > > > > >> under the deck plate, applied a generous amount of RTV silicone to > > > both > > > > >> sides of the gasket and reinstalled the solar vent. The next day > > > > >> (yesterday > > > > >> actually) I used a hose to rain water on the forward deck, aiming > at > > > the > > > > >> solar vent for about 6 minutes and when I checked below everything > > was > > > > >> dry. > > > > >> I checked again in an hour and it was still dry. > > > > >> This morning there was about a cup of water, maybe two cups of > water > > > at > > > > >> the bow. There was no water in the tray that serves as the anchor > > > locker > > > > >> and which is directly under the solar vent. The vent itself was > dry > > as > > > > >> was > > > > >> the ceiling around the vent. The walls were also dry. I dried the > > > water > > > > >> with a towel and a few hours later a small amount of water seemed > to > > > be > > > > >> seeping under a triangular piece of wood at the very bow of the > > boat > > > > >> (see > > > > >> attached photo). I haven't removed that piece of wood yet but I'm > > > pretty > > > > >> sure I'll find the bolts from the chain plate at the bow for the > jib > > > > >> stay. > > > > >> My feeling now is that the solar vent was never the source of the > > leak > > > > >> but > > > > >> I've had a small leak for a while but never noticed because I > never > > > had > > > > >> a > > > > >> reason to go up to the very front of the forward cabin. As it > turns > > > out > > > > >> the > > > > >> bottom of the cushions, which are rubberized are stained, giving > > > > >> evidence > > > > >> that the leak is likely long standing. > > > > >> Those bolts would be my best guess as the source of the leak but > I'd > > > > >> look > > > > >> forward to suggestions as to where else I might look. > > > > >> > > > > >> Its always something > > > > >> > > > > >> --Reuben > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> Reuben Mezrich > > > > >> Pelican Cove in Sarasota > > > > >> Cell: 410-499-8922 > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > > >> -------------- next part -------------- > > > > >> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > > > > >> Name: Screen Shot 2021-03-01 at 4.02.36 PM.png > > > > >> Type: image/png > > > > >> Size: 1826288 bytes > > > > >> Desc: not available > > > > >> URL: < > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210301/6a1cf705/attachment.png > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: image.png Type: image/png Size: 43698 bytes Desc: not available URL: From peter at sunnybeeches.com Wed Mar 10 12:08:02 2021 From: peter at sunnybeeches.com (Peter Nyberg) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2021 12:08:02 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Website News In-Reply-To: <016801d715c9$9cfa2d10$d6ee8730$@ebsmed.com> References: <016801d715c9$9cfa2d10$d6ee8730$@ebsmed.com> Message-ID: Mike forgot to mention the ?Donate? button on the home page. You can kick in a few bucks to help Mike cover the cost of hosting the website and email list. The button takes you to PayPal, but you can donate with a credit card if you prefer. ?Peter > On Mar 10, 2021, at 11:22 AM, Michael D. Weisner wrote: > > Hi Fellow Rhodies, > > > > Please take a look around the www.rhodes22.org > website. It is my hope that this website and the associated Mailman email > forum will be the center of all things Rhodes 22. The website maintains > records, pictures, documents, email exchanges of the Rhodes 22 Owners' Group > for more than 20 years! If you are looking to purchase, own a Rhodes 22 or > have owned one in the past, this website is for you. > > > > I just refreshed the web server with Peter's latest changes. Peter and I > talked about many new items for the site and he has made them "pop" both in > terms of appearance and speed of implementation. Another well deserved round > of applause, and a beer, for Peter! > > > > Checkout the "Community News" webpage for the latest Rhodie events. The > Rhodes 22 Burgee is currently featured on the page with a link to Joe's > purchasing instructions email posting. Kudos to Joe Demsey for all his hard > work in making this happen for our community. Let's go buy them! > > > > We now have a "Video and More" webpage to organize many of the fine videos > that have been posted to youtube and other websites, showing Rhodies sailing > and documenting technical projects associated with owning a Rhodes 22 > sailboat. Don't forget to review Peter's invaluable Silverheels videos on > youtube for project ideas. > > > > In addition, we added a "Contact the Webmaster" button at the bottom of > every webpage. Please use this for website suggestions, submissions (new > videos or documents) and other feedback that you do not wish to post to "da > List". > > > > I would like to update some of the picture gallery with more recent Rhodie > gatherings and pictures of Rhodie families. The latest that I have, I think, > are some pictures from the party at the 2017 Annapolis show. Please send > images to webmaster at rhodes22.org . > > > > Thank you to all of the Rhodies who have made this community a success! > > > > Fair winds, > > Mike > > s/v Wind Lass ('91) > > Nissequogue River, NY > > List/Web Admin > > I'd rather be sailing :-) > > > > > From sloopblueheron at gmail.com Wed Mar 10 12:43:11 2021 From: sloopblueheron at gmail.com (Rick Lange) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2021 12:43:11 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Website News In-Reply-To: References: <016801d715c9$9cfa2d10$d6ee8730$@ebsmed.com> Message-ID: Nicely down, guys. Rick Lange On Wed, Mar 10, 2021, 12:08 PM Peter Nyberg wrote: > Mike forgot to mention the ?Donate? button on the home page. You can kick > in a few bucks to help Mike cover the cost of hosting the website and email > list. The button takes you to PayPal, but you can donate with a credit > card if you prefer. > > ?Peter > > > On Mar 10, 2021, at 11:22 AM, Michael D. Weisner > wrote: > > > > Hi Fellow Rhodies, > > > > > > > > Please take a look around the www.rhodes22.org > > website. It is my hope that this website and the associated Mailman email > > forum will be the center of all things Rhodes 22. The website maintains > > records, pictures, documents, email exchanges of the Rhodes 22 Owners' > Group > > for more than 20 years! If you are looking to purchase, own a Rhodes 22 > or > > have owned one in the past, this website is for you. > > > > > > > > I just refreshed the web server with Peter's latest changes. Peter and I > > talked about many new items for the site and he has made them "pop" both > in > > terms of appearance and speed of implementation. Another well deserved > round > > of applause, and a beer, for Peter! > > > > > > > > Checkout the "Community News" webpage for the latest Rhodie events. The > > Rhodes 22 Burgee is currently featured on the page with a link to Joe's > > purchasing instructions email posting. Kudos to Joe Demsey for all his > hard > > work in making this happen for our community. Let's go buy them! > > > > > > > > We now have a "Video and More" webpage to organize many of the fine > videos > > that have been posted to youtube and other websites, showing Rhodies > sailing > > and documenting technical projects associated with owning a Rhodes 22 > > sailboat. Don't forget to review Peter's invaluable Silverheels videos on > > youtube for project ideas. > > > > > > > > In addition, we added a "Contact the Webmaster" button at the bottom of > > every webpage. Please use this for website suggestions, submissions (new > > videos or documents) and other feedback that you do not wish to post to > "da > > List". > > > > > > > > I would like to update some of the picture gallery with more recent > Rhodie > > gatherings and pictures of Rhodie families. The latest that I have, I > think, > > are some pictures from the party at the 2017 Annapolis show. Please send > > images to webmaster at rhodes22.org . > > > > > > > > Thank you to all of the Rhodies who have made this community a success! > > > > > > > > Fair winds, > > > > Mike > > > > s/v Wind Lass ('91) > > > > Nissequogue River, NY > > > > List/Web Admin > > > > I'd rather be sailing :-) > > > > > > > > > > > > From keywestseccorp at verizon.net Wed Mar 10 13:10:13 2021 From: keywestseccorp at verizon.net (Mark West) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2021 18:10:13 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first In-Reply-To: References: <1613761250989-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <408F9401-E24B-4554-826E-DD98BFC0E1F3@stottarchitecture.com> <1614623625839-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <005601d70ed3$6283eba0$278bc2e0$@ebsmed.com> <916d9b93-9604-8b3a-c9d5-5c84c1acadb8@generalboats.com> <007501d70ee8$6edeb690$4c9c23b0$@ebsmed.com> <54709.24.140.30.102.1614707391.squirrel@quickpop.sssnet.com> <009001d71503$2219f290$664dd7b0$@ca> <003501d715b8$ca4256f0$5ec704d0$@ca> Message-ID: <1347635490.1010062.1615399813953@mail.yahoo.com> our boat had leaking loose pulpit.? The moisture was trapped and rotted the plywood? . Noticed a Soft deck? when we bought it at much lower price? Have pic of what a few leaking screws can cause . Our boat is 1989 model? -----Original Message----- From: Reuben Mezrich To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Sent: Wed, Mar 10, 2021 10:01 am Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first Graham Thank you for this fantastic, detailed, discussion of how the boat (at least the deck) is built and how to repair any damage. So far my deck seems solid without any flex but I'll keep on the lookout. As to when my boat was initially built, I'm not sure. I ordered the rebuilt boat in the spring of 2020 and received it in December, 2020. The HIN indicates it was built (or rebuilt) in 2018. I've asked Stan when it was initially built but haven't heard back yet. Again, I thank you and the rest of da list, for your advice and support. I know I'll be calling on your help often going forward. --Reuben Reuben Mezrich Pelican Cove in Sarasota Cell: 410-499-8922 On Wed, Mar 10, 2021 at 9:22 AM Graham Stewart wrote: > Reuben: > > No, the deck is not solid fiberglass. In most cases it is comprised of a > sandwich construction with plywood between a heavier fiberglass deck and > thin inside liner. I understand that later models of the boat utilized a > foam core which would not have the problem of core rot but I don't know > when that change occurred. What year is your boat? > > In my case the plywood separated from the deck skin resulting in a soft > deck that would flex when you walked on it. I thought that the soft deck > was due to rot in the core so I cut the duck in half immediately in front > of the cabin, removed the bow section of the deck entirely, separated the > liner, removed the core and replaced it with marine plywood encased in > epoxy and then reinstalled the unit. This gave me the chance to examine the > core construction in detail. What I had is not necessarily what you would > have. My boat is a 1976 and clearly boats of that vintage were not built to > the standards of? later boats. Apparently these early boats were built by > contractors who I can attest cut many corners. > > In my case the core was the cheapest plywood (i.e., not even exterior) > with large voids. The layers of the plywood had separated and the plywood > itself was attached to the deck skin with occasional strips of some sort of > sealant which had long past let go. I could remove the core with my hands. > > Except for one area of about 1' square where the head air vent came > through the deck there was no rot so the extreme measures I took turned out > to be unnecessary. Carefully injecting epoxy into the core might have been > sufficient. The problem was that until you look inside the deck, you it is > difficult to know what is wrong or how well the injection process is > working. > > Knowing what I learned from the deck reconstruction I was able to use the > injection method quite successfully on the side deck - so far as I can > tell. By looking at the core from where the deck was removed I could tell > that delimitation had occurred there as well but without any sign of rot. > Knowing what the problem was I was able to inject thickened epoxy into the > core without going through the core - in which case the injected epoxy > would have simply pooled in the space between the core and the liner. The > liner is solidly attached to the core on the cabin top but not the side > decks. By avoiding this problem I could inject the epoxy into one hole > until it came up through the next hole giving me a pretty good indication > that most of the voids in the plywood and the space between the core and > the deck skin were filled. > > By removing the solar vent in the cabin top I was able to see that the > core, at least in that area, appeared to be solid. Certainly there was not > flex in the deck there so I concluded that I could leave the cabin top as > is. > > I am not telling you this because I think that this is something you > should do - quite the contrary - it is simply to describe what the core was > like for my vintage of boat. I have posted pictures of the process and the > state of the core in previous times but if you or anyone would like to see > them and can't find those pictures in the archive I would be happy to post > them again. > > Whenever a bolt is removed from a deck it is a very good idea to determine > whether water has made its way into the core and to also ensure that the > hole is property sealed with epoxy before the bolt is replaced. If water is > coming into the boat there is an excellent chance that it was also making > its way into the core unless the hole was previously prepared properly. > > The best way to prepare the hole that I have seen is to enlarge the hole > going through the core without enlarging the hole in the fiberglass deck > and liner skins. I did this using a dremmel bit that looks like this: > https://www.leevalley.com/en-ca/shop/tools/power-tool-accessories/burrs/31016-hss-carvers-burrs > . It has a shank that is about 1/8" and a cutter cylinder that is about > 1/4". The bit will fit through the deck hole and then by moving it around > you remove wood creating a hole below thr surface that is about 5/8". Check > the wood dust that is removed to see if it is wet or appears rotted. If > there are signs of rot/water, try remove more of the core to get back to > good wood. If you still have signs of rot you might need to consider a more > extensive fix. > > Put tape over the hole on the inside liner and then coat the hole with > un-thickened epoxy and then pack it with thickened epoxy. Once the epoxy is > set re-drill the hole for the bolt. In my experience it is MUCH easier to > drill the hole when the epoxy is set - solid but not sticky - but before it > cures completely. In this semi-cured state drilling straight through is > much easier. Once cured, the epoxy is much harder than the surrounding > material and the drill bit will want to wander. Using a brad point bit also > helps. This gives a solid and waterproof plug between the deck and inner > skins. > > All this is a bit fussy but not difficult to do and gives you reasonable > assurance that the deck core is protected. You really really want to avoid > having to replace sections of the core. > > > > Graham Stewart > Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 > Kingston Ontario > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf > Of Reuben Mezrich > Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 2021 6:15 AM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first > > Graham > thanks for the suggestions on watching for creep and cleaning up the > butyl...haven't seen it yet but I'll look as it gets warmer down here in > Sarasota. > As to the deck, to be honest I didn't think to look for damage. I don't > know what the deck is made of...it looks and feels solid. At the hole for > the solar vent I could see the deck in cross-section and it sure looks like > solid fiberglass nearly one inch thick...is that possible? > --Reuben > Reuben Mezrich > Pelican Cove in Sarasota > Cell: 410-499-8922 > > > On Tue, Mar 9, 2021 at 11:42 AM Graham Stewart > wrote: > > > I love butyl tape and use it everywhere that does not require adhesive > > properties or below the waterline. It seals beautifully and also allows > the > > removal of the hardware easily. > > > > BTW, to clean up squeeze out you can get most of it off by using a small > > ball of butyl that will stick to the squeeze out and lift most of it. The > > remaining bits can be cleaned up easily with turpentine. You may find > that > > the squeeze out will continue to flow for a very long time. > > > > Did you consider whether there might have been any damage to the core oy > > your deck from the water? I would be concerned about that especially if > the > > core is wood. > > > > Graham Stewart > > gstewart8 at cogeco.ca > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On > Behalf > > Of Reuben Mezrich > > Sent: Tuesday, March 9, 2021 11:25 AM > > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first > > > > After receiving the many excellent suggestions on where to look for > leaks I > > started what ended being a 1 week process to find and ultimately repair > the > > leak. > > > > I first removed the cosmetic wood trim inside the forward cabin at the > bow > > to expose the attachments of the Jib chainplate and the Bow eye. I > sprayed > > water at the bow? and determined these were not the source of the leaks. > I > > then sprayed water on the foredeck and initially saw no water leaking > into > > the boat but when I came back to the boat the next morning found that > some > > water (about 1 - 2 cups) had collected at the bow (By now I had removed > the > > cushions and so could see the water in a puddle on the floor of the > forward > > bunk at the bow). I had some sort of a slow leak. > > > > I then had my wife spray water on the foredeck while I was on my back in > > the forecabin and was able to see that there were leaks at each of the > four > > legs of the pulpit. The leaks would drip onto the carpeted shelf that is > at > > each side of the forecabin (behind a white fiberglass trim piece) and > then > > the water would slowly make its way forward to trickle down at the bow > end > > of the forecabin. > > > > The pulpit is attached by 3/8" bolts that are welded to each of the legs > > and which extend down through holes in the deck and fastened with a flat > > washer, lock washer and 9/16" nut. After unfastening the nuts the pulpit > > lifted up easily. One complication is that the electrical wires that feed > > the navigation lights at the bow extend through a seperate hole just > > forward of the hole for the aft-starboard bolt. That wire seems to run > back > > to the distribution panel and has very little slack and so I had to cut > > it.? When I did remove the pulpit I found there was some white sealant > that > > adhered to the deck but not the pulpit leg (which ends in an oval flange > at > > the bottom) as well as an O-ring around the base of the bolt. > > > > After consulting with Stan, who told me that his preferred method for > > keeping water out is to just use an O-ring around the nut (and not to > apply > > sealant), I cleaned off the old sealant (a product called ReMov which was > > recommended in a Practical Sailor review, worked great for this) I put > new > > O-rings on. Rather than putting an O-ring around the electric wire near > the > > aft-starboard leg I put some wraps of butyl rubber tape abound it. > > I reattached the pulpit, tightened the nuts and had my wife spray the > > foredeck again and sadly found that there was again a leak (perhaps even > > worse than before) at each leg - but not where the electric wire entered > > the cabin. > > > > I removed the pulpit again, removed the o_rings and this time used Butyl > > tape to form the seal at each leg. Using a technique I found on You Tube > I > > cut a 3 - 4 inch length of the tape, rolled the tape along its length > into > > a tube (or rope) and then wrapped it several times about the base of the > > bolt. The thickness can be adjusted by adding more or less wraps and I > was > > generous, using the entire 3 - 4 inch tape at each leg. I added more > Butyl > > to the electric wire. > > > > After putting the pulpit back in place and only moderately tightening the > > nuts, my wife sprayed the foredeck again and this time - success - no > > leaks!! > > > > I have become a big fan of Butyl rubber tape, which to be honest I hadn't > > even heard about till last week! > > > > Of course now I have to splice back the electric wire for the navigation > > light and replace the cosmetic wood trim I removed, but I am much > relieved > > that this problem is solved > > > > Thanks for your advice and support > > > > --Reuben > > Reuben Mezrich > > Pelican Cove in Sarasota > > Cell: 410-499-8922 > > > > > > On Tue, Mar 2, 2021 at 12:49 PM wrote: > > > > > I like to tape paper towels around the suspected areas and see which > ones > > > show moisture first, then investigate further from there . > > > > > > > > > Jerry Lowe > > > S/V Country Rhodes '86 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Roger, Rob and Mike > > > > Thanks for the good suggestions. I'll start by taking off that > > > cosmeticsus > > > > piece of wood at the bow and see what's behind. If nothing is loose > > I"ll > > > > have someone aim a hose at the bow while I"m inside watching in the > > hope > > > > that I might actually see where the water is getting in. > > > > I really do hope I don't have to rebed everything. > > > > Probably won't be able to do this till the weekend..I"ll report back > on > > > > what I find > > > > > > > > Reuben Mezrich > > > > Pelican Cove in Sarasota > > > > Cell: 410-499-8922 > > > > > > > > > > > > On Mon, Mar 1, 2021 at 5:15 PM Michael D. Weisner < > mweisner at ebsmed.com > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > >> Reuben, > > > >> > > > >> I would check the bow eye. The wood backing block usually rots and > the > > > >> eye > > > >> loosens up. Sometimes just lifting the boat using the bow eye will > > cause > > > >> the eye to loosen as the wood compresses. > > > >> > > > >> Also, you may want to re-bed the bow pulpit rail deck fittings, > > chocks, > > > >> etc. > > > >> > > > >> Mike > > > >> s/v Wind Lass ('91) > > > >> Nissequogue River, NY > > > >> I?d rather be sailing :~) > > > >> > > > >> -----Original Message----- > > > >> From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf > Of > > > >> Reuben Mezrich > > > >> Sent: Monday, March 1, 2021 4:08 PM > > > >> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > > > >> Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first > > > >> > > > >> As I mentioned a week or two ago, I installed a Marinco 3" Day/night > > > >> solar > > > >> vent at the bow, using the hole already in place for the anchor > > locker. > > > >> It > > > >> installed easily, seemed to work fine but a few days later we had a > > > >> heavy > > > >> rain and the next day the forward tips of the forward cabin cushions > > > >> were > > > >> wet. I removed the vent, replaced the deck plate, installed a new > > gasket > > > >> under the deck plate, applied a generous amount of RTV silicone to > > both > > > >> sides of the gasket and reinstalled the solar vent. The next day > > > >> (yesterday > > > >> actually) I used a hose to rain water on the forward deck, aiming at > > the > > > >> solar vent for about 6 minutes and when I checked below everything > was > > > >> dry. > > > >> I checked again in an hour and it was still dry. > > > >> This morning there was about a cup of water, maybe two cups of water > > at > > > >> the bow. There was no water in the tray that serves as the anchor > > locker > > > >> and which is directly under the solar vent. The vent itself was dry > as > > > >> was > > > >> the ceiling around the vent. The walls were also dry. I dried the > > water > > > >> with a towel and a few hours later a small amount of water seemed to > > be > > > >> seeping under a triangular piece of wood at the very? bow of the > boat > > > >> (see > > > >> attached photo). I haven't removed that piece of wood yet but I'm > > pretty > > > >> sure I'll find the bolts from the chain plate at the bow for the jib > > > >> stay. > > > >> My feeling now is that the solar vent was never the source of the > leak > > > >> but > > > >> I've had a small leak for a while but never noticed because I never > > had > > > >> a > > > >> reason to go up to the very front of the forward cabin. As it turns > > out > > > >> the > > > >> bottom of the cushions, which are rubberized are stained, giving > > > >> evidence > > > >> that the leak is likely long standing. > > > >> Those bolts would be my best guess as the source of the leak but I'd > > > >> look > > > >> forward to suggestions as to where else I might look. > > > >> > > > >> Its always something > > > >> > > > >> --Reuben > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> Reuben Mezrich > > > >> Pelican Cove in Sarasota > > > >> Cell: 410-499-8922 > > > >> > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> -------------- next part -------------- > > > >> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > > > >> Name: Screen Shot 2021-03-01 at 4.02.36 PM.png > > > >> Type: image/png > > > >> Size: 1826288 bytes > > > >> Desc: not available > > > >> URL: < > > > >> > > > > > > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210301/6a1cf705/attachment.png > > > >> > > > > >> > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: IMG_1237 (2).JPG Type: image/jpeg Size: 2640581 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: IMG_1236.JPG Type: image/jpeg Size: 1275938 bytes Desc: not available URL: From gstewart8 at cogeco.ca Wed Mar 10 14:11:20 2021 From: gstewart8 at cogeco.ca (Graham Stewart) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2021 14:11:20 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first In-Reply-To: References: <1613761250989-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <408F9401-E24B-4554-826E-DD98BFC0E1F3@stottarchitecture.com> <1614623625839-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <005601d70ed3$6283eba0$278bc2e0$@ebsmed.com> <916d9b93-9604-8b3a-c9d5-5c84c1acadb8@generalboats.com> <007501d70ee8$6edeb690$4c9c23b0$@ebsmed.com> <54709.24.140.30.102.1614707391.squirrel@quickpop.sssnet.com> <009001d71503$2219f290$664dd7b0$@ca> <003501d715b8$ca4256f0$5ec704d0$@ca> <004e01d715c8$4abad640$e03082c0$@ca> Message-ID: <000901d715e1$290dbcb0$7b293610$@ca> Do you know whether the number matches the one on the boat's transom? Graham Stewart Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 Kingston Ontario -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf Of Reuben Mezrich Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 2021 11:34 AM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first OK This is the HIN as it appears on my Certificate of Origin [image: image.png] My secret ring HIN decoder suggests it was built (I"m not sure if that means started or finished) on May, 7, 2018. The serial number is 22XX5 and of course the builder is GBX I don't think the HIN system was designed for rebuilt boats so I can't tell from this when the boat was initially built I do know it was delivered to me in December, 2020. --Reuben Reuben Mezrich Pelican Cove in Sarasota Cell: 410-499-8922 On Wed, Mar 10, 2021 at 11:13 AM Graham Stewart wrote: > I expect that the HIN would not change when the boat was rebuilt but could > well be wrong about that. At the same time it seems odd to me that the boat > was built in 2018 and rebuilt in 2020. Why not post your HIN and I am sure > someone can figure it out. > > Graham Stewart > Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 > Kingston Ontario > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf > Of Reuben Mezrich > Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 2021 10:02 AM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first > > Graham > Thank you for this fantastic, detailed, discussion of how the boat (at > least the deck) is built and how to repair any damage. So far my deck seems > solid without any flex but I'll keep on the lookout. > > As to when my boat was initially built, I'm not sure. I ordered the rebuilt > boat in the spring of 2020 and received it in December, 2020. The HIN > indicates it was built (or rebuilt) in 2018. I've asked Stan when it was > initially built but haven't heard back yet. > > Again, I thank you and the rest of da list, for your advice and support. I > know I'll be calling on your help often going forward. > --Reuben > > Reuben Mezrich > Pelican Cove in Sarasota > Cell: 410-499-8922 > > > On Wed, Mar 10, 2021 at 9:22 AM Graham Stewart > wrote: > > > Reuben: > > > > No, the deck is not solid fiberglass. In most cases it is comprised of a > > sandwich construction with plywood between a heavier fiberglass deck and > > thin inside liner. I understand that later models of the boat utilized a > > foam core which would not have the problem of core rot but I don't know > > when that change occurred. What year is your boat? > > > > In my case the plywood separated from the deck skin resulting in a soft > > deck that would flex when you walked on it. I thought that the soft deck > > was due to rot in the core so I cut the duck in half immediately in front > > of the cabin, removed the bow section of the deck entirely, separated the > > liner, removed the core and replaced it with marine plywood encased in > > epoxy and then reinstalled the unit. This gave me the chance to examine > the > > core construction in detail. What I had is not necessarily what you would > > have. My boat is a 1976 and clearly boats of that vintage were not built > to > > the standards of later boats. Apparently these early boats were built by > > contractors who I can attest cut many corners. > > > > In my case the core was the cheapest plywood (i.e., not even exterior) > > with large voids. The layers of the plywood had separated and the plywood > > itself was attached to the deck skin with occasional strips of some sort > of > > sealant which had long past let go. I could remove the core with my > hands. > > > > Except for one area of about 1' square where the head air vent came > > through the deck there was no rot so the extreme measures I took turned > out > > to be unnecessary. Carefully injecting epoxy into the core might have > been > > sufficient. The problem was that until you look inside the deck, you it > is > > difficult to know what is wrong or how well the injection process is > > working. > > > > Knowing what I learned from the deck reconstruction I was able to use the > > injection method quite successfully on the side deck - so far as I can > > tell. By looking at the core from where the deck was removed I could tell > > that delimitation had occurred there as well but without any sign of rot. > > Knowing what the problem was I was able to inject thickened epoxy into > the > > core without going through the core - in which case the injected epoxy > > would have simply pooled in the space between the core and the liner. The > > liner is solidly attached to the core on the cabin top but not the side > > decks. By avoiding this problem I could inject the epoxy into one hole > > until it came up through the next hole giving me a pretty good indication > > that most of the voids in the plywood and the space between the core and > > the deck skin were filled. > > > > By removing the solar vent in the cabin top I was able to see that the > > core, at least in that area, appeared to be solid. Certainly there was > not > > flex in the deck there so I concluded that I could leave the cabin top as > > is. > > > > I am not telling you this because I think that this is something you > > should do - quite the contrary - it is simply to describe what the core > was > > like for my vintage of boat. I have posted pictures of the process and > the > > state of the core in previous times but if you or anyone would like to > see > > them and can't find those pictures in the archive I would be happy to > post > > them again. > > > > Whenever a bolt is removed from a deck it is a very good idea to > determine > > whether water has made its way into the core and to also ensure that the > > hole is property sealed with epoxy before the bolt is replaced. If water > is > > coming into the boat there is an excellent chance that it was also making > > its way into the core unless the hole was previously prepared properly. > > > > The best way to prepare the hole that I have seen is to enlarge the hole > > going through the core without enlarging the hole in the fiberglass deck > > and liner skins. I did this using a dremmel bit that looks like this: > > > https://www.leevalley.com/en-ca/shop/tools/power-tool-accessories/burrs/31016-hss-carvers-burrs > > . It has a shank that is about 1/8" and a cutter cylinder that is about > > 1/4". The bit will fit through the deck hole and then by moving it around > > you remove wood creating a hole below thr surface that is about 5/8". > Check > > the wood dust that is removed to see if it is wet or appears rotted. If > > there are signs of rot/water, try remove more of the core to get back to > > good wood. If you still have signs of rot you might need to consider a > more > > extensive fix. > > > > Put tape over the hole on the inside liner and then coat the hole with > > un-thickened epoxy and then pack it with thickened epoxy. Once the epoxy > is > > set re-drill the hole for the bolt. In my experience it is MUCH easier to > > drill the hole when the epoxy is set - solid but not sticky - but before > it > > cures completely. In this semi-cured state drilling straight through is > > much easier. Once cured, the epoxy is much harder than the surrounding > > material and the drill bit will want to wander. Using a brad point bit > also > > helps. This gives a solid and waterproof plug between the deck and inner > > skins. > > > > All this is a bit fussy but not difficult to do and gives you reasonable > > assurance that the deck core is protected. You really really want to > avoid > > having to replace sections of the core. > > > > > > > > Graham Stewart > > Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 > > Kingston Ontario > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On > Behalf > > Of Reuben Mezrich > > Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 2021 6:15 AM > > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first > > > > Graham > > thanks for the suggestions on watching for creep and cleaning up the > > butyl...haven't seen it yet but I'll look as it gets warmer down here in > > Sarasota. > > As to the deck, to be honest I didn't think to look for damage. I don't > > know what the deck is made of...it looks and feels solid. At the hole for > > the solar vent I could see the deck in cross-section and it sure looks > like > > solid fiberglass nearly one inch thick...is that possible? > > --Reuben > > Reuben Mezrich > > Pelican Cove in Sarasota > > Cell: 410-499-8922 > > > > > > On Tue, Mar 9, 2021 at 11:42 AM Graham Stewart > > wrote: > > > > > I love butyl tape and use it everywhere that does not require adhesive > > > properties or below the waterline. It seals beautifully and also allows > > the > > > removal of the hardware easily. > > > > > > BTW, to clean up squeeze out you can get most of it off by using a > small > > > ball of butyl that will stick to the squeeze out and lift most of it. > The > > > remaining bits can be cleaned up easily with turpentine. You may find > > that > > > the squeeze out will continue to flow for a very long time. > > > > > > Did you consider whether there might have been any damage to the core > oy > > > your deck from the water? I would be concerned about that especially if > > the > > > core is wood. > > > > > > Graham Stewart > > > gstewart8 at cogeco.ca > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On > > Behalf > > > Of Reuben Mezrich > > > Sent: Tuesday, March 9, 2021 11:25 AM > > > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > > > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first > > > > > > After receiving the many excellent suggestions on where to look for > > leaks I > > > started what ended being a 1 week process to find and ultimately repair > > the > > > leak. > > > > > > I first removed the cosmetic wood trim inside the forward cabin at the > > bow > > > to expose the attachments of the Jib chainplate and the Bow eye. I > > sprayed > > > water at the bow and determined these were not the source of the > leaks. > > I > > > then sprayed water on the foredeck and initially saw no water leaking > > into > > > the boat but when I came back to the boat the next morning found that > > some > > > water (about 1 - 2 cups) had collected at the bow (By now I had removed > > the > > > cushions and so could see the water in a puddle on the floor of the > > forward > > > bunk at the bow). I had some sort of a slow leak. > > > > > > I then had my wife spray water on the foredeck while I was on my back > in > > > the forecabin and was able to see that there were leaks at each of the > > four > > > legs of the pulpit. The leaks would drip onto the carpeted shelf that > is > > at > > > each side of the forecabin (behind a white fiberglass trim piece) and > > then > > > the water would slowly make its way forward to trickle down at the bow > > end > > > of the forecabin. > > > > > > The pulpit is attached by 3/8" bolts that are welded to each of the > legs > > > and which extend down through holes in the deck and fastened with a > flat > > > washer, lock washer and 9/16" nut. After unfastening the nuts the > pulpit > > > lifted up easily. One complication is that the electrical wires that > feed > > > the navigation lights at the bow extend through a seperate hole just > > > forward of the hole for the aft-starboard bolt. That wire seems to run > > back > > > to the distribution panel and has very little slack and so I had to cut > > > it. When I did remove the pulpit I found there was some white sealant > > that > > > adhered to the deck but not the pulpit leg (which ends in an oval > flange > > at > > > the bottom) as well as an O-ring around the base of the bolt. > > > > > > After consulting with Stan, who told me that his preferred method for > > > keeping water out is to just use an O-ring around the nut (and not to > > apply > > > sealant), I cleaned off the old sealant (a product called ReMov which > was > > > recommended in a Practical Sailor review, worked great for this) I put > > new > > > O-rings on. Rather than putting an O-ring around the electric wire near > > the > > > aft-starboard leg I put some wraps of butyl rubber tape abound it. > > > I reattached the pulpit, tightened the nuts and had my wife spray the > > > foredeck again and sadly found that there was again a leak (perhaps > even > > > worse than before) at each leg - but not where the electric wire > entered > > > the cabin. > > > > > > I removed the pulpit again, removed the o_rings and this time used > Butyl > > > tape to form the seal at each leg. Using a technique I found on You > Tube > > I > > > cut a 3 - 4 inch length of the tape, rolled the tape along its length > > into > > > a tube (or rope) and then wrapped it several times about the base of > the > > > bolt. The thickness can be adjusted by adding more or less wraps and I > > was > > > generous, using the entire 3 - 4 inch tape at each leg. I added more > > Butyl > > > to the electric wire. > > > > > > After putting the pulpit back in place and only moderately tightening > the > > > nuts, my wife sprayed the foredeck again and this time - success - no > > > leaks!! > > > > > > I have become a big fan of Butyl rubber tape, which to be honest I > hadn't > > > even heard about till last week! > > > > > > Of course now I have to splice back the electric wire for the > navigation > > > light and replace the cosmetic wood trim I removed, but I am much > > relieved > > > that this problem is solved > > > > > > Thanks for your advice and support > > > > > > --Reuben > > > Reuben Mezrich > > > Pelican Cove in Sarasota > > > Cell: 410-499-8922 > > > > > > > > > On Tue, Mar 2, 2021 at 12:49 PM wrote: > > > > > > > I like to tape paper towels around the suspected areas and see which > > ones > > > > show moisture first, then investigate further from there . > > > > > > > > > > > > Jerry Lowe > > > > S/V Country Rhodes '86 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Roger, Rob and Mike > > > > > Thanks for the good suggestions. I'll start by taking off that > > > > cosmeticsus > > > > > piece of wood at the bow and see what's behind. If nothing is loose > > > I"ll > > > > > have someone aim a hose at the bow while I"m inside watching in the > > > hope > > > > > that I might actually see where the water is getting in. > > > > > I really do hope I don't have to rebed everything. > > > > > Probably won't be able to do this till the weekend..I"ll report > back > > on > > > > > what I find > > > > > > > > > > Reuben Mezrich > > > > > Pelican Cove in Sarasota > > > > > Cell: 410-499-8922 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Mon, Mar 1, 2021 at 5:15 PM Michael D. Weisner < > > mweisner at ebsmed.com > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > >> Reuben, > > > > >> > > > > >> I would check the bow eye. The wood backing block usually rots and > > the > > > > >> eye > > > > >> loosens up. Sometimes just lifting the boat using the bow eye will > > > cause > > > > >> the eye to loosen as the wood compresses. > > > > >> > > > > >> Also, you may want to re-bed the bow pulpit rail deck fittings, > > > chocks, > > > > >> etc. > > > > >> > > > > >> Mike > > > > >> s/v Wind Lass ('91) > > > > >> Nissequogue River, NY > > > > >> I?d rather be sailing :~) > > > > >> > > > > >> -----Original Message----- > > > > >> From: Rhodes22-list On > Behalf > > Of > > > > >> Reuben Mezrich > > > > >> Sent: Monday, March 1, 2021 4:08 PM > > > > >> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > > > > >> Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first > > > > >> > > > > >> As I mentioned a week or two ago, I installed a Marinco 3" > Day/night > > > > >> solar > > > > >> vent at the bow, using the hole already in place for the anchor > > > locker. > > > > >> It > > > > >> installed easily, seemed to work fine but a few days later we had > a > > > > >> heavy > > > > >> rain and the next day the forward tips of the forward cabin > cushions > > > > >> were > > > > >> wet. I removed the vent, replaced the deck plate, installed a new > > > gasket > > > > >> under the deck plate, applied a generous amount of RTV silicone to > > > both > > > > >> sides of the gasket and reinstalled the solar vent. The next day > > > > >> (yesterday > > > > >> actually) I used a hose to rain water on the forward deck, aiming > at > > > the > > > > >> solar vent for about 6 minutes and when I checked below everything > > was > > > > >> dry. > > > > >> I checked again in an hour and it was still dry. > > > > >> This morning there was about a cup of water, maybe two cups of > water > > > at > > > > >> the bow. There was no water in the tray that serves as the anchor > > > locker > > > > >> and which is directly under the solar vent. The vent itself was > dry > > as > > > > >> was > > > > >> the ceiling around the vent. The walls were also dry. I dried the > > > water > > > > >> with a towel and a few hours later a small amount of water seemed > to > > > be > > > > >> seeping under a triangular piece of wood at the very bow of the > > boat > > > > >> (see > > > > >> attached photo). I haven't removed that piece of wood yet but I'm > > > pretty > > > > >> sure I'll find the bolts from the chain plate at the bow for the > jib > > > > >> stay. > > > > >> My feeling now is that the solar vent was never the source of the > > leak > > > > >> but > > > > >> I've had a small leak for a while but never noticed because I > never > > > had > > > > >> a > > > > >> reason to go up to the very front of the forward cabin. As it > turns > > > out > > > > >> the > > > > >> bottom of the cushions, which are rubberized are stained, giving > > > > >> evidence > > > > >> that the leak is likely long standing. > > > > >> Those bolts would be my best guess as the source of the leak but > I'd > > > > >> look > > > > >> forward to suggestions as to where else I might look. > > > > >> > > > > >> Its always something > > > > >> > > > > >> --Reuben > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> Reuben Mezrich > > > > >> Pelican Cove in Sarasota > > > > >> Cell: 410-499-8922 > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > > >> -------------- next part -------------- > > > > >> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > > > > >> Name: Screen Shot 2021-03-01 at 4.02.36 PM.png > > > > >> Type: image/png > > > > >> Size: 1826288 bytes > > > > >> Desc: not available > > > > >> URL: < > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210301/6a1cf705/attachment.png > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: image.png Type: image/png Size: 43698 bytes Desc: not available URL: From gstewart8 at cogeco.ca Wed Mar 10 14:22:36 2021 From: gstewart8 at cogeco.ca (Graham Stewart) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2021 14:22:36 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Leak at the bow....where to look first In-Reply-To: <1347635490.1010062.1615399813953@mail.yahoo.com> References: <1613761250989-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <408F9401-E24B-4554-826E-DD98BFC0E1F3@stottarchitecture.com> <1614623625839-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <005601d70ed3$6283eba0$278bc2e0$@ebsmed.com> <916d9b93-9604-8b3a-c9d5-5c84c1acadb8@generalboats.com> <007501d70ee8$6edeb690$4c9c23b0$@ebsmed.com> <54709.24.140.30.102.1614707391.squirrel@quickpop.sssnet.com> <009001d71503$2219f290$664dd7b0$@ca> <003501d715b8$ca4256f0$5ec704d0$@ca> <1347635490.1010062.1615399813953@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <000a01d715e2$bcd77cf0$368676d0$@ca> Looks a lot like mine did. What year is your boat? Graham Stewart Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 Kingston Ontario > > > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210301/6a1cf705/attachment.png > > > >> > > > > >> > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: IMG_1237 (2).JPG Type: image/jpeg Size: 2640581 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: IMG_1236.JPG Type: image/jpeg Size: 1275938 bytes Desc: not available URL: From snstaum at gmail.com Wed Mar 10 14:36:37 2021 From: snstaum at gmail.com (Stephen Staum) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2021 14:36:37 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Electric Motor Lift Question Message-ID: Dear All, I have questions for you about the electric motor lift. 1. How many have experience with the reliability of the motor lift in salt water conditions & how many years? 2. What problems have you had with it if any? 3. Is there a fail safe to allow lowering the outboard for use if the electric motor or switch fails? I am thinking of upgrading. Thanks in advance for your help. *Thanks and Stay Well,* *Stephen Staum* s/v Carol Lee 2 Needham, MA From cklang at aol.com Wed Mar 10 14:48:50 2021 From: cklang at aol.com (Cynthia Lang) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2021 19:48:50 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Free Rhodes References: <64203802.1054380.1615405730218.ref@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <64203802.1054380.1615405730218@mail.yahoo.com> https://jerseyshore.craigslist.org/boa/d/manahawkin-22-rhodes-continental-free/7270200444.html It is not mine, but I thought I would share listing. From rweiss at siu.edu Wed Mar 10 15:02:46 2021 From: rweiss at siu.edu (Weiss, Robert L) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2021 20:02:46 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Electric Motor Lift Question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I can't speak to salt water issues, but my electric motor has a knob on the side that would allow me to crank the motor down if the electrical component fails. Bob Robert L Weiss Jr. Director of Music First United Methodist Carbondale, IL Professor Emeritus, SIUC ________________________________ From: Rhodes22-list on behalf of Stephen Staum Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 2021 1:36 PM To: The Rhodes 22 mail list Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Electric Motor Lift Question [EXTERNAL EMAIL ALERT]: Verify sender before opening links or attachments. Dear All, I have questions for you about the electric motor lift. 1. How many have experience with the reliability of the motor lift in salt water conditions & how many years? 2. What problems have you had with it if any? 3. Is there a fail safe to allow lowering the outboard for use if the electric motor or switch fails? I am thinking of upgrading. Thanks in advance for your help. *Thanks and Stay Well,* *Stephen Staum* s/v Carol Lee 2 Needham, MA From snstaum at gmail.com Wed Mar 10 15:05:16 2021 From: snstaum at gmail.com (Stephen Staum) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2021 15:05:16 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Electric Motor Lift Question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Thanks Bob *Thanks and Stay Well,* *Stephen Staum* *s/v Carol Lee 2* On Wed, Mar 10, 2021 at 3:02 PM Weiss, Robert L wrote: > I can't speak to salt water issues, but my electric motor has a knob on > the side that would allow me to crank the motor down if the electrical > component fails. > > Bob > > Robert L Weiss Jr. > Director of Music > First United Methodist Carbondale, IL > Professor Emeritus, SIUC > ________________________________ > From: Rhodes22-list on behalf of > Stephen Staum > Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 2021 1:36 PM > To: The Rhodes 22 mail list > Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Electric Motor Lift Question > > [EXTERNAL EMAIL ALERT]: Verify sender before opening links or attachments. > > Dear All, > > I have questions for you about the electric motor lift. > > 1. How many have experience with the reliability of the motor lift in salt > water conditions & how many years? > 2. What problems have you had with it if any? > 3. Is there a fail safe to allow lowering the outboard for use if the > electric motor or switch fails? > I am thinking of upgrading. Thanks in advance for your help. > > *Thanks and Stay Well,* > > *Stephen Staum* > s/v Carol Lee 2 > Needham, MA > From rweiss at siu.edu Wed Mar 10 15:21:04 2021 From: rweiss at siu.edu (Weiss, Robert L) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2021 20:21:04 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Electric Motor Lift Question In-Reply-To: References: , Message-ID: [cid:683030dc-6688-4199-98fc-d04b4eab4131] Robert L Weiss Jr. Director of Music First United Methodist Carbondale, IL Professor Emeritus, SIUC ________________________________ From: Rhodes22-list on behalf of Stephen Staum Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 2021 2:05 PM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Electric Motor Lift Question [EXTERNAL EMAIL ALERT]: Verify sender before opening links or attachments. Thanks Bob *Thanks and Stay Well,* *Stephen Staum* *s/v Carol Lee 2* On Wed, Mar 10, 2021 at 3:02 PM Weiss, Robert L wrote: > I can't speak to salt water issues, but my electric motor has a knob on > the side that would allow me to crank the motor down if the electrical > component fails. > > Bob > > Robert L Weiss Jr. > Director of Music > First United Methodist Carbondale, IL > Professor Emeritus, SIUC > ________________________________ > From: Rhodes22-list on behalf of > Stephen Staum > Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 2021 1:36 PM > To: The Rhodes 22 mail list > Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Electric Motor Lift Question > > [EXTERNAL EMAIL ALERT]: Verify sender before opening links or attachments. > > Dear All, > > I have questions for you about the electric motor lift. > > 1. How many have experience with the reliability of the motor lift in salt > water conditions & how many years? > 2. What problems have you had with it if any? > 3. Is there a fail safe to allow lowering the outboard for use if the > electric motor or switch fails? > I am thinking of upgrading. Thanks in advance for your help. > > *Thanks and Stay Well,* > > *Stephen Staum* > s/v Carol Lee 2 > Needham, MA > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: IMG_2502_20160506_132353.JPG Type: image/jpeg Size: 1845724 bytes Desc: IMG_2502_20160506_132353.JPG URL: From rweiss at siu.edu Wed Mar 10 15:22:53 2021 From: rweiss at siu.edu (Weiss, Robert L) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2021 20:22:53 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Electric Motor Lift Question In-Reply-To: References: , , Message-ID: Sorry, I should have noted that the I sent a photo of the electric motor showing the knob to turn and the instructions on the motor. Robert L Weiss Jr. Director of Music First United Methodist Carbondale, IL Professor Emeritus, SIUC ________________________________ From: Rhodes22-list on behalf of Weiss, Robert L Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 2021 2:21 PM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Electric Motor Lift Question [cid:683030dc-6688-4199-98fc-d04b4eab4131] Robert L Weiss Jr. Director of Music First United Methodist Carbondale, IL Professor Emeritus, SIUC ________________________________ From: Rhodes22-list on behalf of Stephen Staum Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 2021 2:05 PM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Electric Motor Lift Question [EXTERNAL EMAIL ALERT]: Verify sender before opening links or attachments. Thanks Bob *Thanks and Stay Well,* *Stephen Staum* *s/v Carol Lee 2* On Wed, Mar 10, 2021 at 3:02 PM Weiss, Robert L wrote: > I can't speak to salt water issues, but my electric motor has a knob on > the side that would allow me to crank the motor down if the electrical > component fails. > > Bob > > Robert L Weiss Jr. > Director of Music > First United Methodist Carbondale, IL > Professor Emeritus, SIUC > ________________________________ > From: Rhodes22-list on behalf of > Stephen Staum > Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 2021 1:36 PM > To: The Rhodes 22 mail list > Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Electric Motor Lift Question > > [EXTERNAL EMAIL ALERT]: Verify sender before opening links or attachments. > > Dear All, > > I have questions for you about the electric motor lift. > > 1. How many have experience with the reliability of the motor lift in salt > water conditions & how many years? > 2. What problems have you had with it if any? > 3. Is there a fail safe to allow lowering the outboard for use if the > electric motor or switch fails? > I am thinking of upgrading. Thanks in advance for your help. > > *Thanks and Stay Well,* > > *Stephen Staum* > s/v Carol Lee 2 > Needham, MA > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: IMG_2502_20160506_132353.JPG Type: image/jpeg Size: 1845724 bytes Desc: IMG_2502_20160506_132353.JPG URL: From joedempsey at hughes.net Wed Mar 10 15:37:15 2021 From: joedempsey at hughes.net (Joe Dempsey) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2021 13:37:15 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Website News In-Reply-To: <016801d715c9$9cfa2d10$d6ee8730$@ebsmed.com> References: <016801d715c9$9cfa2d10$d6ee8730$@ebsmed.com> Message-ID: <1615408635307-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Hey, Mike and Peter, great job. It gets better each time I click on it! I know this took alot of time and effort. Thanks for making the Rhodes an even better boat!! Even includes the R22 Burgee info. Orders are coming in. Get your orders in, Rhodies, the sooner we reach 25, the sooner they'll go into production! We had 50 commitments so we should reach the 25 threshold in no time! ----- Joe Dempsey s/v Respite Rhodes 22 1989/2005 Deltaville,VA -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From sloopblueheron at gmail.com Wed Mar 10 16:08:19 2021 From: sloopblueheron at gmail.com (Rick Lange) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2021 16:08:19 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] mooring In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Scott, Your forward crew can do the same on an R22. Regards, Rick Lange On Tue, Mar 9, 2021 at 4:50 PM Scott Andrews via Rhodes22-list < rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org> wrote: > Thanks everyone, I get it now. I was thinking of my experience with > smaller boats, thistles & flying Scots when forward crew could clip on the > ball. > Scott > > Sent from my iPhone > > > On Mar 9, 2021, at 1:49 PM, ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: > > > > ? > > Scott, > > > > Assuming you are using Peter?s below attached definitions for bow eye > and bow cleat, the only reason you would want to tie off to the bow eye vs > the bow cleat would be if you are anchoring on short scope or if the anchor > is set into a poor holding bottom. Tying off to the bow eye reduces the > vertical distance from the tie off point to the anchor. Remember, the > vertical distance is the water depth + height of the tie off point above > the water. An example may make this more clear. My bow eye is about 1.5 > ft above the water and my bow cleats are about 3.0 ft above the water. > Suppose we are anchoring in 7 ft of water using 60 ft of anchor rode. > Tying off to the bow eye would yield a scope ratio of [60 ft] / [7 ft + 1.5 > ft] = 60 / 8.5 = 7.1 . Tying off to the bow cleat would yield a scope > ratio of > > [60 ft] / [7 ft + 3.0 ft] = 60 / 10 = 6.0 . A scope ratio of 7.1 would > probably be OK for anchoring overnight. A scope ratio of 6.0 would be > iffy. So, if you are trying to anchor in a situation where there is > limited room to swing &/or a poor holding bottom; then, consider using the > bow eye vs the bow cleat to slightly improve your scope ratio. Of course, > using the bow eye is much more trouble vs using the bow cleat. A typical > mooring has a huge deeply set anchor that is unlikely to drag and so there > is usually no reason to use the bow eye vs the bow cleat on a mooring. > > > > Having said that, I used my bow eye and stern eye at my slip very time I > docked at my home slip. But, I was in a situation where I parked sideways > to a wharf and the boat was exposed to wave action from the side. Rather > than depend upon fenders to absorb the wave action and keep the hull off > the dock, I had a pair of mooring whips. Mooring whips look like HD > fishing poles attached to the dock. I had my mooring whips setup to attach > to the bow eye and stern eye using quick release carabiners. They held the > boat about 2 ft off the dock. Of course all that gear was swept away along > with my dock during the May 19, 2020 dam failure and flood! > > > > Roger Pihlaja > > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > > > Sent from Mail for Windows 10 > > > > From: Peter Nyberg > > Sent: Tuesday, March 9, 2021 11:00 AM > > To: sea20 at verizon.net; The Rhodes 22 Email List > > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] mooring > > > > Scott, > > > > I?m not sure what you?re asking, and it may be a terminology issue. Is > it possible that when you say ?bow eye? you mean ?bow cleat?? The bow > cleat would be attached to the deck, where as the bow eye is attached to > the stem of the hull. You could in theory attach your mooring to the bow > eye, but I can?t see why you would want a second one. > > > > Adding one or two more cleats at the bow is a pretty common project. You > would want it through-bolted, and you would want to avoid any possibility > of water finding it?s way into the deck core. I?d recommend a > drill-fill-drill approach. If you don?t know what that is, I can > elaborate. > > > > ?Peter > > > > > On Mar 9, 2021, at 8:44 AM, Scott E Andrews via Rhodes22-list < > rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org> wrote: > > > > > > Greetings all, I will likely be on a waiting list for a slip next > season and will be on a mooring. I have a couple questions regarding > painter and pendant attachment. I read MJM"s email regarding use of the bow > eye with chocks. Is the any reason not to add a second bow eye? Also, is > there a recomended pendant or painter length? Thanks everyone. > > > Scott AndrewsFirst year owner, Wilmington De > > > > > From lgioia at yahoo.com Wed Mar 10 17:10:11 2021 From: lgioia at yahoo.com (Larry Gioia) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2021 17:10:11 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Free Rhodes In-Reply-To: <64203802.1054380.1615405730218@mail.yahoo.com> References: <64203802.1054380.1615405730218@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Interesting project! Says the guy with no time nor a place to store it. Larry > On Mar 10, 2021, at 2:49 PM, Cynthia Lang via Rhodes22-list wrote: > > ?https://jerseyshore.craigslist.org/boa/d/manahawkin-22-rhodes-continental-free/7270200444.html > It is not mine, but I thought I would share listing. From jesse.laten.shumaker at gmail.com Wed Mar 10 20:08:09 2021 From: jesse.laten.shumaker at gmail.com (Jesse Shumaker) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2021 19:08:09 -0600 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Website News In-Reply-To: References: <016801d715c9$9cfa2d10$d6ee8730$@ebsmed.com> Message-ID: Great job with the updates to the website! Thanks for your efforts and letting us know how we can help support this. Jesse Shumaker S/V Zephyr On Wed, Mar 10, 2021 at 11:08 AM Peter Nyberg wrote: > Mike forgot to mention the ?Donate? button on the home page. You can kick > in a few bucks to help Mike cover the cost of hosting the website and email > list. The button takes you to PayPal, but you can donate with a credit > card if you prefer. > > ?Peter > > > On Mar 10, 2021, at 11:22 AM, Michael D. Weisner > wrote: > > > > Hi Fellow Rhodies, > > > > > > > > Please take a look around the www.rhodes22.org > > website. It is my hope that this website and the associated Mailman email > > forum will be the center of all things Rhodes 22. The website maintains > > records, pictures, documents, email exchanges of the Rhodes 22 Owners' > Group > > for more than 20 years! If you are looking to purchase, own a Rhodes 22 > or > > have owned one in the past, this website is for you. > > > > > > > > I just refreshed the web server with Peter's latest changes. Peter and I > > talked about many new items for the site and he has made them "pop" both > in > > terms of appearance and speed of implementation. Another well deserved > round > > of applause, and a beer, for Peter! > > > > > > > > Checkout the "Community News" webpage for the latest Rhodie events. The > > Rhodes 22 Burgee is currently featured on the page with a link to Joe's > > purchasing instructions email posting. Kudos to Joe Demsey for all his > hard > > work in making this happen for our community. Let's go buy them! > > > > > > > > We now have a "Video and More" webpage to organize many of the fine > videos > > that have been posted to youtube and other websites, showing Rhodies > sailing > > and documenting technical projects associated with owning a Rhodes 22 > > sailboat. Don't forget to review Peter's invaluable Silverheels videos on > > youtube for project ideas. > > > > > > > > In addition, we added a "Contact the Webmaster" button at the bottom of > > every webpage. Please use this for website suggestions, submissions (new > > videos or documents) and other feedback that you do not wish to post to > "da > > List". > > > > > > > > I would like to update some of the picture gallery with more recent > Rhodie > > gatherings and pictures of Rhodie families. The latest that I have, I > think, > > are some pictures from the party at the 2017 Annapolis show. Please send > > images to webmaster at rhodes22.org . > > > > > > > > Thank you to all of the Rhodies who have made this community a success! > > > > > > > > Fair winds, > > > > Mike > > > > s/v Wind Lass ('91) > > > > Nissequogue River, NY > > > > List/Web Admin > > > > I'd rather be sailing :-) > > > > > > > > > > > > From jesse.laten.shumaker at gmail.com Wed Mar 10 20:15:49 2021 From: jesse.laten.shumaker at gmail.com (Jesse Shumaker) Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2021 19:15:49 -0600 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Electric Motor Lift Question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hi Stephen, The prior owner of my boat had the boat in Florida for several years so it was in a saltwater environment, but it was on a lift so it wasn't left sitting in the water. When I bought the boat, the remote control was becoming unreliable and that was the only switch. Some other folks on the list have had some concerns about the remote and perhaps some people have found replacements for the remote. I think some people have added a wired switch. I took the approach of replacing the winch with one that came with a wired switch as well as two remote controls since I prefer redundancy. It has worked out well. I documented that project at the following link: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/Replacement-of-winch-for-motor-lift-td56157.html#none I think most (perhaps all) of the ATV winches have the release knob that Bob showed in his photo. Jesse Shumaker S/V Zephyr On Wed, Mar 10, 2021 at 1:36 PM Stephen Staum wrote: > Dear All, > > I have questions for you about the electric motor lift. > > 1. How many have experience with the reliability of the motor lift in salt > water conditions & how many years? > 2. What problems have you had with it if any? > 3. Is there a fail safe to allow lowering the outboard for use if the > electric motor or switch fails? > I am thinking of upgrading. Thanks in advance for your help. > > *Thanks and Stay Well,* > > *Stephen Staum* > s/v Carol Lee 2 > Needham, MA > From snstaum at gmail.com Thu Mar 11 06:48:51 2021 From: snstaum at gmail.com (Stephen Staum) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2021 06:48:51 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Electric Motor Lift Question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Thanks Jesse. *Thanks and Stay Well,* *Stephen Staum* *s/v Carol Lee 2* On Wed, Mar 10, 2021 at 8:16 PM Jesse Shumaker < jesse.laten.shumaker at gmail.com> wrote: > Hi Stephen, > > The prior owner of my boat had the boat in Florida for several years so it > was in a saltwater environment, but it was on a lift so it wasn't left > sitting in the water. When I bought the boat, the remote control was > becoming unreliable and that was the only switch. Some other folks on the > list have had some concerns about the remote and perhaps some people have > found replacements for the remote. I think some people have added a wired > switch. I took the approach of replacing the winch with one that came with > a wired switch as well as two remote controls since I prefer redundancy. > It has worked out well. I documented that project at the following link: > > http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/Replacement-of-winch-for-motor-lift-td56157.html#none > > I think most (perhaps all) of the ATV winches have the release knob that > Bob showed in his photo. > > Jesse Shumaker > S/V Zephyr > > On Wed, Mar 10, 2021 at 1:36 PM Stephen Staum wrote: > > > Dear All, > > > > I have questions for you about the electric motor lift. > > > > 1. How many have experience with the reliability of the motor lift in > salt > > water conditions & how many years? > > 2. What problems have you had with it if any? > > 3. Is there a fail safe to allow lowering the outboard for use if the > > electric motor or switch fails? > > I am thinking of upgrading. Thanks in advance for your help. > > > > *Thanks and Stay Well,* > > > > *Stephen Staum* > > s/v Carol Lee 2 > > Needham, MA > > > From reuben.mezrich at gmail.com Thu Mar 11 08:23:05 2021 From: reuben.mezrich at gmail.com (Reuben Mezrich) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2021 08:23:05 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] BURGEE ORDERING INSTRUCTIONS In-Reply-To: <1615389509838-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1615316576867-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <87C25482-3B98-4164-B997-50F5AF4378F8@sunnybeeches.com> <1615389509838-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: Cindy called last evening to confirm my order and take my credit card information. She said much more than 25 people had already placed orders and that I should expect my Burgee in about 4 weeks She said I should thank Joe for his hard work. Thanks Joe! --Reuben Reuben Mezrich Pelican Cove in Sarasota Cell: 410-499-8922 On Wed, Mar 10, 2021 at 10:18 AM Joe Dempsey wrote: > You can certainly do that, but due to time differential and she's using a > cell phone not always at her desk, this was the best I could do and have > some sort of paper trail. > > > > ----- > Joe Dempsey > s/v Respite > Rhodes 22 1989/2005 > Deltaville,VA > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > From goldsmith.cf at gmail.com Thu Mar 11 08:28:49 2021 From: goldsmith.cf at gmail.com (Frank Goldsmith) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2021 08:28:49 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] BURGEE ORDERING INSTRUCTIONS In-Reply-To: References: <1615316576867-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <87C25482-3B98-4164-B997-50F5AF4378F8@sunnybeeches.com> <1615389509838-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <09412022-5F66-4F8C-B4D8-6F2699B8A008@gmail.com> Same here. Yes, thanks, Joe! Great work. Frank Frank Goldsmith Fairview, NC > On Mar 11, 2021, at 8:23 AM, Reuben Mezrich wrote: > > Cindy called last evening to confirm my order and take my credit card > information. She said much more than 25 people had already placed orders > and that I should expect my Burgee in about 4 weeks > She said I should thank Joe for his hard work. > Thanks Joe! > --Reuben > Reuben Mezrich > Pelican Cove in Sarasota > Cell: 410-499-8922 > > > On Wed, Mar 10, 2021 at 10:18 AM Joe Dempsey wrote: > >> You can certainly do that, but due to time differential and she's using a >> cell phone not always at her desk, this was the best I could do and have >> some sort of paper trail. >> >> >> >> ----- >> Joe Dempsey >> s/v Respite >> Rhodes 22 1989/2005 >> Deltaville,VA >> -- >> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ >> From snstaum at gmail.com Thu Mar 11 08:39:38 2021 From: snstaum at gmail.com (Stephen Staum) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2021 08:39:38 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] BURGEE ORDERING INSTRUCTIONS In-Reply-To: <1615316576867-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1615316576867-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: Thanks Joe for your good work on our new burgee! Much appreciated. *Thanks and Stay Well,* *Stephen Staum* *s/v Carol Lee 2* *Needham, MA* On Tue, Mar 9, 2021 at 2:03 PM Joe Dempsey wrote: > Okay, Rhodies, here?s the deal: > You?re saying to yourself ?I already ordered!? NO, you committed to order! > That gave me a number to give to fabricators in order to get the best > price. > I originally estimated between $30 and $35 plus shipping. The Burgee > Shoppe > gave us the best price and the only vendor that would allow individual > ordering. It is the same company that makes burgees for the Marine Trawlers > Association. The price is $29.95 INCLUDING shipping within the U.S.! There > is an additional $7.00 charge for shipments to Canada. HOWEVER, it requires > us all to get our orders in right away so they can ?pool? the orders to get > required minimum production. All is ready for you to place your orders. It > will be a somewhat clumsy process, since the owner of the business recently > passed away, and his wife, Cindy is running the show. Although, not ideal > from my standpoint, it?s the best we could come up with. From my > conversations with her, she is genuinely nice and easy to work with. > Although they have a shopping cart system on their website for inventoried > products, there is no shopping cart style on-line ordering for custom > items. > [REFER TO THE INSTRUCTIONS BELOW TO PLACE YOUR ORDERS] Hopefully, once we > are established with the initial order, they will be able to add a tab for > ?Rhodes 22 Burgees?. Normally, an organization would place the minimum > order > with a deposit and have it paid for so individuals ?members? could order > directly. Cindy is going to let us pool our orders and they won?t start > production until those orders reach 25. The good news, is that you guys > have committed to 48 and counting! > Until she can get IT help to set up a R22 Cart for on-line ordering, we?ll > have to order via email or phone. If you order by email, PLEASE cc me: > joedempsey at hughes.net so I can monitor the ordering until we?ve got the > pool > amount. > Specifications: The burgee will be made from high quality 400 denier nylon > pack cloth, UV treated on both sides; and stitched with extra strong UV > resistant thread also treated for mildew resistance. The burgee pattern is > sewn on both sides concurrently with the same stitch, called appliqu? and > provides the best marine burgee. The two brass star grommets along the > polypropylene heading are special design for burgee applications. Burgees > are designed to withstand a marine environment and are by far the highest > quality burgees available. > Pricing: $29.95 including free shipping only to United States. Add $7.00 > for Canada. No Europe delivery. > Delivery will in 3-4 weeks via US Mail. > Ordering Instructions: > > TYPE THE FOLLOWING: > > Please send ____ 15? X 18? RHODES 22 Burgee(s) at $29.95 to: > NAME, SHIPPING ADDRESS > Your phone number (for Cindy to call for your payment information) > > Email above to Herb at Halling.com or a secondary email > Cindy.Halling1 at gmail.com. > PLEASE cc: "herroberst at hughes.net" > Expect a return call from Cindy Halling : (562) 252-6005. > > NOTE: Your card statement will show the billing as OPB Entertainment. > > < > http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/file/t752/Rhodes_22_Burgee_Triangle.jpg> > > > > > > ----- > Joe Dempsey > s/v Respite > Rhodes 22 1989/2005 > Deltaville,VA > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > From sea20 at verizon.net Thu Mar 11 09:52:37 2021 From: sea20 at verizon.net (Scott Andrews) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2021 09:52:37 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] BURGEE ORDERING INSTRUCTIONS In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <0FC2BB84-FA75-4952-984B-0CE7F760E60D@verizon.net> Many thanks Joe! Scott&Rebecca Sent from my iPhone > On Mar 11, 2021, at 8:39 AM, Stephen Staum wrote: > > ?Thanks Joe for your good work on our new burgee! > Much appreciated. > > > *Thanks and Stay Well,* > > *Stephen Staum* > *s/v Carol Lee 2* > > *Needham, MA* > > >> On Tue, Mar 9, 2021 at 2:03 PM Joe Dempsey wrote: >> >> Okay, Rhodies, here?s the deal: >> You?re saying to yourself ?I already ordered!? NO, you committed to order! >> That gave me a number to give to fabricators in order to get the best >> price. >> I originally estimated between $30 and $35 plus shipping. The Burgee >> Shoppe >> gave us the best price and the only vendor that would allow individual >> ordering. It is the same company that makes burgees for the Marine Trawlers >> Association. The price is $29.95 INCLUDING shipping within the U.S.! There >> is an additional $7.00 charge for shipments to Canada. HOWEVER, it requires >> us all to get our orders in right away so they can ?pool? the orders to get >> required minimum production. All is ready for you to place your orders. It >> will be a somewhat clumsy process, since the owner of the business recently >> passed away, and his wife, Cindy is running the show. Although, not ideal >> from my standpoint, it?s the best we could come up with. From my >> conversations with her, she is genuinely nice and easy to work with. >> Although they have a shopping cart system on their website for inventoried >> products, there is no shopping cart style on-line ordering for custom >> items. >> [REFER TO THE INSTRUCTIONS BELOW TO PLACE YOUR ORDERS] Hopefully, once we >> are established with the initial order, they will be able to add a tab for >> ?Rhodes 22 Burgees?. Normally, an organization would place the minimum >> order >> with a deposit and have it paid for so individuals ?members? could order >> directly. Cindy is going to let us pool our orders and they won?t start >> production until those orders reach 25. The good news, is that you guys >> have committed to 48 and counting! >> Until she can get IT help to set up a R22 Cart for on-line ordering, we?ll >> have to order via email or phone. If you order by email, PLEASE cc me: >> joedempsey at hughes.net so I can monitor the ordering until we?ve got the >> pool >> amount. >> Specifications: The burgee will be made from high quality 400 denier nylon >> pack cloth, UV treated on both sides; and stitched with extra strong UV >> resistant thread also treated for mildew resistance. The burgee pattern is >> sewn on both sides concurrently with the same stitch, called appliqu? and >> provides the best marine burgee. The two brass star grommets along the >> polypropylene heading are special design for burgee applications. Burgees >> are designed to withstand a marine environment and are by far the highest >> quality burgees available. >> Pricing: $29.95 including free shipping only to United States. Add $7.00 >> for Canada. No Europe delivery. >> Delivery will in 3-4 weeks via US Mail. >> Ordering Instructions: >> >> TYPE THE FOLLOWING: >> >> Please send ____ 15? X 18? RHODES 22 Burgee(s) at $29.95 to: >> NAME, SHIPPING ADDRESS >> Your phone number (for Cindy to call for your payment information) >> >> Email above to Herb at Halling.com or a secondary email >> Cindy.Halling1 at gmail.com. >> PLEASE cc: "herroberst at hughes.net" >> Expect a return call from Cindy Halling : (562) 252-6005. >> >> NOTE: Your card statement will show the billing as OPB Entertainment. >> >> < >> http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/file/t752/Rhodes_22_Burgee_Triangle.jpg> >> >> >> >> >> >> ----- >> Joe Dempsey >> s/v Respite >> Rhodes 22 1989/2005 >> Deltaville,VA >> -- >> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ >> From rlowe at vt.edu Thu Mar 11 11:09:19 2021 From: rlowe at vt.edu (Lowe, Rob) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2021 16:09:19 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Free Rhodes In-Reply-To: References: <64203802.1054380.1615405730218@mail.yahoo.com>, Message-ID: Yuck! Graham, You ready for another project boat ? - rob ________________________________ From: Rhodes22-list on behalf of Larry Gioia via Rhodes22-list Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 2021 5:10 PM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Free Rhodes Interesting project! Says the guy with no time nor a place to store it. Larry > On Mar 10, 2021, at 2:49 PM, Cynthia Lang via Rhodes22-list wrote: > > ?https://jerseyshore.craigslist.org/boa/d/manahawkin-22-rhodes-continental-free/7270200444.html > It is not mine, but I thought I would share listing. From gstewart8 at cogeco.ca Thu Mar 11 11:21:15 2021 From: gstewart8 at cogeco.ca (Graham Stewart) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2021 11:21:15 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Free Rhodes In-Reply-To: References: <64203802.1054380.1615405730218@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <002601d71692$91194e30$b34bea90$@ca> Rob, Yes. It is an incurable condition even knowing my wife would cut me off for good. Graham Stewart Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 Kingston Ontario -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf Of Lowe, Rob Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2021 11:09 AM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List; Larry Gioia Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Free Rhodes Yuck! Graham, You ready for another project boat ? - rob ________________________________ From: Rhodes22-list on behalf of Larry Gioia via Rhodes22-list Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 2021 5:10 PM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Free Rhodes Interesting project! Says the guy with no time nor a place to store it. Larry > On Mar 10, 2021, at 2:49 PM, Cynthia Lang via Rhodes22-list wrote: > > ?https://jerseyshore.craigslist.org/boa/d/manahawkin-22-rhodes-continental-free/7270200444.html > It is not mine, but I thought I would share listing. From rlowe at vt.edu Thu Mar 11 11:32:56 2021 From: rlowe at vt.edu (Lowe, Rob) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2021 16:32:56 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Free Rhodes In-Reply-To: <002601d71692$91194e30$b34bea90$@ca> References: <64203802.1054380.1615405730218@mail.yahoo.com> , <002601d71692$91194e30$b34bea90$@ca> Message-ID: Graham, So, you are saying the boat is probably salvageable, but your marriage would not be. Understood! - rob ________________________________ From: Rhodes22-list on behalf of Graham Stewart Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2021 11:21 AM To: 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Free Rhodes Rob, Yes. It is an incurable condition even knowing my wife would cut me off for good. Graham Stewart Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 Kingston Ontario -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf Of Lowe, Rob Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2021 11:09 AM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List; Larry Gioia Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Free Rhodes Yuck! Graham, You ready for another project boat ? - rob ________________________________ From: Rhodes22-list on behalf of Larry Gioia via Rhodes22-list Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 2021 5:10 PM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Free Rhodes Interesting project! Says the guy with no time nor a place to store it. Larry > On Mar 10, 2021, at 2:49 PM, Cynthia Lang via Rhodes22-list wrote: > > ?https://jerseyshore.craigslist.org/boa/d/manahawkin-22-rhodes-continental-free/7270200444.html > It is not mine, but I thought I would share listing. From gstewart8 at cogeco.ca Thu Mar 11 11:45:20 2021 From: gstewart8 at cogeco.ca (Graham Stewart) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2021 11:45:20 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Free Rhodes In-Reply-To: References: <64203802.1054380.1615405730218@mail.yahoo.com> <002601d71692$91194e30$b34bea90$@ca> Message-ID: <003001d71695$edc5f270$c951d750$@ca> I am only saying the boats are very forgiving. Graham Stewart gstewart8 at cogeco.ca -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf Of Lowe, Rob Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2021 11:33 AM To: 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Free Rhodes Graham, So, you are saying the boat is probably salvageable, but your marriage would not be. Understood! - rob ________________________________ From: Rhodes22-list on behalf of Graham Stewart Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2021 11:21 AM To: 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Free Rhodes Rob, Yes. It is an incurable condition even knowing my wife would cut me off for good. Graham Stewart Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 Kingston Ontario -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf Of Lowe, Rob Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2021 11:09 AM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List; Larry Gioia Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Free Rhodes Yuck! Graham, You ready for another project boat ? - rob ________________________________ From: Rhodes22-list on behalf of Larry Gioia via Rhodes22-list Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 2021 5:10 PM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Free Rhodes Interesting project! Says the guy with no time nor a place to store it. Larry > On Mar 10, 2021, at 2:49 PM, Cynthia Lang via Rhodes22-list wrote: > > ?https://jerseyshore.craigslist.org/boa/d/manahawkin-22-rhodes-continental-free/7270200444.html > It is not mine, but I thought I would share listing. From spreadgoodnews at gmail.com Thu Mar 11 11:45:52 2021 From: spreadgoodnews at gmail.com (Goodness) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2021 11:45:52 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] mooring In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I tie my bow eye to the mooring with a large stainless marine caribiner. I feel it is less likely to saw through with wave action like chocks can. I take a dinghy out to my mooring though and use it to clip on to the eye because i cant reach it easily from the deck. So as i return to the mooring i pick up the painter with a boat hook and tie it to the deck bow cleat. Then put everything away and do the switch as i am leaving in the dinghy. I have used the dingy painter to tie to both mooring and boat if the wind was up while doing the switch. Mooring is a #150 mushroom jetted 5? deep into the sand with a #60 section of 6? ship chain attached to the 25? galvanized mooring chain attached to the White/blue stripe mooring ball. My painter is 25? 3/4 inch nylon anchor rope with a small float and a 10? floating poly line for pickup. I do have a good bit of swing but its an empty mooring field that ranges from 8-12? deep. Bob (Palatka) > On Mar 10, 2021, at 4:09 PM, Rick Lange wrote: > > ?Scott, > > Your forward crew can do the same on an R22. > > Regards, > > Rick Lange > > >> On Tue, Mar 9, 2021 at 4:50 PM Scott Andrews via Rhodes22-list < >> rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org> wrote: >> >> Thanks everyone, I get it now. I was thinking of my experience with >> smaller boats, thistles & flying Scots when forward crew could clip on the >> ball. >> Scott >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >>>> On Mar 9, 2021, at 1:49 PM, ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: >>> >>> ? >>> Scott, >>> >>> Assuming you are using Peter?s below attached definitions for bow eye >> and bow cleat, the only reason you would want to tie off to the bow eye vs >> the bow cleat would be if you are anchoring on short scope or if the anchor >> is set into a poor holding bottom. Tying off to the bow eye reduces the >> vertical distance from the tie off point to the anchor. Remember, the >> vertical distance is the water depth + height of the tie off point above >> the water. An example may make this more clear. My bow eye is about 1.5 >> ft above the water and my bow cleats are about 3.0 ft above the water. >> Suppose we are anchoring in 7 ft of water using 60 ft of anchor rode. >> Tying off to the bow eye would yield a scope ratio of [60 ft] / [7 ft + 1.5 >> ft] = 60 / 8.5 = 7.1 . Tying off to the bow cleat would yield a scope >> ratio of >>> [60 ft] / [7 ft + 3.0 ft] = 60 / 10 = 6.0 . A scope ratio of 7.1 would >> probably be OK for anchoring overnight. A scope ratio of 6.0 would be >> iffy. So, if you are trying to anchor in a situation where there is >> limited room to swing &/or a poor holding bottom; then, consider using the >> bow eye vs the bow cleat to slightly improve your scope ratio. Of course, >> using the bow eye is much more trouble vs using the bow cleat. A typical >> mooring has a huge deeply set anchor that is unlikely to drag and so there >> is usually no reason to use the bow eye vs the bow cleat on a mooring. >>> >>> Having said that, I used my bow eye and stern eye at my slip very time I >> docked at my home slip. But, I was in a situation where I parked sideways >> to a wharf and the boat was exposed to wave action from the side. Rather >> than depend upon fenders to absorb the wave action and keep the hull off >> the dock, I had a pair of mooring whips. Mooring whips look like HD >> fishing poles attached to the dock. I had my mooring whips setup to attach >> to the bow eye and stern eye using quick release carabiners. They held the >> boat about 2 ft off the dock. Of course all that gear was swept away along >> with my dock during the May 19, 2020 dam failure and flood! >>> >>> Roger Pihlaja >>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>> >>> Sent from Mail for Windows 10 >>> >>> From: Peter Nyberg >>> Sent: Tuesday, March 9, 2021 11:00 AM >>> To: sea20 at verizon.net; The Rhodes 22 Email List >>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] mooring >>> >>> Scott, >>> >>> I?m not sure what you?re asking, and it may be a terminology issue. Is >> it possible that when you say ?bow eye? you mean ?bow cleat?? The bow >> cleat would be attached to the deck, where as the bow eye is attached to >> the stem of the hull. You could in theory attach your mooring to the bow >> eye, but I can?t see why you would want a second one. >>> >>> Adding one or two more cleats at the bow is a pretty common project. You >> would want it through-bolted, and you would want to avoid any possibility >> of water finding it?s way into the deck core. I?d recommend a >> drill-fill-drill approach. If you don?t know what that is, I can >> elaborate. >>> >>> ?Peter >>> >>>> On Mar 9, 2021, at 8:44 AM, Scott E Andrews via Rhodes22-list < >> rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org> wrote: >>>> >>>> Greetings all, I will likely be on a waiting list for a slip next >> season and will be on a mooring. I have a couple questions regarding >> painter and pendant attachment. I read MJM"s email regarding use of the bow >> eye with chocks. Is the any reason not to add a second bow eye? Also, is >> there a recomended pendant or painter length? Thanks everyone. >>>> Scott AndrewsFirst year owner, Wilmington De >>> >>> >> From mweisner at ebsmed.com Thu Mar 11 11:47:38 2021 From: mweisner at ebsmed.com (Michael D. Weisner) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2021 11:47:38 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Free Rhodes In-Reply-To: <003001d71695$edc5f270$c951d750$@ca> References: <64203802.1054380.1615405730218@mail.yahoo.com> <002601d71692$91194e30$b34bea90$@ca> <003001d71695$edc5f270$c951d750$@ca> Message-ID: <01ad01d71696$3fda1000$bf8e3000$@ebsmed.com> Yes, that's true about many boats. On the other hand, if you left your spouse out in the elements for several years, well, .... Mike s/v Wind Lass ('91) Nissequogue River, NY -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of Graham Stewart Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2021 11:45 AM To: 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Free Rhodes I am only saying the boats are very forgiving. Graham Stewart gstewart8 at cogeco.ca -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf Of Lowe, Rob Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2021 11:33 AM To: 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Free Rhodes Graham, So, you are saying the boat is probably salvageable, but your marriage would not be. Understood! - rob ________________________________ From: Rhodes22-list on behalf of Graham Stewart Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2021 11:21 AM To: 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Free Rhodes Rob, Yes. It is an incurable condition even knowing my wife would cut me off for good. Graham Stewart Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 Kingston Ontario -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf Of Lowe, Rob Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2021 11:09 AM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List; Larry Gioia Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Free Rhodes Yuck! Graham, You ready for another project boat ? - rob ________________________________ From: Rhodes22-list on behalf of Larry Gioia via Rhodes22-list Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 2021 5:10 PM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Free Rhodes Interesting project! Says the guy with no time nor a place to store it. Larry > On Mar 10, 2021, at 2:49 PM, Cynthia Lang via Rhodes22-list wrote: > > ?https://jerseyshore.craigslist.org/boa/d/manahawkin-22-rhodes-contine > ntal-free/7270200444.html It is not mine, but I thought I would share > listing. From spreadgoodnews at gmail.com Thu Mar 11 11:54:50 2021 From: spreadgoodnews at gmail.com (Goodness) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2021 11:54:50 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Free Rhodes In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4A4521C8-0EC9-445F-A8DF-E0E25F05170A@gmail.com> I have two project Rhodes here in florida. One with the ?certificate of cool to order stuff from stan? > On Mar 10, 2021, at 5:10 PM, Larry Gioia via Rhodes22-list wrote: > > ?Interesting project! Says the guy with no time nor a place to store it. > > > Larry > >> On Mar 10, 2021, at 2:49 PM, Cynthia Lang via Rhodes22-list wrote: >> >> ?https://jerseyshore.craigslist.org/boa/d/manahawkin-22-rhodes-continental-free/7270200444.html >> It is not mine, but I thought I would share listing. > From tavares0947 at gmail.com Thu Mar 11 11:56:06 2021 From: tavares0947 at gmail.com (Todd Tavares) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2021 11:56:06 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Free Rhodes In-Reply-To: <01ad01d71696$3fda1000$bf8e3000$@ebsmed.com> References: <64203802.1054380.1615405730218@mail.yahoo.com> <002601d71692$91194e30$b34bea90$@ca> <003001d71695$edc5f270$c951d750$@ca> <01ad01d71696$3fda1000$bf8e3000$@ebsmed.com> Message-ID: MJM once gave great advice; that project boats like this one aren't usually worth the time money or effort. He was right and I have a shed and garage full of rudders, centerboards, laz hatches, poptops and sliders etc to prove it. BUT the outboard is certainly worth the selling price.... Todd T. tavares0947 at gmail.com On Thu, Mar 11, 2021, 11:47 AM Michael D. Weisner wrote: > Yes, that's true about many boats. > > On the other hand, if you left your spouse out in the elements for several > years, well, .... > > Mike > s/v Wind Lass ('91) > Nissequogue River, NY > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of > Graham Stewart > Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2021 11:45 AM > To: 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Free Rhodes > > I am only saying the boats are very forgiving. > > Graham Stewart > gstewart8 at cogeco.ca > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf > Of Lowe, Rob > Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2021 11:33 AM > To: 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Free Rhodes > > Graham, > So, you are saying the boat is probably salvageable, but your marriage > would not be. Understood! - rob > > ________________________________ > From: Rhodes22-list on behalf of > Graham Stewart > Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2021 11:21 AM > To: 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Free Rhodes > > Rob, > > Yes. It is an incurable condition even knowing my wife would cut me off > for good. > > Graham Stewart > Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 > Kingston Ontario > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf > Of Lowe, Rob > Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2021 11:09 AM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List; Larry Gioia > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Free Rhodes > > Yuck! > > Graham, > You ready for another project boat ? - rob > > > ________________________________ > From: Rhodes22-list on behalf of > Larry Gioia via Rhodes22-list > Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 2021 5:10 PM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Free Rhodes > > Interesting project! Says the guy with no time nor a place to store it. > > > Larry > > > On Mar 10, 2021, at 2:49 PM, Cynthia Lang via Rhodes22-list < > rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org> wrote: > > > > ?https://jerseyshore.craigslist.org/boa/d/manahawkin-22-rhodes-contine > > ntal-free/7270200444.html It is not mine, but I thought I would share > > listing. > > > > From mark at whipplefamily.com Thu Mar 11 12:08:35 2021 From: mark at whipplefamily.com (Mark Whipple) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2021 12:08:35 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Free Rhodes In-Reply-To: References: <64203802.1054380.1615405730218@mail.yahoo.com> <002601d71692$91194e30$b34bea90$@ca> <003001d71695$edc5f270$c951d750$@ca> <01ad01d71696$3fda1000$bf8e3000$@ebsmed.com> Message-ID: Todd, I'd summarize that by saying that there is no such thing as a free boat. Mark Whipple Boston, MA On Thu, Mar 11, 2021 at 11:56 AM Todd Tavares wrote: > MJM once gave great advice; that project boats like this one aren't usually > worth the time money or effort. He was right and I have a shed and garage > full of rudders, centerboards, laz hatches, poptops and sliders etc to > prove it. > BUT the outboard is certainly worth the selling price.... > > Todd T. > > tavares0947 at gmail.com > > On Thu, Mar 11, 2021, 11:47 AM Michael D. Weisner > wrote: > > > Yes, that's true about many boats. > > > > On the other hand, if you left your spouse out in the elements for > several > > years, well, .... > > > > Mike > > s/v Wind Lass ('91) > > Nissequogue River, NY > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of > > Graham Stewart > > Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2021 11:45 AM > > To: 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' > > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Free Rhodes > > > > I am only saying the boats are very forgiving. > > > > Graham Stewart > > gstewart8 at cogeco.ca > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On > Behalf > > Of Lowe, Rob > > Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2021 11:33 AM > > To: 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' > > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Free Rhodes > > > > Graham, > > So, you are saying the boat is probably salvageable, but your marriage > > would not be. Understood! - rob > > > > ________________________________ > > From: Rhodes22-list on behalf of > > Graham Stewart > > Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2021 11:21 AM > > To: 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' > > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Free Rhodes > > > > Rob, > > > > Yes. It is an incurable condition even knowing my wife would cut me off > > for good. > > > > Graham Stewart > > Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 > > Kingston Ontario > > > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On > Behalf > > Of Lowe, Rob > > Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2021 11:09 AM > > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List; Larry Gioia > > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Free Rhodes > > > > Yuck! > > > > Graham, > > You ready for another project boat ? - rob > > > > > > ________________________________ > > From: Rhodes22-list on behalf of > > Larry Gioia via Rhodes22-list > > Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 2021 5:10 PM > > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Free Rhodes > > > > Interesting project! Says the guy with no time nor a place to store it. > > > > > > Larry > > > > > On Mar 10, 2021, at 2:49 PM, Cynthia Lang via Rhodes22-list < > > rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org> wrote: > > > > > > ?https://jerseyshore.craigslist.org/boa/d/manahawkin-22-rhodes-contine > > > ntal-free/7270200444.html It is not mine, but I thought I would share > > > listing. > > > > > > > > > From mweisner at ebsmed.com Thu Mar 11 12:10:26 2021 From: mweisner at ebsmed.com (Michael D. Weisner) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2021 12:10:26 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] mooring In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <01ae01d71699$6f2322e0$4d6968a0$@ebsmed.com> I have moored my Rhodes boats for over 30 years in the Nissequogue River. Here are a few observations: 1. Use a swivel 10 feet below the float to prevent chain twisted bunching up which will reduce the scope. 2. Use a positive floatation buoy. The teardrop inflatables do not last and fail at inopportune times. 3. Attach the mooring pennant lines to the top of the buoy with a shackle through the thimble. 4. Use 2 mooring pennants, if possible (don't ask, I learned the hard way). 5. Use 12' mooring pennant(s) to accommodate impulse loads (stretch, give). 5. DO NOT USE CARABINERS! While they may be rated for the needed strength, the spring latch is not a safe solution when unattended for long periods. 6. Foam "pool noodles" make excellent and cheap floatation sleeves for the mooring lines when the boat is out. With a little effort, they usually can be slid over the lines without cutting the foam. Mike s/v Wind Lass ('91) Nissequogue River, NY -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of Goodness Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2021 11:46 AM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] mooring I tie my bow eye to the mooring with a large stainless marine caribiner. I feel it is less likely to saw through with wave action like chocks can. I take a dinghy out to my mooring though and use it to clip on to the eye because i cant reach it easily from the deck. So as i return to the mooring i pick up the painter with a boat hook and tie it to the deck bow cleat. Then put everything away and do the switch as i am leaving in the dinghy. I have used the dingy painter to tie to both mooring and boat if the wind was up while doing the switch. Mooring is a #150 mushroom jetted 5? deep into the sand with a #60 section of 6? ship chain attached to the 25? galvanized mooring chain attached to the White/blue stripe mooring ball. My painter is 25? 3/4 inch nylon anchor rope with a small float and a 10? floating poly line for pickup. I do have a good bit of swing but its an empty mooring field that ranges from 8-12? deep. Bob (Palatka) > On Mar 10, 2021, at 4:09 PM, Rick Lange wrote: > > ?Scott, > > Your forward crew can do the same on an R22. > > Regards, > > Rick Lange > > >> On Tue, Mar 9, 2021 at 4:50 PM Scott Andrews via Rhodes22-list < >> rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org> wrote: >> >> Thanks everyone, I get it now. I was thinking of my experience with >> smaller boats, thistles & flying Scots when forward crew could clip >> on the ball. >> Scott >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >>>> On Mar 9, 2021, at 1:49 PM, ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: >>> >>> ? >>> Scott, >>> >>> Assuming you are using Peter?s below attached definitions for bow >>> eye >> and bow cleat, the only reason you would want to tie off to the bow >> eye vs the bow cleat would be if you are anchoring on short scope or >> if the anchor is set into a poor holding bottom. Tying off to the >> bow eye reduces the vertical distance from the tie off point to the >> anchor. Remember, the vertical distance is the water depth + height >> of the tie off point above the water. An example may make this more >> clear. My bow eye is about 1.5 ft above the water and my bow cleats are about 3.0 ft above the water. >> Suppose we are anchoring in 7 ft of water using 60 ft of anchor rode. >> Tying off to the bow eye would yield a scope ratio of [60 ft] / [7 ft >> + 1.5 ft] = 60 / 8.5 = 7.1 . Tying off to the bow cleat would yield >> a scope ratio of >>> [60 ft] / [7 ft + 3.0 ft] = 60 / 10 = 6.0 . A scope ratio of 7.1 >>> would >> probably be OK for anchoring overnight. A scope ratio of 6.0 would >> be iffy. So, if you are trying to anchor in a situation where there >> is limited room to swing &/or a poor holding bottom; then, consider >> using the bow eye vs the bow cleat to slightly improve your scope >> ratio. Of course, using the bow eye is much more trouble vs using >> the bow cleat. A typical mooring has a huge deeply set anchor that >> is unlikely to drag and so there is usually no reason to use the bow eye vs the bow cleat on a mooring. >>> >>> Having said that, I used my bow eye and stern eye at my slip very >>> time I >> docked at my home slip. But, I was in a situation where I parked >> sideways to a wharf and the boat was exposed to wave action from the >> side. Rather than depend upon fenders to absorb the wave action and >> keep the hull off the dock, I had a pair of mooring whips. Mooring >> whips look like HD fishing poles attached to the dock. I had my >> mooring whips setup to attach to the bow eye and stern eye using >> quick release carabiners. They held the boat about 2 ft off the >> dock. Of course all that gear was swept away along with my dock during the May 19, 2020 dam failure and flood! >>> >>> Roger Pihlaja >>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>> >>> Sent from Mail for Windows 10 >>> >>> From: Peter Nyberg >>> Sent: Tuesday, March 9, 2021 11:00 AM >>> To: sea20 at verizon.net; The Rhodes 22 Email List >>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] mooring >>> >>> Scott, >>> >>> I?m not sure what you?re asking, and it may be a terminology issue. >>> Is >> it possible that when you say ?bow eye? you mean ?bow cleat?? The >> bow cleat would be attached to the deck, where as the bow eye is >> attached to the stem of the hull. You could in theory attach your >> mooring to the bow eye, but I can?t see why you would want a second one. >>> >>> Adding one or two more cleats at the bow is a pretty common project. >>> You >> would want it through-bolted, and you would want to avoid any >> possibility of water finding it?s way into the deck core. I?d >> recommend a drill-fill-drill approach. If you don?t know what that >> is, I can elaborate. >>> >>> ?Peter >>> >>>> On Mar 9, 2021, at 8:44 AM, Scott E Andrews via Rhodes22-list < >> rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org> wrote: >>>> >>>> Greetings all, I will likely be on a waiting list for a slip next >> season and will be on a mooring. I have a couple questions regarding >> painter and pendant attachment. I read MJM"s email regarding use of >> the bow eye with chocks. Is the any reason not to add a second bow >> eye? Also, is there a recomended pendant or painter length? Thanks everyone. >>>> Scott AndrewsFirst year owner, Wilmington De >>> >>> >> From joedempsey at hughes.net Thu Mar 11 12:58:22 2021 From: joedempsey at hughes.net (Joe Dempsey) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2021 10:58:22 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] BURGEE ORDERING INSTRUCTIONS In-Reply-To: <0FC2BB84-FA75-4952-984B-0CE7F760E60D@verizon.net> References: <1615316576867-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <0FC2BB84-FA75-4952-984B-0CE7F760E60D@verizon.net> Message-ID: <1615485502448-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Thanks to all for the nice words. It seems like the ordering is going well. By my count we've got 23 ordered but this does not include those who have ordered by phone. It's fine to do so, but if you haven't ordered yet, which I hope all Rhodies will, if you order by phone, Cindy is most likely going to have to call you back because she may be driving on the LA Freeway! Which ever is easier for you, just get your orders in and let's get Rhodes 22 seen around the world. By the way, this is probably mostly applicable to Chris, hopefully you've got a US address. Cindy told me that International (other than Canada) mail is running 2 months. When you talk to her, you'll have to get a cost estimate. Again, thanks for the kind words, but it's a great group of guys and ladies (can I say that?) and a great boat! ----- Joe Dempsey s/v Respite Rhodes 22 1989/2005 Deltaville,VA -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From joedempsey at hughes.net Thu Mar 11 13:02:28 2021 From: joedempsey at hughes.net (Joe Dempsey) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2021 11:02:28 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Website News In-Reply-To: References: <016801d715c9$9cfa2d10$d6ee8730$@ebsmed.com> Message-ID: <1615485748685-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Done! ----- Joe Dempsey s/v Respite Rhodes 22 1989/2005 Deltaville,VA -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From ric at stottarchitecture.com Thu Mar 11 13:11:13 2021 From: ric at stottarchitecture.com (Richard Stott) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2021 13:11:13 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] BURGEE ORDERING INSTRUCTIONS In-Reply-To: <1615485502448-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1615316576867-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <0FC2BB84-FA75-4952-984B-0CE7F760E60D@verizon.net> <1615485502448-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <63F50587-2048-46C6-8F06-F603F1D8BFDD@stottarchitecture.com> I think I ordered 2 - by phone, but I think I also let you know. I just can?t keep track - to much going on at once. Ric Richard Stott, AIA, LEED AP www.stottarchitecture.com Office 631-283-1777 Cell 516-965-3164 > On Mar 11, 2021, at 12:58 PM, Joe Dempsey wrote: > > Thanks to all for the nice words. It seems like the ordering is going well. > By my count we've got 23 ordered but this does not include those who have > ordered by phone. It's fine to do so, but if you haven't ordered yet, which > I hope all Rhodies will, if you order by phone, Cindy is most likely going > to have to call you back because she may be driving on the LA Freeway! Which > ever is easier for you, just get your orders in and let's get Rhodes 22 seen > around the world. By the way, this is probably mostly applicable to Chris, > hopefully you've got a US address. Cindy told me that International (other > than Canada) mail is running 2 months. When you talk to her, you'll have to > get a cost estimate. Again, thanks for the kind words, but it's a great > group of guys and ladies (can I say that?) and a great boat! > > > > ----- > Joe Dempsey > s/v Respite > Rhodes 22 1989/2005 > Deltaville,VA > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From gstewart8 at cogeco.ca Thu Mar 11 13:35:31 2021 From: gstewart8 at cogeco.ca (Graham Stewart) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2021 13:35:31 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Free Rhodes In-Reply-To: References: <64203802.1054380.1615405730218@mail.yahoo.com> <002601d71692$91194e30$b34bea90$@ca> <003001d71695$edc5f270$c951d750$@ca> <01ad01d71696$3fda1000$bf8e3000$@ebsmed.com> Message-ID: <004001d716a5$52653ba0$f72fb2e0$@ca> A project boat is more like an addiction than an investment. Of the two, feeding the addiction is much more satisfying. Graham Stewart Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 Kingston Ontario -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf Of Mark Whipple Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2021 12:09 PM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Free Rhodes Todd, I'd summarize that by saying that there is no such thing as a free boat. Mark Whipple Boston, MA On Thu, Mar 11, 2021 at 11:56 AM Todd Tavares wrote: > MJM once gave great advice; that project boats like this one aren't usually > worth the time money or effort. He was right and I have a shed and garage > full of rudders, centerboards, laz hatches, poptops and sliders etc to > prove it. > BUT the outboard is certainly worth the selling price.... > > Todd T. > > tavares0947 at gmail.com > > On Thu, Mar 11, 2021, 11:47 AM Michael D. Weisner > wrote: > > > Yes, that's true about many boats. > > > > On the other hand, if you left your spouse out in the elements for > several > > years, well, .... > > > > Mike > > s/v Wind Lass ('91) > > Nissequogue River, NY > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of > > Graham Stewart > > Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2021 11:45 AM > > To: 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' > > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Free Rhodes > > > > I am only saying the boats are very forgiving. > > > > Graham Stewart > > gstewart8 at cogeco.ca > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On > Behalf > > Of Lowe, Rob > > Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2021 11:33 AM > > To: 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' > > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Free Rhodes > > > > Graham, > > So, you are saying the boat is probably salvageable, but your marriage > > would not be. Understood! - rob > > > > ________________________________ > > From: Rhodes22-list on behalf of > > Graham Stewart > > Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2021 11:21 AM > > To: 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' > > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Free Rhodes > > > > Rob, > > > > Yes. It is an incurable condition even knowing my wife would cut me off > > for good. > > > > Graham Stewart > > Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 > > Kingston Ontario > > > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On > Behalf > > Of Lowe, Rob > > Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2021 11:09 AM > > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List; Larry Gioia > > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Free Rhodes > > > > Yuck! > > > > Graham, > > You ready for another project boat ? - rob > > > > > > ________________________________ > > From: Rhodes22-list on behalf of > > Larry Gioia via Rhodes22-list > > Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 2021 5:10 PM > > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Free Rhodes > > > > Interesting project! Says the guy with no time nor a place to store it. > > > > > > Larry > > > > > On Mar 10, 2021, at 2:49 PM, Cynthia Lang via Rhodes22-list < > > rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org> wrote: > > > > > > ?https://jerseyshore.craigslist.org/boa/d/manahawkin-22-rhodes-contine > > > ntal-free/7270200444.html It is not mine, but I thought I would share > > > listing. > > > > > > > > > From ric at stottarchitecture.com Thu Mar 11 13:48:36 2021 From: ric at stottarchitecture.com (Ric Stott) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2021 13:48:36 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Free Rhodes In-Reply-To: <004001d716a5$52653ba0$f72fb2e0$@ca> References: <64203802.1054380.1615405730218@mail.yahoo.com> <002601d71692$91194e30$b34bea90$@ca> <003001d71695$edc5f270$c951d750$@ca> <01ad01d71696$3fda1000$bf8e3000$@ebsmed.com> <004001d716a5$52653ba0$f72fb2e0$@ca> Message-ID: If anyone wants that ?jersey project?, I have a free Mast (Continental) for picking it up. It?s missing one spreader, but has all upper and lower shrouds (I think) + fore and back stays. Ric Sv Dadventure Hampton Bays, NY Richard Stott, AIA, LEED AP www.stottarchitecture.com Office 631-283-1777 Cell 516-965-3164 > On Mar 11, 2021, at 1:35 PM, Graham Stewart wrote: > > A project boat is more like an addiction than an investment. Of the two, feeding the addiction is much more satisfying. > > Graham Stewart > Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 > Kingston Ontario > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf Of Mark Whipple > Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2021 12:09 PM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Free Rhodes > > Todd, > > I'd summarize that by saying that there is no such thing as a free boat. > > Mark Whipple > Boston, MA > > On Thu, Mar 11, 2021 at 11:56 AM Todd Tavares wrote: > >> MJM once gave great advice; that project boats like this one aren't usually >> worth the time money or effort. He was right and I have a shed and garage >> full of rudders, centerboards, laz hatches, poptops and sliders etc to >> prove it. >> BUT the outboard is certainly worth the selling price.... >> >> Todd T. >> >> tavares0947 at gmail.com >> >> On Thu, Mar 11, 2021, 11:47 AM Michael D. Weisner >> wrote: >> >>> Yes, that's true about many boats. >>> >>> On the other hand, if you left your spouse out in the elements for >> several >>> years, well, .... >>> >>> Mike >>> s/v Wind Lass ('91) >>> Nissequogue River, NY >>> >>> >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of >>> Graham Stewart >>> Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2021 11:45 AM >>> To: 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' >>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Free Rhodes >>> >>> I am only saying the boats are very forgiving. >>> >>> Graham Stewart >>> gstewart8 at cogeco.ca >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On >> Behalf >>> Of Lowe, Rob >>> Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2021 11:33 AM >>> To: 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' >>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Free Rhodes >>> >>> Graham, >>> So, you are saying the boat is probably salvageable, but your marriage >>> would not be. Understood! - rob >>> >>> ________________________________ >>> From: Rhodes22-list on behalf of >>> Graham Stewart >>> Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2021 11:21 AM >>> To: 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' >>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Free Rhodes >>> >>> Rob, >>> >>> Yes. It is an incurable condition even knowing my wife would cut me off >>> for good. >>> >>> Graham Stewart >>> Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 >>> Kingston Ontario >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On >> Behalf >>> Of Lowe, Rob >>> Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2021 11:09 AM >>> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List; Larry Gioia >>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Free Rhodes >>> >>> Yuck! >>> >>> Graham, >>> You ready for another project boat ? - rob >>> >>> >>> ________________________________ >>> From: Rhodes22-list on behalf of >>> Larry Gioia via Rhodes22-list >>> Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 2021 5:10 PM >>> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List >>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Free Rhodes >>> >>> Interesting project! Says the guy with no time nor a place to store it. >>> >>> >>> Larry >>> >>>> On Mar 10, 2021, at 2:49 PM, Cynthia Lang via Rhodes22-list < >>> rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org> wrote: >>>> >>>> ?https://jerseyshore.craigslist.org/boa/d/manahawkin-22-rhodes-contine >>>> ntal-free/7270200444.html It is not mine, but I thought I would share >>>> listing. >>> >>> >>> >>> >> > From sea20 at verizon.net Thu Mar 11 14:33:05 2021 From: sea20 at verizon.net (Scott Andrews) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2021 14:33:05 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] mooring In-Reply-To: <01ae01d71699$6f2322e0$4d6968a0$@ebsmed.com> References: <01ae01d71699$6f2322e0$4d6968a0$@ebsmed.com> Message-ID: <420A66CD-2CC4-456D-A8EA-B3ACD1A27B42@verizon.net> Mike, your technique sounds very similar to what I did with the Flying Scots. Particularly the use of two pendants as we had loose boats with only one. Do yours both attach to the same bow eye? Scott 86? Rhodes 22 Wilmington De. Sent from my iPhone > On Mar 11, 2021, at 12:10 PM, Michael D. Weisner wrote: > > ?I have moored my Rhodes boats for over 30 years in the Nissequogue River. > > Here are a few observations: > 1. Use a swivel 10 feet below the float to prevent chain twisted bunching up which will reduce the scope. > 2. Use a positive floatation buoy. The teardrop inflatables do not last and fail at inopportune times. > 3. Attach the mooring pennant lines to the top of the buoy with a shackle through the thimble. > 4. Use 2 mooring pennants, if possible (don't ask, I learned the hard way). > 5. Use 12' mooring pennant(s) to accommodate impulse loads (stretch, give). > 5. DO NOT USE CARABINERS! > While they may be rated for the needed strength, > the spring latch is not a safe solution when unattended for long periods. > 6. Foam "pool noodles" make excellent and cheap floatation sleeves for > the mooring lines when the boat is out. With a little effort, they usually > can be slid over the lines without cutting the foam. > > Mike > s/v Wind Lass ('91) > Nissequogue River, NY > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of Goodness > Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2021 11:46 AM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] mooring > > I tie my bow eye to the mooring with a large stainless marine caribiner. I feel it is less likely to saw through with wave action like chocks can. I take a dinghy out to my mooring though and use it to clip on to the eye because i cant reach it easily from the deck. > So as i return to the mooring i pick up the painter with a boat hook and tie it to the deck bow cleat. Then put everything away and do the switch as i am leaving in the dinghy. I have used the dingy painter to tie to both mooring and boat if the wind was up while doing the switch. > > Mooring is a #150 mushroom jetted 5? deep into the sand with a #60 section of 6? ship chain attached to the 25? galvanized mooring chain attached to the White/blue stripe mooring ball. My painter is 25? 3/4 inch nylon anchor rope with a small float and a 10? floating poly line for pickup. I do have a good bit of swing but its an empty mooring field that ranges from 8-12? deep. > > Bob (Palatka) > >> On Mar 10, 2021, at 4:09 PM, Rick Lange wrote: >> >> ?Scott, >> >> Your forward crew can do the same on an R22. >> >> Regards, >> >> Rick Lange >> >> >>> On Tue, Mar 9, 2021 at 4:50 PM Scott Andrews via Rhodes22-list < >>> rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org> wrote: >>> >>> Thanks everyone, I get it now. I was thinking of my experience with >>> smaller boats, thistles & flying Scots when forward crew could clip >>> on the ball. >>> Scott >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>>>>> On Mar 9, 2021, at 1:49 PM, ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: >>>>> >>>>> ? >>>>> Scott, >>>>> >>>>> Assuming you are using Peter?s below attached definitions for bow >>>>> eye >>> and bow cleat, the only reason you would want to tie off to the bow >>> eye vs the bow cleat would be if you are anchoring on short scope or >>> if the anchor is set into a poor holding bottom. Tying off to the >>> bow eye reduces the vertical distance from the tie off point to the >>> anchor. Remember, the vertical distance is the water depth + height >>> of the tie off point above the water. An example may make this more >>> clear. My bow eye is about 1.5 ft above the water and my bow cleats are about 3.0 ft above the water. >>> Suppose we are anchoring in 7 ft of water using 60 ft of anchor rode. >>> Tying off to the bow eye would yield a scope ratio of [60 ft] / [7 ft >>> + 1.5 ft] = 60 / 8.5 = 7.1 . Tying off to the bow cleat would yield >>> a scope ratio of >>>> [60 ft] / [7 ft + 3.0 ft] = 60 / 10 = 6.0 . A scope ratio of 7.1 >>>> would >>> probably be OK for anchoring overnight. A scope ratio of 6.0 would >>> be iffy. So, if you are trying to anchor in a situation where there >>> is limited room to swing &/or a poor holding bottom; then, consider >>> using the bow eye vs the bow cleat to slightly improve your scope >>> ratio. Of course, using the bow eye is much more trouble vs using >>> the bow cleat. A typical mooring has a huge deeply set anchor that >>> is unlikely to drag and so there is usually no reason to use the bow eye vs the bow cleat on a mooring. >>>> >>>> Having said that, I used my bow eye and stern eye at my slip very >>>> time I >>> docked at my home slip. But, I was in a situation where I parked >>> sideways to a wharf and the boat was exposed to wave action from the >>> side. Rather than depend upon fenders to absorb the wave action and >>> keep the hull off the dock, I had a pair of mooring whips. Mooring >>> whips look like HD fishing poles attached to the dock. I had my >>> mooring whips setup to attach to the bow eye and stern eye using >>> quick release carabiners. They held the boat about 2 ft off the >>> dock. Of course all that gear was swept away along with my dock during the May 19, 2020 dam failure and flood! >>>> >>>> Roger Pihlaja >>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>>> >>>> Sent from Mail for Windows 10 >>>> >>>> From: Peter Nyberg >>>> Sent: Tuesday, March 9, 2021 11:00 AM >>>> To: sea20 at verizon.net; The Rhodes 22 Email List >>>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] mooring >>>> >>>> Scott, >>>> >>>> I?m not sure what you?re asking, and it may be a terminology issue. >>>> Is >>> it possible that when you say ?bow eye? you mean ?bow cleat?? The >>> bow cleat would be attached to the deck, where as the bow eye is >>> attached to the stem of the hull. You could in theory attach your >>> mooring to the bow eye, but I can?t see why you would want a second one. >>>> >>>> Adding one or two more cleats at the bow is a pretty common project. >>>> You >>> would want it through-bolted, and you would want to avoid any >>> possibility of water finding it?s way into the deck core. I?d >>> recommend a drill-fill-drill approach. If you don?t know what that >>> is, I can elaborate. >>>> >>>> ?Peter >>>> >>>>> On Mar 9, 2021, at 8:44 AM, Scott E Andrews via Rhodes22-list < >>> rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Greetings all, I will likely be on a waiting list for a slip next >>> season and will be on a mooring. I have a couple questions regarding >>> painter and pendant attachment. I read MJM"s email regarding use of >>> the bow eye with chocks. Is the any reason not to add a second bow >>> eye? Also, is there a recomended pendant or painter length? Thanks everyone. >>>>> Scott AndrewsFirst year owner, Wilmington De >>>> >>>> >>> > From tavares0947 at gmail.com Thu Mar 11 14:42:40 2021 From: tavares0947 at gmail.com (Todd Tavares) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2021 14:42:40 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] BURGEE ORDERING INSTRUCTIONS In-Reply-To: <1615485502448-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1615316576867-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <0FC2BB84-FA75-4952-984B-0CE7F760E60D@verizon.net> <1615485502448-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: Like when Daffy Duck says in the closing scene of The Stupor Salesman... "Hey Bub! You need a house to go with this door knob!"... Are we eventually going to start an club to go with our burgees? Todd T. On Thu, Mar 11, 2021, 12:58 PM Joe Dempsey wrote: > Thanks to all for the nice words. It seems like the ordering is going well. > By my count we've got 23 ordered but this does not include those who have > ordered by phone. It's fine to do so, but if you haven't ordered yet, which > I hope all Rhodies will, if you order by phone, Cindy is most likely going > to have to call you back because she may be driving on the LA Freeway! > Which > ever is easier for you, just get your orders in and let's get Rhodes 22 > seen > around the world. By the way, this is probably mostly applicable to Chris, > hopefully you've got a US address. Cindy told me that International (other > than Canada) mail is running 2 months. When you talk to her, you'll have to > get a cost estimate. Again, thanks for the kind words, but it's a great > group of guys and ladies (can I say that?) and a great boat! > > > > ----- > Joe Dempsey > s/v Respite > Rhodes 22 1989/2005 > Deltaville,VA > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > From mweisner at ebsmed.com Thu Mar 11 15:59:51 2021 From: mweisner at ebsmed.com (Michael D. Weisner) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2021 15:59:51 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] mooring In-Reply-To: <420A66CD-2CC4-456D-A8EA-B3ACD1A27B42@verizon.net> References: <01ae01d71699$6f2322e0$4d6968a0$@ebsmed.com> <420A66CD-2CC4-456D-A8EA-B3ACD1A27B42@verizon.net> Message-ID: <004001d716b9$7bf8c220$73ea4660$@ebsmed.com> Twin bow cleats. Same deck. Same boat Mike s/v Wind Lass ('91) Nissequogue River, NY I?d rather be sailing :~) -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of Scott Andrews via Rhodes22-list Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2021 2:33 PM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] mooring Mike, your technique sounds very similar to what I did with the Flying Scots. Particularly the use of two pendants as we had loose boats with only one. Do yours both attach to the same bow eye? Scott 86? Rhodes 22 Wilmington De. Sent from my iPhone > On Mar 11, 2021, at 12:10 PM, Michael D. Weisner wrote: > > ?I have moored my Rhodes boats for over 30 years in the Nissequogue River. > > Here are a few observations: > 1. Use a swivel 10 feet below the float to prevent chain twisted bunching up which will reduce the scope. > 2. Use a positive floatation buoy. The teardrop inflatables do not last and fail at inopportune times. > 3. Attach the mooring pennant lines to the top of the buoy with a shackle through the thimble. > 4. Use 2 mooring pennants, if possible (don't ask, I learned the hard way). > 5. Use 12' mooring pennant(s) to accommodate impulse loads (stretch, give). > 5. DO NOT USE CARABINERS! > While they may be rated for the needed strength, > the spring latch is not a safe solution when unattended for long periods. > 6. Foam "pool noodles" make excellent and cheap floatation sleeves for > the mooring lines when the boat is out. With a little effort, they usually > can be slid over the lines without cutting the foam. > > Mike > s/v Wind Lass ('91) > Nissequogue River, NY > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of > Goodness > Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2021 11:46 AM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] mooring > > I tie my bow eye to the mooring with a large stainless marine caribiner. I feel it is less likely to saw through with wave action like chocks can. I take a dinghy out to my mooring though and use it to clip on to the eye because i cant reach it easily from the deck. > So as i return to the mooring i pick up the painter with a boat hook and tie it to the deck bow cleat. Then put everything away and do the switch as i am leaving in the dinghy. I have used the dingy painter to tie to both mooring and boat if the wind was up while doing the switch. > > Mooring is a #150 mushroom jetted 5? deep into the sand with a #60 section of 6? ship chain attached to the 25? galvanized mooring chain attached to the White/blue stripe mooring ball. My painter is 25? 3/4 inch nylon anchor rope with a small float and a 10? floating poly line for pickup. I do have a good bit of swing but its an empty mooring field that ranges from 8-12? deep. > > Bob (Palatka) > >> On Mar 10, 2021, at 4:09 PM, Rick Lange wrote: >> >> ?Scott, >> >> Your forward crew can do the same on an R22. >> >> Regards, >> >> Rick Lange >> >> >>> On Tue, Mar 9, 2021 at 4:50 PM Scott Andrews via Rhodes22-list < >>> rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org> wrote: >>> >>> Thanks everyone, I get it now. I was thinking of my experience with >>> smaller boats, thistles & flying Scots when forward crew could clip >>> on the ball. >>> Scott >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>>>>> On Mar 9, 2021, at 1:49 PM, ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: >>>>> >>>>> ? >>>>> Scott, >>>>> >>>>> Assuming you are using Peter?s below attached definitions for bow >>>>> eye >>> and bow cleat, the only reason you would want to tie off to the bow >>> eye vs the bow cleat would be if you are anchoring on short scope or >>> if the anchor is set into a poor holding bottom. Tying off to the >>> bow eye reduces the vertical distance from the tie off point to the >>> anchor. Remember, the vertical distance is the water depth + height >>> of the tie off point above the water. An example may make this more >>> clear. My bow eye is about 1.5 ft above the water and my bow cleats are about 3.0 ft above the water. >>> Suppose we are anchoring in 7 ft of water using 60 ft of anchor rode. >>> Tying off to the bow eye would yield a scope ratio of [60 ft] / [7 >>> ft >>> + 1.5 ft] = 60 / 8.5 = 7.1 . Tying off to the bow cleat would yield >>> a scope ratio of >>>> [60 ft] / [7 ft + 3.0 ft] = 60 / 10 = 6.0 . A scope ratio of 7.1 >>>> would >>> probably be OK for anchoring overnight. A scope ratio of 6.0 would >>> be iffy. So, if you are trying to anchor in a situation where there >>> is limited room to swing &/or a poor holding bottom; then, consider >>> using the bow eye vs the bow cleat to slightly improve your scope >>> ratio. Of course, using the bow eye is much more trouble vs using >>> the bow cleat. A typical mooring has a huge deeply set anchor that >>> is unlikely to drag and so there is usually no reason to use the bow eye vs the bow cleat on a mooring. >>>> >>>> Having said that, I used my bow eye and stern eye at my slip very >>>> time I >>> docked at my home slip. But, I was in a situation where I parked >>> sideways to a wharf and the boat was exposed to wave action from the >>> side. Rather than depend upon fenders to absorb the wave action and >>> keep the hull off the dock, I had a pair of mooring whips. Mooring >>> whips look like HD fishing poles attached to the dock. I had my >>> mooring whips setup to attach to the bow eye and stern eye using >>> quick release carabiners. They held the boat about 2 ft off the >>> dock. Of course all that gear was swept away along with my dock during the May 19, 2020 dam failure and flood! >>>> >>>> Roger Pihlaja >>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>>> >>>> Sent from Mail for Windows 10 >>>> >>>> From: Peter Nyberg >>>> Sent: Tuesday, March 9, 2021 11:00 AM >>>> To: sea20 at verizon.net; The Rhodes 22 Email List >>>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] mooring >>>> >>>> Scott, >>>> >>>> I?m not sure what you?re asking, and it may be a terminology issue. >>>> Is >>> it possible that when you say ?bow eye? you mean ?bow cleat?? The >>> bow cleat would be attached to the deck, where as the bow eye is >>> attached to the stem of the hull. You could in theory attach your >>> mooring to the bow eye, but I can?t see why you would want a second one. >>>> >>>> Adding one or two more cleats at the bow is a pretty common project. >>>> You >>> would want it through-bolted, and you would want to avoid any >>> possibility of water finding it?s way into the deck core. I?d >>> recommend a drill-fill-drill approach. If you don?t know what that >>> is, I can elaborate. >>>> >>>> ?Peter >>>> >>>>> On Mar 9, 2021, at 8:44 AM, Scott E Andrews via Rhodes22-list < >>> rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Greetings all, I will likely be on a waiting list for a slip next >>> season and will be on a mooring. I have a couple questions regarding >>> painter and pendant attachment. I read MJM"s email regarding use of >>> the bow eye with chocks. Is the any reason not to add a second bow >>> eye? Also, is there a recomended pendant or painter length? Thanks everyone. >>>>> Scott AndrewsFirst year owner, Wilmington De >>>> >>>> >>> > From lvjkuhn at gmail.com Thu Mar 11 16:54:31 2021 From: lvjkuhn at gmail.com (Lee) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2021 14:54:31 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Happy 95th! Message-ID: <1615499671395-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Stan, Happy Birthday! Lee Claytor Lake, VA -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From lvjkuhn at gmail.com Thu Mar 11 17:05:48 2021 From: lvjkuhn at gmail.com (Lee) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2021 15:05:48 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Electric Motor Lift Question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1615500348093-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Stephen, The only problem I had was that it could barely raise the 135 lb. motor. I saturated the belt with WD-40 and it operated smooth as snot after that. Lee Claytor Lake, VA -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From goldsmith.cf at gmail.com Thu Mar 11 17:13:19 2021 From: goldsmith.cf at gmail.com (Frank Goldsmith) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2021 17:13:19 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Happy 95th! In-Reply-To: <1615499671395-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1615499671395-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <03DDA53F-1270-46E5-90E1-0729596D01CC@gmail.com> Wow! I did not know. Yes, Happy Birthday to Stan! To 120, as some of us say ? Frank Frank Goldsmith 1985/2001 Rhodes 22 Lake Keowee, SC, and Fairview, NC > On Mar 11, 2021, at 4:54 PM, Lee wrote: > > Stan, > > Happy Birthday! > > Lee > Claytor Lake, VA > > > > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From tom.vanheule at intrinsicprograms.com Thu Mar 11 19:51:31 2021 From: tom.vanheule at intrinsicprograms.com (Tom Van Heule) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2021 18:51:31 -0600 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Happy 95th! In-Reply-To: <03DDA53F-1270-46E5-90E1-0729596D01CC@gmail.com> References: <1615499671395-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <03DDA53F-1270-46E5-90E1-0729596D01CC@gmail.com> Message-ID: To say an inspiration is too little.. I am also speechless to how he doesn't know how much he changed (our) lives. And this isn't any eulogy. That bastard won't let spite win, respectfully. Happy birthday Stan!!! Hope you've had a wonderful day. On Thu, Mar 11, 2021, 4:13 PM Frank Goldsmith wrote: > Wow! I did not know. Yes, Happy Birthday to Stan! To 120, as some of us > say ? > > Frank > > Frank Goldsmith > 1985/2001 Rhodes 22 > Lake Keowee, SC, and Fairview, NC > > > > On Mar 11, 2021, at 4:54 PM, Lee wrote: > > > > Stan, > > > > Happy Birthday! > > > > Lee > > Claytor Lake, VA > > > > > > > > -- > > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > > From joedempsey at hughes.net Thu Mar 11 21:26:40 2021 From: joedempsey at hughes.net (Joe Dempsey) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2021 19:26:40 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Happy 95th! In-Reply-To: <1615499671395-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1615499671395-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <1615516000039-0.post@n5.nabble.com> And many more! Stay well, Stan! ----- Joe Dempsey s/v Respite Rhodes 22 1989/2005 Deltaville,VA -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From luis.guzman.ve at gmail.com Thu Mar 11 21:38:45 2021 From: luis.guzman.ve at gmail.com (Luis Guzman) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2021 20:38:45 -0600 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Happy 95th! In-Reply-To: <1615516000039-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1615516000039-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <4E8BEE8F-588F-4243-A958-FF2E5DA40EE0@gmail.com> Happy birthday Stan. Thank you for your gift to us of the Rhodes 22....and many more years and Rhodes 22s Sent from my iPhone > On Mar 11, 2021, at 8:26 PM, Joe Dempsey wrote: > > ?And many more! Stay well, Stan! > > > > ----- > Joe Dempsey > s/v Respite > Rhodes 22 1989/2005 > Deltaville,VA > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From joedempsey at hughes.net Thu Mar 11 21:47:13 2021 From: joedempsey at hughes.net (Joe Dempsey) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2021 19:47:13 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Electric Motor Lift Question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1615517233364-0.post@n5.nabble.com> I presume you have the GB lift with the 3/4 HP winch. "Respite" has been in either brackish or salt water for most of her life since 2005 at least. I don't know of any "back up" and as I recall, the make of the winch motor is not made any more but it's pretty typical of the ones you can buy at Lowe's, HD, Tractor Supply, etc. I think there's a slot for a hex wrench to turn the winch if necessary. ----- Joe Dempsey s/v Respite Rhodes 22 1989/2005 Deltaville,VA -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From joedempsey at hughes.net Thu Mar 11 21:52:26 2021 From: joedempsey at hughes.net (Joe Dempsey) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2021 19:52:26 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Electric Motor Lift Question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1615517546431-0.post@n5.nabble.com> I presume you have the GB lift with the 3/4 HP winch. "Respite" has been in either brackish or salt water for most of her life since 2005 at least. I don't know of any "back up" and as I recall, the make of the winch motor is not made any more but it's pretty typical of the ones you can buy at Lowe's, HD, Tractor Supply, etc. I think there's a slot for a hex wrench to turn the winch if necessary. I've looked in to replacing the motor if necessary. It's very do-able you just need to match the bolt pattern. ----- Joe Dempsey s/v Respite Rhodes 22 1989/2005 Deltaville,VA -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From joedempsey at hughes.net Thu Mar 11 21:56:28 2021 From: joedempsey at hughes.net (Joe Dempsey) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2021 19:56:28 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] BURGEE ORDERING INSTRUCTIONS In-Reply-To: References: <1615316576867-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <0FC2BB84-FA75-4952-984B-0CE7F760E60D@verizon.net> <1615485502448-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <1615517788657-0.post@n5.nabble.com> We are sort of an ad hoc club. But formalizing might be a good idea. I've seen some virtual boat clubs on line. The new website is a great start! ----- Joe Dempsey s/v Respite Rhodes 22 1989/2005 Deltaville,VA -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From joedempsey at hughes.net Thu Mar 11 22:08:47 2021 From: joedempsey at hughes.net (Joe Dempsey) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2021 20:08:47 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes 22 Association? In-Reply-To: References: <1615316576867-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <0FC2BB84-FA75-4952-984B-0CE7F760E60D@verizon.net> <1615485502448-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <1615518527644-0.post@n5.nabble.com> We are sort of an ad hoc club. But formalizing might be a good idea. I've seen some virtual boat clubs on line. The new website is a great start! ----- Joe Dempsey s/v Respite Rhodes 22 1989/2005 Deltaville,VA -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From joedempsey at hughes.net Thu Mar 11 22:10:26 2021 From: joedempsey at hughes.net (Joe Dempsey) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2021 20:10:26 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes 22 Association? In-Reply-To: References: <1615316576867-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <0FC2BB84-FA75-4952-984B-0CE7F760E60D@verizon.net> <1615485502448-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <1615518626685-0.post@n5.nabble.com> We are sort of an ad hoc club. But formalizing might be a good idea. I've seen some virtual boat clubs on line. The new website is a great start! ----- Joe Dempsey s/v Respite Rhodes 22 1989/2005 Deltaville,VA -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From john_carlson at mac.com Thu Mar 11 23:18:41 2021 From: john_carlson at mac.com (John Carlson) Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2021 22:18:41 -0600 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Happy 95th! In-Reply-To: <4E8BEE8F-588F-4243-A958-FF2E5DA40EE0@gmail.com> References: <1615516000039-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <4E8BEE8F-588F-4243-A958-FF2E5DA40EE0@gmail.com> Message-ID: <5820EBCA-2FC1-4E84-8414-00D59886229A@mac.com> Happy Birthday Stan! -- John Carlson S/V Lillipelli (2004/2012) On the beautiful Lake Waco > On Mar 11, 2021, at 8:38 PM, Luis Guzman wrote: > > Happy birthday Stan. Thank you for your gift to us of the Rhodes 22....and many more years and Rhodes 22s > > Sent from my iPhone > >> On Mar 11, 2021, at 8:26 PM, Joe Dempsey wrote: >> >> ?And many more! Stay well, Stan! >> >> >> >> ----- >> Joe Dempsey >> s/v Respite >> Rhodes 22 1989/2005 >> Deltaville,VA >> -- >> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From spreadgoodnews at gmail.com Fri Mar 12 08:05:43 2021 From: spreadgoodnews at gmail.com (Goodness) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2021 08:05:43 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Happy 95th! In-Reply-To: <5820EBCA-2FC1-4E84-8414-00D59886229A@mac.com> References: <5820EBCA-2FC1-4E84-8414-00D59886229A@mac.com> Message-ID: <2C1C2B88-AEBB-4B42-AD46-266871CDBFA7@gmail.com> Happy Birthday Stan! Keep eating organic! Bob > On Mar 11, 2021, at 11:18 PM, John Carlson via Rhodes22-list wrote: > > ?Happy Birthday Stan! > > -- > John Carlson > S/V Lillipelli (2004/2012) > On the beautiful Lake Waco > > >> On Mar 11, 2021, at 8:38 PM, Luis Guzman wrote: >> >> Happy birthday Stan. Thank you for your gift to us of the Rhodes 22....and many more years and Rhodes 22s >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >>>> On Mar 11, 2021, at 8:26 PM, Joe Dempsey wrote: >>> >>> ?And many more! Stay well, Stan! >>> >>> >>> >>> ----- >>> Joe Dempsey >>> s/v Respite >>> Rhodes 22 1989/2005 >>> Deltaville,VA >>> -- >>> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > > From forg3d at gmail.com Fri Mar 12 09:22:17 2021 From: forg3d at gmail.com (Jeffrey Camiel) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2021 08:22:17 -0600 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Happy 95th! In-Reply-To: <5820EBCA-2FC1-4E84-8414-00D59886229A@mac.com> References: <1615516000039-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <4E8BEE8F-588F-4243-A958-FF2E5DA40EE0@gmail.com> <5820EBCA-2FC1-4E84-8414-00D59886229A@mac.com> Message-ID: <1077B28A-0B45-424C-872C-16BEDE50835E@gmail.com> Happy Birthday Stan!! Thank you for all your awesome help and beautiful boat! > > From chrisgeankoplis at gmail.com Fri Mar 12 09:35:11 2021 From: chrisgeankoplis at gmail.com (Chris Geankoplis) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2021 09:35:11 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] BURGEE ORDERING INSTRUCTIONS In-Reply-To: <1615517788657-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1615316576867-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <0FC2BB84-FA75-4952-984B-0CE7F760E60D@verizon.net> <1615485502448-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1615517788657-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: Gee I hope we can get reciprocal agreements with other clubs so we can use their facilities! Chris Geankoplis Enosis On Thu, Mar 11, 2021 at 9:56 PM Joe Dempsey wrote: > We are sort of an ad hoc club. But formalizing might be a good idea. I've > seen some virtual boat clubs on line. The new website is a great start! > > > > ----- > Joe Dempsey > s/v Respite > Rhodes 22 1989/2005 > Deltaville,VA > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > From chrisgeankoplis at gmail.com Fri Mar 12 09:45:16 2021 From: chrisgeankoplis at gmail.com (Chris Geankoplis) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2021 09:45:16 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Happy 95th! In-Reply-To: <1077B28A-0B45-424C-872C-16BEDE50835E@gmail.com> References: <1615516000039-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <4E8BEE8F-588F-4243-A958-FF2E5DA40EE0@gmail.com> <5820EBCA-2FC1-4E84-8414-00D59886229A@mac.com> <1077B28A-0B45-424C-872C-16BEDE50835E@gmail.com> Message-ID: On Fri, Mar 12, 2021 at 9:22 AM Jeffrey Camiel wrote: > Happy Birthday Stan!! Thank you for all your awesome help and beautiful > boat! > > > > > > > From chrisgeankoplis at gmail.com Fri Mar 12 09:48:27 2021 From: chrisgeankoplis at gmail.com (Chris Geankoplis) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2021 09:48:27 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Happy 95th! In-Reply-To: References: <1615516000039-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <4E8BEE8F-588F-4243-A958-FF2E5DA40EE0@gmail.com> <5820EBCA-2FC1-4E84-8414-00D59886229A@mac.com> <1077B28A-0B45-424C-872C-16BEDE50835E@gmail.com> Message-ID: On Fri, Mar 12, 2021 at 9:45 AM Chris Geankoplis wrote: > > I expect you will pause for a moment of reflection and say ? I don?t have > time for this crap I?ve got boats to finish?. Happy birthday Stan. > On Fri, Mar 12, 2021 at 9:22 AM Jeffrey Camiel wrote: > >> Happy Birthday Stan!! Thank you for all your awesome help and beautiful >> boat! >> >> > >> > >> >> From joedempsey at hughes.net Fri Mar 12 11:27:35 2021 From: joedempsey at hughes.net (Joe Dempsey) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2021 09:27:35 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes 22 Association? Message-ID: <1615566455579-0.post@n5.nabble.com> I've moved the discussion out of 'Burgee Ordering Instructions'. ----- Joe Dempsey s/v Respite Rhodes 22 1989/2005 Deltaville,VA -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From joedempsey at hughes.net Fri Mar 12 11:40:39 2021 From: joedempsey at hughes.net (Joe Dempsey) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2021 09:40:39 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes 22 Association? In-Reply-To: <1615566455579-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1615566455579-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <1615567239777-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Should be very possible as long as it is organized. I've seen one boat club as a 501(c)3. Stuff like that takes some pretty intensive and dedicated effort. All depends on how interested folks are. I doubt there would be any reciprocity with yacht clubs unless we had a physical location which is not possible. But Boat US and other such organizations could well be supporters. Joe Dempsey Rhodes 22 s/v Respite 1989/2005 Deltaville, VA Re: BURGEE ORDERING INSTRUCTIONS Mar 12, 2021; 9:35am ? by Chris Geankoplis Chris Geankoplis Gee I hope we can get reciprocal agreements with other clubs so we can use their facilities! Chris Geankoplis Enosis On Thu, Mar 11, 2021 at 9:56 PM Joe Dempsey <[hidden email]> wrote: > We are sort of an ad hoc club. But formalizing might be a good idea. I've > seen some virtual boat clubs on line. The new website is a great start! > > > > ----- > Joe Dempsey > s/v Respite > Rhodes 22 1989/2005 > Deltaville,VA > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > ----- Joe Dempsey s/v Respite Rhodes 22 1989/2005 Deltaville,VA -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From rodellner at mac.com Fri Mar 12 16:14:16 2021 From: rodellner at mac.com (Rod Ellner) Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2021 15:14:16 -0600 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Fwd: Happy birthday to you! References: <8EEFC756-D028-4A6E-A999-E029EB317F03@mac.com> Message-ID: Sent from my iPad Begin forwarded message: > From: Rod Ellner > Date: March 12, 2021 at 3:13:03 PM CST > To: Spitzer Stan > Subject: Happy birthday to you! > > ?Stan > > Have a WONDERFUL day! Thank you for making the Rhodes22 which made so many of us happy also! > > Rod and Mary Ellner > St Croix River > Wisconsin > > Sent from my iPad From bgarrant at gmail.com Sat Mar 13 06:25:20 2021 From: bgarrant at gmail.com (Bob Garrant) Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2021 06:25:20 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Happy 95th! In-Reply-To: References: <1615499671395-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <03DDA53F-1270-46E5-90E1-0729596D01CC@gmail.com> Message-ID: Happy Birthday Stan I feel like a newbie in this group since I?ve only had my Rhodes 22 for four years. I?ve only sailed about 500-600 miles so far on the Chesapeake Bay, Severn River and Chester River so I?m still in a learning mode. But I?ve admired the boat and always wanted one since 2005 so I understand the loyalty and enjoyment Rhodes owners have for the gift you?ve given to each of us, and our families and friends. Thanks so much and Happy Birthday. Bob Garrant 2000 Rhodes Kent Island , MD On Thu, Mar 11, 2021 at 7:51 PM Tom Van Heule < tom.vanheule at intrinsicprograms.com> wrote: > To say an inspiration is too little.. > > I am also speechless to how he doesn't know how much he changed (our) > lives. > > And this isn't any eulogy. That bastard won't let spite win, respectfully. > > Happy birthday Stan!!! > Hope you've had a wonderful day. > > On Thu, Mar 11, 2021, 4:13 PM Frank Goldsmith > wrote: > > > Wow! I did not know. Yes, Happy Birthday to Stan! To 120, as some of > us > > say ? > > > > Frank > > > > Frank Goldsmith > > 1985/2001 Rhodes 22 > > Lake Keowee, SC, and Fairview, NC > > > > > > > On Mar 11, 2021, at 4:54 PM, Lee wrote: > > > > > > Stan, > > > > > > Happy Birthday! > > > > > > Lee > > > Claytor Lake, VA > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > > > > > From jeffsmithphoto at gmail.com Sat Mar 13 07:44:18 2021 From: jeffsmithphoto at gmail.com (JeffSmith) Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2021 05:44:18 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Happy 95th! In-Reply-To: References: <1615499671395-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <03DDA53F-1270-46E5-90E1-0729596D01CC@gmail.com> Message-ID: <1615639458474-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Happy irthday, Stan! And many many more. ----- Jeff Smith 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor Atlantic Highlands, NJ -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From sloopblueheron at gmail.com Sat Mar 13 10:35:41 2021 From: sloopblueheron at gmail.com (Rick Lange) Date: Sat, 13 Mar 2021 10:35:41 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Happy 95th! In-Reply-To: References: <1615499671395-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <03DDA53F-1270-46E5-90E1-0729596D01CC@gmail.com> Message-ID: Happy belated birthday, Stan. Regards, Rick Lange On Sat, Mar 13, 2021 at 6:25 AM Bob Garrant wrote: > Happy Birthday Stan > I feel like a newbie in this group since I?ve only had my Rhodes 22 for > four years. I?ve only sailed about 500-600 miles so far on the Chesapeake > Bay, Severn River and Chester River so I?m still in a learning mode. But > I?ve admired the boat and always wanted one since 2005 so I understand the > loyalty and enjoyment Rhodes owners have for the gift you?ve given to each > of us, and our families and friends. Thanks so much and Happy Birthday. > Bob Garrant > 2000 Rhodes > Kent Island , MD > > On Thu, Mar 11, 2021 at 7:51 PM Tom Van Heule < > tom.vanheule at intrinsicprograms.com> wrote: > > > To say an inspiration is too little.. > > > > I am also speechless to how he doesn't know how much he changed (our) > > lives. > > > > And this isn't any eulogy. That bastard won't let spite win, > respectfully. > > > > Happy birthday Stan!!! > > Hope you've had a wonderful day. > > > > On Thu, Mar 11, 2021, 4:13 PM Frank Goldsmith > > wrote: > > > > > Wow! I did not know. Yes, Happy Birthday to Stan! To 120, as some of > > us > > > say ? > > > > > > Frank > > > > > > Frank Goldsmith > > > 1985/2001 Rhodes 22 > > > Lake Keowee, SC, and Fairview, NC > > > > > > > > > > On Mar 11, 2021, at 4:54 PM, Lee wrote: > > > > > > > > Stan, > > > > > > > > Happy Birthday! > > > > > > > > Lee > > > > Claytor Lake, VA > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > > > > > > > > > From joedempsey at hughes.net Sun Mar 14 11:00:34 2021 From: joedempsey at hughes.net (Joe Dempsey) Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2021 08:00:34 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Flag placement? In-Reply-To: <1615734034049-40671.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1615734034049-40671.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <1615734034049-0.post@n5.nabble.com> This post replies to one posted in 2009, but in view of the arrival of our new fleet burgee, is appropriate. I'm posting an article on Flag Etiquette of which there are many. I combined explanations from several. It's amazing how detailed and complex the "rules" are which were developed over the centuries. Traditions have a place in sailing This is a great graphic which brings it into visual simplicity. http://www.flagorder.com/positionetiquette.html For those who might be interested in bringing back the nearly extinct tradition of showing a burgee from a pig stick, I've written out instructions from another article I found and adapted it to the Rhodes. It's about $100 for all the material. Now is the time to install a mini-block at the peak of your mast. You can add the pig stick later. I'll post it later. ----- Joe Dempsey s/v Respite Rhodes 22 1989/2005 Deltaville,VA -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From sloopblueheron at gmail.com Sun Mar 14 11:58:29 2021 From: sloopblueheron at gmail.com (Rick Lange) Date: Sun, 14 Mar 2021 11:58:29 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Flag placement? In-Reply-To: <1615734034049-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1615734034049-40671.post@n5.nabble.com> <1615734034049-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: To be clear, the burgee should be flown only in domestic waters from a flag halyard hung from the starboard spreader. In foreign waters, the host nation's courtesy flag is flown from the flag halyard after entry. The national ensign is always flown from the port aft shroud. Regards, Rick Lange On Sun, Mar 14, 2021 at 11:00 AM Joe Dempsey wrote: > This post replies to one posted in 2009, but in view of the arrival of our > new fleet burgee, is appropriate. I'm posting an article on Flag Etiquette > of which there are many. I combined explanations from several. It's > amazing > how detailed and complex the "rules" are which were developed over the > centuries. Traditions have a place in sailing > > > > This is a great graphic which brings it into visual simplicity. > > http://www.flagorder.com/positionetiquette.html > > For those who might be interested in bringing back the nearly extinct > tradition of showing a burgee from a pig stick, I've written out > instructions from another article I found and adapted it to the Rhodes. > It's > about $100 for all the material. Now is the time to install a mini-block at > the peak of your mast. You can add the pig stick later. I'll post it later. > > > > > ----- > Joe Dempsey > s/v Respite > Rhodes 22 1989/2005 > Deltaville,VA > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > From jeffsmithphoto at gmail.com Mon Mar 15 09:24:39 2021 From: jeffsmithphoto at gmail.com (JeffSmith) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2021 06:24:39 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Flag placement? In-Reply-To: References: <1615734034049-40671.post@n5.nabble.com> <1615734034049-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <1615814679755-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Hose clamping 2 small rotating blocks (from hardware store) 18" apart on the starboard spreader keeps the radar reflector from chafing on the flag halyard. ----- Jeff Smith 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor Atlantic Highlands, NJ -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From goldsmith.cf at gmail.com Mon Mar 15 11:27:11 2021 From: goldsmith.cf at gmail.com (Frank Goldsmith) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2021 11:27:11 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Website News In-Reply-To: <016801d715c9$9cfa2d10$d6ee8730$@ebsmed.com> References: <016801d715c9$9cfa2d10$d6ee8730$@ebsmed.com> Message-ID: <36CCB293-FD69-4532-994B-7747DA584E65@gmail.com> Great job on the website. A real treasure is the recorded interview from a few years ago with Stan, our Patriarch. It?s visible at the ?General Boats? tab. Very interesting; I learned a lot about the history of the company and the boat. Who did the interview? Frank Asheville, NC S/V Mary Bess 1985/2000 Rhodes 22 Lake Keowee, SC > On Mar 10, 2021, at 11:22 AM, Michael D. Weisner wrote: > > Hi Fellow Rhodies, > > > > Please take a look around the www.rhodes22.org > website. It is my hope that this website and the associated Mailman email > forum will be the center of all things Rhodes 22. The website maintains > records, pictures, documents, email exchanges of the Rhodes 22 Owners' Group > for more than 20 years! If you are looking to purchase, own a Rhodes 22 or > have owned one in the past, this website is for you. > > > > I just refreshed the web server with Peter's latest changes. Peter and I > talked about many new items for the site and he has made them "pop" both in > terms of appearance and speed of implementation. Another well deserved round > of applause, and a beer, for Peter! > > > > Checkout the "Community News" webpage for the latest Rhodie events. The > Rhodes 22 Burgee is currently featured on the page with a link to Joe's > purchasing instructions email posting. Kudos to Joe Demsey for all his hard > work in making this happen for our community. Let's go buy them! > > > > We now have a "Video and More" webpage to organize many of the fine videos > that have been posted to youtube and other websites, showing Rhodies sailing > and documenting technical projects associated with owning a Rhodes 22 > sailboat. Don't forget to review Peter's invaluable Silverheels videos on > youtube for project ideas. > > > > In addition, we added a "Contact the Webmaster" button at the bottom of > every webpage. Please use this for website suggestions, submissions (new > videos or documents) and other feedback that you do not wish to post to "da > List". > > > > I would like to update some of the picture gallery with more recent Rhodie > gatherings and pictures of Rhodie families. The latest that I have, I think, > are some pictures from the party at the 2017 Annapolis show. Please send > images to webmaster at rhodes22.org . > > > > Thank you to all of the Rhodies who have made this community a success! > > > > Fair winds, > > Mike > > s/v Wind Lass ('91) > > Nissequogue River, NY > > List/Web Admin > > I'd rather be sailing :-) > > > > > From shawn.sustain at gmail.com Mon Mar 15 16:41:12 2021 From: shawn.sustain at gmail.com (Shawn Boles) Date: Mon, 15 Mar 2021 13:41:12 -0700 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Happy 95th! In-Reply-To: <1615499671395-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1615499671395-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: Stan - Happy Birthday! Best. Boat. Ever. Cheers, Shawn s/v Sweet Baboo On Thu, Mar 11, 2021, 1:54 PM Lee wrote: > Stan, > > Happy Birthday! > > Lee > Claytor Lake, VA > > > > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > From gmorgan.flier at gmail.com Tue Mar 16 05:35:33 2021 From: gmorgan.flier at gmail.com (Gmorganflier) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2021 02:35:33 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Lifting the Mast off of the Boat Message-ID: <1615887333262-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Question for those who might have done this. I want to take my sails in for cleaning and repair. I?ve never removed my sails, so this is going to be all new for me. I have the CDI II furler, so my plan is to lower and remove my 175 genie with the mast up. I then plan to remove the boom, lower the mast, disconnect the shouds and disconnect the CDI furler from the mast. I have no clue how heavy the mast with the furled main is. Can one person lift the mast with the furled main or will I need help? My boat is on a mooring. There are some logistical problems with pulling my boat out of the water....the water depth is too shallow at my club?s ramp. Would I be crazy to attempt this with the boat tied to my club?s dock or pulled up on the shore? Thanks for any advice on how to best accomplish this. George Morgan S/V Knotty Lady 1986 Lake Waccamaw NC -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From tavares0947 at gmail.com Tue Mar 16 06:59:10 2021 From: tavares0947 at gmail.com (Todd Tavares) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2021 06:59:10 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Lifting the Mast off of the Boat In-Reply-To: <1615887333262-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1615887333262-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: George, I do not have the GB in-mast furling mainsail and mast, but I'm sure others will likely say it is a minimum two person operation. My old-style standard mast only weighs about 75lbs, and easily handled on flat solid ground but is quite unwieldy trying to carry it off the boat with the spreaders flopping and all of the rigging wanting to snag the stanchions etc. But some initial questions should be asked first so others can better advise you. Do you have the General Boats mast raising and lowering system, with the stern rail crutch/roller support? If so make sure to follow the instructions exactly with special focus on disconnecting the poptop slider to mast connection. Todd T. tavares0947 at gmail.com On Tue, Mar 16, 2021, 5:35 AM Gmorganflier wrote: > Question for those who might have done this. > > I want to take my sails in for cleaning and repair. I?ve never removed my > sails, so this is going to be all new for me. I have the CDI II furler, so > my plan is to lower and remove my 175 genie with the mast up. I then plan > to > remove the boom, lower the mast, disconnect the shouds and disconnect the > CDI furler from the mast. > I have no clue how heavy the mast with the furled main is. Can one person > lift the mast with the furled main or will I need help? > > My boat is on a mooring. There are some logistical problems with pulling my > boat out of the water....the water depth is too shallow at my club?s ramp. > Would I be crazy to attempt this with the boat tied to my club?s dock or > pulled up on the shore? > > Thanks for any advice on how to best accomplish this. > > George Morgan > S/V Knotty Lady 1986 > Lake Waccamaw NC > > > > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > From snstaum at gmail.com Tue Mar 16 07:30:07 2021 From: snstaum at gmail.com (Stephen Staum) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2021 07:30:07 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Lifting the Mast off of the Boat In-Reply-To: <1615887333262-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1615887333262-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: George, It takes 2 people to raise and lower the mast manually and I would not consider trying it on the water. I did it for several years that way (always on the trailer). When my son went off to college I only had 1 friend willing to help with that. You raise or lower from the bow and when stepping off the cabin top to the bow level you have little control if the mast starts to go sideways. I would recommend buying Stan's mast raising system as I did. It allows 1 person to do it safely and can be done on the water. You don't need to remove the boom to get the mainsail out. The whole assembly slides out of the mast and then you can set it down on a dock and unroll & remove the main sail. Not sure how you do that on the water. Good luck! *Thanks and Stay Well,* *Stephen Staum* *s/v Carol Lee 2* *Needham, MA* On Tue, Mar 16, 2021 at 5:35 AM Gmorganflier wrote: > Question for those who might have done this. > > I want to take my sails in for cleaning and repair. I?ve never removed my > sails, so this is going to be all new for me. I have the CDI II furler, so > my plan is to lower and remove my 175 genie with the mast up. I then plan > to > remove the boom, lower the mast, disconnect the shouds and disconnect the > CDI furler from the mast. > I have no clue how heavy the mast with the furled main is. Can one person > lift the mast with the furled main or will I need help? > > My boat is on a mooring. There are some logistical problems with pulling my > boat out of the water....the water depth is too shallow at my club?s ramp. > Would I be crazy to attempt this with the boat tied to my club?s dock or > pulled up on the shore? > > Thanks for any advice on how to best accomplish this. > > George Morgan > S/V Knotty Lady 1986 > Lake Waccamaw NC > > > > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > From gmorgan.flier at gmail.com Tue Mar 16 09:04:11 2021 From: gmorgan.flier at gmail.com (Gmorganflier) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2021 06:04:11 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Lifting the Mast off of the Boat In-Reply-To: References: <1615887333262-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <1615899851601-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Thanks guys for your advice. I do have the mast hoist system. It does sound like I need help and I need to have the boat on the trailer. George -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From mtroy at atlanticbb.net Tue Mar 16 09:41:50 2021 From: mtroy at atlanticbb.net (Mary Lou Troy) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2021 09:41:50 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Lifting the Mast off of the Boat In-Reply-To: <1615899851601-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1615887333262-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1615899851601-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <92daedba-9475-e05e-a2f3-6d383d753928@atlanticbb.net> If you have the mast hoist system (the crane, the cradle and the instructions!) you can do it with the boat in the water tied to a dock. We did that several times when we owned our R22. It is helpful if you have a second person. You will need help to transfer the mast to the dock or a nearby flat area to remove the sail. The only time we ever removed the sail, we had the mast supported on sawhorses as the equally long furling tube with the sail attached has to slide all the way out the base of the mast. Good luck Mary Lou ex-Rhodes 22 now Rosborough RF-246,? Tara Rock Hall, MD On 3/16/2021 9:04 AM, Gmorganflier wrote: > Thanks guys for your advice. > > I do have the mast hoist system. It does sound like I need help and I need > to have the boat on the trailer. > > George > > > > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ -- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus From gstewart8 at cogeco.ca Tue Mar 16 09:45:09 2021 From: gstewart8 at cogeco.ca (Graham Stewart) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2021 09:45:09 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Lifting the Mast off of the Boat In-Reply-To: References: <1615887333262-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <003f01d71a6a$95ead650$c1c082f0$@ca> I have a traditional old standard rig where you raise the mast from the bow using the boom as a gin pole and stays to control the mast. Realistically it is a two person job. My wife and I do it without difficulty. Because I keep the boat at my dock at my house I store the mast on my property each winter and then raise and lower it at the dock with the boat in the water. The boat rocking can make the process a bit more difficult but not a big problem if you pick your moment when there are no boat wakes or waves to contend with. There are a lot of lines that can and will snag during the process. Untangling these snags when the mast is partly raised and while the boat is in the water really requires two people - one to stabilize the mast and the other to undo the snag. Graham Stewart Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 Kingston Ontario -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf Of Stephen Staum Sent: Tuesday, March 16, 2021 7:30 AM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Lifting the Mast off of the Boat George, It takes 2 people to raise and lower the mast manually and I would not consider trying it on the water. I did it for several years that way (always on the trailer). When my son went off to college I only had 1 friend willing to help with that. You raise or lower from the bow and when stepping off the cabin top to the bow level you have little control if the mast starts to go sideways. I would recommend buying Stan's mast raising system as I did. It allows 1 person to do it safely and can be done on the water. You don't need to remove the boom to get the mainsail out. The whole assembly slides out of the mast and then you can set it down on a dock and unroll & remove the main sail. Not sure how you do that on the water. Good luck! *Thanks and Stay Well,* *Stephen Staum* *s/v Carol Lee 2* *Needham, MA* On Tue, Mar 16, 2021 at 5:35 AM Gmorganflier wrote: > Question for those who might have done this. > > I want to take my sails in for cleaning and repair. I?ve never removed my > sails, so this is going to be all new for me. I have the CDI II furler, so > my plan is to lower and remove my 175 genie with the mast up. I then plan > to > remove the boom, lower the mast, disconnect the shouds and disconnect the > CDI furler from the mast. > I have no clue how heavy the mast with the furled main is. Can one person > lift the mast with the furled main or will I need help? > > My boat is on a mooring. There are some logistical problems with pulling my > boat out of the water....the water depth is too shallow at my club?s ramp. > Would I be crazy to attempt this with the boat tied to my club?s dock or > pulled up on the shore? > > Thanks for any advice on how to best accomplish this. > > George Morgan > S/V Knotty Lady 1986 > Lake Waccamaw NC > > > > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > From joedempsey at hughes.net Tue Mar 16 10:57:51 2021 From: joedempsey at hughes.net (Joe Dempsey) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2021 07:57:51 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Lifting the Mast off of the Boat In-Reply-To: <1615887333262-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1615887333262-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <1615906671287-0.post@n5.nabble.com> George, it's going to take two people. I removed my mast while in the slip. Best to be bow forward so you can bring it over the pulpit. I used the cradle to support the mast aft. I have a photo showing the mast lowered just before bringing it off the boat. I have more photos of the mast once its off, showing the process of disassembling the IMF. I can't remember if we left the genoa onboard or brought it off with the mast. I think we left it onboard but you'll have to remove the bale at the masthead in the middle of the process which will add a third body to the job. ----- Joe Dempsey s/v Respite Rhodes 22 1989/2005 Deltaville,VA -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From goldsmith.cf at gmail.com Tue Mar 16 11:04:32 2021 From: goldsmith.cf at gmail.com (Frank Goldsmith) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2021 11:04:32 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Lifting the Mast off of the Boat In-Reply-To: <1615906671287-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1615887333262-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1615906671287-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <3765A8BA-E888-4882-977E-A466BA16E664@gmail.com> I?m late to chime in but agree with all that?s been said. In fact, I dismantled my mast and headsail furlers this past weekend to measure for new sails, with the boat securely on its trailer and the sails spread out on the ground below, and I can?t imagine doing it alone and on the water. (One could certainly lower the mast alone with the mast hoist system, but still, wrangling all the rigging by oneself to remove the sails would be tough.) Frank Goldsmith 1985/2000 Rhodes 22 Lake Keowee, SC > On Mar 16, 2021, at 10:57 AM, Joe Dempsey wrote: > > George, it's going to take two people. I removed my mast while in the slip. > Best to be bow forward so you can bring it over the pulpit. I used the > cradle to support the mast aft. I have a photo showing the mast lowered > just before bringing it off the boat. > > > > I have more photos of the mast once its off, showing the process of > disassembling the IMF. > > I can't remember if we left the genoa onboard or brought it off with the > mast. I think we left it onboard but you'll have to remove the bale at the > masthead in the middle of the process which will add a third body to the > job. > > > > ----- > Joe Dempsey > s/v Respite > Rhodes 22 1989/2005 > Deltaville,VA > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From tom.vanheule at intrinsicprograms.com Tue Mar 16 12:53:26 2021 From: tom.vanheule at intrinsicprograms.com (Tom Van Heule) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2021 11:53:26 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Lifting the Mast off of the Boat In-Reply-To: <3765A8BA-E888-4882-977E-A466BA16E664@gmail.com> References: <1615887333262-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1615906671287-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <3765A8BA-E888-4882-977E-A466BA16E664@gmail.com> Message-ID: Yeah frank. I will need a few more years experience to be doing this in the water... Joe, our s/v OCTOPIAN has a mount slider for the bast base on the pulpit. I think you can see it here. On Tue, Mar 16, 2021, 10:04 AM Frank Goldsmith wrote: > I?m late to chime in but agree with all that?s been said. In fact, I > dismantled my mast and headsail furlers this past weekend to measure for > new sails, with the boat securely on its trailer and the sails spread out > on the ground below, and I can?t imagine doing it alone and on the water. > (One could certainly lower the mast alone with the mast hoist system, but > still, wrangling all the rigging by oneself to remove the sails would be > tough.) > > Frank Goldsmith > 1985/2000 Rhodes 22 > Lake Keowee, SC > > > > On Mar 16, 2021, at 10:57 AM, Joe Dempsey wrote: > > > > George, it's going to take two people. I removed my mast while in the > slip. > > Best to be bow forward so you can bring it over the pulpit. I used the > > cradle to support the mast aft. I have a photo showing the mast lowered > > just before bringing it off the boat. > > > > > > > > I have more photos of the mast once its off, showing the process of > > disassembling the IMF. > > > > I can't remember if we left the genoa onboard or brought it off with the > > mast. I think we left it onboard but you'll have to remove the bale at > the > > masthead in the middle of the process which will add a third body to the > > job. > > > > > > > > ----- > > Joe Dempsey > > s/v Respite > > Rhodes 22 1989/2005 > > Deltaville,VA > > -- > > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: IMG_20200730_165133894_HDR.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 4648624 bytes Desc: not available URL: From mike at traildesign.com Tue Mar 16 14:19:21 2021 From: mike at traildesign.com (Mike Riter) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2021 14:19:21 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Lifting the Mast off of the Boat In-Reply-To: <1615887333262-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1615887333262-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: George, I was on a sailing adventure with our R22 in Key West a couple years ago and had a problem with ripped sail. I made the decision to motor back to the marina that we had originally launched from and try to repair it myself before continuing on (we were attempting to sail to Dry Tortuga). Like Joe mentioned, I pulled into the slip bow forward and retrieved the mast crutch and GB raising system from the truck. I lowered the mast by myself with no problems and while I could lift the mast and furler myself, it was too awkward to maneuver off the boat alone. My better half guided one end while I carried it onto the dock. Disassembly, repair and reassembly took place right there in front of the boat. Thankfully, the repair wasn't that hard and we were able to get back underway the next morning. I tied the jib furler to the main and carried both off at the same time. I'm going to estimate the mast (in mast furler) and jib together weighed approximately 120- 140#. That's a very general guess. You mentioned you're taking your furler down separately so that should make the rig weigh a bit less. The boat community being what it is, I had no shortage of those willing to lend a hand at the dock. You should be fine at the dock and not having to pull your boat out. Mike SV Emma B On Tue, Mar 16, 2021 at 5:35 AM Gmorganflier wrote: > Question for those who might have done this. > > I want to take my sails in for cleaning and repair. I?ve never removed my > sails, so this is going to be all new for me. I have the CDI II furler, so > my plan is to lower and remove my 175 genie with the mast up. I then plan > to > remove the boom, lower the mast, disconnect the shouds and disconnect the > CDI furler from the mast. > I have no clue how heavy the mast with the furled main is. Can one person > lift the mast with the furled main or will I need help? > > My boat is on a mooring. There are some logistical problems with pulling my > boat out of the water....the water depth is too shallow at my club?s ramp. > Would I be crazy to attempt this with the boat tied to my club?s dock or > pulled up on the shore? > > Thanks for any advice on how to best accomplish this. > > George Morgan > S/V Knotty Lady 1986 > Lake Waccamaw NC > > > > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > From Colealexander at hotmail.com Tue Mar 16 20:10:41 2021 From: Colealexander at hotmail.com (S/V Lark) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2021 17:10:41 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Happy 95th! In-Reply-To: <1615499671395-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1615499671395-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <1615939841851-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Happy birthday and best wishes. Alex ----- Alex Cole S/V Lark -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From Colealexander at hotmail.com Tue Mar 16 20:20:54 2021 From: Colealexander at hotmail.com (S/V Lark) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2021 17:20:54 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Bottom paint Message-ID: <1615940454217-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Does anybody have a practical tip for painting the part resting on the bunks? I?m too lazy to build a proper scaffold. Alex ----- Alex Cole S/V Lark -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From john_carlson at mac.com Tue Mar 16 20:42:48 2021 From: john_carlson at mac.com (john_carlson at mac.com) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2021 19:42:48 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Bottom paint In-Reply-To: <1615940454217-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1615940454217-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: I jacked the boat up off of the trailer and removed the bunks (see pics). It worked pretty well. -- John Carlson S/V Lillipelli (2004/2012) Lake Waco On Mar 16, 2021, 7:21 PM -0500, S/V Lark , wrote: > Does anybody have a practical tip for painting the part resting on the bunks? > I?m too lazy to build a proper scaffold. > > Alex > > > > ----- > Alex Cole > S/V Lark > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: IMG_0412.jpeg Type: image/jpeg Size: 4170643 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: IMG_0453.jpeg Type: image/jpeg Size: 2148211 bytes Desc: not available URL: From Colealexander at hotmail.com Tue Mar 16 20:55:05 2021 From: Colealexander at hotmail.com (S/V Lark) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2021 17:55:05 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Bottom paint In-Reply-To: References: <1615940454217-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <1615942505387-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Perfect. I was worried about Jack placement and hull damage. Gray looks good. Alex ----- Alex Cole S/V Lark -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From cjlowe at sssnet.com Tue Mar 16 21:17:49 2021 From: cjlowe at sssnet.com (cjlowe at sssnet.com) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2021 21:17:49 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Lifting the Mast off of the Boat In-Reply-To: References: <1615887333262-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <59702.24.140.30.102.1615943869.squirrel@quickpop.sssnet.com> I drop and raise my mast bundle every year, at my dock, on the water. That being said, I dock at a well protected marina, little wind and no waves. If where you dock has similar conditions you should be fine. The first thing is to see if you can maneuver 26 feet of mast from boat to the dock where you have 55 feet of space that is level to hold the mast and remove the furling tube. When working above water, anything dropped is usually forfeited. Your idea of removing the boom and head sail is a good one, that extra weight and bulk is not your friend. Think about replacing the inhaul line while you have it apart. Count the amount of wraps of inhaul line on the furling tube and note the direction of the wrap. Seek the proper lubricant for the bearings and coat them well. Now is a good time to replace lights( anchor, spreader, deck,etc. Check the spreader bushings and bolt and windvane. I'm sure I forgot a few things, maybe others will chime in. Jerry Lowe S/V Country Rhodes '86 George, > I was on a sailing adventure with our R22 in Key West a couple years ago > and had a problem with ripped sail. I made the decision to motor back to > the marina that we had originally launched from and try to repair it > myself > before continuing on (we were attempting to sail to Dry Tortuga). Like Joe > mentioned, I pulled into the slip bow forward and retrieved the mast > crutch > and GB raising system from the truck. I lowered the mast by myself with no > problems and while I could lift the mast and furler myself, it was too > awkward to maneuver off the boat alone. My better half guided one end > while I carried it onto the dock. Disassembly, repair and reassembly took > place right there in front of the boat. Thankfully, the repair wasn't that > hard and we were able to get back underway the next morning. > > I tied the jib furler to the main and carried both off at the same time. > I'm going to estimate the mast (in mast furler) and jib together weighed > approximately 120- 140#. That's a very general guess. You mentioned you're > taking your furler down separately so that should make the rig weigh a bit > less. > > The boat community being what it is, I had no shortage of those willing to > lend a hand at the dock. You should be fine at the dock and not having to > pull your boat out. > > > Mike > SV Emma B > > > > > On Tue, Mar 16, 2021 at 5:35 AM Gmorganflier > wrote: > >> Question for those who might have done this. >> >> I want to take my sails in for cleaning and repair. I???ve never removed >> my >> sails, so this is going to be all new for me. I have the CDI II furler, >> so >> my plan is to lower and remove my 175 genie with the mast up. I then >> plan >> to >> remove the boom, lower the mast, disconnect the shouds and disconnect >> the >> CDI furler from the mast. >> I have no clue how heavy the mast with the furled main is. Can one >> person >> lift the mast with the furled main or will I need help? >> >> My boat is on a mooring. There are some logistical problems with pulling >> my >> boat out of the water....the water depth is too shallow at my club???s >> ramp. >> Would I be crazy to attempt this with the boat tied to my club???s dock >> or >> pulled up on the shore? >> >> Thanks for any advice on how to best accomplish this. >> >> George Morgan >> S/V Knotty Lady 1986 >> Lake Waccamaw NC >> >> >> >> -- >> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ >> > From goldsmith.cf at gmail.com Tue Mar 16 21:26:18 2021 From: goldsmith.cf at gmail.com (Frank Goldsmith) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2021 21:26:18 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Lifting the Mast off of the Boat In-Reply-To: <59702.24.140.30.102.1615943869.squirrel@quickpop.sssnet.com> References: <1615887333262-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <59702.24.140.30.102.1615943869.squirrel@quickpop.sssnet.com> Message-ID: Jerry?s post reminds me of a question I meant to ask the group: is there a proper way of lubricating the black round parts that rotate inside the furling tubes (sorry, I don?t know the nomenclature ? bearings?) so that the furling operation is smoother and doesn?t bind, especially the mainsail? I thought that while mine is apart, I?d see what I could do about that. Or maybe lubrication is not called for, perhaps just wiping them clean. Thanks, Frank Goldsmith s/v Mary Bess (1985/2000 Rhodes 22) Lake Keowee, SC > On Mar 16, 2021, at 9:17 PM, cjlowe at sssnet.com wrote: > > I drop and raise my mast bundle every year, at my dock, on the water. That > being said, I dock at a well protected marina, little wind and no waves. > If where you dock has similar conditions you should be fine. The first > thing is to see if you can maneuver 26 feet of mast from boat to the dock > where you have 55 feet of space that is level to hold the mast and remove > the furling tube. When working above water, anything dropped is usually > forfeited. Your idea of removing the boom and head sail is a good one, > that extra weight and bulk is not your friend. Think about replacing the > inhaul line while you have it apart. Count the amount of wraps of inhaul > line on the furling tube and note the direction of the wrap. Seek the > proper lubricant for the bearings and coat them well. Now is a good time > to replace lights( anchor, spreader, deck,etc. Check the spreader bushings > and bolt and windvane. I'm sure I forgot a few things, maybe others will > chime in. > > > Jerry Lowe > S/V Country Rhodes '86 > > > George, >> I was on a sailing adventure with our R22 in Key West a couple years ago >> and had a problem with ripped sail. I made the decision to motor back to >> the marina that we had originally launched from and try to repair it >> myself >> before continuing on (we were attempting to sail to Dry Tortuga). Like Joe >> mentioned, I pulled into the slip bow forward and retrieved the mast >> crutch >> and GB raising system from the truck. I lowered the mast by myself with no >> problems and while I could lift the mast and furler myself, it was too >> awkward to maneuver off the boat alone. My better half guided one end >> while I carried it onto the dock. Disassembly, repair and reassembly took >> place right there in front of the boat. Thankfully, the repair wasn't that >> hard and we were able to get back underway the next morning. >> >> I tied the jib furler to the main and carried both off at the same time. >> I'm going to estimate the mast (in mast furler) and jib together weighed >> approximately 120- 140#. That's a very general guess. You mentioned you're >> taking your furler down separately so that should make the rig weigh a bit >> less. >> >> The boat community being what it is, I had no shortage of those willing to >> lend a hand at the dock. You should be fine at the dock and not having to >> pull your boat out. >> >> >> Mike >> SV Emma B >> >> >> >> >> On Tue, Mar 16, 2021 at 5:35 AM Gmorganflier >> wrote: >> >>> Question for those who might have done this. >>> >>> I want to take my sails in for cleaning and repair. I???ve never removed >>> my >>> sails, so this is going to be all new for me. I have the CDI II furler, >>> so >>> my plan is to lower and remove my 175 genie with the mast up. I then >>> plan >>> to >>> remove the boom, lower the mast, disconnect the shouds and disconnect >>> the >>> CDI furler from the mast. >>> I have no clue how heavy the mast with the furled main is. Can one >>> person >>> lift the mast with the furled main or will I need help? >>> >>> My boat is on a mooring. There are some logistical problems with pulling >>> my >>> boat out of the water....the water depth is too shallow at my club???s >>> ramp. >>> Would I be crazy to attempt this with the boat tied to my club???s dock >>> or >>> pulled up on the shore? >>> >>> Thanks for any advice on how to best accomplish this. >>> >>> George Morgan >>> S/V Knotty Lady 1986 >>> Lake Waccamaw NC >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From gmorgan.flier at gmail.com Tue Mar 16 21:44:26 2021 From: gmorgan.flier at gmail.com (Gmorganflier) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2021 18:44:26 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Lifting the Mast off of the Boat In-Reply-To: <59702.24.140.30.102.1615943869.squirrel@quickpop.sssnet.com> References: <1615887333262-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <59702.24.140.30.102.1615943869.squirrel@quickpop.sssnet.com> Message-ID: <1615945466292-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Thanks to everyone who responded. A friend from my club is going to help me take the genie down at the dock tomorrow. Next week a R22 owner and friend is going to help me trailer the boat at a deeper public ramp about a mile from my shallow club ramp. We plan to lower the mast and either pull the furled main out with the mast on the boat or move to mast to saw horses and remove the sail there. George Morgan S/V Knotty Lady Lake Waccamaw NC -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From goldsmith.cf at gmail.com Tue Mar 16 21:50:56 2021 From: goldsmith.cf at gmail.com (Frank Goldsmith) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2021 21:50:56 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Lifting the Mast off of the Boat In-Reply-To: <1615945466292-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1615887333262-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <59702.24.140.30.102.1615943869.squirrel@quickpop.sssnet.com> <1615945466292-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <19924E8E-D366-4687-A707-59F32FBC0A00@gmail.com> Well, keep a good lookout. I don?t know about Lake Waccamaw itself, but I?ve seen some mighty big snakes on the Waccamaw River while canoeing. A few years ago one fell from a tree into a canoe as we were putting in just below the lake, causing a bit of commotion. I know, most are just Northern Water Snakes, but they look a lot like Cottonmouths unless you get closer than you should to make a diagnosis. Frank > On Mar 16, 2021, at 9:44 PM, Gmorganflier wrote: > > Thanks to everyone who responded. > > A friend from my club is going to help me take the genie down at the dock > tomorrow. > > Next week a R22 owner and friend is going to help me trailer the boat at a > deeper public ramp about a mile from my shallow club ramp. We plan to lower > the mast and either pull the furled main out with the mast on the boat or > move to mast to saw horses and remove the sail there. > > George Morgan > S/V Knotty Lady > Lake Waccamaw NC > > > > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From roger_pihlaja at msn.com Tue Mar 16 22:02:52 2021 From: roger_pihlaja at msn.com (ROGER PIHLAJA) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2021 02:02:52 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Bottom paint In-Reply-To: <1615942505387-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1615940454217-0.post@n5.nabble.com> , <1615942505387-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: Alex, I use a couple of hydraulic bottle jacks with 4?x4? wooden blocks on the keel to lift the boat a couple of inches. As the boat rises off the bunks, wedge pieces of wood in between the hull and the bunks. This will prevent the hull from rolling to port or starboard. When the hull is a couple inches off the bunks, install wooden blocks or jack stands to back up the jacks. Then cover the bunks with plastic sheet and paint the hull. After the paint dries, you will have to slightly jack up up the hull again. Then, move the wooden blocks so you can paint the hull under them. It can be done in one afternoon. Just be careful to not place any part of your body under the boat when it not secured by wooden blocks or jack stands. Roger Pihlaja S/V Dynamic Equilibrium Sent from my iPhone > On Mar 16, 2021, at 8:55 PM, S/V Lark wrote: > > ?Perfect. I was worried about Jack placement and hull damage. Gray looks > good. > > Alex > > > > ----- > Alex Cole > S/V Lark > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From mm.bizlist1 at gmail.com Tue Mar 16 22:06:43 2021 From: mm.bizlist1 at gmail.com (Michael McKay) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2021 22:06:43 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Lifting the Mast off of the Boat In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <493F32C7-3D25-46C0-BD0B-2D22A6AEFB41@gmail.com> This thread is very timely for me since my mast is down right now and my mainsail is at the sailmaker being repaired. It developed a rip near but not at the seam with the Sunbrella?more about that later. However, I would like to hear your recommendations about maintenance of the IMF while it?s accessible. What lubricant would you use? McLube SailKote or something else? Michael McKay (630) 209-2054 (m) Sent from my iPhone > On Mar 16, 2021, at 9:26 PM, Frank Goldsmith wrote: > > ?Jerry?s post reminds me of a question I meant to ask the group: is there a proper way of lubricating the black round parts that rotate inside the furling tubes (sorry, I don?t know the nomenclature ? bearings?) so that the furling operation is smoother and doesn?t bind, especially the mainsail? I thought that while mine is apart, I?d see what I could do about that. Or maybe lubrication is not called for, perhaps just wiping them clean. > > Thanks, > > Frank Goldsmith > s/v Mary Bess (1985/2000 Rhodes 22) > Lake Keowee, SC > > >> On Mar 16, 2021, at 9:17 PM, cjlowe at sssnet.com wrote: >> >> I drop and raise my mast bundle every year, at my dock, on the water. That >> being said, I dock at a well protected marina, little wind and no waves. >> If where you dock has similar conditions you should be fine. The first >> thing is to see if you can maneuver 26 feet of mast from boat to the dock >> where you have 55 feet of space that is level to hold the mast and remove >> the furling tube. When working above water, anything dropped is usually >> forfeited. Your idea of removing the boom and head sail is a good one, >> that extra weight and bulk is not your friend. Think about replacing the >> inhaul line while you have it apart. Count the amount of wraps of inhaul >> line on the furling tube and note the direction of the wrap. Seek the >> proper lubricant for the bearings and coat them well. Now is a good time >> to replace lights( anchor, spreader, deck,etc. Check the spreader bushings >> and bolt and windvane. I'm sure I forgot a few things, maybe others will >> chime in. >> >> >> Jerry Lowe >> S/V Country Rhodes '86 >> >> >> George, >>> I was on a sailing adventure with our R22 in Key West a couple years ago >>> and had a problem with ripped sail. I made the decision to motor back to >>> the marina that we had originally launched from and try to repair it >>> myself >>> before continuing on (we were attempting to sail to Dry Tortuga). Like Joe >>> mentioned, I pulled into the slip bow forward and retrieved the mast >>> crutch >>> and GB raising system from the truck. I lowered the mast by myself with no >>> problems and while I could lift the mast and furler myself, it was too >>> awkward to maneuver off the boat alone. My better half guided one end >>> while I carried it onto the dock. Disassembly, repair and reassembly took >>> place right there in front of the boat. Thankfully, the repair wasn't that >>> hard and we were able to get back underway the next morning. >>> >>> I tied the jib furler to the main and carried both off at the same time. >>> I'm going to estimate the mast (in mast furler) and jib together weighed >>> approximately 120- 140#. That's a very general guess. You mentioned you're >>> taking your furler down separately so that should make the rig weigh a bit >>> less. >>> >>> The boat community being what it is, I had no shortage of those willing to >>> lend a hand at the dock. You should be fine at the dock and not having to >>> pull your boat out. >>> >>> >>> Mike >>> SV Emma B >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> On Tue, Mar 16, 2021 at 5:35 AM Gmorganflier >>> wrote: >>> >>>> Question for those who might have done this. >>>> >>>> I want to take my sails in for cleaning and repair. I???ve never removed >>>> my >>>> sails, so this is going to be all new for me. I have the CDI II furler, >>>> so >>>> my plan is to lower and remove my 175 genie with the mast up. I then >>>> plan >>>> to >>>> remove the boom, lower the mast, disconnect the shouds and disconnect >>>> the >>>> CDI furler from the mast. >>>> I have no clue how heavy the mast with the furled main is. Can one >>>> person >>>> lift the mast with the furled main or will I need help? >>>> >>>> My boat is on a mooring. There are some logistical problems with pulling >>>> my >>>> boat out of the water....the water depth is too shallow at my club???s >>>> ramp. >>>> Would I be crazy to attempt this with the boat tied to my club???s dock >>>> or >>>> pulled up on the shore? >>>> >>>> Thanks for any advice on how to best accomplish this. >>>> >>>> George Morgan >>>> S/V Knotty Lady 1986 >>>> Lake Waccamaw NC >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From gmorgan.flier at gmail.com Tue Mar 16 22:08:11 2021 From: gmorgan.flier at gmail.com (Gmorganflier) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2021 19:08:11 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Bottom paint In-Reply-To: <1615940454217-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1615940454217-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <1615946891565-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Alex, Last summer I bought 4 small bottle jacks from Harbor Freight for less than $100. Using some concrete blocks and wood pieces I had, in a series of small steps I jacked and blocked the trailer and the boat up so the trailer tires were maybe 6? off the ground. I then blocked the boat up and lowered the trailer in a series of steps back to the ground. It was tedious because my bottle jacks were small and there was much jacking and blocking in small increments, but it worked and I felt I put no strain on the boat because it was supported by the bunks while being raised. I friend loaned me two boat stands which I used on the stern, but I helped another friend use my jacks and blocks to do the same thing to his Catalina 22. We just used blocks on his stern using wedges to angle the support boards properly. A couple of photos attached. George Morgan S/V Knotty Lady -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From gmorgan.flier at gmail.com Tue Mar 16 22:19:49 2021 From: gmorgan.flier at gmail.com (Gmorganflier) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2021 19:19:49 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Lifting the Mast off of the Boat In-Reply-To: <19924E8E-D366-4687-A707-59F32FBC0A00@gmail.com> References: <1615887333262-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <59702.24.140.30.102.1615943869.squirrel@quickpop.sssnet.com> <1615945466292-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <19924E8E-D366-4687-A707-59F32FBC0A00@gmail.com> Message-ID: <1615947589206-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Frank, Thanks for the warning. I actually use a drysuit year round to wade out to my boat?s mooring which is in about 5? of water. I just find it easier then dealing with a dinghy. In the summer I see lots of alligators in the swamp just across the road from the lake. Now I have to worry about the snakes to! My dry suit is black with red highlights. The other club members have nicknamed me Captain Nemo as they see me emerge from the lake. George Morgan -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From tavares0947 at gmail.com Tue Mar 16 22:40:50 2021 From: tavares0947 at gmail.com (Todd Tavares) Date: Tue, 16 Mar 2021 22:40:50 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Bottom paint In-Reply-To: <1615946891565-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1615940454217-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1615946891565-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: So no one is going to explain the trailer tilting and blocking method...or jacking up the entire trailer and blocking method? Both require lumber, cinderblocks or other cribbing materials. Boat stands ate ideal. The latter is self explanatory. Jack the entire trailer itself about 6" with 3 bottle or scissor jacks. Block up tight against the hull. Lower the entire trailer back down. The other method works if you only have a single jack. Lower the trailer tongue as low as possible. Block up the stern just aft of the bunks. Raise the tongue back to full height and block up under the forward center of the hull and lower the trailer back level. This creates just enough room for a skinny roller. There is also another method that involves an engine hoist to the bow and stern eyes but is more redneck risky and not advisable. Of course, owning or renting a few boat stands from the local boat yard is much easier and safer than cinderblocks etc. Todd T. tavares0947 at gmail.com On Tue, Mar 16, 2021, 10:08 PM Gmorganflier wrote: > Alex, > > Last summer I bought 4 small bottle jacks from Harbor Freight for less than > $100. Using some concrete blocks and wood pieces I had, in a series of > small > steps I jacked and blocked the trailer and the boat up so the trailer tires > were maybe 6? off the ground. I then blocked the boat up and lowered the > trailer in a series of steps back to the ground. It was tedious because my > bottle jacks were small and there was much jacking and blocking in small > increments, but it worked and I felt I put no strain on the boat because it > was supported by the bunks while being raised. > I friend loaned me two boat stands which I used on the stern, but I helped > another friend use my jacks and blocks to do the same thing to his Catalina > 22. We just used blocks on his stern using wedges to angle the support > boards properly. > > A couple of photos attached. > > George Morgan > S/V Knotty Lady > > < > http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/file/t909/5826018D-DE0C-4488-985E-14EA9EFD4E2B.jpeg> > > > < > http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/file/t909/6DE5DC54-BB75-4563-9480-B492BDDEF837.jpeg> > > > > > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > From snstaum at gmail.com Wed Mar 17 07:06:24 2021 From: snstaum at gmail.com (Stephen Staum) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2021 07:06:24 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Bottom paint In-Reply-To: <1615940454217-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1615940454217-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: Alex, I am from the kiss school (Keep It Simple Stupid). I used a power boat stand to lift the stern so 2/3 of the boat is off the bunks. Paint what you can reach, let it dry overnight then move the stand to the bow and lift it so you can reach the rest of the area in the forward section of bunks. Easy to do and a lot less work than lifting and jacking described elsewhere. Also, can be done safely in the soft dirt of my yard in spring. *Thanks and Stay Well,* *Stephen Staum* *s/v Carol Lee 2* *Needham, MA* On Tue, Mar 16, 2021 at 8:20 PM S/V Lark wrote: > Does anybody have a practical tip for painting the part resting on the > bunks? > I?m too lazy to build a proper scaffold. > > Alex > > > > ----- > Alex Cole > S/V Lark > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > From lvjkuhn at gmail.com Wed Mar 17 11:34:56 2021 From: lvjkuhn at gmail.com (Lee) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2021 08:34:56 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Speed App Message-ID: <1615995296755-0.post@n5.nabble.com> There are lots of sailboat speed apps out there, but the attached free app shows your speed in decimals in numbers large enough that you can see from the far end of your galley's counter top while you're at the helm. The app is called BoatSpeed. It also shows your heading but Stan is busy installing a compass on my "new" boat so I feel like a real sailor. Lee 1999 Rhodes22 Claytor Lake, VA IMG_3786.jpg -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From gstewart8 at cogeco.ca Wed Mar 17 12:54:16 2021 From: gstewart8 at cogeco.ca (Graham Stewart) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2021 12:54:16 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Speed App In-Reply-To: <1615995296755-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1615995296755-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <007301d71b4e$2c06ef50$8414cdf0$@ca> I agree with Lee that BoatSpeed is a great app - especially if you are using it on a cell phone. Another app that I like that is virtually free (10/year for the premium version) is SailFreeGps. It is a very complete navigation program but with large and very legible characters. It is best used with a tablet. All the other navigation programs that I have tried are expensive given the miniscule amount of "navigation" I actually engage in. I use both apps. Graham Stewart gstewart8 at cogeco.ca Graham Stewart Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 Kingston Ontario -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf Of Lee Sent: Wednesday, March 17, 2021 11:35 AM To: rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Speed App There are lots of sailboat speed apps out there, but the attached free app shows your speed in decimals in numbers large enough that you can see from the far end of your galley's counter top while you're at the helm. The app is called BoatSpeed. It also shows your heading but Stan is busy installing a compass on my "new" boat so I feel like a real sailor. Lee 1999 Rhodes22 Claytor Lake, VA IMG_3786.jpg -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From joedempsey at hughes.net Wed Mar 17 14:44:15 2021 From: joedempsey at hughes.net (Joe Dempsey) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2021 11:44:15 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Flag placement? In-Reply-To: References: <1615734034049-40671.post@n5.nabble.com> <1615734034049-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <1616006655115-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Ric, you are correct, the burgee (assuming you are referring to a club burgee and more specifically our soon to arrive Rhodes 22 burgee) should only be flown in domestic waters. You are incorrect that it should be only flown from a halyard from the starboard spreader. In fact the preferred location is either from a small staff on the bow for a mastless or single mast vessel or from the "truck" or masthead of a single masted vessel. As an alternate location, it MAY be flown from the starboard spreader if there is no pigstick or block at the masthead. I vehemently disagree with your decree that the national ensign is "always" flown from the aft shroud. In fact, the Ensign should never be flown from any shroud save the Backstay. "The national ensign [US Stars and Stripes or Canadian "Red Maple Leaf"] should be displayed at the peak of the gaff, i.e., the outer end of the spar extending aft from the mast of your boat?if you boat has a gaff. If it does not, fly it from the flagstaff at your boat's stern. If your boat has an overhanging boom or an outboard motor, your flagstaff may be offset to starboard (preferably) from your boat's centerline. Marconi-rigged sailboats [of which the Rhodes 22 is one] may fly the ensign from the leech of the aftermost sail (or from the back stay), approximately 2/3 the distance up its length. This puts it in about the same position it would occupy if the boat were gaff-rigged." https://www.usps.org/f_stuff/etiquett.html ----- Joe Dempsey s/v Respite Rhodes 22 1989/2005 Deltaville,VA -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From ric at stottarchitecture.com Wed Mar 17 15:06:45 2021 From: ric at stottarchitecture.com (Richard Stott) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2021 15:06:45 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Flag placement? In-Reply-To: <1616006655115-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1615734034049-40671.post@n5.nabble.com> <1615734034049-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616006655115-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <44E0B45E-BF55-4E79-AA25-BFB14BC0DD30@stottarchitecture.com> Joe Thanks for all that good flag protocol. You might have been directing your corrections to Rick lang or - - - But I have never claimed to know proper yacht flag standards. I do what I?ve been doing since I was kid and never looked up the official rules for flags. However, I happen to agree with everything you said. I fly my ensign from a staff on a bracket on the stern rail, just to starboard of center. I fly burgees from the masthead at rest and on the starboard flag halyard when sailing. I use the main halyard or topping lift for the masthead, either works, depending on boom location etc. Was St. Patric a sailor? Ric Richard Stott, AIA, LEED AP www.stottarchitecture.com Office 631-283-1777 Cell 516-965-3164 > On Mar 17, 2021, at 2:44 PM, Joe Dempsey wrote: > > Ric, you are correct, the burgee (assuming you are referring to a club burgee > and more specifically our soon to arrive Rhodes 22 burgee) should only be > flown in domestic waters. You are incorrect that it should be only flown > from a halyard from the starboard spreader. In fact the preferred location > is either from a small staff on the bow for a mastless or single mast vessel > or from the "truck" or masthead of a single masted vessel. As an alternate > location, it MAY be flown from the starboard spreader if there is no > pigstick or block at the masthead. > > I vehemently disagree with your decree that the national ensign is "always" > flown from the aft shroud. In fact, the Ensign should never be flown from > any shroud save the Backstay. "The national ensign [US Stars and Stripes or > Canadian "Red Maple Leaf"] should be displayed at the peak of the gaff, > i.e., the outer end of the spar extending aft from the mast of your boat?if > you boat has a gaff. If it does not, fly it from the flagstaff at your > boat's stern. If your boat has an overhanging boom or an outboard motor, > your flagstaff may be offset to starboard (preferably) from your boat's > centerline. Marconi-rigged sailboats [of which the Rhodes 22 is one] may fly > the ensign from the leech of the aftermost sail (or from the back stay), > approximately 2/3 the distance up its length. This puts it in about the same > position it would occupy if the boat were gaff-rigged." > https://www.usps.org/f_stuff/etiquett.html > > > > > > > > > ----- > Joe Dempsey > s/v Respite > Rhodes 22 1989/2005 > Deltaville,VA > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From ric at stottarchitecture.com Wed Mar 17 15:26:39 2021 From: ric at stottarchitecture.com (Richard Stott) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2021 15:26:39 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Speed App In-Reply-To: <007301d71b4e$2c06ef50$8414cdf0$@ca> References: <1615995296755-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <007301d71b4e$2c06ef50$8414cdf0$@ca> Message-ID: <93E507CD-179A-44D3-8CD2-7C1873BEC135@stottarchitecture.com> I have been using iNAVX on an iPad Full navigation and a great program for free or upgrade to pro for cheap. Split screen options with Chart and Stats I use it on my Rhodes and race with it on the C&C 35, all over the NE Ric Dadventure Hampton Bays NY Richard Stott, AIA, LEED AP www.stottarchitecture.com Office 631-283-1777 Cell 516-965-3164 > On Mar 17, 2021, at 12:54 PM, Graham Stewart wrote: > > > I agree with Lee that BoatSpeed is a great app - especially if you are using > it on a cell phone. > > Another app that I like that is virtually free (10/year for the premium > version) is SailFreeGps. It is a very complete navigation program but with > large and very legible characters. It is best used with a tablet. All the > other navigation programs that I have tried are expensive given the > miniscule amount of "navigation" I actually engage in. > > I use both apps. > > Graham Stewart > gstewart8 at cogeco.ca > > > > > Graham Stewart > Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 > Kingston Ontario > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf Of > Lee > Sent: Wednesday, March 17, 2021 11:35 AM > To: rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org > Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Speed App > > There are lots of sailboat speed apps out there, but the attached free app > shows your speed in decimals in numbers large enough that you can see from > the far end of your galley's counter top while you're at the helm. The app > is called BoatSpeed. > > It also shows your heading but Stan is busy installing a compass on my "new" > boat so I feel like a real sailor. > > Lee > 1999 Rhodes22 > Claytor Lake, VA > > IMG_3786.jpg > > > > > > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > From sloopblueheron at gmail.com Wed Mar 17 15:41:54 2021 From: sloopblueheron at gmail.com (Rick Lange) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2021 15:41:54 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Flag placement? In-Reply-To: <1616006655115-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1615734034049-40671.post@n5.nabble.com> <1615734034049-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616006655115-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: Joe, Port aft shroud = port backstay. Regards, Rick Lange On Wed, Mar 17, 2021 at 2:44 PM Joe Dempsey wrote: > Ric, you are correct, the burgee (assuming you are referring to a club > burgee > and more specifically our soon to arrive Rhodes 22 burgee) should only be > flown in domestic waters. You are incorrect that it should be only flown > from a halyard from the starboard spreader. In fact the preferred location > is either from a small staff on the bow for a mastless or single mast > vessel > or from the "truck" or masthead of a single masted vessel. As an alternate > location, it MAY be flown from the starboard spreader if there is no > pigstick or block at the masthead. > > I vehemently disagree with your decree that the national ensign is "always" > flown from the aft shroud. In fact, the Ensign should never be flown from > any shroud save the Backstay. "The national ensign [US Stars and Stripes or > Canadian "Red Maple Leaf"] should be displayed at the peak of the gaff, > i.e., the outer end of the spar extending aft from the mast of your boat?if > you boat has a gaff. If it does not, fly it from the flagstaff at your > boat's stern. If your boat has an overhanging boom or an outboard motor, > your flagstaff may be offset to starboard (preferably) from your boat's > centerline. Marconi-rigged sailboats [of which the Rhodes 22 is one] may > fly > the ensign from the leech of the aftermost sail (or from the back stay), > approximately 2/3 the distance up its length. This puts it in about the > same > position it would occupy if the boat were gaff-rigged." > https://www.usps.org/f_stuff/etiquett.html > > > > > > > > > ----- > Joe Dempsey > s/v Respite > Rhodes 22 1989/2005 > Deltaville,VA > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > From joedempsey at hughes.net Wed Mar 17 16:11:25 2021 From: joedempsey at hughes.net (Joe Dempsey) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2021 13:11:25 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Flag placement? In-Reply-To: References: <1615734034049-40671.post@n5.nabble.com> <1615734034049-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616006655115-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <1616011885343-0.post@n5.nabble.com> We're into semantics here, but Port aft shroud does not = backstay. Port aft shroud is just that, aft of the shroud on the port side of the boat. But if the backstay is your definition, then placement of your ensign would be appropriate 2/3 of the distance up to the peak. Happy St. Paddy's Day! Cheers, ----- Joe Dempsey s/v Respite Rhodes 22 1989/2005 Deltaville,VA -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From allynb at adsne.com Wed Mar 17 18:00:28 2021 From: allynb at adsne.com (Allyn Baskerville) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2021 22:00:28 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Wallowed Out Holes in Rudder/Head Assy; Flex with Rudder Message-ID: The rudder on my Rhodes is hollow - are all the rudders hollow? We just had single digit temps for a week, and I didn't think of the possibility of the rudder being partially filled with water, which it was, but there doesn't appear to be any freeze damage. However, the holes the bolt that holds the rudder to the rudder head assembly are wallowed out on both the rudder and the head assembly. It's been like this since I purchased the boat, but I'd like to fix it as it's gradually getting worse. Are there supposed to be bushings where the rudder attaches to the head assembly? I generally feel a lot of flex in the tiller and/or rudder on windier days, which is a pretty high percentage here in Oklahoma. I can't tell exactly where the flex is coming from, but I think it's the rudder head assembly, which is made of plastic. Has anyone else noticed flex? If so, can you please describe what you did to fix the issue? Thanks - Allyn From Colealexander at hotmail.com Wed Mar 17 19:24:12 2021 From: Colealexander at hotmail.com (S/V Lark) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2021 16:24:12 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Bottom paint In-Reply-To: <1615940454217-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1615940454217-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <1616023452586-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Thanks everybody for the advice. I'd considered pivoting the trailer with the tongue jack, and will probably combine that with some cradles from 6x6 fence post scrap, cinder blocks, jack stands, etc. After that log went through the keel front of COUNTRY RHODES I became a bit paranoid about where to put pressure when lifting. Stan seems to have forgotten to include those jacking point marks like cars use. ----- Alex Cole S/V Lark -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From tavares0947 at gmail.com Wed Mar 17 19:49:04 2021 From: tavares0947 at gmail.com (Todd Tavares) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2021 19:49:04 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Bottom paint In-Reply-To: <1616023452586-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1615940454217-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616023452586-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: Alex, if you do the trailer tongue method, adding an extra step will get more clearance. Once the tongue lift tops out, I place a jack stand under the trailer frame and lower the trailer to rest on it. Then I retract the the tongue jack/wheel back up and put a cinderblocks under the wheel. That way I can get the tongue much higher before blocking the hull. I hope that makes sense. Todd T. tavares0947 at gmail.com On Wed, Mar 17, 2021, 7:24 PM S/V Lark wrote: > Thanks everybody for the advice. I'd considered pivoting the trailer > with > the tongue jack, and will probably combine that with some cradles from 6x6 > fence post scrap, cinder blocks, jack stands, etc. After that log went > through the keel front of COUNTRY RHODES I became a bit paranoid about > where > to put pressure when lifting. Stan seems to have forgotten to include > those jacking point marks like cars use. > > < > http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/file/t691/aircraft_lifting_point.jpg> > > > > > ----- > Alex Cole > S/V Lark > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > From Colealexander at hotmail.com Wed Mar 17 20:17:08 2021 From: Colealexander at hotmail.com (S/V Lark) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2021 17:17:08 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Wallowed Out Holes in Rudder/Head Assy; Flex with Rudder In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1616026628585-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Most manufacturers use a foam core and fiberglass clam shells for rudders and centerboards. Freezing and delaminating is always a concern if water gets inside. My rudder seems very stiff and heavy, I think Stan put a LOT of glass in there (2002). I cracked my head a couple years ago. (The rudder head as well). Stan was busy getting ready for a boat show and I didn't want to miss the rest of my season. I did a temporary repair with more 'starboard'. Its the same HDPE milk jugs are made out of, treated for UV resistance and intended for various marine uses. It will crack. On the advice of another sailing forum I later upgraded the head with new sheets out of G10 / FR 4. This is the stuff computer circuit boards are made out of. I reused the pintles and raising mechanism from Stan's design. Its too expensive for production boats and there is a mask requirement for cutting, so I understand why Stan doesn't use it. It cuts with a common scroll saw, an advantage over aluminum alloy. Also my local machine shop was scared to mess with a boat part and declined the job. I think I used 0.25" . A materials engineer claimed it would be much stiffer and stronger at half the thickness of starboard, but I didn't buy the good stuff. I notice now that if you check the 'strong' box on the granger website the product I used disappears. Being ignorant I bought the cheapest but was disappointed. Gorilla glue laminated a second layer to the bottom six inches of the cheeks, which stiffened it up considerably. Spray-painting with autozone bumper paint provides UV protection. Apparently its a common Australian sailors' solution. ----- Alex Cole S/V Lark -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From gstewart8 at cogeco.ca Wed Mar 17 20:50:04 2021 From: gstewart8 at cogeco.ca (Graham Stewart) Date: Wed, 17 Mar 2021 20:50:04 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Wallowed Out Holes in Rudder/Head Assy; Flex with Rudder In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <00a101d71b90$a40d13c0$ec273b40$@ca> I don't know if the rudder is supposed to be hollow but it doesn't seem like a good idea to me. When I rebuilt my rudder after the bottom edge was damaged by groundings I found many voids in it. I was able to locate then by tapping on the rudder with a screwdriver handel. I drilled two holes into each void and injected epoxy into one hole until it came out the adjacent hole. I can't tell if I got them all but certainly I was able to inject a lot of epoxy. Of greater concern to me was when I discovered the the keel housing also contained large voids. If anyone is interested in how I located and addressed the voids I have placed a description in the archive about 5 years ago but will repost if it can't be found. Suffice to say that I injected and poured over three gallons of polyester resin into the keel and can't be sure I got all the voids filled. My boat is a 1976 and the keel had been damaged with a large crack all around the base so it might not be typical but those with older Rhodes might want to consider the possibilities. Graham Stewart Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 Kingston Ontario -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf Of Allyn Baskerville Sent: Wednesday, March 17, 2021 6:00 PM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Wallowed Out Holes in Rudder/Head Assy; Flex with Rudder The rudder on my Rhodes is hollow - are all the rudders hollow? We just had single digit temps for a week, and I didn't think of the possibility of the rudder being partially filled with water, which it was, but there doesn't appear to be any freeze damage. However, the holes the bolt that holds the rudder to the rudder head assembly are wallowed out on both the rudder and the head assembly. It's been like this since I purchased the boat, but I'd like to fix it as it's gradually getting worse. Are there supposed to be bushings where the rudder attaches to the head assembly? I generally feel a lot of flex in the tiller and/or rudder on windier days, which is a pretty high percentage here in Oklahoma. I can't tell exactly where the flex is coming from, but I think it's the rudder head assembly, which is made of plastic. Has anyone else noticed flex? If so, can you please describe what you did to fix the issue? Thanks - Allyn From snstaum at gmail.com Thu Mar 18 11:22:53 2021 From: snstaum at gmail.com (Stephen Staum) Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2021 11:22:53 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes 22 For Sale Message-ID: Dear All, We are moving up so are putting our beloved Carol Lee 2 up for sale. It is an '83 updated with an IMF main. Custom sails by Doyle (main- 7 seasons & 130 genoa- 2 seasons). All standing rigging replaced with IMF conversion. Also added: single burner propane stove, 14 watt solar panel, 2nd battery with battery switch, 12 v Chiller (hard wired to its own breaker) & upgraded 4 fuse power panel to 6 breaker panel. Sale includes cockpit cushions, mast raising system & 9.9 HP Johnson Sailmaster outboard. *Thanks and Stay Well,* *Stephen Staum* *s/v Carol Lee 2* *Needham, MA* -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: IMG_0650(1).jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 111547 bytes Desc: not available URL: From retiredtoby at gmail.com Thu Mar 18 11:28:22 2021 From: retiredtoby at gmail.com (Cary Tolbert) Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2021 11:28:22 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes 22 For Sale In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Well Stephen, how much and location? On Thu, Mar 18, 2021, 11:23 AM Stephen Staum wrote: > Dear All, > > We are moving up so are putting our beloved Carol Lee 2 up for sale. It is > an '83 updated with an IMF main. Custom sails by Doyle (main- 7 seasons & > 130 genoa- 2 seasons). All standing rigging replaced with IMF conversion. > Also added: single burner propane stove, 14 watt solar panel, 2nd battery > with battery switch, 12 v Chiller (hard wired to its own breaker) & > upgraded 4 fuse power panel to 6 breaker panel. Sale includes cockpit > cushions, mast raising system & 9.9 HP Johnson Sailmaster outboard. > > > *Thanks and Stay Well,* > > *Stephen Staum* > *s/v Carol Lee 2* > > *Needham, MA* > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: IMG_0650(1).jpg > Type: image/jpeg > Size: 111547 bytes > Desc: not available > URL: < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210318/f21dd438/attachment.jpg > > > From snstaum at gmail.com Thu Mar 18 11:29:21 2021 From: snstaum at gmail.com (Stephen Staum) Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2021 11:29:21 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes 22 For Sale w Contact Info In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Dear All, We are moving up so are putting our beloved Carol Lee 2 up for sale. It is an '83 updated with an IMF main. Custom sails by Doyle (main- 7 seasons & 130 genoa- 2 seasons). All standing rigging replaced with IMF conversion. Also added: single burner propane stove, 14 watt solar panel, 2nd battery with battery switch, 12 v Chiller (hard wired to its own breaker) & upgraded 4 fuse power panel to 6 breaker panel. Sale includes cockpit cushions, mast raising system & 9.9 HP Johnson Sailmaster outboard. Bimini not included. Asking $7,000 minus a $500 discount for 'da list. Contact me directly if interested: snstaum at gmail.com *Thanks and Stay Well,* *Stephen Staum* *s/v Carol Lee 2* *Needham, MA* -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: IMG_0650(1).jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 111547 bytes Desc: not available URL: From snstaum at gmail.com Thu Mar 18 11:31:44 2021 From: snstaum at gmail.com (Stephen Staum) Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2021 11:31:44 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes 22 For Sale In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Boat is now located at the Hingham Shipyard Marina in Hingham, MA but will be moved to my home in Needham, MA in a couple of weeks to make room for it's replacement. Asking is $7,000 for the general public reduced to $6,500 for 'da list. *Thanks and Stay Well,* *Stephen Staum* On Thu, Mar 18, 2021 at 11:28 AM Cary Tolbert wrote: > Well Stephen, how much and location? > > On Thu, Mar 18, 2021, 11:23 AM Stephen Staum wrote: > > > Dear All, > > > > We are moving up so are putting our beloved Carol Lee 2 up for sale. It > is > > an '83 updated with an IMF main. Custom sails by Doyle (main- 7 seasons > & > > 130 genoa- 2 seasons). All standing rigging replaced with IMF > conversion. > > Also added: single burner propane stove, 14 watt solar panel, 2nd > battery > > with battery switch, 12 v Chiller (hard wired to its own breaker) & > > upgraded 4 fuse power panel to 6 breaker panel. Sale includes cockpit > > cushions, mast raising system & 9.9 HP Johnson Sailmaster outboard. > > > > > > *Thanks and Stay Well,* > > > > *Stephen Staum* > > *s/v Carol Lee 2* > > > > *Needham, MA* > > -------------- next part -------------- > > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > > Name: IMG_0650(1).jpg > > Type: image/jpeg > > Size: 111547 bytes > > Desc: not available > > URL: < > > > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210318/f21dd438/attachment.jpg > > > > > > From rlowe at vt.edu Thu Mar 18 12:13:27 2021 From: rlowe at vt.edu (Lowe, Rob) Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2021 16:13:27 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Wallowed Out Holes in Rudder/Head Assy; Flex with Rudder In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Allyn, The rudder on my boat is hollow also. I believe they are made that way. I did have to drain some water out and I used epoxy to seal the edges. Not sure about you rudder to head assembly. Can you take some photos that we can look at? - rob ________________________________ From: Rhodes22-list on behalf of Allyn Baskerville Sent: Wednesday, March 17, 2021 6:00 PM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Wallowed Out Holes in Rudder/Head Assy; Flex with Rudder The rudder on my Rhodes is hollow - are all the rudders hollow? We just had single digit temps for a week, and I didn't think of the possibility of the rudder being partially filled with water, which it was, but there doesn't appear to be any freeze damage. However, the holes the bolt that holds the rudder to the rudder head assembly are wallowed out on both the rudder and the head assembly. It's been like this since I purchased the boat, but I'd like to fix it as it's gradually getting worse. Are there supposed to be bushings where the rudder attaches to the head assembly? I generally feel a lot of flex in the tiller and/or rudder on windier days, which is a pretty high percentage here in Oklahoma. I can't tell exactly where the flex is coming from, but I think it's the rudder head assembly, which is made of plastic. Has anyone else noticed flex? If so, can you please describe what you did to fix the issue? Thanks - Allyn From tom.vanheule at intrinsicprograms.com Thu Mar 18 13:28:21 2021 From: tom.vanheule at intrinsicprograms.com (Tom Van Heule) Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2021 12:28:21 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Wallowed Out Holes in Rudder/Head Assy; Flex with Rudder In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: If my rudder is hollow it still weighs +45lbs....it does NOT sound hollow. 2011 boat. On Thu, Mar 18, 2021, 11:13 AM Lowe, Rob wrote: > Allyn, > The rudder on my boat is hollow also. I believe they are made that way. > I did have to drain some water out and I used epoxy to seal the edges. Not > sure about you rudder to head assembly. Can you take some photos that we > can look at? - rob > > ________________________________ > From: Rhodes22-list on behalf of > Allyn Baskerville > Sent: Wednesday, March 17, 2021 6:00 PM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Wallowed Out Holes in Rudder/Head Assy; Flex with > Rudder > > The rudder on my Rhodes is hollow - are all the rudders hollow? We just > had single digit temps for a week, and I didn't think of the possibility of > the rudder being partially filled with water, which it was, but there > doesn't appear to be any freeze damage. However, the holes the bolt that > holds the rudder to the rudder head assembly are wallowed out on both the > rudder and the head assembly. It's been like this since I purchased the > boat, but I'd like to fix it as it's gradually getting worse. Are there > supposed to be bushings where the rudder attaches to the head assembly? > > I generally feel a lot of flex in the tiller and/or rudder on windier > days, which is a pretty high percentage here in Oklahoma. I can't tell > exactly where the flex is coming from, but I think it's the rudder head > assembly, which is made of plastic. Has anyone else noticed flex? If so, > can you please describe what you did to fix the issue? > > Thanks - Allyn > From mweisner at ebsmed.com Thu Mar 18 14:26:43 2021 From: mweisner at ebsmed.com (Michael D. Weisner) Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2021 14:26:43 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Bottom paint In-Reply-To: <1616023452586-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1615940454217-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616023452586-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <005101d71c24$3fa30e50$bee92af0$@ebsmed.com> I have safely lifted my R22 off the trailer for bottom painting for the nearly 40 years. I generally leave the trailer under the boat while painting, for my own comfort, but she has never fallen. The lifting system requires 2 12'-4x4s (for the "A-frame", use 16' 4x4s if you can find them), 3 8'-4x4s (for the "Pi-frame"), 2 8'-2x6s, 2 chain hooks w/3' of 3/8" chain to engage the lifting eyes at the stern or a 20' tow chain w/hooks (2-ton test), 1 chain coupler (or bolt) , 5 10"-1/2" carriage bolt/nut/washer, 4 5"-1/2" carriage bolt/nut/washer, 1 2-ton and 1 1-ton "come along" winches. The entire assembly can be purchased from Harbor Freight / Home Depot for about $200. Basically, the 2 12' (or 16') 4x4s are assembled into an "A-frame", bolted through by a 10" bolt at the top and placed around the front of the trailer, through or over the bow pulpit. A cut length of the chain is looped around the top of the "A", at the vertex, connected to the 2-T winch which is attached to the bow lift eye (protect the bow and rub rail from damage). Add bracing from the A-frame to the ground to stabilize. The 3 8' 4x4s are assembled into a "Pi shape" with cross bracing using the 2x6 materials. The ends of the tow chain are hooked into the stern lift eyes and attached to the cross piece of the "Pi." To lift the stern, I lower the front of the trailer to the ground and shorten the stern chains to just connect. Then, when I jack up the front of the trailer, the stern "lifts" off the trailer. Next, I lift the bow with the come along and the A-frame and presto she is off the trailer. The second come along is to stabilize the stern "Pi frame" so that the lifting frame does not shift forward (parallelogram) and settle the boat back into the trailer, since the frames are erected slightly tilted towards the boat (don't ask why). I prefer to sand and paint whatever is not obscured by the bunks before lifting, for safety. Once she is up off the trailer, I sand and paint the area that contacts the bunks without being under the boat. Once dry, I lower the boat and finish anything that requires touchup. I have used the same setup to lift the boat and reposition the trailer to achieve the correct tongue weight as well. Pictures (from the 80s) below. Mike s/v Wind Lass ('91) Nissequogue River, NY I'd rather be sailing :~) -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of S/V Lark Sent: Wednesday, March 17, 2021 7:24 PM To: rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Bottom paint Thanks everybody for the advice. I'd considered pivoting the trailer with the tongue jack, and will probably combine that with some cradles from 6x6 fence post scrap, cinder blocks, jack stands, etc. After that log went through the keel front of COUNTRY RHODES I became a bit paranoid about where to put pressure when lifting. Stan seems to have forgotten to include those jacking point marks like cars use. ----- Alex Cole S/V Lark -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Front View.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 216280 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Rear - motor.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 197932 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Rear Frame - Stern Eye Attachment.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 146994 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Rear View.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 155140 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Front Frame.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 180392 bytes Desc: not available URL: From dsempek64506 at yahoo.com Thu Mar 18 14:36:40 2021 From: dsempek64506 at yahoo.com (david sempek) Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2021 18:36:40 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Bottom paint In-Reply-To: <005101d71c24$3fa30e50$bee92af0$@ebsmed.com> References: <1615940454217-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616023452586-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <005101d71c24$3fa30e50$bee92af0$@ebsmed.com> Message-ID: <210962690.339433.1616092600212@mail.yahoo.com> Great stuff to know. I also have a dirt and gravel driveway and was wondering how i was going to lift the boat for painting.?? Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android On Thu, Mar 18, 2021 at 1:26 PM, Michael D. Weisner wrote: I have safely lifted my R22 off the trailer for bottom painting for the nearly 40 years.? I generally leave the trailer under the boat while painting, for my own comfort, but she has never fallen. The lifting system requires 2 12'-4x4s (for the "A-frame", use 16' 4x4s if you can find them), 3 8'-4x4s (for the "Pi-frame"), 2 8'-2x6s, 2 chain hooks w/3' of 3/8" chain to engage the lifting eyes at the stern or a 20' tow chain w/hooks (2-ton test), 1 chain coupler (or bolt) , 5 10"-1/2" carriage bolt/nut/washer, 4 5"-1/2" carriage bolt/nut/washer, 1 2-ton and 1 1-ton "come along" winches.? The entire assembly can be purchased from Harbor Freight / Home Depot for about $200. Basically, the 2 12' (or 16') 4x4s are assembled into an "A-frame", bolted through by a 10" bolt at the top and placed around the front of the trailer, through or over the bow pulpit.? A cut length of the chain is looped around the top of the "A", at the vertex, connected to the 2-T winch which is attached to the bow lift eye (protect the bow and rub rail from damage). Add bracing from the A-frame to the ground to stabilize. The 3 8' 4x4s are assembled into a "Pi shape" with cross bracing using the 2x6 materials.? The ends of the tow chain are hooked into the stern lift eyes and attached to the cross piece of the "Pi." To lift the stern, I lower the front of the trailer to the ground and shorten the stern chains to just connect.? Then, when I jack up the front of the trailer, the stern "lifts" off the trailer.? Next, I lift the bow with the come along and the A-frame and presto she is off the trailer.? The second come along is to stabilize the stern "Pi frame" so that the lifting frame does not shift forward (parallelogram) and settle the boat back into the trailer, since the frames are erected slightly tilted towards the boat (don't ask why). I prefer to sand and paint whatever is not obscured by the bunks before lifting, for safety. Once she is up off the trailer, I sand and paint the area that contacts the bunks without being under the boat. Once dry, I lower the boat and finish anything that requires touchup. I have used the same setup to lift the boat and reposition the trailer to achieve the correct tongue weight as well. Pictures (from the 80s) below. Mike s/v Wind Lass ('91) Nissequogue River, NY I'd rather be sailing :~) -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of S/V Lark Sent: Wednesday, March 17, 2021 7:24 PM To: rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Bottom paint Thanks everybody for the advice.? ? I'd considered pivoting the trailer with the tongue jack, and will probably combine that with some cradles from 6x6 fence post scrap, cinder blocks, jack stands, etc.? After that log went through the keel front of COUNTRY RHODES I became a bit paranoid about where to put pressure when lifting.? Stan seems to have forgotten to include those jacking point marks like cars use.? ? ----- Alex Cole S/V Lark -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Front View.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 216280 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Rear - motor.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 197932 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Rear Frame - Stern Eye Attachment.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 146994 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Rear View.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 155140 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Front Frame.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 180392 bytes Desc: not available URL: From gstewart8 at cogeco.ca Thu Mar 18 15:00:42 2021 From: gstewart8 at cogeco.ca (Graham Stewart) Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2021 15:00:42 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Wallowed Out Holes in Rudder/Head Assy; Flex with Rudder In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <00c401d71c28$ffc13280$ff439780$@ca> To be clear, my rudder was not hollow by design - as far as I could tell. It had large voids throughout. I also rebuilt my centerboard and it had no voids that I could tell. Both the rudder and the centerboard for boats of that vintage used the same mold and are identical except that the centerboard has added weight. The keel had voids but was not likely built to be hollow. In that case I discovered that the large cracks under the keel had been allowing loose material, including flakes of metal probably intended to be ballast, to leak out. My understanding is that the ballast used in the R22 varied a lot over the years. As mentioned before, I was able to put 3 gallons of resin in the keel. That is a lot of space in my books. I am in Canada and we have very cold winters. Water in any of these places could do a lot of damage. The fact that I have had no visible damage from freezing in the years since I did this work suggests that there is very little water in these pieces now. Graham Stewart Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 Kingston Ontario -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf Of Tom Van Heule Sent: Thursday, March 18, 2021 1:28 PM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Wallowed Out Holes in Rudder/Head Assy; Flex with Rudder If my rudder is hollow it still weighs +45lbs....it does NOT sound hollow. 2011 boat. On Thu, Mar 18, 2021, 11:13 AM Lowe, Rob wrote: > Allyn, > The rudder on my boat is hollow also. I believe they are made that way. > I did have to drain some water out and I used epoxy to seal the edges. Not > sure about you rudder to head assembly. Can you take some photos that we > can look at? - rob > > ________________________________ > From: Rhodes22-list on behalf of > Allyn Baskerville > Sent: Wednesday, March 17, 2021 6:00 PM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Wallowed Out Holes in Rudder/Head Assy; Flex with > Rudder > > The rudder on my Rhodes is hollow - are all the rudders hollow? We just > had single digit temps for a week, and I didn't think of the possibility of > the rudder being partially filled with water, which it was, but there > doesn't appear to be any freeze damage. However, the holes the bolt that > holds the rudder to the rudder head assembly are wallowed out on both the > rudder and the head assembly. It's been like this since I purchased the > boat, but I'd like to fix it as it's gradually getting worse. Are there > supposed to be bushings where the rudder attaches to the head assembly? > > I generally feel a lot of flex in the tiller and/or rudder on windier > days, which is a pretty high percentage here in Oklahoma. I can't tell > exactly where the flex is coming from, but I think it's the rudder head > assembly, which is made of plastic. Has anyone else noticed flex? If so, > can you please describe what you did to fix the issue? > > Thanks - Allyn > From mweisner at ebsmed.com Thu Mar 18 15:01:15 2021 From: mweisner at ebsmed.com (Michael D. Weisner) Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2021 15:01:15 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Bottom paint In-Reply-To: <210962690.339433.1616092600212@mail.yahoo.com> References: <1615940454217-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616023452586-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <005101d71c24$3fa30e50$bee92af0$@ebsmed.com> <210962690.339433.1616092600212@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <005b01d71c29$139c0d70$3ad42850$@ebsmed.com> The lifting frame can be easily erected almost anywhere. It is a great tool to have when you need to elevate the Rhodes 22 for maintenance, emergency repairs or, as in the next paragraph, to load a Rhodes 22 onto a trailer without a forklift or crane. Back in 2006, Hank bought a Rhodes 22 that had been sitting on jack stands and some blocks in an old boatyard in Port Jefferson, NY, not too far from my home. Nobody from the yard was available when Hank came with a trailer to pick up his new toy so I showed him how to lift her. A quick trip to a nearby Home Depot to build an A-frame and winch the bow up high enough to slip the trailer under her and she was on her way to her new home! Original posting: http://www.rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/2006-September/034144.html Mike s/v Wind Lass ('91) Nissequogue River, NY I?d rather be sailing :~) -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of david sempek via Rhodes22-list Sent: Thursday, March 18, 2021 2:37 PM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Bottom paint Great stuff to know. I also have a dirt and gravel driveway and was wondering how i was going to lift the boat for painting. Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android On Thu, Mar 18, 2021 at 1:26 PM, Michael D. Weisner wrote: I have safely lifted my R22 off the trailer for bottom painting for the nearly 40 years. I generally leave the trailer under the boat while painting, for my own comfort, but she has never fallen. The lifting system requires 2 12'-4x4s (for the "A-frame", use 16' 4x4s if you can find them), 3 8'-4x4s (for the "Pi-frame"), 2 8'-2x6s, 2 chain hooks w/3' of 3/8" chain to engage the lifting eyes at the stern or a 20' tow chain w/hooks (2-ton test), 1 chain coupler (or bolt) , 5 10"-1/2" carriage bolt/nut/washer, 4 5"-1/2" carriage bolt/nut/washer, 1 2-ton and 1 1-ton "come along" winches. The entire assembly can be purchased from Harbor Freight / Home Depot for about $200. Basically, the 2 12' (or 16') 4x4s are assembled into an "A-frame", bolted through by a 10" bolt at the top and placed around the front of the trailer, through or over the bow pulpit. A cut length of the chain is looped around the top of the "A", at the vertex, connected to the 2-T winch which is attached to the bow lift eye (protect the bow and rub rail from damage). Add bracing from the A-frame to the ground to stabilize. The 3 8' 4x4s are assembled into a "Pi shape" with cross bracing using the 2x6 materials. The ends of the tow chain are hooked into the stern lift eyes and attached to the cross piece of the "Pi." To lift the stern, I lower the front of the trailer to the ground and shorten the stern chains to just connect. Then, when I jack up the front of the trailer, the stern "lifts" off the trailer. Next, I lift the bow with the come along and the A-frame and presto she is off the trailer. The second come along is to stabilize the stern "Pi frame" so that the lifting frame does not shift forward (parallelogram) and settle the boat back into the trailer, since the frames are erected slightly tilted towards the boat (don't ask why). I prefer to sand and paint whatever is not obscured by the bunks before lifting, for safety. Once she is up off the trailer, I sand and paint the area that contacts the bunks without being under the boat. Once dry, I lower the boat and finish anything that requires touchup. I have used the same setup to lift the boat and reposition the trailer to achieve the correct tongue weight as well. Pictures (from the 80s) below. Mike s/v Wind Lass ('91) Nissequogue River, NY I'd rather be sailing :~) -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of S/V Lark Sent: Wednesday, March 17, 2021 7:24 PM To: rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Bottom paint Thanks everybody for the advice. I'd considered pivoting the trailer with the tongue jack, and will probably combine that with some cradles from 6x6 fence post scrap, cinder blocks, jack stands, etc. After that log went through the keel front of COUNTRY RHODES I became a bit paranoid about where to put pressure when lifting. Stan seems to have forgotten to include those jacking point marks like cars use. ----- Alex Cole S/V Lark -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Front View.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 216280 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Rear - motor.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 197932 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Rear Frame - Stern Eye Attachment.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 146994 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Rear View.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 155140 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Front Frame.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 180392 bytes Desc: not available URL: From mweisner at ebsmed.com Thu Mar 18 15:04:26 2021 From: mweisner at ebsmed.com (Michael D. Weisner) Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2021 15:04:26 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Wallowed Out Holes in Rudder/Head Assy; Flex with Rudder In-Reply-To: <00c401d71c28$ffc13280$ff439780$@ca> References: <00c401d71c28$ffc13280$ff439780$@ca> Message-ID: <005e01d71c29$84ce2be0$8e6a83a0$@ebsmed.com> Oh, so rejected centerboards became rudders ... hmmm ... Mike s/v Wind Lass ('91) Nissequogue River, NY I?d rather be sailing :~) -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of Graham Stewart Sent: Thursday, March 18, 2021 3:01 PM To: 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Wallowed Out Holes in Rudder/Head Assy; Flex with Rudder To be clear, my rudder was not hollow by design - as far as I could tell. It had large voids throughout. I also rebuilt my centerboard and it had no voids that I could tell. Both the rudder and the centerboard for boats of that vintage used the same mold and are identical except that the centerboard has added weight. The keel had voids but was not likely built to be hollow. In that case I discovered that the large cracks under the keel had been allowing loose material, including flakes of metal probably intended to be ballast, to leak out. My understanding is that the ballast used in the R22 varied a lot over the years. As mentioned before, I was able to put 3 gallons of resin in the keel. That is a lot of space in my books. I am in Canada and we have very cold winters. Water in any of these places could do a lot of damage. The fact that I have had no visible damage from freezing in the years since I did this work suggests that there is very little water in these pieces now. Graham Stewart Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 Kingston Ontario From tavares0947 at gmail.com Thu Mar 18 15:10:05 2021 From: tavares0947 at gmail.com (Todd Tavares) Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2021 15:10:05 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Bottom paint In-Reply-To: <005b01d71c29$139c0d70$3ad42850$@ebsmed.com> References: <1615940454217-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616023452586-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <005101d71c24$3fa30e50$bee92af0$@ebsmed.com> <210962690.339433.1616092600212@mail.yahoo.com> <005b01d71c29$139c0d70$3ad42850$@ebsmed.com> Message-ID: I have a set of 4 boat stands. If anyone near the mid Chesapeake (Annapolis side) needs to borrow them to paint their bottoms, let me know... Todd T. tavares0947 at gmail.com On Thu, Mar 18, 2021, 3:01 PM Michael D. Weisner wrote: > The lifting frame can be easily erected almost anywhere. It is a great > tool to have when you need to elevate the Rhodes 22 for maintenance, > emergency repairs or, as in the next paragraph, to load a Rhodes 22 onto a > trailer without a forklift or crane. > > Back in 2006, Hank bought a Rhodes 22 that had been sitting on jack stands > and some blocks in an old boatyard in Port Jefferson, NY, not too far from > my home. Nobody from the yard was available when Hank came with a trailer > to pick up his new toy so I showed him how to lift her. A quick trip to a > nearby Home Depot to build an A-frame and winch the bow up high enough to > slip the trailer under her and she was on her way to her new home! > > Original posting: > http://www.rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/2006-September/034144.html > > Mike > s/v Wind Lass ('91) > Nissequogue River, NY > I?d rather be sailing :~) > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of > david sempek via Rhodes22-list > Sent: Thursday, March 18, 2021 2:37 PM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Bottom paint > > Great stuff to know. I also have a dirt and gravel driveway and was > wondering how i was going to lift the boat for painting. > > Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android > > On Thu, Mar 18, 2021 at 1:26 PM, Michael D. Weisner > wrote: I have safely lifted my R22 off the trailer for bottom painting > for the > nearly 40 years. I generally leave the trailer under the boat while > painting, for my own comfort, but she has never fallen. > > The lifting system requires 2 12'-4x4s (for the "A-frame", use 16' 4x4s if > you can find them), 3 8'-4x4s (for the "Pi-frame"), 2 8'-2x6s, 2 chain > hooks w/3' of 3/8" chain to engage the lifting eyes at the stern or a 20' > tow chain w/hooks (2-ton test), 1 chain coupler (or bolt) , 5 10"-1/2" > carriage bolt/nut/washer, 4 5"-1/2" carriage bolt/nut/washer, 1 2-ton and 1 > 1-ton "come along" winches. The entire assembly can be purchased from > Harbor Freight / Home Depot for about $200. > > Basically, the 2 12' (or 16') 4x4s are assembled into an "A-frame", bolted > through by a 10" bolt at the top and placed around the front of the > trailer, through or over the bow pulpit. A cut length of the chain is > looped around the top of the "A", at the vertex, connected to the 2-T winch > which is attached to the bow lift eye (protect the bow and rub rail from > damage). Add bracing from the A-frame to the ground to stabilize. > > The 3 8' 4x4s are assembled into a "Pi shape" with cross bracing using the > 2x6 materials. The ends of the tow chain are hooked into the stern lift > eyes and attached to the cross piece of the "Pi." > > To lift the stern, I lower the front of the trailer to the ground and > shorten the stern chains to just connect. Then, when I jack up the front > of the trailer, the stern "lifts" off the trailer. Next, I lift the bow > with the come along and the A-frame and presto she is off the trailer. The > second come along is to stabilize the stern "Pi frame" so that the lifting > frame does not shift forward (parallelogram) and settle the boat back into > the trailer, since the frames are erected slightly tilted towards the boat > (don't ask why). > > I prefer to sand and paint whatever is not obscured by the bunks before > lifting, for safety. Once she is up off the trailer, I sand and paint the > area that contacts the bunks without being under the boat. Once dry, I > lower the boat and finish anything that requires touchup. > > I have used the same setup to lift the boat and reposition the trailer to > achieve the correct tongue weight as well. > > Pictures (from the 80s) below. > > Mike > s/v Wind Lass ('91) > Nissequogue River, NY > I'd rather be sailing :~) > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of S/V > Lark > Sent: Wednesday, March 17, 2021 7:24 PM > To: rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Bottom paint > > Thanks everybody for the advice. I'd considered pivoting the trailer > with the tongue jack, and will probably combine that with some cradles from > 6x6 fence post scrap, cinder blocks, jack stands, etc. After that log went > through the keel front of COUNTRY RHODES I became a bit paranoid about > where to put pressure when lifting. Stan seems to have forgotten to > include those jacking point marks like cars use. > > < > http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/file/t691/aircraft_lifting_point.jpg > > > > > > ----- > Alex Cole > S/V Lark > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: Front View.jpg > Type: image/jpeg > Size: 216280 bytes > Desc: not available > URL: < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210318/c625a29e/attachment.jpg > > > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: Rear - motor.jpg > Type: image/jpeg > Size: 197932 bytes > Desc: not available > URL: < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210318/c625a29e/attachment-0001.jpg > > > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: Rear Frame - Stern Eye Attachment.jpg > Type: image/jpeg > Size: 146994 bytes > Desc: not available > URL: < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210318/c625a29e/attachment-0002.jpg > > > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: Rear View.jpg > Type: image/jpeg > Size: 155140 bytes > Desc: not available > URL: < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210318/c625a29e/attachment-0003.jpg > > > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: Front Frame.jpg > Type: image/jpeg > Size: 180392 bytes > Desc: not available > URL: < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210318/c625a29e/attachment-0004.jpg > > > > > From kensimolo at gmail.com Thu Mar 18 16:45:58 2021 From: kensimolo at gmail.com (Ken Simolo) Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2021 13:45:58 -0700 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Bottom Paint In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: A tractor and a gantry crane (or two of either one) makes easy work of painting the bottom. We always leave the trailer underneath just in case. Ken From joedempsey at hughes.net Thu Mar 18 16:54:09 2021 From: joedempsey at hughes.net (Joe Dempsey) Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2021 13:54:09 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Lifting the Mast off of the Boat In-Reply-To: <1615887333262-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1615887333262-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <1616100849514-0.post@n5.nabble.com> George, As promised here are some photos that may help you in removing your main from the IMF mast. When removing furling sheet, be sure to remember the orientation for replacing it so it winds in the right direction. Hope this helps. ----- Joe Dempsey s/v Respite Rhodes 22 1989/2005 Deltaville,VA -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From dwbrad at gmail.com Thu Mar 18 17:08:59 2021 From: dwbrad at gmail.com (David Bradley) Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2021 17:08:59 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Lifting the Mast off of the Boat In-Reply-To: <1616100849514-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1615887333262-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616100849514-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <59DAE244-B67A-485C-9E88-E8A0A2078263@gmail.com> I replaced my IMF main last year and one thing Stan had mentioned to take particular care of was to attach the bottom of the luff in the existing hole in the furling tube to line up with the boom, and then stretch the luff to its fullest length at the top. I wanted to use the existing hole at the top of the furling tube as well so had to pull harder than I would have guessed. Dave Bradley s/v Sea Cloud Old Greenwich, CT > On Mar 18, 2021, at 4:54 PM, Joe Dempsey wrote: > > George, As promised here are some photos that may help you in removing your > main from the IMF mast > > > > > > > > > When removing furling sheet, be sure to remember the orientation for > replacing it so it winds in the right direction. Hope this helps. > > > > ----- > Joe Dempsey > s/v Respite > Rhodes 22 1989/2005 > Deltaville,VA > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From dwbrad at gmail.com Thu Mar 18 17:18:50 2021 From: dwbrad at gmail.com (David Bradley) Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2021 17:18:50 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes 22 For Sale In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <5A6B47D9-333C-4F93-A995-F8AC236B47F4@gmail.com> Hey Stephen, what are you moving up to? Dave B > On Mar 18, 2021, at 11:31 AM, Stephen Staum wrote: > > Boat is now located at the Hingham Shipyard Marina in Hingham, MA but will > be moved to my home in Needham, MA in a couple of weeks to make room for > it's replacement. > > Asking is $7,000 for the general public reduced to $6,500 for 'da list. > > > *Thanks and Stay Well,* > > *Stephen Staum* > > > > On Thu, Mar 18, 2021 at 11:28 AM Cary Tolbert wrote: > >> Well Stephen, how much and location? >> >> On Thu, Mar 18, 2021, 11:23 AM Stephen Staum wrote: >> >>> Dear All, >>> >>> We are moving up so are putting our beloved Carol Lee 2 up for sale. It >> is >>> an '83 updated with an IMF main. Custom sails by Doyle (main- 7 seasons >> & >>> 130 genoa- 2 seasons). All standing rigging replaced with IMF >> conversion. >>> Also added: single burner propane stove, 14 watt solar panel, 2nd >> battery >>> with battery switch, 12 v Chiller (hard wired to its own breaker) & >>> upgraded 4 fuse power panel to 6 breaker panel. Sale includes cockpit >>> cushions, mast raising system & 9.9 HP Johnson Sailmaster outboard. >>> >>> >>> *Thanks and Stay Well,* >>> >>> *Stephen Staum* >>> *s/v Carol Lee 2* >>> >>> *Needham, MA* >>> -------------- next part -------------- >>> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... >>> Name: IMG_0650(1).jpg >>> Type: image/jpeg >>> Size: 111547 bytes >>> Desc: not available >>> URL: < >>> >> http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210318/f21dd438/attachment.jpg >>>> >>> >> From joedempsey at hughes.net Thu Mar 18 17:18:53 2021 From: joedempsey at hughes.net (Joe Dempsey) Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2021 14:18:53 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] BURGEE ORDERING INSTRUCTIONS In-Reply-To: <1615316576867-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1615316576867-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <1616102333772-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Da List has really come through on ordering your "official" Rhodes 22 Association burgees! To date 50 have been ordered, several of you have ordered more than one. If you haven't yet ordered, hurry and get your order in if you want yours for this sailing season. TYPE THE FOLLOWING: Please send ____ 15? X 18? RHODES 22 Burgee(s) at $29.95 to: NAME, SHIPPING ADDRESS Your phone number (for Cindy to call for your payment information) Email above to Herb at Halling.com or a secondary email is Cindy.Halling1 at gmail.com PLEASE cc: joedempsey at hughes.net Expect a return call from Cindy Halling : (562) 252-6005 for your payment information. You could call her instead of emailing, but expect her to have to call you back anyway. NOTE: Your card statement will show the billing as OPB Entertainment. ----- Joe Dempsey s/v Respite Rhodes 22 1989/2005 Deltaville,VA -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From dwbrad at gmail.com Thu Mar 18 17:34:24 2021 From: dwbrad at gmail.com (David Bradley) Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2021 17:34:24 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] BURGEE ORDERING INSTRUCTIONS In-Reply-To: <1616102333772-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1615316576867-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616102333772-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <1118FA77-2DC8-4D22-ABD3-B1413C4D097C@gmail.com> Thank you, Joe, for making this so easy. Dave > On Mar 18, 2021, at 5:18 PM, Joe Dempsey wrote: > > Da List has really come through on ordering your "official" Rhodes 22 > Association burgees! To date 50 have been ordered, several of you have > ordered more than one. If you haven't yet ordered, hurry and get your order > in if you want yours for this sailing season. > > TYPE THE FOLLOWING: > > Please send ____ 15? X 18? RHODES 22 Burgee(s) at $29.95 to: > NAME, SHIPPING ADDRESS > Your phone number (for Cindy to call for your payment information) > > Email above to Herb at Halling.com or a secondary email is > Cindy.Halling1 at gmail.com > > PLEASE cc: joedempsey at hughes.net > > Expect a return call from Cindy Halling : (562) 252-6005 for your payment > information. > > You could call her instead of emailing, but expect her to have to call you > back anyway. > > NOTE: Your card statement will show the billing as OPB Entertainment. > > > > > > > > > ----- > Joe Dempsey > s/v Respite > Rhodes 22 1989/2005 > Deltaville,VA > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From bgarrant at gmail.com Thu Mar 18 17:36:32 2021 From: bgarrant at gmail.com (Bob Garrant) Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2021 17:36:32 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] BURGEE ORDERING INSTRUCTIONS In-Reply-To: <1118FA77-2DC8-4D22-ABD3-B1413C4D097C@gmail.com> References: <1615316576867-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616102333772-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1118FA77-2DC8-4D22-ABD3-B1413C4D097C@gmail.com> Message-ID: Thanks Joe I just ordered mine from Cindy. Very friendly and efficient lady. Bob Garrant On Thu, Mar 18, 2021 at 5:34 PM David Bradley wrote: > Thank you, Joe, for making this so easy. > > Dave > > > On Mar 18, 2021, at 5:18 PM, Joe Dempsey wrote: > > > > Da List has really come through on ordering your "official" Rhodes 22 > > Association burgees! To date 50 have been ordered, several of you have > > ordered more than one. If you haven't yet ordered, hurry and get your > order > > in if you want yours for this sailing season. > > > > TYPE THE FOLLOWING: > > > > Please send ____ 15? X 18? RHODES 22 Burgee(s) at $29.95 to: > > NAME, SHIPPING ADDRESS > > Your phone number (for Cindy to call for your payment information) > > > > Email above to Herb at Halling.com or a secondary email is > > Cindy.Halling1 at gmail.com > > > > PLEASE cc: joedempsey at hughes.net > > > > Expect a return call from Cindy Halling : (562) 252-6005 for your payment > > information. > > > > You could call her instead of emailing, but expect her to have to call > you > > back anyway. > > > > NOTE: Your card statement will show the billing as OPB Entertainment. > > > > < > http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/file/t752/Rhodes_22_Burgee_Triangle.jpg> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ----- > > Joe Dempsey > > s/v Respite > > Rhodes 22 1989/2005 > > Deltaville,VA > > -- > > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > > From dwbrad at gmail.com Thu Mar 18 17:41:06 2021 From: dwbrad at gmail.com (David Bradley) Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2021 17:41:06 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Lifting the Mast off of the Boat In-Reply-To: References: <1615887333262-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <59702.24.140.30.102.1615943869.squirrel@quickpop.sssnet.com> Message-ID: <9EF0E453-EA62-418C-949B-A7D296B85712@gmail.com> McLube - I think a teflon spray - works great. Dave B > On Mar 16, 2021, at 9:26 PM, Frank Goldsmith wrote: > > Jerry?s post reminds me of a question I meant to ask the group: is there a proper way of lubricating the black round parts that rotate inside the furling tubes (sorry, I don?t know the nomenclature ? bearings?) so that the furling operation is smoother and doesn?t bind, especially the mainsail? I thought that while mine is apart, I?d see what I could do about that. Or maybe lubrication is not called for, perhaps just wiping them clean. > > Thanks, > > Frank Goldsmith > s/v Mary Bess (1985/2000 Rhodes 22) > Lake Keowee, SC > > >> On Mar 16, 2021, at 9:17 PM, cjlowe at sssnet.com wrote: >> >> I drop and raise my mast bundle every year, at my dock, on the water. That >> being said, I dock at a well protected marina, little wind and no waves. >> If where you dock has similar conditions you should be fine. The first >> thing is to see if you can maneuver 26 feet of mast from boat to the dock >> where you have 55 feet of space that is level to hold the mast and remove >> the furling tube. When working above water, anything dropped is usually >> forfeited. Your idea of removing the boom and head sail is a good one, >> that extra weight and bulk is not your friend. Think about replacing the >> inhaul line while you have it apart. Count the amount of wraps of inhaul >> line on the furling tube and note the direction of the wrap. Seek the >> proper lubricant for the bearings and coat them well. Now is a good time >> to replace lights( anchor, spreader, deck,etc. Check the spreader bushings >> and bolt and windvane. I'm sure I forgot a few things, maybe others will >> chime in. >> >> >> Jerry Lowe >> S/V Country Rhodes '86 >> >> >> George, >>> I was on a sailing adventure with our R22 in Key West a couple years ago >>> and had a problem with ripped sail. I made the decision to motor back to >>> the marina that we had originally launched from and try to repair it >>> myself >>> before continuing on (we were attempting to sail to Dry Tortuga). Like Joe >>> mentioned, I pulled into the slip bow forward and retrieved the mast >>> crutch >>> and GB raising system from the truck. I lowered the mast by myself with no >>> problems and while I could lift the mast and furler myself, it was too >>> awkward to maneuver off the boat alone. My better half guided one end >>> while I carried it onto the dock. Disassembly, repair and reassembly took >>> place right there in front of the boat. Thankfully, the repair wasn't that >>> hard and we were able to get back underway the next morning. >>> >>> I tied the jib furler to the main and carried both off at the same time. >>> I'm going to estimate the mast (in mast furler) and jib together weighed >>> approximately 120- 140#. That's a very general guess. You mentioned you're >>> taking your furler down separately so that should make the rig weigh a bit >>> less. >>> >>> The boat community being what it is, I had no shortage of those willing to >>> lend a hand at the dock. You should be fine at the dock and not having to >>> pull your boat out. >>> >>> >>> Mike >>> SV Emma B >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> On Tue, Mar 16, 2021 at 5:35 AM Gmorganflier >>> wrote: >>> >>>> Question for those who might have done this. >>>> >>>> I want to take my sails in for cleaning and repair. I???ve never removed >>>> my >>>> sails, so this is going to be all new for me. I have the CDI II furler, >>>> so >>>> my plan is to lower and remove my 175 genie with the mast up. I then >>>> plan >>>> to >>>> remove the boom, lower the mast, disconnect the shouds and disconnect >>>> the >>>> CDI furler from the mast. >>>> I have no clue how heavy the mast with the furled main is. Can one >>>> person >>>> lift the mast with the furled main or will I need help? >>>> >>>> My boat is on a mooring. There are some logistical problems with pulling >>>> my >>>> boat out of the water....the water depth is too shallow at my club???s >>>> ramp. >>>> Would I be crazy to attempt this with the boat tied to my club???s dock >>>> or >>>> pulled up on the shore? >>>> >>>> Thanks for any advice on how to best accomplish this. >>>> >>>> George Morgan >>>> S/V Knotty Lady 1986 >>>> Lake Waccamaw NC >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From chcarreon at cox.net Thu Mar 18 18:34:16 2021 From: chcarreon at cox.net (chuy carreon) Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2021 18:34:16 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Wallowed Out Holes in Rudder/Head Assy; Flex with Rudder In-Reply-To: <00c401d71c28$ffc13280$ff439780$@ca> References: <00c401d71c28$ffc13280$ff439780$@ca> Message-ID: <1792883583.14559.1616106856975@myemail.cox.net> Hi All, Totally agree with Graham. I took both the rudder and centerboard to a boat repair shop. Repair guys had never seem a rudder that was so totally void of some kind of foam. Chuy Carreon AfterMath Tempe, Arizona > On March 18, 2021 at 3:00 PM Graham Stewart wrote: > > > To be clear, my rudder was not hollow by design - as far as I could tell. It had large voids throughout. > > I also rebuilt my centerboard and it had no voids that I could tell. Both the rudder and the centerboard for boats of that vintage used the same mold and are identical except that the centerboard has added weight. > > The keel had voids but was not likely built to be hollow. In that case I discovered that the large cracks under the keel had been allowing loose material, including flakes of metal probably intended to be ballast, to leak out. My understanding is that the ballast used in the R22 varied a lot over the years. As mentioned before, I was able to put 3 gallons of resin in the keel. That is a lot of space in my books. I am in Canada and we have very cold winters. Water in any of these places could do a lot of damage. The fact that I have had no visible damage from freezing in the years since I did this work suggests that there is very little water in these pieces now. > > Graham Stewart > Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 > Kingston Ontario > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf Of Tom Van Heule > Sent: Thursday, March 18, 2021 1:28 PM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Wallowed Out Holes in Rudder/Head Assy; Flex with Rudder > > If my rudder is hollow it still weighs +45lbs....it does NOT sound hollow. > 2011 boat. > > On Thu, Mar 18, 2021, 11:13 AM Lowe, Rob wrote: > > > Allyn, > > The rudder on my boat is hollow also. I believe they are made that way. > > I did have to drain some water out and I used epoxy to seal the edges. Not > > sure about you rudder to head assembly. Can you take some photos that we > > can look at? - rob > > > > ________________________________ > > From: Rhodes22-list on behalf of > > Allyn Baskerville > > Sent: Wednesday, March 17, 2021 6:00 PM > > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > > Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Wallowed Out Holes in Rudder/Head Assy; Flex with > > Rudder > > > > The rudder on my Rhodes is hollow - are all the rudders hollow? We just > > had single digit temps for a week, and I didn't think of the possibility of > > the rudder being partially filled with water, which it was, but there > > doesn't appear to be any freeze damage. However, the holes the bolt that > > holds the rudder to the rudder head assembly are wallowed out on both the > > rudder and the head assembly. It's been like this since I purchased the > > boat, but I'd like to fix it as it's gradually getting worse. Are there > > supposed to be bushings where the rudder attaches to the head assembly? > > > > I generally feel a lot of flex in the tiller and/or rudder on windier > > days, which is a pretty high percentage here in Oklahoma. I can't tell > > exactly where the flex is coming from, but I think it's the rudder head > > assembly, which is made of plastic. Has anyone else noticed flex? If so, > > can you please describe what you did to fix the issue? > > > > Thanks - Allyn > > > From goldsmith.cf at gmail.com Thu Mar 18 19:39:18 2021 From: goldsmith.cf at gmail.com (Frank Goldsmith) Date: Thu, 18 Mar 2021 19:39:18 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Lifting the Mast off of the Boat In-Reply-To: <9EF0E453-EA62-418C-949B-A7D296B85712@gmail.com> References: <1615887333262-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <59702.24.140.30.102.1615943869.squirrel@quickpop.sssnet.com> <9EF0E453-EA62-418C-949B-A7D296B85712@gmail.com> Message-ID: <2ABC67F2-6723-4602-875D-10C5823C4BEA@gmail.com> Thanks. I?ll check that out. Frank > On Mar 18, 2021, at 5:41 PM, David Bradley wrote: > > McLube - I think a teflon spray - works great. > > Dave B > >> On Mar 16, 2021, at 9:26 PM, Frank Goldsmith > wrote: >> >> Jerry?s post reminds me of a question I meant to ask the group: is there a proper way of lubricating the black round parts that rotate inside the furling tubes (sorry, I don?t know the nomenclature ? bearings?) so that the furling operation is smoother and doesn?t bind, especially the mainsail? I thought that while mine is apart, I?d see what I could do about that. Or maybe lubrication is not called for, perhaps just wiping them clean. >> >> Thanks, >> >> Frank Goldsmith >> s/v Mary Bess (1985/2000 Rhodes 22) >> Lake Keowee, SC >> >> >>> On Mar 16, 2021, at 9:17 PM, cjlowe at sssnet.com wrote: >>> >>> I drop and raise my mast bundle every year, at my dock, on the water. That >>> being said, I dock at a well protected marina, little wind and no waves. >>> If where you dock has similar conditions you should be fine. The first >>> thing is to see if you can maneuver 26 feet of mast from boat to the dock >>> where you have 55 feet of space that is level to hold the mast and remove >>> the furling tube. When working above water, anything dropped is usually >>> forfeited. Your idea of removing the boom and head sail is a good one, >>> that extra weight and bulk is not your friend. Think about replacing the >>> inhaul line while you have it apart. Count the amount of wraps of inhaul >>> line on the furling tube and note the direction of the wrap. Seek the >>> proper lubricant for the bearings and coat them well. Now is a good time >>> to replace lights( anchor, spreader, deck,etc. Check the spreader bushings >>> and bolt and windvane. I'm sure I forgot a few things, maybe others will >>> chime in. >>> >>> >>> Jerry Lowe >>> S/V Country Rhodes '86 >>> >>> >>> George, >>>> I was on a sailing adventure with our R22 in Key West a couple years ago >>>> and had a problem with ripped sail. I made the decision to motor back to >>>> the marina that we had originally launched from and try to repair it >>>> myself >>>> before continuing on (we were attempting to sail to Dry Tortuga). Like Joe >>>> mentioned, I pulled into the slip bow forward and retrieved the mast >>>> crutch >>>> and GB raising system from the truck. I lowered the mast by myself with no >>>> problems and while I could lift the mast and furler myself, it was too >>>> awkward to maneuver off the boat alone. My better half guided one end >>>> while I carried it onto the dock. Disassembly, repair and reassembly took >>>> place right there in front of the boat. Thankfully, the repair wasn't that >>>> hard and we were able to get back underway the next morning. >>>> >>>> I tied the jib furler to the main and carried both off at the same time. >>>> I'm going to estimate the mast (in mast furler) and jib together weighed >>>> approximately 120- 140#. That's a very general guess. You mentioned you're >>>> taking your furler down separately so that should make the rig weigh a bit >>>> less. >>>> >>>> The boat community being what it is, I had no shortage of those willing to >>>> lend a hand at the dock. You should be fine at the dock and not having to >>>> pull your boat out. >>>> >>>> >>>> Mike >>>> SV Emma B >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On Tue, Mar 16, 2021 at 5:35 AM Gmorganflier >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Question for those who might have done this. >>>>> >>>>> I want to take my sails in for cleaning and repair. I???ve never removed >>>>> my >>>>> sails, so this is going to be all new for me. I have the CDI II furler, >>>>> so >>>>> my plan is to lower and remove my 175 genie with the mast up. I then >>>>> plan >>>>> to >>>>> remove the boom, lower the mast, disconnect the shouds and disconnect >>>>> the >>>>> CDI furler from the mast. >>>>> I have no clue how heavy the mast with the furled main is. Can one >>>>> person >>>>> lift the mast with the furled main or will I need help? >>>>> >>>>> My boat is on a mooring. There are some logistical problems with pulling >>>>> my >>>>> boat out of the water....the water depth is too shallow at my club???s >>>>> ramp. >>>>> Would I be crazy to attempt this with the boat tied to my club???s dock >>>>> or >>>>> pulled up on the shore? >>>>> >>>>> Thanks for any advice on how to best accomplish this. >>>>> >>>>> George Morgan >>>>> S/V Knotty Lady 1986 >>>>> Lake Waccamaw NC >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > From snstaum at gmail.com Fri Mar 19 06:46:49 2021 From: snstaum at gmail.com (Stephen Staum) Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2021 06:46:49 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes 22 For Sale In-Reply-To: <5A6B47D9-333C-4F93-A995-F8AC236B47F4@gmail.com> References: <5A6B47D9-333C-4F93-A995-F8AC236B47F4@gmail.com> Message-ID: Another Rhodes 22. Image that! It has the fully enclosed head plus electric motor lift therefore quailfies as ?moving up?. Stephen Staum s/v Carol Lee 2 Needham, MA On Thu, Mar 18, 2021 at 5:18 PM David Bradley wrote: > Hey Stephen, what are you moving up to? > > Dave B > > > On Mar 18, 2021, at 11:31 AM, Stephen Staum wrote: > > > > Boat is now located at the Hingham Shipyard Marina in Hingham, MA but > will > > be moved to my home in Needham, MA in a couple of weeks to make room for > > it's replacement. > > > > Asking is $7,000 for the general public reduced to $6,500 for 'da list. > > > > > > *Thanks and Stay Well,* > > > > *Stephen Staum* > > > > > > > > On Thu, Mar 18, 2021 at 11:28 AM Cary Tolbert > wrote: > > > >> Well Stephen, how much and location? > >> > >> On Thu, Mar 18, 2021, 11:23 AM Stephen Staum wrote: > >> > >>> Dear All, > >>> > >>> We are moving up so are putting our beloved Carol Lee 2 up for sale. > It > >> is > >>> an '83 updated with an IMF main. Custom sails by Doyle (main- 7 > seasons > >> & > >>> 130 genoa- 2 seasons). All standing rigging replaced with IMF > >> conversion. > >>> Also added: single burner propane stove, 14 watt solar panel, 2nd > >> battery > >>> with battery switch, 12 v Chiller (hard wired to its own breaker) & > >>> upgraded 4 fuse power panel to 6 breaker panel. Sale includes cockpit > >>> cushions, mast raising system & 9.9 HP Johnson Sailmaster outboard. > >>> > >>> > >>> *Thanks and Stay Well,* > >>> > >>> *Stephen Staum* > >>> *s/v Carol Lee 2* > >>> > >>> *Needham, MA* > >>> -------------- next part -------------- > >>> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > >>> Name: IMG_0650(1).jpg > >>> Type: image/jpeg > >>> Size: 111547 bytes > >>> Desc: not available > >>> URL: < > >>> > >> > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210318/f21dd438/attachment.jpg > >>>> > >>> > >> > > -- Thanks and Stay Well, Stephen Staum Pariser Industries, Inc. From dwbrad at gmail.com Fri Mar 19 08:53:10 2021 From: dwbrad at gmail.com (David Bradley) Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2021 08:53:10 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes 22 For Sale In-Reply-To: References: <5A6B47D9-333C-4F93-A995-F8AC236B47F4@gmail.com> Message-ID: <230DC2CF-6FCC-4DFE-B3A9-A36E118CD481@gmail.com> Excellent! Carol Lee 3? Has a nice ring to it. Dave B > On Mar 19, 2021, at 6:46 AM, Stephen Staum wrote: > > Another Rhodes 22. Image that! It has the fully enclosed head plus > electric motor lift therefore quailfies as ?moving up?. > > Stephen Staum > s/v Carol Lee 2 > Needham, MA > > On Thu, Mar 18, 2021 at 5:18 PM David Bradley wrote: > >> Hey Stephen, what are you moving up to? >> >> Dave B >> >>> On Mar 18, 2021, at 11:31 AM, Stephen Staum wrote: >>> >>> Boat is now located at the Hingham Shipyard Marina in Hingham, MA but >> will >>> be moved to my home in Needham, MA in a couple of weeks to make room for >>> it's replacement. >>> >>> Asking is $7,000 for the general public reduced to $6,500 for 'da list. >>> >>> >>> *Thanks and Stay Well,* >>> >>> *Stephen Staum* >>> >>> >>> >>> On Thu, Mar 18, 2021 at 11:28 AM Cary Tolbert >> wrote: >>> >>>> Well Stephen, how much and location? >>>> >>>> On Thu, Mar 18, 2021, 11:23 AM Stephen Staum wrote: >>>> >>>>> Dear All, >>>>> >>>>> We are moving up so are putting our beloved Carol Lee 2 up for sale. >> It >>>> is >>>>> an '83 updated with an IMF main. Custom sails by Doyle (main- 7 >> seasons >>>> & >>>>> 130 genoa- 2 seasons). All standing rigging replaced with IMF >>>> conversion. >>>>> Also added: single burner propane stove, 14 watt solar panel, 2nd >>>> battery >>>>> with battery switch, 12 v Chiller (hard wired to its own breaker) & >>>>> upgraded 4 fuse power panel to 6 breaker panel. Sale includes cockpit >>>>> cushions, mast raising system & 9.9 HP Johnson Sailmaster outboard. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> *Thanks and Stay Well,* >>>>> >>>>> *Stephen Staum* >>>>> *s/v Carol Lee 2* >>>>> >>>>> *Needham, MA* >>>>> -------------- next part -------------- >>>>> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... >>>>> Name: IMG_0650(1).jpg >>>>> Type: image/jpeg >>>>> Size: 111547 bytes >>>>> Desc: not available >>>>> URL: < >>>>> >>>> >> http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210318/f21dd438/attachment.jpg >>>>>> >>>>> >>>> >> >> -- > Thanks and Stay Well, > Stephen Staum > Pariser Industries, Inc. From jeffsmithphoto at gmail.com Fri Mar 19 12:49:51 2021 From: jeffsmithphoto at gmail.com (JeffSmith) Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2021 09:49:51 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Lifting the Mast off of the Boat In-Reply-To: <59DAE244-B67A-485C-9E88-E8A0A2078263@gmail.com> References: <1615887333262-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616100849514-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <59DAE244-B67A-485C-9E88-E8A0A2078263@gmail.com> Message-ID: <1616172591477-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Does the mast H ve to be taken off the boat? Or can the sail assembly be removed from the mast while the base is lowered to the bow pupit? ----- Jeff Smith 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor Atlantic Highlands, NJ -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From mtroy at atlanticbb.net Fri Mar 19 17:22:04 2021 From: mtroy at atlanticbb.net (Mary Lou Troy) Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2021 17:22:04 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Lifting the Mast off of the Boat In-Reply-To: <1616172591477-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1615887333262-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616100849514-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <59DAE244-B67A-485C-9E88-E8A0A2078263@gmail.com> <1616172591477-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: The furling tube inside the mast is as long as the mast. You need to have a way to keep it straight and pull it all the way out of the mast before you can remove the sail. Mary Lou ex Rhodes 22 now Rosborough RF 246, Tara Rock Hall, MD On 3/19/2021 12:49 PM, JeffSmith wrote: > Does the mast H ve to be taken off the boat? Or can the sail assembly be > removed from the mast while the base is lowered to the bow pupit? > > > > ----- > Jeff Smith > 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT > Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor > Atlantic Highlands, NJ > > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ -- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus From chrisgeankoplis at gmail.com Fri Mar 19 18:15:48 2021 From: chrisgeankoplis at gmail.com (Chris Geankoplis) Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2021 18:15:48 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes 22 For Sale In-Reply-To: References: <5A6B47D9-333C-4F93-A995-F8AC236B47F4@gmail.com> Message-ID: Great decision on your move! Chris Geankoplis Enosis On Fri, Mar 19, 2021 at 6:47 AM Stephen Staum wrote: > Another Rhodes 22. Image that! It has the fully enclosed head plus > electric motor lift therefore quailfies as ?moving up?. > > Stephen Staum > s/v Carol Lee 2 > Needham, MA > > On Thu, Mar 18, 2021 at 5:18 PM David Bradley wrote: > > > Hey Stephen, what are you moving up to? > > > > Dave B > > > > > On Mar 18, 2021, at 11:31 AM, Stephen Staum wrote: > > > > > > Boat is now located at the Hingham Shipyard Marina in Hingham, MA but > > will > > > be moved to my home in Needham, MA in a couple of weeks to make room > for > > > it's replacement. > > > > > > Asking is $7,000 for the general public reduced to $6,500 for 'da list. > > > > > > > > > *Thanks and Stay Well,* > > > > > > *Stephen Staum* > > > > > > > > > > > > On Thu, Mar 18, 2021 at 11:28 AM Cary Tolbert > > wrote: > > > > > >> Well Stephen, how much and location? > > >> > > >> On Thu, Mar 18, 2021, 11:23 AM Stephen Staum > wrote: > > >> > > >>> Dear All, > > >>> > > >>> We are moving up so are putting our beloved Carol Lee 2 up for sale. > > It > > >> is > > >>> an '83 updated with an IMF main. Custom sails by Doyle (main- 7 > > seasons > > >> & > > >>> 130 genoa- 2 seasons). All standing rigging replaced with IMF > > >> conversion. > > >>> Also added: single burner propane stove, 14 watt solar panel, 2nd > > >> battery > > >>> with battery switch, 12 v Chiller (hard wired to its own breaker) & > > >>> upgraded 4 fuse power panel to 6 breaker panel. Sale includes > cockpit > > >>> cushions, mast raising system & 9.9 HP Johnson Sailmaster outboard. > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> *Thanks and Stay Well,* > > >>> > > >>> *Stephen Staum* > > >>> *s/v Carol Lee 2* > > >>> > > >>> *Needham, MA* > > >>> -------------- next part -------------- > > >>> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > > >>> Name: IMG_0650(1).jpg > > >>> Type: image/jpeg > > >>> Size: 111547 bytes > > >>> Desc: not available > > >>> URL: < > > >>> > > >> > > > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210318/f21dd438/attachment.jpg > > >>>> > > >>> > > >> > > > > -- > Thanks and Stay Well, > Stephen Staum > Pariser Industries, Inc. > From lgioia at yahoo.com Fri Mar 19 21:28:15 2021 From: lgioia at yahoo.com (Larry Gioia) Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2021 01:28:15 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Line sizes In-Reply-To: <59DAE244-B67A-485C-9E88-E8A0A2078263@gmail.com> References: <1615887333262-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616100849514-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <59DAE244-B67A-485C-9E88-E8A0A2078263@gmail.com> Message-ID: <1561120397.3178059.1616203695652@mail.yahoo.com> Hi,????I'm replacing a few of the lines on the '86 Rhodes I bought last year.? I found some lengths in the archives but not the widths of the lines. I'm not sure that the lines on it were the right size.? Any edits to the following guesses?? ?????Lines to be replaced:? Inner-Mast Furling sheet - 1/4" x 20'? Jib furling sheet - 1/4" x 25'? ?Topping lift line 3/16" x 60'? ??????Lines I have replaced, sizes I used: Afterstay tightening line:1/4"? x 15'? ? ? ? Mainsail outhaul line: 5/16" x 20'? ? ?Mainsheet: 3/8" x 35'? ?Rudder lift line: 1/4" x 10' (I think)??????Lines I won't be replacing this year, but sizes they appear to be:? Jib sheet: 3/8" x 60'? ? ? ?Centerboard line: 5/16" x 15'????Thanks for any edits, or lists you can point me to!????Larry On Thursday, March 18, 2021, 05:09:05 PM EDT, David Bradley wrote: I replaced my IMF main last year and one thing Stan had mentioned to take particular care of was to attach the bottom of the luff in the existing hole in the furling tube to line up with the boom, and then stretch the luff to its fullest length at the top. I wanted to use the existing hole at the top of the furling tube as well so had to pull harder than I would have guessed. Dave Bradley s/v Sea Cloud Old Greenwich, CT > On Mar 18, 2021, at 4:54 PM, Joe Dempsey wrote: > > George, As promised here are some photos that may help you in removing your > main from the IMF mast > > > > > > > > > When removing furling sheet, be sure to remember the orientation for > replacing it so it winds in the right direction.? Hope this helps. > > > > ----- > Joe Dempsey > s/v Respite > Rhodes 22 1989/2005 > Deltaville,VA > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From gstewart8 at cogeco.ca Fri Mar 19 22:22:36 2021 From: gstewart8 at cogeco.ca (Graham Stewart) Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2021 22:22:36 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Line sizes In-Reply-To: <1561120397.3178059.1616203695652@mail.yahoo.com> References: <1615887333262-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616100849514-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <59DAE244-B67A-485C-9E88-E8A0A2078263@gmail.com> <1561120397.3178059.1616203695652@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <003501d71d2f$e74387f0$b5ca97d0$@ca> Dave: The following URL takes you to the SailBoat Owners web site where there is a calculator that will guide you in the choice of line for the R22. That might be of help. https://shop.sailboatowners.com/cu/detail-rrc.php?a=1&brand=RHODES Graham Stewart Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 Kingston Ontario -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf Of Larry Gioia via Rhodes22-list Sent: Friday, March 19, 2021 9:28 PM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Line sizes Hi, I'm replacing a few of the lines on the '86 Rhodes I bought last year. I found some lengths in the archives but not the widths of the lines. I'm not sure that the lines on it were the right size. Any edits to the following guesses? Lines to be replaced: Inner-Mast Furling sheet - 1/4" x 20' Jib furling sheet - 1/4" x 25' Topping lift line 3/16" x 60' Lines I have replaced, sizes I used: Afterstay tightening line:1/4" x 15' Mainsail outhaul line: 5/16" x 20' Mainsheet: 3/8" x 35' Rudder lift line: 1/4" x 10' (I think) Lines I won't be replacing this year, but sizes they appear to be: Jib sheet: 3/8" x 60' Centerboard line: 5/16" x 15' Thanks for any edits, or lists you can point me to! Larry On Thursday, March 18, 2021, 05:09:05 PM EDT, David Bradley wrote: I replaced my IMF main last year and one thing Stan had mentioned to take particular care of was to attach the bottom of the luff in the existing hole in the furling tube to line up with the boom, and then stretch the luff to its fullest length at the top. I wanted to use the existing hole at the top of the furling tube as well so had to pull harder than I would have guessed. Dave Bradley s/v Sea Cloud Old Greenwich, CT > On Mar 18, 2021, at 4:54 PM, Joe Dempsey wrote: > > George, As promised here are some photos that may help you in removing your > main from the IMF mast > > > > > > > > > When removing furling sheet, be sure to remember the orientation for > replacing it so it winds in the right direction. Hope this helps. > > > > ----- > Joe Dempsey > s/v Respite > Rhodes 22 1989/2005 > Deltaville,VA > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From lgioia at yahoo.com Fri Mar 19 22:58:33 2021 From: lgioia at yahoo.com (Larry Gioia) Date: Fri, 19 Mar 2021 22:58:33 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Line sizes In-Reply-To: <003501d71d2f$e74387f0$b5ca97d0$@ca> References: <003501d71d2f$e74387f0$b5ca97d0$@ca> Message-ID: Thanks Graham! Larry > On Mar 19, 2021, at 10:22 PM, Graham Stewart wrote: > > ?Dave: > The following URL takes you to the SailBoat Owners web site where there is a calculator that will guide you in the choice of line for the R22. That might be of help. > https://shop.sailboatowners.com/cu/detail-rrc.php?a=1&brand=RHODES > > Graham Stewart > Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 > Kingston Ontario > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf Of Larry Gioia via Rhodes22-list > Sent: Friday, March 19, 2021 9:28 PM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Line sizes > > Hi, I'm replacing a few of the lines on the '86 Rhodes I bought last year. I found some lengths in the archives but not the widths of the lines. I'm not sure that the lines on it were the right size. Any edits to the following guesses? Lines to be replaced: Inner-Mast Furling sheet - 1/4" x 20' Jib furling sheet - 1/4" x 25' Topping lift line 3/16" x 60' Lines I have replaced, sizes I used: Afterstay tightening line:1/4" x 15' Mainsail outhaul line: 5/16" x 20' Mainsheet: 3/8" x 35' Rudder lift line: 1/4" x 10' (I think) Lines I won't be replacing this year, but sizes they appear to be: Jib sheet: 3/8" x 60' Centerboard line: 5/16" x 15' Thanks for any edits, or lists you can point me to! Larry > On Thursday, March 18, 2021, 05:09:05 PM EDT, David Bradley wrote: > > I replaced my IMF main last year and one thing Stan had mentioned to take particular care of was to attach the bottom of the luff in the existing hole in the furling tube to line up with the boom, and then stretch the luff to its fullest length at the top. I wanted to use the existing hole at the top of the furling tube as well so had to pull harder than I would have guessed. > > Dave Bradley > s/v Sea Cloud > Old Greenwich, CT > >> On Mar 18, 2021, at 4:54 PM, Joe Dempsey wrote: >> >> George, As promised here are some photos that may help you in removing your >> main from the IMF mast >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> When removing furling sheet, be sure to remember the orientation for >> replacing it so it winds in the right direction. Hope this helps. >> >> >> >> ----- >> Joe Dempsey >> s/v Respite >> Rhodes 22 1989/2005 >> Deltaville,VA >> -- >> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > > > From snstaum at gmail.com Sat Mar 20 07:16:09 2021 From: snstaum at gmail.com (Stephen Staum) Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2021 07:16:09 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes 22 For Sale In-Reply-To: <230DC2CF-6FCC-4DFE-B3A9-A36E118CD481@gmail.com> References: <5A6B47D9-333C-4F93-A995-F8AC236B47F4@gmail.com> <230DC2CF-6FCC-4DFE-B3A9-A36E118CD481@gmail.com> Message-ID: Yes, it might be Carol Lee 3 *Thanks and Stay Well,* *Stephen Staum* *s/v Carol Lee 2* On Fri, Mar 19, 2021 at 8:53 AM David Bradley wrote: > Excellent! Carol Lee 3? Has a nice ring to it. > > Dave B > > > On Mar 19, 2021, at 6:46 AM, Stephen Staum wrote: > > > > Another Rhodes 22. Image that! It has the fully enclosed head plus > > electric motor lift therefore quailfies as ?moving up?. > > > > Stephen Staum > > s/v Carol Lee 2 > > Needham, MA > > > > On Thu, Mar 18, 2021 at 5:18 PM David Bradley wrote: > > > >> Hey Stephen, what are you moving up to? > >> > >> Dave B > >> > >>> On Mar 18, 2021, at 11:31 AM, Stephen Staum wrote: > >>> > >>> Boat is now located at the Hingham Shipyard Marina in Hingham, MA but > >> will > >>> be moved to my home in Needham, MA in a couple of weeks to make room > for > >>> it's replacement. > >>> > >>> Asking is $7,000 for the general public reduced to $6,500 for 'da list. > >>> > >>> > >>> *Thanks and Stay Well,* > >>> > >>> *Stephen Staum* > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> On Thu, Mar 18, 2021 at 11:28 AM Cary Tolbert > >> wrote: > >>> > >>>> Well Stephen, how much and location? > >>>> > >>>> On Thu, Mar 18, 2021, 11:23 AM Stephen Staum > wrote: > >>>> > >>>>> Dear All, > >>>>> > >>>>> We are moving up so are putting our beloved Carol Lee 2 up for sale. > >> It > >>>> is > >>>>> an '83 updated with an IMF main. Custom sails by Doyle (main- 7 > >> seasons > >>>> & > >>>>> 130 genoa- 2 seasons). All standing rigging replaced with IMF > >>>> conversion. > >>>>> Also added: single burner propane stove, 14 watt solar panel, 2nd > >>>> battery > >>>>> with battery switch, 12 v Chiller (hard wired to its own breaker) & > >>>>> upgraded 4 fuse power panel to 6 breaker panel. Sale includes > cockpit > >>>>> cushions, mast raising system & 9.9 HP Johnson Sailmaster outboard. > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> *Thanks and Stay Well,* > >>>>> > >>>>> *Stephen Staum* > >>>>> *s/v Carol Lee 2* > >>>>> > >>>>> *Needham, MA* > >>>>> -------------- next part -------------- > >>>>> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > >>>>> Name: IMG_0650(1).jpg > >>>>> Type: image/jpeg > >>>>> Size: 111547 bytes > >>>>> Desc: not available > >>>>> URL: < > >>>>> > >>>> > >> > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210318/f21dd438/attachment.jpg > >>>>>> > >>>>> > >>>> > >> > >> -- > > Thanks and Stay Well, > > Stephen Staum > > Pariser Industries, Inc. > > From snstaum at gmail.com Sat Mar 20 10:19:12 2021 From: snstaum at gmail.com (Stephen Staum) Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2021 10:19:12 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Lifting the Mast off of the Boat In-Reply-To: References: <1615887333262-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616100849514-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <59DAE244-B67A-485C-9E88-E8A0A2078263@gmail.com> <1616172591477-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: With 2 assistants I was able to slide the mainsail assembly out of the mast with it on the boat in my backyard. I am not sure that would work on a dock unless it was long enough and you had the boat close enough to walk the assembly out. *Thanks and Stay Well,* *Stephen Staum* *s/v Carol Lee 2* *Needham, MA* On Fri, Mar 19, 2021 at 5:22 PM Mary Lou Troy wrote: > The furling tube inside the mast is as long as the mast. You need to > have a way to keep it straight and pull it all the way out of the mast > before you can remove the sail. > > Mary Lou > ex Rhodes 22 > now Rosborough RF 246, Tara > Rock Hall, MD > > On 3/19/2021 12:49 PM, JeffSmith wrote: > > Does the mast H ve to be taken off the boat? Or can the sail assembly be > > removed from the mast while the base is lowered to the bow pupit? > > > > > > > > ----- > > Jeff Smith > > 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT > > Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor > > Atlantic Highlands, NJ > > > > -- > > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > > > -- > This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. > https://www.avast.com/antivirus > > From mweisner at ebsmed.com Sat Mar 20 11:44:31 2021 From: mweisner at ebsmed.com (Michael D. Weisner) Date: Sat, 20 Mar 2021 11:44:31 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Lifting the Mast off of the Boat In-Reply-To: References: <1615887333262-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616100849514-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <59DAE244-B67A-485C-9E88-E8A0A2078263@gmail.com> <1616172591477-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <000f01d71d9f$ebc15300$c343f900$@ebsmed.com> My dad always cautioned me about people who asked me to "take a long walk on a short dock" :-) Mike s/v Wind Lass ('91) Nissequogue River, NY I?d rather be sailing :~) -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of Stephen Staum Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2021 10:19 AM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Lifting the Mast off of the Boat With 2 assistants I was able to slide the mainsail assembly out of the mast with it on the boat in my backyard. I am not sure that would work on a dock unless it was long enough and you had the boat close enough to walk the assembly out. *Thanks and Stay Well,* *Stephen Staum* *s/v Carol Lee 2* *Needham, MA* On Fri, Mar 19, 2021 at 5:22 PM Mary Lou Troy wrote: > The furling tube inside the mast is as long as the mast. You need to > have a way to keep it straight and pull it all the way out of the mast > before you can remove the sail. > > Mary Lou > ex Rhodes 22 > now Rosborough RF 246, Tara > Rock Hall, MD > > On 3/19/2021 12:49 PM, JeffSmith wrote: > > Does the mast H ve to be taken off the boat? Or can the sail > > assembly be removed from the mast while the base is lowered to the bow pupit? > > > > > > > > ----- > > Jeff Smith > > 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT > > Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor > > Atlantic Highlands, NJ > > > > -- > > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > > > -- > This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. > https://www.avast.com/antivirus > > From joedempsey at hughes.net Mon Mar 22 12:04:33 2021 From: joedempsey at hughes.net (Joe Dempsey) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2021 09:04:33 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Lifting the Mast off of the Boat In-Reply-To: References: <1615887333262-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616100849514-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <59DAE244-B67A-485C-9E88-E8A0A2078263@gmail.com> <1616172591477-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <1616429073591-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Yes, that was the case when I removed my mast while at the dock. I was at a bulkhead slip and had plenty of room off the bow. Ideally, there was a nice grassy area beside my dock where we could lay the mast, IMF furler tube and mainsail. See photos from my previous post. ----- Joe Dempsey s/v Respite Rhodes 22 1989/2005 Deltaville,VA -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From mweisner at ebsmed.com Mon Mar 22 17:15:05 2021 From: mweisner at ebsmed.com (Michael D. Weisner) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2021 17:15:05 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Changes to the website Message-ID: <008101d71f60$6ecae0b0$4c60a210$@ebsmed.com> Hi Rhodies, Peter and Joe have been hard at work adding a special webpage to our new website for ordering the Rhodes 22 Burgee. You may reach it directly at http://rhodes22.org/burgee.html or by navigating from the home page. A special entry has also been added to the navigation menu. I am happy that we are starting to really make use of the new website that Peter designed. It Is a whole lot better than having to search through emails to find a process to order the burgee. Please raise a glass of your favorite libation and congratulate these folks who have worked to make the Rhodes 22 more than just a sailboat or a website. We are a wonderful community dedicated to sailing, teaching, sharing and maintaining the Rhodes 22. Let's start planning our next get together on the water, on land or on the Internet. Mike s/v Wind Lass ('91) Nissequogue River, NY I'd rather be sailing :~) From goldsmith.cf at gmail.com Mon Mar 22 18:47:16 2021 From: goldsmith.cf at gmail.com (Frank Goldsmith) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2021 18:47:16 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Changes to the website In-Reply-To: <008101d71f60$6ecae0b0$4c60a210$@ebsmed.com> References: <008101d71f60$6ecae0b0$4c60a210$@ebsmed.com> Message-ID: Bourbon being lifted here. Thanks, Peter and Joe! Indeed, as Mike has said, it?s a great sailing and sharing community. I?m grateful to be part of it. Frank Goldsmith Fairview, NC > On Mar 22, 2021, at 5:15 PM, Michael D. Weisner wrote: > > Hi Rhodies, > > > Peter and Joe have been hard at work adding a special webpage to our new > website for ordering the Rhodes 22 Burgee. You may reach it directly at > http://rhodes22.org/burgee.html or by navigating from the home page. A > special entry has also been added to the navigation menu. I am happy that we > are starting to really make use of the new website that Peter designed. It > Is a whole lot better than having to search through emails to find a process > to order the burgee. > > > > Please raise a glass of your favorite libation and congratulate these folks > who have worked to make the Rhodes 22 more than just a sailboat or a > website. We are a wonderful community dedicated to sailing, teaching, > sharing and maintaining the Rhodes 22. > > > > Let's start planning our next get together on the water, on land or on the > Internet. > > > > Mike > > s/v Wind Lass ('91) > > Nissequogue River, NY > > I'd rather be sailing :~) > > > > > From jesse.laten.shumaker at gmail.com Mon Mar 22 19:48:56 2021 From: jesse.laten.shumaker at gmail.com (Jesse Shumaker) Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2021 18:48:56 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Changes to the website In-Reply-To: References: <008101d71f60$6ecae0b0$4c60a210$@ebsmed.com> Message-ID: Yes, thanks for the great work. The wealth of knowledge and helpfulness of this group is one of the great things about owning a Rhodes 22. It's a big enough group to have plenty of people to participate but not too large to become like some online forums which lack a sense of community. I often find myself wondering about how to do something when someone then starts a thread on that topic (like the recent email chain on bottom painting techniques) which I save off for reference. As a relatively new sailor, these conversations really speed up the learning curve and make it less intimidating to tackle projects. Jesse Shumaker S/V Zephyr On Mon, Mar 22, 2021 at 5:47 PM Frank Goldsmith wrote: > Bourbon being lifted here. Thanks, Peter and Joe! Indeed, as Mike has > said, it?s a great sailing and sharing community. I?m grateful to be part > of it. > > Frank Goldsmith > Fairview, NC > > > On Mar 22, 2021, at 5:15 PM, Michael D. Weisner > wrote: > > > > Hi Rhodies, > > > > > > Peter and Joe have been hard at work adding a special webpage to our new > > website for ordering the Rhodes 22 Burgee. You may reach it directly at > > http://rhodes22.org/burgee.html or by navigating from the home page. A > > special entry has also been added to the navigation menu. I am happy > that we > > are starting to really make use of the new website that Peter designed. > It > > Is a whole lot better than having to search through emails to find a > process > > to order the burgee. > > > > > > > > Please raise a glass of your favorite libation and congratulate these > folks > > who have worked to make the Rhodes 22 more than just a sailboat or a > > website. We are a wonderful community dedicated to sailing, teaching, > > sharing and maintaining the Rhodes 22. > > > > > > > > Let's start planning our next get together on the water, on land or on > the > > Internet. > > > > > > > > Mike > > > > s/v Wind Lass ('91) > > > > Nissequogue River, NY > > > > I'd rather be sailing :~) > > > > > > > > > > > > From snstaum at gmail.com Tue Mar 23 08:16:08 2021 From: snstaum at gmail.com (Stephen Staum) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2021 08:16:08 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Additional Info Needed for Insurance Binder In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: James, I would like to put a binder on the boat before moving it. Thanks and see you Saturday. My insurance has requested the following information: The Hull ID The Engine Year, Make and Serial Number The trailer Year Make and Serial Number *Thanks and Stay Well,* *Stephen Staum* *(781) 704-1037* From reuben.mezrich at gmail.com Tue Mar 23 11:58:09 2021 From: reuben.mezrich at gmail.com (Reuben Mezrich) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2021 11:58:09 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] a boisterous sail Message-ID: <27B4E965-6478-4D0B-9197-7904BBED5E04@gmail.com> Last Wednesday Chris Geankoplis drove over from Fort Pierce to go for a sail and give me some tips on how to sail and care for my new Rhodes 22. The winds were about 15 knots when we got out to Little Sarasota Bay from my harbor and rose to about 17 knots, with gusts to 20 knots (as measured by a hand held anemometer) as the afternoon went on. A neighbor in a motorboat passed by and took the pictures below. We had the boat well reefed down but still were doing 4 - 5 knots and occasionally getting up to 6 knots. Chris did most of the sailing - essentially single-handing as I provided rail beef and watched and learned. I was impressed by what the boat - and Chris - could do. I?ve been sailing a big boat (Island Packet 380) till I got the Rhodes last December and its entirely different. This sail provided an ?existence proof? and showed me a skill to aspire to. I?m looking forward to it. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: AAE74A78-7059-4B8D-B62A-DCE7C9DE57B4.jpeg Type: image/jpeg Size: 60030 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: E2C6D04D-1FDF-4973-8C7E-FF20D0D67EB7.jpeg Type: image/jpeg Size: 65487 bytes Desc: not available URL: From mweisner at ebsmed.com Tue Mar 23 12:22:21 2021 From: mweisner at ebsmed.com (Michael D. Weisner) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2021 12:22:21 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] a boisterous sail In-Reply-To: <27B4E965-6478-4D0B-9197-7904BBED5E04@gmail.com> References: <27B4E965-6478-4D0B-9197-7904BBED5E04@gmail.com> Message-ID: <011201d72000$b469cb40$1d3d61c0$@ebsmed.com> Wow, what a great sail! Perfect weather! Minor leaks aside, you got a terrific boat. Enjoy! Mike s/v Wind Lass ('91) Nissequogue River, NY -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of Reuben Mezrich Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2021 11:58 AM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: [Rhodes22-list] a boisterous sail Last Wednesday Chris Geankoplis drove over from Fort Pierce to go for a sail and give me some tips on how to sail and care for my new Rhodes 22. The winds were about 15 knots when we got out to Little Sarasota Bay from my harbor and rose to about 17 knots, with gusts to 20 knots (as measured by a hand held anemometer) as the afternoon went on. A neighbor in a motorboat passed by and took the pictures below. We had the boat well reefed down but still were doing 4 - 5 knots and occasionally getting up to 6 knots. Chris did most of the sailing - essentially single-handing as I provided rail beef and watched and learned. I was impressed by what the boat - and Chris - could do. I?ve been sailing a big boat (Island Packet 380) till I got the Rhodes last December and its entirely different. This sail provided an ?existence proof? and showed me a skill to aspire to. I?m looking forward to it. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: AAE74A78-7059-4B8D-B62A-DCE7C9DE57B4.jpeg Type: image/jpeg Size: 60030 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: E2C6D04D-1FDF-4973-8C7E-FF20D0D67EB7.jpeg Type: image/jpeg Size: 65487 bytes Desc: not available URL: From reuben.mezrich at gmail.com Tue Mar 23 14:44:37 2021 From: reuben.mezrich at gmail.com (Reuben Mezrich) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2021 14:44:37 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] a boisterous sail In-Reply-To: <011201d72000$b469cb40$1d3d61c0$@ebsmed.com> References: <27B4E965-6478-4D0B-9197-7904BBED5E04@gmail.com> <011201d72000$b469cb40$1d3d61c0$@ebsmed.com> Message-ID: Michael No more leaks!! It is indeed a terrific boat. --Reuben Reuben Mezrich Pelican Cove in Sarasota Cell: 410-499-8922 On Tue, Mar 23, 2021 at 12:22 PM Michael D. Weisner wrote: > Wow, what a great sail! Perfect weather! > > Minor leaks aside, you got a terrific boat. > > Enjoy! > > Mike > s/v Wind Lass ('91) > Nissequogue River, NY > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of > Reuben Mezrich > Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2021 11:58 AM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: [Rhodes22-list] a boisterous sail > > Last Wednesday Chris Geankoplis drove over from Fort Pierce to go for a > sail and give me some tips on how to sail and care for my new Rhodes 22. > The winds were about 15 knots when we got out to Little Sarasota Bay from > my harbor and rose to about 17 knots, with gusts to 20 knots (as measured > by a hand held anemometer) as the afternoon went on. A neighbor in a > motorboat passed by and took the pictures below. > > We had the boat well reefed down but still were doing 4 - 5 knots and > occasionally getting up to 6 knots. Chris did most of the sailing - > essentially single-handing as I provided rail beef and watched and learned. > I was impressed by what the boat - and Chris - could do. I?ve been sailing > a big boat (Island Packet 380) till I got the Rhodes last December and its > entirely different. This sail provided an ?existence proof? and showed me > a skill to aspire to. I?m looking forward to it. > > > > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: AAE74A78-7059-4B8D-B62A-DCE7C9DE57B4.jpeg > Type: image/jpeg > Size: 60030 bytes > Desc: not available > URL: < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210323/dabfefbc/attachment.jpeg > > > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: E2C6D04D-1FDF-4973-8C7E-FF20D0D67EB7.jpeg > Type: image/jpeg > Size: 65487 bytes > Desc: not available > URL: < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210323/dabfefbc/attachment-0001.jpeg > > > > From mm.bizlist1 at gmail.com Tue Mar 23 15:02:52 2021 From: mm.bizlist1 at gmail.com (Mike McKay) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2021 12:02:52 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] How to prevent mainsail UV damage? Message-ID: <1616526172142-0.post@n5.nabble.com> I recent acquired Liber, a 2006 R22 recycled in 2018. The 2018 mainsail failed at and near the Sunbrella seam due to UV exposure damage. My sailmaker patched in a panel to replace the damaged section, but it is clear that sunlight will always hit the sail inside the mast and it will become weaker over time due to UV exposure. A picture is attached. The prior owner told me to detach the clew from the outhaul car and wrap it around the mast when leaving the boat for a while (he got that suggestion from Tino at General Boats) but that would still leave a significant section of Dacron constantly exposed through the slot in the mast. Any suggestions for how to better protect the main from premature failure? Thanks, Mike McKay s/v Liber 2006/2018 -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From pbryanriley at gmail.com Tue Mar 23 15:26:51 2021 From: pbryanriley at gmail.com (PBR) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2021 15:26:51 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] How to prevent mainsail UV damage? In-Reply-To: <1616526172142-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1616526172142-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: Mike, You don't show a pic of the sail exposure when the outhaul is all the way out (sail in). It seems to me like you need one more wrap (or two) of the outhaul around the mainsail furling tube. I always have my mast down so I would just pull the furler to the bottom and add a wrap. If your Mast is up you might be able to fish around to add another wrap, not sure. Patrick On Tue, Mar 23, 2021 at 3:02 PM Mike McKay wrote: > I recent acquired Liber, a 2006 R22 recycled in 2018. The 2018 mainsail > failed at and near the Sunbrella seam due to UV exposure damage. My > sailmaker patched in a panel to replace the damaged section, but it is > clear > that sunlight will always hit the sail inside the mast and it will become > weaker over time due to UV exposure. A picture is attached. > > The prior owner told me to detach the clew from the outhaul car and wrap it > around the mast when leaving the boat for a while (he got that suggestion > from Tino at General Boats) but that would still leave a significant > section > of Dacron constantly exposed through the slot in the mast. > > Any suggestions for how to better protect the main from premature failure? > > Thanks, > > Mike McKay > s/v Liber 2006/2018 > > > > > > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > From blue66corvette at hotmail.com Tue Mar 23 15:41:31 2021 From: blue66corvette at hotmail.com (Charles Nieman) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2021 19:41:31 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] How to prevent mainsail UV damage? In-Reply-To: References: <1616526172142-0.post@n5.nabble.com>, Message-ID: Patrick is correct. You can easily fish the outhaul line around the furling tube to get one more turn and that should get all of your sail into the mast and stop the exposure. Don?t ask me how I know ;-) Sent from my iPhone Charles > On Mar 23, 2021, at 2:27 PM, PBR wrote: > > ?Mike, > You don't show a pic of the sail exposure when the outhaul is all the way > out (sail in). It seems to me like you need one more wrap (or two) of the > outhaul around the mainsail furling tube. I always have my mast down so I > would just pull the furler to the bottom and add a wrap. If your Mast is > up you might be able to fish around to add another wrap, not sure. > Patrick > > >> On Tue, Mar 23, 2021 at 3:02 PM Mike McKay wrote: >> >> I recent acquired Liber, a 2006 R22 recycled in 2018. The 2018 mainsail >> failed at and near the Sunbrella seam due to UV exposure damage. My >> sailmaker patched in a panel to replace the damaged section, but it is >> clear >> that sunlight will always hit the sail inside the mast and it will become >> weaker over time due to UV exposure. A picture is attached. >> >> The prior owner told me to detach the clew from the outhaul car and wrap it >> around the mast when leaving the boat for a while (he got that suggestion >> from Tino at General Boats) but that would still leave a significant >> section >> of Dacron constantly exposed through the slot in the mast. >> >> Any suggestions for how to better protect the main from premature failure? >> >> Thanks, >> >> Mike McKay >> s/v Liber 2006/2018 >> >> >> >> >> >> -- >> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ >> From mm.bizlist1 at gmail.com Tue Mar 23 15:44:08 2021 From: mm.bizlist1 at gmail.com (Michael McKay) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2021 15:44:08 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] How to prevent mainsail UV damage? In-Reply-To: References: <1616526172142-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: Thanks Patrick, my boat lives in its slip with the mast up all year, so a portion of the sail will always get some sun exposure through the slot in the mast. Unfortunately, it?s always the same 1? section of the sail. The only idea I?ve come up with is a zipped up Sunbrella sleeve to go around the mast?I?ve see those used for some roller furling headsails. Doing that would require adding a halyard to pull the sleeve up. I?m not sure how hard that would be. Any other suggestions? On Tue, Mar 23, 2021 at 3:27 PM PBR wrote: > Mike, > You don't show a pic of the sail exposure when the outhaul is all the way > out (sail in). It seems to me like you need one more wrap (or two) of the > outhaul around the mainsail furling tube. I always have my mast down so I > would just pull the furler to the bottom and add a wrap. If your Mast is > up you might be able to fish around to add another wrap, not sure. > Patrick > > > On Tue, Mar 23, 2021 at 3:02 PM Mike McKay wrote: > > > I recent acquired Liber, a 2006 R22 recycled in 2018. The 2018 mainsail > > failed at and near the Sunbrella seam due to UV exposure damage. My > > sailmaker patched in a panel to replace the damaged section, but it is > > clear > > that sunlight will always hit the sail inside the mast and it will become > > weaker over time due to UV exposure. A picture is attached. > > > > The prior owner told me to detach the clew from the outhaul car and wrap > it > > around the mast when leaving the boat for a while (he got that suggestion > > from Tino at General Boats) but that would still leave a significant > > section > > of Dacron constantly exposed through the slot in the mast. > > > > Any suggestions for how to better protect the main from premature > failure? > > > > Thanks, > > > > Mike McKay > > s/v Liber 2006/2018 > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > > > -- Michael McKay (mm.bizlist1 at gmail.com) From eandsmoore at hughes.net Tue Mar 23 15:53:12 2021 From: eandsmoore at hughes.net (Ellyn and Sam Moore) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2021 15:53:12 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] How to prevent mainsail UV damage? In-Reply-To: References: <1616526172142-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: Keep the boat turned to face the other way in your slip. Sam Moore ?77 Rhodes Continental > On Mar 23, 2021, at 3:44 PM, Michael McKay wrote: > > Thanks Patrick, my boat lives in its slip with the mast up all year, so a > portion of the sail will always get some sun exposure through the slot in > the mast. Unfortunately, it?s always the same 1? section of the sail. > > The only idea I?ve come up with is a zipped up Sunbrella sleeve to go > around the mast?I?ve see those used for some roller furling headsails. > Doing that would require adding a halyard to pull the sleeve up. I?m not > sure how hard that would be. > > Any other suggestions? > > On Tue, Mar 23, 2021 at 3:27 PM PBR wrote: > >> Mike, >> You don't show a pic of the sail exposure when the outhaul is all the way >> out (sail in). It seems to me like you need one more wrap (or two) of the >> outhaul around the mainsail furling tube. I always have my mast down so I >> would just pull the furler to the bottom and add a wrap. If your Mast is >> up you might be able to fish around to add another wrap, not sure. >> Patrick >> >> >> On Tue, Mar 23, 2021 at 3:02 PM Mike McKay wrote: >> >>> I recent acquired Liber, a 2006 R22 recycled in 2018. The 2018 mainsail >>> failed at and near the Sunbrella seam due to UV exposure damage. My >>> sailmaker patched in a panel to replace the damaged section, but it is >>> clear >>> that sunlight will always hit the sail inside the mast and it will become >>> weaker over time due to UV exposure. A picture is attached. >>> >>> The prior owner told me to detach the clew from the outhaul car and wrap >> it >>> around the mast when leaving the boat for a while (he got that suggestion >>> from Tino at General Boats) but that would still leave a significant >>> section >>> of Dacron constantly exposed through the slot in the mast. >>> >>> Any suggestions for how to better protect the main from premature >> failure? >>> >>> Thanks, >>> >>> Mike McKay >>> s/v Liber 2006/2018 >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ >>> >> > -- > Michael McKay (mm.bizlist1 at gmail.com) From joedempsey at hughes.net Tue Mar 23 16:19:54 2021 From: joedempsey at hughes.net (Joe Dempsey) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2021 13:19:54 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] How to prevent mainsail UV damage? In-Reply-To: <1616526172142-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1616526172142-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <1616530794088-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Keep your Rhodes headed South when not aboard. This will keep the slot facing North reducing UV light into it. ----- Joe Dempsey s/v Respite Rhodes 22 1989/2005 Deltaville,VA -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From joedempsey at hughes.net Tue Mar 23 16:24:40 2021 From: joedempsey at hughes.net (Joe Dempsey) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2021 13:24:40 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] How to prevent mainsail UV damage? In-Reply-To: <1616530794088-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1616526172142-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616530794088-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <1616531080391-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Charles is correct, fish the outhaul around the drum to get another wrap inside the mast. ----- Joe Dempsey s/v Respite Rhodes 22 1989/2005 Deltaville,VA -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From shawn.sustain at gmail.com Tue Mar 23 16:38:54 2021 From: shawn.sustain at gmail.com (Shawn Boles) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2021 13:38:54 -0700 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] a boisterous sail In-Reply-To: <27B4E965-6478-4D0B-9197-7904BBED5E04@gmail.com> References: <27B4E965-6478-4D0B-9197-7904BBED5E04@gmail.com> Message-ID: Hi Reuben: Chris is a good teacher and a fine sailor. He let me sail Enosis before I bought Sweet Baboo. So Chis, are you willing to talk a little about sail balance in 15+ winds? In the first photo, if you dropped the boom, leaving jib as is, would you pull out more main and/or change traveler setting? Cheers, Shawn s/v Sweet Baboo On Tue, Mar 23, 2021, 8:58 AM Reuben Mezrich wrote: > Last Wednesday Chris Geankoplis drove over from Fort Pierce to go for a > sail and give me some tips on how to sail and care for my new Rhodes 22. > The winds were about 15 knots when we got out to Little Sarasota Bay from > my harbor and rose to about 17 knots, with gusts to 20 knots (as measured > by a hand held anemometer) as the afternoon went on. A neighbor in a > motorboat passed by and took the pictures below. > > We had the boat well reefed down but still were doing 4 - 5 knots and > occasionally getting up to 6 knots. Chris did most of the sailing - > essentially single-handing as I provided rail beef and watched and learned. > I was impressed by what the boat - and Chris - could do. I?ve been sailing > a big boat (Island Packet 380) till I got the Rhodes last December and its > entirely different. This sail provided an ?existence proof? and showed me > a skill to aspire to. I?m looking forward to it. > > > > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: AAE74A78-7059-4B8D-B62A-DCE7C9DE57B4.jpeg > Type: image/jpeg > Size: 60030 bytes > Desc: not available > URL: < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210323/dabfefbc/attachment.jpeg > > > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: E2C6D04D-1FDF-4973-8C7E-FF20D0D67EB7.jpeg > Type: image/jpeg > Size: 65487 bytes > Desc: not available > URL: < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210323/dabfefbc/attachment-0001.jpeg > > > From mm.bizlist1 at gmail.com Tue Mar 23 17:24:35 2021 From: mm.bizlist1 at gmail.com (Michael McKay) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2021 17:24:35 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] How to prevent mainsail UV damage? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4A3C01BD-B79F-42B4-9343-4B46DD1F2390@gmail.com> That?s a good idea, my slip is East-West. My stern faces East so that?s the best I can do. I don?t know the orientation where the prior owner had it?I?m just trying to avoid a repeat problem. Thanks, Michael McKay (630) 209-2054 (m) Sent from my iPhone > On Mar 23, 2021, at 3:53 PM, Ellyn and Sam Moore wrote: > > ?Keep the boat turned to face the other way in your slip. > > Sam Moore ?77 Rhodes Continental > >> On Mar 23, 2021, at 3:44 PM, Michael McKay wrote: >> >> Thanks Patrick, my boat lives in its slip with the mast up all year, so a >> portion of the sail will always get some sun exposure through the slot in >> the mast. Unfortunately, it?s always the same 1? section of the sail. >> >> The only idea I?ve come up with is a zipped up Sunbrella sleeve to go >> around the mast?I?ve see those used for some roller furling headsails. >> Doing that would require adding a halyard to pull the sleeve up. I?m not >> sure how hard that would be. >> >> Any other suggestions? >> >>> On Tue, Mar 23, 2021 at 3:27 PM PBR wrote: >>> >>> Mike, >>> You don't show a pic of the sail exposure when the outhaul is all the way >>> out (sail in). It seems to me like you need one more wrap (or two) of the >>> outhaul around the mainsail furling tube. I always have my mast down so I >>> would just pull the furler to the bottom and add a wrap. If your Mast is >>> up you might be able to fish around to add another wrap, not sure. >>> Patrick >>> >>> >>>> On Tue, Mar 23, 2021 at 3:02 PM Mike McKay wrote: >>> >>>> I recent acquired Liber, a 2006 R22 recycled in 2018. The 2018 mainsail >>>> failed at and near the Sunbrella seam due to UV exposure damage. My >>>> sailmaker patched in a panel to replace the damaged section, but it is >>>> clear >>>> that sunlight will always hit the sail inside the mast and it will become >>>> weaker over time due to UV exposure. A picture is attached. >>>> >>>> The prior owner told me to detach the clew from the outhaul car and wrap >>> it >>>> around the mast when leaving the boat for a while (he got that suggestion >>>> from Tino at General Boats) but that would still leave a significant >>>> section >>>> of Dacron constantly exposed through the slot in the mast. >>>> >>>> Any suggestions for how to better protect the main from premature >>> failure? >>>> >>>> Thanks, >>>> >>>> Mike McKay >>>> s/v Liber 2006/2018 >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ >>>> >>> >> -- >> Michael McKay (mm.bizlist1 at gmail.com) > From rlowe at vt.edu Tue Mar 23 17:32:23 2021 From: rlowe at vt.edu (Lowe, Rob) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2021 21:32:23 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] How to prevent mainsail UV damage? In-Reply-To: <4A3C01BD-B79F-42B4-9343-4B46DD1F2390@gmail.com> References: , <4A3C01BD-B79F-42B4-9343-4B46DD1F2390@gmail.com> Message-ID: Probably getting that edge inside the mast would help to. The colored part is Sunbrella already. The white part is not. - rob ________________________________ From: Rhodes22-list on behalf of Michael McKay Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2021 5:24 PM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] How to prevent mainsail UV damage? That?s a good idea, my slip is East-West. My stern faces East so that?s the best I can do. I don?t know the orientation where the prior owner had it?I?m just trying to avoid a repeat problem. Thanks, Michael McKay (630) 209-2054 (m) Sent from my iPhone > On Mar 23, 2021, at 3:53 PM, Ellyn and Sam Moore wrote: > > ?Keep the boat turned to face the other way in your slip. > > Sam Moore ?77 Rhodes Continental > >> On Mar 23, 2021, at 3:44 PM, Michael McKay wrote: >> >> Thanks Patrick, my boat lives in its slip with the mast up all year, so a >> portion of the sail will always get some sun exposure through the slot in >> the mast. Unfortunately, it?s always the same 1? section of the sail. >> >> The only idea I?ve come up with is a zipped up Sunbrella sleeve to go >> around the mast?I?ve see those used for some roller furling headsails. >> Doing that would require adding a halyard to pull the sleeve up. I?m not >> sure how hard that would be. >> >> Any other suggestions? >> >>> On Tue, Mar 23, 2021 at 3:27 PM PBR wrote: >>> >>> Mike, >>> You don't show a pic of the sail exposure when the outhaul is all the way >>> out (sail in). It seems to me like you need one more wrap (or two) of the >>> outhaul around the mainsail furling tube. I always have my mast down so I >>> would just pull the furler to the bottom and add a wrap. If your Mast is >>> up you might be able to fish around to add another wrap, not sure. >>> Patrick >>> >>> >>>> On Tue, Mar 23, 2021 at 3:02 PM Mike McKay wrote: >>> >>>> I recent acquired Liber, a 2006 R22 recycled in 2018. The 2018 mainsail >>>> failed at and near the Sunbrella seam due to UV exposure damage. My >>>> sailmaker patched in a panel to replace the damaged section, but it is >>>> clear >>>> that sunlight will always hit the sail inside the mast and it will become >>>> weaker over time due to UV exposure. A picture is attached. >>>> >>>> The prior owner told me to detach the clew from the outhaul car and wrap >>> it >>>> around the mast when leaving the boat for a while (he got that suggestion >>>> from Tino at General Boats) but that would still leave a significant >>>> section >>>> of Dacron constantly exposed through the slot in the mast. >>>> >>>> Any suggestions for how to better protect the main from premature >>> failure? >>>> >>>> Thanks, >>>> >>>> Mike McKay >>>> s/v Liber 2006/2018 >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ >>>> >>> >> -- >> Michael McKay (mm.bizlist1 at gmail.com) > From snstaum at gmail.com Tue Mar 23 17:38:44 2021 From: snstaum at gmail.com (Stephen Staum) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2021 17:38:44 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] How to prevent mainsail UV damage? In-Reply-To: <1616526172142-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1616526172142-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: I have been on a mooring for 17 years. Upgraded from the original main 7 years ago. No problem with sun damage. Stephen Staum s/v Carol Lee 2 Needham, MA On Tue, Mar 23, 2021 at 3:02 PM Mike McKay wrote: > I recent acquired Liber, a 2006 R22 recycled in 2018. The 2018 mainsail > failed at and near the Sunbrella seam due to UV exposure damage. My > sailmaker patched in a panel to replace the damaged section, but it is > clear > that sunlight will always hit the sail inside the mast and it will become > weaker over time due to UV exposure. A picture is attached. > > The prior owner told me to detach the clew from the outhaul car and wrap it > around the mast when leaving the boat for a while (he got that suggestion > from Tino at General Boats) but that would still leave a significant > section > of Dacron constantly exposed through the slot in the mast. > > Any suggestions for how to better protect the main from premature failure? > > Thanks, > > Mike McKay > s/v Liber 2006/2018 > > > > > > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > -- Thanks and Stay Well, Stephen Staum Pariser Industries, Inc. From jesse.laten.shumaker at gmail.com Tue Mar 23 18:08:25 2021 From: jesse.laten.shumaker at gmail.com (Jesse Shumaker) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2021 17:08:25 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] a boisterous sail In-Reply-To: <27B4E965-6478-4D0B-9197-7904BBED5E04@gmail.com> References: <27B4E965-6478-4D0B-9197-7904BBED5E04@gmail.com> Message-ID: Sounds like fun! Thanks for sharing the photos and story. Jesse Shumaker S/V Zephyr On Tue, Mar 23, 2021 at 10:58 AM Reuben Mezrich wrote: > Last Wednesday Chris Geankoplis drove over from Fort Pierce to go for a > sail and give me some tips on how to sail and care for my new Rhodes 22. > The winds were about 15 knots when we got out to Little Sarasota Bay from > my harbor and rose to about 17 knots, with gusts to 20 knots (as measured > by a hand held anemometer) as the afternoon went on. A neighbor in a > motorboat passed by and took the pictures below. > > We had the boat well reefed down but still were doing 4 - 5 knots and > occasionally getting up to 6 knots. Chris did most of the sailing - > essentially single-handing as I provided rail beef and watched and learned. > I was impressed by what the boat - and Chris - could do. I?ve been sailing > a big boat (Island Packet 380) till I got the Rhodes last December and its > entirely different. This sail provided an ?existence proof? and showed me > a skill to aspire to. I?m looking forward to it. > > > > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: AAE74A78-7059-4B8D-B62A-DCE7C9DE57B4.jpeg > Type: image/jpeg > Size: 60030 bytes > Desc: not available > URL: < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210323/dabfefbc/attachment.jpeg > > > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: E2C6D04D-1FDF-4973-8C7E-FF20D0D67EB7.jpeg > Type: image/jpeg > Size: 65487 bytes > Desc: not available > URL: < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210323/dabfefbc/attachment-0001.jpeg > > > From jesse.laten.shumaker at gmail.com Tue Mar 23 18:18:25 2021 From: jesse.laten.shumaker at gmail.com (Jesse Shumaker) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2021 17:18:25 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] How to prevent mainsail UV damage? In-Reply-To: References: <1616526172142-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: Hi Michael, My mainsail had some UV damage prior to when I bought it since some dacron had been exposed like you mentioned. I addressed the furling issue by adding another wrap as others described. I used some sail tape as a patch between the sunbrella and the dacron on the foot which helped support the damage in that area. However, during a particularly "boisterous" sail in lively conditions during our club regatta at the end of last season, the dacron started to tear where it meets the mainsail. This winter, the local sail repair guy added a patch to extend the sunbrella a few inches further so the sunbrella section will enter the mast by a couple inches or so since there was room to spare. I'll see how the repair holds up when I get the boat back in the water in May. Jesse Shumaker S/V Zephyr On Tue, Mar 23, 2021 at 2:44 PM Michael McKay wrote: > Thanks Patrick, my boat lives in its slip with the mast up all year, so a > portion of the sail will always get some sun exposure through the slot in > the mast. Unfortunately, it?s always the same 1? section of the sail. > > The only idea I?ve come up with is a zipped up Sunbrella sleeve to go > around the mast?I?ve see those used for some roller furling headsails. > Doing that would require adding a halyard to pull the sleeve up. I?m not > sure how hard that would be. > > Any other suggestions? > > On Tue, Mar 23, 2021 at 3:27 PM PBR wrote: > > > Mike, > > You don't show a pic of the sail exposure when the outhaul is all the way > > out (sail in). It seems to me like you need one more wrap (or two) of > the > > outhaul around the mainsail furling tube. I always have my mast down so > I > > would just pull the furler to the bottom and add a wrap. If your Mast is > > up you might be able to fish around to add another wrap, not sure. > > Patrick > > > > > > On Tue, Mar 23, 2021 at 3:02 PM Mike McKay > wrote: > > > > > I recent acquired Liber, a 2006 R22 recycled in 2018. The 2018 > mainsail > > > failed at and near the Sunbrella seam due to UV exposure damage. My > > > sailmaker patched in a panel to replace the damaged section, but it is > > > clear > > > that sunlight will always hit the sail inside the mast and it will > become > > > weaker over time due to UV exposure. A picture is attached. > > > > > > The prior owner told me to detach the clew from the outhaul car and > wrap > > it > > > around the mast when leaving the boat for a while (he got that > suggestion > > > from Tino at General Boats) but that would still leave a significant > > > section > > > of Dacron constantly exposed through the slot in the mast. > > > > > > Any suggestions for how to better protect the main from premature > > failure? > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > Mike McKay > > > s/v Liber 2006/2018 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > > > > > > -- > Michael McKay (mm.bizlist1 at gmail.com) > From mweisner at ebsmed.com Tue Mar 23 18:18:59 2021 From: mweisner at ebsmed.com (Michael D. Weisner) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2021 18:18:59 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] How to prevent mainsail UV damage? In-Reply-To: References: <1616526172142-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <006201d72032$86a2aa60$93e7ff20$@ebsmed.com> I, too, am on a mooring for many years. I was wondering how I was supposed to keep the boat pointed properly to minimize sail UV exposure as she turns continuously in response to winds and currents. Perhaps it is the constant movement that protects the sail from damage by varying the UV exposure orientation. Another way to make sure that the sail is not constantly exposed in the same orientation is to sail as frequently as possible. I'll have to use that excuse on the admiral to justify disappearing for a sail and a beer. "I'm evening out the UV exposure of the main." Sounds good to me! Mike s/v Wind Lass ('91) Nissequogue River, NY I?d rather be sailing :~) -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of Stephen Staum Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2021 5:39 PM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] How to prevent mainsail UV damage? I have been on a mooring for 17 years. Upgraded from the original main 7 years ago. No problem with sun damage. Stephen Staum s/v Carol Lee 2 Needham, MA On Tue, Mar 23, 2021 at 3:02 PM Mike McKay wrote: > I recent acquired Liber, a 2006 R22 recycled in 2018. The 2018 > mainsail failed at and near the Sunbrella seam due to UV exposure > damage. My sailmaker patched in a panel to replace the damaged > section, but it is clear that sunlight will always hit the sail inside > the mast and it will become > weaker over time due to UV exposure. A picture is attached. > > The prior owner told me to detach the clew from the outhaul car and > wrap it around the mast when leaving the boat for a while (he got that > suggestion from Tino at General Boats) but that would still leave a > significant section of Dacron constantly exposed through the slot in > the mast. > > Any suggestions for how to better protect the main from premature failure? > > Thanks, > > Mike McKay > s/v Liber 2006/2018 > > > > > > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > -- Thanks and Stay Well, Stephen Staum Pariser Industries, Inc. From chrisgeankoplis at gmail.com Tue Mar 23 18:22:34 2021 From: chrisgeankoplis at gmail.com (Chris Geankoplis) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2021 18:22:34 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] a boisterous sail In-Reply-To: References: <27B4E965-6478-4D0B-9197-7904BBED5E04@gmail.com> Message-ID: Aww Shawn, that sounds like too much work. But yes, that would have been the next step if it started to be a steady 20 kts. I really enjoyed the sail with Ruben. On Tue, Mar 23, 2021 at 4:39 PM Shawn Boles wrote: > Hi Reuben: > > Chris is a good teacher and a fine sailor. He let me sail Enosis before I > bought Sweet Baboo. > > So Chis, are you willing to talk a little about sail balance in 15+ winds? > In the first photo, if you dropped the boom, leaving jib as is, would you > pull out more main and/or change traveler setting? > > Cheers, > Shawn > s/v Sweet Baboo > > > > On Tue, Mar 23, 2021, 8:58 AM Reuben Mezrich > wrote: > > > Last Wednesday Chris Geankoplis drove over from Fort Pierce to go for a > > sail and give me some tips on how to sail and care for my new Rhodes 22. > > The winds were about 15 knots when we got out to Little Sarasota Bay from > > my harbor and rose to about 17 knots, with gusts to 20 knots (as measured > > by a hand held anemometer) as the afternoon went on. A neighbor in a > > motorboat passed by and took the pictures below. > > > > We had the boat well reefed down but still were doing 4 - 5 knots and > > occasionally getting up to 6 knots. Chris did most of the sailing - > > essentially single-handing as I provided rail beef and watched and > learned. > > I was impressed by what the boat - and Chris - could do. I?ve been > sailing > > a big boat (Island Packet 380) till I got the Rhodes last December and > its > > entirely different. This sail provided an ?existence proof? and showed > me > > a skill to aspire to. I?m looking forward to it. > > > > > > > > -------------- next part -------------- > > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > > Name: AAE74A78-7059-4B8D-B62A-DCE7C9DE57B4.jpeg > > Type: image/jpeg > > Size: 60030 bytes > > Desc: not available > > URL: < > > > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210323/dabfefbc/attachment.jpeg > > > > > -------------- next part -------------- > > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > > Name: E2C6D04D-1FDF-4973-8C7E-FF20D0D67EB7.jpeg > > Type: image/jpeg > > Size: 65487 bytes > > Desc: not available > > URL: < > > > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210323/dabfefbc/attachment-0001.jpeg > > > > > > From cjlowe at sssnet.com Tue Mar 23 20:34:41 2021 From: cjlowe at sssnet.com (cjlowe at sssnet.com) Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2021 20:34:41 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] How to prevent mainsail UV damage? In-Reply-To: <006201d72032$86a2aa60$93e7ff20$@ebsmed.com> References: <1616526172142-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <006201d72032$86a2aa60$93e7ff20$@ebsmed.com> Message-ID: <59284.24.140.30.102.1616546081.squirrel@quickpop.sssnet.com> The mast slot lets light hit about one third of the wrap on the sail. If you vary how far in you furl the sail, you can some what limit the exposure by presenting a different part of the wrap to the mast slot. Jerry Lowe > I, too, am on a mooring for many years. I was wondering how I was supposed > to keep the boat pointed properly to minimize sail UV exposure as she > turns continuously in response to winds and currents. Perhaps it is the > constant movement that protects the sail from damage by varying the UV > exposure orientation. > > Another way to make sure that the sail is not constantly exposed in the > same orientation is to sail as frequently as possible. I'll have to use > that excuse on the admiral to justify disappearing for a sail and a beer. > "I'm evening out the UV exposure of the main." > > Sounds good to me! > > Mike > s/v Wind Lass ('91) > Nissequogue River, NY > I???d rather be sailing :~) > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of > Stephen Staum > Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2021 5:39 PM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] How to prevent mainsail UV damage? > > I have been on a mooring for 17 years. Upgraded from the original main 7 > years ago. No problem with sun damage. > > Stephen Staum > s/v Carol Lee 2 > Needham, MA > > On Tue, Mar 23, 2021 at 3:02 PM Mike McKay wrote: > >> I recent acquired Liber, a 2006 R22 recycled in 2018. The 2018 >> mainsail failed at and near the Sunbrella seam due to UV exposure >> damage. My sailmaker patched in a panel to replace the damaged >> section, but it is clear that sunlight will always hit the sail inside >> the mast and it will become >> weaker over time due to UV exposure. A picture is attached. >> >> The prior owner told me to detach the clew from the outhaul car and >> wrap it around the mast when leaving the boat for a while (he got that >> suggestion from Tino at General Boats) but that would still leave a >> significant section of Dacron constantly exposed through the slot in >> the mast. >> >> Any suggestions for how to better protect the main from premature >> failure? >> >> Thanks, >> >> Mike McKay >> s/v Liber 2006/2018 >> >> >> >> >> >> -- >> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ >> > -- > Thanks and Stay Well, > Stephen Staum > Pariser Industries, Inc. > > From rlowe at vt.edu Wed Mar 24 07:57:09 2021 From: rlowe at vt.edu (Lowe, Rob) Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2021 11:57:09 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] a boisterous sail In-Reply-To: References: <27B4E965-6478-4D0B-9197-7904BBED5E04@gmail.com>, Message-ID: Reuben, Cherish those moments and take inspiration from them. There is nothing like having someone who knows how to handle a boat show you what's she's capable of doing. Chris is one of the better sailors on the list. Maybe one day you will be able to show the next sailor how it's done! Have fun with your boat. - Rob ________________________________ From: Rhodes22-list on behalf of Jesse Shumaker Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2021 6:08 PM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] a boisterous sail Sounds like fun! Thanks for sharing the photos and story. Jesse Shumaker S/V Zephyr On Tue, Mar 23, 2021 at 10:58 AM Reuben Mezrich wrote: > Last Wednesday Chris Geankoplis drove over from Fort Pierce to go for a > sail and give me some tips on how to sail and care for my new Rhodes 22. > The winds were about 15 knots when we got out to Little Sarasota Bay from > my harbor and rose to about 17 knots, with gusts to 20 knots (as measured > by a hand held anemometer) as the afternoon went on. A neighbor in a > motorboat passed by and took the pictures below. > > We had the boat well reefed down but still were doing 4 - 5 knots and > occasionally getting up to 6 knots. Chris did most of the sailing - > essentially single-handing as I provided rail beef and watched and learned. > I was impressed by what the boat - and Chris - could do. I?ve been sailing > a big boat (Island Packet 380) till I got the Rhodes last December and its > entirely different. This sail provided an ?existence proof? and showed me > a skill to aspire to. I?m looking forward to it. > > > > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: AAE74A78-7059-4B8D-B62A-DCE7C9DE57B4.jpeg > Type: image/jpeg > Size: 60030 bytes > Desc: not available > URL: < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210323/dabfefbc/attachment.jpeg > > > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: E2C6D04D-1FDF-4973-8C7E-FF20D0D67EB7.jpeg > Type: image/jpeg > Size: 65487 bytes > Desc: not available > URL: < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210323/dabfefbc/attachment-0001.jpeg > > > From gstewart8 at cogeco.ca Wed Mar 24 09:10:29 2021 From: gstewart8 at cogeco.ca (Graham Stewart) Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2021 09:10:29 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] a boisterous sail In-Reply-To: References: <27B4E965-6478-4D0B-9197-7904BBED5E04@gmail.com> Message-ID: <007f01d720af$11aff9b0$350fed10$@ca> Reuben: You are a lucky guy. I have never has the opportunity to sail with anyone who had a clue about sailing and have just muddled through the hard way. I would give my left elbow to have that experience with Chris. Graham Stewart Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 Kingston Ontario -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf Of Lowe, Rob Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2021 7:57 AM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] a boisterous sail Reuben, Cherish those moments and take inspiration from them. There is nothing like having someone who knows how to handle a boat show you what's she's capable of doing. Chris is one of the better sailors on the list. Maybe one day you will be able to show the next sailor how it's done! Have fun with your boat. - Rob ________________________________ From: Rhodes22-list on behalf of Jesse Shumaker Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2021 6:08 PM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] a boisterous sail Sounds like fun! Thanks for sharing the photos and story. Jesse Shumaker S/V Zephyr On Tue, Mar 23, 2021 at 10:58 AM Reuben Mezrich wrote: > Last Wednesday Chris Geankoplis drove over from Fort Pierce to go for a > sail and give me some tips on how to sail and care for my new Rhodes 22. > The winds were about 15 knots when we got out to Little Sarasota Bay from > my harbor and rose to about 17 knots, with gusts to 20 knots (as measured > by a hand held anemometer) as the afternoon went on. A neighbor in a > motorboat passed by and took the pictures below. > > We had the boat well reefed down but still were doing 4 - 5 knots and > occasionally getting up to 6 knots. Chris did most of the sailing - > essentially single-handing as I provided rail beef and watched and learned. > I was impressed by what the boat - and Chris - could do. I've been sailing > a big boat (Island Packet 380) till I got the Rhodes last December and its > entirely different. This sail provided an "existence proof" and showed me > a skill to aspire to. I'm looking forward to it. > > > > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: AAE74A78-7059-4B8D-B62A-DCE7C9DE57B4.jpeg > Type: image/jpeg > Size: 60030 bytes > Desc: not available > URL: < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210323/dabfefbc/at tachment.jpeg > > > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: E2C6D04D-1FDF-4973-8C7E-FF20D0D67EB7.jpeg > Type: image/jpeg > Size: 65487 bytes > Desc: not available > URL: < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210323/dabfefbc/at tachment-0001.jpeg > > > From jeffsmithphoto at gmail.com Wed Mar 24 09:13:51 2021 From: jeffsmithphoto at gmail.com (JeffSmith) Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2021 06:13:51 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] New Traveler Modifications Message-ID: <1616591631222-0.post@n5.nabble.com> When sailing to weather I like to play the traveler (as opposed to the main sheet) in the puffs while sitting on the high side cockpit combing with the hiking stick. A continuous 5mm line with the core removed where it travels through the blocks on the New Traveler and possibly changing the purchase from 5 to 1 to 3 to 1 is part of my plan. Before holes are drilled in the cockpit sides to accomodate turning blocks to lead the continuous line forward around the perimeter of the cockpit, I would welcome input. ----- Jeff Smith 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor Atlantic Highlands, NJ -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From ric at stottarchitecture.com Wed Mar 24 10:20:48 2021 From: ric at stottarchitecture.com (Richard Stott) Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2021 10:20:48 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] New Traveler Modifications In-Reply-To: <1616591631222-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1616591631222-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: Stan?s traveler works pretty well but is not that great for fast. Serious mods are possible for a quick acting traveller, but getting used to dumping the main sheet is less expensive. Different boats require different techniques. Try some options before you revert to old habits. My2? Ric Dadventure Hampton /bays Richard Stott, AIA, LEED AP www.stottarchitecture.com Office 631-283-1777 Cell 516-965-3164 > On Mar 24, 2021, at 9:13 AM, JeffSmith wrote: > > When sailing to weather I like to play the traveler (as opposed to the main > sheet) in the puffs while sitting on the high side cockpit combing with the > hiking stick. > A continuous 5mm line with the core removed where it travels through the > blocks on the New Traveler and possibly changing the purchase from 5 to 1 to > 3 to 1 is part of my plan. Before holes are drilled in the cockpit sides to > accomodate turning blocks to lead the continuous line forward around the > perimeter of the cockpit, I would welcome input. > > > > ----- > Jeff Smith > 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT > Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor > Atlantic Highlands, NJ > > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From sloopblueheron at gmail.com Wed Mar 24 11:25:02 2021 From: sloopblueheron at gmail.com (Rick Lange) Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2021 11:25:02 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] New Traveler Modifications In-Reply-To: <1616591631222-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1616591631222-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: Jeff, Why the traveller? The sheet is so much faster and gives greater range of boom movement. Rick Lange On Wed, Mar 24, 2021, 9:13 AM JeffSmith wrote: > When sailing to weather I like to play the traveler (as opposed to the main > sheet) in the puffs while sitting on the high side cockpit combing with the > hiking stick. > A continuous 5mm line with the core removed where it travels through the > blocks on the New Traveler and possibly changing the purchase from 5 to 1 > to > 3 to 1 is part of my plan. Before holes are drilled in the cockpit sides to > accomodate turning blocks to lead the continuous line forward around the > perimeter of the cockpit, I would welcome input. > > > > ----- > Jeff Smith > 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT > Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor > Atlantic Highlands, NJ > > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > From bobfcohen at gmail.com Wed Mar 24 11:55:27 2021 From: bobfcohen at gmail.com (bobfcohen at gmail.com) Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2021 11:55:27 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] BURGEE ORDERING INSTRUCTIONS In-Reply-To: <1616102333772-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1615316576867-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616102333772-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <009901d720c6$1c7f7ed0$557e7c70$@gmail.com> Thanks, Joe. I am ordering mine today. Bob Cohen -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of Joe Dempsey Sent: Thursday, March 18, 2021 5:19 PM To: rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] BURGEE ORDERING INSTRUCTIONS Da List has really come through on ordering your "official" Rhodes 22 Association burgees! To date 50 have been ordered, several of you have ordered more than one. If you haven't yet ordered, hurry and get your order in if you want yours for this sailing season. TYPE THE FOLLOWING: Please send ____ 15? X 18? RHODES 22 Burgee(s) at $29.95 to: NAME, SHIPPING ADDRESS Your phone number (for Cindy to call for your payment information) Email above to Herb at Halling.com or a secondary email is Cindy.Halling1 at gmail.com PLEASE cc: joedempsey at hughes.net Expect a return call from Cindy Halling : (562) 252-6005 for your payment information. You could call her instead of emailing, but expect her to have to call you back anyway. NOTE: Your card statement will show the billing as OPB Entertainment. ----- Joe Dempsey s/v Respite Rhodes 22 1989/2005 Deltaville,VA -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From roger_pihlaja at msn.com Wed Mar 24 12:12:14 2021 From: roger_pihlaja at msn.com (ROGER PIHLAJA) Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2021 16:12:14 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications In-Reply-To: References: <1616591631222-0.post@n5.nabble.com>, Message-ID: Rick, When you ease the traveler, the end of the boom does not rise as it does when you ease the mainsheet. Thus the mainsail shape is affected much less when you ease the traveler vs the mainsheet. When you trim the traveler back to where it was, the flow reattaches itself much quicker. Overall, boat speed stays higher. That?s why you play the traveler much more than the mainsheet. Roger Pihlaja S/V Dynamic Equilibrium Sent from my iPhone > On Mar 24, 2021, at 11:25 AM, Rick Lange Trim the trawrote: > > ?Jeff, > > Why the traveller? The sheet is so much faster and gives greater range of > boom movement. > > Rick Lange > >> On Wed, Mar 24, 2021, 9:13 AM JeffSmith wrote: >> >> When sailing to weather I like to play the traveler (as opposed to the main >> sheet) in the puffs while sitting on the high side cockpit combing with the >> hiking stick. >> A continuous 5mm line with the core removed where it travels through the >> blocks on the New Traveler and possibly changing the purchase from 5 to 1 >> to >> 3 to 1 is part of my plan. Before holes are drilled in the cockpit sides to >> accomodate turning blocks to lead the continuous line forward around the >> perimeter of the cockpit, I would welcome input. >> >> >> >> ----- >> Jeff Smith >> 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT >> Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor >> Atlantic Highlands, NJ >> >> -- >> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ >> From jeffsmithphoto at gmail.com Wed Mar 24 13:06:47 2021 From: jeffsmithphoto at gmail.com (JeffSmith) Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2021 10:06:47 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications In-Reply-To: References: <1616591631222-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <1616605607584-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Thank you Roger. Couldn't have said it better myself. Fast is fun. ----- Jeff Smith 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor Atlantic Highlands, NJ -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From roger_pihlaja at msn.com Wed Mar 24 13:48:51 2021 From: roger_pihlaja at msn.com (ROGER PIHLAJA) Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2021 17:48:51 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications In-Reply-To: References: <1616591631222-0.post@n5.nabble.com>, , Message-ID: Rick, My 1976 Rhodes Continental 22 came with a cable style traveler. This was not a very good setup and I soon upgraded to the GBI bar-style traveler that is mounted on the backstay. This traveler was much better and I used it for many years. However, because the mainsail trimmer needed to be in line with the clam cleats on each end of the traveler bar in order to cleat off the control line, it was very difficult for the helmsman to also play the traveler. This was especially an issue when the helmsman was sitting up on the windward gunnel (i.e. hiking out) and the traveler needed to be trimmed to leeward. GBI?s 2nd (3rd?) generation traveler pretty much solves all these issues. Properly adjusted, the latest generation traveler has a built-in slip characteristic that will save you in an accidental gibe or a knockdown gust. The traveler control line is a continuous loop, which enables the helmsman to play the traveler to windward or leeward without leaving his hiking station up on the windward gunnel. The helmsman drives with one hand on the tiller extension, the other on the traveler control line, and multitasks. The helmsman can feel the weather/lee helm pressure thru the tiller and is in the best position to adjust the traveler to optimize the weather helm/lee helm balance. I?ve been sailing with the new generation traveler for 3 seasons now. If you care about boat speed and sail short handed, this upgrade is well worth the price! On a close hauled course in 10-15 knot of wind, If you get into a drag race with another Rhodes 22 that is properly using its latest generation traveler vs you using your mainsheet, you will fall behind by ~30-40 sec/nm. In a PHRF race, that?s huge! Other than buying new sails, there is probably no other upgrade that offers this much performance per dollar spent. Roger Pihlaja S/V Dynamic Equilibrium Sent from Mail for Windows 10 From: ROGER PIHLAJA Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2021 12:12 PM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications Rick, When you ease the traveler, the end of the boom does not rise as it does when you ease the mainsheet. Thus the mainsail shape is affected much less when you ease the traveler vs the mainsheet. When you trim the traveler back to where it was, the flow reattaches itself much quicker. Overall, boat speed stays higher. That?s why you play the traveler much more than the mainsheet. Roger Pihlaja S/V Dynamic Equilibrium Sent from my iPhone > On Mar 24, 2021, at 11:25 AM, Rick Lange Trim the trawrote: > > ?Jeff, > > Why the traveller? The sheet is so much faster and gives greater range of > boom movement. > > Rick Lange > >> On Wed, Mar 24, 2021, 9:13 AM JeffSmith wrote: >> >> When sailing to weather I like to play the traveler (as opposed to the main >> sheet) in the puffs while sitting on the high side cockpit combing with the >> hiking stick. >> A continuous 5mm line with the core removed where it travels through the >> blocks on the New Traveler and possibly changing the purchase from 5 to 1 >> to >> 3 to 1 is part of my plan. Before holes are drilled in the cockpit sides to >> accomodate turning blocks to lead the continuous line forward around the >> perimeter of the cockpit, I would welcome input. >> >> >> >> ----- >> Jeff Smith >> 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT >> Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor >> Atlantic Highlands, NJ >> >> -- >> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ >> From sloopblueheron at gmail.com Wed Mar 24 16:20:30 2021 From: sloopblueheron at gmail.com (Rick Lange) Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2021 16:20:30 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications In-Reply-To: References: <1616591631222-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: Roger, We're talking about sailing close hauled in a stiff breeze (15-20knt) with sudden gusts that will round up the boat. The only mainsail shape that matters during a gust is the shape that quickly dumps enough wind to keep the boat on course without luffing the jib and, in the case of the R22, sailing flat. Easing the main sheet is the quickest way to react while affording the tactile control needed to ease and recover appropriately as the gust varies. In addition to being quicker than a traveller can move, sheet control is not as restrictive as a traveller in allowing greater boom motion for dumping enough wind when there is a really strong gust. For small sloops up to 32', sailing close hauled by feeling sheet tension is the fastest way to go. I have sailed with totally blind crews and they sail closer to the wind than many sighted sailors distracted by watching sail shape. Regards, Rick Lange On Wed, Mar 24, 2021 at 1:48 PM ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: > Rick, > > My 1976 Rhodes Continental 22 came with a cable style traveler. This was > not a very good setup and I soon upgraded to the GBI bar-style traveler > that is mounted on the backstay. This traveler was much better and I used > it for many years. However, because the mainsail trimmer needed to be in > line with the clam cleats on each end of the traveler bar in order to cleat > off the control line, it was very difficult for the helmsman to also play > the traveler. This was especially an issue when the helmsman was sitting > up on the windward gunnel (i.e. hiking out) and the traveler needed to be > trimmed to leeward. GBI?s 2nd > (3rd?) generation traveler pretty much solves all these issues. Properly > adjusted, the latest generation traveler has a built-in slip characteristic > that will save you in an accidental gibe or a knockdown gust. The > traveler control line is a continuous loop, which enables the helmsman to > play the traveler to windward or leeward without leaving his hiking station > up on the windward gunnel. The helmsman drives with one hand on the tiller > extension, the other on the traveler control line, and multitasks. The > helmsman can feel the weather/lee helm pressure thru the tiller and is in > the best position to adjust the traveler to optimize the weather helm/lee > helm balance. I?ve been sailing with the new generation traveler for 3 > seasons now. If you care about boat speed and sail short handed, this > upgrade is well worth the price! On a close hauled course in 10-15 knot of > wind, If you get into a drag race with another Rhodes 22 that is properly > using its latest generation traveler vs you using your mainsheet, you will > fall behind by ~30-40 sec/nm. In a PHRF race, that?s huge! Other than > buying new sails, there is probably no other upgrade that offers this much > performance per dollar spent. > > Roger Pihlaja > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > Sent from Mail for > Windows 10 > > From: ROGER PIHLAJA > Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2021 12:12 PM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications > > Rick, > > When you ease the traveler, the end of the boom does not rise as it does > when you ease the mainsheet. Thus the mainsail shape is affected much less > when you ease the traveler vs the mainsheet. When you trim the traveler > back to where it was, the flow reattaches itself much quicker. Overall, > boat speed stays higher. That?s why you play the traveler much more than > the mainsheet. > > Roger Pihlaja > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > Sent from my iPhone > > > On Mar 24, 2021, at 11:25 AM, Rick Lange Trim > the trawrote: > > > > ?Jeff, > > > > Why the traveller? The sheet is so much faster and gives greater range > of > > boom movement. > > > > Rick Lange > > > >> On Wed, Mar 24, 2021, 9:13 AM JeffSmith > wrote: > >> > >> When sailing to weather I like to play the traveler (as opposed to the > main > >> sheet) in the puffs while sitting on the high side cockpit combing with > the > >> hiking stick. > >> A continuous 5mm line with the core removed where it travels through the > >> blocks on the New Traveler and possibly changing the purchase from 5 to > 1 > >> to > >> 3 to 1 is part of my plan. Before holes are drilled in the cockpit > sides to > >> accomodate turning blocks to lead the continuous line forward around the > >> perimeter of the cockpit, I would welcome input. > >> > >> > >> > >> ----- > >> Jeff Smith > >> 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT > >> Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor > >> Atlantic Highlands, NJ > >> > >> -- > >> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > >> > > From roger_pihlaja at msn.com Wed Mar 24 16:25:11 2021 From: roger_pihlaja at msn.com (ROGER PIHLAJA) Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2021 20:25:11 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications In-Reply-To: References: <1616591631222-0.post@n5.nabble.com> , Message-ID: Rick, I would welcome the chance to match race you. I would be willing to bet considerable money that your strategy is wrong and I would beat you decisively. Roger Pihlaja S/V Dynamic Equilibrium Sent from my iPhone > On Mar 24, 2021, at 4:21 PM, Rick Lange wrote: > > ?Roger, > > We're talking about sailing close hauled in a stiff breeze (15-20knt) with > sudden gusts that will round up the boat. The only mainsail shape that > matters during a gust is the shape that quickly dumps enough wind to keep > the boat on course without luffing the jib and, in the case of the R22, > sailing flat. > > Easing the main sheet is the quickest way to react while affording the > tactile control needed to ease and recover appropriately as the gust > varies. In addition to being quicker than a traveller can move, > sheet control is not as restrictive as a traveller in allowing greater boom > motion for dumping enough wind when there is a really strong gust. > > For small sloops up to 32', sailing close hauled by feeling sheet tension > is the fastest way to go. I have sailed with totally blind crews and they > sail closer to the wind than many sighted sailors distracted by watching > sail shape. > > Regards, > > Rick Lange > > >> On Wed, Mar 24, 2021 at 1:48 PM ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: >> >> Rick, >> >> My 1976 Rhodes Continental 22 came with a cable style traveler. This was >> not a very good setup and I soon upgraded to the GBI bar-style traveler >> that is mounted on the backstay. This traveler was much better and I used >> it for many years. However, because the mainsail trimmer needed to be in >> line with the clam cleats on each end of the traveler bar in order to cleat >> off the control line, it was very difficult for the helmsman to also play >> the traveler. This was especially an issue when the helmsman was sitting >> up on the windward gunnel (i.e. hiking out) and the traveler needed to be >> trimmed to leeward. GBI?s 2nd >> (3rd?) generation traveler pretty much solves all these issues. Properly >> adjusted, the latest generation traveler has a built-in slip characteristic >> that will save you in an accidental gibe or a knockdown gust. The >> traveler control line is a continuous loop, which enables the helmsman to >> play the traveler to windward or leeward without leaving his hiking station >> up on the windward gunnel. The helmsman drives with one hand on the tiller >> extension, the other on the traveler control line, and multitasks. The >> helmsman can feel the weather/lee helm pressure thru the tiller and is in >> the best position to adjust the traveler to optimize the weather helm/lee >> helm balance. I?ve been sailing with the new generation traveler for 3 >> seasons now. If you care about boat speed and sail short handed, this >> upgrade is well worth the price! On a close hauled course in 10-15 knot of >> wind, If you get into a drag race with another Rhodes 22 that is properly >> using its latest generation traveler vs you using your mainsheet, you will >> fall behind by ~30-40 sec/nm. In a PHRF race, that?s huge! Other than >> buying new sails, there is probably no other upgrade that offers this much >> performance per dollar spent. >> >> Roger Pihlaja >> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >> >> Sent from Mail for >> Windows 10 >> >> From: ROGER PIHLAJA >> Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2021 12:12 PM >> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List >> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications >> >> Rick, >> >> When you ease the traveler, the end of the boom does not rise as it does >> when you ease the mainsheet. Thus the mainsail shape is affected much less >> when you ease the traveler vs the mainsheet. When you trim the traveler >> back to where it was, the flow reattaches itself much quicker. Overall, >> boat speed stays higher. That?s why you play the traveler much more than >> the mainsheet. >> >> Roger Pihlaja >> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >> Sent from my iPhone >> >>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 11:25 AM, Rick Lange Trim >> the trawrote: >>> >>> ?Jeff, >>> >>> Why the traveller? The sheet is so much faster and gives greater range >> of >>> boom movement. >>> >>> Rick Lange >>> >>>> On Wed, Mar 24, 2021, 9:13 AM JeffSmith >> wrote: >>>> >>>> When sailing to weather I like to play the traveler (as opposed to the >> main >>>> sheet) in the puffs while sitting on the high side cockpit combing with >> the >>>> hiking stick. >>>> A continuous 5mm line with the core removed where it travels through the >>>> blocks on the New Traveler and possibly changing the purchase from 5 to >> 1 >>>> to >>>> 3 to 1 is part of my plan. Before holes are drilled in the cockpit >> sides to >>>> accomodate turning blocks to lead the continuous line forward around the >>>> perimeter of the cockpit, I would welcome input. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> ----- >>>> Jeff Smith >>>> 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT >>>> Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor >>>> Atlantic Highlands, NJ >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ >>>> >> >> From roger_pihlaja at msn.com Wed Mar 24 16:34:27 2021 From: roger_pihlaja at msn.com (ROGER PIHLAJA) Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2021 20:34:27 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications In-Reply-To: References: <1616591631222-0.post@n5.nabble.com> , , Message-ID: Rick, If you have so much mainsail area up that dumping the traveler is not sufficient to keep the boat upright in a gust; then, you need to reef down the mainsail. The more efficient reefed mainsail shape will more than compensate for the greater unreeled mainsail area that spends a lot of time all twisted and luffing. Besides, it makes you look like a real amateur and it?s hard on the sail. Roger Pihlaja S/V Dynamic Equilibrium Sent from my iPhone > On Mar 24, 2021, at 4:25 PM, ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: > > ?Rick, > > I would welcome the chance to match race you. I would be willing to bet considerable money that your strategy is wrong and I would beat you decisively. > > Roger Pihlaja > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > Sent from my iPhone > >> On Mar 24, 2021, at 4:21 PM, Rick Lange wrote: >> >> ?Roger, >> >> We're talking about sailing close hauled in a stiff breeze (15-20knt) with >> sudden gusts that will round up the boat. The only mainsail shape that >> matters during a gust is the shape that quickly dumps enough wind to keep >> the boat on course without luffing the jib and, in the case of the R22, >> sailing flat. >> >> Easing the main sheet is the quickest way to react while affording the >> tactile control needed to ease and recover appropriately as the gust >> varies. In addition to being quicker than a traveller can move, >> sheet control is not as restrictive as a traveller in allowing greater boom >> motion for dumping enough wind when there is a really strong gust. >> >> For small sloops up to 32', sailing close hauled by feeling sheet tension >> is the fastest way to go. I have sailed with totally blind crews and they >> sail closer to the wind than many sighted sailors distracted by watching >> sail shape. >> >> Regards, >> >> Rick Lange >> >> >>>> On Wed, Mar 24, 2021 at 1:48 PM ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: >>> >>> Rick, >>> >>> My 1976 Rhodes Continental 22 came with a cable style traveler. This was >>> not a very good setup and I soon upgraded to the GBI bar-style traveler >>> that is mounted on the backstay. This traveler was much better and I used >>> it for many years. However, because the mainsail trimmer needed to be in >>> line with the clam cleats on each end of the traveler bar in order to cleat >>> off the control line, it was very difficult for the helmsman to also play >>> the traveler. This was especially an issue when the helmsman was sitting >>> up on the windward gunnel (i.e. hiking out) and the traveler needed to be >>> trimmed to leeward. GBI?s 2nd >>> (3rd?) generation traveler pretty much solves all these issues. Properly >>> adjusted, the latest generation traveler has a built-in slip characteristic >>> that will save you in an accidental gibe or a knockdown gust. The >>> traveler control line is a continuous loop, which enables the helmsman to >>> play the traveler to windward or leeward without leaving his hiking station >>> up on the windward gunnel. The helmsman drives with one hand on the tiller >>> extension, the other on the traveler control line, and multitasks. The >>> helmsman can feel the weather/lee helm pressure thru the tiller and is in >>> the best position to adjust the traveler to optimize the weather helm/lee >>> helm balance. I?ve been sailing with the new generation traveler for 3 >>> seasons now. If you care about boat speed and sail short handed, this >>> upgrade is well worth the price! On a close hauled course in 10-15 knot of >>> wind, If you get into a drag race with another Rhodes 22 that is properly >>> using its latest generation traveler vs you using your mainsheet, you will >>> fall behind by ~30-40 sec/nm. In a PHRF race, that?s huge! Other than >>> buying new sails, there is probably no other upgrade that offers this much >>> performance per dollar spent. >>> >>> Roger Pihlaja >>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>> >>> Sent from Mail for >>> Windows 10 >>> >>> From: ROGER PIHLAJA >>> Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2021 12:12 PM >>> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List >>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications >>> >>> Rick, >>> >>> When you ease the traveler, the end of the boom does not rise as it does >>> when you ease the mainsheet. Thus the mainsail shape is affected much less >>> when you ease the traveler vs the mainsheet. When you trim the traveler >>> back to where it was, the flow reattaches itself much quicker. Overall, >>> boat speed stays higher. That?s why you play the traveler much more than >>> the mainsheet. >>> >>> Roger Pihlaja >>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 11:25 AM, Rick Lange Trim >>> the trawrote: >>>> >>>> ?Jeff, >>>> >>>> Why the traveller? The sheet is so much faster and gives greater range >>> of >>>> boom movement. >>>> >>>> Rick Lange >>>> >>>>> On Wed, Mar 24, 2021, 9:13 AM JeffSmith >>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> When sailing to weather I like to play the traveler (as opposed to the >>> main >>>>> sheet) in the puffs while sitting on the high side cockpit combing with >>> the >>>>> hiking stick. >>>>> A continuous 5mm line with the core removed where it travels through the >>>>> blocks on the New Traveler and possibly changing the purchase from 5 to >>> 1 >>>>> to >>>>> 3 to 1 is part of my plan. Before holes are drilled in the cockpit >>> sides to >>>>> accomodate turning blocks to lead the continuous line forward around the >>>>> perimeter of the cockpit, I would welcome input. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> ----- >>>>> Jeff Smith >>>>> 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT >>>>> Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor >>>>> Atlantic Highlands, NJ >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ >>>>> >>> >>> From roger_pihlaja at msn.com Wed Mar 24 16:51:15 2021 From: roger_pihlaja at msn.com (ROGER PIHLAJA) Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2021 20:51:15 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications In-Reply-To: References: <1616591631222-0.post@n5.nabble.com> , , , Message-ID: Rick, One more question, beginner sailboats do not come equipped with mainsail travelers; but, more advanced sailboats nearly all have travelers. If you don?t sail your Rhodes 22 to windward while playing the traveler, what do you think that piece of gear is for? Roger Pihlaja S/V Dynamic Equilibrium Sent from my iPhone > On Mar 24, 2021, at 4:34 PM, ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: > > ?Rick, > > If you have so much mainsail area up that dumping the traveler is not sufficient to keep the boat upright in a gust; then, you need to reef down the mainsail. The more efficient reefed mainsail shape will more than compensate for the greater unreeled mainsail area that spends a lot of time all twisted and luffing. Besides, it makes you look like a real amateur and it?s hard on the sail. > > Roger Pihlaja > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > Sent from my iPhone > >> On Mar 24, 2021, at 4:25 PM, ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: >> >> ?Rick, >> >> I would welcome the chance to match race you. I would be willing to bet considerable money that your strategy is wrong and I would beat you decisively. >> >> Roger Pihlaja >> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >>>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 4:21 PM, Rick Lange wrote: >>> >>> ?Roger, >>> >>> We're talking about sailing close hauled in a stiff breeze (15-20knt) with >>> sudden gusts that will round up the boat. The only mainsail shape that >>> matters during a gust is the shape that quickly dumps enough wind to keep >>> the boat on course without luffing the jib and, in the case of the R22, >>> sailing flat. >>> >>> Easing the main sheet is the quickest way to react while affording the >>> tactile control needed to ease and recover appropriately as the gust >>> varies. In addition to being quicker than a traveller can move, >>> sheet control is not as restrictive as a traveller in allowing greater boom >>> motion for dumping enough wind when there is a really strong gust. >>> >>> For small sloops up to 32', sailing close hauled by feeling sheet tension >>> is the fastest way to go. I have sailed with totally blind crews and they >>> sail closer to the wind than many sighted sailors distracted by watching >>> sail shape. >>> >>> Regards, >>> >>> Rick Lange >>> >>> >>>>> On Wed, Mar 24, 2021 at 1:48 PM ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: >>>> >>>> Rick, >>>> >>>> My 1976 Rhodes Continental 22 came with a cable style traveler. This was >>>> not a very good setup and I soon upgraded to the GBI bar-style traveler >>>> that is mounted on the backstay. This traveler was much better and I used >>>> it for many years. However, because the mainsail trimmer needed to be in >>>> line with the clam cleats on each end of the traveler bar in order to cleat >>>> off the control line, it was very difficult for the helmsman to also play >>>> the traveler. This was especially an issue when the helmsman was sitting >>>> up on the windward gunnel (i.e. hiking out) and the traveler needed to be >>>> trimmed to leeward. GBI?s 2nd >>>> (3rd?) generation traveler pretty much solves all these issues. Properly >>>> adjusted, the latest generation traveler has a built-in slip characteristic >>>> that will save you in an accidental gibe or a knockdown gust. The >>>> traveler control line is a continuous loop, which enables the helmsman to >>>> play the traveler to windward or leeward without leaving his hiking station >>>> up on the windward gunnel. The helmsman drives with one hand on the tiller >>>> extension, the other on the traveler control line, and multitasks. The >>>> helmsman can feel the weather/lee helm pressure thru the tiller and is in >>>> the best position to adjust the traveler to optimize the weather helm/lee >>>> helm balance. I?ve been sailing with the new generation traveler for 3 >>>> seasons now. If you care about boat speed and sail short handed, this >>>> upgrade is well worth the price! On a close hauled course in 10-15 knot of >>>> wind, If you get into a drag race with another Rhodes 22 that is properly >>>> using its latest generation traveler vs you using your mainsheet, you will >>>> fall behind by ~30-40 sec/nm. In a PHRF race, that?s huge! Other than >>>> buying new sails, there is probably no other upgrade that offers this much >>>> performance per dollar spent. >>>> >>>> Roger Pihlaja >>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>>> >>>> Sent from Mail for >>>> Windows 10 >>>> >>>> From: ROGER PIHLAJA >>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2021 12:12 PM >>>> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List >>>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications >>>> >>>> Rick, >>>> >>>> When you ease the traveler, the end of the boom does not rise as it does >>>> when you ease the mainsheet. Thus the mainsail shape is affected much less >>>> when you ease the traveler vs the mainsheet. When you trim the traveler >>>> back to where it was, the flow reattaches itself much quicker. Overall, >>>> boat speed stays higher. That?s why you play the traveler much more than >>>> the mainsheet. >>>> >>>> Roger Pihlaja >>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>> >>>>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 11:25 AM, Rick Lange Trim >>>> the trawrote: >>>>> >>>>> ?Jeff, >>>>> >>>>> Why the traveller? The sheet is so much faster and gives greater range >>>> of >>>>> boom movement. >>>>> >>>>> Rick Lange >>>>> >>>>>> On Wed, Mar 24, 2021, 9:13 AM JeffSmith >>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> When sailing to weather I like to play the traveler (as opposed to the >>>> main >>>>>> sheet) in the puffs while sitting on the high side cockpit combing with >>>> the >>>>>> hiking stick. >>>>>> A continuous 5mm line with the core removed where it travels through the >>>>>> blocks on the New Traveler and possibly changing the purchase from 5 to >>>> 1 >>>>>> to >>>>>> 3 to 1 is part of my plan. Before holes are drilled in the cockpit >>>> sides to >>>>>> accomodate turning blocks to lead the continuous line forward around the >>>>>> perimeter of the cockpit, I would welcome input. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> ----- >>>>>> Jeff Smith >>>>>> 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT >>>>>> Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor >>>>>> Atlantic Highlands, NJ >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ >>>>>> >>>> >>>> From sloopblueheron at gmail.com Wed Mar 24 17:02:36 2021 From: sloopblueheron at gmail.com (Rick Lange) Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2021 17:02:36 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications In-Reply-To: References: <1616591631222-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: Roger, That piece of gear is for setting your sails to the prevailing wind. It is too cumbersome and limited for responding to gusts. Regards, Rick Lange On Wed, Mar 24, 2021 at 4:51 PM ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: > Rick, > > One more question, beginner sailboats do not come equipped with mainsail > travelers; but, more advanced sailboats nearly all have travelers. If you > don?t sail your Rhodes 22 to windward while playing the traveler, what do > you think that piece of gear is for? > > Roger Pihlaja > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > Sent from my iPhone > > > On Mar 24, 2021, at 4:34 PM, ROGER PIHLAJA > wrote: > > > > ?Rick, > > > > If you have so much mainsail area up that dumping the traveler is not > sufficient to keep the boat upright in a gust; then, you need to reef down > the mainsail. The more efficient reefed mainsail shape will more than > compensate for the greater unreeled mainsail area that spends a lot of time > all twisted and luffing. Besides, it makes you look like a real amateur > and it?s hard on the sail. > > > > Roger Pihlaja > > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > > > Sent from my iPhone > > > >> On Mar 24, 2021, at 4:25 PM, ROGER PIHLAJA > wrote: > >> > >> ?Rick, > >> > >> I would welcome the chance to match race you. I would be willing to > bet considerable money that your strategy is wrong and I would beat you > decisively. > >> > >> Roger Pihlaja > >> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > >> > >> Sent from my iPhone > >> > >>>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 4:21 PM, Rick Lange > wrote: > >>> > >>> ?Roger, > >>> > >>> We're talking about sailing close hauled in a stiff breeze (15-20knt) > with > >>> sudden gusts that will round up the boat. The only mainsail shape that > >>> matters during a gust is the shape that quickly dumps enough wind to > keep > >>> the boat on course without luffing the jib and, in the case of the R22, > >>> sailing flat. > >>> > >>> Easing the main sheet is the quickest way to react while affording the > >>> tactile control needed to ease and recover appropriately as the gust > >>> varies. In addition to being quicker than a traveller can move, > >>> sheet control is not as restrictive as a traveller in allowing greater > boom > >>> motion for dumping enough wind when there is a really strong gust. > >>> > >>> For small sloops up to 32', sailing close hauled by feeling sheet > tension > >>> is the fastest way to go. I have sailed with totally blind crews and > they > >>> sail closer to the wind than many sighted sailors distracted by > watching > >>> sail shape. > >>> > >>> Regards, > >>> > >>> Rick Lange > >>> > >>> > >>>>> On Wed, Mar 24, 2021 at 1:48 PM ROGER PIHLAJA > wrote: > >>>> > >>>> Rick, > >>>> > >>>> My 1976 Rhodes Continental 22 came with a cable style traveler. This > was > >>>> not a very good setup and I soon upgraded to the GBI bar-style > traveler > >>>> that is mounted on the backstay. This traveler was much better and I > used > >>>> it for many years. However, because the mainsail trimmer needed to > be in > >>>> line with the clam cleats on each end of the traveler bar in order to > cleat > >>>> off the control line, it was very difficult for the helmsman to also > play > >>>> the traveler. This was especially an issue when the helmsman was > sitting > >>>> up on the windward gunnel (i.e. hiking out) and the traveler needed > to be > >>>> trimmed to leeward. GBI?s 2nd > >>>> (3rd?) generation traveler pretty much solves all these issues. > Properly > >>>> adjusted, the latest generation traveler has a built-in slip > characteristic > >>>> that will save you in an accidental gibe or a knockdown gust. The > >>>> traveler control line is a continuous loop, which enables the > helmsman to > >>>> play the traveler to windward or leeward without leaving his hiking > station > >>>> up on the windward gunnel. The helmsman drives with one hand on the > tiller > >>>> extension, the other on the traveler control line, and multitasks. > The > >>>> helmsman can feel the weather/lee helm pressure thru the tiller and > is in > >>>> the best position to adjust the traveler to optimize the weather > helm/lee > >>>> helm balance. I?ve been sailing with the new generation traveler for > 3 > >>>> seasons now. If you care about boat speed and sail short handed, this > >>>> upgrade is well worth the price! On a close hauled course in 10-15 > knot of > >>>> wind, If you get into a drag race with another Rhodes 22 that is > properly > >>>> using its latest generation traveler vs you using your mainsheet, > you will > >>>> fall behind by ~30-40 sec/nm. In a PHRF race, that?s huge! Other > than > >>>> buying new sails, there is probably no other upgrade that offers this > much > >>>> performance per dollar spent. > >>>> > >>>> Roger Pihlaja > >>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > >>>> > >>>> Sent from Mail for > >>>> Windows 10 > >>>> > >>>> From: ROGER PIHLAJA > >>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2021 12:12 PM > >>>> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > >>>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler > Modifications > >>>> > >>>> Rick, > >>>> > >>>> When you ease the traveler, the end of the boom does not rise as it > does > >>>> when you ease the mainsheet. Thus the mainsail shape is affected > much less > >>>> when you ease the traveler vs the mainsheet. When you trim the > traveler > >>>> back to where it was, the flow reattaches itself much quicker. > Overall, > >>>> boat speed stays higher. That?s why you play the traveler much more > than > >>>> the mainsheet. > >>>> > >>>> Roger Pihlaja > >>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > >>>> Sent from my iPhone > >>>> > >>>>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 11:25 AM, Rick Lange >Trim > >>>> the trawrote: > >>>>> > >>>>> ?Jeff, > >>>>> > >>>>> Why the traveller? The sheet is so much faster and gives greater > range > >>>> of > >>>>> boom movement. > >>>>> > >>>>> Rick Lange > >>>>> > >>>>>> On Wed, Mar 24, 2021, 9:13 AM JeffSmith > >>>> wrote: > >>>>>> > >>>>>> When sailing to weather I like to play the traveler (as opposed to > the > >>>> main > >>>>>> sheet) in the puffs while sitting on the high side cockpit combing > with > >>>> the > >>>>>> hiking stick. > >>>>>> A continuous 5mm line with the core removed where it travels > through the > >>>>>> blocks on the New Traveler and possibly changing the purchase from > 5 to > >>>> 1 > >>>>>> to > >>>>>> 3 to 1 is part of my plan. Before holes are drilled in the cockpit > >>>> sides to > >>>>>> accomodate turning blocks to lead the continuous line forward > around the > >>>>>> perimeter of the cockpit, I would welcome input. > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> ----- > >>>>>> Jeff Smith > >>>>>> 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT > >>>>>> Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor > >>>>>> Atlantic Highlands, NJ > >>>>>> > >>>>>> -- > >>>>>> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > >>>>>> > >>>> > >>>> > From roger_pihlaja at msn.com Wed Mar 24 17:14:49 2021 From: roger_pihlaja at msn.com (ROGER PIHLAJA) Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2021 21:14:49 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications In-Reply-To: References: <1616591631222-0.post@n5.nabble.com> , Message-ID: Rick, The control lines on the old bar style traveler were rigged 2:1. That?s a faster ratio than the mainsheet blocks and the mainsheet must let out or take in many more feet of line (~3X). The latest generation traveler can be pulled from end to end much faster than the mainsheet can be let out or trimmed in. Check with any book or video tutorial on how to sail fast upwind and it will instruct you to make maximum use of your mainsail traveler. I put it to the rest of the list, have any of you had issues with slow response on the mainsail traveler? Roger Pihlaja S/V Dynamic Equilibrium Sent from my iPhone > On Mar 24, 2021, at 5:03 PM, Rick Lange wrote: > > ?Roger, > > That piece of gear is for setting your sails to the prevailing wind. It is > too cumbersome and limited for responding to gusts. > > Regards, > > Rick Lange > > >> On Wed, Mar 24, 2021 at 4:51 PM ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: >> >> Rick, >> >> One more question, beginner sailboats do not come equipped with mainsail >> travelers; but, more advanced sailboats nearly all have travelers. If you >> don?t sail your Rhodes 22 to windward while playing the traveler, what do >> you think that piece of gear is for? >> >> Roger Pihlaja >> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 4:34 PM, ROGER PIHLAJA >> wrote: >>> >>> ?Rick, >>> >>> If you have so much mainsail area up that dumping the traveler is not >> sufficient to keep the boat upright in a gust; then, you need to reef down >> the mainsail. The more efficient reefed mainsail shape will more than >> compensate for the greater unreefed mainsail area that spends a lot of time >> all twisted and luffing. Besides, it makes you look like a real amateur >> and it?s hard on the sail. >>> >>> Roger Pihlaja >>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 4:25 PM, ROGER PIHLAJA >> wrote: >>>> >>>> ?Rick, >>>> >>>> I would welcome the chance to match race you. I would be willing to >> bet considerable money that your strategy is wrong and I would beat you >> decisively. >>>> >>>> Roger Pihlaja >>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>> >>>>>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 4:21 PM, Rick Lange >> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> ?Roger, >>>>> >>>>> We're talking about sailing close hauled in a stiff breeze (15-20knt) >> with >>>>> sudden gusts that will round up the boat. The only mainsail shape that >>>>> matters during a gust is the shape that quickly dumps enough wind to >> keep >>>>> the boat on course without luffing the jib and, in the case of the R22, >>>>> sailing flat. >>>>> >>>>> Easing the main sheet is the quickest way to react while affording the >>>>> tactile control needed to ease and recover appropriately as the gust >>>>> varies. In addition to being quicker than a traveller can move, >>>>> sheet control is not as restrictive as a traveller in allowing greater >> boom >>>>> motion for dumping enough wind when there is a really strong gust. >>>>> >>>>> For small sloops up to 32', sailing close hauled by feeling sheet >> tension >>>>> is the fastest way to go. I have sailed with totally blind crews and >> they >>>>> sail closer to the wind than many sighted sailors distracted by >> watching >>>>> sail shape. >>>>> >>>>> Regards, >>>>> >>>>> Rick Lange >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>>> On Wed, Mar 24, 2021 at 1:48 PM ROGER PIHLAJA >> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> Rick, >>>>>> >>>>>> My 1976 Rhodes Continental 22 came with a cable style traveler. This >> was >>>>>> not a very good setup and I soon upgraded to the GBI bar-style >> traveler >>>>>> that is mounted on the backstay. This traveler was much better and I >> used >>>>>> it for many years. However, because the mainsail trimmer needed to >> be in >>>>>> line with the clam cleats on each end of the traveler bar in order to >> cleat >>>>>> off the control line, it was very difficult for the helmsman to also >> play >>>>>> the traveler. This was especially an issue when the helmsman was >> sitting >>>>>> up on the windward gunnel (i.e. hiking out) and the traveler needed >> to be >>>>>> trimmed to leeward. GBI?s 2nd >>>>>> (3rd?) generation traveler pretty much solves all these issues. >> Properly >>>>>> adjusted, the latest generation traveler has a built-in slip >> characteristic >>>>>> that will save you in an accidental gibe or a knockdown gust. The >>>>>> traveler control line is a continuous loop, which enables the >> helmsman to >>>>>> play the traveler to windward or leeward without leaving his hiking >> station >>>>>> up on the windward gunnel. The helmsman drives with one hand on the >> tiller >>>>>> extension, the other on the traveler control line, and multitasks. >> The >>>>>> helmsman can feel the weather/lee helm pressure thru the tiller and >> is in >>>>>> the best position to adjust the traveler to optimize the weather >> helm/lee >>>>>> helm balance. I?ve been sailing with the new generation traveler for >> 3 >>>>>> seasons now. If you care about boat speed and sail short handed, this >>>>>> upgrade is well worth the price! On a close hauled course in 10-15 >> knot of >>>>>> wind, If you get into a drag race with another Rhodes 22 that is >> properly >>>>>> using its latest generation traveler vs you using your mainsheet, >> you will >>>>>> fall behind by ~30-40 sec/nm. In a PHRF race, that?s huge! Other >> than >>>>>> buying new sails, there is probably no other upgrade that offers this >> much >>>>>> performance per dollar spent. >>>>>> >>>>>> Roger Pihlaja >>>>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>>>>> >>>>>> Sent from Mail for >>>>>> Windows 10 >>>>>> >>>>>> From: ROGER PIHLAJA >>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2021 12:12 PM >>>>>> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List >>>>>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler >> Modifications >>>>>> >>>>>> Rick, >>>>>> >>>>>> When you ease the traveler, the end of the boom does not rise as it >> does >>>>>> when you ease the mainsheet. Thus the mainsail shape is affected >> much less >>>>>> when you ease the traveler vs the mainsheet. When you trim the >> traveler >>>>>> back to where it was, the flow reattaches itself much quicker. >> Overall, >>>>>> boat speed stays higher. That?s why you play the traveler much more >> than >>>>>> the mainsheet. >>>>>> >>>>>> Roger Pihlaja >>>>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>>> >>>>>>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 11:25 AM, Rick Lange >> Trim >>>>>> the trawrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> ?Jeff, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Why the traveller? The sheet is so much faster and gives greater >> range >>>>>> of >>>>>>> boom movement. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Rick Lange >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Wed, Mar 24, 2021, 9:13 AM JeffSmith >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> When sailing to weather I like to play the traveler (as opposed to >> the >>>>>> main >>>>>>>> sheet) in the puffs while sitting on the high side cockpit combing >> with >>>>>> the >>>>>>>> hiking stick. >>>>>>>> A continuous 5mm line with the core removed where it travels >> through the >>>>>>>> blocks on the New Traveler and possibly changing the purchase from >> 5 to >>>>>> 1 >>>>>>>> to >>>>>>>> 3 to 1 is part of my plan. Before holes are drilled in the cockpit >>>>>> sides to >>>>>>>> accomodate turning blocks to lead the continuous line forward >> around the >>>>>>>> perimeter of the cockpit, I would welcome input. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> ----- >>>>>>>> Jeff Smith >>>>>>>> 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT >>>>>>>> Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor >>>>>>>> Atlantic Highlands, NJ >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ >>>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >> From roger_pihlaja at msn.com Wed Mar 24 18:00:26 2021 From: roger_pihlaja at msn.com (ROGER PIHLAJA) Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2021 22:00:26 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications In-Reply-To: References: <1616591631222-0.post@n5.nabble.com> , , Message-ID: Hi All, I want to make one clarification. I am talking about upwind sailing using the latest generation GBI mainsail traveler. It is available to members of ROC for $495 and retrofits in place of your old bar style traveler. Check out the Rhodes parts website: http://www.rhodes22parts.com Part No Description GB29 GB TRAVELER INVENTION A General Boats product available thru ROC membership. 5' ss bar with all hardware mounted and ready to use. Requiring no cleats. it is positioned by a single continuous push or pull control line from port or starboard seating. I would invite the readers to go back and reread my description of the evolution of the mainsail traveler on S/V Dynamic Equilibrium given earlier in this e-mail thread. The bar style traveler that mounts on the backstays has certain issues, especially for short handed sailing close hauled. The latest generation traveler (I guess I should start calling it the GB29 Traveler) solves all these issues. It?s yet another example of Stan?s out-of-the-box thinking that results in a clever, elegant solution. Again, if you sail short handed and care about boat speed, the GB29 Traveler is a game changer! No, I don?t get any commissions from Stan for this endorsement, although I ought to considering how much pushback I?m getting! Stan, I don?t happen to have any pictures of the GB29 Traveler as installed, my boat is still in winter storage, and I don?t have a lake to float my boat in. Could you publish a picture? Roger Pihlaja S/V Dynamic Equilibrium Sent from Mail for Windows 10 From: ROGER PIHLAJA Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2021 5:14 PM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications Rick, The control lines on the old bar style traveler were rigged 2:1. That?s a faster ratio than the mainsheet blocks and the mainsheet must let out or take in many more feet of line (~3X). The latest generation traveler can be pulled from end to end much faster than the mainsheet can be let out or trimmed in. Check with any book or video tutorial on how to sail fast upwind and it will instruct you to make maximum use of your mainsail traveler. I put it to the rest of the list, have any of you had issues with slow response on the mainsail traveler? Roger Pihlaja S/V Dynamic Equilibrium Sent from my iPhone > On Mar 24, 2021, at 5:03 PM, Rick Lange wrote: > > ?Roger, > > That piece of gear is for setting your sails to the prevailing wind. It is > too cumbersome and limited for responding to gusts. > > Regards, > > Rick Lange > > >> On Wed, Mar 24, 2021 at 4:51 PM ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: >> >> Rick, >> >> One more question, beginner sailboats do not come equipped with mainsail >> travelers; but, more advanced sailboats nearly all have travelers. If you >> don?t sail your Rhodes 22 to windward while playing the traveler, what do >> you think that piece of gear is for? >> >> Roger Pihlaja >> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 4:34 PM, ROGER PIHLAJA >> wrote: >>> >>> ?Rick, >>> >>> If you have so much mainsail area up that dumping the traveler is not >> sufficient to keep the boat upright in a gust; then, you need to reef down >> the mainsail. The more efficient reefed mainsail shape will more than >> compensate for the greater unreefed mainsail area that spends a lot of time >> all twisted and luffing. Besides, it makes you look like a real amateur >> and it?s hard on the sail. >>> >>> Roger Pihlaja >>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 4:25 PM, ROGER PIHLAJA >> wrote: >>>> >>>> ?Rick, >>>> >>>> I would welcome the chance to match race you. I would be willing to >> bet considerable money that your strategy is wrong and I would beat you >> decisively. >>>> >>>> Roger Pihlaja >>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>> >>>>>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 4:21 PM, Rick Lange >> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> ?Roger, >>>>> >>>>> We're talking about sailing close hauled in a stiff breeze (15-20knt) >> with >>>>> sudden gusts that will round up the boat. The only mainsail shape that >>>>> matters during a gust is the shape that quickly dumps enough wind to >> keep >>>>> the boat on course without luffing the jib and, in the case of the R22, >>>>> sailing flat. >>>>> >>>>> Easing the main sheet is the quickest way to react while affording the >>>>> tactile control needed to ease and recover appropriately as the gust >>>>> varies. In addition to being quicker than a traveller can move, >>>>> sheet control is not as restrictive as a traveller in allowing greater >> boom >>>>> motion for dumping enough wind when there is a really strong gust. >>>>> >>>>> For small sloops up to 32', sailing close hauled by feeling sheet >> tension >>>>> is the fastest way to go. I have sailed with totally blind crews and >> they >>>>> sail closer to the wind than many sighted sailors distracted by >> watching >>>>> sail shape. >>>>> >>>>> Regards, >>>>> >>>>> Rick Lange >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>>> On Wed, Mar 24, 2021 at 1:48 PM ROGER PIHLAJA >> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> Rick, >>>>>> >>>>>> My 1976 Rhodes Continental 22 came with a cable style traveler. This >> was >>>>>> not a very good setup and I soon upgraded to the GBI bar-style >> traveler >>>>>> that is mounted on the backstay. This traveler was much better and I >> used >>>>>> it for many years. However, because the mainsail trimmer needed to >> be in >>>>>> line with the clam cleats on each end of the traveler bar in order to >> cleat >>>>>> off the control line, it was very difficult for the helmsman to also >> play >>>>>> the traveler. This was especially an issue when the helmsman was >> sitting >>>>>> up on the windward gunnel (i.e. hiking out) and the traveler needed >> to be >>>>>> trimmed to leeward. GBI?s 2nd >>>>>> (3rd?) generation traveler pretty much solves all these issues. >> Properly >>>>>> adjusted, the latest generation traveler has a built-in slip >> characteristic >>>>>> that will save you in an accidental gibe or a knockdown gust. The >>>>>> traveler control line is a continuous loop, which enables the >> helmsman to >>>>>> play the traveler to windward or leeward without leaving his hiking >> station >>>>>> up on the windward gunnel. The helmsman drives with one hand on the >> tiller >>>>>> extension, the other on the traveler control line, and multitasks. >> The >>>>>> helmsman can feel the weather/lee helm pressure thru the tiller and >> is in >>>>>> the best position to adjust the traveler to optimize the weather >> helm/lee >>>>>> helm balance. I?ve been sailing with the new generation traveler for >> 3 >>>>>> seasons now. If you care about boat speed and sail short handed, this >>>>>> upgrade is well worth the price! On a close hauled course in 10-15 >> knot of >>>>>> wind, If you get into a drag race with another Rhodes 22 that is >> properly >>>>>> using its latest generation traveler vs you using your mainsheet, >> you will >>>>>> fall behind by ~30-40 sec/nm. In a PHRF race, that?s huge! Other >> than >>>>>> buying new sails, there is probably no other upgrade that offers this >> much >>>>>> performance per dollar spent. >>>>>> >>>>>> Roger Pihlaja >>>>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>>>>> >>>>>> Sent from Mail for >>>>>> Windows 10 >>>>>> >>>>>> From: ROGER PIHLAJA >>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2021 12:12 PM >>>>>> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List >>>>>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler >> Modifications >>>>>> >>>>>> Rick, >>>>>> >>>>>> When you ease the traveler, the end of the boom does not rise as it >> does >>>>>> when you ease the mainsheet. Thus the mainsail shape is affected >> much less >>>>>> when you ease the traveler vs the mainsheet. When you trim the >> traveler >>>>>> back to where it was, the flow reattaches itself much quicker. >> Overall, >>>>>> boat speed stays higher. That?s why you play the traveler much more >> than >>>>>> the mainsheet. >>>>>> >>>>>> Roger Pihlaja >>>>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>>> >>>>>>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 11:25 AM, Rick Lange >> Trim >>>>>> the trawrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> ?Jeff, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Why the traveller? The sheet is so much faster and gives greater >> range >>>>>> of >>>>>>> boom movement. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Rick Lange >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Wed, Mar 24, 2021, 9:13 AM JeffSmith >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> When sailing to weather I like to play the traveler (as opposed to >> the >>>>>> main >>>>>>>> sheet) in the puffs while sitting on the high side cockpit combing >> with >>>>>> the >>>>>>>> hiking stick. >>>>>>>> A continuous 5mm line with the core removed where it travels >> through the >>>>>>>> blocks on the New Traveler and possibly changing the purchase from >> 5 to >>>>>> 1 >>>>>>>> to >>>>>>>> 3 to 1 is part of my plan. Before holes are drilled in the cockpit >>>>>> sides to >>>>>>>> accomodate turning blocks to lead the continuous line forward >> around the >>>>>>>> perimeter of the cockpit, I would welcome input. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> ----- >>>>>>>> Jeff Smith >>>>>>>> 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT >>>>>>>> Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor >>>>>>>> Atlantic Highlands, NJ >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ >>>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >> From jeffsmithphoto at gmail.com Wed Mar 24 18:05:51 2021 From: jeffsmithphoto at gmail.com (JeffSmith) Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2021 15:05:51 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications In-Reply-To: References: <1616591631222-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <1616623551671-0.post@n5.nabble.com> I have raced my last 2 boats (a Baltic 39 and a J/30) with good results over the past 12 years in the AHYC PHRF Fleet-Non Spin. I hope to race my R22 this year, but feel I have a lot to learn and modify before I can be competitive against a fleet of bigger boats. I will certainly have the highest PHRF rating by far. The one race I ran last year (which was when I first sailed the R22) was a disaster upwind. So my goal is to improve performance within a budget... Steering from the forward end of the cockpit (keep the weight out of the ends!) has led me to the above traveler mods, with the control lines led forward to my steering station. I'm pretty sure I have the newest traveler, but find it is totality under responsive to racing needs. The friction from 3/16 th" 5 purchase continuous line in the small blocks does not even need a cleat to keep it from moving! Tomorrow I plan to raise my mast on the boat in the driveway and fiddle around with the traveler. Roger obviously Races and I hope to pick his brains, if he will allow. But how about others? I know that the R22 is considered a cruising boat, but Racing is tons of fun and a great way to spend additional time on the water with other great sailors. ----- Jeff Smith 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor Atlantic Highlands, NJ -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From lvjkuhn at gmail.com Wed Mar 24 18:19:46 2021 From: lvjkuhn at gmail.com (Lee Kuhn) Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2021 18:19:46 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications In-Reply-To: References: <1616591631222-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: From the website On Wed, Mar 24, 2021, 6:00 PM ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: > Hi All, > > I want to make one clarification. I am talking about upwind sailing using > the latest generation GBI mainsail traveler. It is available to members of > ROC for $495 and retrofits in place of your old bar style traveler. Check > out the Rhodes parts website: http://www.rhodes22parts.com > > > Part No Description > > GB29 GB TRAVELER INVENTION > > A General Boats product available thru ROC > membership. > > 5' ss bar with all hardware mounted and ready to > use. > > Requiring no cleats. it is positioned by a single > continuous > > push or pull control line from port or starboard > seating. > > > I would invite the readers to go back and reread my description of the > evolution of the mainsail traveler on S/V Dynamic Equilibrium given earlier > in this e-mail thread. The bar style traveler that mounts on the backstays > has certain issues, especially for short handed sailing close hauled. The > latest generation traveler (I guess I should start calling it the GB29 > Traveler) solves all these issues. It?s yet another example of Stan?s > out-of-the-box thinking that results in a clever, elegant solution. Again, > if you sail short handed and care about boat speed, the GB29 Traveler is a > game changer! No, I don?t get any commissions from Stan for this > endorsement, although I ought to considering how much pushback I?m > getting! Stan, I don?t happen to have any pictures of the GB29 Traveler as > installed, my boat is still in winter storage, and I don?t have a lake to > float my boat in. Could you publish a picture? > > Roger Pihlaja > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > Sent from Mail for > Windows 10 > > From: ROGER PIHLAJA > Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2021 5:14 PM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications > > Rick, > > The control lines on the old bar style traveler were rigged 2:1. That?s > a faster ratio than the mainsheet blocks and the mainsheet must let out or > take in many more feet of line (~3X). The latest generation traveler can > be pulled from end to end much faster than the mainsheet can be let out or > trimmed in. > > Check with any book or video tutorial on how to sail fast upwind and it > will instruct you to make maximum use of your mainsail traveler. > > I put it to the rest of the list, have any of you had issues with slow > response on the mainsail traveler? > > Roger Pihlaja > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > Sent from my iPhone > > > On Mar 24, 2021, at 5:03 PM, Rick Lange > wrote: > > > > ?Roger, > > > > That piece of gear is for setting your sails to the prevailing wind. It > is > > too cumbersome and limited for responding to gusts. > > > > Regards, > > > > Rick Lange > > > > > >> On Wed, Mar 24, 2021 at 4:51 PM ROGER PIHLAJA > wrote: > >> > >> Rick, > >> > >> One more question, beginner sailboats do not come equipped with mainsail > >> travelers; but, more advanced sailboats nearly all have travelers. If > you > >> don?t sail your Rhodes 22 to windward while playing the traveler, what > do > >> you think that piece of gear is for? > >> > >> Roger Pihlaja > >> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > >> > >> Sent from my iPhone > >> > >>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 4:34 PM, ROGER PIHLAJA > >> wrote: > >>> > >>> ?Rick, > >>> > >>> If you have so much mainsail area up that dumping the traveler is not > >> sufficient to keep the boat upright in a gust; then, you need to reef > down > >> the mainsail. The more efficient reefed mainsail shape will more than > >> compensate for the greater unreefed mainsail area that spends a lot of > time > >> all twisted and luffing. Besides, it makes you look like a real amateur > >> and it?s hard on the sail. > >>> > >>> Roger Pihlaja > >>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > >>> > >>> Sent from my iPhone > >>> > >>>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 4:25 PM, ROGER PIHLAJA > >> wrote: > >>>> > >>>> ?Rick, > >>>> > >>>> I would welcome the chance to match race you. I would be willing to > >> bet considerable money that your strategy is wrong and I would beat you > >> decisively. > >>>> > >>>> Roger Pihlaja > >>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > >>>> > >>>> Sent from my iPhone > >>>> > >>>>>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 4:21 PM, Rick Lange > >> wrote: > >>>>> > >>>>> ?Roger, > >>>>> > >>>>> We're talking about sailing close hauled in a stiff breeze (15-20knt) > >> with > >>>>> sudden gusts that will round up the boat. The only mainsail shape > that > >>>>> matters during a gust is the shape that quickly dumps enough wind to > >> keep > >>>>> the boat on course without luffing the jib and, in the case of the > R22, > >>>>> sailing flat. > >>>>> > >>>>> Easing the main sheet is the quickest way to react while affording > the > >>>>> tactile control needed to ease and recover appropriately as the gust > >>>>> varies. In addition to being quicker than a traveller can move, > >>>>> sheet control is not as restrictive as a traveller in allowing > greater > >> boom > >>>>> motion for dumping enough wind when there is a really strong gust. > >>>>> > >>>>> For small sloops up to 32', sailing close hauled by feeling sheet > >> tension > >>>>> is the fastest way to go. I have sailed with totally blind crews and > >> they > >>>>> sail closer to the wind than many sighted sailors distracted by > >> watching > >>>>> sail shape. > >>>>> > >>>>> Regards, > >>>>> > >>>>> Rick Lange > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>>>> On Wed, Mar 24, 2021 at 1:48 PM ROGER PIHLAJA < > roger_pihlaja at msn.com> > >> wrote: > >>>>>> > >>>>>> Rick, > >>>>>> > >>>>>> My 1976 Rhodes Continental 22 came with a cable style traveler. > This > >> was > >>>>>> not a very good setup and I soon upgraded to the GBI bar-style > >> traveler > >>>>>> that is mounted on the backstay. This traveler was much better and > I > >> used > >>>>>> it for many years. However, because the mainsail trimmer needed to > >> be in > >>>>>> line with the clam cleats on each end of the traveler bar in order > to > >> cleat > >>>>>> off the control line, it was very difficult for the helmsman to also > >> play > >>>>>> the traveler. This was especially an issue when the helmsman was > >> sitting > >>>>>> up on the windward gunnel (i.e. hiking out) and the traveler needed > >> to be > >>>>>> trimmed to leeward. GBI?s 2nd > >>>>>> (3rd?) generation traveler pretty much solves all these issues. > >> Properly > >>>>>> adjusted, the latest generation traveler has a built-in slip > >> characteristic > >>>>>> that will save you in an accidental gibe or a knockdown gust. The > >>>>>> traveler control line is a continuous loop, which enables the > >> helmsman to > >>>>>> play the traveler to windward or leeward without leaving his hiking > >> station > >>>>>> up on the windward gunnel. The helmsman drives with one hand on the > >> tiller > >>>>>> extension, the other on the traveler control line, and multitasks. > >> The > >>>>>> helmsman can feel the weather/lee helm pressure thru the tiller and > >> is in > >>>>>> the best position to adjust the traveler to optimize the weather > >> helm/lee > >>>>>> helm balance. I?ve been sailing with the new generation traveler > for > >> 3 > >>>>>> seasons now. If you care about boat speed and sail short handed, > this > >>>>>> upgrade is well worth the price! On a close hauled course in 10-15 > >> knot of > >>>>>> wind, If you get into a drag race with another Rhodes 22 that is > >> properly > >>>>>> using its latest generation traveler vs you using your mainsheet, > >> you will > >>>>>> fall behind by ~30-40 sec/nm. In a PHRF race, that?s huge! Other > >> than > >>>>>> buying new sails, there is probably no other upgrade that offers > this > >> much > >>>>>> performance per dollar spent. > >>>>>> > >>>>>> Roger Pihlaja > >>>>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > >>>>>> > >>>>>> Sent from Mail for > >>>>>> Windows 10 > >>>>>> > >>>>>> From: ROGER PIHLAJA > >>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2021 12:12 PM > >>>>>> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > >>>>>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler > >> Modifications > >>>>>> > >>>>>> Rick, > >>>>>> > >>>>>> When you ease the traveler, the end of the boom does not rise as it > >> does > >>>>>> when you ease the mainsheet. Thus the mainsail shape is affected > >> much less > >>>>>> when you ease the traveler vs the mainsheet. When you trim the > >> traveler > >>>>>> back to where it was, the flow reattaches itself much quicker. > >> Overall, > >>>>>> boat speed stays higher. That?s why you play the traveler much more > >> than > >>>>>> the mainsheet. > >>>>>> > >>>>>> Roger Pihlaja > >>>>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > >>>>>> Sent from my iPhone > >>>>>> > >>>>>>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 11:25 AM, Rick Lange >>> Trim > >>>>>> the trawrote: > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> ?Jeff, > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Why the traveller? The sheet is so much faster and gives greater > >> range > >>>>>> of > >>>>>>> boom movement. > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Rick Lange > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> On Wed, Mar 24, 2021, 9:13 AM JeffSmith > > >>>>>> wrote: > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> When sailing to weather I like to play the traveler (as opposed to > >> the > >>>>>> main > >>>>>>>> sheet) in the puffs while sitting on the high side cockpit combing > >> with > >>>>>> the > >>>>>>>> hiking stick. > >>>>>>>> A continuous 5mm line with the core removed where it travels > >> through the > >>>>>>>> blocks on the New Traveler and possibly changing the purchase from > >> 5 to > >>>>>> 1 > >>>>>>>> to > >>>>>>>> 3 to 1 is part of my plan. Before holes are drilled in the cockpit > >>>>>> sides to > >>>>>>>> accomodate turning blocks to lead the continuous line forward > >> around the > >>>>>>>> perimeter of the cockpit, I would welcome input. > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> ----- > >>>>>>>> Jeff Smith > >>>>>>>> 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT > >>>>>>>> Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor > >>>>>>>> Atlantic Highlands, NJ > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> -- > >>>>>>>> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >> > > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Screenshot_20210324-181451_Chrome.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 1293693 bytes Desc: not available URL: From roger_pihlaja at msn.com Wed Mar 24 18:26:16 2021 From: roger_pihlaja at msn.com (ROGER PIHLAJA) Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2021 22:26:16 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications In-Reply-To: <1616623551671-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1616591631222-0.post@n5.nabble.com> , <1616623551671-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: Jeff, The GBI 29 Traveler must be positioned in the desired location on the SS bar using the control lines. It doesn?t just slide back and forth. The helmsman holds the hiking stick in one hand and the traveler control line in the other. On S/V Dynamic Equilibrium, the hiking stick and the length of the standard control lines make the preferred helm gunnel position about 20-25 inches aft of the genoa sheet winches. You could lengthen the control lines to move forward; but, then you might be in the way of the genoa sheet trimmer. If you are single handing; then, you probably won?t be actively trimming both the genoa and the mainsail. In this case, I would cross sheet the genoa to the windward winch, set the genoa at a conservative size and trim, and then play with the traveler and helm. If things go crooked, you can always dump the genoa sheet! Roger Pihlaja S/V Dynamic Equilibrium Sent from my iPhone > On Mar 24, 2021, at 6:05 PM, JeffSmith wrote: > > ? I have raced my last 2 boats (a Baltic 39 and a J/30) with good results > over the past 12 years in the AHYC PHRF Fleet-Non Spin. I hope to race my > R22 this year, but feel I have a lot to learn and modify before I can be > competitive against a fleet of bigger boats. I will certainly have the > highest PHRF rating by far. > The one race I ran last year (which was when I first sailed the R22) was a > disaster upwind. > So my goal is to improve performance within a budget... > Steering from the forward end of the cockpit (keep the weight out of the > ends!) has led me to the above traveler mods, with the control lines led > forward to my steering station. > I'm pretty sure I have the newest traveler, but find it is totality under > responsive to racing needs. The friction from 3/16 th" 5 purchase > continuous line in the small blocks does not even need a cleat to keep it > from moving! > Tomorrow I plan to raise my mast on the boat in the driveway and fiddle > around with the traveler. > Roger obviously Races and I hope to pick his brains, if he will allow. But > how about others? I know that the R22 is considered a cruising boat, but > Racing is tons of fun and a great way to spend additional time on the water > with other great sailors. > > > > ----- > Jeff Smith > 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT > Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor > Atlantic Highlands, NJ > > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From jeffsmithphoto at gmail.com Wed Mar 24 19:05:41 2021 From: jeffsmithphoto at gmail.com (JeffSmith) Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2021 16:05:41 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications In-Reply-To: References: <1616623551671-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <1616627141536-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Hi Roger, I have been sailing with the 130% Genoa. It seems like a good size and makes my wife, Emily happy! The 175 seems like over kill and hard to tack. ----- Jeff Smith 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor Atlantic Highlands, NJ -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From roger_pihlaja at msn.com Wed Mar 24 19:07:13 2021 From: roger_pihlaja at msn.com (ROGER PIHLAJA) Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2021 23:07:13 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications In-Reply-To: References: <1616591631222-0.post@n5.nabble.com> , <1616623551671-0.post@n5.nabble.com>, Message-ID: Jeff, The GBI 29 Traveler has one continuous control line. The trimmer must push or pull from virtually anywhere on that line to cause the traveler car to move. You can move it as fast as you wish. But, once you stop pulling or pushing on the control line, the traveler car will remain in that position unless the force on the traveler exceeds a certain threshold. Once that force threshold is exceeded, the traveler car will begin to slip along the bar to leeward. This force threshold is set be using the single cam cleat on the traveler car to set the tension in the control line. The more control line tension, the higher the required breakaway force threshold. This design feature allows the traveler car to slip to leeward to spill wind from the sail in the event of an uncontrolled gibe or sudden knockdown gust. This design is unlike anything I have ever used in my sailing career and it took me a little while to get used to it. But, when it?s properly adjusted, you really can set the traveler car wherever you want it, expect it to stay there, and then quickly move it to a new location. It sounds like you have been trying to use the GBI 29 Traveler with the control line tension set so low that the traveler car will slide along the bar on its own. Try increasing the line tension and then using the control lines to set the traveler car position. Roger Pihlaja S/V Dynamic Equilibrium Sent from Mail for Windows 10 From: ROGER PIHLAJA Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2021 6:26 PM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications Jeff, The GBI 29 Traveler must be positioned in the desired location on the SS bar using the control lines. It doesn?t just slide back and forth. The helmsman holds the hiking stick in one hand and the traveler control line in the other. On S/V Dynamic Equilibrium, the hiking stick and the length of the standard control lines make the preferred helm gunnel position about 20-25 inches aft of the genoa sheet winches. You could lengthen the control lines to move forward; but, then you might be in the way of the genoa sheet trimmer. If you are single handing; then, you probably won?t be actively trimming both the genoa and the mainsail. In this case, I would cross sheet the genoa to the windward winch, set the genoa at a conservative size and trim, and then play with the traveler and helm. If things go crooked, you can always dump the genoa sheet! Roger Pihlaja S/V Dynamic Equilibrium Sent from my iPhone > On Mar 24, 2021, at 6:05 PM, JeffSmith wrote: > > ? I have raced my last 2 boats (a Baltic 39 and a J/30) with good results > over the past 12 years in the AHYC PHRF Fleet-Non Spin. I hope to race my > R22 this year, but feel I have a lot to learn and modify before I can be > competitive against a fleet of bigger boats. I will certainly have the > highest PHRF rating by far. > The one race I ran last year (which was when I first sailed the R22) was a > disaster upwind. > So my goal is to improve performance within a budget... > Steering from the forward end of the cockpit (keep the weight out of the > ends!) has led me to the above traveler mods, with the control lines led > forward to my steering station. > I'm pretty sure I have the newest traveler, but find it is totality under > responsive to racing needs. The friction from 3/16 th" 5 purchase > continuous line in the small blocks does not even need a cleat to keep it > from moving! > Tomorrow I plan to raise my mast on the boat in the driveway and fiddle > around with the traveler. > Roger obviously Races and I hope to pick his brains, if he will allow. But > how about others? I know that the R22 is considered a cruising boat, but > Racing is tons of fun and a great way to spend additional time on the water > with other great sailors. > > > > ----- > Jeff Smith > 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT > Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor > Atlantic Highlands, NJ > > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From roger_pihlaja at msn.com Wed Mar 24 19:08:52 2021 From: roger_pihlaja at msn.com (ROGER PIHLAJA) Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2021 23:08:52 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications In-Reply-To: <1616627141536-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1616623551671-0.post@n5.nabble.com> , <1616627141536-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: Jeff, Here in the Midwest, we have predominantly light air. So, I sail with a 150% genoa most of the time. Roger Pihlaja S/V Dynamic Equilibrium Sent from Mail for Windows 10 From: JeffSmith Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2021 7:05 PM To: rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications Hi Roger, I have been sailing with the 130% Genoa. It seems like a good size and makes my wife, Emily happy! The 175 seems like over kill and hard to tack. ----- Jeff Smith 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor Atlantic Highlands, NJ -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From jeffsmithphoto at gmail.com Wed Mar 24 19:17:41 2021 From: jeffsmithphoto at gmail.com (JeffSmith) Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2021 16:17:41 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications In-Reply-To: References: <1616623551671-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616627141536-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <1616627861562-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Roger, Which leads do you use for the 150? ----- Jeff Smith 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor Atlantic Highlands, NJ -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From roger_pihlaja at msn.com Wed Mar 24 20:13:44 2021 From: roger_pihlaja at msn.com (ROGER PIHLAJA) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2021 00:13:44 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications In-Reply-To: <1616627861562-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1616623551671-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616627141536-0.post@n5.nabble.com> , <1616627861562-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: Jeff, If you mean what lead position, I use the Schaffer genoa track holes that are 4-6 positions back from the front of the track. The #4 hole is used for heavy air and the #6 position for light air. As the genoa is reefed, the lead position also moves forward. Roger Pihlaja S/V Dynamic Equilibrium Sent from Mail for Windows 10 From: JeffSmith Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2021 7:17 PM To: rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications Roger, Which leads do you use for the 150? ----- Jeff Smith 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor Atlantic Highlands, NJ -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From mm.bizlist1 at gmail.com Wed Mar 24 23:12:02 2021 From: mm.bizlist1 at gmail.com (Michael McKay) Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2021 23:12:02 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: This is a very informative discussion. I am very new to the R22, but my initial impression is that the traveler is slow to manipulate. In a race I would adjust it for the tack and conditions but use the mainsheet to fine tune for gusts. Michael McKay (630) 209-2054 (m) Sent from my iPhone > On Mar 24, 2021, at 7:07 PM, ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: > > ?Jeff, > > The GBI 29 Traveler has one continuous control line. The trimmer must push or pull from virtually anywhere on that line to cause the traveler car to move. You can move it as fast as you wish. But, once you stop pulling or pushing on the control line, the traveler car will remain in that position unless the force on the traveler exceeds a certain threshold. Once that force threshold is exceeded, the traveler car will begin to slip along the bar to leeward. This force threshold is set be using the single cam cleat on the traveler car to set the tension in the control line. The more control line tension, the higher the required breakaway force threshold. This design feature allows the traveler car to slip to leeward to spill wind from the sail in the event of an uncontrolled gibe or sudden knockdown gust. This design is unlike anything I have ever used in my sailing career and it took me a little while to get used to it. But, when it?s properly adjusted, you really can set the traveler car wherever you want it, expect it to stay there, and then quickly move it to a new location. It sounds like you have been trying to use the GBI 29 Traveler with the control line tension set so low that the traveler car will slide along the bar on its own. Try increasing the line tension and then using the control lines to set the traveler car position. > > Roger Pihlaja > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > Sent from Mail for Windows 10 > > From: ROGER PIHLAJA > Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2021 6:26 PM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications > > Jeff, > > The GBI 29 Traveler must be positioned in the desired location on the SS bar using the control lines. It doesn?t just slide back and forth. The helmsman holds the hiking stick in one hand and the traveler control line in the other. On S/V Dynamic Equilibrium, the hiking stick and the length of the standard control lines make the preferred helm gunnel position about 20-25 inches aft of the genoa sheet winches. You could lengthen the control lines to move forward; but, then you might be in the way of the genoa sheet trimmer. If you are single handing; then, you probably won?t be actively trimming both the genoa and the mainsail. In this case, I would cross sheet the genoa to the windward winch, set the genoa at a conservative size and trim, and then play with the traveler and helm. If things go crooked, you can always dump the genoa sheet! > > Roger Pihlaja > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > Sent from my iPhone > >> On Mar 24, 2021, at 6:05 PM, JeffSmith wrote: >> >> ? I have raced my last 2 boats (a Baltic 39 and a J/30) with good results >> over the past 12 years in the AHYC PHRF Fleet-Non Spin. I hope to race my >> R22 this year, but feel I have a lot to learn and modify before I can be >> competitive against a fleet of bigger boats. I will certainly have the >> highest PHRF rating by far. >> The one race I ran last year (which was when I first sailed the R22) was a >> disaster upwind. >> So my goal is to improve performance within a budget... >> Steering from the forward end of the cockpit (keep the weight out of the >> ends!) has led me to the above traveler mods, with the control lines led >> forward to my steering station. >> I'm pretty sure I have the newest traveler, but find it is totality under >> responsive to racing needs. The friction from 3/16 th" 5 purchase >> continuous line in the small blocks does not even need a cleat to keep it >> from moving! >> Tomorrow I plan to raise my mast on the boat in the driveway and fiddle >> around with the traveler. >> Roger obviously Races and I hope to pick his brains, if he will allow. But >> how about others? I know that the R22 is considered a cruising boat, but >> Racing is tons of fun and a great way to spend additional time on the water >> with other great sailors. >> >> >> >> ----- >> Jeff Smith >> 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT >> Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor >> Atlantic Highlands, NJ >> >> -- >> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > From rlowe at vt.edu Thu Mar 25 09:35:14 2021 From: rlowe at vt.edu (Lowe, Rob) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2021 13:35:14 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications In-Reply-To: References: <1616591631222-0.post@n5.nabble.com> , <1616623551671-0.post@n5.nabble.com>, , Message-ID: Roger, I've got the new traveler but have not installed it yet. Will be shortly. I'm still trying to figure out how to adjust as use it and I see you had a learning curve. Could someone post a few photos on how to use the adjustments on it? Thanks - rob ________________________________ From: Rhodes22-list on behalf of ROGER PIHLAJA Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2021 7:07 PM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications Jeff, The GBI 29 Traveler has one continuous control line. The trimmer must push or pull from virtually anywhere on that line to cause the traveler car to move. You can move it as fast as you wish. But, once you stop pulling or pushing on the control line, the traveler car will remain in that position unless the force on the traveler exceeds a certain threshold. Once that force threshold is exceeded, the traveler car will begin to slip along the bar to leeward. This force threshold is set be using the single cam cleat on the traveler car to set the tension in the control line. The more control line tension, the higher the required breakaway force threshold. This design feature allows the traveler car to slip to leeward to spill wind from the sail in the event of an uncontrolled gibe or sudden knockdown gust. This design is unlike anything I have ever used in my sailing career and it took me a little while to get used to it. But, when it?s properly adjusted, you really can set the traveler car wherever you want it, expect it to stay there, and then quickly move it to a new location. It sounds like you have been trying to use the GBI 29 Traveler with the control line tension set so low that the traveler car will slide along the bar on its own. Try increasing the line tension and then using the control lines to set the traveler car position. Roger Pihlaja S/V Dynamic Equilibrium Sent from Mail for Windows 10 From: ROGER PIHLAJA Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2021 6:26 PM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications Jeff, The GBI 29 Traveler must be positioned in the desired location on the SS bar using the control lines. It doesn?t just slide back and forth. The helmsman holds the hiking stick in one hand and the traveler control line in the other. On S/V Dynamic Equilibrium, the hiking stick and the length of the standard control lines make the preferred helm gunnel position about 20-25 inches aft of the genoa sheet winches. You could lengthen the control lines to move forward; but, then you might be in the way of the genoa sheet trimmer. If you are single handing; then, you probably won?t be actively trimming both the genoa and the mainsail. In this case, I would cross sheet the genoa to the windward winch, set the genoa at a conservative size and trim, and then play with the traveler and helm. If things go crooked, you can always dump the genoa sheet! Roger Pihlaja S/V Dynamic Equilibrium Sent from my iPhone > On Mar 24, 2021, at 6:05 PM, JeffSmith wrote: > > ? I have raced my last 2 boats (a Baltic 39 and a J/30) with good results > over the past 12 years in the AHYC PHRF Fleet-Non Spin. I hope to race my > R22 this year, but feel I have a lot to learn and modify before I can be > competitive against a fleet of bigger boats. I will certainly have the > highest PHRF rating by far. > The one race I ran last year (which was when I first sailed the R22) was a > disaster upwind. > So my goal is to improve performance within a budget... > Steering from the forward end of the cockpit (keep the weight out of the > ends!) has led me to the above traveler mods, with the control lines led > forward to my steering station. > I'm pretty sure I have the newest traveler, but find it is totality under > responsive to racing needs. The friction from 3/16 th" 5 purchase > continuous line in the small blocks does not even need a cleat to keep it > from moving! > Tomorrow I plan to raise my mast on the boat in the driveway and fiddle > around with the traveler. > Roger obviously Races and I hope to pick his brains, if he will allow. But > how about others? I know that the R22 is considered a cruising boat, but > Racing is tons of fun and a great way to spend additional time on the water > with other great sailors. > > > > ----- > Jeff Smith > 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT > Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor > Atlantic Highlands, NJ > > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From ric at stottarchitecture.com Thu Mar 25 09:41:57 2021 From: ric at stottarchitecture.com (Richard Stott) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2021 09:41:57 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications In-Reply-To: References: <1616591631222-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <27107F4C-FC0E-4C4B-A485-D7EF102C8EAE@stottarchitecture.com> When sailing to whether, the traveler is used to bring the boom to the boat?s centerline. This improves sail shape, the relationship of the Jib/Main and ability to point higher. It is not the tool on a Rhodes to depower the Rig in a gust - use the main sheet for that. Ric Dadventure Richard Stott, AIA, LEED AP www.stottarchitecture.com Office 631-283-1777 Cell 516-965-3164 > On Mar 24, 2021, at 5:02 PM, Rick Lange wrote: > > Roger, > > That piece of gear is for setting your sails to the prevailing wind. It is > too cumbersome and limited for responding to gusts. > > Regards, > > Rick Lange > > > On Wed, Mar 24, 2021 at 4:51 PM ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: > >> Rick, >> >> One more question, beginner sailboats do not come equipped with mainsail >> travelers; but, more advanced sailboats nearly all have travelers. If you >> don?t sail your Rhodes 22 to windward while playing the traveler, what do >> you think that piece of gear is for? >> >> Roger Pihlaja >> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 4:34 PM, ROGER PIHLAJA >> wrote: >>> >>> ?Rick, >>> >>> If you have so much mainsail area up that dumping the traveler is not >> sufficient to keep the boat upright in a gust; then, you need to reef down >> the mainsail. The more efficient reefed mainsail shape will more than >> compensate for the greater unreeled mainsail area that spends a lot of time >> all twisted and luffing. Besides, it makes you look like a real amateur >> and it?s hard on the sail. >>> >>> Roger Pihlaja >>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 4:25 PM, ROGER PIHLAJA >> wrote: >>>> >>>> ?Rick, >>>> >>>> I would welcome the chance to match race you. I would be willing to >> bet considerable money that your strategy is wrong and I would beat you >> decisively. >>>> >>>> Roger Pihlaja >>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>> >>>>>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 4:21 PM, Rick Lange >> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> ?Roger, >>>>> >>>>> We're talking about sailing close hauled in a stiff breeze (15-20knt) >> with >>>>> sudden gusts that will round up the boat. The only mainsail shape that >>>>> matters during a gust is the shape that quickly dumps enough wind to >> keep >>>>> the boat on course without luffing the jib and, in the case of the R22, >>>>> sailing flat. >>>>> >>>>> Easing the main sheet is the quickest way to react while affording the >>>>> tactile control needed to ease and recover appropriately as the gust >>>>> varies. In addition to being quicker than a traveller can move, >>>>> sheet control is not as restrictive as a traveller in allowing greater >> boom >>>>> motion for dumping enough wind when there is a really strong gust. >>>>> >>>>> For small sloops up to 32', sailing close hauled by feeling sheet >> tension >>>>> is the fastest way to go. I have sailed with totally blind crews and >> they >>>>> sail closer to the wind than many sighted sailors distracted by >> watching >>>>> sail shape. >>>>> >>>>> Regards, >>>>> >>>>> Rick Lange >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>>> On Wed, Mar 24, 2021 at 1:48 PM ROGER PIHLAJA >> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> Rick, >>>>>> >>>>>> My 1976 Rhodes Continental 22 came with a cable style traveler. This >> was >>>>>> not a very good setup and I soon upgraded to the GBI bar-style >> traveler >>>>>> that is mounted on the backstay. This traveler was much better and I >> used >>>>>> it for many years. However, because the mainsail trimmer needed to >> be in >>>>>> line with the clam cleats on each end of the traveler bar in order to >> cleat >>>>>> off the control line, it was very difficult for the helmsman to also >> play >>>>>> the traveler. This was especially an issue when the helmsman was >> sitting >>>>>> up on the windward gunnel (i.e. hiking out) and the traveler needed >> to be >>>>>> trimmed to leeward. GBI?s 2nd >>>>>> (3rd?) generation traveler pretty much solves all these issues. >> Properly >>>>>> adjusted, the latest generation traveler has a built-in slip >> characteristic >>>>>> that will save you in an accidental gibe or a knockdown gust. The >>>>>> traveler control line is a continuous loop, which enables the >> helmsman to >>>>>> play the traveler to windward or leeward without leaving his hiking >> station >>>>>> up on the windward gunnel. The helmsman drives with one hand on the >> tiller >>>>>> extension, the other on the traveler control line, and multitasks. >> The >>>>>> helmsman can feel the weather/lee helm pressure thru the tiller and >> is in >>>>>> the best position to adjust the traveler to optimize the weather >> helm/lee >>>>>> helm balance. I?ve been sailing with the new generation traveler for >> 3 >>>>>> seasons now. If you care about boat speed and sail short handed, this >>>>>> upgrade is well worth the price! On a close hauled course in 10-15 >> knot of >>>>>> wind, If you get into a drag race with another Rhodes 22 that is >> properly >>>>>> using its latest generation traveler vs you using your mainsheet, >> you will >>>>>> fall behind by ~30-40 sec/nm. In a PHRF race, that?s huge! Other >> than >>>>>> buying new sails, there is probably no other upgrade that offers this >> much >>>>>> performance per dollar spent. >>>>>> >>>>>> Roger Pihlaja >>>>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>>>>> >>>>>> Sent from Mail for >>>>>> Windows 10 >>>>>> >>>>>> From: ROGER PIHLAJA >>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2021 12:12 PM >>>>>> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List >>>>>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler >> Modifications >>>>>> >>>>>> Rick, >>>>>> >>>>>> When you ease the traveler, the end of the boom does not rise as it >> does >>>>>> when you ease the mainsheet. Thus the mainsail shape is affected >> much less >>>>>> when you ease the traveler vs the mainsheet. When you trim the >> traveler >>>>>> back to where it was, the flow reattaches itself much quicker. >> Overall, >>>>>> boat speed stays higher. That?s why you play the traveler much more >> than >>>>>> the mainsheet. >>>>>> >>>>>> Roger Pihlaja >>>>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>>> >>>>>>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 11:25 AM, Rick Lange >> Trim >>>>>> the trawrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> ?Jeff, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Why the traveller? The sheet is so much faster and gives greater >> range >>>>>> of >>>>>>> boom movement. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Rick Lange >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Wed, Mar 24, 2021, 9:13 AM JeffSmith >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> When sailing to weather I like to play the traveler (as opposed to >> the >>>>>> main >>>>>>>> sheet) in the puffs while sitting on the high side cockpit combing >> with >>>>>> the >>>>>>>> hiking stick. >>>>>>>> A continuous 5mm line with the core removed where it travels >> through the >>>>>>>> blocks on the New Traveler and possibly changing the purchase from >> 5 to >>>>>> 1 >>>>>>>> to >>>>>>>> 3 to 1 is part of my plan. Before holes are drilled in the cockpit >>>>>> sides to >>>>>>>> accomodate turning blocks to lead the continuous line forward >> around the >>>>>>>> perimeter of the cockpit, I would welcome input. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> ----- >>>>>>>> Jeff Smith >>>>>>>> 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT >>>>>>>> Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor >>>>>>>> Atlantic Highlands, NJ >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ >>>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >> From stan at generalboats.com Thu Mar 25 09:56:14 2021 From: stan at generalboats.com (stan) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2021 09:56:14 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications In-Reply-To: References: <1616591631222-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <4e93b185-b508-ed21-02dd-7f107448f20d@generalboats.com> http://nebula.wsimg.com/0174a5cf7410a3277e13a4893356fdd2?AccessKeyId=FE52E8E6030ADE269F8D&disposition=0&alloworigin=1 one feature I did not notice mentioned:? On the aft side of the traveler bar car is a means for adjusting the slack in the endless cleatless control line which allows for changing the mechanical advantage ratio which then would automatically change the wind force it would require to automatically spill wind.? Also someone mentioned the line used is one where the core has been removed. If that were the case, that would be news to me.? Roger, what charity did you have in mind to send the commission checks to. On 3/24/21 6:00 PM, ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: > Hi All, > > I want to make one clarification. I am talking about upwind sailing using the latest generation GBI mainsail traveler. It is available to members of ROC for $495 and retrofits in place of your old bar style traveler. Check out the Rhodes parts website: http://www.rhodes22parts.com > > > Part No Description > > GB29 GB TRAVELER INVENTION > > A General Boats product available thru ROC membership. > > 5' ss bar with all hardware mounted and ready to use. > > Requiring no cleats. it is positioned by a single continuous > > push or pull control line from port or starboard seating. > > > I would invite the readers to go back and reread my description of the evolution of the mainsail traveler on S/V Dynamic Equilibrium given earlier in this e-mail thread. The bar style traveler that mounts on the backstays has certain issues, especially for short handed sailing close hauled. The latest generation traveler (I guess I should start calling it the GB29 Traveler) solves all these issues. It?s yet another example of Stan?s out-of-the-box thinking that results in a clever, elegant solution. Again, if you sail short handed and care about boat speed, the GB29 Traveler is a game changer! No, I don?t get any commissions from Stan for this endorsement, although I ought to considering how much pushback I?m getting! Stan, I don?t happen to have any pictures of the GB29 Traveler as installed, my boat is still in winter storage, and I don?t have a lake to float my boat in. Could you publish a picture? > > Roger Pihlaja > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > Sent from Mail for Windows 10 > > From: ROGER PIHLAJA > Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2021 5:14 PM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications > > Rick, > > The control lines on the old bar style traveler were rigged 2:1. That?s a faster ratio than the mainsheet blocks and the mainsheet must let out or take in many more feet of line (~3X). The latest generation traveler can be pulled from end to end much faster than the mainsheet can be let out or trimmed in. > > Check with any book or video tutorial on how to sail fast upwind and it will instruct you to make maximum use of your mainsail traveler. > > I put it to the rest of the list, have any of you had issues with slow response on the mainsail traveler? > > Roger Pihlaja > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > Sent from my iPhone > >> On Mar 24, 2021, at 5:03 PM, Rick Lange wrote: >> >> ?Roger, >> >> That piece of gear is for setting your sails to the prevailing wind. It is >> too cumbersome and limited for responding to gusts. >> >> Regards, >> >> Rick Lange >> >> >>> On Wed, Mar 24, 2021 at 4:51 PM ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: >>> >>> Rick, >>> >>> One more question, beginner sailboats do not come equipped with mainsail >>> travelers; but, more advanced sailboats nearly all have travelers. If you >>> don?t sail your Rhodes 22 to windward while playing the traveler, what do >>> you think that piece of gear is for? >>> >>> Roger Pihlaja >>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 4:34 PM, ROGER PIHLAJA >>> wrote: >>>> ?Rick, >>>> >>>> If you have so much mainsail area up that dumping the traveler is not >>> sufficient to keep the boat upright in a gust; then, you need to reef down >>> the mainsail. The more efficient reefed mainsail shape will more than >>> compensate for the greater unreefed mainsail area that spends a lot of time >>> all twisted and luffing. Besides, it makes you look like a real amateur >>> and it?s hard on the sail. >>>> Roger Pihlaja >>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>> >>>>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 4:25 PM, ROGER PIHLAJA >>> wrote: >>>>> ?Rick, >>>>> >>>>> I would welcome the chance to match race you. I would be willing to >>> bet considerable money that your strategy is wrong and I would beat you >>> decisively. >>>>> Roger Pihlaja >>>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>>>> >>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>> >>>>>>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 4:21 PM, Rick Lange >>> wrote: >>>>>> ?Roger, >>>>>> >>>>>> We're talking about sailing close hauled in a stiff breeze (15-20knt) >>> with >>>>>> sudden gusts that will round up the boat. The only mainsail shape that >>>>>> matters during a gust is the shape that quickly dumps enough wind to >>> keep >>>>>> the boat on course without luffing the jib and, in the case of the R22, >>>>>> sailing flat. >>>>>> >>>>>> Easing the main sheet is the quickest way to react while affording the >>>>>> tactile control needed to ease and recover appropriately as the gust >>>>>> varies. In addition to being quicker than a traveller can move, >>>>>> sheet control is not as restrictive as a traveller in allowing greater >>> boom >>>>>> motion for dumping enough wind when there is a really strong gust. >>>>>> >>>>>> For small sloops up to 32', sailing close hauled by feeling sheet >>> tension >>>>>> is the fastest way to go. I have sailed with totally blind crews and >>> they >>>>>> sail closer to the wind than many sighted sailors distracted by >>> watching >>>>>> sail shape. >>>>>> >>>>>> Regards, >>>>>> >>>>>> Rick Lange >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Wed, Mar 24, 2021 at 1:48 PM ROGER PIHLAJA >>> wrote: >>>>>>> Rick, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> My 1976 Rhodes Continental 22 came with a cable style traveler. This >>> was >>>>>>> not a very good setup and I soon upgraded to the GBI bar-style >>> traveler >>>>>>> that is mounted on the backstay. This traveler was much better and I >>> used >>>>>>> it for many years. However, because the mainsail trimmer needed to >>> be in >>>>>>> line with the clam cleats on each end of the traveler bar in order to >>> cleat >>>>>>> off the control line, it was very difficult for the helmsman to also >>> play >>>>>>> the traveler. This was especially an issue when the helmsman was >>> sitting >>>>>>> up on the windward gunnel (i.e. hiking out) and the traveler needed >>> to be >>>>>>> trimmed to leeward. GBI?s 2nd >>>>>>> (3rd?) generation traveler pretty much solves all these issues. >>> Properly >>>>>>> adjusted, the latest generation traveler has a built-in slip >>> characteristic >>>>>>> that will save you in an accidental gibe or a knockdown gust. The >>>>>>> traveler control line is a continuous loop, which enables the >>> helmsman to >>>>>>> play the traveler to windward or leeward without leaving his hiking >>> station >>>>>>> up on the windward gunnel. The helmsman drives with one hand on the >>> tiller >>>>>>> extension, the other on the traveler control line, and multitasks. >>> The >>>>>>> helmsman can feel the weather/lee helm pressure thru the tiller and >>> is in >>>>>>> the best position to adjust the traveler to optimize the weather >>> helm/lee >>>>>>> helm balance. I?ve been sailing with the new generation traveler for >>> 3 >>>>>>> seasons now. If you care about boat speed and sail short handed, this >>>>>>> upgrade is well worth the price! On a close hauled course in 10-15 >>> knot of >>>>>>> wind, If you get into a drag race with another Rhodes 22 that is >>> properly >>>>>>> using its latest generation traveler vs you using your mainsheet, >>> you will >>>>>>> fall behind by ~30-40 sec/nm. In a PHRF race, that?s huge! Other >>> than >>>>>>> buying new sails, there is probably no other upgrade that offers this >>> much >>>>>>> performance per dollar spent. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Roger Pihlaja >>>>>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Sent from Mail for >>>>>>> Windows 10 >>>>>>> >>>>>>> From: ROGER PIHLAJA >>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2021 12:12 PM >>>>>>> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List >>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler >>> Modifications >>>>>>> Rick, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> When you ease the traveler, the end of the boom does not rise as it >>> does >>>>>>> when you ease the mainsheet. Thus the mainsail shape is affected >>> much less >>>>>>> when you ease the traveler vs the mainsheet. When you trim the >>> traveler >>>>>>> back to where it was, the flow reattaches itself much quicker. >>> Overall, >>>>>>> boat speed stays higher. That?s why you play the traveler much more >>> than >>>>>>> the mainsheet. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Roger Pihlaja >>>>>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>>>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 11:25 AM, Rick Lange >>> Trim >>>>>>> the trawrote: >>>>>>>> ?Jeff, >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Why the traveller? The sheet is so much faster and gives greater >>> range >>>>>>> of >>>>>>>> boom movement. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Rick Lange >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On Wed, Mar 24, 2021, 9:13 AM JeffSmith >>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>> When sailing to weather I like to play the traveler (as opposed to >>> the >>>>>>> main >>>>>>>>> sheet) in the puffs while sitting on the high side cockpit combing >>> with >>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>> hiking stick. >>>>>>>>> A continuous 5mm line with the core removed where it travels >>> through the >>>>>>>>> blocks on the New Traveler and possibly changing the purchase from >>> 5 to >>>>>>> 1 >>>>>>>>> to >>>>>>>>> 3 to 1 is part of my plan. Before holes are drilled in the cockpit >>>>>>> sides to >>>>>>>>> accomodate turning blocks to lead the continuous line forward >>> around the >>>>>>>>> perimeter of the cockpit, I would welcome input. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> ----- >>>>>>>>> Jeff Smith >>>>>>>>> 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT >>>>>>>>> Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor >>>>>>>>> Atlantic Highlands, NJ >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>> From mweisner at ebsmed.com Thu Mar 25 10:42:50 2021 From: mweisner at ebsmed.com (Michael D. Weisner) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2021 10:42:50 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Tool Definitions Message-ID: <002001d72185$227ddd80$67799880$@ebsmed.com> For some of us, repairing, maintaining and rebuilding a project boat is very rewarding and almost as much fun as sailing. I said ALMOST. For those who are members of the aforementioned "club," who may actually believe that if you need a tool for performing a task you should buy it or "He or she who dies with the most tools wins," I present the attached list of tool definitions. Hopefully you will find the list amusing. Mike s/v Wind Lass ('91) Nissequogue River, NY -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Tool Definitions.pdf Type: application/pdf Size: 64282 bytes Desc: not available URL: From tom.vanheule at intrinsicprograms.com Thu Mar 25 10:44:39 2021 From: tom.vanheule at intrinsicprograms.com (Tom Van Heule) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2021 09:44:39 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Tool Definitions In-Reply-To: <002001d72185$227ddd80$67799880$@ebsmed.com> References: <002001d72185$227ddd80$67799880$@ebsmed.com> Message-ID: Hah thanks Mike. On Thu, Mar 25, 2021, 9:42 AM Michael D. Weisner wrote: > For some of us, repairing, maintaining and rebuilding a project boat is > very > rewarding and almost as much fun as sailing. > > > > I said ALMOST. > > > > For those who are members of the aforementioned "club," who may actually > believe that if you need a tool for performing a task you should buy it or > "He or she who dies with the most tools wins," I present the attached list > of tool definitions. > > > > Hopefully you will find the list amusing. > > > > Mike > > s/v Wind Lass ('91) > > Nissequogue River, NY > > > > > > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: Tool Definitions.pdf > Type: application/pdf > Size: 64282 bytes > Desc: not available > URL: < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210325/0e55f721/attachment.pdf > > > From mitchpadl at gmail.com Thu Mar 25 12:27:12 2021 From: mitchpadl at gmail.com (Mitch Mitchell) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2021 12:27:12 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Tool Definitions In-Reply-To: <002001d72185$227ddd80$67799880$@ebsmed.com> References: <002001d72185$227ddd80$67799880$@ebsmed.com> Message-ID: I can relate to every definition! Sent from my iPhone > On Mar 25, 2021, at 10:42 AM, Michael D. Weisner wrote: > > ?For some of us, repairing, maintaining and rebuilding a project boat is very > rewarding and almost as much fun as sailing. > > > > I said ALMOST. > > > > For those who are members of the aforementioned "club," who may actually > believe that if you need a tool for performing a task you should buy it or > "He or she who dies with the most tools wins," I present the attached list > of tool definitions. > > > > Hopefully you will find the list amusing. > > > > Mike > > s/v Wind Lass ('91) > > Nissequogue River, NY > > > > > > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: Tool Definitions.pdf > Type: application/pdf > Size: 64282 bytes > Desc: not available > URL: From roger_pihlaja at msn.com Thu Mar 25 12:35:26 2021 From: roger_pihlaja at msn.com (ROGER PIHLAJA) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2021 16:35:26 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications In-Reply-To: <27107F4C-FC0E-4C4B-A485-D7EF102C8EAE@stottarchitecture.com> References: <1616591631222-0.post@n5.nabble.com> , <27107F4C-FC0E-4C4B-A485-D7EF102C8EAE@stottarchitecture.com> Message-ID: Richard, The way the traveler is used to bring the boom to the boat?s centerline is the traveler car is positioned to windward and then the mainsheet is tensioned. On the Rhodes 22, this means there is up to 5 feet of traveler bar for the car to move to leeward if necessary. Moving the end of the boom 5 feet to leeward is a huge amount of depowering on the mainsail. In fact, on S/V Dynamic Equilibrium, if dumping the traveler is not enough to keep the boat on its feet in a gust, we use that as an indication of when its time to reef the mainsail. Note, if dumping the traveler is not sufficient, you can always uncleat the mainsheet and let it run. But, we regard this as the equivalent of having the pressure safety valve pop open on a pressure vessel. It?s undesirable and ugly when it happens. The GBI 29 Traveler car is positively moved from one position to another by pushing or pulling on the control line. You never uncleat the control line and let the traveler car just slide on its own. There are several advantages: 1. Because the GBI 29 Traveler control lines are one continuous loop, there is no chance of a line getting snarled or fouled like there is when using the mainsheet to depower the mainsail. 2. You never have to assist the boom to move because of snarls or friction in the mainsheet blocks. Manipulate the GBI 29 Traveler control lines and the end of the boom moves right now, every time, no more and no less than you ask for. 3. The end of the boom does not rise up as much as when the mainsheet is used to depower the mainsail. This means there is not as much twist introduced into the top half of the mainsail and the mainsail does not interfere with the genoa as much. 4. After the gust has passed, the GBI 29 Traveler can move the end of the boom back to the centerline of the boat much more quickly vs the mainsheet (~3X less line to be manipulated). Again there is no chance of a tangle or snarl and the end of the boom is already down where it belongs so the top of the mainsail is not twisted off. So, for all the above reasons, I strongly disagree with you, Richard. Look in any book or video tutorial on sailing fast to windward and you will find they agree with me. Although the details of mainsheet travelers varies from boat to boat, the proper usage of them does not change. The GBI 29 Traveler is a unique design that I had not encountered in a lifetime of sailing. I guess that?s why Stan got a patent on it! Once you get used to it, it?s a marvelous piece of equipment. Before you criticize again, I would ask you to try sailing with one hand on the tiller extension and the other on the traveler control line. You will quickly come to appreciate the degree of fine control this gives you. It?s the sailing equivalent of the ?stick and throttle? feel that fighter pilots like so much. If this doesn?t change your mind; then, I guess nothing will. Roger Pihlaja S/V Dynamic Equilibrium Sent from Mail for Windows 10 From: Richard Stott Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2021 9:42 AM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications When sailing to whether, the traveler is used to bring the boom to the boat?s centerline. This improves sail shape, the relationship of the Jib/Main and ability to point higher. It is not the tool on a Rhodes to depower the Rig in a gust - use the main sheet for that. Ric Dadventure Richard Stott, AIA, LEED AP www.stottarchitecture.com Office 631-283-1777 Cell 516-965-3164 > On Mar 24, 2021, at 5:02 PM, Rick Lange wrote: > > Roger, > > That piece of gear is for setting your sails to the prevailing wind. It is > too cumbersome and limited for responding to gusts. > > Regards, > > Rick Lange > > > On Wed, Mar 24, 2021 at 4:51 PM ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: > >> Rick, >> >> One more question, beginner sailboats do not come equipped with mainsail >> travelers; but, more advanced sailboats nearly all have travelers. If you >> don?t sail your Rhodes 22 to windward while playing the traveler, what do >> you think that piece of gear is for? >> >> Roger Pihlaja >> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 4:34 PM, ROGER PIHLAJA >> wrote: >>> >>> ?Rick, >>> >>> If you have so much mainsail area up that dumping the traveler is not >> sufficient to keep the boat upright in a gust; then, you need to reef down >> the mainsail. The more efficient reefed mainsail shape will more than >> compensate for the greater unreeled mainsail area that spends a lot of time >> all twisted and luffing. Besides, it makes you look like a real amateur >> and it?s hard on the sail. >>> >>> Roger Pihlaja >>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 4:25 PM, ROGER PIHLAJA >> wrote: >>>> >>>> ?Rick, >>>> >>>> I would welcome the chance to match race you. I would be willing to >> bet considerable money that your strategy is wrong and I would beat you >> decisively. >>>> >>>> Roger Pihlaja >>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>> >>>>>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 4:21 PM, Rick Lange >> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> ?Roger, >>>>> >>>>> We're talking about sailing close hauled in a stiff breeze (15-20knt) >> with >>>>> sudden gusts that will round up the boat. The only mainsail shape that >>>>> matters during a gust is the shape that quickly dumps enough wind to >> keep >>>>> the boat on course without luffing the jib and, in the case of the R22, >>>>> sailing flat. >>>>> >>>>> Easing the main sheet is the quickest way to react while affording the >>>>> tactile control needed to ease and recover appropriately as the gust >>>>> varies. In addition to being quicker than a traveller can move, >>>>> sheet control is not as restrictive as a traveller in allowing greater >> boom >>>>> motion for dumping enough wind when there is a really strong gust. >>>>> >>>>> For small sloops up to 32', sailing close hauled by feeling sheet >> tension >>>>> is the fastest way to go. I have sailed with totally blind crews and >> they >>>>> sail closer to the wind than many sighted sailors distracted by >> watching >>>>> sail shape. >>>>> >>>>> Regards, >>>>> >>>>> Rick Lange >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>>> On Wed, Mar 24, 2021 at 1:48 PM ROGER PIHLAJA >> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> Rick, >>>>>> >>>>>> My 1976 Rhodes Continental 22 came with a cable style traveler. This >> was >>>>>> not a very good setup and I soon upgraded to the GBI bar-style >> traveler >>>>>> that is mounted on the backstay. This traveler was much better and I >> used >>>>>> it for many years. However, because the mainsail trimmer needed to >> be in >>>>>> line with the clam cleats on each end of the traveler bar in order to >> cleat >>>>>> off the control line, it was very difficult for the helmsman to also >> play >>>>>> the traveler. This was especially an issue when the helmsman was >> sitting >>>>>> up on the windward gunnel (i.e. hiking out) and the traveler needed >> to be >>>>>> trimmed to leeward. GBI?s 2nd >>>>>> (3rd?) generation traveler pretty much solves all these issues. >> Properly >>>>>> adjusted, the latest generation traveler has a built-in slip >> characteristic >>>>>> that will save you in an accidental gibe or a knockdown gust. The >>>>>> traveler control line is a continuous loop, which enables the >> helmsman to >>>>>> play the traveler to windward or leeward without leaving his hiking >> station >>>>>> up on the windward gunnel. The helmsman drives with one hand on the >> tiller >>>>>> extension, the other on the traveler control line, and multitasks. >> The >>>>>> helmsman can feel the weather/lee helm pressure thru the tiller and >> is in >>>>>> the best position to adjust the traveler to optimize the weather >> helm/lee >>>>>> helm balance. I?ve been sailing with the new generation traveler for >> 3 >>>>>> seasons now. If you care about boat speed and sail short handed, this >>>>>> upgrade is well worth the price! On a close hauled course in 10-15 >> knot of >>>>>> wind, If you get into a drag race with another Rhodes 22 that is >> properly >>>>>> using its latest generation traveler vs you using your mainsheet, >> you will >>>>>> fall behind by ~30-40 sec/nm. In a PHRF race, that?s huge! Other >> than >>>>>> buying new sails, there is probably no other upgrade that offers this >> much >>>>>> performance per dollar spent. >>>>>> >>>>>> Roger Pihlaja >>>>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>>>>> >>>>>> Sent from Mail for >>>>>> Windows 10 >>>>>> >>>>>> From: ROGER PIHLAJA >>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2021 12:12 PM >>>>>> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List >>>>>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler >> Modifications >>>>>> >>>>>> Rick, >>>>>> >>>>>> When you ease the traveler, the end of the boom does not rise as it >> does >>>>>> when you ease the mainsheet. Thus the mainsail shape is affected >> much less >>>>>> when you ease the traveler vs the mainsheet. When you trim the >> traveler >>>>>> back to where it was, the flow reattaches itself much quicker. >> Overall, >>>>>> boat speed stays higher. That?s why you play the traveler much more >> than >>>>>> the mainsheet. >>>>>> >>>>>> Roger Pihlaja >>>>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>>> >>>>>>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 11:25 AM, Rick Lange >> Trim >>>>>> the trawrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> ?Jeff, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Why the traveller? The sheet is so much faster and gives greater >> range >>>>>> of >>>>>>> boom movement. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Rick Lange >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Wed, Mar 24, 2021, 9:13 AM JeffSmith >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> When sailing to weather I like to play the traveler (as opposed to >> the >>>>>> main >>>>>>>> sheet) in the puffs while sitting on the high side cockpit combing >> with >>>>>> the >>>>>>>> hiking stick. >>>>>>>> A continuous 5mm line with the core removed where it travels >> through the >>>>>>>> blocks on the New Traveler and possibly changing the purchase from >> 5 to >>>>>> 1 >>>>>>>> to >>>>>>>> 3 to 1 is part of my plan. Before holes are drilled in the cockpit >>>>>> sides to >>>>>>>> accomodate turning blocks to lead the continuous line forward >> around the >>>>>>>> perimeter of the cockpit, I would welcome input. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> ----- >>>>>>>> Jeff Smith >>>>>>>> 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT >>>>>>>> Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor >>>>>>>> Atlantic Highlands, NJ >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ >>>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >> From ric at stottarchitecture.com Thu Mar 25 12:42:41 2021 From: ric at stottarchitecture.com (Ric Stott) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2021 12:42:41 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <0E4A457F-703F-4C5C-BA80-A34153EC5244@stottarchitecture.com> Hi Roger I?ve been racing sailboats all my life and agree with everything you said except, the GBI traveler that I bought from Stan is not operable quickly enough to make it an effective and valuable tool to depower when the boat is overpowered. Maybe I don?t know how to use it correctly. I like it for what it is but it has limitations. Ric Sent from my iPhone > On Mar 25, 2021, at 12:35 PM, ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: > > ?Richard, > > The way the traveler is used to bring the boom to the boat?s centerline is the traveler car is positioned to windward and then the mainsheet is tensioned. On the Rhodes 22, this means there is up to 5 feet of traveler bar for the car to move to leeward if necessary. Moving the end of the boom 5 feet to leeward is a huge amount of depowering on the mainsail. In fact, on S/V Dynamic Equilibrium, if dumping the traveler is not enough to keep the boat on its feet in a gust, we use that as an indication of when its time to reef the mainsail. Note, if dumping the traveler is not sufficient, you can always uncleat the mainsheet and let it run. But, we regard this as the equivalent of having the pressure safety valve pop open on a pressure vessel. It?s undesirable and ugly when it happens. The GBI 29 Traveler car is positively moved from one position to another by pushing or pulling on the control line. You never uncleat the control line and let the traveler car just slide on its own. There are several advantages: > > > 1. Because the GBI 29 Traveler control lines are one continuous loop, there is no chance of a line getting snarled or fouled like there is when using the mainsheet to depower the mainsail. > 2. You never have to assist the boom to move because of snarls or friction in the mainsheet blocks. Manipulate the GBI 29 Traveler control lines and the end of the boom moves right now, every time, no more and no less than you ask for. > 3. The end of the boom does not rise up as much as when the mainsheet is used to depower the mainsail. This means there is not as much twist introduced into the top half of the mainsail and the mainsail does not interfere with the genoa as much. > 4. After the gust has passed, the GBI 29 Traveler can move the end of the boom back to the centerline of the boat much more quickly vs the mainsheet (~3X less line to be manipulated). Again there is no chance of a tangle or snarl and the end of the boom is already down where it belongs so the top of the mainsail is not twisted off. > > So, for all the above reasons, I strongly disagree with you, Richard. Look in any book or video tutorial on sailing fast to windward and you will find they agree with me. Although the details of mainsheet travelers varies from boat to boat, the proper usage of them does not change. The GBI 29 Traveler is a unique design that I had not encountered in a lifetime of sailing. I guess that?s why Stan got a patent on it! Once you get used to it, it?s a marvelous piece of equipment. > > Before you criticize again, I would ask you to try sailing with one hand on the tiller extension and the other on the traveler control line. You will quickly come to appreciate the degree of fine control this gives you. It?s the sailing equivalent of the ?stick and throttle? feel that fighter pilots like so much. If this doesn?t change your mind; then, I guess nothing will. > > Roger Pihlaja > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > Sent from Mail for Windows 10 > > From: Richard Stott > Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2021 9:42 AM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications > > When sailing to whether, the traveler is used to bring the boom to the boat?s centerline. > This improves sail shape, the relationship of the Jib/Main and ability to point higher. > It is not the tool on a Rhodes to depower the Rig in a gust - use the main sheet for that. > Ric > Dadventure > > Richard Stott, AIA, LEED AP > www.stottarchitecture.com > Office 631-283-1777 > Cell 516-965-3164 > > > > > >> On Mar 24, 2021, at 5:02 PM, Rick Lange wrote: >> >> Roger, >> >> That piece of gear is for setting your sails to the prevailing wind. It is >> too cumbersome and limited for responding to gusts. >> >> Regards, >> >> Rick Lange >> >> >>> On Wed, Mar 24, 2021 at 4:51 PM ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: >>> >>> Rick, >>> >>> One more question, beginner sailboats do not come equipped with mainsail >>> travelers; but, more advanced sailboats nearly all have travelers. If you >>> don?t sail your Rhodes 22 to windward while playing the traveler, what do >>> you think that piece of gear is for? >>> >>> Roger Pihlaja >>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 4:34 PM, ROGER PIHLAJA >>> wrote: >>>> >>>> ?Rick, >>>> >>>> If you have so much mainsail area up that dumping the traveler is not >>> sufficient to keep the boat upright in a gust; then, you need to reef down >>> the mainsail. The more efficient reefed mainsail shape will more than >>> compensate for the greater unreeled mainsail area that spends a lot of time >>> all twisted and luffing. Besides, it makes you look like a real amateur >>> and it?s hard on the sail. >>>> >>>> Roger Pihlaja >>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>> >>>>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 4:25 PM, ROGER PIHLAJA >>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> ?Rick, >>>>> >>>>> I would welcome the chance to match race you. I would be willing to >>> bet considerable money that your strategy is wrong and I would beat you >>> decisively. >>>>> >>>>> Roger Pihlaja >>>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>>>> >>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>> >>>>>>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 4:21 PM, Rick Lange >>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> ?Roger, >>>>>> >>>>>> We're talking about sailing close hauled in a stiff breeze (15-20knt) >>> with >>>>>> sudden gusts that will round up the boat. The only mainsail shape that >>>>>> matters during a gust is the shape that quickly dumps enough wind to >>> keep >>>>>> the boat on course without luffing the jib and, in the case of the R22, >>>>>> sailing flat. >>>>>> >>>>>> Easing the main sheet is the quickest way to react while affording the >>>>>> tactile control needed to ease and recover appropriately as the gust >>>>>> varies. In addition to being quicker than a traveller can move, >>>>>> sheet control is not as restrictive as a traveller in allowing greater >>> boom >>>>>> motion for dumping enough wind when there is a really strong gust. >>>>>> >>>>>> For small sloops up to 32', sailing close hauled by feeling sheet >>> tension >>>>>> is the fastest way to go. I have sailed with totally blind crews and >>> they >>>>>> sail closer to the wind than many sighted sailors distracted by >>> watching >>>>>> sail shape. >>>>>> >>>>>> Regards, >>>>>> >>>>>> Rick Lange >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Wed, Mar 24, 2021 at 1:48 PM ROGER PIHLAJA >>> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Rick, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> My 1976 Rhodes Continental 22 came with a cable style traveler. This >>> was >>>>>>> not a very good setup and I soon upgraded to the GBI bar-style >>> traveler >>>>>>> that is mounted on the backstay. This traveler was much better and I >>> used >>>>>>> it for many years. However, because the mainsail trimmer needed to >>> be in >>>>>>> line with the clam cleats on each end of the traveler bar in order to >>> cleat >>>>>>> off the control line, it was very difficult for the helmsman to also >>> play >>>>>>> the traveler. This was especially an issue when the helmsman was >>> sitting >>>>>>> up on the windward gunnel (i.e. hiking out) and the traveler needed >>> to be >>>>>>> trimmed to leeward. GBI?s 2nd >>>>>>> (3rd?) generation traveler pretty much solves all these issues. >>> Properly >>>>>>> adjusted, the latest generation traveler has a built-in slip >>> characteristic >>>>>>> that will save you in an accidental gibe or a knockdown gust. The >>>>>>> traveler control line is a continuous loop, which enables the >>> helmsman to >>>>>>> play the traveler to windward or leeward without leaving his hiking >>> station >>>>>>> up on the windward gunnel. The helmsman drives with one hand on the >>> tiller >>>>>>> extension, the other on the traveler control line, and multitasks. >>> The >>>>>>> helmsman can feel the weather/lee helm pressure thru the tiller and >>> is in >>>>>>> the best position to adjust the traveler to optimize the weather >>> helm/lee >>>>>>> helm balance. I?ve been sailing with the new generation traveler for >>> 3 >>>>>>> seasons now. If you care about boat speed and sail short handed, this >>>>>>> upgrade is well worth the price! On a close hauled course in 10-15 >>> knot of >>>>>>> wind, If you get into a drag race with another Rhodes 22 that is >>> properly >>>>>>> using its latest generation traveler vs you using your mainsheet, >>> you will >>>>>>> fall behind by ~30-40 sec/nm. In a PHRF race, that?s huge! Other >>> than >>>>>>> buying new sails, there is probably no other upgrade that offers this >>> much >>>>>>> performance per dollar spent. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Roger Pihlaja >>>>>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Sent from Mail for >>>>>>> Windows 10 >>>>>>> >>>>>>> From: ROGER PIHLAJA >>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2021 12:12 PM >>>>>>> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List >>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler >>> Modifications >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Rick, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> When you ease the traveler, the end of the boom does not rise as it >>> does >>>>>>> when you ease the mainsheet. Thus the mainsail shape is affected >>> much less >>>>>>> when you ease the traveler vs the mainsheet. When you trim the >>> traveler >>>>>>> back to where it was, the flow reattaches itself much quicker. >>> Overall, >>>>>>> boat speed stays higher. That?s why you play the traveler much more >>> than >>>>>>> the mainsheet. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Roger Pihlaja >>>>>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>>>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 11:25 AM, Rick Lange >>> Trim >>>>>>> the trawrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> ?Jeff, >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Why the traveller? The sheet is so much faster and gives greater >>> range >>>>>>> of >>>>>>>> boom movement. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Rick Lange >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On Wed, Mar 24, 2021, 9:13 AM JeffSmith >>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> When sailing to weather I like to play the traveler (as opposed to >>> the >>>>>>> main >>>>>>>>> sheet) in the puffs while sitting on the high side cockpit combing >>> with >>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>> hiking stick. >>>>>>>>> A continuous 5mm line with the core removed where it travels >>> through the >>>>>>>>> blocks on the New Traveler and possibly changing the purchase from >>> 5 to >>>>>>> 1 >>>>>>>>> to >>>>>>>>> 3 to 1 is part of my plan. Before holes are drilled in the cockpit >>>>>>> sides to >>>>>>>>> accomodate turning blocks to lead the continuous line forward >>> around the >>>>>>>>> perimeter of the cockpit, I would welcome input. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> ----- >>>>>>>>> Jeff Smith >>>>>>>>> 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT >>>>>>>>> Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor >>>>>>>>> Atlantic Highlands, NJ >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>> > From roger_pihlaja at msn.com Thu Mar 25 13:01:24 2021 From: roger_pihlaja at msn.com (ROGER PIHLAJA) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2021 17:01:24 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications In-Reply-To: <0E4A457F-703F-4C5C-BA80-A34153EC5244@stottarchitecture.com> References: , <0E4A457F-703F-4C5C-BA80-A34153EC5244@stottarchitecture.com> Message-ID: Ric, I don?t understand why you think the GBI 29 Traveler is too slow to be useful for depowering the rig? There is nothing to uncleat or cleat, you just push or pull on the control line and the traveler car moves. It?s at least as fast as the mainsheet. Again, I sail with one hand on the control line and the other on the tiller extension. So, I don?t even need to reach for the control line. The traveler car movement is fast, positive, and controlled. Roger Pihlaja S/V Dynamic Equilibrium Sent from Mail for Windows 10 From: Ric Stott Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2021 12:42 PM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications Hi Roger I?ve been racing sailboats all my life and agree with everything you said except, the GBI traveler that I bought from Stan is not operable quickly enough to make it an effective and valuable tool to depower when the boat is overpowered. Maybe I don?t know how to use it correctly. I like it for what it is but it has limitations. Ric Sent from my iPhone > On Mar 25, 2021, at 12:35 PM, ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: > > ?Richard, > > The way the traveler is used to bring the boom to the boat?s centerline is the traveler car is positioned to windward and then the mainsheet is tensioned. On the Rhodes 22, this means there is up to 5 feet of traveler bar for the car to move to leeward if necessary. Moving the end of the boom 5 feet to leeward is a huge amount of depowering on the mainsail. In fact, on S/V Dynamic Equilibrium, if dumping the traveler is not enough to keep the boat on its feet in a gust, we use that as an indication of when its time to reef the mainsail. Note, if dumping the traveler is not sufficient, you can always uncleat the mainsheet and let it run. But, we regard this as the equivalent of having the pressure safety valve pop open on a pressure vessel. It?s undesirable and ugly when it happens. The GBI 29 Traveler car is positively moved from one position to another by pushing or pulling on the control line. You never uncleat the control line and let the traveler car just slide on its own. There are several advantages: > > > 1. Because the GBI 29 Traveler control lines are one continuous loop, there is no chance of a line getting snarled or fouled like there is when using the mainsheet to depower the mainsail. > 2. You never have to assist the boom to move because of snarls or friction in the mainsheet blocks. Manipulate the GBI 29 Traveler control lines and the end of the boom moves right now, every time, no more and no less than you ask for. > 3. The end of the boom does not rise up as much as when the mainsheet is used to depower the mainsail. This means there is not as much twist introduced into the top half of the mainsail and the mainsail does not interfere with the genoa as much. > 4. After the gust has passed, the GBI 29 Traveler can move the end of the boom back to the centerline of the boat much more quickly vs the mainsheet (~3X less line to be manipulated). Again there is no chance of a tangle or snarl and the end of the boom is already down where it belongs so the top of the mainsail is not twisted off. > > So, for all the above reasons, I strongly disagree with you, Richard. Look in any book or video tutorial on sailing fast to windward and you will find they agree with me. Although the details of mainsheet travelers varies from boat to boat, the proper usage of them does not change. The GBI 29 Traveler is a unique design that I had not encountered in a lifetime of sailing. I guess that?s why Stan got a patent on it! Once you get used to it, it?s a marvelous piece of equipment. > > Before you criticize again, I would ask you to try sailing with one hand on the tiller extension and the other on the traveler control line. You will quickly come to appreciate the degree of fine control this gives you. It?s the sailing equivalent of the ?stick and throttle? feel that fighter pilots like so much. If this doesn?t change your mind; then, I guess nothing will. > > Roger Pihlaja > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > Sent from Mail for Windows 10 > > From: Richard Stott > Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2021 9:42 AM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications > > When sailing to whether, the traveler is used to bring the boom to the boat?s centerline. > This improves sail shape, the relationship of the Jib/Main and ability to point higher. > It is not the tool on a Rhodes to depower the Rig in a gust - use the main sheet for that. > Ric > Dadventure > > Richard Stott, AIA, LEED AP > www.stottarchitecture.com> > Office 631-283-1777 > Cell 516-965-3164 > > > > > >> On Mar 24, 2021, at 5:02 PM, Rick Lange wrote: >> >> Roger, >> >> That piece of gear is for setting your sails to the prevailing wind. It is >> too cumbersome and limited for responding to gusts. >> >> Regards, >> >> Rick Lange >> >> >>> On Wed, Mar 24, 2021 at 4:51 PM ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: >>> >>> Rick, >>> >>> One more question, beginner sailboats do not come equipped with mainsail >>> travelers; but, more advanced sailboats nearly all have travelers. If you >>> don?t sail your Rhodes 22 to windward while playing the traveler, what do >>> you think that piece of gear is for? >>> >>> Roger Pihlaja >>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 4:34 PM, ROGER PIHLAJA >>> wrote: >>>> >>>> ?Rick, >>>> >>>> If you have so much mainsail area up that dumping the traveler is not >>> sufficient to keep the boat upright in a gust; then, you need to reef down >>> the mainsail. The more efficient reefed mainsail shape will more than >>> compensate for the greater unreeled mainsail area that spends a lot of time >>> all twisted and luffing. Besides, it makes you look like a real amateur >>> and it?s hard on the sail. >>>> >>>> Roger Pihlaja >>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>> >>>>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 4:25 PM, ROGER PIHLAJA >>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> ?Rick, >>>>> >>>>> I would welcome the chance to match race you. I would be willing to >>> bet considerable money that your strategy is wrong and I would beat you >>> decisively. >>>>> >>>>> Roger Pihlaja >>>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>>>> >>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>> >>>>>>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 4:21 PM, Rick Lange >>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> ?Roger, >>>>>> >>>>>> We're talking about sailing close hauled in a stiff breeze (15-20knt) >>> with >>>>>> sudden gusts that will round up the boat. The only mainsail shape that >>>>>> matters during a gust is the shape that quickly dumps enough wind to >>> keep >>>>>> the boat on course without luffing the jib and, in the case of the R22, >>>>>> sailing flat. >>>>>> >>>>>> Easing the main sheet is the quickest way to react while affording the >>>>>> tactile control needed to ease and recover appropriately as the gust >>>>>> varies. In addition to being quicker than a traveller can move, >>>>>> sheet control is not as restrictive as a traveller in allowing greater >>> boom >>>>>> motion for dumping enough wind when there is a really strong gust. >>>>>> >>>>>> For small sloops up to 32', sailing close hauled by feeling sheet >>> tension >>>>>> is the fastest way to go. I have sailed with totally blind crews and >>> they >>>>>> sail closer to the wind than many sighted sailors distracted by >>> watching >>>>>> sail shape. >>>>>> >>>>>> Regards, >>>>>> >>>>>> Rick Lange >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Wed, Mar 24, 2021 at 1:48 PM ROGER PIHLAJA >>> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Rick, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> My 1976 Rhodes Continental 22 came with a cable style traveler. This >>> was >>>>>>> not a very good setup and I soon upgraded to the GBI bar-style >>> traveler >>>>>>> that is mounted on the backstay. This traveler was much better and I >>> used >>>>>>> it for many years. However, because the mainsail trimmer needed to >>> be in >>>>>>> line with the clam cleats on each end of the traveler bar in order to >>> cleat >>>>>>> off the control line, it was very difficult for the helmsman to also >>> play >>>>>>> the traveler. This was especially an issue when the helmsman was >>> sitting >>>>>>> up on the windward gunnel (i.e. hiking out) and the traveler needed >>> to be >>>>>>> trimmed to leeward. GBI?s 2nd >>>>>>> (3rd?) generation traveler pretty much solves all these issues. >>> Properly >>>>>>> adjusted, the latest generation traveler has a built-in slip >>> characteristic >>>>>>> that will save you in an accidental gibe or a knockdown gust. The >>>>>>> traveler control line is a continuous loop, which enables the >>> helmsman to >>>>>>> play the traveler to windward or leeward without leaving his hiking >>> station >>>>>>> up on the windward gunnel. The helmsman drives with one hand on the >>> tiller >>>>>>> extension, the other on the traveler control line, and multitasks. >>> The >>>>>>> helmsman can feel the weather/lee helm pressure thru the tiller and >>> is in >>>>>>> the best position to adjust the traveler to optimize the weather >>> helm/lee >>>>>>> helm balance. I?ve been sailing with the new generation traveler for >>> 3 >>>>>>> seasons now. If you care about boat speed and sail short handed, this >>>>>>> upgrade is well worth the price! On a close hauled course in 10-15 >>> knot of >>>>>>> wind, If you get into a drag race with another Rhodes 22 that is >>> properly >>>>>>> using its latest generation traveler vs you using your mainsheet, >>> you will >>>>>>> fall behind by ~30-40 sec/nm. In a PHRF race, that?s huge! Other >>> than >>>>>>> buying new sails, there is probably no other upgrade that offers this >>> much >>>>>>> performance per dollar spent. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Roger Pihlaja >>>>>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Sent from Mail for >>>>>>> Windows 10 >>>>>>> >>>>>>> From: ROGER PIHLAJA >>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2021 12:12 PM >>>>>>> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List >>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler >>> Modifications >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Rick, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> When you ease the traveler, the end of the boom does not rise as it >>> does >>>>>>> when you ease the mainsheet. Thus the mainsail shape is affected >>> much less >>>>>>> when you ease the traveler vs the mainsheet. When you trim the >>> traveler >>>>>>> back to where it was, the flow reattaches itself much quicker. >>> Overall, >>>>>>> boat speed stays higher. That?s why you play the traveler much more >>> than >>>>>>> the mainsheet. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Roger Pihlaja >>>>>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>>>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 11:25 AM, Rick Lange >>> Trim >>>>>>> the trawrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> ?Jeff, >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Why the traveller? The sheet is so much faster and gives greater >>> range >>>>>>> of >>>>>>>> boom movement. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Rick Lange >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On Wed, Mar 24, 2021, 9:13 AM JeffSmith >>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> When sailing to weather I like to play the traveler (as opposed to >>> the >>>>>>> main >>>>>>>>> sheet) in the puffs while sitting on the high side cockpit combing >>> with >>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>> hiking stick. >>>>>>>>> A continuous 5mm line with the core removed where it travels >>> through the >>>>>>>>> blocks on the New Traveler and possibly changing the purchase from >>> 5 to >>>>>>> 1 >>>>>>>>> to >>>>>>>>> 3 to 1 is part of my plan. Before holes are drilled in the cockpit >>>>>>> sides to >>>>>>>>> accomodate turning blocks to lead the continuous line forward >>> around the >>>>>>>>> perimeter of the cockpit, I would welcome input. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> ----- >>>>>>>>> Jeff Smith >>>>>>>>> 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT >>>>>>>>> Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor >>>>>>>>> Atlantic Highlands, NJ >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>> > From ric at stottarchitecture.com Thu Mar 25 13:37:24 2021 From: ric at stottarchitecture.com (Richard Stott) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2021 13:37:24 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications In-Reply-To: References: <0E4A457F-703F-4C5C-BA80-A34153EC5244@stottarchitecture.com> Message-ID: I must be doing something wrong. Mine is not so easy to use and I bust my knuckles on it too. Richard Stott, AIA, LEED AP www.stottarchitecture.com Office 631-283-1777 Cell 516-965-3164 > On Mar 25, 2021, at 1:01 PM, ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: > > Ric, > > I don?t understand why you think the GBI 29 Traveler is too slow to be useful for depowering the rig? There is nothing to uncleat or cleat, you just push or pull on the control line and the traveler car moves. It?s at least as fast as the mainsheet. Again, I sail with one hand on the control line and the other on the tiller extension. So, I don?t even need to reach for the control line. The traveler car movement is fast, positive, and controlled. > > Roger Pihlaja > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > Sent from Mail> for Windows 10 > > From: Ric Stott> > Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2021 12:42 PM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List> > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications > > Hi Roger > I?ve been racing sailboats all my life and agree with everything you said except, the GBI traveler that I bought from Stan is not operable quickly enough to make it an effective and valuable tool to depower when the boat is overpowered. > Maybe I don?t know how to use it correctly. I like it for what it is but it has limitations. > Ric > Sent from my iPhone > >> On Mar 25, 2021, at 12:35 PM, ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: >> >> ?Richard, >> >> The way the traveler is used to bring the boom to the boat?s centerline is the traveler car is positioned to windward and then the mainsheet is tensioned. On the Rhodes 22, this means there is up to 5 feet of traveler bar for the car to move to leeward if necessary. Moving the end of the boom 5 feet to leeward is a huge amount of depowering on the mainsail. In fact, on S/V Dynamic Equilibrium, if dumping the traveler is not enough to keep the boat on its feet in a gust, we use that as an indication of when its time to reef the mainsail. Note, if dumping the traveler is not sufficient, you can always uncleat the mainsheet and let it run. But, we regard this as the equivalent of having the pressure safety valve pop open on a pressure vessel. It?s undesirable and ugly when it happens. The GBI 29 Traveler car is positively moved from one position to another by pushing or pulling on the control line. You never uncleat the control line and let the traveler car just slide on its own. There are several advantages: >> >> >> 1. Because the GBI 29 Traveler control lines are one continuous loop, there is no chance of a line getting snarled or fouled like there is when using the mainsheet to depower the mainsail. >> 2. You never have to assist the boom to move because of snarls or friction in the mainsheet blocks. Manipulate the GBI 29 Traveler control lines and the end of the boom moves right now, every time, no more and no less than you ask for. >> 3. The end of the boom does not rise up as much as when the mainsheet is used to depower the mainsail. This means there is not as much twist introduced into the top half of the mainsail and the mainsail does not interfere with the genoa as much. >> 4. After the gust has passed, the GBI 29 Traveler can move the end of the boom back to the centerline of the boat much more quickly vs the mainsheet (~3X less line to be manipulated). Again there is no chance of a tangle or snarl and the end of the boom is already down where it belongs so the top of the mainsail is not twisted off. >> >> So, for all the above reasons, I strongly disagree with you, Richard. Look in any book or video tutorial on sailing fast to windward and you will find they agree with me. Although the details of mainsheet travelers varies from boat to boat, the proper usage of them does not change. The GBI 29 Traveler is a unique design that I had not encountered in a lifetime of sailing. I guess that?s why Stan got a patent on it! Once you get used to it, it?s a marvelous piece of equipment. >> >> Before you criticize again, I would ask you to try sailing with one hand on the tiller extension and the other on the traveler control line. You will quickly come to appreciate the degree of fine control this gives you. It?s the sailing equivalent of the ?stick and throttle? feel that fighter pilots like so much. If this doesn?t change your mind; then, I guess nothing will. >> >> Roger Pihlaja >> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >> >> Sent from Mail for Windows 10 >> >> From: Richard Stott >> Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2021 9:42 AM >> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List >> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications >> >> When sailing to whether, the traveler is used to bring the boom to the boat?s centerline. >> This improves sail shape, the relationship of the Jib/Main and ability to point higher. >> It is not the tool on a Rhodes to depower the Rig in a gust - use the main sheet for that. >> Ric >> Dadventure >> >> Richard Stott, AIA, LEED AP >> www.stottarchitecture.com >> >> Office 631-283-1777 >> Cell 516-965-3164 >> >> >> >> >> >>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 5:02 PM, Rick Lange wrote: >>> >>> Roger, >>> >>> That piece of gear is for setting your sails to the prevailing wind. It is >>> too cumbersome and limited for responding to gusts. >>> >>> Regards, >>> >>> Rick Lange >>> >>> >>>> On Wed, Mar 24, 2021 at 4:51 PM ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: >>>> >>>> Rick, >>>> >>>> One more question, beginner sailboats do not come equipped with mainsail >>>> travelers; but, more advanced sailboats nearly all have travelers. If you >>>> don?t sail your Rhodes 22 to windward while playing the traveler, what do >>>> you think that piece of gear is for? >>>> >>>> Roger Pihlaja >>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>> >>>>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 4:34 PM, ROGER PIHLAJA >>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> ?Rick, >>>>> >>>>> If you have so much mainsail area up that dumping the traveler is not >>>> sufficient to keep the boat upright in a gust; then, you need to reef down >>>> the mainsail. The more efficient reefed mainsail shape will more than >>>> compensate for the greater unreeled mainsail area that spends a lot of time >>>> all twisted and luffing. Besides, it makes you look like a real amateur >>>> and it?s hard on the sail. >>>>> >>>>> Roger Pihlaja >>>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>>>> >>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>> >>>>>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 4:25 PM, ROGER PIHLAJA >>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> ?Rick, >>>>>> >>>>>> I would welcome the chance to match race you. I would be willing to >>>> bet considerable money that your strategy is wrong and I would beat you >>>> decisively. >>>>>> >>>>>> Roger Pihlaja >>>>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>>>>> >>>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 4:21 PM, Rick Lange >>>> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> ?Roger, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> We're talking about sailing close hauled in a stiff breeze (15-20knt) >>>> with >>>>>>> sudden gusts that will round up the boat. The only mainsail shape that >>>>>>> matters during a gust is the shape that quickly dumps enough wind to >>>> keep >>>>>>> the boat on course without luffing the jib and, in the case of the R22, >>>>>>> sailing flat. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Easing the main sheet is the quickest way to react while affording the >>>>>>> tactile control needed to ease and recover appropriately as the gust >>>>>>> varies. In addition to being quicker than a traveller can move, >>>>>>> sheet control is not as restrictive as a traveller in allowing greater >>>> boom >>>>>>> motion for dumping enough wind when there is a really strong gust. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> For small sloops up to 32', sailing close hauled by feeling sheet >>>> tension >>>>>>> is the fastest way to go. I have sailed with totally blind crews and >>>> they >>>>>>> sail closer to the wind than many sighted sailors distracted by >>>> watching >>>>>>> sail shape. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Regards, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Rick Lange >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On Wed, Mar 24, 2021 at 1:48 PM ROGER PIHLAJA >>>> wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Rick, >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> My 1976 Rhodes Continental 22 came with a cable style traveler. This >>>> was >>>>>>>> not a very good setup and I soon upgraded to the GBI bar-style >>>> traveler >>>>>>>> that is mounted on the backstay. This traveler was much better and I >>>> used >>>>>>>> it for many years. However, because the mainsail trimmer needed to >>>> be in >>>>>>>> line with the clam cleats on each end of the traveler bar in order to >>>> cleat >>>>>>>> off the control line, it was very difficult for the helmsman to also >>>> play >>>>>>>> the traveler. This was especially an issue when the helmsman was >>>> sitting >>>>>>>> up on the windward gunnel (i.e. hiking out) and the traveler needed >>>> to be >>>>>>>> trimmed to leeward. GBI?s 2nd >>>>>>>> (3rd?) generation traveler pretty much solves all these issues. >>>> Properly >>>>>>>> adjusted, the latest generation traveler has a built-in slip >>>> characteristic >>>>>>>> that will save you in an accidental gibe or a knockdown gust. The >>>>>>>> traveler control line is a continuous loop, which enables the >>>> helmsman to >>>>>>>> play the traveler to windward or leeward without leaving his hiking >>>> station >>>>>>>> up on the windward gunnel. The helmsman drives with one hand on the >>>> tiller >>>>>>>> extension, the other on the traveler control line, and multitasks. >>>> The >>>>>>>> helmsman can feel the weather/lee helm pressure thru the tiller and >>>> is in >>>>>>>> the best position to adjust the traveler to optimize the weather >>>> helm/lee >>>>>>>> helm balance. I?ve been sailing with the new generation traveler for >>>> 3 >>>>>>>> seasons now. If you care about boat speed and sail short handed, this >>>>>>>> upgrade is well worth the price! On a close hauled course in 10-15 >>>> knot of >>>>>>>> wind, If you get into a drag race with another Rhodes 22 that is >>>> properly >>>>>>>> using its latest generation traveler vs you using your mainsheet, >>>> you will >>>>>>>> fall behind by ~30-40 sec/nm. In a PHRF race, that?s huge! Other >>>> than >>>>>>>> buying new sails, there is probably no other upgrade that offers this >>>> much >>>>>>>> performance per dollar spent. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Roger Pihlaja >>>>>>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Sent from Mail for >>>>>>>> Windows 10 >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> From: ROGER PIHLAJA >>>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2021 12:12 PM >>>>>>>> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List >>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler >>>> Modifications >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Rick, >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> When you ease the traveler, the end of the boom does not rise as it >>>> does >>>>>>>> when you ease the mainsheet. Thus the mainsail shape is affected >>>> much less >>>>>>>> when you ease the traveler vs the mainsheet. When you trim the >>>> traveler >>>>>>>> back to where it was, the flow reattaches itself much quicker. >>>> Overall, >>>>>>>> boat speed stays higher. That?s why you play the traveler much more >>>> than >>>>>>>> the mainsheet. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Roger Pihlaja >>>>>>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>>>>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 11:25 AM, Rick Lange >>>> Trim >>>>>>>> the trawrote: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> ?Jeff, >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Why the traveller? The sheet is so much faster and gives greater >>>> range >>>>>>>> of >>>>>>>>> boom movement. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Rick Lange >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> On Wed, Mar 24, 2021, 9:13 AM JeffSmith >>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> When sailing to weather I like to play the traveler (as opposed to >>>> the >>>>>>>> main >>>>>>>>>> sheet) in the puffs while sitting on the high side cockpit combing >>>> with >>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>> hiking stick. >>>>>>>>>> A continuous 5mm line with the core removed where it travels >>>> through the >>>>>>>>>> blocks on the New Traveler and possibly changing the purchase from >>>> 5 to >>>>>>>> 1 >>>>>>>>>> to >>>>>>>>>> 3 to 1 is part of my plan. Before holes are drilled in the cockpit >>>>>>>> sides to >>>>>>>>>> accomodate turning blocks to lead the continuous line forward >>>> around the >>>>>>>>>> perimeter of the cockpit, I would welcome input. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> ----- >>>>>>>>>> Jeff Smith >>>>>>>>>> 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT >>>>>>>>>> Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor >>>>>>>>>> Atlantic Highlands, NJ >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From sloopblueheron at gmail.com Thu Mar 25 13:43:44 2021 From: sloopblueheron at gmail.com (Rick Lange) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2021 13:43:44 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications In-Reply-To: <1616623551671-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1616591631222-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616623551671-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: Jeff, If you have IMF and the diamond board, you'll be lucky to keep her under 45 deg off the wind. You'll definitely need able bodied crew in winds 10 knt or above. Regards, Rick Lange On Wed, Mar 24, 2021 at 6:05 PM JeffSmith wrote: > I have raced my last 2 boats (a Baltic 39 and a J/30) with good results > over the past 12 years in the AHYC PHRF Fleet-Non Spin. I hope to race my > R22 this year, but feel I have a lot to learn and modify before I can be > competitive against a fleet of bigger boats. I will certainly have the > highest PHRF rating by far. > The one race I ran last year (which was when I first sailed the R22) was a > disaster upwind. > So my goal is to improve performance within a budget... > Steering from the forward end of the cockpit (keep the weight out of the > ends!) has led me to the above traveler mods, with the control lines led > forward to my steering station. > I'm pretty sure I have the newest traveler, but find it is totality under > responsive to racing needs. The friction from 3/16 th" 5 purchase > continuous line in the small blocks does not even need a cleat to keep it > from moving! > Tomorrow I plan to raise my mast on the boat in the driveway and fiddle > around with the traveler. > Roger obviously Races and I hope to pick his brains, if he will allow. But > how about others? I know that the R22 is considered a cruising boat, but > Racing is tons of fun and a great way to spend additional time on the water > with other great sailors. > > > > ----- > Jeff Smith > 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT > Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor > Atlantic Highlands, NJ > > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > From rlowe at vt.edu Thu Mar 25 13:44:42 2021 From: rlowe at vt.edu (Lowe, Rob) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2021 17:44:42 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications In-Reply-To: References: <0E4A457F-703F-4C5C-BA80-A34153EC5244@stottarchitecture.com> , Message-ID: Sounds like we all could use a lesson on proper adjustment and use of the new traveler. Just messing with mine off the boat, I'm not sure how to use it correctly. - rob ________________________________ From: Rhodes22-list on behalf of Richard Stott Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2021 1:37 PM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications I must be doing something wrong. Mine is not so easy to use and I bust my knuckles on it too. Richard Stott, AIA, LEED AP www.stottarchitecture.com Office 631-283-1777 Cell 516-965-3164 > On Mar 25, 2021, at 1:01 PM, ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: > > Ric, > > I don?t understand why you think the GBI 29 Traveler is too slow to be useful for depowering the rig? There is nothing to uncleat or cleat, you just push or pull on the control line and the traveler car moves. It?s at least as fast as the mainsheet. Again, I sail with one hand on the control line and the other on the tiller extension. So, I don?t even need to reach for the control line. The traveler car movement is fast, positive, and controlled. > > Roger Pihlaja > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > Sent from Mail> for Windows 10 > > From: Ric Stott> > Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2021 12:42 PM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List> > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications > > Hi Roger > I?ve been racing sailboats all my life and agree with everything you said except, the GBI traveler that I bought from Stan is not operable quickly enough to make it an effective and valuable tool to depower when the boat is overpowered. > Maybe I don?t know how to use it correctly. I like it for what it is but it has limitations. > Ric > Sent from my iPhone > >> On Mar 25, 2021, at 12:35 PM, ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: >> >> ?Richard, >> >> The way the traveler is used to bring the boom to the boat?s centerline is the traveler car is positioned to windward and then the mainsheet is tensioned. On the Rhodes 22, this means there is up to 5 feet of traveler bar for the car to move to leeward if necessary. Moving the end of the boom 5 feet to leeward is a huge amount of depowering on the mainsail. In fact, on S/V Dynamic Equilibrium, if dumping the traveler is not enough to keep the boat on its feet in a gust, we use that as an indication of when its time to reef the mainsail. Note, if dumping the traveler is not sufficient, you can always uncleat the mainsheet and let it run. But, we regard this as the equivalent of having the pressure safety valve pop open on a pressure vessel. It?s undesirable and ugly when it happens. The GBI 29 Traveler car is positively moved from one position to another by pushing or pulling on the control line. You never uncleat the control line and let the traveler car just slide on its own. There are several advantages: >> >> >> 1. Because the GBI 29 Traveler control lines are one continuous loop, there is no chance of a line getting snarled or fouled like there is when using the mainsheet to depower the mainsail. >> 2. You never have to assist the boom to move because of snarls or friction in the mainsheet blocks. Manipulate the GBI 29 Traveler control lines and the end of the boom moves right now, every time, no more and no less than you ask for. >> 3. The end of the boom does not rise up as much as when the mainsheet is used to depower the mainsail. This means there is not as much twist introduced into the top half of the mainsail and the mainsail does not interfere with the genoa as much. >> 4. After the gust has passed, the GBI 29 Traveler can move the end of the boom back to the centerline of the boat much more quickly vs the mainsheet (~3X less line to be manipulated). Again there is no chance of a tangle or snarl and the end of the boom is already down where it belongs so the top of the mainsail is not twisted off. >> >> So, for all the above reasons, I strongly disagree with you, Richard. Look in any book or video tutorial on sailing fast to windward and you will find they agree with me. Although the details of mainsheet travelers varies from boat to boat, the proper usage of them does not change. The GBI 29 Traveler is a unique design that I had not encountered in a lifetime of sailing. I guess that?s why Stan got a patent on it! Once you get used to it, it?s a marvelous piece of equipment. >> >> Before you criticize again, I would ask you to try sailing with one hand on the tiller extension and the other on the traveler control line. You will quickly come to appreciate the degree of fine control this gives you. It?s the sailing equivalent of the ?stick and throttle? feel that fighter pilots like so much. If this doesn?t change your mind; then, I guess nothing will. >> >> Roger Pihlaja >> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >> >> Sent from Mail for Windows 10 >> >> From: Richard Stott >> Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2021 9:42 AM >> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List >> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications >> >> When sailing to whether, the traveler is used to bring the boom to the boat?s centerline. >> This improves sail shape, the relationship of the Jib/Main and ability to point higher. >> It is not the tool on a Rhodes to depower the Rig in a gust - use the main sheet for that. >> Ric >> Dadventure >> >> Richard Stott, AIA, LEED AP >> www.stottarchitecture.com >> >> Office 631-283-1777 >> Cell 516-965-3164 >> >> >> >> >> >>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 5:02 PM, Rick Lange wrote: >>> >>> Roger, >>> >>> That piece of gear is for setting your sails to the prevailing wind. It is >>> too cumbersome and limited for responding to gusts. >>> >>> Regards, >>> >>> Rick Lange >>> >>> >>>> On Wed, Mar 24, 2021 at 4:51 PM ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: >>>> >>>> Rick, >>>> >>>> One more question, beginner sailboats do not come equipped with mainsail >>>> travelers; but, more advanced sailboats nearly all have travelers. If you >>>> don?t sail your Rhodes 22 to windward while playing the traveler, what do >>>> you think that piece of gear is for? >>>> >>>> Roger Pihlaja >>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>> >>>>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 4:34 PM, ROGER PIHLAJA >>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> ?Rick, >>>>> >>>>> If you have so much mainsail area up that dumping the traveler is not >>>> sufficient to keep the boat upright in a gust; then, you need to reef down >>>> the mainsail. The more efficient reefed mainsail shape will more than >>>> compensate for the greater unreeled mainsail area that spends a lot of time >>>> all twisted and luffing. Besides, it makes you look like a real amateur >>>> and it?s hard on the sail. >>>>> >>>>> Roger Pihlaja >>>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>>>> >>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>> >>>>>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 4:25 PM, ROGER PIHLAJA >>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> ?Rick, >>>>>> >>>>>> I would welcome the chance to match race you. I would be willing to >>>> bet considerable money that your strategy is wrong and I would beat you >>>> decisively. >>>>>> >>>>>> Roger Pihlaja >>>>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>>>>> >>>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 4:21 PM, Rick Lange >>>> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> ?Roger, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> We're talking about sailing close hauled in a stiff breeze (15-20knt) >>>> with >>>>>>> sudden gusts that will round up the boat. The only mainsail shape that >>>>>>> matters during a gust is the shape that quickly dumps enough wind to >>>> keep >>>>>>> the boat on course without luffing the jib and, in the case of the R22, >>>>>>> sailing flat. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Easing the main sheet is the quickest way to react while affording the >>>>>>> tactile control needed to ease and recover appropriately as the gust >>>>>>> varies. In addition to being quicker than a traveller can move, >>>>>>> sheet control is not as restrictive as a traveller in allowing greater >>>> boom >>>>>>> motion for dumping enough wind when there is a really strong gust. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> For small sloops up to 32', sailing close hauled by feeling sheet >>>> tension >>>>>>> is the fastest way to go. I have sailed with totally blind crews and >>>> they >>>>>>> sail closer to the wind than many sighted sailors distracted by >>>> watching >>>>>>> sail shape. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Regards, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Rick Lange >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On Wed, Mar 24, 2021 at 1:48 PM ROGER PIHLAJA >>>> wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Rick, >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> My 1976 Rhodes Continental 22 came with a cable style traveler. This >>>> was >>>>>>>> not a very good setup and I soon upgraded to the GBI bar-style >>>> traveler >>>>>>>> that is mounted on the backstay. This traveler was much better and I >>>> used >>>>>>>> it for many years. However, because the mainsail trimmer needed to >>>> be in >>>>>>>> line with the clam cleats on each end of the traveler bar in order to >>>> cleat >>>>>>>> off the control line, it was very difficult for the helmsman to also >>>> play >>>>>>>> the traveler. This was especially an issue when the helmsman was >>>> sitting >>>>>>>> up on the windward gunnel (i.e. hiking out) and the traveler needed >>>> to be >>>>>>>> trimmed to leeward. GBI?s 2nd >>>>>>>> (3rd?) generation traveler pretty much solves all these issues. >>>> Properly >>>>>>>> adjusted, the latest generation traveler has a built-in slip >>>> characteristic >>>>>>>> that will save you in an accidental gibe or a knockdown gust. The >>>>>>>> traveler control line is a continuous loop, which enables the >>>> helmsman to >>>>>>>> play the traveler to windward or leeward without leaving his hiking >>>> station >>>>>>>> up on the windward gunnel. The helmsman drives with one hand on the >>>> tiller >>>>>>>> extension, the other on the traveler control line, and multitasks. >>>> The >>>>>>>> helmsman can feel the weather/lee helm pressure thru the tiller and >>>> is in >>>>>>>> the best position to adjust the traveler to optimize the weather >>>> helm/lee >>>>>>>> helm balance. I?ve been sailing with the new generation traveler for >>>> 3 >>>>>>>> seasons now. If you care about boat speed and sail short handed, this >>>>>>>> upgrade is well worth the price! On a close hauled course in 10-15 >>>> knot of >>>>>>>> wind, If you get into a drag race with another Rhodes 22 that is >>>> properly >>>>>>>> using its latest generation traveler vs you using your mainsheet, >>>> you will >>>>>>>> fall behind by ~30-40 sec/nm. In a PHRF race, that?s huge! Other >>>> than >>>>>>>> buying new sails, there is probably no other upgrade that offers this >>>> much >>>>>>>> performance per dollar spent. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Roger Pihlaja >>>>>>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Sent from Mail for >>>>>>>> Windows 10 >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> From: ROGER PIHLAJA >>>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2021 12:12 PM >>>>>>>> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List >>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler >>>> Modifications >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Rick, >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> When you ease the traveler, the end of the boom does not rise as it >>>> does >>>>>>>> when you ease the mainsheet. Thus the mainsail shape is affected >>>> much less >>>>>>>> when you ease the traveler vs the mainsheet. When you trim the >>>> traveler >>>>>>>> back to where it was, the flow reattaches itself much quicker. >>>> Overall, >>>>>>>> boat speed stays higher. That?s why you play the traveler much more >>>> than >>>>>>>> the mainsheet. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Roger Pihlaja >>>>>>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>>>>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 11:25 AM, Rick Lange >>>> Trim >>>>>>>> the trawrote: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> ?Jeff, >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Why the traveller? The sheet is so much faster and gives greater >>>> range >>>>>>>> of >>>>>>>>> boom movement. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Rick Lange >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> On Wed, Mar 24, 2021, 9:13 AM JeffSmith >>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> When sailing to weather I like to play the traveler (as opposed to >>>> the >>>>>>>> main >>>>>>>>>> sheet) in the puffs while sitting on the high side cockpit combing >>>> with >>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>> hiking stick. >>>>>>>>>> A continuous 5mm line with the core removed where it travels >>>> through the >>>>>>>>>> blocks on the New Traveler and possibly changing the purchase from >>>> 5 to >>>>>>>> 1 >>>>>>>>>> to >>>>>>>>>> 3 to 1 is part of my plan. Before holes are drilled in the cockpit >>>>>>>> sides to >>>>>>>>>> accomodate turning blocks to lead the continuous line forward >>>> around the >>>>>>>>>> perimeter of the cockpit, I would welcome input. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> ----- >>>>>>>>>> Jeff Smith >>>>>>>>>> 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT >>>>>>>>>> Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor >>>>>>>>>> Atlantic Highlands, NJ >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From jeffsmithphoto at gmail.com Thu Mar 25 13:48:38 2021 From: jeffsmithphoto at gmail.com (JeffSmith) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2021 10:48:38 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications In-Reply-To: References: <1616623551671-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616627141536-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <1616694518911-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Thanks for all the info Roger! I'm glad I asked. ----- Jeff Smith 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor Atlantic Highlands, NJ -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From sloopblueheron at gmail.com Thu Mar 25 13:58:05 2021 From: sloopblueheron at gmail.com (Rick Lange) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2021 13:58:05 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications In-Reply-To: References: <0E4A457F-703F-4C5C-BA80-A34153EC5244@stottarchitecture.com> Message-ID: Roger, When I sail close hauled in under 10 knots, I point highest when the traveller is all the way to the leeward end of the bar. Only in stronger winds do I move the traveller no tighter than midships. So even the most responsive traveller doesn't have the room to dump much wind. The only use I can think of for a really responsive traveller is in a frequent tacking situation. Regards, Rick Lange On Thu, Mar 25, 2021 at 1:01 PM ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: > Ric, > > I don?t understand why you think the GBI 29 Traveler is too slow to be > useful for depowering the rig? There is nothing to uncleat or cleat, you > just push or pull on the control line and the traveler car moves. It?s at > least as fast as the mainsheet. Again, I sail with one hand on the control > line and the other on the tiller extension. So, I don?t even need to reach > for the control line. The traveler car movement is fast, positive, and > controlled. > > Roger Pihlaja > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > Sent from Mail for > Windows 10 > > From: Ric Stott > Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2021 12:42 PM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications > > Hi Roger > I?ve been racing sailboats all my life and agree with everything you said > except, the GBI traveler that I bought from Stan is not operable quickly > enough to make it an effective and valuable tool to depower when the boat > is overpowered. > Maybe I don?t know how to use it correctly. I like it for what it is but > it has limitations. > Ric > Sent from my iPhone > > > On Mar 25, 2021, at 12:35 PM, ROGER PIHLAJA > wrote: > > > > ?Richard, > > > > The way the traveler is used to bring the boom to the boat?s centerline > is the traveler car is positioned to windward and then the mainsheet is > tensioned. On the Rhodes 22, this means there is up to 5 feet of traveler > bar for the car to move to leeward if necessary. Moving the end of the > boom 5 feet to leeward is a huge amount of depowering on the mainsail. In > fact, on S/V Dynamic Equilibrium, if dumping the traveler is not enough to > keep the boat on its feet in a gust, we use that as an indication of when > its time to reef the mainsail. Note, if dumping the traveler is not > sufficient, you can always uncleat the mainsheet and let it run. But, we > regard this as the equivalent of having the pressure safety valve pop open > on a pressure vessel. It?s undesirable and ugly when it happens. The GBI > 29 Traveler car is positively moved from one position to another by pushing > or pulling on the control line. You never uncleat the control line and let > the traveler car just slide on its own. There are several advantages: > > > > > > 1. Because the GBI 29 Traveler control lines are one continuous loop, > there is no chance of a line getting snarled or fouled like there is when > using the mainsheet to depower the mainsail. > > 2. You never have to assist the boom to move because of snarls or > friction in the mainsheet blocks. Manipulate the GBI 29 Traveler control > lines and the end of the boom moves right now, every time, no more and no > less than you ask for. > > 3. The end of the boom does not rise up as much as when the mainsheet > is used to depower the mainsail. This means there is not as much twist > introduced into the top half of the mainsail and the mainsail does not > interfere with the genoa as much. > > 4. After the gust has passed, the GBI 29 Traveler can move the end of > the boom back to the centerline of the boat much more quickly vs the > mainsheet (~3X less line to be manipulated). Again there is no chance of a > tangle or snarl and the end of the boom is already down where it belongs so > the top of the mainsail is not twisted off. > > > > So, for all the above reasons, I strongly disagree with you, Richard. > Look in any book or video tutorial on sailing fast to windward and you will > find they agree with me. Although the details of mainsheet travelers > varies from boat to boat, the proper usage of them does not change. The > GBI 29 Traveler is a unique design that I had not encountered in a lifetime > of sailing. I guess that?s why Stan got a patent on it! Once you get used > to it, it?s a marvelous piece of equipment. > > > > Before you criticize again, I would ask you to try sailing with one hand > on the tiller extension and the other on the traveler control line. You > will quickly come to appreciate the degree of fine control this gives you. > It?s the sailing equivalent of the ?stick and throttle? feel that fighter > pilots like so much. If this doesn?t change your mind; then, I guess > nothing will. > > > > Roger Pihlaja > > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > > > Sent from Mail for > Windows 10 > > > > From: Richard Stott > > Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2021 9:42 AM > > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications > > > > When sailing to whether, the traveler is used to bring the boom to the > boat?s centerline. > > This improves sail shape, the relationship of the Jib/Main and ability > to point higher. > > It is not the tool on a Rhodes to depower the Rig in a gust - use the > main sheet for that. > > Ric > > Dadventure > > > > Richard Stott, AIA, LEED AP > > www.stottarchitecture.com http://www.stottarchitecture.com%3chttp:/www.stottarchitecture.com>> > > Office 631-283-1777 > > Cell 516-965-3164 > > > > > > > > > > > >> On Mar 24, 2021, at 5:02 PM, Rick Lange > wrote: > >> > >> Roger, > >> > >> That piece of gear is for setting your sails to the prevailing wind. > It is > >> too cumbersome and limited for responding to gusts. > >> > >> Regards, > >> > >> Rick Lange > >> > >> > >>> On Wed, Mar 24, 2021 at 4:51 PM ROGER PIHLAJA > wrote: > >>> > >>> Rick, > >>> > >>> One more question, beginner sailboats do not come equipped with > mainsail > >>> travelers; but, more advanced sailboats nearly all have travelers. If > you > >>> don?t sail your Rhodes 22 to windward while playing the traveler, what > do > >>> you think that piece of gear is for? > >>> > >>> Roger Pihlaja > >>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > >>> > >>> Sent from my iPhone > >>> > >>>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 4:34 PM, ROGER PIHLAJA > >>> wrote: > >>>> > >>>> ?Rick, > >>>> > >>>> If you have so much mainsail area up that dumping the traveler is not > >>> sufficient to keep the boat upright in a gust; then, you need to reef > down > >>> the mainsail. The more efficient reefed mainsail shape will more than > >>> compensate for the greater unreeled mainsail area that spends a lot of > time > >>> all twisted and luffing. Besides, it makes you look like a real > amateur > >>> and it?s hard on the sail. > >>>> > >>>> Roger Pihlaja > >>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > >>>> > >>>> Sent from my iPhone > >>>> > >>>>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 4:25 PM, ROGER PIHLAJA > >>> wrote: > >>>>> > >>>>> ?Rick, > >>>>> > >>>>> I would welcome the chance to match race you. I would be willing to > >>> bet considerable money that your strategy is wrong and I would beat you > >>> decisively. > >>>>> > >>>>> Roger Pihlaja > >>>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > >>>>> > >>>>> Sent from my iPhone > >>>>> > >>>>>>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 4:21 PM, Rick Lange > >>> wrote: > >>>>>> > >>>>>> ?Roger, > >>>>>> > >>>>>> We're talking about sailing close hauled in a stiff breeze > (15-20knt) > >>> with > >>>>>> sudden gusts that will round up the boat. The only mainsail shape > that > >>>>>> matters during a gust is the shape that quickly dumps enough wind to > >>> keep > >>>>>> the boat on course without luffing the jib and, in the case of the > R22, > >>>>>> sailing flat. > >>>>>> > >>>>>> Easing the main sheet is the quickest way to react while affording > the > >>>>>> tactile control needed to ease and recover appropriately as the > gust > >>>>>> varies. In addition to being quicker than a traveller can move, > >>>>>> sheet control is not as restrictive as a traveller in allowing > greater > >>> boom > >>>>>> motion for dumping enough wind when there is a really strong gust. > >>>>>> > >>>>>> For small sloops up to 32', sailing close hauled by feeling sheet > >>> tension > >>>>>> is the fastest way to go. I have sailed with totally blind crews > and > >>> they > >>>>>> sail closer to the wind than many sighted sailors distracted by > >>> watching > >>>>>> sail shape. > >>>>>> > >>>>>> Regards, > >>>>>> > >>>>>> Rick Lange > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>>>> On Wed, Mar 24, 2021 at 1:48 PM ROGER PIHLAJA < > roger_pihlaja at msn.com> > >>> wrote: > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Rick, > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> My 1976 Rhodes Continental 22 came with a cable style traveler. > This > >>> was > >>>>>>> not a very good setup and I soon upgraded to the GBI bar-style > >>> traveler > >>>>>>> that is mounted on the backstay. This traveler was much better > and I > >>> used > >>>>>>> it for many years. However, because the mainsail trimmer needed to > >>> be in > >>>>>>> line with the clam cleats on each end of the traveler bar in order > to > >>> cleat > >>>>>>> off the control line, it was very difficult for the helmsman to > also > >>> play > >>>>>>> the traveler. This was especially an issue when the helmsman was > >>> sitting > >>>>>>> up on the windward gunnel (i.e. hiking out) and the traveler needed > >>> to be > >>>>>>> trimmed to leeward. GBI?s 2nd > >>>>>>> (3rd?) generation traveler pretty much solves all these issues. > >>> Properly > >>>>>>> adjusted, the latest generation traveler has a built-in slip > >>> characteristic > >>>>>>> that will save you in an accidental gibe or a knockdown gust. The > >>>>>>> traveler control line is a continuous loop, which enables the > >>> helmsman to > >>>>>>> play the traveler to windward or leeward without leaving his hiking > >>> station > >>>>>>> up on the windward gunnel. The helmsman drives with one hand on > the > >>> tiller > >>>>>>> extension, the other on the traveler control line, and multitasks. > >>> The > >>>>>>> helmsman can feel the weather/lee helm pressure thru the tiller and > >>> is in > >>>>>>> the best position to adjust the traveler to optimize the weather > >>> helm/lee > >>>>>>> helm balance. I?ve been sailing with the new generation traveler > for > >>> 3 > >>>>>>> seasons now. If you care about boat speed and sail short handed, > this > >>>>>>> upgrade is well worth the price! On a close hauled course in 10-15 > >>> knot of > >>>>>>> wind, If you get into a drag race with another Rhodes 22 that is > >>> properly > >>>>>>> using its latest generation traveler vs you using your mainsheet, > >>> you will > >>>>>>> fall behind by ~30-40 sec/nm. In a PHRF race, that?s huge! Other > >>> than > >>>>>>> buying new sails, there is probably no other upgrade that offers > this > >>> much > >>>>>>> performance per dollar spent. > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Roger Pihlaja > >>>>>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Sent from Mail for > >>>>>>> Windows 10 > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> From: ROGER PIHLAJA > >>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2021 12:12 PM > >>>>>>> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > >>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler > >>> Modifications > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Rick, > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> When you ease the traveler, the end of the boom does not rise as it > >>> does > >>>>>>> when you ease the mainsheet. Thus the mainsail shape is affected > >>> much less > >>>>>>> when you ease the traveler vs the mainsheet. When you trim the > >>> traveler > >>>>>>> back to where it was, the flow reattaches itself much quicker. > >>> Overall, > >>>>>>> boat speed stays higher. That?s why you play the traveler much > more > >>> than > >>>>>>> the mainsheet. > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Roger Pihlaja > >>>>>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > >>>>>>> Sent from my iPhone > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 11:25 AM, Rick Lange < > sloopblueheron at gmail.com > >>>> Trim > >>>>>>> the trawrote: > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> ?Jeff, > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> Why the traveller? The sheet is so much faster and gives greater > >>> range > >>>>>>> of > >>>>>>>> boom movement. > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> Rick Lange > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> On Wed, Mar 24, 2021, 9:13 AM JeffSmith < > jeffsmithphoto at gmail.com> > >>>>>>> wrote: > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> When sailing to weather I like to play the traveler (as opposed > to > >>> the > >>>>>>> main > >>>>>>>>> sheet) in the puffs while sitting on the high side cockpit > combing > >>> with > >>>>>>> the > >>>>>>>>> hiking stick. > >>>>>>>>> A continuous 5mm line with the core removed where it travels > >>> through the > >>>>>>>>> blocks on the New Traveler and possibly changing the purchase > from > >>> 5 to > >>>>>>> 1 > >>>>>>>>> to > >>>>>>>>> 3 to 1 is part of my plan. Before holes are drilled in the > cockpit > >>>>>>> sides to > >>>>>>>>> accomodate turning blocks to lead the continuous line forward > >>> around the > >>>>>>>>> perimeter of the cockpit, I would welcome input. > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> ----- > >>>>>>>>> Jeff Smith > >>>>>>>>> 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT > >>>>>>>>> Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor > >>>>>>>>> Atlantic Highlands, NJ > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> -- > >>>>>>>>> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>> > > > > From lvjkuhn at gmail.com Thu Mar 25 14:09:05 2021 From: lvjkuhn at gmail.com (Lee) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2021 11:09:05 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications In-Reply-To: References: <27107F4C-FC0E-4C4B-A485-D7EF102C8EAE@stottarchitecture.com> <0E4A457F-703F-4C5C-BA80-A34153EC5244@stottarchitecture.com> Message-ID: <1616695745224-0.post@n5.nabble.com> I'm certainly learning a lot about travelers from you guys. So much in fact that I learned nothing new from Googling: https://www.quantumsails.com/en/resources-and-expertise/articles/what-do-i-do-with-my-traveler Lee 1999 Rhodes22 soon to be ready Claytor Lake, VA -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From lvjkuhn at gmail.com Thu Mar 25 14:37:45 2021 From: lvjkuhn at gmail.com (Lee) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2021 11:37:45 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] a boisterous sail In-Reply-To: <27B4E965-6478-4D0B-9197-7904BBED5E04@gmail.com> References: <27B4E965-6478-4D0B-9197-7904BBED5E04@gmail.com> Message-ID: <1616697465780-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Impressive! Sir Francis Beaufort may call a 17-knot wind the beginning of a fresh breeze but I struggle to make headway in anything much more. I prefer to sail with the poptop up and to see you guys on a close reach with so little heel makes me think that I may never lower the boom again. Stan once told me that he usually deployed the iron Genny if he wanted to make headway in anything more than a 28-knot wind. He also told me that poor performance is because of the captain and not the boat. So true. Lee 1999 Rhodes22 soon Claytor Lake, VA -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From sloopblueheron at gmail.com Thu Mar 25 14:39:43 2021 From: sloopblueheron at gmail.com (Rick Lange) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2021 14:39:43 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications In-Reply-To: <1616695745224-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <27107F4C-FC0E-4C4B-A485-D7EF102C8EAE@stottarchitecture.com> <0E4A457F-703F-4C5C-BA80-A34153EC5244@stottarchitecture.com> <1616695745224-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: I especially like the second sentence: "A general rule of thumb is to use the mainsheet first for the gross tuning, then fine-tune using the traveler." That reinforces my argument to use the mainsheet for dumping gusts. Still waiting for Roger's videos. Regards, Rick Lange On Thu, Mar 25, 2021 at 2:09 PM Lee wrote: > I'm certainly learning a lot about travelers from you guys. So much in > fact > that I learned nothing new from Googling: > > > https://www.quantumsails.com/en/resources-and-expertise/articles/what-do-i-do-with-my-traveler > > Lee > 1999 Rhodes22 soon to be ready > Claytor Lake, VA > > > > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > From roger_pihlaja at msn.com Thu Mar 25 14:44:45 2021 From: roger_pihlaja at msn.com (ROGER PIHLAJA) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2021 18:44:45 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications In-Reply-To: References: <0E4A457F-703F-4C5C-BA80-A34153EC5244@stottarchitecture.com> , Message-ID: Stan, I give up! I?ve tried to explain the merits of your GBI 29 Traveler to the best of my ability. But, it?s not working. If you want to jump into this discussion, go ahead. But, I?m done. Roger Pihlaja S/V Dynamic Equilibrium Sent from my iPhone > On Mar 25, 2021, at 1:58 PM, Rick Lange wrote: > ?Roger, > > When I sail close hauled in under 10 knots, I point highest when the > traveller is all the way to the leeward end of the bar. Only in stronger > winds do I move the traveller no tighter than midships. So even the most > responsive traveller doesn't have the room to dump much wind. > > The only use I can think of for a really responsive traveller is in a > frequent tacking situation. > > Regards, > > Rick Lange > > >> On Thu, Mar 25, 2021 at 1:01 PM ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: >> >> Ric, >> >> I don?t understand why you think the GBI 29 Traveler is too slow to be >> useful for depowering the rig? There is nothing to uncleat or cleat, you >> just push or pull on the control line and the traveler car moves. It?s at >> least as fast as the mainsheet. Again, I sail with one hand on the control >> line and the other on the tiller extension. So, I don?t even need to reach >> for the control line. The traveler car movement is fast, positive, and >> controlled. >> >> Roger Pihlaja >> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >> >> Sent from Mail for >> Windows 10 >> >> From: Ric Stott >> Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2021 12:42 PM >> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List >> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications >> >> Hi Roger >> I?ve been racing sailboats all my life and agree with everything you said >> except, the GBI traveler that I bought from Stan is not operable quickly >> enough to make it an effective and valuable tool to depower when the boat >> is overpowered. >> Maybe I don?t know how to use it correctly. I like it for what it is but >> it has limitations. >> Ric >> Sent from my iPhone >> >>> On Mar 25, 2021, at 12:35 PM, ROGER PIHLAJA >> wrote: >>> ?Richard, >>> The way the traveler is used to bring the boom to the boat?s centerline >> is the traveler car is positioned to windward and then the mainsheet is >> tensioned. On the Rhodes 22, this means there is up to 5 feet of traveler >> bar for the car to move to leeward if necessary. Moving the end of the >> boom 5 feet to leeward is a huge amount of depowering on the mainsail. In >> fact, on S/V Dynamic Equilibrium, if dumping the traveler is not enough to >> keep the boat on its feet in a gust, we use that as an indication of when >> its time to reef the mainsail. Note, if dumping the traveler is not >> sufficient, you can always uncleat the mainsheet and let it run. But, we >> regard this as the equivalent of having the pressure safety valve pop open >> on a pressure vessel. It?s undesirable and ugly when it happens. The GBI >> 29 Traveler car is positively moved from one position to another by pushing >> or pulling on the control line. You never uncleat the control line and let >> the traveler car just slide on its own. There are several advantages: >>> 1. Because the GBI 29 Traveler control lines are one continuous loop, >> there is no chance of a line getting snarled or fouled like there is when >> using the mainsheet to depower the mainsail. >>> 2. You never have to assist the boom to move because of snarls or >> friction in the mainsheet blocks. Manipulate the GBI 29 Traveler control >> lines and the end of the boom moves right now, every time, no more and no >> less than you ask for. >>> 3. The end of the boom does not rise up as much as when the mainsheet >> is used to depower the mainsail. This means there is not as much twist >> introduced into the top half of the mainsail and the mainsail does not >> interfere with the genoa as much. >>> 4. After the gust has passed, the GBI 29 Traveler can move the end of >> the boom back to the centerline of the boat much more quickly vs the >> mainsheet (~3X less line to be manipulated). Again there is no chance of a >> tangle or snarl and the end of the boom is already down where it belongs so >> the top of the mainsail is not twisted off. >>> So, for all the above reasons, I strongly disagree with you, Richard. >> Look in any book or video tutorial on sailing fast to windward and you will >> find they agree with me. Although the details of mainsheet travelers >> varies from boat to boat, the proper usage of them does not change. The >> GBI 29 Traveler is a unique design that I had not encountered in a lifetime >> of sailing. I guess that?s why Stan got a patent on it! Once you get used >> to it, it?s a marvelous piece of equipment. >>> Before you criticize again, I would ask you to try sailing with one hand >> on the tiller extension and the other on the traveler control line. You >> will quickly come to appreciate the degree of fine control this gives you. >> It?s the sailing equivalent of the ?stick and throttle? feel that fighter >> pilots like so much. If this doesn?t change your mind; then, I guess >> nothing will. >>> Roger Pihlaja >>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>> Sent from Mail for >> Windows 10 >>> From: Richard Stott >>> Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2021 9:42 AM >>> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List >>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications >>> When sailing to whether, the traveler is used to bring the boom to the >> boat?s centerline. >>> This improves sail shape, the relationship of the Jib/Main and ability >> to point higher. >>> It is not the tool on a Rhodes to depower the Rig in a gust - use the >> main sheet for that. >>> Ric >>> Dadventure >>> Richard Stott, AIA, LEED AP >>> www.stottarchitecture.com> http://www.stottarchitecture.com%3chttp:/www.stottarchitecture.com>> >>> Office 631-283-1777 >>> Cell 516-965-3164 >>>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 5:02 PM, Rick Lange >> wrote: >>>> Roger, >>>> That piece of gear is for setting your sails to the prevailing wind. >> It is >>>> too cumbersome and limited for responding to gusts. >>>> Regards, >>>> Rick Lange >>>>> On Wed, Mar 24, 2021 at 4:51 PM ROGER PIHLAJA >> wrote: >>>>> Rick, >>>>> One more question, beginner sailboats do not come equipped with >> mainsail >>>>> travelers; but, more advanced sailboats nearly all have travelers. If >> you >>>>> don?t sail your Rhodes 22 to windward while playing the traveler, what >> do >>>>> you think that piece of gear is for? >>>>> Roger Pihlaja >>>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 4:34 PM, ROGER PIHLAJA >>>>> wrote: >>>>>> ?Rick, >>>>>> If you have so much mainsail area up that dumping the traveler is not >>>>> sufficient to keep the boat upright in a gust; then, you need to reef >> down >>>>> the mainsail. The more efficient reefed mainsail shape will more than >>>>> compensate for the greater unreeled mainsail area that spends a lot of >> time >>>>> all twisted and luffing. Besides, it makes you look like a real >> amateur >>>>> and it?s hard on the sail. >>>>>> Roger Pihlaja >>>>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>>>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 4:25 PM, ROGER PIHLAJA >>>>> wrote: >>>>>>> ?Rick, >>>>>>> I would welcome the chance to match race you. I would be willing to >>>>> bet considerable money that your strategy is wrong and I would beat you >>>>> decisively. >>>>>>> Roger Pihlaja >>>>>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>>>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>>>>>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 4:21 PM, Rick Lange >>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>> ?Roger, >>>>>>>> We're talking about sailing close hauled in a stiff breeze >> (15-20knt) >>>>> with >>>>>>>> sudden gusts that will round up the boat. The only mainsail shape >> that >>>>>>>> matters during a gust is the shape that quickly dumps enough wind to >>>>> keep >>>>>>>> the boat on course without luffing the jib and, in the case of the >> R22, >>>>>>>> sailing flat. >>>>>>>> Easing the main sheet is the quickest way to react while affording >> the >>>>>>>> tactile control needed to ease and recover appropriately as the >> gust >>>>>>>> varies. In addition to being quicker than a traveller can move, >>>>>>>> sheet control is not as restrictive as a traveller in allowing >> greater >>>>> boom >>>>>>>> motion for dumping enough wind when there is a really strong gust. >>>>>>>> For small sloops up to 32', sailing close hauled by feeling sheet >>>>> tension >>>>>>>> is the fastest way to go. I have sailed with totally blind crews >> and >>>>> they >>>>>>>> sail closer to the wind than many sighted sailors distracted by >>>>> watching >>>>>>>> sail shape. >>>>>>>> Regards, >>>>>>>> Rick Lange >>>>>>>>>> On Wed, Mar 24, 2021 at 1:48 PM ROGER PIHLAJA < >> roger_pihlaja at msn.com> >>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>> Rick, >>>>>>>>> My 1976 Rhodes Continental 22 came with a cable style traveler. >> This >>>>> was >>>>>>>>> not a very good setup and I soon upgraded to the GBI bar-style >>>>> traveler >>>>>>>>> that is mounted on the backstay. This traveler was much better >> and I >>>>> used >>>>>>>>> it for many years. However, because the mainsail trimmer needed to >>>>> be in >>>>>>>>> line with the clam cleats on each end of the traveler bar in order >> to >>>>> cleat >>>>>>>>> off the control line, it was very difficult for the helmsman to >> also >>>>> play >>>>>>>>> the traveler. This was especially an issue when the helmsman was >>>>> sitting >>>>>>>>> up on the windward gunnel (i.e. hiking out) and the traveler needed >>>>> to be >>>>>>>>> trimmed to leeward. GBI?s 2nd >>>>>>>>> (3rd?) generation traveler pretty much solves all these issues. >>>>> Properly >>>>>>>>> adjusted, the latest generation traveler has a built-in slip >>>>> characteristic >>>>>>>>> that will save you in an accidental gibe or a knockdown gust. The >>>>>>>>> traveler control line is a continuous loop, which enables the >>>>> helmsman to >>>>>>>>> play the traveler to windward or leeward without leaving his hiking >>>>> station >>>>>>>>> up on the windward gunnel. The helmsman drives with one hand on >> the >>>>> tiller >>>>>>>>> extension, the other on the traveler control line, and multitasks. >>>>> The >>>>>>>>> helmsman can feel the weather/lee helm pressure thru the tiller and >>>>> is in >>>>>>>>> the best position to adjust the traveler to optimize the weather >>>>> helm/lee >>>>>>>>> helm balance. I?ve been sailing with the new generation traveler >> for >>>>> 3 >>>>>>>>> seasons now. If you care about boat speed and sail short handed, >> this >>>>>>>>> upgrade is well worth the price! On a close hauled course in 10-15 >>>>> knot of >>>>>>>>> wind, If you get into a drag race with another Rhodes 22 that is >>>>> properly >>>>>>>>> using its latest generation traveler vs you using your mainsheet, >>>>> you will >>>>>>>>> fall behind by ~30-40 sec/nm. In a PHRF race, that?s huge! Other >>>>> than >>>>>>>>> buying new sails, there is probably no other upgrade that offers >> this >>>>> much >>>>>>>>> performance per dollar spent. >>>>>>>>> Roger Pihlaja >>>>>>>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>>>>>>>> Sent from Mail for >>>>>>>>> Windows 10 >>>>>>>>> From: ROGER PIHLAJA >>>>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2021 12:12 PM >>>>>>>>> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List >>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler >>>>> Modifications >>>>>>>>> Rick, >>>>>>>>> When you ease the traveler, the end of the boom does not rise as it >>>>> does >>>>>>>>> when you ease the mainsheet. Thus the mainsail shape is affected >>>>> much less >>>>>>>>> when you ease the traveler vs the mainsheet. When you trim the >>>>> traveler >>>>>>>>> back to where it was, the flow reattaches itself much quicker. >>>>> Overall, >>>>>>>>> boat speed stays higher. That?s why you play the traveler much >> more >>>>> than >>>>>>>>> the mainsheet. >>>>>>>>> Roger Pihlaja >>>>>>>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>>>>>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>>>>>>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 11:25 AM, Rick Lange < >> sloopblueheron at gmail.com >>>>>> Trim >>>>>>>>> the trawrote: >>>>>>>>>> ?Jeff, >>>>>>>>>> Why the traveller? The sheet is so much faster and gives greater >>>>> range >>>>>>>>> of >>>>>>>>>> boom movement. >>>>>>>>>> Rick Lange >>>>>>>>>>> On Wed, Mar 24, 2021, 9:13 AM JeffSmith < >> jeffsmithphoto at gmail.com> >>>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> When sailing to weather I like to play the traveler (as opposed >> to >>>>> the >>>>>>>>> main >>>>>>>>>>> sheet) in the puffs while sitting on the high side cockpit >> combing >>>>> with >>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>>> hiking stick. >>>>>>>>>>> A continuous 5mm line with the core removed where it travels >>>>> through the >>>>>>>>>>> blocks on the New Traveler and possibly changing the purchase >> from >>>>> 5 to >>>>>>>>> 1 >>>>>>>>>>> to >>>>>>>>>>> 3 to 1 is part of my plan. Before holes are drilled in the >> cockpit >>>>>>>>> sides to >>>>>>>>>>> accomodate turning blocks to lead the continuous line forward >>>>> around the >>>>>>>>>>> perimeter of the cockpit, I would welcome input. >>>>>>>>>>> ----- >>>>>>>>>>> Jeff Smith >>>>>>>>>>> 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT >>>>>>>>>>> Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor >>>>>>>>>>> Atlantic Highlands, NJ >>>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>>> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From roger_pihlaja at msn.com Thu Mar 25 14:44:52 2021 From: roger_pihlaja at msn.com (ROGER PIHLAJA) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2021 18:44:52 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications Message-ID: Rick, We were having a discussion of mainsail trim and traveler use in heavy air wherein the rig needs to be depowered in gusts and then quickly brought back on line after the gust has passed. Mainsail shape for <= 10 knots is considered light air and is a different subject. As you noted, the optimum light air mainsail shape is achieved with a different traveler car position and mainsheet tension vs heavy air. In light air, it is also much less likely the rig will need to be depowered as per the original discussion. It is beyond the scope of my job description to give tutorials on sail trim in all possible conditions. I suggest you take a class or go racing. Stan, I give up! I?ve tried to explain the merits of your GBI 29 Traveler to the best of my ability. But, it?s not working. If you want to jump into this discussion, go ahead. But, I?m done. Roger Pihlaja S/V Dynamic Equilibrium Sent from my iPhone > On Mar 25, 2021, at 1:58 PM, Rick Lange wrote: > ?Roger, > > When I sail close hauled in under 10 knots, I point highest when the > traveller is all the way to the leeward end of the bar. Only in stronger > winds do I move the traveller no tighter than midships. So even the most > responsive traveller doesn't have the room to dump much wind. > > The only use I can think of for a really responsive traveller is in a > frequent tacking situation. > > Regards, > > Rick Lange > > >> On Thu, Mar 25, 2021 at 1:01 PM ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: >> Ric, >> I don?t understand why you think the GBI 29 Traveler is too slow to be >> useful for depowering the rig? There is nothing to uncleat or cleat, you >> just push or pull on the control line and the traveler car moves. It?s at >> least as fast as the mainsheet. Again, I sail with one hand on the control >> line and the other on the tiller extension. So, I don?t even need to reach >> for the control line. The traveler car movement is fast, positive, and >> controlled. >> Roger Pihlaja >> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >> Sent from Mail for >> Windows 10 >> From: Ric Stott >> Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2021 12:42 PM >> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List >> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications >> Hi Roger >> I?ve been racing sailboats all my life and agree with everything you said >> except, the GBI traveler that I bought from Stan is not operable quickly >> enough to make it an effective and valuable tool to depower when the boat >> is overpowered. >> Maybe I don?t know how to use it correctly. I like it for what it is but >> it has limitations. >> Ric >> Sent from my iPhone >>> On Mar 25, 2021, at 12:35 PM, ROGER PIHLAJA >> wrote: >>> ?Richard, >>> The way the traveler is used to bring the boom to the boat?s centerline >> is the traveler car is positioned to windward and then the mainsheet is >> tensioned. On the Rhodes 22, this means there is up to 5 feet of traveler >> bar for the car to move to leeward if necessary. Moving the end of the >> boom 5 feet to leeward is a huge amount of depowering on the mainsail. In >> fact, on S/V Dynamic Equilibrium, if dumping the traveler is not enough to >> keep the boat on its feet in a gust, we use that as an indication of when >> its time to reef the mainsail. Note, if dumping the traveler is not >> sufficient, you can always uncleat the mainsheet and let it run. But, we >> regard this as the equivalent of having the pressure safety valve pop open >> on a pressure vessel. It?s undesirable and ugly when it happens. The GBI >> 29 Traveler car is positively moved from one position to another by pushing >> or pulling on the control line. You never uncleat the control line and let >> the traveler car just slide on its own. There are several advantages: >>> 1. Because the GBI 29 Traveler control lines are one continuous loop, >> there is no chance of a line getting snarled or fouled like there is when >> using the mainsheet to depower the mainsail. >>> 2. You never have to assist the boom to move because of snarls or >> friction in the mainsheet blocks. Manipulate the GBI 29 Traveler control >> lines and the end of the boom moves right now, every time, no more and no >> less than you ask for. >>> 3. The end of the boom does not rise up as much as when the mainsheet >> is used to depower the mainsail. This means there is not as much twist >> introduced into the top half of the mainsail and the mainsail does not >> interfere with the genoa as much. >>> 4. After the gust has passed, the GBI 29 Traveler can move the end of >> the boom back to the centerline of the boat much more quickly vs the >> mainsheet (~3X less line to be manipulated). Again there is no chance of a >> tangle or snarl and the end of the boom is already down where it belongs so >> the top of the mainsail is not twisted off. >>> So, for all the above reasons, I strongly disagree with you, Richard. >> Look in any book or video tutorial on sailing fast to windward and you will >> find they agree with me. Although the details of mainsheet travelers >> varies from boat to boat, the proper usage of them does not change. The >> GBI 29 Traveler is a unique design that I had not encountered in a lifetime >> of sailing. I guess that?s why Stan got a patent on it! Once you get used >> to it, it?s a marvelous piece of equipment. >>> Before you criticize again, I would ask you to try sailing with one hand >> on the tiller extension and the other on the traveler control line. You >> will quickly come to appreciate the degree of fine control this gives you. >> It?s the sailing equivalent of the ?stick and throttle? feel that fighter >> pilots like so much. If this doesn?t change your mind; then, I guess >> nothing will. >>> Roger Pihlaja >>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>> Sent from Mail for >> Windows 10 >>> From: Richard Stott >>> Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2021 9:42 AM >>> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List >>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications >>> When sailing to whether, the traveler is used to bring the boom to the >> boat?s centerline. >>> This improves sail shape, the relationship of the Jib/Main and ability >> to point higher. >>> It is not the tool on a Rhodes to depower the Rig in a gust - use the >> main sheet for that. >>> Ric >>> Dadventure >>> Richard Stott, AIA, LEED AP >>> www.stottarchitecture.com> http://www.stottarchitecture.com%3chttp:/www.stottarchitecture.com>> >>> Office 631-283-1777 >>> Cell 516-965-3164 >>>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 5:02 PM, Rick Lange >> wrote: >>>> Roger, >>>> That piece of gear is for setting your sails to the prevailing wind. >> It is >>>> too cumbersome and limited for responding to gusts. >>>> Regards, >>>> Rick Lange >>>>> On Wed, Mar 24, 2021 at 4:51 PM ROGER PIHLAJA >> wrote: >>>>> Rick, >>>>> One more question, beginner sailboats do not come equipped with >> mainsail >>>>> travelers; but, more advanced sailboats nearly all have travelers. If >> you >>>>> don?t sail your Rhodes 22 to windward while playing the traveler, what >> do >>>>> you think that piece of gear is for? >>>>> Roger Pihlaja >>>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 4:34 PM, ROGER PIHLAJA >>>>> wrote: >>>>>> ?Rick, >>>>>> If you have so much mainsail area up that dumping the traveler is not >>>>> sufficient to keep the boat upright in a gust; then, you need to reef >> down >>>>> the mainsail. The more efficient reefed mainsail shape will more than >>>>> compensate for the greater unreeled mainsail area that spends a lot of >> time >>>>> all twisted and luffing. Besides, it makes you look like a real >> amateur >>>>> and it?s hard on the sail. >>>>>> Roger Pihlaja >>>>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>>>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 4:25 PM, ROGER PIHLAJA >>>>> wrote: >>>>>>> ?Rick, >>>>>>> I would welcome the chance to match race you. I would be willing to >>>>> bet considerable money that your strategy is wrong and I would beat you >>>>> decisively. >>>>>>> Roger Pihlaja >>>>>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>>>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>>>>>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 4:21 PM, Rick Lange >>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>> ?Roger, >>>>>>>> We're talking about sailing close hauled in a stiff breeze >> (15-20knt) >>>>> with >>>>>>>> sudden gusts that will round up the boat. The only mainsail shape >> that >>>>>>>> matters during a gust is the shape that quickly dumps enough wind to >>>>> keep >>>>>>>> the boat on course without luffing the jib and, in the case of the >> R22, >>>>>>>> sailing flat. >>>>>>>> Easing the main sheet is the quickest way to react while affording >> the >>>>>>>> tactile control needed to ease and recover appropriately as the >> gust >>>>>>>> varies. In addition to being quicker than a traveller can move, >>>>>>>> sheet control is not as restrictive as a traveller in allowing >> greater >>>>> boom >>>>>>>> motion for dumping enough wind when there is a really strong gust. >>>>>>>> For small sloops up to 32', sailing close hauled by feeling sheet >>>>> tension >>>>>>>> is the fastest way to go. I have sailed with totally blind crews >> and >>>>> they >>>>>>>> sail closer to the wind than many sighted sailors distracted by >>>>> watching >>>>>>>> sail shape. >>>>>>>> Regards, >>>>>>>> Rick Lange >>>>>>>>>> On Wed, Mar 24, 2021 at 1:48 PM ROGER PIHLAJA < >> roger_pihlaja at msn.com> >>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>> Rick, >>>>>>>>> My 1976 Rhodes Continental 22 came with a cable style traveler. >> This >>>>> was >>>>>>>>> not a very good setup and I soon upgraded to the GBI bar-style >>>>> traveler >>>>>>>>> that is mounted on the backstay. This traveler was much better >> and I >>>>> used >>>>>>>>> it for many years. However, because the mainsail trimmer needed to >>>>> be in >>>>>>>>> line with the clam cleats on each end of the traveler bar in order >> to >>>>> cleat >>>>>>>>> off the control line, it was very difficult for the helmsman to >> also >>>>> play >>>>>>>>> the traveler. This was especially an issue when the helmsman was >>>>> sitting >>>>>>>>> up on the windward gunnel (i.e. hiking out) and the traveler needed >>>>> to be >>>>>>>>> trimmed to leeward. GBI?s 2nd >>>>>>>>> (3rd?) generation traveler pretty much solves all these issues. >>>>> Properly >>>>>>>>> adjusted, the latest generation traveler has a built-in slip >>>>> characteristic >>>>>>>>> that will save you in an accidental gibe or a knockdown gust. The >>>>>>>>> traveler control line is a continuous loop, which enables the >>>>> helmsman to >>>>>>>>> play the traveler to windward or leeward without leaving his hiking >>>>> station >>>>>>>>> up on the windward gunnel. The helmsman drives with one hand on >> the >>>>> tiller >>>>>>>>> extension, the other on the traveler control line, and multitasks. >>>>> The >>>>>>>>> helmsman can feel the weather/lee helm pressure thru the tiller and >>>>> is in >>>>>>>>> the best position to adjust the traveler to optimize the weather >>>>> helm/lee >>>>>>>>> helm balance. I?ve been sailing with the new generation traveler >> for >>>>> 3 >>>>>>>>> seasons now. If you care about boat speed and sail short handed, >> this >>>>>>>>> upgrade is well worth the price! On a close hauled course in 10-15 >>>>> knot of >>>>>>>>> wind, If you get into a drag race with another Rhodes 22 that is >>>>> properly >>>>>>>>> using its latest generation traveler vs you using your mainsheet, >>>>> you will >>>>>>>>> fall behind by ~30-40 sec/nm. In a PHRF race, that?s huge! Other >>>>> than >>>>>>>>> buying new sails, there is probably no other upgrade that offers >> this >>>>> much >>>>>>>>> performance per dollar spent. >>>>>>>>> Roger Pihlaja >>>>>>>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>>>>>>>> Sent from Mail for >>>>>>>>> Windows 10 >>>>>>>>> From: ROGER PIHLAJA >>>>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2021 12:12 PM >>>>>>>>> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List >>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler >>>>> Modifications >>>>>>>>> Rick, >>>>>>>>> When you ease the traveler, the end of the boom does not rise as it >>>>> does >>>>>>>>> when you ease the mainsheet. Thus the mainsail shape is affected >>>>> much less >>>>>>>>> when you ease the traveler vs the mainsheet. When you trim the >>>>> traveler >>>>>>>>> back to where it was, the flow reattaches itself much quicker. >>>>> Overall, >>>>>>>>> boat speed stays higher. That?s why you play the traveler much >> more >>>>> than >>>>>>>>> the mainsheet. >>>>>>>>> Roger Pihlaja >>>>>>>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>>>>>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>>>>>>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 11:25 AM, Rick Lange < >> sloopblueheron at gmail.com >>>>>> Trim >>>>>>>>> the trawrote: >>>>>>>>>> ?Jeff, >>>>>>>>>> Why the traveller? The sheet is so much faster and gives greater >>>>> range >>>>>>>>> of >>>>>>>>>> boom movement. >>>>>>>>>> Rick Lange >>>>>>>>>>> On Wed, Mar 24, 2021, 9:13 AM JeffSmith < >> jeffsmithphoto at gmail.com> >>>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> When sailing to weather I like to play the traveler (as opposed >> to >>>>> the >>>>>>>>> main >>>>>>>>>>> sheet) in the puffs while sitting on the high side cockpit >> combing >>>>> with >>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>>> hiking stick. >>>>>>>>>>> A continuous 5mm line with the core removed where it travels >>>>> through the >>>>>>>>>>> blocks on the New Traveler and possibly changing the purchase >> from >>>>> 5 to >>>>>>>>> 1 >>>>>>>>>>> to >>>>>>>>>>> 3 to 1 is part of my plan. Before holes are drilled in the >> cockpit >>>>>>>>> sides to >>>>>>>>>>> accomodate turning blocks to lead the continuous line forward >>>>> around the >>>>>>>>>>> perimeter of the cockpit, I would welcome input. >>>>>>>>>>> ----- >>>>>>>>>>> Jeff Smith >>>>>>>>>>> 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT >>>>>>>>>>> Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor >>>>>>>>>>> Atlantic Highlands, NJ >>>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>>> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From retiredtoby at gmail.com Thu Mar 25 14:44:40 2021 From: retiredtoby at gmail.com (Cary Tolbert) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2021 14:44:40 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] a boisterous sail In-Reply-To: <1616697465780-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <27B4E965-6478-4D0B-9197-7904BBED5E04@gmail.com> <1616697465780-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: Hey Lee, have you named your new ride? Cary S/V Whisper '86 Claytor Lake, VA On Thu, Mar 25, 2021, 2:37 PM Lee wrote: > Impressive! Sir Francis Beaufort may call a 17-knot wind the beginning of > a > fresh breeze but I struggle to make headway in anything much more. I > prefer > to sail with the poptop up and to see you guys on a close reach with so > little heel makes me think that I may never lower the boom again. > > Stan once told me that he usually deployed the iron Genny if he wanted to > make headway in anything more than a 28-knot wind. He also told me that > poor performance is because of the captain and not the boat. So true. > > Lee > 1999 Rhodes22 soon > Claytor Lake, VA > > > > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > From roger_pihlaja at msn.com Thu Mar 25 14:45:09 2021 From: roger_pihlaja at msn.com (ROGER PIHLAJA) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2021 18:45:09 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications Message-ID: Richard, What are you hitting your knuckles on? Roger Pihlaja S/V Dynamic Equilibrium Sent from my iPhone > On Mar 25, 2021, at 1:58 PM, Rick Lange wrote: > > ?Roger, > > When I sail close hauled in under 10 knots, I point highest when the > traveller is all the way to the leeward end of the bar. Only in stronger > winds do I move the traveller no tighter than midships. So even the most > responsive traveller doesn't have the room to dump much wind. > > The only use I can think of for a really responsive traveller is in a > frequent tacking situation. > > Regards, > > Rick Lange > > >> On Thu, Mar 25, 2021 at 1:01 PM ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: >> Ric, >> I don?t understand why you think the GBI 29 Traveler is too slow to be >> useful for depowering the rig? There is nothing to uncleat or cleat, you >> just push or pull on the control line and the traveler car moves. It?s at >> least as fast as the mainsheet. Again, I sail with one hand on the control >> line and the other on the tiller extension. So, I don?t even need to reach >> for the control line. The traveler car movement is fast, positive, and >> controlled. >> Roger Pihlaja >> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >> Sent from Mail for >> Windows 10 >> From: Ric Stott >> Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2021 12:42 PM >> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List >> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications >> Hi Roger >> I?ve been racing sailboats all my life and agree with everything you said >> except, the GBI traveler that I bought from Stan is not operable quickly >> enough to make it an effective and valuable tool to depower when the boat >> is overpowered. >> Maybe I don?t know how to use it correctly. I like it for what it is but >> it has limitations. >> Ric >> Sent from my iPhone >>> On Mar 25, 2021, at 12:35 PM, ROGER PIHLAJA >> wrote: >>> ?Richard, >>> The way the traveler is used to bring the boom to the boat?s centerline >> is the traveler car is positioned to windward and then the mainsheet is >> tensioned. On the Rhodes 22, this means there is up to 5 feet of traveler >> bar for the car to move to leeward if necessary. Moving the end of the >> boom 5 feet to leeward is a huge amount of depowering on the mainsail. In >> fact, on S/V Dynamic Equilibrium, if dumping the traveler is not enough to >> keep the boat on its feet in a gust, we use that as an indication of when >> its time to reef the mainsail. Note, if dumping the traveler is not >> sufficient, you can always uncleat the mainsheet and let it run. But, we >> regard this as the equivalent of having the pressure safety valve pop open >> on a pressure vessel. It?s undesirable and ugly when it happens. The GBI >> 29 Traveler car is positively moved from one position to another by pushing >> or pulling on the control line. You never uncleat the control line and let >> the traveler car just slide on its own. There are several advantages: >>> 1. Because the GBI 29 Traveler control lines are one continuous loop, >> there is no chance of a line getting snarled or fouled like there is when >> using the mainsheet to depower the mainsail. >>> 2. You never have to assist the boom to move because of snarls or >> friction in the mainsheet blocks. Manipulate the GBI 29 Traveler control >> lines and the end of the boom moves right now, every time, no more and no >> less than you ask for. >>> 3. The end of the boom does not rise up as much as when the mainsheet >> is used to depower the mainsail. This means there is not as much twist >> introduced into the top half of the mainsail and the mainsail does not >> interfere with the genoa as much. >>> 4. After the gust has passed, the GBI 29 Traveler can move the end of >> the boom back to the centerline of the boat much more quickly vs the >> mainsheet (~3X less line to be manipulated). Again there is no chance of a >> tangle or snarl and the end of the boom is already down where it belongs so >> the top of the mainsail is not twisted off. >>> So, for all the above reasons, I strongly disagree with you, Richard. >> Look in any book or video tutorial on sailing fast to windward and you will >> find they agree with me. Although the details of mainsheet travelers >> varies from boat to boat, the proper usage of them does not change. The >> GBI 29 Traveler is a unique design that I had not encountered in a lifetime >> of sailing. I guess that?s why Stan got a patent on it! Once you get used >> to it, it?s a marvelous piece of equipment. >>> Before you criticize again, I would ask you to try sailing with one hand >> on the tiller extension and the other on the traveler control line. You >> will quickly come to appreciate the degree of fine control this gives you. >> It?s the sailing equivalent of the ?stick and throttle? feel that fighter >> pilots like so much. If this doesn?t change your mind; then, I guess >> nothing will. >>> Roger Pihlaja >>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>> Sent from Mail for >> Windows 10 >>> From: Richard Stott >>> Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2021 9:42 AM >>> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List >>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications >>> When sailing to whether, the traveler is used to bring the boom to the >> boat?s centerline. >>> This improves sail shape, the relationship of the Jib/Main and ability >> to point higher. >>> It is not the tool on a Rhodes to depower the Rig in a gust - use the >> main sheet for that. >>> Ric >>> Dadventure >>> Richard Stott, AIA, LEED AP >>> www.stottarchitecture.com> http://www.stottarchitecture.com%3chttp:/www.stottarchitecture.com>> >>> Office 631-283-1777 >>> Cell 516-965-3164 >>>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 5:02 PM, Rick Lange >> wrote: >>>> Roger, >>>> That piece of gear is for setting your sails to the prevailing wind. >> It is >>>> too cumbersome and limited for responding to gusts. >>>> Regards, >>>> Rick Lange >>>>> On Wed, Mar 24, 2021 at 4:51 PM ROGER PIHLAJA >> wrote: >>>>> Rick, >>>>> One more question, beginner sailboats do not come equipped with >> mainsail >>>>> travelers; but, more advanced sailboats nearly all have travelers. If >> you >>>>> don?t sail your Rhodes 22 to windward while playing the traveler, what >> do >>>>> you think that piece of gear is for? >>>>> Roger Pihlaja >>>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 4:34 PM, ROGER PIHLAJA >>>>> wrote: >>>>>> ?Rick, >>>>>> If you have so much mainsail area up that dumping the traveler is not >>>>> sufficient to keep the boat upright in a gust; then, you need to reef >> down >>>>> the mainsail. The more efficient reefed mainsail shape will more than >>>>> compensate for the greater unreeled mainsail area that spends a lot of >> time >>>>> all twisted and luffing. Besides, it makes you look like a real >> amateur >>>>> and it?s hard on the sail. >>>>>> Roger Pihlaja >>>>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>>>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 4:25 PM, ROGER PIHLAJA >>>>> wrote: >>>>>>> ?Rick, >>>>>>> I would welcome the chance to match race you. I would be willing to >>>>> bet considerable money that your strategy is wrong and I would beat you >>>>> decisively. >>>>>>> Roger Pihlaja >>>>>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>>>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>>>>>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 4:21 PM, Rick Lange >>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>> ?Roger, >>>>>>>> We're talking about sailing close hauled in a stiff breeze >> (15-20knt) >>>>> with >>>>>>>> sudden gusts that will round up the boat. The only mainsail shape >> that >>>>>>>> matters during a gust is the shape that quickly dumps enough wind to >>>>> keep >>>>>>>> the boat on course without luffing the jib and, in the case of the >> R22, >>>>>>>> sailing flat. >>>>>>>> Easing the main sheet is the quickest way to react while affording >> the >>>>>>>> tactile control needed to ease and recover appropriately as the >> gust >>>>>>>> varies. In addition to being quicker than a traveller can move, >>>>>>>> sheet control is not as restrictive as a traveller in allowing >> greater >>>>> boom >>>>>>>> motion for dumping enough wind when there is a really strong gust. >>>>>>>> For small sloops up to 32', sailing close hauled by feeling sheet >>>>> tension >>>>>>>> is the fastest way to go. I have sailed with totally blind crews >> and >>>>> they >>>>>>>> sail closer to the wind than many sighted sailors distracted by >>>>> watching >>>>>>>> sail shape. >>>>>>>> Regards, >>>>>>>> Rick Lange >>>>>>>>>> On Wed, Mar 24, 2021 at 1:48 PM ROGER PIHLAJA < >> roger_pihlaja at msn.com> >>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>> Rick, >>>>>>>>> My 1976 Rhodes Continental 22 came with a cable style traveler. >> This >>>>> was >>>>>>>>> not a very good setup and I soon upgraded to the GBI bar-style >>>>> traveler >>>>>>>>> that is mounted on the backstay. This traveler was much better >> and I >>>>> used >>>>>>>>> it for many years. However, because the mainsail trimmer needed to >>>>> be in >>>>>>>>> line with the clam cleats on each end of the traveler bar in order >> to >>>>> cleat >>>>>>>>> off the control line, it was very difficult for the helmsman to >> also >>>>> play >>>>>>>>> the traveler. This was especially an issue when the helmsman was >>>>> sitting >>>>>>>>> up on the windward gunnel (i.e. hiking out) and the traveler needed >>>>> to be >>>>>>>>> trimmed to leeward. GBI?s 2nd >>>>>>>>> (3rd?) generation traveler pretty much solves all these issues. >>>>> Properly >>>>>>>>> adjusted, the latest generation traveler has a built-in slip >>>>> characteristic >>>>>>>>> that will save you in an accidental gibe or a knockdown gust. The >>>>>>>>> traveler control line is a continuous loop, which enables the >>>>> helmsman to >>>>>>>>> play the traveler to windward or leeward without leaving his hiking >>>>> station >>>>>>>>> up on the windward gunnel. The helmsman drives with one hand on >> the >>>>> tiller >>>>>>>>> extension, the other on the traveler control line, and multitasks. >>>>> The >>>>>>>>> helmsman can feel the weather/lee helm pressure thru the tiller and >>>>> is in >>>>>>>>> the best position to adjust the traveler to optimize the weather >>>>> helm/lee >>>>>>>>> helm balance. I?ve been sailing with the new generation traveler >> for >>>>> 3 >>>>>>>>> seasons now. If you care about boat speed and sail short handed, >> this >>>>>>>>> upgrade is well worth the price! On a close hauled course in 10-15 >>>>> knot of >>>>>>>>> wind, If you get into a drag race with another Rhodes 22 that is >>>>> properly >>>>>>>>> using its latest generation traveler vs you using your mainsheet, >>>>> you will >>>>>>>>> fall behind by ~30-40 sec/nm. In a PHRF race, that?s huge! Other >>>>> than >>>>>>>>> buying new sails, there is probably no other upgrade that offers >> this >>>>> much >>>>>>>>> performance per dollar spent. >>>>>>>>> Roger Pihlaja >>>>>>>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>>>>>>>> Sent from Mail for >>>>>>>>> Windows 10 >>>>>>>>> From: ROGER PIHLAJA >>>>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2021 12:12 PM >>>>>>>>> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List >>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler >>>>> Modifications >>>>>>>>> Rick, >>>>>>>>> When you ease the traveler, the end of the boom does not rise as it >>>>> does >>>>>>>>> when you ease the mainsheet. Thus the mainsail shape is affected >>>>> much less >>>>>>>>> when you ease the traveler vs the mainsheet. When you trim the >>>>> traveler >>>>>>>>> back to where it was, the flow reattaches itself much quicker. >>>>> Overall, >>>>>>>>> boat speed stays higher. That?s why you play the traveler much >> more >>>>> than >>>>>>>>> the mainsheet. >>>>>>>>> Roger Pihlaja >>>>>>>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>>>>>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>>>>>>> On Mar 24, 2021, at 11:25 AM, Rick Lange < >> sloopblueheron at gmail.com >>>>>> Trim >>>>>>>>> the trawrote: >>>>>>>>>> ?Jeff, >>>>>>>>>> Why the traveller? The sheet is so much faster and gives greater >>>>> range >>>>>>>>> of >>>>>>>>>> boom movement. >>>>>>>>>> Rick Lange >>>>>>>>>>> On Wed, Mar 24, 2021, 9:13 AM JeffSmith < >> jeffsmithphoto at gmail.com> >>>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> When sailing to weather I like to play the traveler (as opposed >> to >>>>> the >>>>>>>>> main >>>>>>>>>>> sheet) in the puffs while sitting on the high side cockpit >> combing >>>>> with >>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>>> hiking stick. >>>>>>>>>>> A continuous 5mm line with the core removed where it travels >>>>> through the >>>>>>>>>>> blocks on the New Traveler and possibly changing the purchase >> from >>>>> 5 to >>>>>>>>> 1 >>>>>>>>>>> to >>>>>>>>>>> 3 to 1 is part of my plan. Before holes are drilled in the >> cockpit >>>>>>>>> sides to >>>>>>>>>>> accomodate turning blocks to lead the continuous line forward >>>>> around the >>>>>>>>>>> perimeter of the cockpit, I would welcome input. >>>>>>>>>>> ----- >>>>>>>>>>> Jeff Smith >>>>>>>>>>> 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT >>>>>>>>>>> Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor >>>>>>>>>>> Atlantic Highlands, NJ >>>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>>> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From lvjkuhn at gmail.com Thu Mar 25 14:56:03 2021 From: lvjkuhn at gmail.com (Lee) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2021 11:56:03 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] a boisterous sail In-Reply-To: References: <27B4E965-6478-4D0B-9197-7904BBED5E04@gmail.com> <1616697465780-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <1616698563492-0.post@n5.nabble.com> I'm retired and my wife is still working so she's telling everyone that she's buying the boat for me and that she will be naming it. Don't know what she plans on naming it but it won't be my choice; AT EASE 2. She can name it Titan Uranus as long as I get my boat. Lee -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From retiredtoby at gmail.com Thu Mar 25 15:06:18 2021 From: retiredtoby at gmail.com (Cary Tolbert) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2021 15:06:18 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] a boisterous sail In-Reply-To: <1616698563492-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <27B4E965-6478-4D0B-9197-7904BBED5E04@gmail.com> <1616697465780-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616698563492-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: Love it. Do you have an estimated time window for launching? On Thu, Mar 25, 2021, 2:56 PM Lee wrote: > I'm retired and my wife is still working so she's telling everyone that > she's > buying the boat for me and that she will be naming it. Don't know what she > plans on naming it but it won't be my choice; AT EASE 2. > > She can name it Titan Uranus as long as I get my boat. > > Lee > > > > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > From ric at stottarchitecture.com Thu Mar 25 15:30:24 2021 From: ric at stottarchitecture.com (Richard Stott) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2021 15:30:24 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications In-Reply-To: References: <1616591631222-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616623551671-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <6819B3D3-F3E4-4715-B1A2-3CE1F0B9FCD9@stottarchitecture.com> I?m glad I?m not alone my opinion of the GBI Traveler. Was beginning to wonder if I had a problem or the gear did. Actually, the gear doesn?t have a problem. It?s a good design in most respects, it just doesn?t do everything. Racing is fun and I enjoy it on other boats. I think the Rhodes is better left for fun time with the family rather than going up against boats that were actually designed to go fast. IF I had not other options for racing, I might give it a go, but I?d rather be first to cocktails since I don?t drink until after the race. So I race to win on a fast boat. I take my Rhodes clamming, and to the restaurant. How many sailboats can you take to the shallows to go clamming? Ric Dadventure Richard Stott, AIA, LEED AP www.stottarchitecture.com Office 631-283-1777 Cell 516-965-3164 > On Mar 25, 2021, at 1:43 PM, Rick Lange wrote: > > Jeff, > > If you have IMF and the diamond board, you'll be lucky to keep her under 45 > deg off the wind. You'll definitely need able bodied crew in winds 10 knt > or above. > > Regards, > > Rick Lange > > > On Wed, Mar 24, 2021 at 6:05 PM JeffSmith wrote: > >> I have raced my last 2 boats (a Baltic 39 and a J/30) with good results >> over the past 12 years in the AHYC PHRF Fleet-Non Spin. I hope to race my >> R22 this year, but feel I have a lot to learn and modify before I can be >> competitive against a fleet of bigger boats. I will certainly have the >> highest PHRF rating by far. >> The one race I ran last year (which was when I first sailed the R22) was a >> disaster upwind. >> So my goal is to improve performance within a budget... >> Steering from the forward end of the cockpit (keep the weight out of the >> ends!) has led me to the above traveler mods, with the control lines led >> forward to my steering station. >> I'm pretty sure I have the newest traveler, but find it is totality under >> responsive to racing needs. The friction from 3/16 th" 5 purchase >> continuous line in the small blocks does not even need a cleat to keep it >> from moving! >> Tomorrow I plan to raise my mast on the boat in the driveway and fiddle >> around with the traveler. >> Roger obviously Races and I hope to pick his brains, if he will allow. But >> how about others? I know that the R22 is considered a cruising boat, but >> Racing is tons of fun and a great way to spend additional time on the water >> with other great sailors. >> >> >> >> ----- >> Jeff Smith >> 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT >> Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor >> Atlantic Highlands, NJ >> >> -- >> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ >> From lvjkuhn at gmail.com Thu Mar 25 15:32:49 2021 From: lvjkuhn at gmail.com (Lee) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2021 12:32:49 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] a boisterous sail In-Reply-To: References: <27B4E965-6478-4D0B-9197-7904BBED5E04@gmail.com> <1616697465780-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616698563492-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <1616700769474-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Cary, No date yet but when the time comes I may be contacting you and Rob for help. I've never trailered or launched or raised/lowered a mast yet. The trailer hitch should be installed on my wife's SUV next week. I'm assuming a 5,000 lb. towing limit will handle Fancy Gap mountain? West Marine just delivered my compass to Stan and he's not finished with the recycling yet. I'm in no real rush aside from I want to get out sailing. I saw the club boat was just launched so I'll have something to sail while I wait, but it's no Rhodes22. Lee -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From retiredtoby at gmail.com Thu Mar 25 15:55:24 2021 From: retiredtoby at gmail.com (Cary Tolbert) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2021 15:55:24 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] a boisterous sail In-Reply-To: <1616700769474-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <27B4E965-6478-4D0B-9197-7904BBED5E04@gmail.com> <1616697465780-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616698563492-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616700769474-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: Lee, you should be fine on the towing limit. The boat and trailer should be around 3800 lbs. My boat was my first tow. NJ by Staten Is To Radford. At the time the trailer did not have brakes so I stayed at 55 mph. I pulled fine up that long climb from Roanoke to Christiansburg. I can't speak for Rob but I am sure he would not miss helping with your new boat. Heck, we will have a Fleet of Rhodes at Claytor and all on "C" dock. Did you get Stan's mast raising system? With that system it is not difficult at all to raise the mast. Everyone is chomping at their bits to get on the water this season Let us know on the Sail Clator List. Congrats on the new ownership. Cary On Thu, Mar 25, 2021, 3:32 PM Lee wrote: > Cary, > > No date yet but when the time comes I may be contacting you and Rob for > help. I've never trailered or launched or raised/lowered a mast yet. The > trailer hitch should be installed on my wife's SUV next week. I'm assuming > a 5,000 lb. towing limit will handle Fancy Gap mountain? > > West Marine just delivered my compass to Stan and he's not finished with > the > recycling yet. I'm in no real rush aside from I want to get out sailing. > I > saw the club boat was just launched so I'll have something to sail while I > wait, but it's no Rhodes22. > > Lee > > > > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > From mtroy at atlanticbb.net Thu Mar 25 15:57:44 2021 From: mtroy at atlanticbb.net (Mary Lou Troy) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2021 15:57:44 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] a boisterous sail In-Reply-To: <1616700769474-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <27B4E965-6478-4D0B-9197-7904BBED5E04@gmail.com> <1616697465780-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616698563492-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616700769474-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: We towed ours back and forth PA to the Chesapeake for a long time with a Chevy Blazer rated for 5000 lbs. It did fine but when we switched it out for the Nissan Frontier rated at 6300 lbs it was noticeably better, even around town and at the launch ramp - but the Blazer worked. I think you'll be fine at Fancy Gap (we were with a heavier and less aerodynamic travel trailer towed by the Nissan) but plan on taking it slow.? Just make sure the brakes on the trailer work and make sure you've got about 11-13% tongue weight. Good luck! Hope you get it home in time to enjoy the summer sailing. Mary Lou ex R22 now Rosborough RF-246,? Tara Rock Hall, MD On 3/25/2021 3:32 PM, Lee wrote: > Cary, > > No date yet but when the time comes I may be contacting you and Rob for > help. I've never trailered or launched or raised/lowered a mast yet. The > trailer hitch should be installed on my wife's SUV next week. I'm assuming > a 5,000 lb. towing limit will handle Fancy Gap mountain? > > West Marine just delivered my compass to Stan and he's not finished with the > recycling yet. I'm in no real rush aside from I want to get out sailing. I > saw the club boat was just launched so I'll have something to sail while I > wait, but it's no Rhodes22. > > Lee > > > > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ -- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. https://www.avast.com/antivirus From lvjkuhn at gmail.com Thu Mar 25 16:11:28 2021 From: lvjkuhn at gmail.com (Lee) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2021 13:11:28 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] a boisterous sail In-Reply-To: References: <27B4E965-6478-4D0B-9197-7904BBED5E04@gmail.com> <1616697465780-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616698563492-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616700769474-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <1616703088046-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Mary Lou and Cary, Thanks and yes I'm getting the mast raising system. Lee -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From tom.vanheule at intrinsicprograms.com Thu Mar 25 16:23:53 2021 From: tom.vanheule at intrinsicprograms.com (Tom Van Heule) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2021 15:23:53 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] a boisterous sail In-Reply-To: <1616703088046-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <27B4E965-6478-4D0B-9197-7904BBED5E04@gmail.com> <1616697465780-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616698563492-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616700769474-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616703088046-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: My boat must be a fat ass. I won't believe it's 3800 with the fully dipped trailer.... 3.6l grandcheokee doesn't like towing, it can move around ok though. The 2500 duramax acted like nothing was back there. Tounge was over 500lbs.... On Thu, Mar 25, 2021, 3:11 PM Lee wrote: > Mary Lou and Cary, > > Thanks and yes I'm getting the mast raising system. > > Lee > > > > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > From sloopblueheron at gmail.com Thu Mar 25 16:49:18 2021 From: sloopblueheron at gmail.com (Rick Lange) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2021 16:49:18 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Roger, I learned to sail and race by taking a college physical education class over 50 years ago. I've raced dinghies through keel boats, including the R22, and as skipper, have a few blue flags to show for it. I accept your challenge to match race R22's with the IMF and diamond board. I challenge you to produce the videos you said are so common demonstrating using the traveller on small sloops to dump wind during gusts that overpower while close hauled. Regards, Rick Lange On Thu, Mar 25, 2021 at 2:44 PM ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: > Rick, > > We were having a discussion of mainsail trim and traveler use in heavy air > wherein the rig needs to be depowered in gusts and then quickly brought > back on line after the gust has passed. Mainsail shape for <= 10 knots is > considered light air and is a different subject. As you noted, the optimum > light air mainsail shape is achieved with a different traveler car position > and mainsheet tension vs heavy air. In light air, it is also much less > likely the rig will need to be depowered as per the original discussion. > > It is beyond the scope of my job description to give tutorials on sail > trim in all possible conditions. I suggest you take a class or go racing. > > Stan, > > I give up! I?ve tried to explain the merits of your GBI 29 Traveler to > the best of my ability. But, it?s not working. If you want to jump into > this discussion, go ahead. But, I?m done. > > Roger Pihlaja > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > > From chrisgeankoplis at gmail.com Thu Mar 25 19:29:07 2021 From: chrisgeankoplis at gmail.com (Chris Geankoplis) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2021 19:29:07 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Tool Definitions In-Reply-To: References: <002001d72185$227ddd80$67799880$@ebsmed.com> Message-ID: Ha! Good to know I have been using all my tools properly. Chris Geankoplis Enosis On Thu, Mar 25, 2021 at 12:27 PM Mitch Mitchell wrote: > I can relate to every definition! > > Sent from my iPhone > > > On Mar 25, 2021, at 10:42 AM, Michael D. Weisner > wrote: > > > > ?For some of us, repairing, maintaining and rebuilding a project boat is > very > > rewarding and almost as much fun as sailing. > > > > > > > > I said ALMOST. > > > > > > > > For those who are members of the aforementioned "club," who may actually > > believe that if you need a tool for performing a task you should buy it > or > > "He or she who dies with the most tools wins," I present the attached > list > > of tool definitions. > > > > > > > > Hopefully you will find the list amusing. > > > > > > > > Mike > > > > s/v Wind Lass ('91) > > > > Nissequogue River, NY > > > > > > > > > > > > -------------- next part -------------- > > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > > Name: Tool Definitions.pdf > > Type: application/pdf > > Size: 64282 bytes > > Desc: not available > > URL: < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210325/0e55f721/attachment.pdf > > > From gstewart8 at cogeco.ca Thu Mar 25 19:39:08 2021 From: gstewart8 at cogeco.ca (Graham Stewart) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2021 19:39:08 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Tool Definitions In-Reply-To: <002001d72185$227ddd80$67799880$@ebsmed.com> References: <002001d72185$227ddd80$67799880$@ebsmed.com> Message-ID: <00f601d721d0$0e261550$2a723ff0$@ca> Describes me to a tee. Graham Stewart Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 Kingston Ontario -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf Of Michael D. Weisner Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2021 10:43 AM To: 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Tool Definitions For some of us, repairing, maintaining and rebuilding a project boat is very rewarding and almost as much fun as sailing. I said ALMOST. For those who are members of the aforementioned "club," who may actually believe that if you need a tool for performing a task you should buy it or "He or she who dies with the most tools wins," I present the attached list of tool definitions. Hopefully you will find the list amusing. Mike s/v Wind Lass ('91) Nissequogue River, NY -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Tool Definitions.pdf Type: application/pdf Size: 64282 bytes Desc: not available URL: From shawn.sustain at gmail.com Thu Mar 25 20:38:15 2021 From: shawn.sustain at gmail.com (Shawn Boles) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2021 17:38:15 -0700 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Oh boy, a match race! Much more enjoyable than the obscene, but fascinating, America's Cup races I just watched. Cheers, Shawn s/v Sweet Baboo (1986/2010) On Thu, Mar 25, 2021, 1:49 PM Rick Lange wrote: > Roger, > > I learned to sail and race by taking a college physical education class > over 50 years ago. I've raced dinghies through keel boats, including the > R22, and as skipper, have a few blue flags to show for it. > > I accept your challenge to match race R22's with the IMF and diamond board. > > I challenge you to produce the videos you said are so common demonstrating > using the traveller on small sloops to dump wind during gusts > that overpower while close hauled. > > Regards, > > Rick Lange > > > On Thu, Mar 25, 2021 at 2:44 PM ROGER PIHLAJA > wrote: > > > Rick, > > > > We were having a discussion of mainsail trim and traveler use in heavy > air > > wherein the rig needs to be depowered in gusts and then quickly brought > > back on line after the gust has passed. Mainsail shape for <= 10 knots > is > > considered light air and is a different subject. As you noted, the > optimum > > light air mainsail shape is achieved with a different traveler car > position > > and mainsheet tension vs heavy air. In light air, it is also much less > > likely the rig will need to be depowered as per the original discussion. > > > > It is beyond the scope of my job description to give tutorials on sail > > trim in all possible conditions. I suggest you take a class or go racing. > > > > Stan, > > > > I give up! I?ve tried to explain the merits of your GBI 29 Traveler to > > the best of my ability. But, it?s not working. If you want to jump into > > this discussion, go ahead. But, I?m done. > > > > Roger Pihlaja > > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > > > > > > From ruckc at yahoo.com Thu Mar 25 21:45:15 2021 From: ruckc at yahoo.com (Curtis Ruck) Date: Thu, 25 Mar 2021 21:45:15 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hmm, i'll jump in and throw my two cents in, with my 1976 R22. When i'm racing in gusty 15+ knots... i am typically sitting on the side rails above the seat, with one hand on the tiller extension and my other fully gloved hand is holding the mainsheet uncleated, and i use that hand to either let slip the mainsheet in a strong gust, or i give and take a little with my hand holding the mainsheet from flying loose. I have a harken 3:1 windward sheeting traveler rail mounted on the back stays. I try to get the mainsheet as flat as possible. I would never use my traveler to try controlling the main for gusting, holding the uncleated mainsheet just feels natural, a little give, a little take, lets me feel like i'm riding with the wind, and it allows instant response. Though on long races my arms feel it. BTW, my traveler setup in the picture. I mounted the harken traveler rail on a 1" OD Fiberglass tube with stainless 316 mounts on each end that the backstays run through. Mounts are attached to the backstay with a small stainless tube slightly larger than the backstay diameter to reduce the friction wear on the backstays. I love the setup, but sometimes wish I had a fixed traveler rail that wasn't floating. [image: image.png] -- Curtis On Thu, Mar 25, 2021 at 8:38 PM Shawn Boles wrote: > Oh boy, a match race! Much more enjoyable than the obscene, but > fascinating, America's Cup races I just watched. > > Cheers, > Shawn s/v Sweet Baboo (1986/2010) > > On Thu, Mar 25, 2021, 1:49 PM Rick Lange wrote: > > > Roger, > > > > I learned to sail and race by taking a college physical education class > > over 50 years ago. I've raced dinghies through keel boats, including the > > R22, and as skipper, have a few blue flags to show for it. > > > > I accept your challenge to match race R22's with the IMF and diamond > board. > > > > I challenge you to produce the videos you said are so common > demonstrating > > using the traveller on small sloops to dump wind during gusts > > that overpower while close hauled. > > > > Regards, > > > > Rick Lange > > > > > > On Thu, Mar 25, 2021 at 2:44 PM ROGER PIHLAJA > > wrote: > > > > > Rick, > > > > > > We were having a discussion of mainsail trim and traveler use in heavy > > air > > > wherein the rig needs to be depowered in gusts and then quickly brought > > > back on line after the gust has passed. Mainsail shape for <= 10 knots > > is > > > considered light air and is a different subject. As you noted, the > > optimum > > > light air mainsail shape is achieved with a different traveler car > > position > > > and mainsheet tension vs heavy air. In light air, it is also much less > > > likely the rig will need to be depowered as per the original > discussion. > > > > > > It is beyond the scope of my job description to give tutorials on sail > > > trim in all possible conditions. I suggest you take a class or go > racing. > > > > > > Stan, > > > > > > I give up! I?ve tried to explain the merits of your GBI 29 Traveler to > > > the best of my ability. But, it?s not working. If you want to jump > into > > > this discussion, go ahead. But, I?m done. > > > > > > Roger Pihlaja > > > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > > > > > > > > > > > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: image.png Type: image/png Size: 3456191 bytes Desc: not available URL: From gstewart8 at cogeco.ca Fri Mar 26 10:11:35 2021 From: gstewart8 at cogeco.ca (Graham Stewart) Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2021 10:11:35 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications - another alternative In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <011601d72249$f0e2ee80$d2a8cb80$@ca> I have been interested in the traveler discussion. My boat (1976) didn't have a traveler when I got it and the mainsheet was simply attached to the table base in the cockpit. My backstays are not equipped to install a traveler and replacing the stays with new ones seemed cost prohibitive to me. Initially I installed a traveler between the lazerette and the cockpit seats. That worked well enough but made movement around the cockpit awkward. My latest version was to mount the traveler track to a 1" stainless steel tube and fasten that to my stern rail where it would seem to work in a manner similar to those attached to the back stays. The rail does not flex like the backstays would but I don't know if that is a good thing or not. While this system seems very strong to me I am no engineer or otherwise qualified to know. For those who are reluctant to pay the cost of both the backstay replacement plus the cost of the new traveler this arrangement might be worth considering. I like that the traveler being close to the stern rail means I don't have an additional barrier to reaching over the stern rail to lift the motor and that it is out of the way when sailing. I don't like the fact the it is awkward to reach the lee traveler line. Any thought on improvements or worries about this installation would be welcome. Graham Stewart Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 Kingston Ontario -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf Of Curtis Ruck via Rhodes22-list Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2021 9:45 PM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications Hmm, i'll jump in and throw my two cents in, with my 1976 R22. When i'm racing in gusty 15+ knots... i am typically sitting on the side rails above the seat, with one hand on the tiller extension and my other fully gloved hand is holding the mainsheet uncleated, and i use that hand to either let slip the mainsheet in a strong gust, or i give and take a little with my hand holding the mainsheet from flying loose. I have a harken 3:1 windward sheeting traveler rail mounted on the back stays. I try to get the mainsheet as flat as possible. I would never use my traveler to try controlling the main for gusting, holding the uncleated mainsheet just feels natural, a little give, a little take, lets me feel like i'm riding with the wind, and it allows instant response. Though on long races my arms feel it. BTW, my traveler setup in the picture. I mounted the harken traveler rail on a 1" OD Fiberglass tube with stainless 316 mounts on each end that the backstays run through. Mounts are attached to the backstay with a small stainless tube slightly larger than the backstay diameter to reduce the friction wear on the backstays. I love the setup, but sometimes wish I had a fixed traveler rail that wasn't floating. [image: image.png] -- Curtis On Thu, Mar 25, 2021 at 8:38 PM Shawn Boles wrote: > Oh boy, a match race! Much more enjoyable than the obscene, but > fascinating, America's Cup races I just watched. > > Cheers, > Shawn s/v Sweet Baboo (1986/2010) > > On Thu, Mar 25, 2021, 1:49 PM Rick Lange wrote: > > > Roger, > > > > I learned to sail and race by taking a college physical education class > > over 50 years ago. I've raced dinghies through keel boats, including the > > R22, and as skipper, have a few blue flags to show for it. > > > > I accept your challenge to match race R22's with the IMF and diamond > board. > > > > I challenge you to produce the videos you said are so common > demonstrating > > using the traveller on small sloops to dump wind during gusts > > that overpower while close hauled. > > > > Regards, > > > > Rick Lange > > > > > > On Thu, Mar 25, 2021 at 2:44 PM ROGER PIHLAJA > > wrote: > > > > > Rick, > > > > > > We were having a discussion of mainsail trim and traveler use in heavy > > air > > > wherein the rig needs to be depowered in gusts and then quickly brought > > > back on line after the gust has passed. Mainsail shape for <= 10 knots > > is > > > considered light air and is a different subject. As you noted, the > > optimum > > > light air mainsail shape is achieved with a different traveler car > > position > > > and mainsheet tension vs heavy air. In light air, it is also much less > > > likely the rig will need to be depowered as per the original > discussion. > > > > > > It is beyond the scope of my job description to give tutorials on sail > > > trim in all possible conditions. I suggest you take a class or go > racing. > > > > > > Stan, > > > > > > I give up! I?ve tried to explain the merits of your GBI 29 Traveler to > > > the best of my ability. But, it?s not working. If you want to jump > into > > > this discussion, go ahead. But, I?m done. > > > > > > Roger Pihlaja > > > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > > > > > > > > > > > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: image.png Type: image/png Size: 3456191 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: New traveller.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 128837 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Taveller end hardware.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 106100 bytes Desc: not available URL: From sloopblueheron at gmail.com Fri Mar 26 10:16:06 2021 From: sloopblueheron at gmail.com (Rick Lange) Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2021 10:16:06 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications - another alternative In-Reply-To: <011601d72249$f0e2ee80$d2a8cb80$@ca> References: <011601d72249$f0e2ee80$d2a8cb80$@ca> Message-ID: Graham, Maybe you can get in earlier, cheaper model from Stan. I have one that works fine, just slower. Rick Lange On Fri, Mar 26, 2021, 10:11 AM Graham Stewart wrote: > I have been interested in the traveler discussion. My boat (1976) didn't > have a traveler when I got it and the mainsheet was simply attached to the > table base in the cockpit. My backstays are not equipped to install a > traveler and replacing the stays with new ones seemed cost prohibitive to > me. Initially I installed a traveler between the lazerette and the cockpit > seats. That worked well enough but made movement around the cockpit > awkward. > > My latest version was to mount the traveler track to a 1" stainless steel > tube and fasten that to my stern rail where it would seem to work in a > manner similar to those attached to the back stays. The rail does not flex > like the backstays would but I don't know if that is a good thing or not. > While this system seems very strong to me I am no engineer or otherwise > qualified to know. > > For those who are reluctant to pay the cost of both the backstay > replacement plus the cost of the new traveler this arrangement might be > worth considering. > > I like that the traveler being close to the stern rail means I don't have > an additional barrier to reaching over the stern rail to lift the motor and > that it is out of the way when sailing. I don't like the fact the it is > awkward to reach the lee traveler line. Any thought on improvements or > worries about this installation would be welcome. > > Graham Stewart > Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 > Kingston Ontario > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf > Of Curtis Ruck via Rhodes22-list > Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2021 9:45 PM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications > > Hmm, i'll jump in and throw my two cents in, with my 1976 R22. > > When i'm racing in gusty 15+ knots... i am typically sitting on the side > rails above the seat, with one hand on the tiller extension and my other > fully gloved hand is holding the mainsheet uncleated, and i use that hand > to either let slip the mainsheet in a strong gust, or i give and take a > little with my hand holding the mainsheet from flying loose. I have a > harken 3:1 windward sheeting traveler rail mounted on the back stays. I > try to get the mainsheet as flat as possible. I would never use my > traveler to try controlling the main for gusting, holding the uncleated > mainsheet just feels natural, a little give, a little take, lets me feel > like i'm riding with the wind, and it allows instant response. Though on > long races my arms feel it. > > BTW, my traveler setup in the picture. I mounted the harken traveler rail > on a 1" OD Fiberglass tube with stainless 316 mounts on each end that the > backstays run through. Mounts are attached to the backstay with a small > stainless tube slightly larger than the backstay diameter to reduce the > friction wear on the backstays. I love the setup, but sometimes wish I had > a fixed traveler rail that wasn't floating. > > [image: image.png] > > -- > Curtis > > > On Thu, Mar 25, 2021 at 8:38 PM Shawn Boles > wrote: > > > Oh boy, a match race! Much more enjoyable than the obscene, but > > fascinating, America's Cup races I just watched. > > > > Cheers, > > Shawn s/v Sweet Baboo (1986/2010) > > > > On Thu, Mar 25, 2021, 1:49 PM Rick Lange > wrote: > > > > > Roger, > > > > > > I learned to sail and race by taking a college physical education class > > > over 50 years ago. I've raced dinghies through keel boats, including > the > > > R22, and as skipper, have a few blue flags to show for it. > > > > > > I accept your challenge to match race R22's with the IMF and diamond > > board. > > > > > > I challenge you to produce the videos you said are so common > > demonstrating > > > using the traveller on small sloops to dump wind during gusts > > > that overpower while close hauled. > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > Rick Lange > > > > > > > > > On Thu, Mar 25, 2021 at 2:44 PM ROGER PIHLAJA > > > wrote: > > > > > > > Rick, > > > > > > > > We were having a discussion of mainsail trim and traveler use in > heavy > > > air > > > > wherein the rig needs to be depowered in gusts and then quickly > brought > > > > back on line after the gust has passed. Mainsail shape for <= 10 > knots > > > is > > > > considered light air and is a different subject. As you noted, the > > > optimum > > > > light air mainsail shape is achieved with a different traveler car > > > position > > > > and mainsheet tension vs heavy air. In light air, it is also much > less > > > > likely the rig will need to be depowered as per the original > > discussion. > > > > > > > > It is beyond the scope of my job description to give tutorials on > sail > > > > trim in all possible conditions. I suggest you take a class or go > > racing. > > > > > > > > Stan, > > > > > > > > I give up! I?ve tried to explain the merits of your GBI 29 Traveler > to > > > > the best of my ability. But, it?s not working. If you want to jump > > into > > > > this discussion, go ahead. But, I?m done. > > > > > > > > Roger Pihlaja > > > > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: image.png > Type: image/png > Size: 3456191 bytes > Desc: not available > URL: < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210325/763bc9ee/attachment.png > > > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: New traveller.jpg > Type: image/jpeg > Size: 128837 bytes > Desc: not available > URL: < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210326/74da184f/attachment.jpg > > > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: Taveller end hardware.jpg > Type: image/jpeg > Size: 106100 bytes > Desc: not available > URL: < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210326/74da184f/attachment-0001.jpg > > > From hnw555 at gmail.com Fri Mar 26 10:20:16 2021 From: hnw555 at gmail.com (Hank) Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2021 10:20:16 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications - another alternative In-Reply-To: <011601d72249$f0e2ee80$d2a8cb80$@ca> References: <011601d72249$f0e2ee80$d2a8cb80$@ca> Message-ID: Graham, So is your mainsheet basically connected to the boat through the stern rails? Normally, travellers are attached to something a bit more substantial as railing mounts are generally not that strong or designed to hold a load in that direction. Just something to think about. Hank On Fri, Mar 26, 2021 at 10:11 AM Graham Stewart wrote: > I have been interested in the traveler discussion. My boat (1976) didn't > have a traveler when I got it and the mainsheet was simply attached to the > table base in the cockpit. My backstays are not equipped to install a > traveler and replacing the stays with new ones seemed cost prohibitive to > me. Initially I installed a traveler between the lazerette and the cockpit > seats. That worked well enough but made movement around the cockpit > awkward. > > My latest version was to mount the traveler track to a 1" stainless steel > tube and fasten that to my stern rail where it would seem to work in a > manner similar to those attached to the back stays. The rail does not flex > like the backstays would but I don't know if that is a good thing or not. > While this system seems very strong to me I am no engineer or otherwise > qualified to know. > > For those who are reluctant to pay the cost of both the backstay > replacement plus the cost of the new traveler this arrangement might be > worth considering. > > I like that the traveler being close to the stern rail means I don't have > an additional barrier to reaching over the stern rail to lift the motor and > that it is out of the way when sailing. I don't like the fact the it is > awkward to reach the lee traveler line. Any thought on improvements or > worries about this installation would be welcome. > > Graham Stewart > Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 > Kingston Ontario > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf > Of Curtis Ruck via Rhodes22-list > Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2021 9:45 PM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications > > Hmm, i'll jump in and throw my two cents in, with my 1976 R22. > > When i'm racing in gusty 15+ knots... i am typically sitting on the side > rails above the seat, with one hand on the tiller extension and my other > fully gloved hand is holding the mainsheet uncleated, and i use that hand > to either let slip the mainsheet in a strong gust, or i give and take a > little with my hand holding the mainsheet from flying loose. I have a > harken 3:1 windward sheeting traveler rail mounted on the back stays. I > try to get the mainsheet as flat as possible. I would never use my > traveler to try controlling the main for gusting, holding the uncleated > mainsheet just feels natural, a little give, a little take, lets me feel > like i'm riding with the wind, and it allows instant response. Though on > long races my arms feel it. > > BTW, my traveler setup in the picture. I mounted the harken traveler rail > on a 1" OD Fiberglass tube with stainless 316 mounts on each end that the > backstays run through. Mounts are attached to the backstay with a small > stainless tube slightly larger than the backstay diameter to reduce the > friction wear on the backstays. I love the setup, but sometimes wish I had > a fixed traveler rail that wasn't floating. > > [image: image.png] > > -- > Curtis > > > On Thu, Mar 25, 2021 at 8:38 PM Shawn Boles > wrote: > > > Oh boy, a match race! Much more enjoyable than the obscene, but > > fascinating, America's Cup races I just watched. > > > > Cheers, > > Shawn s/v Sweet Baboo (1986/2010) > > > > On Thu, Mar 25, 2021, 1:49 PM Rick Lange > wrote: > > > > > Roger, > > > > > > I learned to sail and race by taking a college physical education class > > > over 50 years ago. I've raced dinghies through keel boats, including > the > > > R22, and as skipper, have a few blue flags to show for it. > > > > > > I accept your challenge to match race R22's with the IMF and diamond > > board. > > > > > > I challenge you to produce the videos you said are so common > > demonstrating > > > using the traveller on small sloops to dump wind during gusts > > > that overpower while close hauled. > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > Rick Lange > > > > > > > > > On Thu, Mar 25, 2021 at 2:44 PM ROGER PIHLAJA > > > wrote: > > > > > > > Rick, > > > > > > > > We were having a discussion of mainsail trim and traveler use in > heavy > > > air > > > > wherein the rig needs to be depowered in gusts and then quickly > brought > > > > back on line after the gust has passed. Mainsail shape for <= 10 > knots > > > is > > > > considered light air and is a different subject. As you noted, the > > > optimum > > > > light air mainsail shape is achieved with a different traveler car > > > position > > > > and mainsheet tension vs heavy air. In light air, it is also much > less > > > > likely the rig will need to be depowered as per the original > > discussion. > > > > > > > > It is beyond the scope of my job description to give tutorials on > sail > > > > trim in all possible conditions. I suggest you take a class or go > > racing. > > > > > > > > Stan, > > > > > > > > I give up! I?ve tried to explain the merits of your GBI 29 Traveler > to > > > > the best of my ability. But, it?s not working. If you want to jump > > into > > > > this discussion, go ahead. But, I?m done. > > > > > > > > Roger Pihlaja > > > > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: image.png > Type: image/png > Size: 3456191 bytes > Desc: not available > URL: < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210325/763bc9ee/attachment.png > > > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: New traveller.jpg > Type: image/jpeg > Size: 128837 bytes > Desc: not available > URL: < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210326/74da184f/attachment.jpg > > > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: Taveller end hardware.jpg > Type: image/jpeg > Size: 106100 bytes > Desc: not available > URL: < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210326/74da184f/attachment-0001.jpg > > > From rlowe at vt.edu Fri Mar 26 10:24:32 2021 From: rlowe at vt.edu (Lowe, Rob) Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2021 14:24:32 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications - another alternative In-Reply-To: <011601d72249$f0e2ee80$d2a8cb80$@ca> References: , <011601d72249$f0e2ee80$d2a8cb80$@ca> Message-ID: Graham, My first boat was a 1976 and had the traveler bar mounted between two 'bar end cups' that attached to the back stays. Is your boat not similarity equipped? I don't think there was anything special about the backstays. - Rob ________________________________ From: Rhodes22-list on behalf of Graham Stewart Sent: Friday, March 26, 2021 10:11 AM To: 'Curtis Ruck' ; 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications - another alternative I have been interested in the traveler discussion. My boat (1976) didn't have a traveler when I got it and the mainsheet was simply attached to the table base in the cockpit. My backstays are not equipped to install a traveler and replacing the stays with new ones seemed cost prohibitive to me. Initially I installed a traveler between the lazerette and the cockpit seats. That worked well enough but made movement around the cockpit awkward. My latest version was to mount the traveler track to a 1" stainless steel tube and fasten that to my stern rail where it would seem to work in a manner similar to those attached to the back stays. The rail does not flex like the backstays would but I don't know if that is a good thing or not. While this system seems very strong to me I am no engineer or otherwise qualified to know. For those who are reluctant to pay the cost of both the backstay replacement plus the cost of the new traveler this arrangement might be worth considering. I like that the traveler being close to the stern rail means I don't have an additional barrier to reaching over the stern rail to lift the motor and that it is out of the way when sailing. I don't like the fact the it is awkward to reach the lee traveler line. Any thought on improvements or worries about this installation would be welcome. Graham Stewart Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 Kingston Ontario -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf Of Curtis Ruck via Rhodes22-list Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2021 9:45 PM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications Hmm, i'll jump in and throw my two cents in, with my 1976 R22. When i'm racing in gusty 15+ knots... i am typically sitting on the side rails above the seat, with one hand on the tiller extension and my other fully gloved hand is holding the mainsheet uncleated, and i use that hand to either let slip the mainsheet in a strong gust, or i give and take a little with my hand holding the mainsheet from flying loose. I have a harken 3:1 windward sheeting traveler rail mounted on the back stays. I try to get the mainsheet as flat as possible. I would never use my traveler to try controlling the main for gusting, holding the uncleated mainsheet just feels natural, a little give, a little take, lets me feel like i'm riding with the wind, and it allows instant response. Though on long races my arms feel it. BTW, my traveler setup in the picture. I mounted the harken traveler rail on a 1" OD Fiberglass tube with stainless 316 mounts on each end that the backstays run through. Mounts are attached to the backstay with a small stainless tube slightly larger than the backstay diameter to reduce the friction wear on the backstays. I love the setup, but sometimes wish I had a fixed traveler rail that wasn't floating. [image: image.png] -- Curtis On Thu, Mar 25, 2021 at 8:38 PM Shawn Boles wrote: > Oh boy, a match race! Much more enjoyable than the obscene, but > fascinating, America's Cup races I just watched. > > Cheers, > Shawn s/v Sweet Baboo (1986/2010) > > On Thu, Mar 25, 2021, 1:49 PM Rick Lange wrote: > > > Roger, > > > > I learned to sail and race by taking a college physical education class > > over 50 years ago. I've raced dinghies through keel boats, including the > > R22, and as skipper, have a few blue flags to show for it. > > > > I accept your challenge to match race R22's with the IMF and diamond > board. > > > > I challenge you to produce the videos you said are so common > demonstrating > > using the traveller on small sloops to dump wind during gusts > > that overpower while close hauled. > > > > Regards, > > > > Rick Lange > > > > > > On Thu, Mar 25, 2021 at 2:44 PM ROGER PIHLAJA > > wrote: > > > > > Rick, > > > > > > We were having a discussion of mainsail trim and traveler use in heavy > > air > > > wherein the rig needs to be depowered in gusts and then quickly brought > > > back on line after the gust has passed. Mainsail shape for <= 10 knots > > is > > > considered light air and is a different subject. As you noted, the > > optimum > > > light air mainsail shape is achieved with a different traveler car > > position > > > and mainsheet tension vs heavy air. In light air, it is also much less > > > likely the rig will need to be depowered as per the original > discussion. > > > > > > It is beyond the scope of my job description to give tutorials on sail > > > trim in all possible conditions. I suggest you take a class or go > racing. > > > > > > Stan, > > > > > > I give up! I?ve tried to explain the merits of your GBI 29 Traveler to > > > the best of my ability. But, it?s not working. If you want to jump > into > > > this discussion, go ahead. But, I?m done. > > > > > > Roger Pihlaja > > > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > > > > > > > > > > > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: image.png Type: image/png Size: 3456191 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: New traveller.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 128837 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Taveller end hardware.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 106100 bytes Desc: not available URL: From gstewart8 at cogeco.ca Fri Mar 26 10:33:29 2021 From: gstewart8 at cogeco.ca (Graham Stewart) Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2021 10:33:29 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications - another alternative In-Reply-To: <011601d72249$f0e2ee80$d2a8cb80$@ca> References: <011601d72249$f0e2ee80$d2a8cb80$@ca> Message-ID: <012001d7224c$fee6dac0$fcb49040$@ca> Oops. The first photo that I attached was not of me or my boat but one that someone else posted. If you are the person in the photo rest assured that I am not trying to be an imposter. Graham Stewart Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 Kingston Ontario -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf Of Graham Stewart Sent: Friday, March 26, 2021 10:12 AM To: 'Curtis Ruck'; 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications - another alternative I have been interested in the traveler discussion. My boat (1976) didn't have a traveler when I got it and the mainsheet was simply attached to the table base in the cockpit. My backstays are not equipped to install a traveler and replacing the stays with new ones seemed cost prohibitive to me. Initially I installed a traveler between the lazerette and the cockpit seats. That worked well enough but made movement around the cockpit awkward. My latest version was to mount the traveler track to a 1" stainless steel tube and fasten that to my stern rail where it would seem to work in a manner similar to those attached to the back stays. The rail does not flex like the backstays would but I don't know if that is a good thing or not. While this system seems very strong to me I am no engineer or otherwise qualified to know. For those who are reluctant to pay the cost of both the backstay replacement plus the cost of the new traveler this arrangement might be worth considering. I like that the traveler being close to the stern rail means I don't have an additional barrier to reaching over the stern rail to lift the motor and that it is out of the way when sailing. I don't like the fact the it is awkward to reach the lee traveler line. Any thought on improvements or worries about this installation would be welcome. Graham Stewart Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 Kingston Ontario -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf Of Curtis Ruck via Rhodes22-list Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2021 9:45 PM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications Hmm, i'll jump in and throw my two cents in, with my 1976 R22. When i'm racing in gusty 15+ knots... i am typically sitting on the side rails above the seat, with one hand on the tiller extension and my other fully gloved hand is holding the mainsheet uncleated, and i use that hand to either let slip the mainsheet in a strong gust, or i give and take a little with my hand holding the mainsheet from flying loose. I have a harken 3:1 windward sheeting traveler rail mounted on the back stays. I try to get the mainsheet as flat as possible. I would never use my traveler to try controlling the main for gusting, holding the uncleated mainsheet just feels natural, a little give, a little take, lets me feel like i'm riding with the wind, and it allows instant response. Though on long races my arms feel it. BTW, my traveler setup in the picture. I mounted the harken traveler rail on a 1" OD Fiberglass tube with stainless 316 mounts on each end that the backstays run through. Mounts are attached to the backstay with a small stainless tube slightly larger than the backstay diameter to reduce the friction wear on the backstays. I love the setup, but sometimes wish I had a fixed traveler rail that wasn't floating. [image: image.png] -- Curtis On Thu, Mar 25, 2021 at 8:38 PM Shawn Boles wrote: > Oh boy, a match race! Much more enjoyable than the obscene, but > fascinating, America's Cup races I just watched. > > Cheers, > Shawn s/v Sweet Baboo (1986/2010) > > On Thu, Mar 25, 2021, 1:49 PM Rick Lange wrote: > > > Roger, > > > > I learned to sail and race by taking a college physical education class > > over 50 years ago. I've raced dinghies through keel boats, including the > > R22, and as skipper, have a few blue flags to show for it. > > > > I accept your challenge to match race R22's with the IMF and diamond > board. > > > > I challenge you to produce the videos you said are so common > demonstrating > > using the traveller on small sloops to dump wind during gusts > > that overpower while close hauled. > > > > Regards, > > > > Rick Lange > > > > > > On Thu, Mar 25, 2021 at 2:44 PM ROGER PIHLAJA > > wrote: > > > > > Rick, > > > > > > We were having a discussion of mainsail trim and traveler use in heavy > > air > > > wherein the rig needs to be depowered in gusts and then quickly brought > > > back on line after the gust has passed. Mainsail shape for <= 10 knots > > is > > > considered light air and is a different subject. As you noted, the > > optimum > > > light air mainsail shape is achieved with a different traveler car > > position > > > and mainsheet tension vs heavy air. In light air, it is also much less > > > likely the rig will need to be depowered as per the original > discussion. > > > > > > It is beyond the scope of my job description to give tutorials on sail > > > trim in all possible conditions. I suggest you take a class or go > racing. > > > > > > Stan, > > > > > > I give up! I?ve tried to explain the merits of your GBI 29 Traveler to > > > the best of my ability. But, it?s not working. If you want to jump > into > > > this discussion, go ahead. But, I?m done. > > > > > > Roger Pihlaja > > > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > > > > > > > > > > > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: image.png Type: image/png Size: 3456191 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: New traveller.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 128837 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Taveller end hardware.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 106100 bytes Desc: not available URL: From gstewart8 at cogeco.ca Fri Mar 26 10:37:45 2021 From: gstewart8 at cogeco.ca (Graham Stewart) Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2021 10:37:45 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications - another alternative In-Reply-To: References: <011601d72249$f0e2ee80$d2a8cb80$@ca> Message-ID: <012101d7224d$97b44940$c71cdbc0$@ca> Rob: No, my boat did not have anything attached to the back stays that would attach to a traveler. I thought that those with the end cups were specially made. Otherwise, how were the cups attached? Graham Stewart gstewart8 at cogeco.ca -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf Of Lowe, Rob Sent: Friday, March 26, 2021 10:25 AM To: 'Curtis Ruck'; 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications - another alternative Graham, My first boat was a 1976 and had the traveler bar mounted between two 'bar end cups' that attached to the back stays. Is your boat not similarity equipped? I don't think there was anything special about the backstays. - Rob ________________________________ From: Rhodes22-list on behalf of Graham Stewart Sent: Friday, March 26, 2021 10:11 AM To: 'Curtis Ruck' ; 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications - another alternative I have been interested in the traveler discussion. My boat (1976) didn't have a traveler when I got it and the mainsheet was simply attached to the table base in the cockpit. My backstays are not equipped to install a traveler and replacing the stays with new ones seemed cost prohibitive to me. Initially I installed a traveler between the lazerette and the cockpit seats. That worked well enough but made movement around the cockpit awkward. My latest version was to mount the traveler track to a 1" stainless steel tube and fasten that to my stern rail where it would seem to work in a manner similar to those attached to the back stays. The rail does not flex like the backstays would but I don't know if that is a good thing or not. While this system seems very strong to me I am no engineer or otherwise qualified to know. For those who are reluctant to pay the cost of both the backstay replacement plus the cost of the new traveler this arrangement might be worth considering. I like that the traveler being close to the stern rail means I don't have an additional barrier to reaching over the stern rail to lift the motor and that it is out of the way when sailing. I don't like the fact the it is awkward to reach the lee traveler line. Any thought on improvements or worries about this installation would be welcome. Graham Stewart Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 Kingston Ontario -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf Of Curtis Ruck via Rhodes22-list Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2021 9:45 PM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications Hmm, i'll jump in and throw my two cents in, with my 1976 R22. When i'm racing in gusty 15+ knots... i am typically sitting on the side rails above the seat, with one hand on the tiller extension and my other fully gloved hand is holding the mainsheet uncleated, and i use that hand to either let slip the mainsheet in a strong gust, or i give and take a little with my hand holding the mainsheet from flying loose. I have a harken 3:1 windward sheeting traveler rail mounted on the back stays. I try to get the mainsheet as flat as possible. I would never use my traveler to try controlling the main for gusting, holding the uncleated mainsheet just feels natural, a little give, a little take, lets me feel like i'm riding with the wind, and it allows instant response. Though on long races my arms feel it. BTW, my traveler setup in the picture. I mounted the harken traveler rail on a 1" OD Fiberglass tube with stainless 316 mounts on each end that the backstays run through. Mounts are attached to the backstay with a small stainless tube slightly larger than the backstay diameter to reduce the friction wear on the backstays. I love the setup, but sometimes wish I had a fixed traveler rail that wasn't floating. [image: image.png] -- Curtis On Thu, Mar 25, 2021 at 8:38 PM Shawn Boles wrote: > Oh boy, a match race! Much more enjoyable than the obscene, but > fascinating, America's Cup races I just watched. > > Cheers, > Shawn s/v Sweet Baboo (1986/2010) > > On Thu, Mar 25, 2021, 1:49 PM Rick Lange wrote: > > > Roger, > > > > I learned to sail and race by taking a college physical education class > > over 50 years ago. I've raced dinghies through keel boats, including the > > R22, and as skipper, have a few blue flags to show for it. > > > > I accept your challenge to match race R22's with the IMF and diamond > board. > > > > I challenge you to produce the videos you said are so common > demonstrating > > using the traveller on small sloops to dump wind during gusts > > that overpower while close hauled. > > > > Regards, > > > > Rick Lange > > > > > > On Thu, Mar 25, 2021 at 2:44 PM ROGER PIHLAJA > > wrote: > > > > > Rick, > > > > > > We were having a discussion of mainsail trim and traveler use in heavy > > air > > > wherein the rig needs to be depowered in gusts and then quickly brought > > > back on line after the gust has passed. Mainsail shape for <= 10 knots > > is > > > considered light air and is a different subject. As you noted, the > > optimum > > > light air mainsail shape is achieved with a different traveler car > > position > > > and mainsheet tension vs heavy air. In light air, it is also much less > > > likely the rig will need to be depowered as per the original > discussion. > > > > > > It is beyond the scope of my job description to give tutorials on sail > > > trim in all possible conditions. I suggest you take a class or go > racing. > > > > > > Stan, > > > > > > I give up! I've tried to explain the merits of your GBI 29 Traveler to > > > the best of my ability. But, it's not working. If you want to jump > into > > > this discussion, go ahead. But, I'm done. > > > > > > Roger Pihlaja > > > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > > > > > > > > > > > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: image.png Type: image/png Size: 3456191 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: New traveller.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 128837 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Taveller end hardware.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 106100 bytes Desc: not available URL: From ccowie at cowieassociates.com Fri Mar 26 10:59:10 2021 From: ccowie at cowieassociates.com (Chris Cowie) Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2021 14:59:10 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications - another alternative In-Reply-To: <011601d72249$f0e2ee80$d2a8cb80$@ca> References: <011601d72249$f0e2ee80$d2a8cb80$@ca> Message-ID: Another option to consider is an off the shelf standard Harkin type traveler mounted to the bar. Christopher P. Cowie? ?? 4200 Massachusetts Ave NW 119 Washington DC, 20016 703.717.9103 office 202.270.1470 mobile [ccowie at cowieassociates.com] Please consider the environment before printing this email. -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of Graham Stewart Sent: Friday, March 26, 2021 10:12 AM To: 'Curtis Ruck' ; 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications - another alternative I have been interested in the traveler discussion. My boat (1976) didn't have a traveler when I got it and the mainsheet was simply attached to the table base in the cockpit. My backstays are not equipped to install a traveler and replacing the stays with new ones seemed cost prohibitive to me. Initially I installed a traveler between the lazerette and the cockpit seats. That worked well enough but made movement around the cockpit awkward. My latest version was to mount the traveler track to a 1" stainless steel tube and fasten that to my stern rail where it would seem to work in a manner similar to those attached to the back stays. The rail does not flex like the backstays would but I don't know if that is a good thing or not. While this system seems very strong to me I am no engineer or otherwise qualified to know. For those who are reluctant to pay the cost of both the backstay replacement plus the cost of the new traveler this arrangement might be worth considering. I like that the traveler being close to the stern rail means I don't have an additional barrier to reaching over the stern rail to lift the motor and that it is out of the way when sailing. I don't like the fact the it is awkward to reach the lee traveler line. Any thought on improvements or worries about this installation would be welcome. Graham Stewart Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 Kingston Ontario -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf Of Curtis Ruck via Rhodes22-list Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2021 9:45 PM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications Hmm, i'll jump in and throw my two cents in, with my 1976 R22. When i'm racing in gusty 15+ knots... i am typically sitting on the side rails above the seat, with one hand on the tiller extension and my other fully gloved hand is holding the mainsheet uncleated, and i use that hand to either let slip the mainsheet in a strong gust, or i give and take a little with my hand holding the mainsheet from flying loose. I have a harken 3:1 windward sheeting traveler rail mounted on the back stays. I try to get the mainsheet as flat as possible. I would never use my traveler to try controlling the main for gusting, holding the uncleated mainsheet just feels natural, a little give, a little take, lets me feel like i'm riding with the wind, and it allows instant response. Though on long races my arms feel it. BTW, my traveler setup in the picture. I mounted the harken traveler rail on a 1" OD Fiberglass tube with stainless 316 mounts on each end that the backstays run through. Mounts are attached to the backstay with a small stainless tube slightly larger than the backstay diameter to reduce the friction wear on the backstays. I love the setup, but sometimes wish I had a fixed traveler rail that wasn't floating. [image: image.png] -- Curtis On Thu, Mar 25, 2021 at 8:38 PM Shawn Boles wrote: > Oh boy, a match race! Much more enjoyable than the obscene, but > fascinating, America's Cup races I just watched. > > Cheers, > Shawn s/v Sweet Baboo (1986/2010) > > On Thu, Mar 25, 2021, 1:49 PM Rick Lange wrote: > > > Roger, > > > > I learned to sail and race by taking a college physical education > > class over 50 years ago. I've raced dinghies through keel boats, > > including the R22, and as skipper, have a few blue flags to show for it. > > > > I accept your challenge to match race R22's with the IMF and diamond > board. > > > > I challenge you to produce the videos you said are so common > demonstrating > > using the traveller on small sloops to dump wind during gusts that > > overpower while close hauled. > > > > Regards, > > > > Rick Lange > > > > > > On Thu, Mar 25, 2021 at 2:44 PM ROGER PIHLAJA > > > > wrote: > > > > > Rick, > > > > > > We were having a discussion of mainsail trim and traveler use in > > > heavy > > air > > > wherein the rig needs to be depowered in gusts and then quickly > > > brought back on line after the gust has passed. Mainsail shape > > > for <= 10 knots > > is > > > considered light air and is a different subject. As you noted, > > > the > > optimum > > > light air mainsail shape is achieved with a different traveler car > > position > > > and mainsheet tension vs heavy air. In light air, it is also much > > > less likely the rig will need to be depowered as per the original > discussion. > > > > > > It is beyond the scope of my job description to give tutorials on > > > sail trim in all possible conditions. I suggest you take a class > > > or go > racing. > > > > > > Stan, > > > > > > I give up! I?ve tried to explain the merits of your GBI 29 > > > Traveler to the best of my ability. But, it?s not working. If > > > you want to jump > into > > > this discussion, go ahead. But, I?m done. > > > > > > Roger Pihlaja > > > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > > > > > > > > > > > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: image.png Type: image/png Size: 3456191 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: New traveller.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 128837 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Taveller end hardware.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 106100 bytes Desc: not available URL: From rlowe at vt.edu Fri Mar 26 11:03:56 2021 From: rlowe at vt.edu (Lowe, Rob) Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2021 15:03:56 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications - another alternative In-Reply-To: <012101d7224d$97b44940$c71cdbc0$@ca> References: <011601d72249$f0e2ee80$d2a8cb80$@ca> , <012101d7224d$97b44940$c71cdbc0$@ca> Message-ID: Graham, Let me find some photos of my old boat's set up. They are on my work machine so might not be until Monday. - rob ________________________________ From: Rhodes22-list on behalf of Graham Stewart Sent: Friday, March 26, 2021 10:37 AM To: 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications - another alternative Rob: No, my boat did not have anything attached to the back stays that would attach to a traveler. I thought that those with the end cups were specially made. Otherwise, how were the cups attached? Graham Stewart gstewart8 at cogeco.ca -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf Of Lowe, Rob Sent: Friday, March 26, 2021 10:25 AM To: 'Curtis Ruck'; 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications - another alternative Graham, My first boat was a 1976 and had the traveler bar mounted between two 'bar end cups' that attached to the back stays. Is your boat not similarity equipped? I don't think there was anything special about the backstays. - Rob ________________________________ From: Rhodes22-list on behalf of Graham Stewart Sent: Friday, March 26, 2021 10:11 AM To: 'Curtis Ruck' ; 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications - another alternative I have been interested in the traveler discussion. My boat (1976) didn't have a traveler when I got it and the mainsheet was simply attached to the table base in the cockpit. My backstays are not equipped to install a traveler and replacing the stays with new ones seemed cost prohibitive to me. Initially I installed a traveler between the lazerette and the cockpit seats. That worked well enough but made movement around the cockpit awkward. My latest version was to mount the traveler track to a 1" stainless steel tube and fasten that to my stern rail where it would seem to work in a manner similar to those attached to the back stays. The rail does not flex like the backstays would but I don't know if that is a good thing or not. While this system seems very strong to me I am no engineer or otherwise qualified to know. For those who are reluctant to pay the cost of both the backstay replacement plus the cost of the new traveler this arrangement might be worth considering. I like that the traveler being close to the stern rail means I don't have an additional barrier to reaching over the stern rail to lift the motor and that it is out of the way when sailing. I don't like the fact the it is awkward to reach the lee traveler line. Any thought on improvements or worries about this installation would be welcome. Graham Stewart Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 Kingston Ontario -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf Of Curtis Ruck via Rhodes22-list Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2021 9:45 PM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications Hmm, i'll jump in and throw my two cents in, with my 1976 R22. When i'm racing in gusty 15+ knots... i am typically sitting on the side rails above the seat, with one hand on the tiller extension and my other fully gloved hand is holding the mainsheet uncleated, and i use that hand to either let slip the mainsheet in a strong gust, or i give and take a little with my hand holding the mainsheet from flying loose. I have a harken 3:1 windward sheeting traveler rail mounted on the back stays. I try to get the mainsheet as flat as possible. I would never use my traveler to try controlling the main for gusting, holding the uncleated mainsheet just feels natural, a little give, a little take, lets me feel like i'm riding with the wind, and it allows instant response. Though on long races my arms feel it. BTW, my traveler setup in the picture. I mounted the harken traveler rail on a 1" OD Fiberglass tube with stainless 316 mounts on each end that the backstays run through. Mounts are attached to the backstay with a small stainless tube slightly larger than the backstay diameter to reduce the friction wear on the backstays. I love the setup, but sometimes wish I had a fixed traveler rail that wasn't floating. [image: image.png] -- Curtis On Thu, Mar 25, 2021 at 8:38 PM Shawn Boles wrote: > Oh boy, a match race! Much more enjoyable than the obscene, but > fascinating, America's Cup races I just watched. > > Cheers, > Shawn s/v Sweet Baboo (1986/2010) > > On Thu, Mar 25, 2021, 1:49 PM Rick Lange wrote: > > > Roger, > > > > I learned to sail and race by taking a college physical education class > > over 50 years ago. I've raced dinghies through keel boats, including the > > R22, and as skipper, have a few blue flags to show for it. > > > > I accept your challenge to match race R22's with the IMF and diamond > board. > > > > I challenge you to produce the videos you said are so common > demonstrating > > using the traveller on small sloops to dump wind during gusts > > that overpower while close hauled. > > > > Regards, > > > > Rick Lange > > > > > > On Thu, Mar 25, 2021 at 2:44 PM ROGER PIHLAJA > > wrote: > > > > > Rick, > > > > > > We were having a discussion of mainsail trim and traveler use in heavy > > air > > > wherein the rig needs to be depowered in gusts and then quickly brought > > > back on line after the gust has passed. Mainsail shape for <= 10 knots > > is > > > considered light air and is a different subject. As you noted, the > > optimum > > > light air mainsail shape is achieved with a different traveler car > > position > > > and mainsheet tension vs heavy air. In light air, it is also much less > > > likely the rig will need to be depowered as per the original > discussion. > > > > > > It is beyond the scope of my job description to give tutorials on sail > > > trim in all possible conditions. I suggest you take a class or go > racing. > > > > > > Stan, > > > > > > I give up! I've tried to explain the merits of your GBI 29 Traveler to > > > the best of my ability. But, it's not working. If you want to jump > into > > > this discussion, go ahead. But, I'm done. > > > > > > Roger Pihlaja > > > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > > > > > > > > > > > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: image.png Type: image/png Size: 3456191 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: New traveller.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 128837 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Taveller end hardware.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 106100 bytes Desc: not available URL: From jbconnolly at comcast.net Fri Mar 26 11:08:20 2021 From: jbconnolly at comcast.net (Jim Connolly) Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2021 11:08:20 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications - another alternative In-Reply-To: <012101d7224d$97b44940$c71cdbc0$@ca> References: <011601d72249$f0e2ee80$d2a8cb80$@ca> , <012101d7224d$97b44940$c71cdbc0$@ca> Message-ID: <6312493E-3DBB-E94A-967D-28E7D3E77670@hxcore.ol> From roger_pihlaja at msn.com Fri Mar 26 11:40:15 2021 From: roger_pihlaja at msn.com (ROGER PIHLAJA) Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2021 15:40:15 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications - another alternative In-Reply-To: <012101d7224d$97b44940$c71cdbc0$@ca> References: <011601d72249$f0e2ee80$d2a8cb80$@ca> , <012101d7224d$97b44940$c71cdbc0$@ca> Message-ID: Rick, OK, here?s 2 books on sail trim Bill Gladstone, ?North U TRIM?, 6th ed, (2007), North U, Madison, CT ?The North U Fast Couse?, (1990), North U, Milford, CT Each of the above are textbooks as part of a North U sailing class and there are companion videos under the same titles. Here?s 2 more videos: Peter Bateman, ?Sail Trimming Made Easy?, R129, Bennett Marine Video, Marina Del Ray, CA ?The Shape Of Speed?, R329, Bennett Marine Video, Marina Del Ray, CA One thing you will note in all of these references is that the traveler is constantly adjusted to maintain the windward/leeward helm balance. The traveler is not a digital on/off device, it is constantly used for fine tuning while underway. With the traveler and the tiller both under the control of the helmsman, the Rhodes 22?s helm balance can be adjusted on the fly better than any other boat I?ve ever experienced. The GBI 29 Traveler has the additional advantage of having sufficient range of motion and responsiveness to be able to depower the rig in a gust and quickly get back on line after the gust has passed. If other boats could do it, they would! If your GBI-29 Traveler cannot do this; then, you are using it wrong. If you are busting your knuckles on your traveler then I can only imagine what unspeakable act you are attempting to commit! ? In general, racing dingies do not have as much range of traveler movement as our Rhodes 22?s. Since the range of movement is limited, you cannot use the traveler to depower the main. Some keelboats also do not have sufficient range of motion in the traveler. Some boats are limited by their traveler design, like the 2nd generation traveler on the Rhodes 22, which had poor ergonomics on the clam cleat placement, thus making it hard for the helmsman to operate without leaving his preferred hiking position on the windward gunnel. Some boats have sticky, poorly designed, &/or placed traveler tracks, thus making it impossible for the helmsman to constantly play with the traveler. Name the sailboats, other than the Rhodes 22, that you?ve sailed that combine sufficient range of traveler movement to be able to depower the rig, good ergonomics for the helmsman, fast response, and can be operated with one hand. Off the top of my head, I can?t think of any. Our boats are unique. The only Rhodes 22 I have access to is S/V Dynamic Equilibrium, a 1976 model. How about if I spot you 10 sec/nm? This thread is getting really long and very old. Can we please change the subject? Roger Pihlaja S/V Dynamic Equilibrium From: Graham Stewart Sent: Friday, March 26, 2021 10:37 AM To: 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications - another alternative Rob: No, my boat did not have anything attached to the back stays that would attach to a traveler. I thought that those with the end cups were specially made. Otherwise, how were the cups attached? Graham Stewart gstewart8 at cogeco.ca -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf Of Lowe, Rob Sent: Friday, March 26, 2021 10:25 AM To: 'Curtis Ruck'; 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications - another alternative Graham, My first boat was a 1976 and had the traveler bar mounted between two 'bar end cups' that attached to the back stays. Is your boat not similarity equipped? I don't think there was anything special about the backstays. - Rob ________________________________ From: Rhodes22-list on behalf of Graham Stewart Sent: Friday, March 26, 2021 10:11 AM To: 'Curtis Ruck' ; 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications - another alternative I have been interested in the traveler discussion. My boat (1976) didn't have a traveler when I got it and the mainsheet was simply attached to the table base in the cockpit. My backstays are not equipped to install a traveler and replacing the stays with new ones seemed cost prohibitive to me. Initially I installed a traveler between the lazerette and the cockpit seats. That worked well enough but made movement around the cockpit awkward. My latest version was to mount the traveler track to a 1" stainless steel tube and fasten that to my stern rail where it would seem to work in a manner similar to those attached to the back stays. The rail does not flex like the backstays would but I don't know if that is a good thing or not. While this system seems very strong to me I am no engineer or otherwise qualified to know. For those who are reluctant to pay the cost of both the backstay replacement plus the cost of the new traveler this arrangement might be worth considering. I like that the traveler being close to the stern rail means I don't have an additional barrier to reaching over the stern rail to lift the motor and that it is out of the way when sailing. I don't like the fact the it is awkward to reach the lee traveler line. Any thought on improvements or worries about this installation would be welcome. Graham Stewart Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 Kingston Ontario -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf Of Curtis Ruck via Rhodes22-list Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2021 9:45 PM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications Hmm, i'll jump in and throw my two cents in, with my 1976 R22. When i'm racing in gusty 15+ knots... i am typically sitting on the side rails above the seat, with one hand on the tiller extension and my other fully gloved hand is holding the mainsheet uncleated, and i use that hand to either let slip the mainsheet in a strong gust, or i give and take a little with my hand holding the mainsheet from flying loose. I have a harken 3:1 windward sheeting traveler rail mounted on the back stays. I try to get the mainsheet as flat as possible. I would never use my traveler to try controlling the main for gusting, holding the uncleated mainsheet just feels natural, a little give, a little take, lets me feel like i'm riding with the wind, and it allows instant response. Though on long races my arms feel it. BTW, my traveler setup in the picture. I mounted the harken traveler rail on a 1" OD Fiberglass tube with stainless 316 mounts on each end that the backstays run through. Mounts are attached to the backstay with a small stainless tube slightly larger than the backstay diameter to reduce the friction wear on the backstays. I love the setup, but sometimes wish I had a fixed traveler rail that wasn't floating. [image: image.png] -- Curtis On Thu, Mar 25, 2021 at 8:38 PM Shawn Boles wrote: > Oh boy, a match race! Much more enjoyable than the obscene, but > fascinating, America's Cup races I just watched. > > Cheers, > Shawn s/v Sweet Baboo (1986/2010) > > On Thu, Mar 25, 2021, 1:49 PM Rick Lange wrote: > > > Roger, > > > > I learned to sail and race by taking a college physical education class > > over 50 years ago. I've raced dinghies through keel boats, including the > > R22, and as skipper, have a few blue flags to show for it. > > > > I accept your challenge to match race R22's with the IMF and diamond > board. > > > > I challenge you to produce the videos you said are so common > demonstrating > > using the traveller on small sloops to dump wind during gusts > > that overpower while close hauled. > > > > Regards, > > > > Rick Lange > > > > > > On Thu, Mar 25, 2021 at 2:44 PM ROGER PIHLAJA > > wrote: > > > > > Rick, > > > > > > We were having a discussion of mainsail trim and traveler use in heavy > > air > > > wherein the rig needs to be depowered in gusts and then quickly brought > > > back on line after the gust has passed. Mainsail shape for <= 10 knots > > is > > > considered light air and is a different subject. As you noted, the > > optimum > > > light air mainsail shape is achieved with a different traveler car > > position > > > and mainsheet tension vs heavy air. In light air, it is also much less > > > likely the rig will need to be depowered as per the original > discussion. > > > > > > It is beyond the scope of my job description to give tutorials on sail > > > trim in all possible conditions. I suggest you take a class or go > racing. > > > > > > Stan, > > > > > > I give up! I've tried to explain the merits of your GBI 29 Traveler to > > > the best of my ability. But, it's not working. If you want to jump > into > > > this discussion, go ahead. But, I'm done. > > > > > > Roger Pihlaja > > > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > > > > > > > > > > > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: image.png Type: image/png Size: 3456191 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: New traveller.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 128837 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Taveller end hardware.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 106100 bytes Desc: not available URL: From mm.bizlist1 at gmail.com Fri Mar 26 11:56:34 2021 From: mm.bizlist1 at gmail.com (Michael McKay) Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2021 11:56:34 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications - another alternative In-Reply-To: References: <011601d72249$f0e2ee80$d2a8cb80$@ca> <012101d7224d$97b44940$c71cdbc0$@ca> Message-ID: One last group of questions before we change the topic?I am new to my R22, but I find my traveler very ?stiff? and fairly hard to adjust without considerable physical effort. Is that normal or does it need some lubrication? How much tension should be in the traveler line? Thank you for the very informative discussion. On Fri, Mar 26, 2021 at 11:40 AM ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: > Rick, > > OK, here?s 2 books on sail trim > > Bill Gladstone, ?North U TRIM?, 6th ed, (2007), North U, Madison, CT > > ?The North U Fast Couse?, (1990), North U, Milford, CT > > Each of the above are textbooks as part of a North U sailing class and > there are companion videos under the same titles. > > Here?s 2 more videos: > > Peter Bateman, ?Sail Trimming Made Easy?, R129, Bennett Marine Video, > Marina Del Ray, CA > > ?The Shape Of Speed?, R329, Bennett Marine Video, Marina Del Ray, CA > > One thing you will note in all of these references is that the traveler is > constantly adjusted to maintain the windward/leeward helm balance. The > traveler is not a digital on/off device, it is constantly used for fine > tuning while underway. With the traveler and the tiller both under the > control of the helmsman, the Rhodes 22?s helm balance can be adjusted on > the fly better than any other boat I?ve ever experienced. The GBI 29 > Traveler has the additional advantage of having sufficient range of motion > and responsiveness to be able to depower the rig in a gust and quickly get > back on line after the gust has passed. If other boats could do it, they > would! If your GBI-29 Traveler cannot do this; then, you are using it > wrong. If you are busting your knuckles on your traveler then I can only > imagine what unspeakable act you are attempting to commit! ? > > In general, racing dingies do not have as much range of traveler movement > as our Rhodes 22?s. Since the range of movement is limited, you cannot use > the traveler to depower the main. Some keelboats also do not have > sufficient range of motion in the traveler. Some boats are limited by > their traveler design, like the 2nd generation traveler on the Rhodes 22, > which had poor ergonomics on the clam cleat placement, thus making it hard > for the helmsman to operate without leaving his preferred hiking position > on the windward gunnel. Some boats have sticky, poorly designed, &/or > placed traveler tracks, thus making it impossible for the helmsman to > constantly play with the traveler. Name the sailboats, other than the > Rhodes 22, that you?ve sailed that combine sufficient range of traveler > movement to be able to depower the rig, good ergonomics for the helmsman, > fast response, and can be operated with one hand. Off the top of my head, > I can?t think of any. Our boats are unique. > > The only Rhodes 22 I have access to is S/V Dynamic Equilibrium, a 1976 > model. How about if I spot you 10 sec/nm? > > This thread is getting really long and very old. Can we please change the > subject? > > Roger Pihlaja > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > From: Graham Stewart > Sent: Friday, March 26, 2021 10:37 AM > To: 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications - > another alternative > > Rob: No, my boat did not have anything attached to the back stays that > would > attach to a traveler. I thought that those with the end cups were specially > made. Otherwise, how were the cups attached? > > Graham Stewart > gstewart8 at cogeco.ca > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf > Of > Lowe, Rob > Sent: Friday, March 26, 2021 10:25 AM > To: 'Curtis Ruck'; 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications - > another alternative > > Graham, > My first boat was a 1976 and had the traveler bar mounted between two 'bar > end cups' that attached to the back stays. Is your boat not similarity > equipped? I don't think there was anything special about the backstays. - > Rob > > ________________________________ > From: Rhodes22-list on behalf of > Graham > Stewart > Sent: Friday, March 26, 2021 10:11 AM > To: 'Curtis Ruck' ; 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' > > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications - > another alternative > > I have been interested in the traveler discussion. My boat (1976) didn't > have a traveler when I got it and the mainsheet was simply attached to the > table base in the cockpit. My backstays are not equipped to install a > traveler and replacing the stays with new ones seemed cost prohibitive to > me. Initially I installed a traveler between the lazerette and the cockpit > seats. That worked well enough but made movement around the cockpit > awkward. > > My latest version was to mount the traveler track to a 1" stainless steel > tube and fasten that to my stern rail where it would seem to work in a > manner similar to those attached to the back stays. The rail does not flex > like the backstays would but I don't know if that is a good thing or not. > While this system seems very strong to me I am no engineer or otherwise > qualified to know. > > For those who are reluctant to pay the cost of both the backstay > replacement > plus the cost of the new traveler this arrangement might be worth > considering. > > I like that the traveler being close to the stern rail means I don't have > an > additional barrier to reaching over the stern rail to lift the motor and > that it is out of the way when sailing. I don't like the fact the it is > awkward to reach the lee traveler line. Any thought on improvements or > worries about this installation would be welcome. > > Graham Stewart > Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 > Kingston Ontario > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf > Of > Curtis Ruck via Rhodes22-list > Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2021 9:45 PM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications > > Hmm, i'll jump in and throw my two cents in, with my 1976 R22. > > When i'm racing in gusty 15+ knots... i am typically sitting on the side > rails above the seat, with one hand on the tiller extension and my other > fully gloved hand is holding the mainsheet uncleated, and i use that hand > to either let slip the mainsheet in a strong gust, or i give and take a > little with my hand holding the mainsheet from flying loose. I have a > harken 3:1 windward sheeting traveler rail mounted on the back stays. I > try to get the mainsheet as flat as possible. I would never use my > traveler to try controlling the main for gusting, holding the uncleated > mainsheet just feels natural, a little give, a little take, lets me feel > like i'm riding with the wind, and it allows instant response. Though on > long races my arms feel it. > > BTW, my traveler setup in the picture. I mounted the harken traveler rail > on a 1" OD Fiberglass tube with stainless 316 mounts on each end that the > backstays run through. Mounts are attached to the backstay with a small > stainless tube slightly larger than the backstay diameter to reduce the > friction wear on the backstays. I love the setup, but sometimes wish I had > a fixed traveler rail that wasn't floating. > > [image: image.png] > > -- > Curtis > > > On Thu, Mar 25, 2021 at 8:38 PM Shawn Boles > wrote: > > > Oh boy, a match race! Much more enjoyable than the obscene, but > > fascinating, America's Cup races I just watched. > > > > Cheers, > > Shawn s/v Sweet Baboo (1986/2010) > > > > On Thu, Mar 25, 2021, 1:49 PM Rick Lange > wrote: > > > > > Roger, > > > > > > I learned to sail and race by taking a college physical education class > > > over 50 years ago. I've raced dinghies through keel boats, including > the > > > R22, and as skipper, have a few blue flags to show for it. > > > > > > I accept your challenge to match race R22's with the IMF and diamond > > board. > > > > > > I challenge you to produce the videos you said are so common > > demonstrating > > > using the traveller on small sloops to dump wind during gusts > > > that overpower while close hauled. > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > Rick Lange > > > > > > > > > On Thu, Mar 25, 2021 at 2:44 PM ROGER PIHLAJA > > > wrote: > > > > > > > Rick, > > > > > > > > We were having a discussion of mainsail trim and traveler use in > heavy > > > air > > > > wherein the rig needs to be depowered in gusts and then quickly > brought > > > > back on line after the gust has passed. Mainsail shape for <= 10 > knots > > > is > > > > considered light air and is a different subject. As you noted, the > > > optimum > > > > light air mainsail shape is achieved with a different traveler car > > > position > > > > and mainsheet tension vs heavy air. In light air, it is also much > less > > > > likely the rig will need to be depowered as per the original > > discussion. > > > > > > > > It is beyond the scope of my job description to give tutorials on > sail > > > > trim in all possible conditions. I suggest you take a class or go > > racing. > > > > > > > > Stan, > > > > > > > > I give up! I've tried to explain the merits of your GBI 29 Traveler > to > > > > the best of my ability. But, it's not working. If you want to jump > > into > > > > this discussion, go ahead. But, I'm done. > > > > > > > > Roger Pihlaja > > > > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: image.png > Type: image/png > Size: 3456191 bytes > Desc: not available > URL: > < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210325/763bc9ee/a > ttachment.png > > > > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: New traveller.jpg > Type: image/jpeg > Size: 128837 bytes > Desc: not available > URL: > < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210326/74da184f/a > ttachment.jpg > > > > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: Taveller end hardware.jpg > Type: image/jpeg > Size: 106100 bytes > Desc: not available > URL: > < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210326/74da184f/a > ttachment-0001.jpg > > > > > -- Michael McKay (mm.bizlist1 at gmail.com) From stan at generalboats.com Fri Mar 26 12:33:27 2021 From: stan at generalboats.com (stan) Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2021 12:33:27 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications - another alternative In-Reply-To: References: <011601d72249$f0e2ee80$d2a8cb80$@ca> <012101d7224d$97b44940$c71cdbc0$@ca> Message-ID: <89cbebc0-69a9-800a-4038-698d56a0a0bc@generalboats.com> Mike, you are a member of ROC entitled to pick what is left of my grey matter: / //"Is it normal?" /NO /"does it need lubrication"/???? NO /"How much tension should be in the traveler line?" /Here is your answer.? If you don't know how to adjust the slack i your continuous control line, email me if you do not get an earlier response. stan // On 3/26/21 11:56 AM, Michael McKay wrote: > One last group of questions before we change the topic?I am new to my R22, > but I find my traveler very ?stiff? and fairly hard to adjust without > considerable physical effort. Is that normal or does it need some > lubrication? How much tension should be in the traveler line? > > Thank you for the very informative discussion. > > On Fri, Mar 26, 2021 at 11:40 AM ROGER PIHLAJA > wrote: > >> Rick, >> >> OK, here?s 2 books on sail trim >> >> Bill Gladstone, ?North U TRIM?, 6th ed, (2007), North U, Madison, CT >> >> ?The North U Fast Couse?, (1990), North U, Milford, CT >> >> Each of the above are textbooks as part of a North U sailing class and >> there are companion videos under the same titles. >> >> Here?s 2 more videos: >> >> Peter Bateman, ?Sail Trimming Made Easy?, R129, Bennett Marine Video, >> Marina Del Ray, CA >> >> ?The Shape Of Speed?, R329, Bennett Marine Video, Marina Del Ray, CA >> >> One thing you will note in all of these references is that the traveler is >> constantly adjusted to maintain the windward/leeward helm balance. The >> traveler is not a digital on/off device, it is constantly used for fine >> tuning while underway. With the traveler and the tiller both under the >> control of the helmsman, the Rhodes 22?s helm balance can be adjusted on >> the fly better than any other boat I?ve ever experienced. The GBI 29 >> Traveler has the additional advantage of having sufficient range of motion >> and responsiveness to be able to depower the rig in a gust and quickly get >> back on line after the gust has passed. If other boats could do it, they >> would! If your GBI-29 Traveler cannot do this; then, you are using it >> wrong. If you are busting your knuckles on your traveler then I can only >> imagine what unspeakable act you are attempting to commit! ? >> >> In general, racing dingies do not have as much range of traveler movement >> as our Rhodes 22?s. Since the range of movement is limited, you cannot use >> the traveler to depower the main. Some keelboats also do not have >> sufficient range of motion in the traveler. Some boats are limited by >> their traveler design, like the 2nd generation traveler on the Rhodes 22, >> which had poor ergonomics on the clam cleat placement, thus making it hard >> for the helmsman to operate without leaving his preferred hiking position >> on the windward gunnel. Some boats have sticky, poorly designed, &/or >> placed traveler tracks, thus making it impossible for the helmsman to >> constantly play with the traveler. Name the sailboats, other than the >> Rhodes 22, that you?ve sailed that combine sufficient range of traveler >> movement to be able to depower the rig, good ergonomics for the helmsman, >> fast response, and can be operated with one hand. Off the top of my head, >> I can?t think of any. Our boats are unique. >> >> The only Rhodes 22 I have access to is S/V Dynamic Equilibrium, a 1976 >> model. How about if I spot you 10 sec/nm? >> >> This thread is getting really long and very old. Can we please change the >> subject? >> >> Roger Pihlaja >> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >> >> From: Graham Stewart >> Sent: Friday, March 26, 2021 10:37 AM >> To: 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' >> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications - >> another alternative >> >> Rob: No, my boat did not have anything attached to the back stays that >> would >> attach to a traveler. I thought that those with the end cups were specially >> made. Otherwise, how were the cups attached? >> >> Graham Stewart >> gstewart8 at cogeco.ca >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf >> Of >> Lowe, Rob >> Sent: Friday, March 26, 2021 10:25 AM >> To: 'Curtis Ruck'; 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' >> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications - >> another alternative >> >> Graham, >> My first boat was a 1976 and had the traveler bar mounted between two 'bar >> end cups' that attached to the back stays. Is your boat not similarity >> equipped? I don't think there was anything special about the backstays. - >> Rob >> >> ________________________________ >> From: Rhodes22-list on behalf of >> Graham >> Stewart >> Sent: Friday, March 26, 2021 10:11 AM >> To: 'Curtis Ruck' ; 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' >> >> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications - >> another alternative >> >> I have been interested in the traveler discussion. My boat (1976) didn't >> have a traveler when I got it and the mainsheet was simply attached to the >> table base in the cockpit. My backstays are not equipped to install a >> traveler and replacing the stays with new ones seemed cost prohibitive to >> me. Initially I installed a traveler between the lazerette and the cockpit >> seats. That worked well enough but made movement around the cockpit >> awkward. >> >> My latest version was to mount the traveler track to a 1" stainless steel >> tube and fasten that to my stern rail where it would seem to work in a >> manner similar to those attached to the back stays. The rail does not flex >> like the backstays would but I don't know if that is a good thing or not. >> While this system seems very strong to me I am no engineer or otherwise >> qualified to know. >> >> For those who are reluctant to pay the cost of both the backstay >> replacement >> plus the cost of the new traveler this arrangement might be worth >> considering. >> >> I like that the traveler being close to the stern rail means I don't have >> an >> additional barrier to reaching over the stern rail to lift the motor and >> that it is out of the way when sailing. I don't like the fact the it is >> awkward to reach the lee traveler line. Any thought on improvements or >> worries about this installation would be welcome. >> >> Graham Stewart >> Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 >> Kingston Ontario >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf >> Of >> Curtis Ruck via Rhodes22-list >> Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2021 9:45 PM >> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List >> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications >> >> Hmm, i'll jump in and throw my two cents in, with my 1976 R22. >> >> When i'm racing in gusty 15+ knots... i am typically sitting on the side >> rails above the seat, with one hand on the tiller extension and my other >> fully gloved hand is holding the mainsheet uncleated, and i use that hand >> to either let slip the mainsheet in a strong gust, or i give and take a >> little with my hand holding the mainsheet from flying loose. I have a >> harken 3:1 windward sheeting traveler rail mounted on the back stays. I >> try to get the mainsheet as flat as possible. I would never use my >> traveler to try controlling the main for gusting, holding the uncleated >> mainsheet just feels natural, a little give, a little take, lets me feel >> like i'm riding with the wind, and it allows instant response. Though on >> long races my arms feel it. >> >> BTW, my traveler setup in the picture. I mounted the harken traveler rail >> on a 1" OD Fiberglass tube with stainless 316 mounts on each end that the >> backstays run through. Mounts are attached to the backstay with a small >> stainless tube slightly larger than the backstay diameter to reduce the >> friction wear on the backstays. I love the setup, but sometimes wish I had >> a fixed traveler rail that wasn't floating. >> >> [image: image.png] >> >> -- >> Curtis >> >> >> On Thu, Mar 25, 2021 at 8:38 PM Shawn Boles >> wrote: >> >>> Oh boy, a match race! Much more enjoyable than the obscene, but >>> fascinating, America's Cup races I just watched. >>> >>> Cheers, >>> Shawn s/v Sweet Baboo (1986/2010) >>> >>> On Thu, Mar 25, 2021, 1:49 PM Rick Lange >> wrote: >>>> Roger, >>>> >>>> I learned to sail and race by taking a college physical education class >>>> over 50 years ago. I've raced dinghies through keel boats, including >> the >>>> R22, and as skipper, have a few blue flags to show for it. >>>> >>>> I accept your challenge to match race R22's with the IMF and diamond >>> board. >>>> I challenge you to produce the videos you said are so common >>> demonstrating >>>> using the traveller on small sloops to dump wind during gusts >>>> that overpower while close hauled. >>>> >>>> Regards, >>>> >>>> Rick Lange >>>> >>>> >>>> On Thu, Mar 25, 2021 at 2:44 PM ROGER PIHLAJA >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Rick, >>>>> >>>>> We were having a discussion of mainsail trim and traveler use in >> heavy >>>> air >>>>> wherein the rig needs to be depowered in gusts and then quickly >> brought >>>>> back on line after the gust has passed. Mainsail shape for <= 10 >> knots >>>> is >>>>> considered light air and is a different subject. As you noted, the >>>> optimum >>>>> light air mainsail shape is achieved with a different traveler car >>>> position >>>>> and mainsheet tension vs heavy air. In light air, it is also much >> less >>>>> likely the rig will need to be depowered as per the original >>> discussion. >>>>> It is beyond the scope of my job description to give tutorials on >> sail >>>>> trim in all possible conditions. I suggest you take a class or go >>> racing. >>>>> Stan, >>>>> >>>>> I give up! I've tried to explain the merits of your GBI 29 Traveler >> to >>>>> the best of my ability. But, it's not working. If you want to jump >>> into >>>>> this discussion, go ahead. But, I'm done. >>>>> >>>>> Roger Pihlaja >>>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >> -------------- next part -------------- >> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... >> Name: image.png >> Type: image/png >> Size: 3456191 bytes >> Desc: not available >> URL: >> < >> http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210325/763bc9ee/a >> ttachment.png >> >> -------------- next part -------------- >> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... >> Name: New traveller.jpg >> Type: image/jpeg >> Size: 128837 bytes >> Desc: not available >> URL: >> < >> http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210326/74da184f/a >> ttachment.jpg >> >> -------------- next part -------------- >> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... >> Name: Taveller end hardware.jpg >> Type: image/jpeg >> Size: 106100 bytes >> Desc: not available >> URL: >> < >> http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210326/74da184f/a >> ttachment-0001.jpg >> >> -- > Michael McKay (mm.bizlist1 at gmail.com) From roger_pihlaja at msn.com Fri Mar 26 12:50:03 2021 From: roger_pihlaja at msn.com (ROGER PIHLAJA) Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2021 16:50:03 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications - another alternative In-Reply-To: References: <011601d72249$f0e2ee80$d2a8cb80$@ca> <012101d7224d$97b44940$c71cdbc0$@ca> , Message-ID: Michael, OK, last response for me on this topic I assume you are pushing/pulling on the correct part of the control line tackle, the part with the mechanical advantage? You use the clam cleat to set the tension in the control line. Less tension = easier movement but also a lower mainsheet force threshold before the traveler car starts to slide along the bar to leeward. The tension must be set high enough; that, the traveler car does not move along the bar under ?normal? mainsheet force. Your tolerance for risk will determine how much you go beyond that minimum. It?s something that is best determined out on the water. If the traveler car is slipping under conditions you think are normal; then, increase the control line tension. We have our control line tension set pretty high. Once you have set the control line tension, cleat off the line and leave it alone. You normally only push/pull on the control line to move the traveler. If you find the traveler car is hard to adjust even with mechanical advantage; then, I would take a look inside the traveler car and turning blocks to see if there?s something stuck/broken/crudded up in there. Stan, correct me if I?m wrong; but, I don?t think it needs to be lubricated. I think it helps to keep the traveler bar bright and shiny. But, this might be just my preferences as a chemical engineer. Chemical engineers are irresistibly drawn to bright, shiny, polished alloy steel equipment! I sail on fresh water and my traveler hasn?t needed any attention, other than external cleaning, for 3 years. If you sail on salt water, the traveler might need more maintenance, just like all the other running rigging on your boat. If all this fails to make your GBI 29 Traveler move more easily; then, I?m stuck and defer to Stan. I suppose it?s possible there could be a manufacturing defect. Roger Pihlaja S/V Dynamic Equilibrium Sent from Mail for Windows 10 From: Michael McKay Sent: Friday, March 26, 2021 11:56 AM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications - another alternative One last group of questions before we change the topic?I am new to my R22, but I find my traveler very ?stiff? and fairly hard to adjust without considerable physical effort. Is that normal or does it need some lubrication? How much tension should be in the traveler line? Thank you for the very informative discussion. On Fri, Mar 26, 2021 at 11:40 AM ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: > Rick, > > OK, here?s 2 books on sail trim > > Bill Gladstone, ?North U TRIM?, 6th ed, (2007), North U, Madison, CT > > ?The North U Fast Couse?, (1990), North U, Milford, CT > > Each of the above are textbooks as part of a North U sailing class and > there are companion videos under the same titles. > > Here?s 2 more videos: > > Peter Bateman, ?Sail Trimming Made Easy?, R129, Bennett Marine Video, > Marina Del Ray, CA > > ?The Shape Of Speed?, R329, Bennett Marine Video, Marina Del Ray, CA > > One thing you will note in all of these references is that the traveler is > constantly adjusted to maintain the windward/leeward helm balance. The > traveler is not a digital on/off device, it is constantly used for fine > tuning while underway. With the traveler and the tiller both under the > control of the helmsman, the Rhodes 22?s helm balance can be adjusted on > the fly better than any other boat I?ve ever experienced. The GBI 29 > Traveler has the additional advantage of having sufficient range of motion > and responsiveness to be able to depower the rig in a gust and quickly get > back on line after the gust has passed. If other boats could do it, they > would! If your GBI-29 Traveler cannot do this; then, you are using it > wrong. If you are busting your knuckles on your traveler then I can only > imagine what unspeakable act you are attempting to commit! ? > > In general, racing dingies do not have as much range of traveler movement > as our Rhodes 22?s. Since the range of movement is limited, you cannot use > the traveler to depower the main. Some keelboats also do not have > sufficient range of motion in the traveler. Some boats are limited by > their traveler design, like the 2nd generation traveler on the Rhodes 22, > which had poor ergonomics on the clam cleat placement, thus making it hard > for the helmsman to operate without leaving his preferred hiking position > on the windward gunnel. Some boats have sticky, poorly designed, &/or > placed traveler tracks, thus making it impossible for the helmsman to > constantly play with the traveler. Name the sailboats, other than the > Rhodes 22, that you?ve sailed that combine sufficient range of traveler > movement to be able to depower the rig, good ergonomics for the helmsman, > fast response, and can be operated with one hand. Off the top of my head, > I can?t think of any. Our boats are unique. > > The only Rhodes 22 I have access to is S/V Dynamic Equilibrium, a 1976 > model. How about if I spot you 10 sec/nm? > > This thread is getting really long and very old. Can we please change the > subject? > > Roger Pihlaja > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > From: Graham Stewart > Sent: Friday, March 26, 2021 10:37 AM > To: 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications - > another alternative > > Rob: No, my boat did not have anything attached to the back stays that > would > attach to a traveler. I thought that those with the end cups were specially > made. Otherwise, how were the cups attached? > > Graham Stewart > gstewart8 at cogeco.ca > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf > Of > Lowe, Rob > Sent: Friday, March 26, 2021 10:25 AM > To: 'Curtis Ruck'; 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications - > another alternative > > Graham, > My first boat was a 1976 and had the traveler bar mounted between two 'bar > end cups' that attached to the back stays. Is your boat not similarity > equipped? I don't think there was anything special about the backstays. - > Rob > > ________________________________ > From: Rhodes22-list on behalf of > Graham > Stewart > Sent: Friday, March 26, 2021 10:11 AM > To: 'Curtis Ruck' ; 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' > > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications - > another alternative > > I have been interested in the traveler discussion. My boat (1976) didn't > have a traveler when I got it and the mainsheet was simply attached to the > table base in the cockpit. My backstays are not equipped to install a > traveler and replacing the stays with new ones seemed cost prohibitive to > me. Initially I installed a traveler between the lazerette and the cockpit > seats. That worked well enough but made movement around the cockpit > awkward. > > My latest version was to mount the traveler track to a 1" stainless steel > tube and fasten that to my stern rail where it would seem to work in a > manner similar to those attached to the back stays. The rail does not flex > like the backstays would but I don't know if that is a good thing or not. > While this system seems very strong to me I am no engineer or otherwise > qualified to know. > > For those who are reluctant to pay the cost of both the backstay > replacement > plus the cost of the new traveler this arrangement might be worth > considering. > > I like that the traveler being close to the stern rail means I don't have > an > additional barrier to reaching over the stern rail to lift the motor and > that it is out of the way when sailing. I don't like the fact the it is > awkward to reach the lee traveler line. Any thought on improvements or > worries about this installation would be welcome. > > Graham Stewart > Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 > Kingston Ontario > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf > Of > Curtis Ruck via Rhodes22-list > Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2021 9:45 PM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications > > Hmm, i'll jump in and throw my two cents in, with my 1976 R22. > > When i'm racing in gusty 15+ knots... i am typically sitting on the side > rails above the seat, with one hand on the tiller extension and my other > fully gloved hand is holding the mainsheet uncleated, and i use that hand > to either let slip the mainsheet in a strong gust, or i give and take a > little with my hand holding the mainsheet from flying loose. I have a > harken 3:1 windward sheeting traveler rail mounted on the back stays. I > try to get the mainsheet as flat as possible. I would never use my > traveler to try controlling the main for gusting, holding the uncleated > mainsheet just feels natural, a little give, a little take, lets me feel > like i'm riding with the wind, and it allows instant response. Though on > long races my arms feel it. > > BTW, my traveler setup in the picture. I mounted the harken traveler rail > on a 1" OD Fiberglass tube with stainless 316 mounts on each end that the > backstays run through. Mounts are attached to the backstay with a small > stainless tube slightly larger than the backstay diameter to reduce the > friction wear on the backstays. I love the setup, but sometimes wish I had > a fixed traveler rail that wasn't floating. > > [image: image.png] > > -- > Curtis > > > On Thu, Mar 25, 2021 at 8:38 PM Shawn Boles > wrote: > > > Oh boy, a match race! Much more enjoyable than the obscene, but > > fascinating, America's Cup races I just watched. > > > > Cheers, > > Shawn s/v Sweet Baboo (1986/2010) > > > > On Thu, Mar 25, 2021, 1:49 PM Rick Lange > wrote: > > > > > Roger, > > > > > > I learned to sail and race by taking a college physical education class > > > over 50 years ago. I've raced dinghies through keel boats, including > the > > > R22, and as skipper, have a few blue flags to show for it. > > > > > > I accept your challenge to match race R22's with the IMF and diamond > > board. > > > > > > I challenge you to produce the videos you said are so common > > demonstrating > > > using the traveller on small sloops to dump wind during gusts > > > that overpower while close hauled. > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > Rick Lange > > > > > > > > > On Thu, Mar 25, 2021 at 2:44 PM ROGER PIHLAJA > > > wrote: > > > > > > > Rick, > > > > > > > > We were having a discussion of mainsail trim and traveler use in > heavy > > > air > > > > wherein the rig needs to be depowered in gusts and then quickly > brought > > > > back on line after the gust has passed. Mainsail shape for <= 10 > knots > > > is > > > > considered light air and is a different subject. As you noted, the > > > optimum > > > > light air mainsail shape is achieved with a different traveler car > > > position > > > > and mainsheet tension vs heavy air. In light air, it is also much > less > > > > likely the rig will need to be depowered as per the original > > discussion. > > > > > > > > It is beyond the scope of my job description to give tutorials on > sail > > > > trim in all possible conditions. I suggest you take a class or go > > racing. > > > > > > > > Stan, > > > > > > > > I give up! I've tried to explain the merits of your GBI 29 Traveler > to > > > > the best of my ability. But, it's not working. If you want to jump > > into > > > > this discussion, go ahead. But, I'm done. > > > > > > > > Roger Pihlaja > > > > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: image.png > Type: image/png > Size: 3456191 bytes > Desc: not available > URL: > < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210325/763bc9ee/a > ttachment.png > > > > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: New traveller.jpg > Type: image/jpeg > Size: 128837 bytes > Desc: not available > URL: > < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210326/74da184f/a > ttachment.jpg > > > > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: Taveller end hardware.jpg > Type: image/jpeg > Size: 106100 bytes > Desc: not available > URL: > < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210326/74da184f/a > ttachment-0001.jpg > > > > > -- Michael McKay (mm.bizlist1 at gmail.com) From roger_pihlaja at msn.com Fri Mar 26 13:13:58 2021 From: roger_pihlaja at msn.com (ROGER PIHLAJA) Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2021 17:13:58 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications - another alternative In-Reply-To: <012101d7224d$97b44940$c71cdbc0$@ca> References: <011601d72249$f0e2ee80$d2a8cb80$@ca> , <012101d7224d$97b44940$c71cdbc0$@ca> Message-ID: Graham, S/V Dynamic Equilibrium needed a new backstay at the time anyway. So, I took the opportunity to order a new double backstay assembly from GBI with the traveler bar sockets attached. The traveler bar sockets are simply pieces of 1-1/4? OD X 0.120? Wall Thickness (1.010? ID) X 2? Long 316 SS seamless tubing that have been drilled for the backstay cable and fast pin. Assuming you either order the sockets from Stan or build them yourself, the backstays could be assembled by any competent rigging shop. Remember, you would also need the blocks for the backstay adjuster if you a building a new backstay. Roger Pihlaja S/V Dynamic Equilibrium Sent from Mail for Windows 10 From: Graham Stewart Sent: Friday, March 26, 2021 10:37 AM To: 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications - another alternative Rob: No, my boat did not have anything attached to the back stays that would attach to a traveler. I thought that those with the end cups were specially made. Otherwise, how were the cups attached? Graham Stewart gstewart8 at cogeco.ca -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf Of Lowe, Rob Sent: Friday, March 26, 2021 10:25 AM To: 'Curtis Ruck'; 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications - another alternative Graham, My first boat was a 1976 and had the traveler bar mounted between two 'bar end cups' that attached to the back stays. Is your boat not similarity equipped? I don't think there was anything special about the backstays. - Rob ________________________________ From: Rhodes22-list on behalf of Graham Stewart Sent: Friday, March 26, 2021 10:11 AM To: 'Curtis Ruck' ; 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications - another alternative I have been interested in the traveler discussion. My boat (1976) didn't have a traveler when I got it and the mainsheet was simply attached to the table base in the cockpit. My backstays are not equipped to install a traveler and replacing the stays with new ones seemed cost prohibitive to me. Initially I installed a traveler between the lazerette and the cockpit seats. That worked well enough but made movement around the cockpit awkward. My latest version was to mount the traveler track to a 1" stainless steel tube and fasten that to my stern rail where it would seem to work in a manner similar to those attached to the back stays. The rail does not flex like the backstays would but I don't know if that is a good thing or not. While this system seems very strong to me I am no engineer or otherwise qualified to know. For those who are reluctant to pay the cost of both the backstay replacement plus the cost of the new traveler this arrangement might be worth considering. I like that the traveler being close to the stern rail means I don't have an additional barrier to reaching over the stern rail to lift the motor and that it is out of the way when sailing. I don't like the fact the it is awkward to reach the lee traveler line. Any thought on improvements or worries about this installation would be welcome. Graham Stewart Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 Kingston Ontario -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf Of Curtis Ruck via Rhodes22-list Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2021 9:45 PM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications Hmm, i'll jump in and throw my two cents in, with my 1976 R22. When i'm racing in gusty 15+ knots... i am typically sitting on the side rails above the seat, with one hand on the tiller extension and my other fully gloved hand is holding the mainsheet uncleated, and i use that hand to either let slip the mainsheet in a strong gust, or i give and take a little with my hand holding the mainsheet from flying loose. I have a harken 3:1 windward sheeting traveler rail mounted on the back stays. I try to get the mainsheet as flat as possible. I would never use my traveler to try controlling the main for gusting, holding the uncleated mainsheet just feels natural, a little give, a little take, lets me feel like i'm riding with the wind, and it allows instant response. Though on long races my arms feel it. BTW, my traveler setup in the picture. I mounted the harken traveler rail on a 1" OD Fiberglass tube with stainless 316 mounts on each end that the backstays run through. Mounts are attached to the backstay with a small stainless tube slightly larger than the backstay diameter to reduce the friction wear on the backstays. I love the setup, but sometimes wish I had a fixed traveler rail that wasn't floating. [image: image.png] -- Curtis On Thu, Mar 25, 2021 at 8:38 PM Shawn Boles wrote: > Oh boy, a match race! Much more enjoyable than the obscene, but > fascinating, America's Cup races I just watched. > > Cheers, > Shawn s/v Sweet Baboo (1986/2010) > > On Thu, Mar 25, 2021, 1:49 PM Rick Lange wrote: > > > Roger, > > > > I learned to sail and race by taking a college physical education class > > over 50 years ago. I've raced dinghies through keel boats, including the > > R22, and as skipper, have a few blue flags to show for it. > > > > I accept your challenge to match race R22's with the IMF and diamond > board. > > > > I challenge you to produce the videos you said are so common > demonstrating > > using the traveller on small sloops to dump wind during gusts > > that overpower while close hauled. > > > > Regards, > > > > Rick Lange > > > > > > On Thu, Mar 25, 2021 at 2:44 PM ROGER PIHLAJA > > wrote: > > > > > Rick, > > > > > > We were having a discussion of mainsail trim and traveler use in heavy > > air > > > wherein the rig needs to be depowered in gusts and then quickly brought > > > back on line after the gust has passed. Mainsail shape for <= 10 knots > > is > > > considered light air and is a different subject. As you noted, the > > optimum > > > light air mainsail shape is achieved with a different traveler car > > position > > > and mainsheet tension vs heavy air. In light air, it is also much less > > > likely the rig will need to be depowered as per the original > discussion. > > > > > > It is beyond the scope of my job description to give tutorials on sail > > > trim in all possible conditions. I suggest you take a class or go > racing. > > > > > > Stan, > > > > > > I give up! I've tried to explain the merits of your GBI 29 Traveler to > > > the best of my ability. But, it's not working. If you want to jump > into > > > this discussion, go ahead. But, I'm done. > > > > > > Roger Pihlaja > > > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > > > > > > > > > > > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: image.png Type: image/png Size: 3456191 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: New traveller.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 128837 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Taveller end hardware.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 106100 bytes Desc: not available URL: From gstewart8 at cogeco.ca Fri Mar 26 14:33:14 2021 From: gstewart8 at cogeco.ca (Graham Stewart) Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2021 14:33:14 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications - another alternative In-Reply-To: References: <011601d72249$f0e2ee80$d2a8cb80$@ca> Message-ID: <014601d7226e$7d48d0f0$77da72d0$@ca> Hank: The ability of the stern rail to hold the load was something I was wondering about as well. I thought the whole stern rail might come off the first time I had a major jibe but so far so good. I have heaved on the rail with my full weight and it doesn't budge oo even flex and I thought that stainless tubing should be at least as strong as rigging but the fact that it doesn't flex might be the weak point. Graham Stewart Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 Kingston Ontario -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf Of Hank Sent: Friday, March 26, 2021 10:20 AM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications - another alternative Graham, So is your mainsheet basically connected to the boat through the stern rails? Normally, travellers are attached to something a bit more substantial as railing mounts are generally not that strong or designed to hold a load in that direction. Just something to think about. Hank On Fri, Mar 26, 2021 at 10:11 AM Graham Stewart wrote: > I have been interested in the traveler discussion. My boat (1976) didn't > have a traveler when I got it and the mainsheet was simply attached to the > table base in the cockpit. My backstays are not equipped to install a > traveler and replacing the stays with new ones seemed cost prohibitive to > me. Initially I installed a traveler between the lazerette and the cockpit > seats. That worked well enough but made movement around the cockpit > awkward. > > My latest version was to mount the traveler track to a 1" stainless steel > tube and fasten that to my stern rail where it would seem to work in a > manner similar to those attached to the back stays. The rail does not flex > like the backstays would but I don't know if that is a good thing or not. > While this system seems very strong to me I am no engineer or otherwise > qualified to know. > > For those who are reluctant to pay the cost of both the backstay > replacement plus the cost of the new traveler this arrangement might be > worth considering. > > I like that the traveler being close to the stern rail means I don't have > an additional barrier to reaching over the stern rail to lift the motor and > that it is out of the way when sailing. I don't like the fact the it is > awkward to reach the lee traveler line. Any thought on improvements or > worries about this installation would be welcome. > > Graham Stewart > Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 > Kingston Ontario > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf > Of Curtis Ruck via Rhodes22-list > Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2021 9:45 PM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications > > Hmm, i'll jump in and throw my two cents in, with my 1976 R22. > > When i'm racing in gusty 15+ knots... i am typically sitting on the side > rails above the seat, with one hand on the tiller extension and my other > fully gloved hand is holding the mainsheet uncleated, and i use that hand > to either let slip the mainsheet in a strong gust, or i give and take a > little with my hand holding the mainsheet from flying loose. I have a > harken 3:1 windward sheeting traveler rail mounted on the back stays. I > try to get the mainsheet as flat as possible. I would never use my > traveler to try controlling the main for gusting, holding the uncleated > mainsheet just feels natural, a little give, a little take, lets me feel > like i'm riding with the wind, and it allows instant response. Though on > long races my arms feel it. > > BTW, my traveler setup in the picture. I mounted the harken traveler rail > on a 1" OD Fiberglass tube with stainless 316 mounts on each end that the > backstays run through. Mounts are attached to the backstay with a small > stainless tube slightly larger than the backstay diameter to reduce the > friction wear on the backstays. I love the setup, but sometimes wish I had > a fixed traveler rail that wasn't floating. > > [image: image.png] > > -- > Curtis > > > On Thu, Mar 25, 2021 at 8:38 PM Shawn Boles > wrote: > > > Oh boy, a match race! Much more enjoyable than the obscene, but > > fascinating, America's Cup races I just watched. > > > > Cheers, > > Shawn s/v Sweet Baboo (1986/2010) > > > > On Thu, Mar 25, 2021, 1:49 PM Rick Lange > wrote: > > > > > Roger, > > > > > > I learned to sail and race by taking a college physical education class > > > over 50 years ago. I've raced dinghies through keel boats, including > the > > > R22, and as skipper, have a few blue flags to show for it. > > > > > > I accept your challenge to match race R22's with the IMF and diamond > > board. > > > > > > I challenge you to produce the videos you said are so common > > demonstrating > > > using the traveller on small sloops to dump wind during gusts > > > that overpower while close hauled. > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > Rick Lange > > > > > > > > > On Thu, Mar 25, 2021 at 2:44 PM ROGER PIHLAJA > > > wrote: > > > > > > > Rick, > > > > > > > > We were having a discussion of mainsail trim and traveler use in > heavy > > > air > > > > wherein the rig needs to be depowered in gusts and then quickly > brought > > > > back on line after the gust has passed. Mainsail shape for <= 10 > knots > > > is > > > > considered light air and is a different subject. As you noted, the > > > optimum > > > > light air mainsail shape is achieved with a different traveler car > > > position > > > > and mainsheet tension vs heavy air. In light air, it is also much > less > > > > likely the rig will need to be depowered as per the original > > discussion. > > > > > > > > It is beyond the scope of my job description to give tutorials on > sail > > > > trim in all possible conditions. I suggest you take a class or go > > racing. > > > > > > > > Stan, > > > > > > > > I give up! I?ve tried to explain the merits of your GBI 29 Traveler > to > > > > the best of my ability. But, it?s not working. If you want to jump > > into > > > > this discussion, go ahead. But, I?m done. > > > > > > > > Roger Pihlaja > > > > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: image.png > Type: image/png > Size: 3456191 bytes > Desc: not available > URL: < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210325/763bc9ee/attachment.png > > > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: New traveller.jpg > Type: image/jpeg > Size: 128837 bytes > Desc: not available > URL: < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210326/74da184f/attachment.jpg > > > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: Taveller end hardware.jpg > Type: image/jpeg > Size: 106100 bytes > Desc: not available > URL: < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210326/74da184f/attachment-0001.jpg > > > From jeffsmithphoto at gmail.com Sat Mar 27 06:31:43 2021 From: jeffsmithphoto at gmail.com (JeffSmith) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2021 03:31:43 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications In-Reply-To: References: <1616623551671-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616627141536-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616627861562-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <1616841103874-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Roger, I was referring to the 3 athwartship jib lead positions. I have been using the adjustable block on the track for my lead. ----- Jeff Smith 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor Atlantic Highlands, NJ -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From ric at stottarchitecture.com Sat Mar 27 07:17:54 2021 From: ric at stottarchitecture.com (Ric Stott) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2021 07:17:54 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications In-Reply-To: <1616841103874-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1616841103874-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: I?ve seen other Rhodes with the traveler attached to the stern rail. It?s a compelling idea. My GBI 29 that I purchased from Stan about 7 years ago does a fairly good job but I?m in and out of the boat from the stern ladder often and it?s always in the way. I designed and built a couple of Delrin connectors with fast pins so I can remove one or both ends of the traveler and swing it out of the way or remove it. I have a spare pair of bar ends and the drawing I made to create them if anyone is interested. My stern rail has a kink in it from a crash my father had 25 years ago. I also want to add a passage in the rail at the ladder which will make using the stern ladder much easier. The newer 1? stern rails with the curves for the helm chairs are a big improvement over the older 7/8 tube like mine. If I upgrade my stern rail I might consider attaching a Harken or equal traveler to it. Then it?s out of the way for the ladder and operation the outboard. Stan is a genius and the boat is a blessing to own. I?m proud of my boat and the organization. Sail on. Ric Dadventure. Sent from my iPhone > On Mar 27, 2021, at 6:31 AM, JeffSmith wrote: > > ?Roger, > I was referring to the 3 athwartship jib lead positions. I have been using > the adjustable block on the track for my lead. > > > > ----- > Jeff Smith > 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT > Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor > Atlantic Highlands, NJ > > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From goldsmith.cf at gmail.com Sat Mar 27 07:52:46 2021 From: goldsmith.cf at gmail.com (Frank Goldsmith) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2021 07:52:46 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications In-Reply-To: References: <1616841103874-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <931EC1C8-0008-45EB-9D93-0F0622F17B72@gmail.com> Ric, I would be interested in seeing your design that lets you swing the traveler out of the way of the stern boarding ladder. Sounds like a good idea. Frank s/v Mary Bess Lake Keowee, SC > On Mar 27, 2021, at 7:17 AM, Ric Stott wrote: > > I?ve seen other Rhodes with the traveler attached to the stern rail. It?s a compelling idea. My GBI 29 that I purchased from Stan about 7 years ago does a fairly good job but I?m in and out of the boat from the stern ladder often and it?s always in the way. > I designed and built a couple of Delrin connectors with fast pins so I can remove one or both ends of the traveler and swing it out of the way or remove it. I have a spare pair of bar ends and the drawing I made to create them if anyone is interested. My stern rail has a kink in it from a crash my father had 25 years ago. I also want to add a passage in the rail at the ladder which will make using the stern ladder much easier. The newer 1? stern rails with the curves for the helm chairs are a big improvement over the older 7/8 tube like mine. If I upgrade my stern rail I might consider attaching a Harken or equal traveler to it. Then it?s out of the way for the ladder and operation the outboard. > Stan is a genius and the boat is a blessing to own. I?m proud of my boat and the organization. > Sail on. > Ric > Dadventure. > > Sent from my iPhone > >> On Mar 27, 2021, at 6:31 AM, JeffSmith wrote: >> >> ?Roger, >> I was referring to the 3 athwartship jib lead positions. I have been using >> the adjustable block on the track for my lead. >> >> >> >> ----- >> Jeff Smith >> 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT >> Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor >> Atlantic Highlands, NJ >> >> -- >> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From roger_pihlaja at msn.com Sat Mar 27 08:13:40 2021 From: roger_pihlaja at msn.com (ROGER PIHLAJA) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2021 12:13:40 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications In-Reply-To: <1616841103874-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1616623551671-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616627141536-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616627861562-0.post@n5.nabble.com> , <1616841103874-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: Jeff, I think your boat must have an option mine doesn?t have. All I have are the genoa tracks. Tell me more about these athwartships jib lead positions. Roger Pihlaja S/V Dynamic Equilibrium Sent from Mail for Windows 10 From: JeffSmith Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2021 6:31 AM To: rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications Roger, I was referring to the 3 athwartship jib lead positions. I have been using the adjustable block on the track for my lead. ----- Jeff Smith 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor Atlantic Highlands, NJ -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From gstewart8 at cogeco.ca Sat Mar 27 09:06:56 2021 From: gstewart8 at cogeco.ca (Graham Stewart) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2021 09:06:56 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications In-Reply-To: References: <1616841103874-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <017801d7230a$1209b470$361d1d50$@ca> Rick: I am interested in seeing your drawings. Graham Stewart Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 Kingston Ontario -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf Of Ric Stott Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2021 7:18 AM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications I?ve seen other Rhodes with the traveler attached to the stern rail. It?s a compelling idea. My GBI 29 that I purchased from Stan about 7 years ago does a fairly good job but I?m in and out of the boat from the stern ladder often and it?s always in the way. I designed and built a couple of Delrin connectors with fast pins so I can remove one or both ends of the traveler and swing it out of the way or remove it. I have a spare pair of bar ends and the drawing I made to create them if anyone is interested. My stern rail has a kink in it from a crash my father had 25 years ago. I also want to add a passage in the rail at the ladder which will make using the stern ladder much easier. The newer 1? stern rails with the curves for the helm chairs are a big improvement over the older 7/8 tube like mine. If I upgrade my stern rail I might consider attaching a Harken or equal traveler to it. Then it?s out of the way for the ladder and operation the outboard. Stan is a genius and the boat is a blessing to own. I?m proud of my boat and the organization. Sail on. Ric Dadventure. Sent from my iPhone > On Mar 27, 2021, at 6:31 AM, JeffSmith wrote: > > ?Roger, > I was referring to the 3 athwartship jib lead positions. I have been using > the adjustable block on the track for my lead. > > > > ----- > Jeff Smith > 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT > Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor > Atlantic Highlands, NJ > > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From forg3d at gmail.com Sat Mar 27 09:18:27 2021 From: forg3d at gmail.com (Jeffrey Camiel) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2021 08:18:27 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications In-Reply-To: References: <1616841103874-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <600835DD-2794-4F60-B9B1-8149AFD3D0CB@gmail.com> definitely interested in see your drawings. > On Mar 27, 2021, at 6:17 AM, Ric Stott wrote: > > I?ve seen other Rhodes with the traveler attached to the stern rail. It?s a compelling idea. My GBI 29 that I purchased from Stan about 7 years ago does a fairly good job but I?m in and out of the boat from the stern ladder often and it?s always in the way. > I designed and built a couple of Delrin connectors with fast pins so I can remove one or both ends of the traveler and swing it out of the way or remove it. I have a spare pair of bar ends and the drawing I made to create them if anyone is interested. My stern rail has a kink in it from a crash my father had 25 years ago. I also want to add a passage in the rail at the ladder which will make using the stern ladder much easier. The newer 1? stern rails with the curves for the helm chairs are a big improvement over the older 7/8 tube like mine. If I upgrade my stern rail I might consider attaching a Harken or equal traveler to it. Then it?s out of the way for the ladder and operation the outboard. > Stan is a genius and the boat is a blessing to own. I?m proud of my boat and the organization. > Sail on. > Ric > Dadventure. > > Sent from my iPhone > >> On Mar 27, 2021, at 6:31 AM, JeffSmith wrote: >> >> ?Roger, >> I was referring to the 3 athwartship jib lead positions. I have been using >> the adjustable block on the track for my lead. >> >> >> >> ----- >> Jeff Smith >> 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT >> Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor >> Atlantic Highlands, NJ >> >> -- >> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From ric at stottarchitecture.com Sat Mar 27 09:47:50 2021 From: ric at stottarchitecture.com (Ric Stott) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2021 09:47:50 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications In-Reply-To: <600835DD-2794-4F60-B9B1-8149AFD3D0CB@gmail.com> References: <1616841103874-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <600835DD-2794-4F60-B9B1-8149AFD3D0CB@gmail.com> Message-ID: It might take me a few days to dig them up. I?m super busy - moving office. But close by. Ric Richard Stott, AIA, LEED AP www.stottarchitecture.com Office 631-283-1777 Cell 516-965-3164 > On Mar 27, 2021, at 9:18 AM, Jeffrey Camiel wrote: > > definitely interested in see your drawings. > >> On Mar 27, 2021, at 6:17 AM, Ric Stott wrote: >> >> I?ve seen other Rhodes with the traveler attached to the stern rail. It?s a compelling idea. My GBI 29 that I purchased from Stan about 7 years ago does a fairly good job but I?m in and out of the boat from the stern ladder often and it?s always in the way. >> I designed and built a couple of Delrin connectors with fast pins so I can remove one or both ends of the traveler and swing it out of the way or remove it. I have a spare pair of bar ends and the drawing I made to create them if anyone is interested. My stern rail has a kink in it from a crash my father had 25 years ago. I also want to add a passage in the rail at the ladder which will make using the stern ladder much easier. The newer 1? stern rails with the curves for the helm chairs are a big improvement over the older 7/8 tube like mine. If I upgrade my stern rail I might consider attaching a Harken or equal traveler to it. Then it?s out of the way for the ladder and operation the outboard. >> Stan is a genius and the boat is a blessing to own. I?m proud of my boat and the organization. >> Sail on. >> Ric >> Dadventure. >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >>> On Mar 27, 2021, at 6:31 AM, JeffSmith wrote: >>> >>> ?Roger, >>> I was referring to the 3 athwartship jib lead positions. I have been using >>> the adjustable block on the track for my lead. >>> >>> >>> >>> ----- >>> Jeff Smith >>> 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT >>> Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor >>> Atlantic Highlands, NJ >>> >>> -- >>> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > From jeffsmithphoto at gmail.com Sat Mar 27 10:00:07 2021 From: jeffsmithphoto at gmail.com (JeffSmith) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2021 07:00:07 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications In-Reply-To: References: <1616623551671-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616627141536-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616627861562-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616841103874-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <1616853607667-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Roger, Here are the two additional jib leads in from the main track. ----- Jeff Smith 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor Atlantic Highlands, NJ -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From mweisner at ebsmed.com Sat Mar 27 10:04:21 2021 From: mweisner at ebsmed.com (Michael D. Weisner) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2021 10:04:21 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications In-Reply-To: <1616853607667-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1616623551671-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616627141536-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616627861562-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616841103874-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616853607667-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <009101d72312$16cee400$446cac00$@ebsmed.com> Jeff, I believe the cabin top cleat is used for the jib furling line. Mike s/v Wind Lass ('91) Nissequogue River, NY -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of JeffSmith Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2021 10:00 AM To: rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications Roger, Here are the two additional jib leads in from the main track. ----- Jeff Smith 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor Atlantic Highlands, NJ -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From goldsmith.cf at gmail.com Sat Mar 27 10:05:31 2021 From: goldsmith.cf at gmail.com (Frank Goldsmith) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2021 10:05:31 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications In-Reply-To: <009101d72312$16cee400$446cac00$@ebsmed.com> References: <1616623551671-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616627141536-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616627861562-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616841103874-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616853607667-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <009101d72312$16cee400$446cac00$@ebsmed.com> Message-ID: Yes, at least that?s what I use it for, and how I was taught. Frank > On Mar 27, 2021, at 10:04 AM, Michael D. Weisner wrote: > > Jeff, > > I believe the cabin top cleat is used for the jib furling line. > > Mike > s/v Wind Lass ('91) > Nissequogue River, NY > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of > JeffSmith > Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2021 10:00 AM > To: rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications > > Roger, > Here are the two additional jib leads in from the main track. > > > > > > > > > ----- > Jeff Smith > 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT > Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor > Atlantic Highlands, NJ > > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > From jeffsmithphoto at gmail.com Sat Mar 27 10:07:46 2021 From: jeffsmithphoto at gmail.com (JeffSmith) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2021 07:07:46 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications In-Reply-To: <1616853607667-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1616623551671-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616627141536-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616627861562-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616841103874-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616853607667-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <1616854066502-0.post@n5.nabble.com> I use the track mounted car lead for the sheet and sometimes run a "twing (?)" from the Cabin Side Lead to pull the sheet inboard and/or down. I have to remember to unhook the carabiner before tacking... ----- Jeff Smith 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor Atlantic Highlands, NJ -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From roger_pihlaja at msn.com Sat Mar 27 10:12:22 2021 From: roger_pihlaja at msn.com (ROGER PIHLAJA) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2021 14:12:22 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications In-Reply-To: <1616853607667-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1616623551671-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616627141536-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616627861562-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616841103874-0.post@n5.nabble.com> , <1616853607667-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: Jeff, The 1st picture looks like the jib sheet lead position you would use once the genoa has been furled too small to use the most forward genoa track hole. Say < ~100%. The 2nd picture looks like the cleat on the cabin roof where the OEM roller furling control line cleats off. Where does your roller furling control line cleat off? Roger Pihlaja S/V Dynamic Equilbrium Sent from my iPhone > On Mar 27, 2021, at 10:00 AM, JeffSmith wrote: > > ?Roger, > Here are the two additional jib leads in from the main track. > > > > > > > > > ----- > Jeff Smith > 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT > Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor > Atlantic Highlands, NJ > > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From jeffsmithphoto at gmail.com Sat Mar 27 10:23:04 2021 From: jeffsmithphoto at gmail.com (JeffSmith) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2021 07:23:04 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications In-Reply-To: <009101d72312$16cee400$446cac00$@ebsmed.com> References: <1616623551671-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616627141536-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616627861562-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616841103874-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616853607667-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <009101d72312$16cee400$446cac00$@ebsmed.com> Message-ID: <1616854984644-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Mike, There is another smaller lead and cleat outboard for the furling line in my setup. I have never used the Cabin Top Lead, because it seem TOO far inboard. ----- Jeff Smith 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor Atlantic Highlands, NJ -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From jeffsmithphoto at gmail.com Sat Mar 27 10:28:24 2021 From: jeffsmithphoto at gmail.com (JeffSmith) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2021 07:28:24 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications In-Reply-To: <017801d7230a$1209b470$361d1d50$@ca> References: <1616623551671-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616627141536-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616627861562-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616841103874-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <017801d7230a$1209b470$361d1d50$@ca> Message-ID: <1616855304515-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Graham, Here is a photo of the backstay socket: ----- Jeff Smith 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor Atlantic Highlands, NJ -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From jeffsmithphoto at gmail.com Sat Mar 27 10:34:19 2021 From: jeffsmithphoto at gmail.com (JeffSmith) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2021 07:34:19 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications In-Reply-To: <1616854984644-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1616627141536-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616627861562-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616841103874-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616853607667-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <009101d72312$16cee400$446cac00$@ebsmed.com> <1616854984644-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <1616855659690-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Photo of Cabin Top: ----- Jeff Smith 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor Atlantic Highlands, NJ -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From gstewart8 at cogeco.ca Sat Mar 27 10:54:22 2021 From: gstewart8 at cogeco.ca (Graham Stewart) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2021 10:54:22 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications In-Reply-To: <1616855304515-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1616623551671-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616627141536-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616627861562-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616841103874-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <017801d7230a$1209b470$361d1d50$@ca> <1616855304515-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <018501d72319$145d4390$3d17cab0$@ca> Thanks Jeff: Am I correct that the back stay was cut and the two pieces passed through the hole in the cap to be crimped both below and above the cap? Can you tell me approximately how far up the stay the cap is located? Thanks, Graham Stewart Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 Kingston Ontario -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf Of JeffSmith Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2021 10:28 AM To: rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications Graham, Here is a photo of the backstay socket: ----- Jeff Smith 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor Atlantic Highlands, NJ -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From sloopblueheron at gmail.com Sat Mar 27 11:40:35 2021 From: sloopblueheron at gmail.com (Rick Lange) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2021 11:40:35 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications - another alternative In-Reply-To: References: <011601d72249$f0e2ee80$d2a8cb80$@ca> <012101d7224d$97b44940$c71cdbc0$@ca> Message-ID: Roger, Although dated in that they don't address loose footed mainsails, these are interesting videos. But they miss the mark. The videos are talking about trimming the mainsail for windshifts, not depowering for gusts. The wind may change direction following a gust, but you better know how to focus on the main problem during the gust.. Otherwise, you will be sitting in irons down course as I breeze over the finish line. On the R22, you need to learn how to release the mainsheet when a gust starts heading the boat up and then deal with the traveller if needed once the wind dies back. Where did you get the idea that I bust my knuckles on my traveller? I have a 90's vintage one from Stan and it is completely harmless, unlike some others I've experienced. The only thing is, I switched out the jam cleats for cam cleats to more reliably hold the control line and to give better tacktile control pulling the traveller toward me. And tying together the control line ends makes popping the cleats easy. Regards, Rick Lange On Fri, Mar 26, 2021 at 11:40 AM ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: > Rick, > > OK, here?s 2 books on sail trim > > Bill Gladstone, ?North U TRIM?, 6th ed, (2007), North U, Madison, CT > > ?The North U Fast Couse?, (1990), North U, Milford, CT > > Each of the above are textbooks as part of a North U sailing class and > there are companion videos under the same titles. > > Here?s 2 more videos: > > Peter Bateman, ?Sail Trimming Made Easy?, R129, Bennett Marine Video, > Marina Del Ray, CA > > ?The Shape Of Speed?, R329, Bennett Marine Video, Marina Del Ray, CA > > One thing you will note in all of these references is that the traveler is > constantly adjusted to maintain the windward/leeward helm balance. The > traveler is not a digital on/off device, it is constantly used for fine > tuning while underway. With the traveler and the tiller both under the > control of the helmsman, the Rhodes 22?s helm balance can be adjusted on > the fly better than any other boat I?ve ever experienced. The GBI 29 > Traveler has the additional advantage of having sufficient range of motion > and responsiveness to be able to depower the rig in a gust and quickly get > back on line after the gust has passed. If other boats could do it, they > would! If your GBI-29 Traveler cannot do this; then, you are using it > wrong. If you are busting your knuckles on your traveler then I can only > imagine what unspeakable act you are attempting to commit! ? > > In general, racing dingies do not have as much range of traveler movement > as our Rhodes 22?s. Since the range of movement is limited, you cannot use > the traveler to depower the main. Some keelboats also do not have > sufficient range of motion in the traveler. Some boats are limited by > their traveler design, like the 2nd generation traveler on the Rhodes 22, > which had poor ergonomics on the clam cleat placement, thus making it hard > for the helmsman to operate without leaving his preferred hiking position > on the windward gunnel. Some boats have sticky, poorly designed, &/or > placed traveler tracks, thus making it impossible for the helmsman to > constantly play with the traveler. Name the sailboats, other than the > Rhodes 22, that you?ve sailed that combine sufficient range of traveler > movement to be able to depower the rig, good ergonomics for the helmsman, > fast response, and can be operated with one hand. Off the top of my head, > I can?t think of any. Our boats are unique. > > The only Rhodes 22 I have access to is S/V Dynamic Equilibrium, a 1976 > model. How about if I spot you 10 sec/nm? > > This thread is getting really long and very old. Can we please change the > subject? > > Roger Pihlaja > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > From: Graham Stewart > Sent: Friday, March 26, 2021 10:37 AM > To: 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications - > another alternative > > Rob: No, my boat did not have anything attached to the back stays that > would > attach to a traveler. I thought that those with the end cups were specially > made. Otherwise, how were the cups attached? > > Graham Stewart > gstewart8 at cogeco.ca > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf > Of > Lowe, Rob > Sent: Friday, March 26, 2021 10:25 AM > To: 'Curtis Ruck'; 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications - > another alternative > > Graham, > My first boat was a 1976 and had the traveler bar mounted between two 'bar > end cups' that attached to the back stays. Is your boat not similarity > equipped? I don't think there was anything special about the backstays. - > Rob > > ________________________________ > From: Rhodes22-list on behalf of > Graham > Stewart > Sent: Friday, March 26, 2021 10:11 AM > To: 'Curtis Ruck' ; 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' > > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications - > another alternative > > I have been interested in the traveler discussion. My boat (1976) didn't > have a traveler when I got it and the mainsheet was simply attached to the > table base in the cockpit. My backstays are not equipped to install a > traveler and replacing the stays with new ones seemed cost prohibitive to > me. Initially I installed a traveler between the lazerette and the cockpit > seats. That worked well enough but made movement around the cockpit > awkward. > > My latest version was to mount the traveler track to a 1" stainless steel > tube and fasten that to my stern rail where it would seem to work in a > manner similar to those attached to the back stays. The rail does not flex > like the backstays would but I don't know if that is a good thing or not. > While this system seems very strong to me I am no engineer or otherwise > qualified to know. > > For those who are reluctant to pay the cost of both the backstay > replacement > plus the cost of the new traveler this arrangement might be worth > considering. > > I like that the traveler being close to the stern rail means I don't have > an > additional barrier to reaching over the stern rail to lift the motor and > that it is out of the way when sailing. I don't like the fact the it is > awkward to reach the lee traveler line. Any thought on improvements or > worries about this installation would be welcome. > > Graham Stewart > Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 > Kingston Ontario > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf > Of > Curtis Ruck via Rhodes22-list > Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2021 9:45 PM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications > > Hmm, i'll jump in and throw my two cents in, with my 1976 R22. > > When i'm racing in gusty 15+ knots... i am typically sitting on the side > rails above the seat, with one hand on the tiller extension and my other > fully gloved hand is holding the mainsheet uncleated, and i use that hand > to either let slip the mainsheet in a strong gust, or i give and take a > little with my hand holding the mainsheet from flying loose. I have a > harken 3:1 windward sheeting traveler rail mounted on the back stays. I > try to get the mainsheet as flat as possible. I would never use my > traveler to try controlling the main for gusting, holding the uncleated > mainsheet just feels natural, a little give, a little take, lets me feel > like i'm riding with the wind, and it allows instant response. Though on > long races my arms feel it. > > BTW, my traveler setup in the picture. I mounted the harken traveler rail > on a 1" OD Fiberglass tube with stainless 316 mounts on each end that the > backstays run through. Mounts are attached to the backstay with a small > stainless tube slightly larger than the backstay diameter to reduce the > friction wear on the backstays. I love the setup, but sometimes wish I had > a fixed traveler rail that wasn't floating. > > [image: image.png] > > -- > Curtis > > > On Thu, Mar 25, 2021 at 8:38 PM Shawn Boles > wrote: > > > Oh boy, a match race! Much more enjoyable than the obscene, but > > fascinating, America's Cup races I just watched. > > > > Cheers, > > Shawn s/v Sweet Baboo (1986/2010) > > > > On Thu, Mar 25, 2021, 1:49 PM Rick Lange > wrote: > > > > > Roger, > > > > > > I learned to sail and race by taking a college physical education class > > > over 50 years ago. I've raced dinghies through keel boats, including > the > > > R22, and as skipper, have a few blue flags to show for it. > > > > > > I accept your challenge to match race R22's with the IMF and diamond > > board. > > > > > > I challenge you to produce the videos you said are so common > > demonstrating > > > using the traveller on small sloops to dump wind during gusts > > > that overpower while close hauled. > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > Rick Lange > > > > > > > > > On Thu, Mar 25, 2021 at 2:44 PM ROGER PIHLAJA > > > wrote: > > > > > > > Rick, > > > > > > > > We were having a discussion of mainsail trim and traveler use in > heavy > > > air > > > > wherein the rig needs to be depowered in gusts and then quickly > brought > > > > back on line after the gust has passed. Mainsail shape for <= 10 > knots > > > is > > > > considered light air and is a different subject. As you noted, the > > > optimum > > > > light air mainsail shape is achieved with a different traveler car > > > position > > > > and mainsheet tension vs heavy air. In light air, it is also much > less > > > > likely the rig will need to be depowered as per the original > > discussion. > > > > > > > > It is beyond the scope of my job description to give tutorials on > sail > > > > trim in all possible conditions. I suggest you take a class or go > > racing. > > > > > > > > Stan, > > > > > > > > I give up! I've tried to explain the merits of your GBI 29 Traveler > to > > > > the best of my ability. But, it's not working. If you want to jump > > into > > > > this discussion, go ahead. But, I'm done. > > > > > > > > Roger Pihlaja > > > > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: image.png > Type: image/png > Size: 3456191 bytes > Desc: not available > URL: > < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210325/763bc9ee/a > ttachment.png > > > > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: New traveller.jpg > Type: image/jpeg > Size: 128837 bytes > Desc: not available > URL: > < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210326/74da184f/a > ttachment.jpg > > > > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: Taveller end hardware.jpg > Type: image/jpeg > Size: 106100 bytes > Desc: not available > URL: > < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210326/74da184f/a > ttachment-0001.jpg > > > > > From jeffsmithphoto at gmail.com Sat Mar 27 12:46:39 2021 From: jeffsmithphoto at gmail.com (JeffSmith) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2021 09:46:39 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications In-Reply-To: <018501d72319$145d4390$3d17cab0$@ca> References: <1616627141536-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616627861562-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616841103874-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <017801d7230a$1209b470$361d1d50$@ca> <1616855304515-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <018501d72319$145d4390$3d17cab0$@ca> Message-ID: <1616863599205-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Hi Graham, >From the center of the cup to the top of the tang hole is 17.5" If you have a regular turnbuckle (as opposed to the type of eye swage pictured here) you would only need 5/16" or so hole with crimp on swages on either side. ----- Jeff Smith 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor Atlantic Highlands, NJ -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From roger_pihlaja at msn.com Sat Mar 27 20:59:58 2021 From: roger_pihlaja at msn.com (ROGER PIHLAJA) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2021 00:59:58 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications - another alternative In-Reply-To: References: <011601d72249$f0e2ee80$d2a8cb80$@ca> <012101d7224d$97b44940$c71cdbc0$@ca> , Message-ID: Rick, In all the dozens of posts in this thread, someone said they were busting their knuckles on their traveler. I don?t remember who. I remember asking what they were hitting their knuckles on. I don?t think I ever got a response. Can you post a picture of your traveler? From your last post, it sounds like you don?t have a GBI 29 Traveler. Rather, you have a 2nd generation traveler modified with cam cleats replacing the OEM standard jam cleats. Roger Pihlaja S/V Dynamic Equilibrium Sent from Mail for Windows 10 From: Rick Lange Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2021 11:41 AM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications - another alternative Roger, Although dated in that they don't address loose footed mainsails, these are interesting videos. But they miss the mark. The videos are talking about trimming the mainsail for windshifts, not depowering for gusts. The wind may change direction following a gust, but you better know how to focus on the main problem during the gust.. Otherwise, you will be sitting in irons down course as I breeze over the finish line. On the R22, you need to learn how to release the mainsheet when a gust starts heading the boat up and then deal with the traveller if needed once the wind dies back. Where did you get the idea that I bust my knuckles on my traveller? I have a 90's vintage one from Stan and it is completely harmless, unlike some others I've experienced. The only thing is, I switched out the jam cleats for cam cleats to more reliably hold the control line and to give better tacktile control pulling the traveller toward me. And tying together the control line ends makes popping the cleats easy. Regards, Rick Lange On Fri, Mar 26, 2021 at 11:40 AM ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: > Rick, > > OK, here?s 2 books on sail trim > > Bill Gladstone, ?North U TRIM?, 6th ed, (2007), North U, Madison, CT > > ?The North U Fast Couse?, (1990), North U, Milford, CT > > Each of the above are textbooks as part of a North U sailing class and > there are companion videos under the same titles. > > Here?s 2 more videos: > > Peter Bateman, ?Sail Trimming Made Easy?, R129, Bennett Marine Video, > Marina Del Ray, CA > > ?The Shape Of Speed?, R329, Bennett Marine Video, Marina Del Ray, CA > > One thing you will note in all of these references is that the traveler is > constantly adjusted to maintain the windward/leeward helm balance. The > traveler is not a digital on/off device, it is constantly used for fine > tuning while underway. With the traveler and the tiller both under the > control of the helmsman, the Rhodes 22?s helm balance can be adjusted on > the fly better than any other boat I?ve ever experienced. The GBI 29 > Traveler has the additional advantage of having sufficient range of motion > and responsiveness to be able to depower the rig in a gust and quickly get > back on line after the gust has passed. If other boats could do it, they > would! If your GBI-29 Traveler cannot do this; then, you are using it > wrong. If you are busting your knuckles on your traveler then I can only > imagine what unspeakable act you are attempting to commit! ? > > In general, racing dingies do not have as much range of traveler movement > as our Rhodes 22?s. Since the range of movement is limited, you cannot use > the traveler to depower the main. Some keelboats also do not have > sufficient range of motion in the traveler. Some boats are limited by > their traveler design, like the 2nd generation traveler on the Rhodes 22, > which had poor ergonomics on the clam cleat placement, thus making it hard > for the helmsman to operate without leaving his preferred hiking position > on the windward gunnel. Some boats have sticky, poorly designed, &/or > placed traveler tracks, thus making it impossible for the helmsman to > constantly play with the traveler. Name the sailboats, other than the > Rhodes 22, that you?ve sailed that combine sufficient range of traveler > movement to be able to depower the rig, good ergonomics for the helmsman, > fast response, and can be operated with one hand. Off the top of my head, > I can?t think of any. Our boats are unique. > > The only Rhodes 22 I have access to is S/V Dynamic Equilibrium, a 1976 > model. How about if I spot you 10 sec/nm? > > This thread is getting really long and very old. Can we please change the > subject? > > Roger Pihlaja > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > From: Graham Stewart > Sent: Friday, March 26, 2021 10:37 AM > To: 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications - > another alternative > > Rob: No, my boat did not have anything attached to the back stays that > would > attach to a traveler. I thought that those with the end cups were specially > made. Otherwise, how were the cups attached? > > Graham Stewart > gstewart8 at cogeco.ca > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf > Of > Lowe, Rob > Sent: Friday, March 26, 2021 10:25 AM > To: 'Curtis Ruck'; 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications - > another alternative > > Graham, > My first boat was a 1976 and had the traveler bar mounted between two 'bar > end cups' that attached to the back stays. Is your boat not similarity > equipped? I don't think there was anything special about the backstays. - > Rob > > ________________________________ > From: Rhodes22-list on behalf of > Graham > Stewart > Sent: Friday, March 26, 2021 10:11 AM > To: 'Curtis Ruck' ; 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' > > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications - > another alternative > > I have been interested in the traveler discussion. My boat (1976) didn't > have a traveler when I got it and the mainsheet was simply attached to the > table base in the cockpit. My backstays are not equipped to install a > traveler and replacing the stays with new ones seemed cost prohibitive to > me. Initially I installed a traveler between the lazerette and the cockpit > seats. That worked well enough but made movement around the cockpit > awkward. > > My latest version was to mount the traveler track to a 1" stainless steel > tube and fasten that to my stern rail where it would seem to work in a > manner similar to those attached to the back stays. The rail does not flex > like the backstays would but I don't know if that is a good thing or not. > While this system seems very strong to me I am no engineer or otherwise > qualified to know. > > For those who are reluctant to pay the cost of both the backstay > replacement > plus the cost of the new traveler this arrangement might be worth > considering. > > I like that the traveler being close to the stern rail means I don't have > an > additional barrier to reaching over the stern rail to lift the motor and > that it is out of the way when sailing. I don't like the fact the it is > awkward to reach the lee traveler line. Any thought on improvements or > worries about this installation would be welcome. > > Graham Stewart > Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 > Kingston Ontario > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf > Of > Curtis Ruck via Rhodes22-list > Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2021 9:45 PM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications > > Hmm, i'll jump in and throw my two cents in, with my 1976 R22. > > When i'm racing in gusty 15+ knots... i am typically sitting on the side > rails above the seat, with one hand on the tiller extension and my other > fully gloved hand is holding the mainsheet uncleated, and i use that hand > to either let slip the mainsheet in a strong gust, or i give and take a > little with my hand holding the mainsheet from flying loose. I have a > harken 3:1 windward sheeting traveler rail mounted on the back stays. I > try to get the mainsheet as flat as possible. I would never use my > traveler to try controlling the main for gusting, holding the uncleated > mainsheet just feels natural, a little give, a little take, lets me feel > like i'm riding with the wind, and it allows instant response. Though on > long races my arms feel it. > > BTW, my traveler setup in the picture. I mounted the harken traveler rail > on a 1" OD Fiberglass tube with stainless 316 mounts on each end that the > backstays run through. Mounts are attached to the backstay with a small > stainless tube slightly larger than the backstay diameter to reduce the > friction wear on the backstays. I love the setup, but sometimes wish I had > a fixed traveler rail that wasn't floating. > > [image: image.png] > > -- > Curtis > > > On Thu, Mar 25, 2021 at 8:38 PM Shawn Boles > wrote: > > > Oh boy, a match race! Much more enjoyable than the obscene, but > > fascinating, America's Cup races I just watched. > > > > Cheers, > > Shawn s/v Sweet Baboo (1986/2010) > > > > On Thu, Mar 25, 2021, 1:49 PM Rick Lange > wrote: > > > > > Roger, > > > > > > I learned to sail and race by taking a college physical education class > > > over 50 years ago. I've raced dinghies through keel boats, including > the > > > R22, and as skipper, have a few blue flags to show for it. > > > > > > I accept your challenge to match race R22's with the IMF and diamond > > board. > > > > > > I challenge you to produce the videos you said are so common > > demonstrating > > > using the traveller on small sloops to dump wind during gusts > > > that overpower while close hauled. > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > Rick Lange > > > > > > > > > On Thu, Mar 25, 2021 at 2:44 PM ROGER PIHLAJA > > > wrote: > > > > > > > Rick, > > > > > > > > We were having a discussion of mainsail trim and traveler use in > heavy > > > air > > > > wherein the rig needs to be depowered in gusts and then quickly > brought > > > > back on line after the gust has passed. Mainsail shape for <= 10 > knots > > > is > > > > considered light air and is a different subject. As you noted, the > > > optimum > > > > light air mainsail shape is achieved with a different traveler car > > > position > > > > and mainsheet tension vs heavy air. In light air, it is also much > less > > > > likely the rig will need to be depowered as per the original > > discussion. > > > > > > > > It is beyond the scope of my job description to give tutorials on > sail > > > > trim in all possible conditions. I suggest you take a class or go > > racing. > > > > > > > > Stan, > > > > > > > > I give up! I've tried to explain the merits of your GBI 29 Traveler > to > > > > the best of my ability. But, it's not working. If you want to jump > > into > > > > this discussion, go ahead. But, I'm done. > > > > > > > > Roger Pihlaja > > > > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: image.png > Type: image/png > Size: 3456191 bytes > Desc: not available > URL: > < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210325/763bc9ee/a > ttachment.png > > > > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: New traveller.jpg > Type: image/jpeg > Size: 128837 bytes > Desc: not available > URL: > < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210326/74da184f/a > ttachment.jpg > > > > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: Taveller end hardware.jpg > Type: image/jpeg > Size: 106100 bytes > Desc: not available > URL: > < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210326/74da184f/a > ttachment-0001.jpg > > > > > From roger_pihlaja at msn.com Sat Mar 27 21:21:54 2021 From: roger_pihlaja at msn.com (ROGER PIHLAJA) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2021 01:21:54 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications In-Reply-To: <1616855659690-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1616627141536-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616627861562-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616841103874-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <1616853607667-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <009101d72312$16cee400$446cac00$@ebsmed.com> <1616854984644-0.post@n5.nabble.com>,<1616855659690-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: Jeff, In this photo, the most inboard cam cleat is probably for your roller furling control line. It looks like it?s in line with the 2 fairleads on the cabin top for routing the control line from the furling drum with minimal changes of direction. The OEM standard roller furling control line on S/V Dynamic Equilibrium was routed from the furling drum across the cabin top like that. If there are matching cam cleats on the port side; then, the other cam cleats are probably inboard jib sheet points. If there are no matching port side cam cleats; then, the other starboard cam cleats on the cabin top were probably intended for routing other lines like a halyard, topping lift, mainsail roller furling, etc. S/V Dynamic Equilibrium does not have the inner mast furling mainsail. So, I am not familiar with how the control lines for that gear are laid out. S/V Dynamic Equilibrium has many lines routed back to the cockpit: Roller Furling Control Line ? Mine now runs along the starboard toe rail Spinnaker Pole Topping Lift Spinnaker Pole Downhaul Spinnaker Snuffer Sock Uphaul Spinnaker Snuffer Sock Downhaul Boom Topping Lift Boom Vang Boom Downhaul Roger Pihlaja S/V Dynamic Equilibrium Sent from Mail for Windows 10 From: JeffSmith Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2021 10:34 AM To: rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications Photo of Cabin Top: ----- Jeff Smith 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor Atlantic Highlands, NJ -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From tavares0947 at gmail.com Sat Mar 27 21:24:37 2021 From: tavares0947 at gmail.com (Todd Tavares) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2021 21:24:37 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications - another alternative In-Reply-To: References: <011601d72249$f0e2ee80$d2a8cb80$@ca> <012101d7224d$97b44940$c71cdbc0$@ca> Message-ID: So, How did we arrive at the GBI 29 Traveler designation? Save me from reading the 46+ posts. Todd T. tavares0947 at gmail.com On Sat, Mar 27, 2021, 9:00 PM ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: > Rick, > > In all the dozens of posts in this thread, someone said they were busting > their knuckles on their traveler. I don?t remember who. I remember asking > what they were hitting their knuckles on. I don?t think I ever got a > response. > > Can you post a picture of your traveler? From your last post, it sounds > like you don?t have a GBI 29 Traveler. Rather, you have a 2nd generation > traveler modified with cam cleats replacing the OEM standard jam cleats. > > Roger Pihlaja > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > Sent from Mail for > Windows 10 > > From: Rick Lange > Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2021 11:41 AM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications - > another alternative > > Roger, > > Although dated in that they don't address loose footed mainsails, these are > interesting videos. But they miss the mark. > > The videos are talking about trimming the mainsail for windshifts, not > depowering for gusts. The wind may change direction following a gust, but > you better know how to focus on the main problem during the gust.. > Otherwise, you will be sitting in irons down course as I breeze over the > finish line. On the R22, you need to learn how to release the mainsheet > when a gust starts heading the boat up and then deal with the traveller if > needed once the wind dies back. > > Where did you get the idea that I bust my knuckles on my traveller? I have > a 90's vintage one from Stan and it is completely harmless, unlike some > others I've experienced. The only thing is, I switched out the jam cleats > for cam cleats to more reliably hold the control line and to give better > tacktile control pulling the traveller toward me. And tying together the > control line ends makes popping the cleats easy. > > Regards, > > Rick Lange > > > On Fri, Mar 26, 2021 at 11:40 AM ROGER PIHLAJA > wrote: > > > Rick, > > > > OK, here?s 2 books on sail trim > > > > Bill Gladstone, ?North U TRIM?, 6th ed, (2007), North U, Madison, CT > > > > ?The North U Fast Couse?, (1990), North U, Milford, CT > > > > Each of the above are textbooks as part of a North U sailing class and > > there are companion videos under the same titles. > > > > Here?s 2 more videos: > > > > Peter Bateman, ?Sail Trimming Made Easy?, R129, Bennett Marine Video, > > Marina Del Ray, CA > > > > ?The Shape Of Speed?, R329, Bennett Marine Video, Marina Del Ray, CA > > > > One thing you will note in all of these references is that the traveler > is > > constantly adjusted to maintain the windward/leeward helm balance. The > > traveler is not a digital on/off device, it is constantly used for fine > > tuning while underway. With the traveler and the tiller both under the > > control of the helmsman, the Rhodes 22?s helm balance can be adjusted on > > the fly better than any other boat I?ve ever experienced. The GBI 29 > > Traveler has the additional advantage of having sufficient range of > motion > > and responsiveness to be able to depower the rig in a gust and quickly > get > > back on line after the gust has passed. If other boats could do it, they > > would! If your GBI-29 Traveler cannot do this; then, you are using it > > wrong. If you are busting your knuckles on your traveler then I can only > > imagine what unspeakable act you are attempting to commit! ? > > > > In general, racing dingies do not have as much range of traveler movement > > as our Rhodes 22?s. Since the range of movement is limited, you cannot > use > > the traveler to depower the main. Some keelboats also do not have > > sufficient range of motion in the traveler. Some boats are limited by > > their traveler design, like the 2nd generation traveler on the Rhodes 22, > > which had poor ergonomics on the clam cleat placement, thus making it > hard > > for the helmsman to operate without leaving his preferred hiking position > > on the windward gunnel. Some boats have sticky, poorly designed, &/or > > placed traveler tracks, thus making it impossible for the helmsman to > > constantly play with the traveler. Name the sailboats, other than the > > Rhodes 22, that you?ve sailed that combine sufficient range of traveler > > movement to be able to depower the rig, good ergonomics for the helmsman, > > fast response, and can be operated with one hand. Off the top of my > head, > > I can?t think of any. Our boats are unique. > > > > The only Rhodes 22 I have access to is S/V Dynamic Equilibrium, a 1976 > > model. How about if I spot you 10 sec/nm? > > > > This thread is getting really long and very old. Can we please change > the > > subject? > > > > Roger Pihlaja > > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > > > From: Graham Stewart > > Sent: Friday, March 26, 2021 10:37 AM > > To: 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' > > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications > - > > another alternative > > > > Rob: No, my boat did not have anything attached to the back stays that > > would > > attach to a traveler. I thought that those with the end cups were > specially > > made. Otherwise, how were the cups attached? > > > > Graham Stewart > > gstewart8 at cogeco.ca > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On > Behalf > > Of > > Lowe, Rob > > Sent: Friday, March 26, 2021 10:25 AM > > To: 'Curtis Ruck'; 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' > > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications > - > > another alternative > > > > Graham, > > My first boat was a 1976 and had the traveler bar mounted between two > 'bar > > end cups' that attached to the back stays. Is your boat not similarity > > equipped? I don't think there was anything special about the backstays. > - > > Rob > > > > ________________________________ > > From: Rhodes22-list on behalf of > > Graham > > Stewart > > Sent: Friday, March 26, 2021 10:11 AM > > To: 'Curtis Ruck' ; 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' > > > > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications > - > > another alternative > > > > I have been interested in the traveler discussion. My boat (1976) didn't > > have a traveler when I got it and the mainsheet was simply attached to > the > > table base in the cockpit. My backstays are not equipped to install a > > traveler and replacing the stays with new ones seemed cost prohibitive to > > me. Initially I installed a traveler between the lazerette and the > cockpit > > seats. That worked well enough but made movement around the cockpit > > awkward. > > > > My latest version was to mount the traveler track to a 1" stainless steel > > tube and fasten that to my stern rail where it would seem to work in a > > manner similar to those attached to the back stays. The rail does not > flex > > like the backstays would but I don't know if that is a good thing or not. > > While this system seems very strong to me I am no engineer or otherwise > > qualified to know. > > > > For those who are reluctant to pay the cost of both the backstay > > replacement > > plus the cost of the new traveler this arrangement might be worth > > considering. > > > > I like that the traveler being close to the stern rail means I don't have > > an > > additional barrier to reaching over the stern rail to lift the motor and > > that it is out of the way when sailing. I don't like the fact the it is > > awkward to reach the lee traveler line. Any thought on improvements or > > worries about this installation would be welcome. > > > > Graham Stewart > > Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 > > Kingston Ontario > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On > Behalf > > Of > > Curtis Ruck via Rhodes22-list > > Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2021 9:45 PM > > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications > > > > Hmm, i'll jump in and throw my two cents in, with my 1976 R22. > > > > When i'm racing in gusty 15+ knots... i am typically sitting on the side > > rails above the seat, with one hand on the tiller extension and my other > > fully gloved hand is holding the mainsheet uncleated, and i use that hand > > to either let slip the mainsheet in a strong gust, or i give and take a > > little with my hand holding the mainsheet from flying loose. I have a > > harken 3:1 windward sheeting traveler rail mounted on the back stays. I > > try to get the mainsheet as flat as possible. I would never use my > > traveler to try controlling the main for gusting, holding the uncleated > > mainsheet just feels natural, a little give, a little take, lets me feel > > like i'm riding with the wind, and it allows instant response. Though on > > long races my arms feel it. > > > > BTW, my traveler setup in the picture. I mounted the harken traveler > rail > > on a 1" OD Fiberglass tube with stainless 316 mounts on each end that the > > backstays run through. Mounts are attached to the backstay with a small > > stainless tube slightly larger than the backstay diameter to reduce the > > friction wear on the backstays. I love the setup, but sometimes wish I > had > > a fixed traveler rail that wasn't floating. > > > > [image: image.png] > > > > -- > > Curtis > > > > > > On Thu, Mar 25, 2021 at 8:38 PM Shawn Boles > > wrote: > > > > > Oh boy, a match race! Much more enjoyable than the obscene, but > > > fascinating, America's Cup races I just watched. > > > > > > Cheers, > > > Shawn s/v Sweet Baboo (1986/2010) > > > > > > On Thu, Mar 25, 2021, 1:49 PM Rick Lange > > wrote: > > > > > > > Roger, > > > > > > > > I learned to sail and race by taking a college physical education > class > > > > over 50 years ago. I've raced dinghies through keel boats, including > > the > > > > R22, and as skipper, have a few blue flags to show for it. > > > > > > > > I accept your challenge to match race R22's with the IMF and diamond > > > board. > > > > > > > > I challenge you to produce the videos you said are so common > > > demonstrating > > > > using the traveller on small sloops to dump wind during gusts > > > > that overpower while close hauled. > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > Rick Lange > > > > > > > > > > > > On Thu, Mar 25, 2021 at 2:44 PM ROGER PIHLAJA > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > Rick, > > > > > > > > > > We were having a discussion of mainsail trim and traveler use in > > heavy > > > > air > > > > > wherein the rig needs to be depowered in gusts and then quickly > > brought > > > > > back on line after the gust has passed. Mainsail shape for <= 10 > > knots > > > > is > > > > > considered light air and is a different subject. As you noted, the > > > > optimum > > > > > light air mainsail shape is achieved with a different traveler car > > > > position > > > > > and mainsheet tension vs heavy air. In light air, it is also much > > less > > > > > likely the rig will need to be depowered as per the original > > > discussion. > > > > > > > > > > It is beyond the scope of my job description to give tutorials on > > sail > > > > > trim in all possible conditions. I suggest you take a class or go > > > racing. > > > > > > > > > > Stan, > > > > > > > > > > I give up! I've tried to explain the merits of your GBI 29 > Traveler > > to > > > > > the best of my ability. But, it's not working. If you want to > jump > > > into > > > > > this discussion, go ahead. But, I'm done. > > > > > > > > > > Roger Pihlaja > > > > > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -------------- next part -------------- > > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > > Name: image.png > > Type: image/png > > Size: 3456191 bytes > > Desc: not available > > URL: > > < > > > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210325/763bc9ee/a > > ttachment.png > > < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210325/763bc9ee/attachment.png > > > > > > > -------------- next part -------------- > > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > > Name: New traveller.jpg > > Type: image/jpeg > > Size: 128837 bytes > > Desc: not available > > URL: > > < > > > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210326/74da184f/a > > ttachment.jpg > > < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210326/74da184f/attachment.jpg > > > > > > > -------------- next part -------------- > > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > > Name: Taveller end hardware.jpg > > Type: image/jpeg > > Size: 106100 bytes > > Desc: not available > > URL: > > < > > > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210326/74da184f/a > > ttachment-0001.jpg > > < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210326/74da184f/attachment-0001.jpg > > > > > > > > > > > From joedempsey at hughes.net Sat Mar 27 22:08:56 2021 From: joedempsey at hughes.net (Joe Dempsey) Date: Sat, 27 Mar 2021 19:08:56 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Rhodes Burgee Update In-Reply-To: <1614894428456-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1614894428456-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <1616897336885-0.post@n5.nabble.com> I've just received a message from Cindy at the Burgee Shoppe. The Rhodes burgees were shipped today. You should receive yours within the next 5 or 6 days. Hope everybody likes them. She said that she enjoyed talking with all of you. Your cards were charged today. Remember , the billing will be from OPB Entertainment. ----- Joe Dempsey s/v Respite Rhodes 22 1989/2005 Deltaville,VA -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From roger_pihlaja at msn.com Sun Mar 28 06:31:42 2021 From: roger_pihlaja at msn.com (ROGER PIHLAJA) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2021 10:31:42 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications - another alternative In-Reply-To: References: <011601d72249$f0e2ee80$d2a8cb80$@ca> <012101d7224d$97b44940$c71cdbc0$@ca> , Message-ID: Todd, GBI 29 is the part number of the latest generation traveler on the factory website. One of the e-mail posts has a copy of the part number, catalog description, and price taken from the on-line parts catalog. I started using this designation to distinguish the latest generation traveler from the 2nd generation traveler. The 2nd generation traveler is the one with the bar that attaches between sockets on the backstays and has the 2:1 control line tackle rigged from the traveler car to jam cleats on each end of the bar. I used a 2nd generation traveler for many years and upgraded to the GBI 29 Traveler 3 seasons ago. In fact, I still have my old 2nd generation traveler in my garage. The differences between these two generations of factory travelers may have slipped thru the cracks during the lengthy discussion. If people are confused about the two different generations of factory travelers; then, I apologize. But, I fear we might have just wasted a great deal of time and energy arguing past each other about 2 different things. Roger Pihlaja S/V Dynamic Equilibrium Sent from Mail for Windows 10 From: Todd Tavares Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2021 9:24 PM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications - another alternative So, How did we arrive at the GBI 29 Traveler designation? Save me from reading the 46+ posts. Todd T. tavares0947 at gmail.com On Sat, Mar 27, 2021, 9:00 PM ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: > Rick, > > In all the dozens of posts in this thread, someone said they were busting > their knuckles on their traveler. I don?t remember who. I remember asking > what they were hitting their knuckles on. I don?t think I ever got a > response. > > Can you post a picture of your traveler? From your last post, it sounds > like you don?t have a GBI 29 Traveler. Rather, you have a 2nd generation > traveler modified with cam cleats replacing the OEM standard jam cleats. > > Roger Pihlaja > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > Sent from Mail for > Windows 10 > > From: Rick Lange > Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2021 11:41 AM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications - > another alternative > > Roger, > > Although dated in that they don't address loose footed mainsails, these are > interesting videos. But they miss the mark. > > The videos are talking about trimming the mainsail for windshifts, not > depowering for gusts. The wind may change direction following a gust, but > you better know how to focus on the main problem during the gust.. > Otherwise, you will be sitting in irons down course as I breeze over the > finish line. On the R22, you need to learn how to release the mainsheet > when a gust starts heading the boat up and then deal with the traveller if > needed once the wind dies back. > > Where did you get the idea that I bust my knuckles on my traveller? I have > a 90's vintage one from Stan and it is completely harmless, unlike some > others I've experienced. The only thing is, I switched out the jam cleats > for cam cleats to more reliably hold the control line and to give better > tacktile control pulling the traveller toward me. And tying together the > control line ends makes popping the cleats easy. > > Regards, > > Rick Lange > > > On Fri, Mar 26, 2021 at 11:40 AM ROGER PIHLAJA > wrote: > > > Rick, > > > > OK, here?s 2 books on sail trim > > > > Bill Gladstone, ?North U TRIM?, 6th ed, (2007), North U, Madison, CT > > > > ?The North U Fast Couse?, (1990), North U, Milford, CT > > > > Each of the above are textbooks as part of a North U sailing class and > > there are companion videos under the same titles. > > > > Here?s 2 more videos: > > > > Peter Bateman, ?Sail Trimming Made Easy?, R129, Bennett Marine Video, > > Marina Del Ray, CA > > > > ?The Shape Of Speed?, R329, Bennett Marine Video, Marina Del Ray, CA > > > > One thing you will note in all of these references is that the traveler > is > > constantly adjusted to maintain the windward/leeward helm balance. The > > traveler is not a digital on/off device, it is constantly used for fine > > tuning while underway. With the traveler and the tiller both under the > > control of the helmsman, the Rhodes 22?s helm balance can be adjusted on > > the fly better than any other boat I?ve ever experienced. The GBI 29 > > Traveler has the additional advantage of having sufficient range of > motion > > and responsiveness to be able to depower the rig in a gust and quickly > get > > back on line after the gust has passed. If other boats could do it, they > > would! If your GBI-29 Traveler cannot do this; then, you are using it > > wrong. If you are busting your knuckles on your traveler then I can only > > imagine what unspeakable act you are attempting to commit! ? > > > > In general, racing dingies do not have as much range of traveler movement > > as our Rhodes 22?s. Since the range of movement is limited, you cannot > use > > the traveler to depower the main. Some keelboats also do not have > > sufficient range of motion in the traveler. Some boats are limited by > > their traveler design, like the 2nd generation traveler on the Rhodes 22, > > which had poor ergonomics on the clam cleat placement, thus making it > hard > > for the helmsman to operate without leaving his preferred hiking position > > on the windward gunnel. Some boats have sticky, poorly designed, &/or > > placed traveler tracks, thus making it impossible for the helmsman to > > constantly play with the traveler. Name the sailboats, other than the > > Rhodes 22, that you?ve sailed that combine sufficient range of traveler > > movement to be able to depower the rig, good ergonomics for the helmsman, > > fast response, and can be operated with one hand. Off the top of my > head, > > I can?t think of any. Our boats are unique. > > > > The only Rhodes 22 I have access to is S/V Dynamic Equilibrium, a 1976 > > model. How about if I spot you 10 sec/nm? > > > > This thread is getting really long and very old. Can we please change > the > > subject? > > > > Roger Pihlaja > > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > > > From: Graham Stewart > > Sent: Friday, March 26, 2021 10:37 AM > > To: 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' > > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications > - > > another alternative > > > > Rob: No, my boat did not have anything attached to the back stays that > > would > > attach to a traveler. I thought that those with the end cups were > specially > > made. Otherwise, how were the cups attached? > > > > Graham Stewart > > gstewart8 at cogeco.ca > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On > Behalf > > Of > > Lowe, Rob > > Sent: Friday, March 26, 2021 10:25 AM > > To: 'Curtis Ruck'; 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' > > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications > - > > another alternative > > > > Graham, > > My first boat was a 1976 and had the traveler bar mounted between two > 'bar > > end cups' that attached to the back stays. Is your boat not similarity > > equipped? I don't think there was anything special about the backstays. > - > > Rob > > > > ________________________________ > > From: Rhodes22-list on behalf of > > Graham > > Stewart > > Sent: Friday, March 26, 2021 10:11 AM > > To: 'Curtis Ruck' ; 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' > > > > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications > - > > another alternative > > > > I have been interested in the traveler discussion. My boat (1976) didn't > > have a traveler when I got it and the mainsheet was simply attached to > the > > table base in the cockpit. My backstays are not equipped to install a > > traveler and replacing the stays with new ones seemed cost prohibitive to > > me. Initially I installed a traveler between the lazerette and the > cockpit > > seats. That worked well enough but made movement around the cockpit > > awkward. > > > > My latest version was to mount the traveler track to a 1" stainless steel > > tube and fasten that to my stern rail where it would seem to work in a > > manner similar to those attached to the back stays. The rail does not > flex > > like the backstays would but I don't know if that is a good thing or not. > > While this system seems very strong to me I am no engineer or otherwise > > qualified to know. > > > > For those who are reluctant to pay the cost of both the backstay > > replacement > > plus the cost of the new traveler this arrangement might be worth > > considering. > > > > I like that the traveler being close to the stern rail means I don't have > > an > > additional barrier to reaching over the stern rail to lift the motor and > > that it is out of the way when sailing. I don't like the fact the it is > > awkward to reach the lee traveler line. Any thought on improvements or > > worries about this installation would be welcome. > > > > Graham Stewart > > Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 > > Kingston Ontario > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On > Behalf > > Of > > Curtis Ruck via Rhodes22-list > > Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2021 9:45 PM > > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications > > > > Hmm, i'll jump in and throw my two cents in, with my 1976 R22. > > > > When i'm racing in gusty 15+ knots... i am typically sitting on the side > > rails above the seat, with one hand on the tiller extension and my other > > fully gloved hand is holding the mainsheet uncleated, and i use that hand > > to either let slip the mainsheet in a strong gust, or i give and take a > > little with my hand holding the mainsheet from flying loose. I have a > > harken 3:1 windward sheeting traveler rail mounted on the back stays. I > > try to get the mainsheet as flat as possible. I would never use my > > traveler to try controlling the main for gusting, holding the uncleated > > mainsheet just feels natural, a little give, a little take, lets me feel > > like i'm riding with the wind, and it allows instant response. Though on > > long races my arms feel it. > > > > BTW, my traveler setup in the picture. I mounted the harken traveler > rail > > on a 1" OD Fiberglass tube with stainless 316 mounts on each end that the > > backstays run through. Mounts are attached to the backstay with a small > > stainless tube slightly larger than the backstay diameter to reduce the > > friction wear on the backstays. I love the setup, but sometimes wish I > had > > a fixed traveler rail that wasn't floating. > > > > [image: image.png] > > > > -- > > Curtis > > > > > > On Thu, Mar 25, 2021 at 8:38 PM Shawn Boles > > wrote: > > > > > Oh boy, a match race! Much more enjoyable than the obscene, but > > > fascinating, America's Cup races I just watched. > > > > > > Cheers, > > > Shawn s/v Sweet Baboo (1986/2010) > > > > > > On Thu, Mar 25, 2021, 1:49 PM Rick Lange > > wrote: > > > > > > > Roger, > > > > > > > > I learned to sail and race by taking a college physical education > class > > > > over 50 years ago. I've raced dinghies through keel boats, including > > the > > > > R22, and as skipper, have a few blue flags to show for it. > > > > > > > > I accept your challenge to match race R22's with the IMF and diamond > > > board. > > > > > > > > I challenge you to produce the videos you said are so common > > > demonstrating > > > > using the traveller on small sloops to dump wind during gusts > > > > that overpower while close hauled. > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > Rick Lange > > > > > > > > > > > > On Thu, Mar 25, 2021 at 2:44 PM ROGER PIHLAJA > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > Rick, > > > > > > > > > > We were having a discussion of mainsail trim and traveler use in > > heavy > > > > air > > > > > wherein the rig needs to be depowered in gusts and then quickly > > brought > > > > > back on line after the gust has passed. Mainsail shape for <= 10 > > knots > > > > is > > > > > considered light air and is a different subject. As you noted, the > > > > optimum > > > > > light air mainsail shape is achieved with a different traveler car > > > > position > > > > > and mainsheet tension vs heavy air. In light air, it is also much > > less > > > > > likely the rig will need to be depowered as per the original > > > discussion. > > > > > > > > > > It is beyond the scope of my job description to give tutorials on > > sail > > > > > trim in all possible conditions. I suggest you take a class or go > > > racing. > > > > > > > > > > Stan, > > > > > > > > > > I give up! I've tried to explain the merits of your GBI 29 > Traveler > > to > > > > > the best of my ability. But, it's not working. If you want to > jump > > > into > > > > > this discussion, go ahead. But, I'm done. > > > > > > > > > > Roger Pihlaja > > > > > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -------------- next part -------------- > > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > > Name: image.png > > Type: image/png > > Size: 3456191 bytes > > Desc: not available > > URL: > > < > > > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210325/763bc9ee/a > > ttachment.png > > < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210325/763bc9ee/attachment.png > > > > > > > -------------- next part -------------- > > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > > Name: New traveller.jpg > > Type: image/jpeg > > Size: 128837 bytes > > Desc: not available > > URL: > > < > > > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210326/74da184f/a > > ttachment.jpg > > < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210326/74da184f/attachment.jpg > > > > > > > -------------- next part -------------- > > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > > Name: Taveller end hardware.jpg > > Type: image/jpeg > > Size: 106100 bytes > > Desc: not available > > URL: > > < > > > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210326/74da184f/a > > ttachment-0001.jpg > > < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210326/74da184f/attachment-0001.jpg > > > > > > > > > > > From Roger_Pihlaja at msn.com Sun Mar 28 10:49:48 2021 From: Roger_Pihlaja at msn.com (ROGER PIHLAJA) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2021 14:49:48 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? Message-ID: Hi All, So, here we are on Palm Sunday, 2021. What are everyone?s plans for a summer cruise? My plan for a Great Circle Loop High Adventure Sailing/Sea Kayaking Tour Of Apostle Islands National Lakeshore continues to move forward. Last week, I was able to reserve a special campsite at Little Sand Bay Campground on the tip of the Bayfield Peninsula for the beginning put-in and ending take-out. After consultation with the campground manager, it turns out campsite #40 has an unused grassy area next to the campsite where we can park S/V Dynamic Equilibrium fully rigged on its trailer. Not only can we use the boat as a pop top camper; but, site #40 has unobstructed access to/from the launch ramp. So, we don?t have to rig/unrig the boat at the launch ramp. Little Sand Bay Campground will also let us park 2 vehicles + the empty boat trailer in their parking lot while we?re out on the water. The National Park Service only reserves backcountry campsites out in the Apostle Islands 1 month in advance. I will have to set my alarm clock early on June 22-24, 2021 to make sure I get on-line and reserve the campsites I want. I have the design for the kayak towing harness finished and I?ve started accumulating pieces/parts. After doing some research and modeling, I think a towing harness that lines the 4 boats up side-by-side will tow the best, be the most seaworthy configuration, and the easiest to deal with around the marina and on the beach. But, I plan to do some tow testing with S/V Dynamic Equilibrium in late May or early June in Ross Lake, about 12 miles from my house. I have finished the 4 cockpit covers with their around the hull retaining straps and verified fit/security on each of the kayaks. Losing a cockpit cover and filling the cockpit with water on Lake Superior might be the start of a bad day on the water! But, my biggest potential show stopper issue is me. As many of you know, I am 67 years old with A-Fib and 2 arthritic knees. I have a pacemaker and last month, I had my 2nd Cardiac Ablation procedure. For those of you not familiar with a Cardiac Ablation, it involves making an incision in your groin, snaking a catheter-like probe up the big vein in your leg back into the heart, and then selectively electrocuting the biological pacemaker cells that are causing the A-Fib. It stops the A-Fib; but, you are left with electrical burns and scar tissue inside the heart. 6 weeks after the Cardiac Ablation procedure, I still tire easily and have very poor aerobic stamina. I have a lot of rehab work to do in order to be ready for the High Adventure Trip in July. So, what cruise trips are everyone else planning? Roger Pihlaja S/V Dynamic Equilibrium Sent from Mail for Windows 10 From mweisner at ebsmed.com Sun Mar 28 11:26:42 2021 From: mweisner at ebsmed.com (Michael D. Weisner) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2021 11:26:42 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <000601d723e6$c24a79f0$46df6dd0$@ebsmed.com> Roger, As I have aged, my ability to enter and exit my Pamlico 145T from my Rhodes 22 has become more challenging. Dinghy transfers are not a problem but the kayak has proven too unstable to access from the side of the Rhodes or even the swim ladder. Maybe if I had a swim platform it would be easier. Do you have any tips? Mike s/v Wind Lass ('91) Nissequogue River, NY -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of ROGER PIHLAJA Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2021 10:50 AM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? Hi All, So, here we are on Palm Sunday, 2021. What are everyone's plans for a summer cruise? My plan for a Great Circle Loop High Adventure Sailing/Sea Kayaking Tour Of Apostle Islands National Lakeshore continues to move forward. Last week, I was able to reserve a special campsite at Little Sand Bay Campground on the tip of the Bayfield Peninsula for the beginning put-in and ending take-out. After consultation with the campground manager, it turns out campsite #40 has an unused grassy area next to the campsite where we can park S/V Dynamic Equilibrium fully rigged on its trailer. Not only can we use the boat as a pop top camper; but, site #40 has unobstructed access to/from the launch ramp. So, we don't have to rig/unrig the boat at the launch ramp. Little Sand Bay Campground will also let us park 2 vehicles + the empty boat trailer in their parking lot while we're out on the water. The National Park Service only reserves backcountry campsites out in the Apostle Islands 1 month in advance. I will have to set my alarm clock early on June 22-24, 2021 to make sure I get on-line and reserve the campsites I want. I have the design for the kayak towing harness finished and I've started accumulating pieces/parts. After doing some research and modeling, I think a towing harness that lines the 4 boats up side-by-side will tow the best, be the most seaworthy configuration, and the easiest to deal with around the marina and on the beach. But, I plan to do some tow testing with S/V Dynamic Equilibrium in late May or early June in Ross Lake, about 12 miles from my house. I have finished the 4 cockpit covers with their around the hull retaining straps and verified fit/security on each of the kayaks. Losing a cockpit cover and filling the cockpit with water on Lake Superior might be the start of a bad day on the water! But, my biggest potential show stopper issue is me. As many of you know, I am 67 years old with A-Fib and 2 arthritic knees. I have a pacemaker and last month, I had my 2nd Cardiac Ablation procedure. For those of you not familiar with a Cardiac Ablation, it involves making an incision in your groin, snaking a catheter-like probe up the big vein in your leg back into the heart, and then selectively electrocuting the biological pacemaker cells that are causing the A-Fib. It stops the A-Fib; but, you are left with electrical burns and scar tissue inside the heart. 6 weeks after the Cardiac Ablation procedure, I still tire easily and have very poor aerobic stamina. I have a lot of rehab work to do in order to be ready for the High Adventure Trip in July. So, what cruise trips are everyone else planning? Roger Pihlaja S/V Dynamic Equilibrium Sent from Mail for Windows 10 From chrisgeankoplis at gmail.com Sun Mar 28 11:35:50 2021 From: chrisgeankoplis at gmail.com (Chris Geankoplis) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2021 11:35:50 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? In-Reply-To: <000601d723e6$c24a79f0$46df6dd0$@ebsmed.com> References: <000601d723e6$c24a79f0$46df6dd0$@ebsmed.com> Message-ID: Hey Roger, Just an observation. I had an ablation about 7 years ago. Got my stamina back pretty quickly and no problems. Plans? Plans? We don? need no stinkin? plans. Well actually we aren?t making no stinkin? plans. Gotta wait to see if Greece will open up by July, if so we go, if not something with the other Rhodes. Chris G Enosis On Sun, Mar 28, 2021 at 11:26 AM Michael D. Weisner wrote: > Roger, > > As I have aged, my ability to enter and exit my Pamlico 145T from my Rhodes > 22 has become more challenging. Dinghy transfers are not a problem but the > kayak has proven too unstable to access from the side of the Rhodes or even > the swim ladder. > > Maybe if I had a swim platform it would be easier. > > Do you have any tips? > > Mike > s/v Wind Lass ('91) > Nissequogue River, NY > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of > ROGER > PIHLAJA > Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2021 10:50 AM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? > > Hi All, > > So, here we are on Palm Sunday, 2021. What are everyone's plans for a > summer cruise? > > My plan for a Great Circle Loop High Adventure Sailing/Sea Kayaking Tour Of > Apostle Islands National Lakeshore continues to move forward. Last week, I > was able to reserve a special campsite at Little Sand Bay Campground on the > tip of the Bayfield Peninsula for the beginning put-in and ending take-out. > After consultation with the campground manager, it turns out campsite #40 > has an unused grassy area next to the campsite where we can park S/V > Dynamic > Equilibrium fully rigged on its trailer. Not only can we use the boat as a > pop top camper; but, site #40 has unobstructed access to/from the launch > ramp. So, we don't have to rig/unrig the boat at the launch ramp. Little > Sand Bay Campground will also let us park 2 vehicles + the empty boat > trailer in their parking lot while we're out on the water. > > The National Park Service only reserves backcountry campsites out in the > Apostle Islands 1 month in advance. I will have to set my alarm clock > early > on June 22-24, 2021 to make sure I get on-line and reserve the campsites I > want. > > I have the design for the kayak towing harness finished and I've started > accumulating pieces/parts. After doing some research and modeling, I think > a towing harness that lines the 4 boats up side-by-side will tow the best, > be the most seaworthy configuration, and the easiest to deal with around > the > marina and on the beach. But, I plan to do some tow testing with S/V > Dynamic Equilibrium in late May or early June in Ross Lake, about 12 miles > from my house. I have finished the 4 cockpit covers with their around the > hull retaining straps and verified fit/security on each of the kayaks. > Losing a cockpit cover and filling the cockpit with water on Lake Superior > might be the start of a bad day on the water! > > But, my biggest potential show stopper issue is me. As many of you know, I > am 67 years old with A-Fib and 2 arthritic knees. I have a pacemaker and > last month, I had my 2nd Cardiac Ablation procedure. For those of you not > familiar with a Cardiac Ablation, it involves making an incision in your > groin, snaking a catheter-like probe up the big vein in your leg back into > the heart, and then selectively electrocuting the biological pacemaker > cells > that are causing the A-Fib. It stops the A-Fib; but, you are left with > electrical burns and scar tissue inside the heart. 6 weeks after the > Cardiac Ablation procedure, I still tire easily and have very poor aerobic > stamina. I have a lot of rehab work to do in order to be ready for the > High > Adventure Trip in July. > > So, what cruise trips are everyone else planning? > > Roger Pihlaja > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > > > > > Sent from Mail for Windows > 10 > > From jesse.laten.shumaker at gmail.com Sun Mar 28 12:14:59 2021 From: jesse.laten.shumaker at gmail.com (Jesse Shumaker) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2021 11:14:59 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hi Roger, I hope your recovery picks up speed so you can enjoy the trip to Apostle Islands. We would all enjoy hearing about it. Hopefully Greece opens up so we can look forward to hearing more of Chris G's adventures abroad. We've got a few trips planned. A couple of these I have mentioned earlier on the list. - Some sailing classes in San Francisco in late May / early June - Charter from Traverse City in late June / early July. This time we are going with another couple that are also sailors we plan to make it out of Grand Traverse Bay and up to Charlevoix. If the weather permits, we'll make it over to Beaver Island. If we get there, then I'll look for the signs that your son made for trails awhile ago. - A sailing class in August out of Bayfield, Wisconsin to somewhere across Lake Superior with some local sailor friends. I appreciate the insight you provided on considerations for this trip. - One or two road trips with my Rhodes to larger lakes in the region. Probably over labor day weekend but perhaps another one earlier in the season. We might make it down to one of the larger lakes in Kansas. Now that I've got my own tow vehicle it makes it easier to plan a trip. Fortunately my wife likes sailing and doesn't mind me spending a lot of time at the lake. She's looking forward to sailing season as well, especially since it has such a positive impact on my mood :) Next year I may do a longer road trip with my Rhodes. I'm working my way up as I get used to towing. Sometime in the next few years, I would like to take my Rhodes up to Lake Mille Lacs in Minnesota and do a circumnavigation. It's a relatively big body of water for the midwest if you set aside the Great Lakes. At the link below, you can see a trip report from someone that has done that: http://www.altenberg.com/gary/MilleLacs/ It would be interesting to hear about the adventures from other folks on the list. Jesse Shumaker S/V Zephyr On Sun, Mar 28, 2021 at 9:49 AM ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: > Hi All, > > So, here we are on Palm Sunday, 2021. What are everyone?s plans for a > summer cruise? > > My plan for a Great Circle Loop High Adventure Sailing/Sea Kayaking Tour > Of Apostle Islands National Lakeshore continues to move forward. Last > week, I was able to reserve a special campsite at Little Sand Bay > Campground on the tip of the Bayfield Peninsula for the beginning put-in > and ending take-out. After consultation with the campground manager, it > turns out campsite #40 has an unused grassy area next to the campsite where > we can park S/V Dynamic Equilibrium fully rigged on its trailer. Not only > can we use the boat as a pop top camper; but, site #40 has unobstructed > access to/from the launch ramp. So, we don?t have to rig/unrig the boat at > the launch ramp. Little Sand Bay Campground will also let us park 2 > vehicles + the empty boat trailer in their parking lot while we?re out on > the water. > > The National Park Service only reserves backcountry campsites out in the > Apostle Islands 1 month in advance. I will have to set my alarm clock > early on June 22-24, 2021 to make sure I get on-line and reserve the > campsites I want. > > I have the design for the kayak towing harness finished and I?ve started > accumulating pieces/parts. After doing some research and modeling, I think > a towing harness that lines the 4 boats up side-by-side will tow the best, > be the most seaworthy configuration, and the easiest to deal with around > the marina and on the beach. But, I plan to do some tow testing with S/V > Dynamic Equilibrium in late May or early June in Ross Lake, about 12 miles > from my house. I have finished the 4 cockpit covers with their around the > hull retaining straps and verified fit/security on each of the kayaks. > Losing a cockpit cover and filling the cockpit with water on Lake Superior > might be the start of a bad day on the water! > > But, my biggest potential show stopper issue is me. As many of you know, > I am 67 years old with A-Fib and 2 arthritic knees. I have a pacemaker and > last month, I had my 2nd Cardiac Ablation procedure. For those of you not > familiar with a Cardiac Ablation, it involves making an incision in your > groin, snaking a catheter-like probe up the big vein in your leg back into > the heart, and then selectively electrocuting the biological pacemaker > cells that are causing the A-Fib. It stops the A-Fib; but, you are left > with electrical burns and scar tissue inside the heart. 6 weeks after the > Cardiac Ablation procedure, I still tire easily and have very poor aerobic > stamina. I have a lot of rehab work to do in order to be ready for the > High Adventure Trip in July. > > So, what cruise trips are everyone else planning? > > Roger Pihlaja > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > > > > > Sent from Mail for > Windows 10 > > From tavares0947 at gmail.com Sun Mar 28 12:15:59 2021 From: tavares0947 at gmail.com (Todd Tavares) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2021 12:15:59 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications - another alternative In-Reply-To: References: <011601d72249$f0e2ee80$d2a8cb80$@ca> <012101d7224d$97b44940$c71cdbc0$@ca> Message-ID: Roger, Thanks for the clarification on the part number. I have never looked at the online parts catalog. I'm not a holder of an ROC nor did I have the preceding C of S; eventhough IIRC, I offered to pay Stan the then 5% of the purchase price of my first Rhodes 22. $15 on the purchase price of $300...which, again my memory is hazy, he declined. I think he mused once that I was an honorary member. I have enough tools in my garage to open a machine shop, as well as a few heavy duty Pfaff sewing machines. There isn't much I can't fabricate myself so I would rather pay Stan full price if I ever needed anything. As yet, the only thing I want would be one of those nice all fiberglass tillers. I will have to check out the parts list. Thanks. Todd T. tavares0947 at gmail.com On Sun, Mar 28, 2021, 6:31 AM ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: > Todd, > GBI 29 is the part number of the latest generation traveler on the factory > website. One of the e-mail posts has a copy of the part number, catalog > description, and price taken from the on-line parts catalog. I started > using this designation to distinguish the latest generation traveler from > the 2nd generation traveler. The 2nd generation traveler is the one with > the bar that attaches between sockets on the backstays and has the 2:1 > control line tackle rigged from the traveler car to jam cleats on each end > of the bar. I used a 2nd generation traveler for many years and upgraded > to the GBI 29 Traveler 3 seasons ago. In fact, I still have my old 2nd > generation traveler in my garage. The differences between these two > generations of factory travelers may have slipped thru the cracks during > the lengthy discussion. If people are confused about the two different > generations of factory travelers; then, I apologize. But, I fear we might > have just wasted a great deal of time and energy arguing past each other > about 2 different things. > > Roger Pihlaja > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > Sent from Mail for > Windows 10 > > From: Todd Tavares > Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2021 9:24 PM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications - > another alternative > > So, > > How did we arrive at the GBI 29 Traveler designation? Save me from reading > the 46+ posts. > > Todd T. > > tavares0947 at gmail.com > > On Sat, Mar 27, 2021, 9:00 PM ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: > > > Rick, > > > > In all the dozens of posts in this thread, someone said they were busting > > their knuckles on their traveler. I don?t remember who. I remember > asking > > what they were hitting their knuckles on. I don?t think I ever got a > > response. > > > > Can you post a picture of your traveler? From your last post, it sounds > > like you don?t have a GBI 29 Traveler. Rather, you have a 2nd generation > > traveler modified with cam cleats replacing the OEM standard jam cleats. > > > > Roger Pihlaja > > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > > > Sent from Mail for > > Windows 10 > > > > From: Rick Lange > > Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2021 11:41 AM > > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications > - > > another alternative > > > > Roger, > > > > Although dated in that they don't address loose footed mainsails, these > are > > interesting videos. But they miss the mark. > > > > The videos are talking about trimming the mainsail for windshifts, not > > depowering for gusts. The wind may change direction following a gust, > but > > you better know how to focus on the main problem during the gust.. > > Otherwise, you will be sitting in irons down course as I breeze over the > > finish line. On the R22, you need to learn how to release the mainsheet > > when a gust starts heading the boat up and then deal with the traveller > if > > needed once the wind dies back. > > > > Where did you get the idea that I bust my knuckles on my traveller? I > have > > a 90's vintage one from Stan and it is completely harmless, unlike some > > others I've experienced. The only thing is, I switched out the jam > cleats > > for cam cleats to more reliably hold the control line and to give better > > tacktile control pulling the traveller toward me. And tying together the > > control line ends makes popping the cleats easy. > > > > Regards, > > > > Rick Lange > > > > > > On Fri, Mar 26, 2021 at 11:40 AM ROGER PIHLAJA > > wrote: > > > > > Rick, > > > > > > OK, here?s 2 books on sail trim > > > > > > Bill Gladstone, ?North U TRIM?, 6th ed, (2007), North U, Madison, CT > > > > > > ?The North U Fast Couse?, (1990), North U, Milford, CT > > > > > > Each of the above are textbooks as part of a North U sailing class and > > > there are companion videos under the same titles. > > > > > > Here?s 2 more videos: > > > > > > Peter Bateman, ?Sail Trimming Made Easy?, R129, Bennett Marine Video, > > > Marina Del Ray, CA > > > > > > ?The Shape Of Speed?, R329, Bennett Marine Video, Marina Del Ray, CA > > > > > > One thing you will note in all of these references is that the traveler > > is > > > constantly adjusted to maintain the windward/leeward helm balance. The > > > traveler is not a digital on/off device, it is constantly used for fine > > > tuning while underway. With the traveler and the tiller both under the > > > control of the helmsman, the Rhodes 22?s helm balance can be adjusted > on > > > the fly better than any other boat I?ve ever experienced. The GBI 29 > > > Traveler has the additional advantage of having sufficient range of > > motion > > > and responsiveness to be able to depower the rig in a gust and quickly > > get > > > back on line after the gust has passed. If other boats could do it, > they > > > would! If your GBI-29 Traveler cannot do this; then, you are using it > > > wrong. If you are busting your knuckles on your traveler then I can > only > > > imagine what unspeakable act you are attempting to commit! ? > > > > > > In general, racing dingies do not have as much range of traveler > movement > > > as our Rhodes 22?s. Since the range of movement is limited, you cannot > > use > > > the traveler to depower the main. Some keelboats also do not have > > > sufficient range of motion in the traveler. Some boats are limited by > > > their traveler design, like the 2nd generation traveler on the Rhodes > 22, > > > which had poor ergonomics on the clam cleat placement, thus making it > > hard > > > for the helmsman to operate without leaving his preferred hiking > position > > > on the windward gunnel. Some boats have sticky, poorly designed, &/or > > > placed traveler tracks, thus making it impossible for the helmsman to > > > constantly play with the traveler. Name the sailboats, other than the > > > Rhodes 22, that you?ve sailed that combine sufficient range of traveler > > > movement to be able to depower the rig, good ergonomics for the > helmsman, > > > fast response, and can be operated with one hand. Off the top of my > > head, > > > I can?t think of any. Our boats are unique. > > > > > > The only Rhodes 22 I have access to is S/V Dynamic Equilibrium, a 1976 > > > model. How about if I spot you 10 sec/nm? > > > > > > This thread is getting really long and very old. Can we please change > > the > > > subject? > > > > > > Roger Pihlaja > > > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > > > > > From: Graham Stewart > > > Sent: Friday, March 26, 2021 10:37 AM > > > To: 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' > > > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler > Modifications > > - > > > another alternative > > > > > > Rob: No, my boat did not have anything attached to the back stays that > > > would > > > attach to a traveler. I thought that those with the end cups were > > specially > > > made. Otherwise, how were the cups attached? > > > > > > Graham Stewart > > > gstewart8 at cogeco.ca > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On > > Behalf > > > Of > > > Lowe, Rob > > > Sent: Friday, March 26, 2021 10:25 AM > > > To: 'Curtis Ruck'; 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' > > > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler > Modifications > > - > > > another alternative > > > > > > Graham, > > > My first boat was a 1976 and had the traveler bar mounted between two > > 'bar > > > end cups' that attached to the back stays. Is your boat not similarity > > > equipped? I don't think there was anything special about the backstays. > > - > > > Rob > > > > > > ________________________________ > > > From: Rhodes22-list on behalf of > > > Graham > > > Stewart > > > Sent: Friday, March 26, 2021 10:11 AM > > > To: 'Curtis Ruck' ; 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' > > > > > > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler > Modifications > > - > > > another alternative > > > > > > I have been interested in the traveler discussion. My boat (1976) > didn't > > > have a traveler when I got it and the mainsheet was simply attached to > > the > > > table base in the cockpit. My backstays are not equipped to install a > > > traveler and replacing the stays with new ones seemed cost prohibitive > to > > > me. Initially I installed a traveler between the lazerette and the > > cockpit > > > seats. That worked well enough but made movement around the cockpit > > > awkward. > > > > > > My latest version was to mount the traveler track to a 1" stainless > steel > > > tube and fasten that to my stern rail where it would seem to work in a > > > manner similar to those attached to the back stays. The rail does not > > flex > > > like the backstays would but I don't know if that is a good thing or > not. > > > While this system seems very strong to me I am no engineer or otherwise > > > qualified to know. > > > > > > For those who are reluctant to pay the cost of both the backstay > > > replacement > > > plus the cost of the new traveler this arrangement might be worth > > > considering. > > > > > > I like that the traveler being close to the stern rail means I don't > have > > > an > > > additional barrier to reaching over the stern rail to lift the motor > and > > > that it is out of the way when sailing. I don't like the fact the it is > > > awkward to reach the lee traveler line. Any thought on improvements or > > > worries about this installation would be welcome. > > > > > > Graham Stewart > > > Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 > > > Kingston Ontario > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On > > Behalf > > > Of > > > Curtis Ruck via Rhodes22-list > > > Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2021 9:45 PM > > > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > > > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler > Modifications > > > > > > Hmm, i'll jump in and throw my two cents in, with my 1976 R22. > > > > > > When i'm racing in gusty 15+ knots... i am typically sitting on the > side > > > rails above the seat, with one hand on the tiller extension and my > other > > > fully gloved hand is holding the mainsheet uncleated, and i use that > hand > > > to either let slip the mainsheet in a strong gust, or i give and take a > > > little with my hand holding the mainsheet from flying loose. I have a > > > harken 3:1 windward sheeting traveler rail mounted on the back stays. > I > > > try to get the mainsheet as flat as possible. I would never use my > > > traveler to try controlling the main for gusting, holding the uncleated > > > mainsheet just feels natural, a little give, a little take, lets me > feel > > > like i'm riding with the wind, and it allows instant response. Though > on > > > long races my arms feel it. > > > > > > BTW, my traveler setup in the picture. I mounted the harken traveler > > rail > > > on a 1" OD Fiberglass tube with stainless 316 mounts on each end that > the > > > backstays run through. Mounts are attached to the backstay with a > small > > > stainless tube slightly larger than the backstay diameter to reduce the > > > friction wear on the backstays. I love the setup, but sometimes wish I > > had > > > a fixed traveler rail that wasn't floating. > > > > > > [image: image.png] > > > > > > -- > > > Curtis > > > > > > > > > On Thu, Mar 25, 2021 at 8:38 PM Shawn Boles > > > wrote: > > > > > > > Oh boy, a match race! Much more enjoyable than the obscene, but > > > > fascinating, America's Cup races I just watched. > > > > > > > > Cheers, > > > > Shawn s/v Sweet Baboo (1986/2010) > > > > > > > > On Thu, Mar 25, 2021, 1:49 PM Rick Lange > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > Roger, > > > > > > > > > > I learned to sail and race by taking a college physical education > > class > > > > > over 50 years ago. I've raced dinghies through keel boats, > including > > > the > > > > > R22, and as skipper, have a few blue flags to show for it. > > > > > > > > > > I accept your challenge to match race R22's with the IMF and > diamond > > > > board. > > > > > > > > > > I challenge you to produce the videos you said are so common > > > > demonstrating > > > > > using the traveller on small sloops to dump wind during gusts > > > > > that overpower while close hauled. > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > > > Rick Lange > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Thu, Mar 25, 2021 at 2:44 PM ROGER PIHLAJA < > roger_pihlaja at msn.com > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > Rick, > > > > > > > > > > > > We were having a discussion of mainsail trim and traveler use in > > > heavy > > > > > air > > > > > > wherein the rig needs to be depowered in gusts and then quickly > > > brought > > > > > > back on line after the gust has passed. Mainsail shape for <= 10 > > > knots > > > > > is > > > > > > considered light air and is a different subject. As you noted, > the > > > > > optimum > > > > > > light air mainsail shape is achieved with a different traveler > car > > > > > position > > > > > > and mainsheet tension vs heavy air. In light air, it is also > much > > > less > > > > > > likely the rig will need to be depowered as per the original > > > > discussion. > > > > > > > > > > > > It is beyond the scope of my job description to give tutorials on > > > sail > > > > > > trim in all possible conditions. I suggest you take a class or go > > > > racing. > > > > > > > > > > > > Stan, > > > > > > > > > > > > I give up! I've tried to explain the merits of your GBI 29 > > Traveler > > > to > > > > > > the best of my ability. But, it's not working. If you want to > > jump > > > > into > > > > > > this discussion, go ahead. But, I'm done. > > > > > > > > > > > > Roger Pihlaja > > > > > > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -------------- next part -------------- > > > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > > > Name: image.png > > > Type: image/png > > > Size: 3456191 bytes > > > Desc: not available > > > URL: > > > < > > > > > > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210325/763bc9ee/a > > > ttachment.png > > > < > > > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210325/763bc9ee/attachment.png > > > > > > > > > > -------------- next part -------------- > > > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > > > Name: New traveller.jpg > > > Type: image/jpeg > > > Size: 128837 bytes > > > Desc: not available > > > URL: > > > < > > > > > > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210326/74da184f/a > > > ttachment.jpg > > > < > > > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210326/74da184f/attachment.jpg > > > > > > > > > > -------------- next part -------------- > > > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > > > Name: Taveller end hardware.jpg > > > Type: image/jpeg > > > Size: 106100 bytes > > > Desc: not available > > > URL: > > > < > > > > > > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210326/74da184f/a > > > ttachment-0001.jpg > > > < > > > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210326/74da184f/attachment-0001.jpg > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > From sloopblueheron at gmail.com Sun Mar 28 12:41:56 2021 From: sloopblueheron at gmail.com (Rick Lange) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2021 12:41:56 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications - another alternative In-Reply-To: References: <011601d72249$f0e2ee80$d2a8cb80$@ca> <012101d7224d$97b44940$c71cdbc0$@ca> Message-ID: Roger, Here's some of it. You can see a cleat and the knot of the control line ends tied together. [image: ATT00010.jpg] Regards, Rick Lange On Sat, Mar 27, 2021 at 9:00 PM ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: > Rick, > > In all the dozens of posts in this thread, someone said they were busting > their knuckles on their traveler. I don?t remember who. I remember asking > what they were hitting their knuckles on. I don?t think I ever got a > response. > > Can you post a picture of your traveler? From your last post, it sounds > like you don?t have a GBI 29 Traveler. Rather, you have a 2nd generation > traveler modified with cam cleats replacing the OEM standard jam cleats. > > Roger Pihlaja > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > Sent from Mail for > Windows 10 > > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: ATT00010.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 81236 bytes Desc: not available URL: From chrisgeankoplis at gmail.com Sun Mar 28 13:26:50 2021 From: chrisgeankoplis at gmail.com (Chris Geankoplis) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2021 13:26:50 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hey Jesse, We will see about Greece, but if you head to Mollford in Kansas I?ll get you in touch with my son who is co-owner with us on our other Rhodes. He keeps it at the club there. Sounds like you have great sailing season/s planned. Chris Geankoplis Enosis On Sun, Mar 28, 2021 at 12:15 PM Jesse Shumaker < jesse.laten.shumaker at gmail.com> wrote: > Hi Roger, I hope your recovery picks up speed so you can enjoy the trip to > Apostle Islands. We would all enjoy hearing about it. Hopefully Greece > opens up so we can look forward to hearing more of Chris G's adventures > abroad. > > We've got a few trips planned. A couple of these I have mentioned earlier > on the list. > > - Some sailing classes in San Francisco in late May / early June > - Charter from Traverse City in late June / early July. This time we > are going with another couple that are also sailors we plan to make it > out > of Grand Traverse Bay and up to Charlevoix. If the weather permits, > we'll > make it over to Beaver Island. If we get there, then I'll look for the > signs that your son made for trails awhile ago. > - A sailing class in August out of Bayfield, Wisconsin to somewhere > across Lake Superior with some local sailor friends. I appreciate the > insight you provided on considerations for this trip. > - One or two road trips with my Rhodes to larger lakes in the region. > Probably over labor day weekend but perhaps another one earlier in the > season. We might make it down to one of the larger lakes in Kansas. > Now > that I've got my own tow vehicle it makes it easier to plan a trip. > > Fortunately my wife likes sailing and doesn't mind me spending a lot of > time at the lake. She's looking forward to sailing season as well, > especially since it has such a positive impact on my mood :) > > Next year I may do a longer road trip with my Rhodes. I'm working my way > up as I get used to towing. Sometime in the next few years, I would like > to take my Rhodes up to Lake Mille Lacs in Minnesota and do a > circumnavigation. It's a relatively big body of water for the midwest if > you set aside the Great Lakes. At the link below, you can see a trip > report from someone that has done that: > http://www.altenberg.com/gary/MilleLacs/ > > It would be interesting to hear about the adventures from other folks on > the list. > > Jesse Shumaker > S/V Zephyr > > On Sun, Mar 28, 2021 at 9:49 AM ROGER PIHLAJA > wrote: > > > Hi All, > > > > So, here we are on Palm Sunday, 2021. What are everyone?s plans for a > > summer cruise? > > > > My plan for a Great Circle Loop High Adventure Sailing/Sea Kayaking Tour > > Of Apostle Islands National Lakeshore continues to move forward. Last > > week, I was able to reserve a special campsite at Little Sand Bay > > Campground on the tip of the Bayfield Peninsula for the beginning put-in > > and ending take-out. After consultation with the campground manager, it > > turns out campsite #40 has an unused grassy area next to the campsite > where > > we can park S/V Dynamic Equilibrium fully rigged on its trailer. Not > only > > can we use the boat as a pop top camper; but, site #40 has unobstructed > > access to/from the launch ramp. So, we don?t have to rig/unrig the boat > at > > the launch ramp. Little Sand Bay Campground will also let us park 2 > > vehicles + the empty boat trailer in their parking lot while we?re out on > > the water. > > > > The National Park Service only reserves backcountry campsites out in the > > Apostle Islands 1 month in advance. I will have to set my alarm clock > > early on June 22-24, 2021 to make sure I get on-line and reserve the > > campsites I want. > > > > I have the design for the kayak towing harness finished and I?ve started > > accumulating pieces/parts. After doing some research and modeling, I > think > > a towing harness that lines the 4 boats up side-by-side will tow the > best, > > be the most seaworthy configuration, and the easiest to deal with around > > the marina and on the beach. But, I plan to do some tow testing with S/V > > Dynamic Equilibrium in late May or early June in Ross Lake, about 12 > miles > > from my house. I have finished the 4 cockpit covers with their around > the > > hull retaining straps and verified fit/security on each of the kayaks. > > Losing a cockpit cover and filling the cockpit with water on Lake > Superior > > might be the start of a bad day on the water! > > > > But, my biggest potential show stopper issue is me. As many of you know, > > I am 67 years old with A-Fib and 2 arthritic knees. I have a pacemaker > and > > last month, I had my 2nd Cardiac Ablation procedure. For those of you > not > > familiar with a Cardiac Ablation, it involves making an incision in your > > groin, snaking a catheter-like probe up the big vein in your leg back > into > > the heart, and then selectively electrocuting the biological pacemaker > > cells that are causing the A-Fib. It stops the A-Fib; but, you are left > > with electrical burns and scar tissue inside the heart. 6 weeks after > the > > Cardiac Ablation procedure, I still tire easily and have very poor > aerobic > > stamina. I have a lot of rehab work to do in order to be ready for the > > High Adventure Trip in July. > > > > So, what cruise trips are everyone else planning? > > > > Roger Pihlaja > > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > > > > > > > > > > > Sent from Mail for > > Windows 10 > > > > > From jesse.laten.shumaker at gmail.com Sun Mar 28 14:16:13 2021 From: jesse.laten.shumaker at gmail.com (Jesse Shumaker) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2021 13:16:13 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Thanks Chris, it would be great to meet up and sail with your son. I will let you know as plans come together this summer. On Sun, Mar 28, 2021, 12:27 PM Chris Geankoplis wrote: > Hey Jesse, > We will see about Greece, but if you head to Mollford in Kansas I?ll get > you in touch with my son who is co-owner with us on our other Rhodes. He > keeps it at the club there. Sounds like you have great sailing season/s > planned. > Chris Geankoplis > Enosis > > On Sun, Mar 28, 2021 at 12:15 PM Jesse Shumaker < > jesse.laten.shumaker at gmail.com> wrote: > > > Hi Roger, I hope your recovery picks up speed so you can enjoy the trip > to > > Apostle Islands. We would all enjoy hearing about it. Hopefully Greece > > opens up so we can look forward to hearing more of Chris G's adventures > > abroad. > > > > We've got a few trips planned. A couple of these I have mentioned > earlier > > on the list. > > > > - Some sailing classes in San Francisco in late May / early June > > - Charter from Traverse City in late June / early July. This time we > > are going with another couple that are also sailors we plan to make it > > out > > of Grand Traverse Bay and up to Charlevoix. If the weather permits, > > we'll > > make it over to Beaver Island. If we get there, then I'll look for > the > > signs that your son made for trails awhile ago. > > - A sailing class in August out of Bayfield, Wisconsin to somewhere > > across Lake Superior with some local sailor friends. I appreciate the > > insight you provided on considerations for this trip. > > - One or two road trips with my Rhodes to larger lakes in the region. > > Probably over labor day weekend but perhaps another one earlier in the > > season. We might make it down to one of the larger lakes in Kansas. > > Now > > that I've got my own tow vehicle it makes it easier to plan a trip. > > > > Fortunately my wife likes sailing and doesn't mind me spending a lot of > > time at the lake. She's looking forward to sailing season as well, > > especially since it has such a positive impact on my mood :) > > > > Next year I may do a longer road trip with my Rhodes. I'm working my way > > up as I get used to towing. Sometime in the next few years, I would > like > > to take my Rhodes up to Lake Mille Lacs in Minnesota and do a > > circumnavigation. It's a relatively big body of water for the midwest if > > you set aside the Great Lakes. At the link below, you can see a trip > > report from someone that has done that: > > http://www.altenberg.com/gary/MilleLacs/ > > > > It would be interesting to hear about the adventures from other folks on > > the list. > > > > Jesse Shumaker > > S/V Zephyr > > > > On Sun, Mar 28, 2021 at 9:49 AM ROGER PIHLAJA > > wrote: > > > > > Hi All, > > > > > > So, here we are on Palm Sunday, 2021. What are everyone?s plans for a > > > summer cruise? > > > > > > My plan for a Great Circle Loop High Adventure Sailing/Sea Kayaking > Tour > > > Of Apostle Islands National Lakeshore continues to move forward. Last > > > week, I was able to reserve a special campsite at Little Sand Bay > > > Campground on the tip of the Bayfield Peninsula for the beginning > put-in > > > and ending take-out. After consultation with the campground manager, > it > > > turns out campsite #40 has an unused grassy area next to the campsite > > where > > > we can park S/V Dynamic Equilibrium fully rigged on its trailer. Not > > only > > > can we use the boat as a pop top camper; but, site #40 has unobstructed > > > access to/from the launch ramp. So, we don?t have to rig/unrig the > boat > > at > > > the launch ramp. Little Sand Bay Campground will also let us park 2 > > > vehicles + the empty boat trailer in their parking lot while we?re out > on > > > the water. > > > > > > The National Park Service only reserves backcountry campsites out in > the > > > Apostle Islands 1 month in advance. I will have to set my alarm clock > > > early on June 22-24, 2021 to make sure I get on-line and reserve the > > > campsites I want. > > > > > > I have the design for the kayak towing harness finished and I?ve > started > > > accumulating pieces/parts. After doing some research and modeling, I > > think > > > a towing harness that lines the 4 boats up side-by-side will tow the > > best, > > > be the most seaworthy configuration, and the easiest to deal with > around > > > the marina and on the beach. But, I plan to do some tow testing with > S/V > > > Dynamic Equilibrium in late May or early June in Ross Lake, about 12 > > miles > > > from my house. I have finished the 4 cockpit covers with their around > > the > > > hull retaining straps and verified fit/security on each of the kayaks. > > > Losing a cockpit cover and filling the cockpit with water on Lake > > Superior > > > might be the start of a bad day on the water! > > > > > > But, my biggest potential show stopper issue is me. As many of you > know, > > > I am 67 years old with A-Fib and 2 arthritic knees. I have a pacemaker > > and > > > last month, I had my 2nd Cardiac Ablation procedure. For those of you > > not > > > familiar with a Cardiac Ablation, it involves making an incision in > your > > > groin, snaking a catheter-like probe up the big vein in your leg back > > into > > > the heart, and then selectively electrocuting the biological pacemaker > > > cells that are causing the A-Fib. It stops the A-Fib; but, you are > left > > > with electrical burns and scar tissue inside the heart. 6 weeks after > > the > > > Cardiac Ablation procedure, I still tire easily and have very poor > > aerobic > > > stamina. I have a lot of rehab work to do in order to be ready for the > > > High Adventure Trip in July. > > > > > > So, what cruise trips are everyone else planning? > > > > > > Roger Pihlaja > > > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sent from Mail for > > > Windows 10 > > > > > > > > > From roger_pihlaja at msn.com Sun Mar 28 15:55:12 2021 From: roger_pihlaja at msn.com (ROGER PIHLAJA) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2021 19:55:12 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? In-Reply-To: <000601d723e6$c24a79f0$46df6dd0$@ebsmed.com> References: , <000601d723e6$c24a79f0$46df6dd0$@ebsmed.com> Message-ID: Mike, I know what you mean. Getting in and out of our Walker Bay RIB from the side or the stern of our Rhodes 22 is not a problem. But, I don?t envision being able to get in or out of my Delta 145 Expedition kayak from the Rhodes 22 when the kayak is tied off to the mother ship. I suppose if it came right down it, we could use the RIB instead of the kayaks. Four of us, one canoe paddle in each corner, could paddle the RIB into most of the sea caves. But, I don?t want to ask the rest of my family to downgrade from the kayaks unless we have to. Right now, the plan is to dock the Rhodes 22, take the kayak fleet to the beach, separate the kayaks, and launch the kayaks off the beach. Fortunately, there are NPS docks within a few miles of each of the sea cave areas we intend to visit. This is kind of an ugly workaround and I?m not entirely satisfied with it. It would be great if there was some way to anchor S/V Dynamic Equilibrium just offshore from the sea caves and be able to get in and out of the kayaks from the mother ship. But, when the mother ship is a Rhodes 22, I don?t see a practical way to do that. Implementing the current plan means I must be fit enough to get on/off the beach and paddle ~4 nm by myself on Lake Superior in pretty calm conditions. We can?t paddle into the sea caves unless conditions are calm anyway. One of the rules of our family High Adventure Trips is, ?It?s not a High Adventure Trip unless there is some chance of serious injury or death!? Part of the fun is in the planning how to reduce the danger to the level of an acceptable calculated risk and accept that challenge. I wish the weather would warm up so I can get out on the water to get some paddling exercise in. Right now, I?m logging a few miles on my stationary bike. I?ve been out once on my real bike; but, only for a couple of miles on easy terrain. It?s hard when you?re trying to recover from electrical burns and scar tissue inside the heart. How do you rehab that kind of injury? I did have my cardiologist reprogram my pacemaker to enable a cardiac redline of 180 bpm vs the factory setting of 100 bpm. She wouldn?t set my cardiac redline any higher. I promised my family I wouldn?t attempt this High Adventure Trip unless she gave her blessing. So, I have a lot of work to do! Roger Pihlaja S/V Dynamic Equilibrium Sent from Mail for Windows 10 From: Michael D. Weisner Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2021 11:26 AM To: 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? Roger, As I have aged, my ability to enter and exit my Pamlico 145T from my Rhodes 22 has become more challenging. Dinghy transfers are not a problem but the kayak has proven too unstable to access from the side of the Rhodes or even the swim ladder. Maybe if I had a swim platform it would be easier. Do you have any tips? Mike s/v Wind Lass ('91) Nissequogue River, NY -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of ROGER PIHLAJA Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2021 10:50 AM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? Hi All, So, here we are on Palm Sunday, 2021. What are everyone's plans for a summer cruise? My plan for a Great Circle Loop High Adventure Sailing/Sea Kayaking Tour Of Apostle Islands National Lakeshore continues to move forward. Last week, I was able to reserve a special campsite at Little Sand Bay Campground on the tip of the Bayfield Peninsula for the beginning put-in and ending take-out. After consultation with the campground manager, it turns out campsite #40 has an unused grassy area next to the campsite where we can park S/V Dynamic Equilibrium fully rigged on its trailer. Not only can we use the boat as a pop top camper; but, site #40 has unobstructed access to/from the launch ramp. So, we don't have to rig/unrig the boat at the launch ramp. Little Sand Bay Campground will also let us park 2 vehicles + the empty boat trailer in their parking lot while we're out on the water. The National Park Service only reserves backcountry campsites out in the Apostle Islands 1 month in advance. I will have to set my alarm clock early on June 22-24, 2021 to make sure I get on-line and reserve the campsites I want. I have the design for the kayak towing harness finished and I've started accumulating pieces/parts. After doing some research and modeling, I think a towing harness that lines the 4 boats up side-by-side will tow the best, be the most seaworthy configuration, and the easiest to deal with around the marina and on the beach. But, I plan to do some tow testing with S/V Dynamic Equilibrium in late May or early June in Ross Lake, about 12 miles from my house. I have finished the 4 cockpit covers with their around the hull retaining straps and verified fit/security on each of the kayaks. Losing a cockpit cover and filling the cockpit with water on Lake Superior might be the start of a bad day on the water! But, my biggest potential show stopper issue is me. As many of you know, I am 67 years old with A-Fib and 2 arthritic knees. I have a pacemaker and last month, I had my 2nd Cardiac Ablation procedure. For those of you not familiar with a Cardiac Ablation, it involves making an incision in your groin, snaking a catheter-like probe up the big vein in your leg back into the heart, and then selectively electrocuting the biological pacemaker cells that are causing the A-Fib. It stops the A-Fib; but, you are left with electrical burns and scar tissue inside the heart. 6 weeks after the Cardiac Ablation procedure, I still tire easily and have very poor aerobic stamina. I have a lot of rehab work to do in order to be ready for the High Adventure Trip in July. So, what cruise trips are everyone else planning? Roger Pihlaja S/V Dynamic Equilibrium Sent from Mail for Windows 10 From peter at sunnybeeches.com Sun Mar 28 16:41:27 2021 From: peter at sunnybeeches.com (Peter Nyberg) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2021 16:41:27 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <8C4077B0-A764-47E1-AAB8-95124AE270A6@sunnybeeches.com> One word: Maine! ?Peter > On Mar 28, 2021, at 10:49 AM, ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: > > Hi All, > > So, here we are on Palm Sunday, 2021. What are everyone?s plans for a summer cruise? > From tom.vanheule at intrinsicprograms.com Sun Mar 28 17:22:12 2021 From: tom.vanheule at intrinsicprograms.com (Tom Van Heule) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2021 16:22:12 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? In-Reply-To: <8C4077B0-A764-47E1-AAB8-95124AE270A6@sunnybeeches.com> References: <8C4077B0-A764-47E1-AAB8-95124AE270A6@sunnybeeches.com> Message-ID: But peter, how do we get up niagra?! Lake michigan to maine is... A lifetime trip? On Sun, Mar 28, 2021, 3:42 PM Peter Nyberg wrote: > One word: Maine! > > ?Peter > > > On Mar 28, 2021, at 10:49 AM, ROGER PIHLAJA > wrote: > > > > Hi All, > > > > So, here we are on Palm Sunday, 2021. What are everyone?s plans for a > summer cruise? > > > > From mitchpadl at gmail.com Sun Mar 28 17:27:54 2021 From: mitchpadl at gmail.com (Mitch Mitchell) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2021 17:27:54 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? In-Reply-To: <000601d723e6$c24a79f0$46df6dd0$@ebsmed.com> References: <000601d723e6$c24a79f0$46df6dd0$@ebsmed.com> Message-ID: Mike, one of the easiest ways to get in a kayak from a boat is by using the swim ladder. It just needs to extend deep enough in the water so that you can put one foot on the bottom rung at least a foot below the water and then swing the other leg into the kayak - sit down and then bring the other leg in. I think I made a video on it a while back, I'll have to look and see. The other option is a seal launch. I did this seal launch video a long time ago. https://youtu.be/Em5bbFNsy6Y?t=50 Good luck! By the way, just kidding about the seal launch from the Rhodes - would scratch the boat too much. Mitch On Sun, Mar 28, 2021 at 11:26 AM Michael D. Weisner wrote: > Roger, > > As I have aged, my ability to enter and exit my Pamlico 145T from my Rhodes > 22 has become more challenging. Dinghy transfers are not a problem but the > kayak has proven too unstable to access from the side of the Rhodes or even > the swim ladder. > > Maybe if I had a swim platform it would be easier. > > Do you have any tips? > > Mike > s/v Wind Lass ('91) > Nissequogue River, NY > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of > ROGER > PIHLAJA > Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2021 10:50 AM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? > > Hi All, > > So, here we are on Palm Sunday, 2021. What are everyone's plans for a > summer cruise? > > My plan for a Great Circle Loop High Adventure Sailing/Sea Kayaking Tour Of > Apostle Islands National Lakeshore continues to move forward. Last week, I > was able to reserve a special campsite at Little Sand Bay Campground on the > tip of the Bayfield Peninsula for the beginning put-in and ending take-out. > After consultation with the campground manager, it turns out campsite #40 > has an unused grassy area next to the campsite where we can park S/V > Dynamic > Equilibrium fully rigged on its trailer. Not only can we use the boat as a > pop top camper; but, site #40 has unobstructed access to/from the launch > ramp. So, we don't have to rig/unrig the boat at the launch ramp. Little > Sand Bay Campground will also let us park 2 vehicles + the empty boat > trailer in their parking lot while we're out on the water. > > The National Park Service only reserves backcountry campsites out in the > Apostle Islands 1 month in advance. I will have to set my alarm clock > early > on June 22-24, 2021 to make sure I get on-line and reserve the campsites I > want. > > I have the design for the kayak towing harness finished and I've started > accumulating pieces/parts. After doing some research and modeling, I think > a towing harness that lines the 4 boats up side-by-side will tow the best, > be the most seaworthy configuration, and the easiest to deal with around > the > marina and on the beach. But, I plan to do some tow testing with S/V > Dynamic Equilibrium in late May or early June in Ross Lake, about 12 miles > from my house. I have finished the 4 cockpit covers with their around the > hull retaining straps and verified fit/security on each of the kayaks. > Losing a cockpit cover and filling the cockpit with water on Lake Superior > might be the start of a bad day on the water! > > But, my biggest potential show stopper issue is me. As many of you know, I > am 67 years old with A-Fib and 2 arthritic knees. I have a pacemaker and > last month, I had my 2nd Cardiac Ablation procedure. For those of you not > familiar with a Cardiac Ablation, it involves making an incision in your > groin, snaking a catheter-like probe up the big vein in your leg back into > the heart, and then selectively electrocuting the biological pacemaker > cells > that are causing the A-Fib. It stops the A-Fib; but, you are left with > electrical burns and scar tissue inside the heart. 6 weeks after the > Cardiac Ablation procedure, I still tire easily and have very poor aerobic > stamina. I have a lot of rehab work to do in order to be ready for the > High > Adventure Trip in July. > > So, what cruise trips are everyone else planning? > > Roger Pihlaja > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > > > > > Sent from Mail for Windows > 10 > > From mm.bizlist1 at gmail.com Sun Mar 28 17:32:50 2021 From: mm.bizlist1 at gmail.com (mm.bizlist1 at gmail.com) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2021 17:32:50 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Lifting the Mast off of the Boat In-Reply-To: <9EF0E453-EA62-418C-949B-A7D296B85712@gmail.com> References: <1615887333262-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <59702.24.140.30.102.1615943869.squirrel@quickpop.sssnet.com> <9EF0E453-EA62-418C-949B-A7D296B85712@gmail.com> Message-ID: <0fad01d72419$e75af840$b610e8c0$@gmail.com> I used McLube on both the IMF and the Genny--both roll out/in very nicely. I did learn that the IMF is very sensitive to the topping lift setting, which is not surprising. Stan's outhaul car design requires the foot of the sail and the boom to be very parallel. -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of David Bradley Sent: Thursday, March 18, 2021 5:41 PM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Lifting the Mast off of the Boat McLube - I think a teflon spray - works great. Dave B > On Mar 16, 2021, at 9:26 PM, Frank Goldsmith wrote: > > Jerry?s post reminds me of a question I meant to ask the group: is there a proper way of lubricating the black round parts that rotate inside the furling tubes (sorry, I don?t know the nomenclature ? bearings?) so that the furling operation is smoother and doesn?t bind, especially the mainsail? I thought that while mine is apart, I?d see what I could do about that. Or maybe lubrication is not called for, perhaps just wiping them clean. > > Thanks, > > Frank Goldsmith > s/v Mary Bess (1985/2000 Rhodes 22) > Lake Keowee, SC > > >> On Mar 16, 2021, at 9:17 PM, cjlowe at sssnet.com wrote: >> >> I drop and raise my mast bundle every year, at my dock, on the water. >> That being said, I dock at a well protected marina, little wind and no waves. >> If where you dock has similar conditions you should be fine. The >> first thing is to see if you can maneuver 26 feet of mast from boat >> to the dock where you have 55 feet of space that is level to hold the >> mast and remove the furling tube. When working above water, anything >> dropped is usually forfeited. Your idea of removing the boom and head >> sail is a good one, that extra weight and bulk is not your friend. >> Think about replacing the inhaul line while you have it apart. Count >> the amount of wraps of inhaul line on the furling tube and note the >> direction of the wrap. Seek the proper lubricant for the bearings and >> coat them well. Now is a good time to replace lights( anchor, >> spreader, deck,etc. Check the spreader bushings and bolt and >> windvane. I'm sure I forgot a few things, maybe others will chime in. >> >> >> Jerry Lowe >> S/V Country Rhodes '86 >> >> >> George, >>> I was on a sailing adventure with our R22 in Key West a couple years >>> ago and had a problem with ripped sail. I made the decision to motor >>> back to the marina that we had originally launched from and try to >>> repair it myself before continuing on (we were attempting to sail to >>> Dry Tortuga). Like Joe mentioned, I pulled into the slip bow forward >>> and retrieved the mast crutch and GB raising system from the truck. >>> I lowered the mast by myself with no problems and while I could lift >>> the mast and furler myself, it was too awkward to maneuver off the >>> boat alone. My better half guided one end while I carried it onto >>> the dock. Disassembly, repair and reassembly took place right there >>> in front of the boat. Thankfully, the repair wasn't that hard and we >>> were able to get back underway the next morning. >>> >>> I tied the jib furler to the main and carried both off at the same time. >>> I'm going to estimate the mast (in mast furler) and jib together >>> weighed approximately 120- 140#. That's a very general guess. You >>> mentioned you're taking your furler down separately so that should >>> make the rig weigh a bit less. >>> >>> The boat community being what it is, I had no shortage of those >>> willing to lend a hand at the dock. You should be fine at the dock >>> and not having to pull your boat out. >>> >>> >>> Mike >>> SV Emma B >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> On Tue, Mar 16, 2021 at 5:35 AM Gmorganflier >>> >>> wrote: >>> >>>> Question for those who might have done this. >>>> >>>> I want to take my sails in for cleaning and repair. I???ve never >>>> removed my sails, so this is going to be all new for me. I have the >>>> CDI II furler, so my plan is to lower and remove my 175 genie with >>>> the mast up. I then plan to remove the boom, lower the mast, >>>> disconnect the shouds and disconnect the CDI furler from the mast. >>>> I have no clue how heavy the mast with the furled main is. Can one >>>> person lift the mast with the furled main or will I need help? >>>> >>>> My boat is on a mooring. There are some logistical problems with >>>> pulling my boat out of the water....the water depth is too shallow >>>> at my club???s ramp. >>>> Would I be crazy to attempt this with the boat tied to my club???s >>>> dock or pulled up on the shore? >>>> >>>> Thanks for any advice on how to best accomplish this. >>>> >>>> George Morgan >>>> S/V Knotty Lady 1986 >>>> Lake Waccamaw NC >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ >>>> From roger_pihlaja at msn.com Sun Mar 28 18:12:19 2021 From: roger_pihlaja at msn.com (ROGER PIHLAJA) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2021 22:12:19 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? In-Reply-To: <8C4077B0-A764-47E1-AAB8-95124AE270A6@sunnybeeches.com> References: , <8C4077B0-A764-47E1-AAB8-95124AE270A6@sunnybeeches.com> Message-ID: Peter, Cmon man, we need more details than just one word! Roger Pihlaja S/V Dynamic Equilibrium Sent from my iPhone > On Mar 28, 2021, at 4:42 PM, Peter Nyberg wrote: > > ?One word: Maine! > > ?Peter > >> On Mar 28, 2021, at 10:49 AM, ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: >> >> Hi All, >> >> So, here we are on Palm Sunday, 2021. What are everyone?s plans for a summer cruise? >> > From goldsmith.cf at gmail.com Sun Mar 28 18:28:04 2021 From: goldsmith.cf at gmail.com (Frank Goldsmith) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2021 18:28:04 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: The start of an interesting thread. I envy those of you who have sailboat cruising plans. My immediate nautical plans involve paddling rather than sailing. In mid-April I will be joining some friends for an extended weekend of swamp canoeing on the Black River in North Carolina, including a visit to the Three Sisters Swamp, which is part of that river. The Three Sisters section includes the oldest trees in the Eastern U.S., bald cypresses that have been dated back to at least 605 B.C.E., the time of the Babylonian empire. Our group has been exploring various blackwater rivers in the Carolinas since 1980, although we?ve also made forays into the Quetico Provincial Park in Canada, the Okefenokee Swamp in south Georgia, and even a river in Sweden (sadly, I missed that trip). We?re mostly in our mid-seventies now, and for the last few trips we?ve elected to establish a fixed base camp in a nearby state park or some private property (with permission) and make day trips, rather than hauling all our gear in our canoes and looking in the afternoon for dry ground, as we?ve mostly done in the past. The variety of ailments that afflict many men of our age have made unburdened canoes the better choice. But I am looking forward to getting my Rhodes back in the water at Lake Keowee, once new sails are installed in a couple of weeks. Frank Frank Goldsmith s/v Mary Bess (1985/2001 Rhodes) Asheville, NC and Lake Keowee, SC > On Mar 28, 2021, at 10:49 AM, ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: > > Hi All, > > So, here we are on Palm Sunday, 2021. What are everyone?s plans for a summer cruise? > > My plan for a Great Circle Loop High Adventure Sailing/Sea Kayaking Tour Of Apostle Islands National Lakeshore continues to move forward. Last week, I was able to reserve a special campsite at Little Sand Bay Campground on the tip of the Bayfield Peninsula for the beginning put-in and ending take-out. After consultation with the campground manager, it turns out campsite #40 has an unused grassy area next to the campsite where we can park S/V Dynamic Equilibrium fully rigged on its trailer. Not only can we use the boat as a pop top camper; but, site #40 has unobstructed access to/from the launch ramp. So, we don?t have to rig/unrig the boat at the launch ramp. Little Sand Bay Campground will also let us park 2 vehicles + the empty boat trailer in their parking lot while we?re out on the water. > > The National Park Service only reserves backcountry campsites out in the Apostle Islands 1 month in advance. I will have to set my alarm clock early on June 22-24, 2021 to make sure I get on-line and reserve the campsites I want. > > I have the design for the kayak towing harness finished and I?ve started accumulating pieces/parts. After doing some research and modeling, I think a towing harness that lines the 4 boats up side-by-side will tow the best, be the most seaworthy configuration, and the easiest to deal with around the marina and on the beach. But, I plan to do some tow testing with S/V Dynamic Equilibrium in late May or early June in Ross Lake, about 12 miles from my house. I have finished the 4 cockpit covers with their around the hull retaining straps and verified fit/security on each of the kayaks. Losing a cockpit cover and filling the cockpit with water on Lake Superior might be the start of a bad day on the water! > > But, my biggest potential show stopper issue is me. As many of you know, I am 67 years old with A-Fib and 2 arthritic knees. I have a pacemaker and last month, I had my 2nd Cardiac Ablation procedure. For those of you not familiar with a Cardiac Ablation, it involves making an incision in your groin, snaking a catheter-like probe up the big vein in your leg back into the heart, and then selectively electrocuting the biological pacemaker cells that are causing the A-Fib. It stops the A-Fib; but, you are left with electrical burns and scar tissue inside the heart. 6 weeks after the Cardiac Ablation procedure, I still tire easily and have very poor aerobic stamina. I have a lot of rehab work to do in order to be ready for the High Adventure Trip in July. > > So, what cruise trips are everyone else planning? > > Roger Pihlaja > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > > > > > Sent from Mail for Windows 10 > From roger_pihlaja at msn.com Sun Mar 28 19:06:06 2021 From: roger_pihlaja at msn.com (ROGER PIHLAJA) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2021 23:06:06 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? In-Reply-To: References: , Message-ID: Frank, In 2008, our family High Adventure Trip was called the Three Rivers Trip. We put-in on the Kickapoo River at the Plum Creek Canoe Landing, paddled to the Wisconsin River, and then followed the Wisconsin River to the Mississippi River. Along the way, we backcountry camped on sandbars. We took-out at Wyalusing Recreation Area Boat Landing on the Mississippi River. On the last day of the trip, we attempted to find our way thru the Wood Yard Slough, a backwater swampy area off the Mississippi River. Despite having the latest chart issued by Wyalusing State Park and the highest resolution Garmin GPS maps available, we got thoroughly turned around and eventually ended up leaving at the same place as we entered the slough. Exploring a backwater Mississippi River slough by canoe had always been on my bucket list. After this experience, I can say I?m glad I went once. But, I got it out my system! I?ve made multiple paddling trips into the Boundary Waters and Voyageur?s National Park, both of which border Quetico Provincial Park. The international border is poorly marked (if at all!) up there and I?m certain we briefly crossed over into Quetico a couple of times. Did you know there?s a place called Kettle Falls in Voyageur?s National Park where you can stand in the United States and look south into Canada? Roger Pihlaja S/V Dynamic Equilibrium Sent from Mail for Windows 10 From: Frank Goldsmith Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2021 6:28 PM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? The start of an interesting thread. I envy those of you who have sailboat cruising plans. My immediate nautical plans involve paddling rather than sailing. In mid-April I will be joining some friends for an extended weekend of swamp canoeing on the Black River in North Carolina, including a visit to the Three Sisters Swamp, which is part of that river. The Three Sisters section includes the oldest trees in the Eastern U.S., bald cypresses that have been dated back to at least 605 B.C.E., the time of the Babylonian empire. Our group has been exploring various blackwater rivers in the Carolinas since 1980, although we?ve also made forays into the Quetico Provincial Park in Canada, the Okefenokee Swamp in south Georgia, and even a river in Sweden (sadly, I missed that trip). We?re mostly in our mid-seventies now, and for the last few trips we?ve elected to establish a fixed base camp in a nearby state park or some private property (with permission) and make day trips, rather than hauling all our gear in our canoes and looking in the afternoon for dry ground, as we?ve mostly done in the past. The variety of ailments that afflict many men of our age have made unburdened canoes the better choice. But I am looking forward to getting my Rhodes back in the water at Lake Keowee, once new sails are installed in a couple of weeks. Frank Frank Goldsmith s/v Mary Bess (1985/2001 Rhodes) Asheville, NC and Lake Keowee, SC > On Mar 28, 2021, at 10:49 AM, ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: > > Hi All, > > So, here we are on Palm Sunday, 2021. What are everyone?s plans for a summer cruise? > > My plan for a Great Circle Loop High Adventure Sailing/Sea Kayaking Tour Of Apostle Islands National Lakeshore continues to move forward. Last week, I was able to reserve a special campsite at Little Sand Bay Campground on the tip of the Bayfield Peninsula for the beginning put-in and ending take-out. After consultation with the campground manager, it turns out campsite #40 has an unused grassy area next to the campsite where we can park S/V Dynamic Equilibrium fully rigged on its trailer. Not only can we use the boat as a pop top camper; but, site #40 has unobstructed access to/from the launch ramp. So, we don?t have to rig/unrig the boat at the launch ramp. Little Sand Bay Campground will also let us park 2 vehicles + the empty boat trailer in their parking lot while we?re out on the water. > > The National Park Service only reserves backcountry campsites out in the Apostle Islands 1 month in advance. I will have to set my alarm clock early on June 22-24, 2021 to make sure I get on-line and reserve the campsites I want. > > I have the design for the kayak towing harness finished and I?ve started accumulating pieces/parts. After doing some research and modeling, I think a towing harness that lines the 4 boats up side-by-side will tow the best, be the most seaworthy configuration, and the easiest to deal with around the marina and on the beach. But, I plan to do some tow testing with S/V Dynamic Equilibrium in late May or early June in Ross Lake, about 12 miles from my house. I have finished the 4 cockpit covers with their around the hull retaining straps and verified fit/security on each of the kayaks. Losing a cockpit cover and filling the cockpit with water on Lake Superior might be the start of a bad day on the water! > > But, my biggest potential show stopper issue is me. As many of you know, I am 67 years old with A-Fib and 2 arthritic knees. I have a pacemaker and last month, I had my 2nd Cardiac Ablation procedure. For those of you not familiar with a Cardiac Ablation, it involves making an incision in your groin, snaking a catheter-like probe up the big vein in your leg back into the heart, and then selectively electrocuting the biological pacemaker cells that are causing the A-Fib. It stops the A-Fib; but, you are left with electrical burns and scar tissue inside the heart. 6 weeks after the Cardiac Ablation procedure, I still tire easily and have very poor aerobic stamina. I have a lot of rehab work to do in order to be ready for the High Adventure Trip in July. > > So, what cruise trips are everyone else planning? > > Roger Pihlaja > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > > > > > Sent from Mail for Windows 10 > From tom.vanheule at intrinsicprograms.com Sun Mar 28 21:04:33 2021 From: tom.vanheule at intrinsicprograms.com (Tom Van Heule) Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2021 20:04:33 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Maybe he's talking about growing his beard! I jest peter, one big bearded sailor to another. On Sun, Mar 28, 2021, 6:06 PM ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: > Frank, > > In 2008, our family High Adventure Trip was called the Three Rivers Trip. > We put-in on the Kickapoo River at the Plum Creek Canoe Landing, paddled to > the Wisconsin River, and then followed the Wisconsin River to the > Mississippi River. Along the way, we backcountry camped on sandbars. We > took-out at Wyalusing Recreation Area Boat Landing on the Mississippi > River. On the last day of the trip, we attempted to find our way thru the > Wood Yard Slough, a backwater swampy area off the Mississippi River. > Despite having the latest chart issued by Wyalusing State Park and the > highest resolution Garmin GPS maps available, we got thoroughly turned > around and eventually ended up leaving at the same place as we entered the > slough. Exploring a backwater Mississippi River slough by canoe had always > been on my bucket list. After this experience, I can say I?m glad I went > once. But, I got it out my system! > > I?ve made multiple paddling trips into the Boundary Waters and Voyageur?s > National Park, both of which border Quetico Provincial Park. The > international border is poorly marked (if at all!) up there and I?m certain > we briefly crossed over into Quetico a couple of times. Did you know > there?s a place called Kettle Falls in Voyageur?s National Park where you > can stand in the United States and look south into Canada? > > Roger Pihlaja > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > Sent from Mail for > Windows 10 > > From: Frank Goldsmith > Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2021 6:28 PM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? > > The start of an interesting thread. I envy those of you who have sailboat > cruising plans. > > My immediate nautical plans involve paddling rather than sailing. In > mid-April I will be joining some friends for an extended weekend of swamp > canoeing on the Black River in North Carolina, including a visit to the > Three Sisters Swamp, which is part of that river. The Three Sisters > section includes the oldest trees in the Eastern U.S., bald cypresses that > have been dated back to at least 605 B.C.E., the time of the Babylonian > empire. > > Our group has been exploring various blackwater rivers in the Carolinas > since 1980, although we?ve also made forays into the Quetico Provincial > Park in Canada, the Okefenokee Swamp in south Georgia, and even a river in > Sweden (sadly, I missed that trip). We?re mostly in our mid-seventies now, > and for the last few trips we?ve elected to establish a fixed base camp in > a nearby state park or some private property (with permission) and make day > trips, rather than hauling all our gear in our canoes and looking in the > afternoon for dry ground, as we?ve mostly done in the past. The variety of > ailments that afflict many men of our age have made unburdened canoes the > better choice. > > But I am looking forward to getting my Rhodes back in the water at Lake > Keowee, once new sails are installed in a couple of weeks. > > Frank > > Frank Goldsmith > s/v Mary Bess (1985/2001 Rhodes) > Asheville, NC and > Lake Keowee, SC > > > > On Mar 28, 2021, at 10:49 AM, ROGER PIHLAJA > wrote: > > > > Hi All, > > > > So, here we are on Palm Sunday, 2021. What are everyone?s plans for a > summer cruise? > > > > My plan for a Great Circle Loop High Adventure Sailing/Sea Kayaking Tour > Of Apostle Islands National Lakeshore continues to move forward. Last > week, I was able to reserve a special campsite at Little Sand Bay > Campground on the tip of the Bayfield Peninsula for the beginning put-in > and ending take-out. After consultation with the campground manager, it > turns out campsite #40 has an unused grassy area next to the campsite where > we can park S/V Dynamic Equilibrium fully rigged on its trailer. Not only > can we use the boat as a pop top camper; but, site #40 has unobstructed > access to/from the launch ramp. So, we don?t have to rig/unrig the boat at > the launch ramp. Little Sand Bay Campground will also let us park 2 > vehicles + the empty boat trailer in their parking lot while we?re out on > the water. > > > > The National Park Service only reserves backcountry campsites out in the > Apostle Islands 1 month in advance. I will have to set my alarm clock > early on June 22-24, 2021 to make sure I get on-line and reserve the > campsites I want. > > > > I have the design for the kayak towing harness finished and I?ve started > accumulating pieces/parts. After doing some research and modeling, I think > a towing harness that lines the 4 boats up side-by-side will tow the best, > be the most seaworthy configuration, and the easiest to deal with around > the marina and on the beach. But, I plan to do some tow testing with S/V > Dynamic Equilibrium in late May or early June in Ross Lake, about 12 miles > from my house. I have finished the 4 cockpit covers with their around the > hull retaining straps and verified fit/security on each of the kayaks. > Losing a cockpit cover and filling the cockpit with water on Lake Superior > might be the start of a bad day on the water! > > > > But, my biggest potential show stopper issue is me. As many of you > know, I am 67 years old with A-Fib and 2 arthritic knees. I have a > pacemaker and last month, I had my 2nd Cardiac Ablation procedure. For > those of you not familiar with a Cardiac Ablation, it involves making an > incision in your groin, snaking a catheter-like probe up the big vein in > your leg back into the heart, and then selectively electrocuting the > biological pacemaker cells that are causing the A-Fib. It stops the A-Fib; > but, you are left with electrical burns and scar tissue inside the heart. > 6 weeks after the Cardiac Ablation procedure, I still tire easily and have > very poor aerobic stamina. I have a lot of rehab work to do in order to be > ready for the High Adventure Trip in July. > > > > So, what cruise trips are everyone else planning? > > > > Roger Pihlaja > > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > > > > > > > > > > > Sent from Mail for > Windows 10 > > > > From jeffsmithphoto at gmail.com Mon Mar 29 07:00:46 2021 From: jeffsmithphoto at gmail.com (JeffSmith) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2021 04:00:46 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? In-Reply-To: References: <000601d723e6$c24a79f0$46df6dd0$@ebsmed.com> Message-ID: <1617015646651-0.post@n5.nabble.com> WOW! Some video. Do you still do stuff like that? ----- Jeff Smith 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor Atlantic Highlands, NJ -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From mitchpadl at gmail.com Mon Mar 29 07:39:00 2021 From: mitchpadl at gmail.com (Mitch Mitchell) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2021 07:39:00 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? In-Reply-To: <1617015646651-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1617015646651-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: Still prefer rough water although I get a lot more sore afterwards theses days! ? Sent from my iPhone > On Mar 29, 2021, at 7:00 AM, JeffSmith wrote: > > ?WOW! Some video. Do you still do stuff like that? > > > > ----- > Jeff Smith > 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT > Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor > Atlantic Highlands, NJ > > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From roger_pihlaja at msn.com Mon Mar 29 09:10:38 2021 From: roger_pihlaja at msn.com (ROGER PIHLAJA) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2021 13:10:38 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications - another alternative In-Reply-To: References: <011601d72249$f0e2ee80$d2a8cb80$@ca> <012101d7224d$97b44940$c71cdbc0$@ca> , Message-ID: Rick, It?s hard to tell for sure from this photo. But, I don?t think this is a GBI 29 Traveler. My control lines don?t have any knots in them. Do you have a close up picture of the traveler car? Roger Pihlaja S/V Dynamic Equilibrium Sent from my iPhone > On Mar 28, 2021, at 12:42 PM, Rick Lange wrote: > > ?Roger, > > Here's some of it. You can see a cleat and the knot of the control line > ends tied together. > [image: ATT00010.jpg] > > Regards, > > Rick Lange > > >> On Sat, Mar 27, 2021 at 9:00 PM ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: >> >> Rick, >> >> In all the dozens of posts in this thread, someone said they were busting >> their knuckles on their traveler. I don?t remember who. I remember asking >> what they were hitting their knuckles on. I don?t think I ever got a >> response. >> >> Can you post a picture of your traveler? From your last post, it sounds >> like you don?t have a GBI 29 Traveler. Rather, you have a 2nd generation >> traveler modified with cam cleats replacing the OEM standard jam cleats. >> >> Roger Pihlaja >> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >> >> Sent from Mail for >> Windows 10 >> >> > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: ATT00010.jpg > Type: image/jpeg > Size: 81236 bytes > Desc: not available > URL: From peter at sunnybeeches.com Mon Mar 29 09:47:31 2021 From: peter at sunnybeeches.com (Peter Nyberg) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2021 09:47:31 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? In-Reply-To: References: <8C4077B0-A764-47E1-AAB8-95124AE270A6@sunnybeeches.com> Message-ID: <9D190611-A0E2-422C-B1F5-5C5E5BA95F9C@sunnybeeches.com> My cruising plan for this year is for week-long excursions on the coast of Maine launching from the public ramp in Rockland. There will be video. ?Peter > On Mar 28, 2021, at 6:12 PM, ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: > > Peter, > > Cmon man, we need more details than just one word! > > Roger Pihlaja > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > Sent from my iPhone > >> On Mar 28, 2021, at 4:42 PM, Peter Nyberg wrote: >> >> ?One word: Maine! >> >> ?Peter >> >>> On Mar 28, 2021, at 10:49 AM, ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: >>> >>> Hi All, >>> >>> So, here we are on Palm Sunday, 2021. What are everyone?s plans for a summer cruise? >>> >> From hnw555 at gmail.com Mon Mar 29 10:10:12 2021 From: hnw555 at gmail.com (Hank) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2021 10:10:12 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? In-Reply-To: <9D190611-A0E2-422C-B1F5-5C5E5BA95F9C@sunnybeeches.com> References: <8C4077B0-A764-47E1-AAB8-95124AE270A6@sunnybeeches.com> <9D190611-A0E2-422C-B1F5-5C5E5BA95F9C@sunnybeeches.com> Message-ID: We'll be up there in July for a 6 day trip on the JE Riggin. Looking forward to seeing that part of the country. Hank On Mon, Mar 29, 2021 at 9:48 AM Peter Nyberg wrote: > My cruising plan for this year is for week-long excursions on the coast of > Maine launching from the public ramp in Rockland. > > There will be video. > > ?Peter > > > On Mar 28, 2021, at 6:12 PM, ROGER PIHLAJA > wrote: > > > > Peter, > > > > Cmon man, we need more details than just one word! > > > > Roger Pihlaja > > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > > > Sent from my iPhone > > > >> On Mar 28, 2021, at 4:42 PM, Peter Nyberg > wrote: > >> > >> ?One word: Maine! > >> > >> ?Peter > >> > >>> On Mar 28, 2021, at 10:49 AM, ROGER PIHLAJA > wrote: > >>> > >>> Hi All, > >>> > >>> So, here we are on Palm Sunday, 2021. What are everyone?s plans for a > summer cruise? > >>> > >> > > From stan at generalboats.com Mon Mar 29 10:55:25 2021 From: stan at generalboats.com (stan) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2021 10:55:25 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] GB Notice re the latest traveler system In-Reply-To: References: <011601d72249$f0e2ee80$d2a8cb80$@ca> <012101d7224d$97b44940$c71cdbc0$@ca> Message-ID: *Please note.? Re the new Rhodes traveler, which is a holistic designed operational system that functions in conjunction with the new outhaul car configuration and the proprietary cut IMF mainsail:** ** **1.??? Per attachment:? No knots.? No Cleats.? One simple continuous control line whose force needed to move it, is controllable with one simple adjustment.** ** **2.??? That the **_part number_**on the ROC parts site ? is? GB29? (there is no number or letter after the 'GB'.** ** **If you purchased this version traveler from General Boats and have any questions, please contact me direct at **? If you purchased your boat from another source that has had its traveler system "improved" by a prior owner, we are not in a position to be of help. If you have found another system, (i.e. Harken) that is*/less costly/*for its total needed parts and */simpler to install /and/handle/*, we would very much appreciate its part number and hearing your take on what makes it the better way to go, with an eye to using it with new and recycled Rhodes in place of our current system. ** **thanks, stan *** On 3/29/21 9:10 AM, ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: > Rick, > > It?s hard to tell for sure from this photo. But, I don?t think this is a GBI 29 Traveler. My control lines don?t have any knots in them. Do you have a close up picture of the traveler car? > > Roger Pihlaja > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > Sent from my iPhone > >> On Mar 28, 2021, at 12:42 PM, Rick Lange wrote: >> >> ?Roger, >> >> Here's some of it. You can see a cleat and the knot of the control line >> ends tied together. >> [image: ATT00010.jpg] >> >> Regards, >> >> Rick Lange >> >> >>> On Sat, Mar 27, 2021 at 9:00 PM ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: >>> >>> Rick, >>> >>> In all the dozens of posts in this thread, someone said they were busting >>> their knuckles on their traveler. I don?t remember who. I remember asking >>> what they were hitting their knuckles on. I don?t think I ever got a >>> response. >>> >>> Can you post a picture of your traveler? From your last post, it sounds >>> like you don?t have a GBI 29 Traveler. Rather, you have a 2nd generation >>> traveler modified with cam cleats replacing the OEM standard jam cleats. >>> >>> Roger Pihlaja >>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>> >>> Sent from Mail for >>> Windows 10 >>> >>> >> -------------- next part -------------- >> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... >> Name: ATT00010.jpg >> Type: image/jpeg >> Size: 81236 bytes >> Desc: not available >> URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: 50e4fc946ccfda33104f307faad0d9f5.jpeg Type: image/jpeg Size: 75505 bytes Desc: not available URL: From peter at sunnybeeches.com Mon Mar 29 11:08:05 2021 From: peter at sunnybeeches.com (Peter Nyberg) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2021 11:08:05 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? In-Reply-To: References: <8C4077B0-A764-47E1-AAB8-95124AE270A6@sunnybeeches.com> <9D190611-A0E2-422C-B1F5-5C5E5BA95F9C@sunnybeeches.com> Message-ID: <6389A2B0-083D-4551-B944-694F552E4CCA@sunnybeeches.com> Small world. My wife and I took week-long cruises on the J&E Riggin for several years running back in the late 90?s. After some experience, we opted for dates in September, for cooler temperatures and better wind. This is how I first became aware of the Penobscot Bay area as a prime cruising location. ?Peter > On Mar 29, 2021, at 10:10 AM, Hank wrote: > > We'll be up there in July for a 6 day trip on the JE Riggin. > Looking forward to seeing that part of the country. > > Hank > > On Mon, Mar 29, 2021 at 9:48 AM Peter Nyberg wrote: > >> My cruising plan for this year is for week-long excursions on the coast of >> Maine launching from the public ramp in Rockland. >> >> There will be video. >> >> ?Peter From lvjkuhn at gmail.com Mon Mar 29 11:35:16 2021 From: lvjkuhn at gmail.com (Lee) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2021 08:35:16 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1617032116809-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Chris, Milford? That's where I learned how to sail back in the mid-70s! Wow I'm old. A friend took me out on a Sunfish. A few days later I went out by myself so I would be confident in taking a girl along with me. Winds were extremely high for a Rhodes so you can imagine a novice on a Sunfish. Fortunately my friend showed me how to right the thing and after about a dozen capsizes I got pretty good at it. Never did take a girl out on it. I believe I saw that your son teaches at my alma mater. Tuttle Creek Lake also has some great sailing but an extremely rough road to get to the "club." http://https://beaconmarineboats.com/boating-in-kansas/ Lee 1999 Rhodes22 TBD Claytor Lake, VA -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From keywestseccorp at verizon.net Mon Mar 29 11:47:37 2021 From: keywestseccorp at verizon.net (Mark West) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2021 15:47:37 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? In-Reply-To: <9D190611-A0E2-422C-B1F5-5C5E5BA95F9C@sunnybeeches.com> References: <8C4077B0-A764-47E1-AAB8-95124AE270A6@sunnybeeches.com> <9D190611-A0E2-422C-B1F5-5C5E5BA95F9C@sunnybeeches.com> Message-ID: <306752139.850983.1617032857858@mail.yahoo.com> Fairwinds 2? will cruise The? Albemarle Loop. then cruise up to Portsmouth Va. from Hertford Nc. for the Cock Island race, if They have it this year.? It would be? nice to have R22 Fleet? Gathering in mid Atlantic? -----Original Message----- From: Peter Nyberg To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Sent: Mon, Mar 29, 2021 9:47 am Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? My cruising plan for this year is for week-long excursions on the coast of Maine launching from the public ramp in Rockland. There will be video. ?Peter > On Mar 28, 2021, at 6:12 PM, ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: > > Peter, > > Cmon man, we need more details than just one word! > > Roger Pihlaja > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > Sent from my iPhone > >> On Mar 28, 2021, at 4:42 PM, Peter Nyberg wrote: >> >> ?One word:? Maine! >> >> ?Peter >> >>> On Mar 28, 2021, at 10:49 AM, ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: >>> >>> Hi All, >>> >>> So, here we are on Palm Sunday, 2021.? What are everyone?s plans for a summer cruise? >>> >> From chrisgeankoplis at gmail.com Mon Mar 29 12:43:13 2021 From: chrisgeankoplis at gmail.com (Chris Geankoplis) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2021 12:43:13 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? In-Reply-To: <1617032116809-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1617032116809-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: Small world indeed. Well let?s you got the right girl. You got the right boat. Chris Geankoplis Enosis On Mon, Mar 29, 2021 at 11:35 AM Lee wrote: > Chris, > > Milford? That's where I learned how to sail back in the mid-70s! Wow I'm > old. A friend took me out on a Sunfish. A few days later I went out by > myself so I would be confident in taking a girl along with me. Winds were > extremely high for a Rhodes so you can imagine a novice on a Sunfish. > Fortunately my friend showed me how to right the thing and after about a > dozen capsizes I got pretty good at it. Never did take a girl out on it. > > I believe I saw that your son teaches at my alma mater. Tuttle Creek Lake > also has some great sailing but an extremely rough road to get to the > "club." > > http://https://beaconmarineboats.com/boating-in-kansas/ > > > Lee > 1999 Rhodes22 TBD > Claytor Lake, VA > > > > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > From sloopblueheron at gmail.com Mon Mar 29 13:31:08 2021 From: sloopblueheron at gmail.com (Rick Lange) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2021 13:31:08 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications - another alternative In-Reply-To: References: <011601d72249$f0e2ee80$d2a8cb80$@ca> <012101d7224d$97b44940$c71cdbc0$@ca> Message-ID: Originally, the ends of the control line had stop knots. I just tied the line ends together instead and with the cam cleats, I can release, move and lock the traveller in either direction from either side of the cockpit. After I rig for the season in about a month, I'll try to remember to take a better picture. On Mon, Mar 29, 2021 at 9:10 AM ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: > Rick, > > It?s hard to tell for sure from this photo. But, I don?t think this is a > GBI 29 Traveler. My control lines don?t have any knots in them. Do you > have a close up picture of the traveler car? > > Roger Pihlaja > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > Sent from my iPhone > > > On Mar 28, 2021, at 12:42 PM, Rick Lange > wrote: > > > > ?Roger, > > > > Here's some of it. You can see a cleat and the knot of the control line > > ends tied together. > > [image: ATT00010.jpg] > > > > Regards, > > > > Rick Lange > > > > > >> On Sat, Mar 27, 2021 at 9:00 PM ROGER PIHLAJA > wrote: > >> > >> Rick, > >> > >> In all the dozens of posts in this thread, someone said they were > busting > >> their knuckles on their traveler. I don?t remember who. I remember > asking > >> what they were hitting their knuckles on. I don?t think I ever got a > >> response. > >> > >> Can you post a picture of your traveler? From your last post, it sounds > >> like you don?t have a GBI 29 Traveler. Rather, you have a 2nd > generation > >> traveler modified with cam cleats replacing the OEM standard jam cleats. > >> > >> Roger Pihlaja > >> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > >> > >> Sent from Mail for > >> Windows 10 > >> > >> > > -------------- next part -------------- > > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > > Name: ATT00010.jpg > > Type: image/jpeg > > Size: 81236 bytes > > Desc: not available > > URL: < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210328/60dfe6c8/attachment.jpg > > > From joedempsey at hughes.net Mon Mar 29 13:49:31 2021 From: joedempsey at hughes.net (Joe Dempsey) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2021 10:49:31 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Lifting the Mast off of the Boat In-Reply-To: <0fad01d72419$e75af840$b610e8c0$@gmail.com> References: <1615887333262-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <59702.24.140.30.102.1615943869.squirrel@quickpop.sssnet.com> <9EF0E453-EA62-418C-949B-A7D296B85712@gmail.com> <0fad01d72419$e75af840$b610e8c0$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <1617040171331-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Should also be level for easiest performance. Thats done with the topping lift. ----- Joe Dempsey s/v Respite Rhodes 22 1989/2005 Deltaville,VA -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From joedempsey at hughes.net Mon Mar 29 14:07:19 2021 From: joedempsey at hughes.net (Joe Dempsey) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2021 11:07:19 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Lifting the Mast off of the Boat In-Reply-To: <1617040171331-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1615887333262-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <59702.24.140.30.102.1615943869.squirrel@quickpop.sssnet.com> <9EF0E453-EA62-418C-949B-A7D296B85712@gmail.com> <0fad01d72419$e75af840$b610e8c0$@gmail.com> <1617040171331-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <1617041239314-0.post@n5.nabble.com> More precisely, the boom should be perpendicular to the mast. ----- Joe Dempsey s/v Respite Rhodes 22 1989/2005 Deltaville,VA -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From mark at whipplefamily.com Mon Mar 29 14:41:53 2021 From: mark at whipplefamily.com (Mark Whipple) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2021 14:41:53 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Motor Mount In-Reply-To: References: <03FD3E2B-C823-4E42-8483-33FB5A89E980@stottarchitecture.com> <5E4905C0-5E49-415F-A5DE-A903A6E377D2@stottarchitecture.com> <003c01d63926$6c8e8bb0$45aba310$@ebsmed.com> <85FEE3FA-D475-484C-9E2C-6CFE9B40055A@stottarchitecture.com> Message-ID: Hi folks, I'm responding to an older post by Roger about his experience using an off-the-shelf motor mount with the goal of seeing if others can share their experiences with a non-GB outboard mounting solution. My R22 has a Saildrive and the manufacturer is out of business. I suspect the bellows may be leaking when the stern is heavily loaded, but even if that's not the case I want to plan for an eventual replacement of that engine. I'm convinced that if I don't take proactive steps, some part of that engine/drive will fail mid-season and I won't be able to get parts for it. As far as I know no one is currently making a Saildrive with an outboard head on it. There are a few with small diesels like Yanmar and Beta. I installed a Beta 16 in my 30' Nimble but I'm not interested in trying to squeeze a diesel into the lazarette of an R22. So I plan to replace the saildrive with an outboard mounted on the stern. I reached out to Stan about bringing my boat down next fall to have a GB lift system installed but he's apparently got too much on his plate right now. In searching some of the email traffic on this topic I came up with Roger's post below. My question: has anyone had success with an off-the-shelf solution? I don't plan to try to fabricate my own sliding motor mount so I need to find something I can buy and install. Any suggestions are welcome. Thanks, Mark Boston, MA 2000 R22 *Luna Mia* 1987 Nimble 30 *Under agreement* 1982 Com-Pac 16 *For Sale* On Wed, Jun 3, 2020 at 7:15 AM ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: > Hi Ric, > > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium originally had a parallelogram linkage style motor > mount. It worked OK. But, before you buy, consider two major > disadvantages of this style motor mount. > > One, the parallelogram linkage has a number of heavily loaded pivot > points. On my motor mount, these pivot points were made from some sort of > riveted bushings. They had no provision for lubrication and so had a > tendency to wear and get sloppy. The GBI motor mount has no such built-in > wear points. This pivot wear was the primary reason I decided to replace > my motor mount back in 2010. But, replace it with what? > > Which brings me to disadvantage #2. By design, the parallelogram linkage > moves the motor out away from the transom as well as down. So what you may > ask? Well, at least on S/V Dynamic Equilibrium, this outward movement > ended up putting the motor?s lower unit right in the bottom of the trough > of the stern wave. i.e. The stern wave?s trough caused the lower unit to > be less submerged than it could have been if the lower unit were closer to > the transom. This made the outboard more susceptible to cavitation in > heavy weather. Note, that I also have an extra long shaft Honda outboard > (25?) to help with this same issue. The GBI motor mount allows the lower > unit to be as deep as possible and as close as possible to the transom as > any motor mount on the market today. The GBI motor mount also allows the > vertical position of the motor to be adjusted. i.e. You can adjust it to > be very deep to prevent cavitation when motor sailing on port tack and then > raise it up to prevent the motor?s upper unit from taking on water on > starboard tack. In the picture of S/V Dynamic Equilibrium?s stern that you > have been referencing, the motor mount is shown in the fully lowered > position. Note how far below the waterline stripe the motor?s lower unit > is. In heavy conditions, often the only way to make progress to windward > is to motor sail. The combination of a GBI motor mount and an extra long > shaft outboard, gives S/V Dynamic Equilibrium significantly more heavy > weather capability vs. when it had the old parallelogram style motor > mount. Another GBI motor mount advantage is the built-in 6:1 block and > tackle, which makes raising and lowering the motor almost effortless. The > GBI motor mount is a well engineered, well built piece of gear. > > Stan, you can send my sales commission to my home address! ? > > Roger Pihlaja > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > Sent from Mail for > Windows 10 > > From: Richard Stott > Sent: Tuesday, June 2, 2020 6:01 PM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Motor Mount > > Hey Mike > Thanks for the research and the drawings. > The lift on Dynamic Equilibrium is what I have seen and remembered. > I have tried to buy this from Stan, but he told me I?d have to bring the > boat to Edmonton to have it installed. > Not sure why. > It looks robust and permanent, but it also looks overly large and > cumbersome for operating the motor with the tiller. > I?m thinking that this West marinate bracket will do the trick. > It has a 16? vertical trail which allows the motor to lift all the way > above the waterline without tilting it and all the gear moves with the > motor so there is nothing in the way of steering or reaching controls. > Has anyone chosen this ?dark side?? > Any reports on after market /non-GB mounts? > Thanks Ric > > > > > Richard Stott, AIA, LEED AP > www.stottarchitecture.com > Office 631-283-1777 > Cell 516-965-3164 > > > > > > > On Jun 2, 2020, at 5:40 PM, Michael D. Weisner > wrote: > > > > Ric, > > > > I'm not sure what you are looking to build in the way of a motor mount. > > > > I searched the archives and found a photo of an GB design on Roger's > Rhodes from a 2019 post at: > > > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20190526/bf33e9c5/attachment.jpg > > and > > > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20190526/97a8a159/attachment.jpeg > > Maybe Stan can ship you one. > > > > Way back in 2007, Jay Bulfer nearly lost his motor while trying to beat > out a storm. s/v Just Bent's engine mount had failed. He provided the > attached drawing and reconstructed the mount using stainless steel (he is a > metal fabricator at jbtek.com). > > > > My GB motor mount looks a lot like yours with the exception of the wood > (see photos added at the end of the message). > > > > Mike > > s/v Wind Lass ('91) > > Nissequogue River, NY > > I?d rather be sailing :~) > > > > -------------- next part -------------- > > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > > Name: MotorMounting.jpg > > Type: image/jpeg > > Size: 2303172 bytes > > Desc: not available > > URL: < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20200602/2b1297c6/attachment.jpg > > > > -------------- next part -------------- > > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > > Name: MotorMountPortSide.jpg > > Type: image/jpeg > > Size: 1833453 bytes > > Desc: not available > > URL: < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20200602/2b1297c6/attachment-0001.jpg > > > > -------------- next part -------------- > > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > > Name: JB's Motor Mount CCF06112007_00000.pdf > > Type: application/pdf > > Size: 775013 bytes > > Desc: not available > > URL: < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20200602/2b1297c6/attachment.pdf > > > > From roger_pihlaja at msn.com Mon Mar 29 15:59:52 2021 From: roger_pihlaja at msn.com (ROGER PIHLAJA) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2021 19:59:52 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] GB Notice re the latest traveler system In-Reply-To: References: <011601d72249$f0e2ee80$d2a8cb80$@ca> <012101d7224d$97b44940$c71cdbc0$@ca> , Message-ID: Thanks Stan, I was starting to feel kind of lonely out here on this branch all by myself! If you want us to refer to it as the GB 29 Traveler, I will of course comply. Roger Pihlaja S/V Dynamic Equilibrium Sent from Mail for Windows 10 From: stan Sent: Monday, March 29, 2021 10:55 AM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: [Rhodes22-list] GB Notice re the latest traveler system *Please note. Re the new Rhodes traveler, which is a holistic designed operational system that functions in conjunction with the new outhaul car configuration and the proprietary cut IMF mainsail:** ** **1. Per attachment: No knots. No Cleats. One simple continuous control line whose force needed to move it, is controllable with one simple adjustment.** ** **2. That the **_part number_**on the ROC parts site > is GB29 (there is no number or letter after the 'GB'.** ** **If you purchased this version traveler from General Boats and have any questions, please contact me direct at ** If you purchased your boat from another source that has had its traveler system "improved" by a prior owner, we are not in a position to be of help. If you have found another system, (i.e. Harken) that is*/less costly/*for its total needed parts and */simpler to install /and/handle/*, we would very much appreciate its part number and hearing your take on what makes it the better way to go, with an eye to using it with new and recycled Rhodes in place of our current system. ** **thanks, stan *** On 3/29/21 9:10 AM, ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: > Rick, > > It?s hard to tell for sure from this photo. But, I don?t think this is a GBI 29 Traveler. My control lines don?t have any knots in them. Do you have a close up picture of the traveler car? > > Roger Pihlaja > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > Sent from my iPhone > >> On Mar 28, 2021, at 12:42 PM, Rick Lange wrote: >> >> ?Roger, >> >> Here's some of it. You can see a cleat and the knot of the control line >> ends tied together. >> [image: ATT00010.jpg] >> >> Regards, >> >> Rick Lange >> >> >>> On Sat, Mar 27, 2021 at 9:00 PM ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: >>> >>> Rick, >>> >>> In all the dozens of posts in this thread, someone said they were busting >>> their knuckles on their traveler. I don?t remember who. I remember asking >>> what they were hitting their knuckles on. I don?t think I ever got a >>> response. >>> >>> Can you post a picture of your traveler? From your last post, it sounds >>> like you don?t have a GBI 29 Traveler. Rather, you have a 2nd generation >>> traveler modified with cam cleats replacing the OEM standard jam cleats. >>> >>> Roger Pihlaja >>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>> >>> Sent from Mail for >>> Windows 10 >>> >>> >> -------------- next part -------------- >> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... >> Name: ATT00010.jpg >> Type: image/jpeg >> Size: 81236 bytes >> Desc: not available >> URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: 50e4fc946ccfda33104f307faad0d9f5.jpeg Type: image/jpeg Size: 75505 bytes Desc: not available URL: From cklang at aol.com Mon Mar 29 16:51:33 2021 From: cklang at aol.com (Cynthia Lang) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2021 20:51:33 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] plans In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <677526273.942339.1617051094030@mail.yahoo.com> We have our boat on the Delaware, 30 miles north of Philadelphia. Hope to finally make it to the Chesapeake this year. Not sure if we will tow it down or take the C&D. I tore a meniscus badly 5 weeks ago, so I have appreciated the discussion about getting on and off the Rhodes. We have a canoe with outrigger stabilizers, thinking that the stability will help with the failing knees, but perhaps our trusty 1970's vintage Avon may be easier. Roger, I enjoyed your presentations at Canoecopia. I hope your plans work out for you this season. Cynthia1990 Rhodes 22 On Monday, March 29, 2021, 11:35:21 AM EDT, wrote: Send Rhodes22-list mailing list submissions to ??? rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit ??? http://rhodes22.org/mailman/listinfo/rhodes22-list or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to ??? rhodes22-list-request at rhodes22.org You can reach the person managing the list at ??? rhodes22-list-owner at rhodes22.org When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of Rhodes22-list digest..." Today's Topics: ? 1. Re: Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? (Jesse Shumaker) ? 2. Re: Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? (ROGER PIHLAJA) ? 3. Re: Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? (Peter Nyberg) ? 4. Re: Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? (Tom Van Heule) ? 5. Re: Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? (Mitch Mitchell) ? 6. Re: Lifting the Mast off of the Boat (mm.bizlist1 at gmail.com) ? 7. Re: Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? (ROGER PIHLAJA) ? 8. Re: Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? (Frank Goldsmith) ? 9. Re: Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? (ROGER PIHLAJA) ? 10. Re: Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? (Tom Van Heule) ? 11. Re: Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? (JeffSmith) ? 12. Re: Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? (Mitch Mitchell) ? 13. Re: [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications - another ? ? ? alternative (ROGER PIHLAJA) ? 14. Re: Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? (Peter Nyberg) ? 15. Re: Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? (Hank) ? 16. GB Notice re the latest traveler system (stan) ? 17. Re: Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? (Peter Nyberg) ? 18. Re: Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? (Lee) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2021 13:16:13 -0500 From: Jesse Shumaker To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? Message-ID: ??? Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Thanks Chris, it would be great to meet up and sail with your son.? I will let you know as plans come together this summer. On Sun, Mar 28, 2021, 12:27 PM Chris Geankoplis wrote: > Hey Jesse, > We will see about Greece, but if you head to Mollford in Kansas I?ll get > you in touch with my son who is co-owner with us on our other Rhodes. He > keeps it at the club there. Sounds like you have great sailing season/s > planned. > Chris Geankoplis > Enosis > > On Sun, Mar 28, 2021 at 12:15 PM Jesse Shumaker < > jesse.laten.shumaker at gmail.com> wrote: > > > Hi Roger, I hope your recovery picks up speed so you can enjoy the trip > to > > Apostle Islands.? We would all enjoy hearing about it.? Hopefully Greece > > opens up so we can look forward to hearing more of Chris G's adventures > > abroad. > > > > We've got a few trips planned.? A couple of these I have mentioned > earlier > > on the list. > > > >? ? - Some sailing classes in San Francisco in late May / early June > >? ? - Charter from Traverse City in late June / early July.? This time we > >? ? are going with another couple that are also sailors we plan to make it > > out > >? ? of Grand Traverse Bay and up to Charlevoix.? If the weather permits, > > we'll > >? ? make it over to Beaver Island.? If we get there, then I'll look for > the > >? ? signs that your son made for trails awhile ago. > >? ? - A sailing class in August out of Bayfield, Wisconsin to somewhere > >? ? across Lake Superior with some local sailor friends.? I appreciate the > >? ? insight you provided on considerations for this trip. > >? ? - One or two road trips with my Rhodes to larger lakes in the region. > >? ? Probably over labor day weekend but perhaps another one earlier in the > >? ? season.? We might make it down to one of the larger lakes in Kansas. > > Now > >? ? that I've got my own tow vehicle it makes it easier to plan a trip. > > > > Fortunately my wife likes sailing and doesn't mind me spending a lot of > > time at the lake.? She's looking forward to sailing season as well, > > especially since it has such a positive impact on my mood :) > > > > Next year I may do a longer road trip with my Rhodes.? I'm working my way > > up as I get used to towing.? Sometime in the next few years, I would > like > > to take my Rhodes up to Lake Mille Lacs in Minnesota and do a > > circumnavigation.? It's a relatively big body of water for the midwest if > > you set aside the Great Lakes.? At the link below, you can see a trip > > report from someone that has done that: > > http://www.altenberg.com/gary/MilleLacs/ > > > > It would be interesting to hear about the adventures from other folks on > > the list. > > > > Jesse Shumaker > > S/V Zephyr > > > > On Sun, Mar 28, 2021 at 9:49 AM ROGER PIHLAJA > > wrote: > > > > > Hi All, > > > > > > So, here we are on Palm Sunday, 2021.? What are everyone?s plans for a > > > summer cruise? > > > > > > My plan for a Great Circle Loop High Adventure Sailing/Sea Kayaking > Tour > > > Of Apostle Islands National Lakeshore continues to move forward.? Last > > > week, I was able to reserve a special campsite at Little Sand Bay > > > Campground on the tip of the Bayfield Peninsula for the beginning > put-in > > > and ending take-out.? After consultation with the campground manager, > it > > > turns out campsite #40 has an unused grassy area next to the campsite > > where > > > we can park S/V Dynamic Equilibrium fully rigged on its trailer.? Not > > only > > > can we use the boat as a pop top camper; but, site #40 has unobstructed > > > access to/from the launch ramp.? So, we don?t have to rig/unrig the > boat > > at > > > the launch ramp.? Little Sand Bay Campground will also let us park 2 > > > vehicles + the empty boat trailer in their parking lot while we?re out > on > > > the water. > > > > > > The National Park Service only reserves backcountry campsites out in > the > > > Apostle Islands 1 month in advance.? I will have to set my alarm clock > > > early on June 22-24, 2021 to make sure I get on-line and reserve the > > > campsites I want. > > > > > > I have the design for the kayak towing harness finished and I?ve > started > > > accumulating pieces/parts.? After doing some research and modeling, I > > think > > > a towing harness that lines the 4 boats up side-by-side will tow the > > best, > > > be the most seaworthy configuration, and the easiest to deal with > around > > > the marina and on the beach.? But, I plan to do some tow testing with > S/V > > > Dynamic Equilibrium in late May or early June in Ross Lake, about 12 > > miles > > > from my house.? I have finished the 4 cockpit covers with their around > > the > > > hull retaining straps and verified fit/security on each of the kayaks. > > > Losing a cockpit cover and filling the cockpit with water on Lake > > Superior > > > might be the start of a bad day on the water! > > > > > > But, my biggest potential show stopper issue is me.? As many of you > know, > > > I am 67 years old with A-Fib and 2 arthritic knees.? I have a pacemaker > > and > > > last month, I had my 2nd Cardiac Ablation procedure.? For those of you > > not > > > familiar with a Cardiac Ablation, it involves making an incision in > your > > > groin, snaking a catheter-like probe up the big vein in your leg back > > into > > > the heart, and then selectively electrocuting the biological pacemaker > > > cells that are causing the A-Fib.? It stops the A-Fib; but, you are > left > > > with electrical burns and scar tissue inside the heart.? 6 weeks after > > the > > > Cardiac Ablation procedure, I still tire easily and have very poor > > aerobic > > > stamina.? I have a lot of rehab work to do in order to be ready for the > > > High Adventure Trip in July. > > > > > > So, what cruise trips are everyone else planning? > > > > > > Roger Pihlaja > > > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sent from Mail for > > > Windows 10 > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------ Message: 2 Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2021 19:55:12 +0000 From: ROGER PIHLAJA To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? Message-ID: ??? ??? Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" Mike, I know what you mean.? Getting in and out of our Walker Bay RIB from the side or the stern of our Rhodes 22 is not a problem.? But, I don?t envision being able to get in or out of my Delta 145 Expedition kayak from the Rhodes 22 when the kayak is tied off to the mother ship.? I suppose if it came right down it, we could use the RIB instead of the kayaks.? Four of us, one canoe paddle in each corner, could paddle the RIB into most of the sea caves.? But, I don?t want to ask the rest of my family to downgrade from the kayaks unless we have to.? Right now, the plan is to dock the Rhodes 22, take the kayak fleet to the beach, separate the kayaks, and launch the kayaks off the beach.? Fortunately, there are NPS docks within a few miles of each of the sea cave areas we intend to visit.? This is kind of an ugly workaround and I?m not entirely satisfied with it.? It would be great if there was some way to anchor S/V Dynamic Equilibrium just offshore from the sea caves and be able to get in and out of the kayaks from the mother ship.? But, when the mother ship is a Rhodes 22, I don?t see a practical way to do that.? Implementing the current plan means I must be fit enough to get on/off the beach and paddle ~4 nm by myself on Lake Superior in pretty calm conditions.? We can?t paddle into the sea caves unless conditions are calm anyway.? One of the rules of our family High Adventure Trips is, ?It?s not a High Adventure Trip unless there is some chance of serious injury or death!?? Part of the fun is in the planning how to reduce the danger to the level of an acceptable calculated risk and accept that challenge. I wish the weather would warm up so I can get out on the water to get some paddling exercise in.? Right now, I?m logging a few miles on my stationary bike.? I?ve been out once on my real bike; but, only for a couple of miles on easy terrain.? It?s hard when you?re trying to recover from electrical burns and scar tissue inside the heart.? How do you rehab that kind of injury?? I did have my cardiologist reprogram my pacemaker to enable a cardiac redline of 180 bpm vs the factory setting of 100 bpm.? She wouldn?t set my cardiac redline any higher.? I promised my family I wouldn?t attempt this High Adventure Trip unless she gave her blessing.? So, I have a lot of work to do! Roger Pihlaja S/V Dynamic Equilibrium Sent from Mail for Windows 10 From: Michael D. Weisner Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2021 11:26 AM To: 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? Roger, As I have aged, my ability to enter and exit my Pamlico 145T from my Rhodes 22 has become more challenging. Dinghy transfers are not a problem but the kayak has proven too unstable to access from the side of the Rhodes or even the swim ladder. Maybe if I had a swim platform it would be easier. Do you have any tips? Mike s/v Wind Lass ('91) Nissequogue River, NY -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of ROGER PIHLAJA Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2021 10:50 AM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? Hi All, So, here we are on Palm Sunday, 2021.? What are everyone's plans for a summer cruise? My plan for a Great Circle Loop High Adventure Sailing/Sea Kayaking Tour Of Apostle Islands National Lakeshore continues to move forward.? Last week, I was able to reserve a special campsite at Little Sand Bay Campground on the tip of the Bayfield Peninsula for the beginning put-in and ending take-out. After consultation with the campground manager, it turns out campsite #40 has an unused grassy area next to the campsite where we can park S/V Dynamic Equilibrium fully rigged on its trailer.? Not only can we use the boat as a pop top camper; but, site #40 has unobstructed access to/from the launch ramp.? So, we don't have to rig/unrig the boat at the launch ramp.? Little Sand Bay Campground will also let us park 2 vehicles + the empty boat trailer in their parking lot while we're out on the water. The National Park Service only reserves backcountry campsites out in the Apostle Islands 1 month in advance.? I will have to set my alarm clock early on June 22-24, 2021 to make sure I get on-line and reserve the campsites I want. I have the design for the kayak towing harness finished and I've started accumulating pieces/parts.? After doing some research and modeling, I think a towing harness that lines the 4 boats up side-by-side will tow the best, be the most seaworthy configuration, and the easiest to deal with around the marina and on the beach.? But, I plan to do some tow testing with S/V Dynamic Equilibrium in late May or early June in Ross Lake, about 12 miles from my house.? I have finished the 4 cockpit covers with their around the hull retaining straps and verified fit/security on each of the kayaks. Losing a cockpit cover and filling the cockpit with water on Lake Superior might be the start of a bad day on the water! But, my biggest potential show stopper issue is me.? As many of you know, I am 67 years old with A-Fib and 2 arthritic knees.? I have a pacemaker and last month, I had my 2nd Cardiac Ablation procedure.? For those of you not familiar with a Cardiac Ablation, it involves making an incision in your groin, snaking a catheter-like probe up the big vein in your leg back into the heart, and then selectively electrocuting the biological pacemaker cells that are causing the A-Fib.? It stops the A-Fib; but, you are left with electrical burns and scar tissue inside the heart.? 6 weeks after the Cardiac Ablation procedure, I still tire easily and have very poor aerobic stamina.? I have a lot of rehab work to do in order to be ready for the High Adventure Trip in July. So, what cruise trips are everyone else planning? Roger Pihlaja S/V Dynamic Equilibrium Sent from Mail for Windows 10 ------------------------------ Message: 3 Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2021 16:41:27 -0400 From: Peter Nyberg To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? Message-ID: <8C4077B0-A764-47E1-AAB8-95124AE270A6 at sunnybeeches.com> Content-Type: text/plain;??? charset=utf-8 One word:? Maine! ?Peter > On Mar 28, 2021, at 10:49 AM, ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: > > Hi All, > > So, here we are on Palm Sunday, 2021.? What are everyone?s plans for a summer cruise? > ------------------------------ Message: 4 Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2021 16:22:12 -0500 From: Tom Van Heule To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? Message-ID: ??? Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" But peter, how do we get up niagra?! Lake michigan to maine is... A lifetime trip? On Sun, Mar 28, 2021, 3:42 PM Peter Nyberg wrote: > One word:? Maine! > > ?Peter > > > On Mar 28, 2021, at 10:49 AM, ROGER PIHLAJA > wrote: > > > > Hi All, > > > > So, here we are on Palm Sunday, 2021.? What are everyone?s plans for a > summer cruise? > > > > ------------------------------ Message: 5 Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2021 17:27:54 -0400 From: Mitch Mitchell To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? Message-ID: ??? Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Mike, one of the easiest ways to get in a kayak from a boat is by using the swim ladder. It just needs to extend deep enough in the water so that you can put one foot on the bottom rung at least a foot below the water and then swing the other leg into the kayak - sit down and then bring the other leg in. I think I made a video on it a while back, I'll have to look and see. The other option is a seal launch. I did this seal launch video a long time ago. https://youtu.be/Em5bbFNsy6Y?t=50 Good luck! By the way, just kidding about the seal launch from the Rhodes - would scratch the boat too much. Mitch On Sun, Mar 28, 2021 at 11:26 AM Michael D. Weisner wrote: > Roger, > > As I have aged, my ability to enter and exit my Pamlico 145T from my Rhodes > 22 has become more challenging. Dinghy transfers are not a problem but the > kayak has proven too unstable to access from the side of the Rhodes or even > the swim ladder. > > Maybe if I had a swim platform it would be easier. > > Do you have any tips? > > Mike > s/v Wind Lass ('91) > Nissequogue River, NY > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of > ROGER > PIHLAJA > Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2021 10:50 AM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? > > Hi All, > > So, here we are on Palm Sunday, 2021.? What are everyone's plans for a > summer cruise? > > My plan for a Great Circle Loop High Adventure Sailing/Sea Kayaking Tour Of > Apostle Islands National Lakeshore continues to move forward.? Last week, I > was able to reserve a special campsite at Little Sand Bay Campground on the > tip of the Bayfield Peninsula for the beginning put-in and ending take-out. > After consultation with the campground manager, it turns out campsite #40 > has an unused grassy area next to the campsite where we can park S/V > Dynamic > Equilibrium fully rigged on its trailer.? Not only can we use the boat as a > pop top camper; but, site #40 has unobstructed access to/from the launch > ramp.? So, we don't have to rig/unrig the boat at the launch ramp.? Little > Sand Bay Campground will also let us park 2 vehicles + the empty boat > trailer in their parking lot while we're out on the water. > > The National Park Service only reserves backcountry campsites out in the > Apostle Islands 1 month in advance.? I will have to set my alarm clock > early > on June 22-24, 2021 to make sure I get on-line and reserve the campsites I > want. > > I have the design for the kayak towing harness finished and I've started > accumulating pieces/parts.? After doing some research and modeling, I think > a towing harness that lines the 4 boats up side-by-side will tow the best, > be the most seaworthy configuration, and the easiest to deal with around > the > marina and on the beach.? But, I plan to do some tow testing with S/V > Dynamic Equilibrium in late May or early June in Ross Lake, about 12 miles > from my house.? I have finished the 4 cockpit covers with their around the > hull retaining straps and verified fit/security on each of the kayaks. > Losing a cockpit cover and filling the cockpit with water on Lake Superior > might be the start of a bad day on the water! > > But, my biggest potential show stopper issue is me.? As many of you know, I > am 67 years old with A-Fib and 2 arthritic knees.? I have a pacemaker and > last month, I had my 2nd Cardiac Ablation procedure.? For those of you not > familiar with a Cardiac Ablation, it involves making an incision in your > groin, snaking a catheter-like probe up the big vein in your leg back into > the heart, and then selectively electrocuting the biological pacemaker > cells > that are causing the A-Fib.? It stops the A-Fib; but, you are left with > electrical burns and scar tissue inside the heart.? 6 weeks after the > Cardiac Ablation procedure, I still tire easily and have very poor aerobic > stamina.? I have a lot of rehab work to do in order to be ready for the > High > Adventure Trip in July. > > So, what cruise trips are everyone else planning? > > Roger Pihlaja > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > > > > > Sent from Mail for Windows > 10 > > ------------------------------ Message: 6 Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2021 17:32:50 -0400 From: To: "'The Rhodes 22 Email List'" Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Lifting the Mast off of the Boat Message-ID: <0fad01d72419$e75af840$b610e8c0$@gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain;??? charset="UTF-8" I used McLube on both the IMF and the Genny--both roll out/in very nicely.? I did learn that the IMF is very sensitive to the topping lift setting, which is not surprising.? Stan's outhaul car design requires the foot of the sail and the boom to be very parallel. -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of David Bradley Sent: Thursday, March 18, 2021 5:41 PM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Lifting the Mast off of the Boat McLube - I think a teflon spray - works great. Dave B > On Mar 16, 2021, at 9:26 PM, Frank Goldsmith wrote: > > Jerry?s post reminds me of a question I meant to ask the group:? is there a proper way of lubricating the black round parts that rotate inside the furling tubes (sorry, I don?t know the nomenclature ? bearings?) so that the furling operation is smoother and doesn?t bind, especially the mainsail?? I thought that while mine is apart, I?d see what I could do about that.? Or maybe lubrication is not called for, perhaps just wiping them clean.? > > Thanks, > > Frank Goldsmith > s/v Mary Bess (1985/2000 Rhodes 22) > Lake Keowee, SC > > >> On Mar 16, 2021, at 9:17 PM, cjlowe at sssnet.com wrote: >> >> I drop and raise my mast bundle every year, at my dock, on the water. >> That being said, I dock at a well protected marina, little wind and no waves. >> If where you dock has similar conditions you should be fine. The >> first thing is to see if you can maneuver 26 feet of mast from boat >> to the dock where you have 55 feet of space that is level to hold the >> mast and remove the furling tube. When working above water, anything >> dropped is usually forfeited. Your idea of removing the boom and head >> sail is a good one, that extra weight and bulk is not your friend. >> Think about replacing the inhaul line while you have it apart. Count >> the amount of wraps of inhaul line on the furling tube and note the >> direction of the wrap. Seek the proper lubricant for the bearings and >> coat them well. Now is a good time to replace lights( anchor, >> spreader, deck,etc. Check the spreader bushings and bolt and >> windvane. I'm sure I forgot a few things, maybe others will chime in. >> >> >> Jerry Lowe >> S/V Country Rhodes '86 >> >> >> George, >>> I was on a sailing adventure with our R22 in Key West a couple years >>> ago and had a problem with ripped sail. I made the decision to motor >>> back to the marina that we had originally launched from and try to >>> repair it myself before continuing on (we were attempting to sail to >>> Dry Tortuga). Like Joe mentioned, I pulled into the slip bow forward >>> and retrieved the mast crutch and GB raising system from the truck. >>> I lowered the mast by myself with no problems and while I could lift >>> the mast and furler myself, it was too awkward to maneuver off the >>> boat alone.? My better half guided one end while I carried it onto >>> the dock. Disassembly, repair and reassembly took place right there >>> in front of the boat. Thankfully, the repair wasn't that hard and we >>> were able to get back underway the next morning. >>> >>> I tied the jib furler to the main and carried both off at the same time. >>> I'm going to estimate the mast (in mast furler) and jib together >>> weighed approximately 120- 140#. That's a very general guess. You >>> mentioned you're taking your furler down separately so that should >>> make the rig weigh a bit less. >>> >>> The boat community being what it is, I had no shortage of those >>> willing to lend a hand at the dock. You should be fine at the dock >>> and not having to pull your boat out. >>> >>> >>> Mike >>> SV Emma B >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> On Tue, Mar 16, 2021 at 5:35 AM Gmorganflier >>> >>> wrote: >>> >>>> Question for those who might have done this. >>>> >>>> I want to take my sails in for cleaning and repair. I???ve never >>>> removed my sails, so this is going to be all new for me. I have the >>>> CDI II furler, so my plan is to lower and remove my 175 genie with >>>> the mast up. I then plan to remove the boom, lower the mast, >>>> disconnect the shouds and disconnect the CDI furler from the mast. >>>> I have no clue how heavy the mast with the furled main is. Can one >>>> person lift the mast with the furled main or will I need help? >>>> >>>> My boat is on a mooring. There are some logistical problems with >>>> pulling my boat out of the water....the water depth is too shallow >>>> at my club???s ramp. >>>> Would I be crazy to attempt this with the boat tied to my club???s >>>> dock or pulled up on the shore? >>>> >>>> Thanks for any advice on how to best accomplish this. >>>> >>>> George Morgan >>>> S/V Knotty Lady 1986 >>>> Lake Waccamaw NC >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ >>>> ------------------------------ Message: 7 Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2021 22:12:19 +0000 From: ROGER PIHLAJA To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? Message-ID: ??? ??? Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Peter, Cmon man, we need more details than just one word! Roger Pihlaja S/V Dynamic Equilibrium Sent from my iPhone > On Mar 28, 2021, at 4:42 PM, Peter Nyberg wrote: > > ?One word:? Maine! > > ?Peter > >> On Mar 28, 2021, at 10:49 AM, ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: >> >> Hi All, >> >> So, here we are on Palm Sunday, 2021.? What are everyone?s plans for a summer cruise? >> > ------------------------------ Message: 8 Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2021 18:28:04 -0400 From: Frank Goldsmith To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain;??? charset=utf-8 The start of an interesting thread.? I envy those of you who have sailboat cruising plans.? My immediate nautical plans involve paddling rather than sailing.? In mid-April I will be joining some friends for an extended weekend of swamp canoeing on the Black River in North Carolina, including a visit to the Three Sisters Swamp, which is part of that river.? The Three Sisters section includes the oldest trees in the Eastern U.S., bald cypresses that have been dated back to at least 605 B.C.E., the time of the Babylonian empire.? Our group has been exploring various blackwater rivers in the Carolinas since 1980, although we?ve also made forays into the Quetico Provincial Park in Canada, the Okefenokee Swamp in south Georgia, and even a river in Sweden (sadly, I missed that trip).? We?re mostly in our mid-seventies now, and for the last few trips we?ve elected to establish a fixed base camp in a nearby state park or some private property (with permission) and make day trips, rather than hauling all our gear in our canoes and looking in the afternoon for dry ground, as we?ve mostly done in the past.? The variety of ailments that afflict many men of our age have made unburdened canoes the better choice. But I am looking forward to getting my Rhodes back in the water at Lake Keowee, once new sails are installed in a couple of weeks. Frank Frank Goldsmith s/v Mary Bess (1985/2001 Rhodes) Asheville, NC and Lake Keowee, SC > On Mar 28, 2021, at 10:49 AM, ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: > > Hi All, > > So, here we are on Palm Sunday, 2021.? What are everyone?s plans for a summer cruise? > > My plan for a Great Circle Loop High Adventure Sailing/Sea Kayaking Tour Of Apostle Islands National Lakeshore continues to move forward.? Last week, I was able to reserve a special campsite at Little Sand Bay Campground on the tip of the Bayfield Peninsula for the beginning put-in and ending take-out.? After consultation with the campground manager, it turns out campsite #40 has an unused grassy area next to the campsite where we can park S/V Dynamic Equilibrium fully rigged on its trailer.? Not only can we use the boat as a pop top camper; but, site #40 has unobstructed access to/from the launch ramp.? So, we don?t have to rig/unrig the boat at the launch ramp.? Little Sand Bay Campground will also let us park 2 vehicles + the empty boat trailer in their parking lot while we?re out on the water. > > The National Park Service only reserves backcountry campsites out in the Apostle Islands 1 month in advance.? I will have to set my alarm clock early on June 22-24, 2021 to make sure I get on-line and reserve the campsites I want. > > I have the design for the kayak towing harness finished and I?ve started accumulating pieces/parts.? After doing some research and modeling, I think a towing harness that lines the 4 boats up side-by-side will tow the best, be the most seaworthy configuration, and the easiest to deal with around the marina and on the beach.? But, I plan to do some tow testing with S/V Dynamic Equilibrium in late May or early June in Ross Lake, about 12 miles from my house.? I have finished the 4 cockpit covers with their around the hull retaining straps and verified fit/security on each of the kayaks.? Losing a cockpit cover and filling the cockpit with water on Lake Superior might be the start of a bad day on the water! > > But, my biggest potential show stopper issue is me.? As many of you know, I am 67 years old with A-Fib and 2 arthritic knees.? I have a pacemaker and last month, I had my 2nd Cardiac Ablation procedure.? For those of you not familiar with a Cardiac Ablation, it involves making an incision in your groin, snaking a catheter-like probe up the big vein in your leg back into the heart, and then selectively electrocuting the biological pacemaker cells that are causing the A-Fib.? It stops the A-Fib; but, you are left with electrical burns and scar tissue inside the heart.? 6 weeks after the Cardiac Ablation procedure, I still tire easily and have very poor aerobic stamina.? I have a lot of rehab work to do in order to be ready for the High Adventure Trip in July. > > So, what cruise trips are everyone else planning? > > Roger Pihlaja > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > > > > > Sent from Mail for Windows 10 > ------------------------------ Message: 9 Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2021 23:06:06 +0000 From: ROGER PIHLAJA To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? Message-ID: ??? ??? Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" Frank, In 2008, our family High Adventure Trip was called the Three Rivers Trip.? We put-in on the Kickapoo River at the Plum Creek Canoe Landing, paddled to the Wisconsin River, and then followed the Wisconsin River to the Mississippi River.? Along the way, we backcountry camped on sandbars.? We took-out at Wyalusing Recreation Area Boat Landing on the Mississippi River.? On the last day of the trip, we attempted to find our way thru the Wood Yard Slough, a backwater swampy area off the Mississippi River.? Despite having the latest chart issued by Wyalusing State Park and the highest resolution Garmin GPS maps available, we got thoroughly turned around and eventually ended up leaving at the same place as we entered the slough.? Exploring a backwater Mississippi River slough by canoe had always been on my bucket list.? After this experience, I can say I?m glad I went once.? But, I got it out my system! I?ve made multiple paddling trips into the Boundary Waters and Voyageur?s National Park, both of which border Quetico Provincial Park.? The international border is poorly marked (if at all!) up there and I?m certain we briefly crossed over into Quetico a couple of times.? Did you know there?s a place called Kettle Falls in Voyageur?s National Park where you can stand in the United States and look south into Canada? Roger Pihlaja S/V Dynamic Equilibrium Sent from Mail for Windows 10 From: Frank Goldsmith Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2021 6:28 PM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? The start of an interesting thread.? I envy those of you who have sailboat cruising plans. My immediate nautical plans involve paddling rather than sailing.? In mid-April I will be joining some friends for an extended weekend of swamp canoeing on the Black River in North Carolina, including a visit to the Three Sisters Swamp, which is part of that river.? The Three Sisters section includes the oldest trees in the Eastern U.S., bald cypresses that have been dated back to at least 605 B.C.E., the time of the Babylonian empire. Our group has been exploring various blackwater rivers in the Carolinas since 1980, although we?ve also made forays into the Quetico Provincial Park in Canada, the Okefenokee Swamp in south Georgia, and even a river in Sweden (sadly, I missed that trip).? We?re mostly in our mid-seventies now, and for the last few trips we?ve elected to establish a fixed base camp in a nearby state park or some private property (with permission) and make day trips, rather than hauling all our gear in our canoes and looking in the afternoon for dry ground, as we?ve mostly done in the past.? The variety of ailments that afflict many men of our age have made unburdened canoes the better choice. But I am looking forward to getting my Rhodes back in the water at Lake Keowee, once new sails are installed in a couple of weeks. Frank Frank Goldsmith s/v Mary Bess (1985/2001 Rhodes) Asheville, NC and Lake Keowee, SC > On Mar 28, 2021, at 10:49 AM, ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: > > Hi All, > > So, here we are on Palm Sunday, 2021.? What are everyone?s plans for a summer cruise? > > My plan for a Great Circle Loop High Adventure Sailing/Sea Kayaking Tour Of Apostle Islands National Lakeshore continues to move forward.? Last week, I was able to reserve a special campsite at Little Sand Bay Campground on the tip of the Bayfield Peninsula for the beginning put-in and ending take-out.? After consultation with the campground manager, it turns out campsite #40 has an unused grassy area next to the campsite where we can park S/V Dynamic Equilibrium fully rigged on its trailer.? Not only can we use the boat as a pop top camper; but, site #40 has unobstructed access to/from the launch ramp.? So, we don?t have to rig/unrig the boat at the launch ramp.? Little Sand Bay Campground will also let us park 2 vehicles + the empty boat trailer in their parking lot while we?re out on the water. > > The National Park Service only reserves backcountry campsites out in the Apostle Islands 1 month in advance.? I will have to set my alarm clock early on June 22-24, 2021 to make sure I get on-line and reserve the campsites I want. > > I have the design for the kayak towing harness finished and I?ve started accumulating pieces/parts.? After doing some research and modeling, I think a towing harness that lines the 4 boats up side-by-side will tow the best, be the most seaworthy configuration, and the easiest to deal with around the marina and on the beach.? But, I plan to do some tow testing with S/V Dynamic Equilibrium in late May or early June in Ross Lake, about 12 miles from my house.? I have finished the 4 cockpit covers with their around the hull retaining straps and verified fit/security on each of the kayaks.? Losing a cockpit cover and filling the cockpit with water on Lake Superior might be the start of a bad day on the water! > > But, my biggest potential show stopper issue is me.? As many of you know, I am 67 years old with A-Fib and 2 arthritic knees.? I have a pacemaker and last month, I had my 2nd Cardiac Ablation procedure.? For those of you not familiar with a Cardiac Ablation, it involves making an incision in your groin, snaking a catheter-like probe up the big vein in your leg back into the heart, and then selectively electrocuting the biological pacemaker cells that are causing the A-Fib.? It stops the A-Fib; but, you are left with electrical burns and scar tissue inside the heart.? 6 weeks after the Cardiac Ablation procedure, I still tire easily and have very poor aerobic stamina.? I have a lot of rehab work to do in order to be ready for the High Adventure Trip in July. > > So, what cruise trips are everyone else planning? > > Roger Pihlaja > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > > > > > Sent from Mail for Windows 10 > ------------------------------ Message: 10 Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2021 20:04:33 -0500 From: Tom Van Heule To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? Message-ID: ??? Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Maybe he's talking about growing his beard! I jest peter, one big bearded sailor to another. On Sun, Mar 28, 2021, 6:06 PM ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: > Frank, > > In 2008, our family High Adventure Trip was called the Three Rivers Trip. > We put-in on the Kickapoo River at the Plum Creek Canoe Landing, paddled to > the Wisconsin River, and then followed the Wisconsin River to the > Mississippi River.? Along the way, we backcountry camped on sandbars.? We > took-out at Wyalusing Recreation Area Boat Landing on the Mississippi > River.? On the last day of the trip, we attempted to find our way thru the > Wood Yard Slough, a backwater swampy area off the Mississippi River. > Despite having the latest chart issued by Wyalusing State Park and the > highest resolution Garmin GPS maps available, we got thoroughly turned > around and eventually ended up leaving at the same place as we entered the > slough.? Exploring a backwater Mississippi River slough by canoe had always > been on my bucket list.? After this experience, I can say I?m glad I went > once.? But, I got it out my system! > > I?ve made multiple paddling trips into the Boundary Waters and Voyageur?s > National Park, both of which border Quetico Provincial Park.? The > international border is poorly marked (if at all!) up there and I?m certain > we briefly crossed over into Quetico a couple of times.? Did you know > there?s a place called Kettle Falls in Voyageur?s National Park where you > can stand in the United States and look south into Canada? > > Roger Pihlaja > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > Sent from Mail for > Windows 10 > > From: Frank Goldsmith > Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2021 6:28 PM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? > > The start of an interesting thread.? I envy those of you who have sailboat > cruising plans. > > My immediate nautical plans involve paddling rather than sailing.? In > mid-April I will be joining some friends for an extended weekend of swamp > canoeing on the Black River in North Carolina, including a visit to the > Three Sisters Swamp, which is part of that river.? The Three Sisters > section includes the oldest trees in the Eastern U.S., bald cypresses that > have been dated back to at least 605 B.C.E., the time of the Babylonian > empire. > > Our group has been exploring various blackwater rivers in the Carolinas > since 1980, although we?ve also made forays into the Quetico Provincial > Park in Canada, the Okefenokee Swamp in south Georgia, and even a river in > Sweden (sadly, I missed that trip).? We?re mostly in our mid-seventies now, > and for the last few trips we?ve elected to establish a fixed base camp in > a nearby state park or some private property (with permission) and make day > trips, rather than hauling all our gear in our canoes and looking in the > afternoon for dry ground, as we?ve mostly done in the past.? The variety of > ailments that afflict many men of our age have made unburdened canoes the > better choice. > > But I am looking forward to getting my Rhodes back in the water at Lake > Keowee, once new sails are installed in a couple of weeks. > > Frank > > Frank Goldsmith > s/v Mary Bess (1985/2001 Rhodes) > Asheville, NC and > Lake Keowee, SC > > > > On Mar 28, 2021, at 10:49 AM, ROGER PIHLAJA > wrote: > > > > Hi All, > > > > So, here we are on Palm Sunday, 2021.? What are everyone?s plans for a > summer cruise? > > > > My plan for a Great Circle Loop High Adventure Sailing/Sea Kayaking Tour > Of Apostle Islands National Lakeshore continues to move forward.? Last > week, I was able to reserve a special campsite at Little Sand Bay > Campground on the tip of the Bayfield Peninsula for the beginning put-in > and ending take-out.? After consultation with the campground manager, it > turns out campsite #40 has an unused grassy area next to the campsite where > we can park S/V Dynamic Equilibrium fully rigged on its trailer.? Not only > can we use the boat as a pop top camper; but, site #40 has unobstructed > access to/from the launch ramp.? So, we don?t have to rig/unrig the boat at > the launch ramp.? Little Sand Bay Campground will also let us park 2 > vehicles + the empty boat trailer in their parking lot while we?re out on > the water. > > > > The National Park Service only reserves backcountry campsites out in the > Apostle Islands 1 month in advance.? I will have to set my alarm clock > early on June 22-24, 2021 to make sure I get on-line and reserve the > campsites I want. > > > > I have the design for the kayak towing harness finished and I?ve started > accumulating pieces/parts.? After doing some research and modeling, I think > a towing harness that lines the 4 boats up side-by-side will tow the best, > be the most seaworthy configuration, and the easiest to deal with around > the marina and on the beach.? But, I plan to do some tow testing with S/V > Dynamic Equilibrium in late May or early June in Ross Lake, about 12 miles > from my house.? I have finished the 4 cockpit covers with their around the > hull retaining straps and verified fit/security on each of the kayaks. > Losing a cockpit cover and filling the cockpit with water on Lake Superior > might be the start of a bad day on the water! > > > > But, my biggest potential show stopper issue is me.? As many of you > know, I am 67 years old with A-Fib and 2 arthritic knees.? I have a > pacemaker and last month, I had my 2nd Cardiac Ablation procedure.? For > those of you not familiar with a Cardiac Ablation, it involves making an > incision in your groin, snaking a catheter-like probe up the big vein in > your leg back into the heart, and then selectively electrocuting the > biological pacemaker cells that are causing the A-Fib.? It stops the A-Fib; > but, you are left with electrical burns and scar tissue inside the heart. > 6 weeks after the Cardiac Ablation procedure, I still tire easily and have > very poor aerobic stamina.? I have a lot of rehab work to do in order to be > ready for the High Adventure Trip in July. > > > > So, what cruise trips are everyone else planning? > > > > Roger Pihlaja > > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > > > > > > > > > > > Sent from Mail for > Windows 10 > > > > ------------------------------ Message: 11 Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2021 04:00:46 -0700 (MST) From: JeffSmith To: rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? Message-ID: <1617015646651-0.post at n5.nabble.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii WOW! Some video.? Do you still do stuff like that? ----- Jeff Smith 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor Atlantic Highlands, NJ -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ ------------------------------ Message: 12 Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2021 07:39:00 -0400 From: Mitch Mitchell To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Still prefer rough water although I get a lot more sore afterwards theses days! ? Sent from my iPhone > On Mar 29, 2021, at 7:00 AM, JeffSmith wrote: > > ?WOW! Some video.? Do you still do stuff like that? > > > > ----- > Jeff Smith > 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT > Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor > Atlantic Highlands, NJ > > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ ------------------------------ Message: 13 Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2021 13:10:38 +0000 From: ROGER PIHLAJA To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler ??? Modifications - another alternative Message-ID: ??? ??? Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Rick, It?s hard to tell for sure from this photo.? But, I don?t think this is a GBI 29 Traveler.? My control lines don?t have any knots in them.? Do you have a close up picture of the traveler car? Roger Pihlaja S/V Dynamic Equilibrium Sent from my iPhone > On Mar 28, 2021, at 12:42 PM, Rick Lange wrote: > > ?Roger, > > Here's some of it.? You can see a cleat and the knot of the control line > ends tied together. > [image: ATT00010.jpg] > > Regards, > > Rick Lange > > >> On Sat, Mar 27, 2021 at 9:00 PM ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: >> >> Rick, >> >> In all the dozens of posts in this thread, someone said they were busting >> their knuckles on their traveler.? I don?t remember who.? I remember asking >> what they were hitting their knuckles on.? I don?t think I ever got a >> response. >> >> Can you post a picture of your traveler?? From your last post, it sounds >> like you don?t have a GBI 29 Traveler.? Rather, you have a 2nd generation >> traveler modified with cam cleats replacing the OEM standard jam cleats. >> >> Roger Pihlaja >> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >> >> Sent from Mail for >> Windows 10 >> >> > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: ATT00010.jpg > Type: image/jpeg > Size: 81236 bytes > Desc: not available > URL: ------------------------------ Message: 14 Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2021 09:47:31 -0400 From: Peter Nyberg To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? Message-ID: <9D190611-A0E2-422C-B1F5-5C5E5BA95F9C at sunnybeeches.com> Content-Type: text/plain;??? charset=utf-8 My cruising plan for this year is for week-long excursions on the coast of Maine launching from the public ramp in Rockland. There will be video. ?Peter > On Mar 28, 2021, at 6:12 PM, ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: > > Peter, > > Cmon man, we need more details than just one word! > > Roger Pihlaja > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > Sent from my iPhone > >> On Mar 28, 2021, at 4:42 PM, Peter Nyberg wrote: >> >> ?One word:? Maine! >> >> ?Peter >> >>> On Mar 28, 2021, at 10:49 AM, ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: >>> >>> Hi All, >>> >>> So, here we are on Palm Sunday, 2021.? What are everyone?s plans for a summer cruise? >>> >> ------------------------------ Message: 15 Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2021 10:10:12 -0400 From: Hank To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? Message-ID: ??? Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" We'll be up there in July for a 6 day trip on the JE Riggin. Looking forward to seeing that part of the country. Hank On Mon, Mar 29, 2021 at 9:48 AM Peter Nyberg wrote: > My cruising plan for this year is for week-long excursions on the coast of > Maine launching from the public ramp in Rockland. > > There will be video. > > ?Peter > > > On Mar 28, 2021, at 6:12 PM, ROGER PIHLAJA > wrote: > > > > Peter, > > > > Cmon man, we need more details than just one word! > > > > Roger Pihlaja > > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > > > Sent from my iPhone > > > >> On Mar 28, 2021, at 4:42 PM, Peter Nyberg > wrote: > >> > >> ?One word:? Maine! > >> > >> ?Peter > >> > >>> On Mar 28, 2021, at 10:49 AM, ROGER PIHLAJA > wrote: > >>> > >>> Hi All, > >>> > >>> So, here we are on Palm Sunday, 2021.? What are everyone?s plans for a > summer cruise? > >>> > >> > > ------------------------------ Message: 16 Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2021 10:55:25 -0400 From: stan To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: [Rhodes22-list] GB Notice re the latest traveler system Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"; Format="flowed" *Please note.? Re the new Rhodes traveler, which is a holistic designed operational system that functions in conjunction with the new outhaul car configuration and the proprietary cut IMF mainsail:** ** **1.??? Per attachment:? No knots.? No Cleats.? One simple continuous control line whose force needed to move it, is controllable with one simple adjustment.** ** **2.??? That the **_part number_**on the ROC parts site ? is? GB29? (there is no number or letter after the 'GB'.** ** **If you purchased this version traveler from General Boats and have any questions, please contact me direct at **? If you purchased your boat from another source that has had its traveler system "improved" by a prior owner, we are not in a position to be of help. If you have found another system, (i.e. Harken) that is*/less costly/*for its total needed parts and */simpler to install /and/handle/*, we would very much appreciate its part number and hearing your take on what makes it the better way to go, with an eye to using it with new and recycled Rhodes in place of our current system. ** **thanks, stan *** On 3/29/21 9:10 AM, ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: > Rick, > > It?s hard to tell for sure from this photo.? But, I don?t think this is a GBI 29 Traveler.? My control lines don?t have any knots in them.? Do you have a close up picture of the traveler car? > > Roger Pihlaja > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > Sent from my iPhone > >> On Mar 28, 2021, at 12:42 PM, Rick Lange wrote: >> >> ?Roger, >> >> Here's some of it.? You can see a cleat and the knot of the control line >> ends tied together. >> [image: ATT00010.jpg] >> >> Regards, >> >> Rick Lange >> >> >>> On Sat, Mar 27, 2021 at 9:00 PM ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: >>> >>> Rick, >>> >>> In all the dozens of posts in this thread, someone said they were busting >>> their knuckles on their traveler.? I don?t remember who.? I remember asking >>> what they were hitting their knuckles on.? I don?t think I ever got a >>> response. >>> >>> Can you post a picture of your traveler?? From your last post, it sounds >>> like you don?t have a GBI 29 Traveler.? Rather, you have a 2nd generation >>> traveler modified with cam cleats replacing the OEM standard jam cleats. >>> >>> Roger Pihlaja >>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>> >>> Sent from Mail for >>> Windows 10 >>> >>> >> -------------- next part -------------- >> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... >> Name: ATT00010.jpg >> Type: image/jpeg >> Size: 81236 bytes >> Desc: not available >> URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: 50e4fc946ccfda33104f307faad0d9f5.jpeg Type: image/jpeg Size: 75505 bytes Desc: not available URL: ------------------------------ Message: 17 Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2021 11:08:05 -0400 From: Peter Nyberg To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? Message-ID: <6389A2B0-083D-4551-B944-694F552E4CCA at sunnybeeches.com> Content-Type: text/plain;??? charset=utf-8 Small world.? My wife and I took week-long cruises on the J&E Riggin for several years running back in the late 90?s.? After some experience, we opted for dates in September, for cooler temperatures and better wind.? This is how I first became aware of the Penobscot Bay area as a prime cruising location.? ? ?Peter > On Mar 29, 2021, at 10:10 AM, Hank wrote: > > We'll be up there in July for a 6 day trip on the JE Riggin. > Looking forward to seeing that part of the country. > > Hank > > On Mon, Mar 29, 2021 at 9:48 AM Peter Nyberg wrote: > >> My cruising plan for this year is for week-long excursions on the coast of >> Maine launching from the public ramp in Rockland. >> >> There will be video. >> >> ?Peter ------------------------------ Message: 18 Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2021 08:35:16 -0700 (MST) From: Lee To: rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? Message-ID: <1617032116809-0.post at n5.nabble.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Chris,? Milford?? That's where I learned how to sail back in the mid-70s!? Wow I'm old.? A friend took me out on a Sunfish.? A few days later I went out by myself so I would be confident in taking a girl along with me.? Winds were extremely high for a Rhodes so you can imagine a novice on a Sunfish. Fortunately my friend showed me how to right the thing and after about a dozen capsizes I got pretty good at it.? Never did take a girl out on it. I believe I saw that your son teaches at my alma mater.? Tuttle Creek Lake also has some great sailing but an extremely rough road to get to the "club." http://https://beaconmarineboats.com/boating-in-kansas/ ? Lee 1999 Rhodes22 TBD Claytor Lake, VA -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ ------------------------------ Subject: Digest Footer _______________________________________________ Rhodes22-list mailing list Rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org http://rhodes22.org/mailman/listinfo/rhodes22-list ------------------------------ End of Rhodes22-list Digest, Vol 4325, Issue 1 ********************************************** From roger_pihlaja at msn.com Mon Mar 29 17:07:13 2021 From: roger_pihlaja at msn.com (ROGER PIHLAJA) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2021 21:07:13 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] plans In-Reply-To: <677526273.942339.1617051094030@mail.yahoo.com> References: , <677526273.942339.1617051094030@mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Cynthia, Thank you! Which Canoecopia presentations did you watch? Roger Pihlaja S/V Dynamic Equilibrium Sent from my iPhone > On Mar 29, 2021, at 4:52 PM, Cynthia Lang via Rhodes22-list wrote: > > ? We have our boat on the Delaware, 30 miles north of Philadelphia. Hope to finally make it to the Chesapeake this year. Not sure if we will tow it down or take the C&D. > I tore a meniscus badly 5 weeks ago, so I have appreciated the discussion about getting on and off the Rhodes. We have a canoe with outrigger stabilizers, thinking that the stability will help with the failing knees, but perhaps our trusty 1970's vintage Avon may be easier. > Roger, I enjoyed your presentations at Canoecopia. I hope your plans work out for you this season. > Cynthia1990 Rhodes 22 > On Monday, March 29, 2021, 11:35:21 AM EDT, wrote: > > Send Rhodes22-list mailing list submissions to > rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > http://rhodes22.org/mailman/listinfo/rhodes22-list > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > rhodes22-list-request at rhodes22.org > > You can reach the person managing the list at > rhodes22-list-owner at rhodes22.org > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of Rhodes22-list digest..." > > > Today's Topics: > > 1. Re: Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? (Jesse Shumaker) > 2. Re: Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? (ROGER PIHLAJA) > 3. Re: Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? (Peter Nyberg) > 4. Re: Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? (Tom Van Heule) > 5. Re: Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? (Mitch Mitchell) > 6. Re: Lifting the Mast off of the Boat (mm.bizlist1 at gmail.com) > 7. Re: Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? (ROGER PIHLAJA) > 8. Re: Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? (Frank Goldsmith) > 9. Re: Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? (ROGER PIHLAJA) > 10. Re: Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? (Tom Van Heule) > 11. Re: Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? (JeffSmith) > 12. Re: Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? (Mitch Mitchell) > 13. Re: [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler Modifications - another > alternative (ROGER PIHLAJA) > 14. Re: Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? (Peter Nyberg) > 15. Re: Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? (Hank) > 16. GB Notice re the latest traveler system (stan) > 17. Re: Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? (Peter Nyberg) > 18. Re: Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? (Lee) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2021 13:16:13 -0500 > From: Jesse Shumaker > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? > Message-ID: > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" > > Thanks Chris, it would be great to meet up and sail with your son. I will > let you know as plans come together this summer. > >> On Sun, Mar 28, 2021, 12:27 PM Chris Geankoplis >> wrote: >> >> Hey Jesse, >> We will see about Greece, but if you head to Mollford in Kansas I?ll get >> you in touch with my son who is co-owner with us on our other Rhodes. He >> keeps it at the club there. Sounds like you have great sailing season/s >> planned. >> Chris Geankoplis >> Enosis >> >> On Sun, Mar 28, 2021 at 12:15 PM Jesse Shumaker < >> jesse.laten.shumaker at gmail.com> wrote: >> >>> Hi Roger, I hope your recovery picks up speed so you can enjoy the trip >> to >>> Apostle Islands. We would all enjoy hearing about it. Hopefully Greece >>> opens up so we can look forward to hearing more of Chris G's adventures >>> abroad. >>> >>> We've got a few trips planned. A couple of these I have mentioned >> earlier >>> on the list. >>> >>> - Some sailing classes in San Francisco in late May / early June >>> - Charter from Traverse City in late June / early July. This time we >>> are going with another couple that are also sailors we plan to make it >>> out >>> of Grand Traverse Bay and up to Charlevoix. If the weather permits, >>> we'll >>> make it over to Beaver Island. If we get there, then I'll look for >> the >>> signs that your son made for trails awhile ago. >>> - A sailing class in August out of Bayfield, Wisconsin to somewhere >>> across Lake Superior with some local sailor friends. I appreciate the >>> insight you provided on considerations for this trip. >>> - One or two road trips with my Rhodes to larger lakes in the region. >>> Probably over labor day weekend but perhaps another one earlier in the >>> season. We might make it down to one of the larger lakes in Kansas. >>> Now >>> that I've got my own tow vehicle it makes it easier to plan a trip. >>> >>> Fortunately my wife likes sailing and doesn't mind me spending a lot of >>> time at the lake. She's looking forward to sailing season as well, >>> especially since it has such a positive impact on my mood :) >>> >>> Next year I may do a longer road trip with my Rhodes. I'm working my way >>> up as I get used to towing. Sometime in the next few years, I would >> like >>> to take my Rhodes up to Lake Mille Lacs in Minnesota and do a >>> circumnavigation. It's a relatively big body of water for the midwest if >>> you set aside the Great Lakes. At the link below, you can see a trip >>> report from someone that has done that: >>> http://www.altenberg.com/gary/MilleLacs/ >>> >>> It would be interesting to hear about the adventures from other folks on >>> the list. >>> >>> Jesse Shumaker >>> S/V Zephyr >>> >>> On Sun, Mar 28, 2021 at 9:49 AM ROGER PIHLAJA >>> wrote: >>> >>>> Hi All, >>>> >>>> So, here we are on Palm Sunday, 2021. What are everyone?s plans for a >>>> summer cruise? >>>> >>>> My plan for a Great Circle Loop High Adventure Sailing/Sea Kayaking >> Tour >>>> Of Apostle Islands National Lakeshore continues to move forward. Last >>>> week, I was able to reserve a special campsite at Little Sand Bay >>>> Campground on the tip of the Bayfield Peninsula for the beginning >> put-in >>>> and ending take-out. After consultation with the campground manager, >> it >>>> turns out campsite #40 has an unused grassy area next to the campsite >>> where >>>> we can park S/V Dynamic Equilibrium fully rigged on its trailer. Not >>> only >>>> can we use the boat as a pop top camper; but, site #40 has unobstructed >>>> access to/from the launch ramp. So, we don?t have to rig/unrig the >> boat >>> at >>>> the launch ramp. Little Sand Bay Campground will also let us park 2 >>>> vehicles + the empty boat trailer in their parking lot while we?re out >> on >>>> the water. >>>> >>>> The National Park Service only reserves backcountry campsites out in >> the >>>> Apostle Islands 1 month in advance. I will have to set my alarm clock >>>> early on June 22-24, 2021 to make sure I get on-line and reserve the >>>> campsites I want. >>>> >>>> I have the design for the kayak towing harness finished and I?ve >> started >>>> accumulating pieces/parts. After doing some research and modeling, I >>> think >>>> a towing harness that lines the 4 boats up side-by-side will tow the >>> best, >>>> be the most seaworthy configuration, and the easiest to deal with >> around >>>> the marina and on the beach. But, I plan to do some tow testing with >> S/V >>>> Dynamic Equilibrium in late May or early June in Ross Lake, about 12 >>> miles >>>> from my house. I have finished the 4 cockpit covers with their around >>> the >>>> hull retaining straps and verified fit/security on each of the kayaks. >>>> Losing a cockpit cover and filling the cockpit with water on Lake >>> Superior >>>> might be the start of a bad day on the water! >>>> >>>> But, my biggest potential show stopper issue is me. As many of you >> know, >>>> I am 67 years old with A-Fib and 2 arthritic knees. I have a pacemaker >>> and >>>> last month, I had my 2nd Cardiac Ablation procedure. For those of you >>> not >>>> familiar with a Cardiac Ablation, it involves making an incision in >> your >>>> groin, snaking a catheter-like probe up the big vein in your leg back >>> into >>>> the heart, and then selectively electrocuting the biological pacemaker >>>> cells that are causing the A-Fib. It stops the A-Fib; but, you are >> left >>>> with electrical burns and scar tissue inside the heart. 6 weeks after >>> the >>>> Cardiac Ablation procedure, I still tire easily and have very poor >>> aerobic >>>> stamina. I have a lot of rehab work to do in order to be ready for the >>>> High Adventure Trip in July. >>>> >>>> So, what cruise trips are everyone else planning? >>>> >>>> Roger Pihlaja >>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Sent from Mail for >>>> Windows 10 >>>> >>>> >>> >> > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 2 > Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2021 19:55:12 +0000 > From: ROGER PIHLAJA > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? > Message-ID: > > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" > > Mike, > > I know what you mean. Getting in and out of our Walker Bay RIB from the side or the stern of our Rhodes 22 is not a problem. But, I don?t envision being able to get in or out of my Delta 145 Expedition kayak from the Rhodes 22 when the kayak is tied off to the mother ship. I suppose if it came right down it, we could use the RIB instead of the kayaks. Four of us, one canoe paddle in each corner, could paddle the RIB into most of the sea caves. But, I don?t want to ask the rest of my family to downgrade from the kayaks unless we have to. Right now, the plan is to dock the Rhodes 22, take the kayak fleet to the beach, separate the kayaks, and launch the kayaks off the beach. Fortunately, there are NPS docks within a few miles of each of the sea cave areas we intend to visit. This is kind of an ugly workaround and I?m not entirely satisfied with it. It would be great if there was some way to anchor S/V Dynamic Equilibrium just offshore from the sea caves and be able to > get in and out of the kayaks from the mother ship. But, when the mother ship is a Rhodes 22, I don?t see a practical way to do that. Implementing the current plan means I must be fit enough to get on/off the beach and paddle ~4 nm by myself on Lake Superior in pretty calm conditions. We can?t paddle into the sea caves unless conditions are calm anyway. One of the rules of our family High Adventure Trips is, ?It?s not a High Adventure Trip unless there is some chance of serious injury or death!? Part of the fun is in the planning how to reduce the danger to the level of an acceptable calculated risk and accept that challenge. > > I wish the weather would warm up so I can get out on the water to get some paddling exercise in. Right now, I?m logging a few miles on my stationary bike. I?ve been out once on my real bike; but, only for a couple of miles on easy terrain. It?s hard when you?re trying to recover from electrical burns and scar tissue inside the heart. How do you rehab that kind of injury? I did have my cardiologist reprogram my pacemaker to enable a cardiac redline of 180 bpm vs the factory setting of 100 bpm. She wouldn?t set my cardiac redline any higher. I promised my family I wouldn?t attempt this High Adventure Trip unless she gave her blessing. So, I have a lot of work to do! > > Roger Pihlaja > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > Sent from Mail for Windows 10 > > From: Michael D. Weisner > Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2021 11:26 AM > To: 'The Rhodes 22 Email List' > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? > > Roger, > > As I have aged, my ability to enter and exit my Pamlico 145T from my Rhodes > 22 has become more challenging. Dinghy transfers are not a problem but the > kayak has proven too unstable to access from the side of the Rhodes or even > the swim ladder. > > Maybe if I had a swim platform it would be easier. > > Do you have any tips? > > Mike > s/v Wind Lass ('91) > Nissequogue River, NY > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of ROGER > PIHLAJA > Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2021 10:50 AM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? > > Hi All, > > So, here we are on Palm Sunday, 2021. What are everyone's plans for a > summer cruise? > > My plan for a Great Circle Loop High Adventure Sailing/Sea Kayaking Tour Of > Apostle Islands National Lakeshore continues to move forward. Last week, I > was able to reserve a special campsite at Little Sand Bay Campground on the > tip of the Bayfield Peninsula for the beginning put-in and ending take-out. > After consultation with the campground manager, it turns out campsite #40 > has an unused grassy area next to the campsite where we can park S/V Dynamic > Equilibrium fully rigged on its trailer. Not only can we use the boat as a > pop top camper; but, site #40 has unobstructed access to/from the launch > ramp. So, we don't have to rig/unrig the boat at the launch ramp. Little > Sand Bay Campground will also let us park 2 vehicles + the empty boat > trailer in their parking lot while we're out on the water. > > The National Park Service only reserves backcountry campsites out in the > Apostle Islands 1 month in advance. I will have to set my alarm clock early > on June 22-24, 2021 to make sure I get on-line and reserve the campsites I > want. > > I have the design for the kayak towing harness finished and I've started > accumulating pieces/parts. After doing some research and modeling, I think > a towing harness that lines the 4 boats up side-by-side will tow the best, > be the most seaworthy configuration, and the easiest to deal with around the > marina and on the beach. But, I plan to do some tow testing with S/V > Dynamic Equilibrium in late May or early June in Ross Lake, about 12 miles > from my house. I have finished the 4 cockpit covers with their around the > hull retaining straps and verified fit/security on each of the kayaks. > Losing a cockpit cover and filling the cockpit with water on Lake Superior > might be the start of a bad day on the water! > > But, my biggest potential show stopper issue is me. As many of you know, I > am 67 years old with A-Fib and 2 arthritic knees. I have a pacemaker and > last month, I had my 2nd Cardiac Ablation procedure. For those of you not > familiar with a Cardiac Ablation, it involves making an incision in your > groin, snaking a catheter-like probe up the big vein in your leg back into > the heart, and then selectively electrocuting the biological pacemaker cells > that are causing the A-Fib. It stops the A-Fib; but, you are left with > electrical burns and scar tissue inside the heart. 6 weeks after the > Cardiac Ablation procedure, I still tire easily and have very poor aerobic > stamina. I have a lot of rehab work to do in order to be ready for the High > Adventure Trip in July. > > So, what cruise trips are everyone else planning? > > Roger Pihlaja > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > > > > > Sent from Mail for Windows > 10 > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 3 > Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2021 16:41:27 -0400 > From: Peter Nyberg > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? > Message-ID: <8C4077B0-A764-47E1-AAB8-95124AE270A6 at sunnybeeches.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 > > One word: Maine! > > ?Peter > >> On Mar 28, 2021, at 10:49 AM, ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: >> >> Hi All, >> >> So, here we are on Palm Sunday, 2021. What are everyone?s plans for a summer cruise? >> > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 4 > Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2021 16:22:12 -0500 > From: Tom Van Heule > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? > Message-ID: > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" > > But peter, how do we get up niagra?! > Lake michigan to maine is... A lifetime trip? > >> On Sun, Mar 28, 2021, 3:42 PM Peter Nyberg wrote: >> >> One word: Maine! >> >> ?Peter >> >>> On Mar 28, 2021, at 10:49 AM, ROGER PIHLAJA >> wrote: >>> >>> Hi All, >>> >>> So, here we are on Palm Sunday, 2021. What are everyone?s plans for a >> summer cruise? >>> >> >> > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 5 > Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2021 17:27:54 -0400 > From: Mitch Mitchell > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? > Message-ID: > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" > > Mike, one of the easiest ways to get in a kayak from a boat is by using the > swim ladder. It just needs to extend deep enough in the water so that you > can put one foot on the bottom rung at least a foot below the water and > then swing the other leg into the kayak - sit down and then bring the other > leg in. I think I made a video on it a while back, I'll have to look and > see. The other option is a seal launch. I did this seal launch video a long > time ago. > https://youtu.be/Em5bbFNsy6Y?t=50 > Good luck! > By the way, just kidding about the seal launch from the Rhodes - would > scratch the boat too much. > Mitch > > On Sun, Mar 28, 2021 at 11:26 AM Michael D. Weisner > wrote: > >> Roger, >> >> As I have aged, my ability to enter and exit my Pamlico 145T from my Rhodes >> 22 has become more challenging. Dinghy transfers are not a problem but the >> kayak has proven too unstable to access from the side of the Rhodes or even >> the swim ladder. >> >> Maybe if I had a swim platform it would be easier. >> >> Do you have any tips? >> >> Mike >> s/v Wind Lass ('91) >> Nissequogue River, NY >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of >> ROGER >> PIHLAJA >> Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2021 10:50 AM >> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List >> Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? >> >> Hi All, >> >> So, here we are on Palm Sunday, 2021. What are everyone's plans for a >> summer cruise? >> >> My plan for a Great Circle Loop High Adventure Sailing/Sea Kayaking Tour Of >> Apostle Islands National Lakeshore continues to move forward. Last week, I >> was able to reserve a special campsite at Little Sand Bay Campground on the >> tip of the Bayfield Peninsula for the beginning put-in and ending take-out. >> After consultation with the campground manager, it turns out campsite #40 >> has an unused grassy area next to the campsite where we can park S/V >> Dynamic >> Equilibrium fully rigged on its trailer. Not only can we use the boat as a >> pop top camper; but, site #40 has unobstructed access to/from the launch >> ramp. So, we don't have to rig/unrig the boat at the launch ramp. Little >> Sand Bay Campground will also let us park 2 vehicles + the empty boat >> trailer in their parking lot while we're out on the water. >> >> The National Park Service only reserves backcountry campsites out in the >> Apostle Islands 1 month in advance. I will have to set my alarm clock >> early >> on June 22-24, 2021 to make sure I get on-line and reserve the campsites I >> want. >> >> I have the design for the kayak towing harness finished and I've started >> accumulating pieces/parts. After doing some research and modeling, I think >> a towing harness that lines the 4 boats up side-by-side will tow the best, >> be the most seaworthy configuration, and the easiest to deal with around >> the >> marina and on the beach. But, I plan to do some tow testing with S/V >> Dynamic Equilibrium in late May or early June in Ross Lake, about 12 miles >> from my house. I have finished the 4 cockpit covers with their around the >> hull retaining straps and verified fit/security on each of the kayaks. >> Losing a cockpit cover and filling the cockpit with water on Lake Superior >> might be the start of a bad day on the water! >> >> But, my biggest potential show stopper issue is me. As many of you know, I >> am 67 years old with A-Fib and 2 arthritic knees. I have a pacemaker and >> last month, I had my 2nd Cardiac Ablation procedure. For those of you not >> familiar with a Cardiac Ablation, it involves making an incision in your >> groin, snaking a catheter-like probe up the big vein in your leg back into >> the heart, and then selectively electrocuting the biological pacemaker >> cells >> that are causing the A-Fib. It stops the A-Fib; but, you are left with >> electrical burns and scar tissue inside the heart. 6 weeks after the >> Cardiac Ablation procedure, I still tire easily and have very poor aerobic >> stamina. I have a lot of rehab work to do in order to be ready for the >> High >> Adventure Trip in July. >> >> So, what cruise trips are everyone else planning? >> >> Roger Pihlaja >> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >> >> >> >> >> >> Sent from Mail for Windows >> 10 >> >> > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 6 > Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2021 17:32:50 -0400 > From: > To: "'The Rhodes 22 Email List'" > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Lifting the Mast off of the Boat > Message-ID: <0fad01d72419$e75af840$b610e8c0$@gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" > > I used McLube on both the IMF and the Genny--both roll out/in very nicely. I did learn that the IMF is very sensitive to the topping lift setting, which is not surprising. Stan's outhaul car design requires the foot of the sail and the boom to be very parallel. > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of David Bradley > Sent: Thursday, March 18, 2021 5:41 PM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Lifting the Mast off of the Boat > > McLube - I think a teflon spray - works great. > > Dave B > >> On Mar 16, 2021, at 9:26 PM, Frank Goldsmith wrote: >> >> Jerry?s post reminds me of a question I meant to ask the group: is there a proper way of lubricating the black round parts that rotate inside the furling tubes (sorry, I don?t know the nomenclature ? bearings?) so that the furling operation is smoother and doesn?t bind, especially the mainsail? I thought that while mine is apart, I?d see what I could do about that. Or maybe lubrication is not called for, perhaps just wiping them clean. >> >> Thanks, >> >> Frank Goldsmith >> s/v Mary Bess (1985/2000 Rhodes 22) >> Lake Keowee, SC >> >> >>>> On Mar 16, 2021, at 9:17 PM, cjlowe at sssnet.com wrote: >>> >>> I drop and raise my mast bundle every year, at my dock, on the water. >>> That being said, I dock at a well protected marina, little wind and no waves. >>> If where you dock has similar conditions you should be fine. The >>> first thing is to see if you can maneuver 26 feet of mast from boat >>> to the dock where you have 55 feet of space that is level to hold the >>> mast and remove the furling tube. When working above water, anything >>> dropped is usually forfeited. Your idea of removing the boom and head >>> sail is a good one, that extra weight and bulk is not your friend. >>> Think about replacing the inhaul line while you have it apart. Count >>> the amount of wraps of inhaul line on the furling tube and note the >>> direction of the wrap. Seek the proper lubricant for the bearings and >>> coat them well. Now is a good time to replace lights( anchor, >>> spreader, deck,etc. Check the spreader bushings and bolt and >>> windvane. I'm sure I forgot a few things, maybe others will chime in. >>> >>> >>> Jerry Lowe >>> S/V Country Rhodes '86 >>> >>> >>> George, >>>> I was on a sailing adventure with our R22 in Key West a couple years >>>> ago and had a problem with ripped sail. I made the decision to motor >>>> back to the marina that we had originally launched from and try to >>>> repair it myself before continuing on (we were attempting to sail to >>>> Dry Tortuga). Like Joe mentioned, I pulled into the slip bow forward >>>> and retrieved the mast crutch and GB raising system from the truck. >>>> I lowered the mast by myself with no problems and while I could lift >>>> the mast and furler myself, it was too awkward to maneuver off the >>>> boat alone. My better half guided one end while I carried it onto >>>> the dock. Disassembly, repair and reassembly took place right there >>>> in front of the boat. Thankfully, the repair wasn't that hard and we >>>> were able to get back underway the next morning. >>>> >>>> I tied the jib furler to the main and carried both off at the same time. >>>> I'm going to estimate the mast (in mast furler) and jib together >>>> weighed approximately 120- 140#. That's a very general guess. You >>>> mentioned you're taking your furler down separately so that should >>>> make the rig weigh a bit less. >>>> >>>> The boat community being what it is, I had no shortage of those >>>> willing to lend a hand at the dock. You should be fine at the dock >>>> and not having to pull your boat out. >>>> >>>> >>>> Mike >>>> SV Emma B >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On Tue, Mar 16, 2021 at 5:35 AM Gmorganflier >>>> >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Question for those who might have done this. >>>>> >>>>> I want to take my sails in for cleaning and repair. I???ve never >>>>> removed my sails, so this is going to be all new for me. I have the >>>>> CDI II furler, so my plan is to lower and remove my 175 genie with >>>>> the mast up. I then plan to remove the boom, lower the mast, >>>>> disconnect the shouds and disconnect the CDI furler from the mast. >>>>> I have no clue how heavy the mast with the furled main is. Can one >>>>> person lift the mast with the furled main or will I need help? >>>>> >>>>> My boat is on a mooring. There are some logistical problems with >>>>> pulling my boat out of the water....the water depth is too shallow >>>>> at my club???s ramp. >>>>> Would I be crazy to attempt this with the boat tied to my club???s >>>>> dock or pulled up on the shore? >>>>> >>>>> Thanks for any advice on how to best accomplish this. >>>>> >>>>> George Morgan >>>>> S/V Knotty Lady 1986 >>>>> Lake Waccamaw NC >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ >>>>> > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 7 > Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2021 22:12:19 +0000 > From: ROGER PIHLAJA > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? > Message-ID: > > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" > > Peter, > > Cmon man, we need more details than just one word! > > Roger Pihlaja > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > Sent from my iPhone > >> On Mar 28, 2021, at 4:42 PM, Peter Nyberg wrote: >> >> ?One word: Maine! >> >> ?Peter >> >>>> On Mar 28, 2021, at 10:49 AM, ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: >>> >>> Hi All, >>> >>> So, here we are on Palm Sunday, 2021. What are everyone?s plans for a summer cruise? >>> >> > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 8 > Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2021 18:28:04 -0400 > From: Frank Goldsmith > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? > Message-ID: > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 > > The start of an interesting thread. I envy those of you who have sailboat cruising plans. > > My immediate nautical plans involve paddling rather than sailing. In mid-April I will be joining some friends for an extended weekend of swamp canoeing on the Black River in North Carolina, including a visit to the Three Sisters Swamp, which is part of that river. The Three Sisters section includes the oldest trees in the Eastern U.S., bald cypresses that have been dated back to at least 605 B.C.E., the time of the Babylonian empire. > > Our group has been exploring various blackwater rivers in the Carolinas since 1980, although we?ve also made forays into the Quetico Provincial Park in Canada, the Okefenokee Swamp in south Georgia, and even a river in Sweden (sadly, I missed that trip). We?re mostly in our mid-seventies now, and for the last few trips we?ve elected to establish a fixed base camp in a nearby state park or some private property (with permission) and make day trips, rather than hauling all our gear in our canoes and looking in the afternoon for dry ground, as we?ve mostly done in the past. The variety of ailments that afflict many men of our age have made unburdened canoes the better choice. > > But I am looking forward to getting my Rhodes back in the water at Lake Keowee, once new sails are installed in a couple of weeks. > > Frank > > Frank Goldsmith > s/v Mary Bess (1985/2001 Rhodes) > Asheville, NC and > Lake Keowee, SC > > >> On Mar 28, 2021, at 10:49 AM, ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: >> >> Hi All, >> >> So, here we are on Palm Sunday, 2021. What are everyone?s plans for a summer cruise? >> >> My plan for a Great Circle Loop High Adventure Sailing/Sea Kayaking Tour Of Apostle Islands National Lakeshore continues to move forward. Last week, I was able to reserve a special campsite at Little Sand Bay Campground on the tip of the Bayfield Peninsula for the beginning put-in and ending take-out. After consultation with the campground manager, it turns out campsite #40 has an unused grassy area next to the campsite where we can park S/V Dynamic Equilibrium fully rigged on its trailer. Not only can we use the boat as a pop top camper; but, site #40 has unobstructed access to/from the launch ramp. So, we don?t have to rig/unrig the boat at the launch ramp. Little Sand Bay Campground will also let us park 2 vehicles + the empty boat trailer in their parking lot while we?re out on the water. >> >> The National Park Service only reserves backcountry campsites out in the Apostle Islands 1 month in advance. I will have to set my alarm clock early on June 22-24, 2021 to make sure I get on-line and reserve the campsites I want. >> >> I have the design for the kayak towing harness finished and I?ve started accumulating pieces/parts. After doing some research and modeling, I think a towing harness that lines the 4 boats up side-by-side will tow the best, be the most seaworthy configuration, and the easiest to deal with around the marina and on the beach. But, I plan to do some tow testing with S/V Dynamic Equilibrium in late May or early June in Ross Lake, about 12 miles from my house. I have finished the 4 cockpit covers with their around the hull retaining straps and verified fit/security on each of the kayaks. Losing a cockpit cover and filling the cockpit with water on Lake Superior might be the start of a bad day on the water! >> >> But, my biggest potential show stopper issue is me. As many of you know, I am 67 years old with A-Fib and 2 arthritic knees. I have a pacemaker and last month, I had my 2nd Cardiac Ablation procedure. For those of you not familiar with a Cardiac Ablation, it involves making an incision in your groin, snaking a catheter-like probe up the big vein in your leg back into the heart, and then selectively electrocuting the biological pacemaker cells that are causing the A-Fib. It stops the A-Fib; but, you are left with electrical burns and scar tissue inside the heart. 6 weeks after the Cardiac Ablation procedure, I still tire easily and have very poor aerobic stamina. I have a lot of rehab work to do in order to be ready for the High Adventure Trip in July. >> >> So, what cruise trips are everyone else planning? >> >> Roger Pihlaja >> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >> >> >> >> >> >> Sent from Mail for Windows 10 >> > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 9 > Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2021 23:06:06 +0000 > From: ROGER PIHLAJA > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? > Message-ID: > > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" > > Frank, > > In 2008, our family High Adventure Trip was called the Three Rivers Trip. We put-in on the Kickapoo River at the Plum Creek Canoe Landing, paddled to the Wisconsin River, and then followed the Wisconsin River to the Mississippi River. Along the way, we backcountry camped on sandbars. We took-out at Wyalusing Recreation Area Boat Landing on the Mississippi River. On the last day of the trip, we attempted to find our way thru the Wood Yard Slough, a backwater swampy area off the Mississippi River. Despite having the latest chart issued by Wyalusing State Park and the highest resolution Garmin GPS maps available, we got thoroughly turned around and eventually ended up leaving at the same place as we entered the slough. Exploring a backwater Mississippi River slough by canoe had always been on my bucket list. After this experience, I can say I?m glad I went once. But, I got it out my system! > > I?ve made multiple paddling trips into the Boundary Waters and Voyageur?s National Park, both of which border Quetico Provincial Park. The international border is poorly marked (if at all!) up there and I?m certain we briefly crossed over into Quetico a couple of times. Did you know there?s a place called Kettle Falls in Voyageur?s National Park where you can stand in the United States and look south into Canada? > > Roger Pihlaja > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > Sent from Mail for Windows 10 > > From: Frank Goldsmith > Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2021 6:28 PM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? > > The start of an interesting thread. I envy those of you who have sailboat cruising plans. > > My immediate nautical plans involve paddling rather than sailing. In mid-April I will be joining some friends for an extended weekend of swamp canoeing on the Black River in North Carolina, including a visit to the Three Sisters Swamp, which is part of that river. The Three Sisters section includes the oldest trees in the Eastern U.S., bald cypresses that have been dated back to at least 605 B.C.E., the time of the Babylonian empire. > > Our group has been exploring various blackwater rivers in the Carolinas since 1980, although we?ve also made forays into the Quetico Provincial Park in Canada, the Okefenokee Swamp in south Georgia, and even a river in Sweden (sadly, I missed that trip). We?re mostly in our mid-seventies now, and for the last few trips we?ve elected to establish a fixed base camp in a nearby state park or some private property (with permission) and make day trips, rather than hauling all our gear in our canoes and looking in the afternoon for dry ground, as we?ve mostly done in the past. The variety of ailments that afflict many men of our age have made unburdened canoes the better choice. > > But I am looking forward to getting my Rhodes back in the water at Lake Keowee, once new sails are installed in a couple of weeks. > > Frank > > Frank Goldsmith > s/v Mary Bess (1985/2001 Rhodes) > Asheville, NC and > Lake Keowee, SC > > >> On Mar 28, 2021, at 10:49 AM, ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: >> >> Hi All, >> >> So, here we are on Palm Sunday, 2021. What are everyone?s plans for a summer cruise? >> >> My plan for a Great Circle Loop High Adventure Sailing/Sea Kayaking Tour Of Apostle Islands National Lakeshore continues to move forward. Last week, I was able to reserve a special campsite at Little Sand Bay Campground on the tip of the Bayfield Peninsula for the beginning put-in and ending take-out. After consultation with the campground manager, it turns out campsite #40 has an unused grassy area next to the campsite where we can park S/V Dynamic Equilibrium fully rigged on its trailer. Not only can we use the boat as a pop top camper; but, site #40 has unobstructed access to/from the launch ramp. So, we don?t have to rig/unrig the boat at the launch ramp. Little Sand Bay Campground will also let us park 2 vehicles + the empty boat trailer in their parking lot while we?re out on the water. >> >> The National Park Service only reserves backcountry campsites out in the Apostle Islands 1 month in advance. I will have to set my alarm clock early on June 22-24, 2021 to make sure I get on-line and reserve the campsites I want. >> >> I have the design for the kayak towing harness finished and I?ve started accumulating pieces/parts. After doing some research and modeling, I think a towing harness that lines the 4 boats up side-by-side will tow the best, be the most seaworthy configuration, and the easiest to deal with around the marina and on the beach. But, I plan to do some tow testing with S/V Dynamic Equilibrium in late May or early June in Ross Lake, about 12 miles from my house. I have finished the 4 cockpit covers with their around the hull retaining straps and verified fit/security on each of the kayaks. Losing a cockpit cover and filling the cockpit with water on Lake Superior might be the start of a bad day on the water! >> >> But, my biggest potential show stopper issue is me. As many of you know, I am 67 years old with A-Fib and 2 arthritic knees. I have a pacemaker and last month, I had my 2nd Cardiac Ablation procedure. For those of you not familiar with a Cardiac Ablation, it involves making an incision in your groin, snaking a catheter-like probe up the big vein in your leg back into the heart, and then selectively electrocuting the biological pacemaker cells that are causing the A-Fib. It stops the A-Fib; but, you are left with electrical burns and scar tissue inside the heart. 6 weeks after the Cardiac Ablation procedure, I still tire easily and have very poor aerobic stamina. I have a lot of rehab work to do in order to be ready for the High Adventure Trip in July. >> >> So, what cruise trips are everyone else planning? >> >> Roger Pihlaja >> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >> >> >> >> >> >> Sent from Mail for Windows 10 >> > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 10 > Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2021 20:04:33 -0500 > From: Tom Van Heule > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? > Message-ID: > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" > > Maybe he's talking about growing his beard! > I jest peter, one big bearded sailor to another. > >> On Sun, Mar 28, 2021, 6:06 PM ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: >> >> Frank, >> >> In 2008, our family High Adventure Trip was called the Three Rivers Trip. >> We put-in on the Kickapoo River at the Plum Creek Canoe Landing, paddled to >> the Wisconsin River, and then followed the Wisconsin River to the >> Mississippi River. Along the way, we backcountry camped on sandbars. We >> took-out at Wyalusing Recreation Area Boat Landing on the Mississippi >> River. On the last day of the trip, we attempted to find our way thru the >> Wood Yard Slough, a backwater swampy area off the Mississippi River. >> Despite having the latest chart issued by Wyalusing State Park and the >> highest resolution Garmin GPS maps available, we got thoroughly turned >> around and eventually ended up leaving at the same place as we entered the >> slough. Exploring a backwater Mississippi River slough by canoe had always >> been on my bucket list. After this experience, I can say I?m glad I went >> once. But, I got it out my system! >> >> I?ve made multiple paddling trips into the Boundary Waters and Voyageur?s >> National Park, both of which border Quetico Provincial Park. The >> international border is poorly marked (if at all!) up there and I?m certain >> we briefly crossed over into Quetico a couple of times. Did you know >> there?s a place called Kettle Falls in Voyageur?s National Park where you >> can stand in the United States and look south into Canada? >> >> Roger Pihlaja >> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >> >> Sent from Mail for >> Windows 10 >> >> From: Frank Goldsmith >> Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2021 6:28 PM >> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List >> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? >> >> The start of an interesting thread. I envy those of you who have sailboat >> cruising plans. >> >> My immediate nautical plans involve paddling rather than sailing. In >> mid-April I will be joining some friends for an extended weekend of swamp >> canoeing on the Black River in North Carolina, including a visit to the >> Three Sisters Swamp, which is part of that river. The Three Sisters >> section includes the oldest trees in the Eastern U.S., bald cypresses that >> have been dated back to at least 605 B.C.E., the time of the Babylonian >> empire. >> >> Our group has been exploring various blackwater rivers in the Carolinas >> since 1980, although we?ve also made forays into the Quetico Provincial >> Park in Canada, the Okefenokee Swamp in south Georgia, and even a river in >> Sweden (sadly, I missed that trip). We?re mostly in our mid-seventies now, >> and for the last few trips we?ve elected to establish a fixed base camp in >> a nearby state park or some private property (with permission) and make day >> trips, rather than hauling all our gear in our canoes and looking in the >> afternoon for dry ground, as we?ve mostly done in the past. The variety of >> ailments that afflict many men of our age have made unburdened canoes the >> better choice. >> >> But I am looking forward to getting my Rhodes back in the water at Lake >> Keowee, once new sails are installed in a couple of weeks. >> >> Frank >> >> Frank Goldsmith >> s/v Mary Bess (1985/2001 Rhodes) >> Asheville, NC and >> Lake Keowee, SC >> >> >>> On Mar 28, 2021, at 10:49 AM, ROGER PIHLAJA >> wrote: >>> >>> Hi All, >>> >>> So, here we are on Palm Sunday, 2021. What are everyone?s plans for a >> summer cruise? >>> >>> My plan for a Great Circle Loop High Adventure Sailing/Sea Kayaking Tour >> Of Apostle Islands National Lakeshore continues to move forward. Last >> week, I was able to reserve a special campsite at Little Sand Bay >> Campground on the tip of the Bayfield Peninsula for the beginning put-in >> and ending take-out. After consultation with the campground manager, it >> turns out campsite #40 has an unused grassy area next to the campsite where >> we can park S/V Dynamic Equilibrium fully rigged on its trailer. Not only >> can we use the boat as a pop top camper; but, site #40 has unobstructed >> access to/from the launch ramp. So, we don?t have to rig/unrig the boat at >> the launch ramp. Little Sand Bay Campground will also let us park 2 >> vehicles + the empty boat trailer in their parking lot while we?re out on >> the water. >>> >>> The National Park Service only reserves backcountry campsites out in the >> Apostle Islands 1 month in advance. I will have to set my alarm clock >> early on June 22-24, 2021 to make sure I get on-line and reserve the >> campsites I want. >>> >>> I have the design for the kayak towing harness finished and I?ve started >> accumulating pieces/parts. After doing some research and modeling, I think >> a towing harness that lines the 4 boats up side-by-side will tow the best, >> be the most seaworthy configuration, and the easiest to deal with around >> the marina and on the beach. But, I plan to do some tow testing with S/V >> Dynamic Equilibrium in late May or early June in Ross Lake, about 12 miles >> from my house. I have finished the 4 cockpit covers with their around the >> hull retaining straps and verified fit/security on each of the kayaks. >> Losing a cockpit cover and filling the cockpit with water on Lake Superior >> might be the start of a bad day on the water! >>> >>> But, my biggest potential show stopper issue is me. As many of you >> know, I am 67 years old with A-Fib and 2 arthritic knees. I have a >> pacemaker and last month, I had my 2nd Cardiac Ablation procedure. For >> those of you not familiar with a Cardiac Ablation, it involves making an >> incision in your groin, snaking a catheter-like probe up the big vein in >> your leg back into the heart, and then selectively electrocuting the >> biological pacemaker cells that are causing the A-Fib. It stops the A-Fib; >> but, you are left with electrical burns and scar tissue inside the heart. >> 6 weeks after the Cardiac Ablation procedure, I still tire easily and have >> very poor aerobic stamina. I have a lot of rehab work to do in order to be >> ready for the High Adventure Trip in July. >>> >>> So, what cruise trips are everyone else planning? >>> >>> Roger Pihlaja >>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Sent from Mail for >> Windows 10 >>> >> >> > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 11 > Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2021 04:00:46 -0700 (MST) > From: JeffSmith > To: rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? > Message-ID: <1617015646651-0.post at n5.nabble.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > > WOW! Some video. Do you still do stuff like that? > > > > ----- > Jeff Smith > 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT > Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor > Atlantic Highlands, NJ > > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 12 > Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2021 07:39:00 -0400 > From: Mitch Mitchell > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? > Message-ID: > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 > > Still prefer rough water although I get a lot more sore afterwards theses days! ? > > Sent from my iPhone > >> On Mar 29, 2021, at 7:00 AM, JeffSmith wrote: >> >> ?WOW! Some video. Do you still do stuff like that? >> >> >> >> ----- >> Jeff Smith >> 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT >> Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor >> Atlantic Highlands, NJ >> >> -- >> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 13 > Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2021 13:10:38 +0000 > From: ROGER PIHLAJA > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] [Rhodes22e-list] New Traveler > Modifications - another alternative > Message-ID: > > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" > > Rick, > > It?s hard to tell for sure from this photo. But, I don?t think this is a GBI 29 Traveler. My control lines don?t have any knots in them. Do you have a close up picture of the traveler car? > > Roger Pihlaja > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > Sent from my iPhone > >> On Mar 28, 2021, at 12:42 PM, Rick Lange wrote: >> >> ?Roger, >> >> Here's some of it. You can see a cleat and the knot of the control line >> ends tied together. >> [image: ATT00010.jpg] >> >> Regards, >> >> Rick Lange >> >> >>>> On Sat, Mar 27, 2021 at 9:00 PM ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: >>> >>> Rick, >>> >>> In all the dozens of posts in this thread, someone said they were busting >>> their knuckles on their traveler. I don?t remember who. I remember asking >>> what they were hitting their knuckles on. I don?t think I ever got a >>> response. >>> >>> Can you post a picture of your traveler? From your last post, it sounds >>> like you don?t have a GBI 29 Traveler. Rather, you have a 2nd generation >>> traveler modified with cam cleats replacing the OEM standard jam cleats. >>> >>> Roger Pihlaja >>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>> >>> Sent from Mail for >>> Windows 10 >>> >>> >> -------------- next part -------------- >> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... >> Name: ATT00010.jpg >> Type: image/jpeg >> Size: 81236 bytes >> Desc: not available >> URL: > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 14 > Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2021 09:47:31 -0400 > From: Peter Nyberg > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? > Message-ID: <9D190611-A0E2-422C-B1F5-5C5E5BA95F9C at sunnybeeches.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 > > My cruising plan for this year is for week-long excursions on the coast of Maine launching from the public ramp in Rockland. > > There will be video. > > ?Peter > >> On Mar 28, 2021, at 6:12 PM, ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: >> >> Peter, >> >> Cmon man, we need more details than just one word! >> >> Roger Pihlaja >> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >>>> On Mar 28, 2021, at 4:42 PM, Peter Nyberg wrote: >>> >>> ?One word: Maine! >>> >>> ?Peter >>> >>>> On Mar 28, 2021, at 10:49 AM, ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: >>>> >>>> Hi All, >>>> >>>> So, here we are on Palm Sunday, 2021. What are everyone?s plans for a summer cruise? >>>> >>> > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 15 > Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2021 10:10:12 -0400 > From: Hank > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? > Message-ID: > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" > > We'll be up there in July for a 6 day trip on the JE Riggin. > Looking forward to seeing that part of the country. > > Hank > >> On Mon, Mar 29, 2021 at 9:48 AM Peter Nyberg wrote: >> >> My cruising plan for this year is for week-long excursions on the coast of >> Maine launching from the public ramp in Rockland. >> >> There will be video. >> >> ?Peter >> >>> On Mar 28, 2021, at 6:12 PM, ROGER PIHLAJA >> wrote: >>> >>> Peter, >>> >>> Cmon man, we need more details than just one word! >>> >>> Roger Pihlaja >>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> >>>> On Mar 28, 2021, at 4:42 PM, Peter Nyberg >> wrote: >>>> >>>> ?One word: Maine! >>>> >>>> ?Peter >>>> >>>>> On Mar 28, 2021, at 10:49 AM, ROGER PIHLAJA >> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Hi All, >>>>> >>>>> So, here we are on Palm Sunday, 2021. What are everyone?s plans for a >> summer cruise? >>>>> >>>> >> >> > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 16 > Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2021 10:55:25 -0400 > From: stan > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: [Rhodes22-list] GB Notice re the latest traveler system > Message-ID: > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"; Format="flowed" > > > *Please note.? Re the new Rhodes traveler, which is a holistic designed > operational system that functions in conjunction with the new outhaul > car configuration and the proprietary cut IMF mainsail:** > ** > **1.??? Per attachment:? No knots.? No Cleats.? One simple continuous > control line whose force needed to move it, is controllable with one > simple adjustment.** > ** > **2.??? That the **_part number_**on the ROC parts site > ? is? GB29? (there is no number or letter after > the 'GB'.** > ** > **If you purchased this version traveler from General Boats and have any > questions, please contact me direct at **? If you > purchased your boat from another source that has had its traveler system > "improved" by a prior owner, we are not in a position to be of help. If > you have found another system, (i.e. Harken) that is*/less costly/*for > its total needed parts and */simpler to install /and/handle/*, we would > very much appreciate its part number and hearing your take on what makes > it the better way to go, with an eye to using it with new and recycled > Rhodes in place of our current system. > ** > **thanks, > > stan > > *** >> On 3/29/21 9:10 AM, ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: >> Rick, >> >> It?s hard to tell for sure from this photo. But, I don?t think this is a GBI 29 Traveler. My control lines don?t have any knots in them. Do you have a close up picture of the traveler car? >> >> Roger Pihlaja >> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >>>> On Mar 28, 2021, at 12:42 PM, Rick Lange wrote: >>> >>> ?Roger, >>> >>> Here's some of it. You can see a cleat and the knot of the control line >>> ends tied together. >>> [image: ATT00010.jpg] >>> >>> Regards, >>> >>> Rick Lange >>> >>> >>>> On Sat, Mar 27, 2021 at 9:00 PM ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: >>>> >>>> Rick, >>>> >>>> In all the dozens of posts in this thread, someone said they were busting >>>> their knuckles on their traveler. I don?t remember who. I remember asking >>>> what they were hitting their knuckles on. I don?t think I ever got a >>>> response. >>>> >>>> Can you post a picture of your traveler? From your last post, it sounds >>>> like you don?t have a GBI 29 Traveler. Rather, you have a 2nd generation >>>> traveler modified with cam cleats replacing the OEM standard jam cleats. >>>> >>>> Roger Pihlaja >>>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>>> >>>> Sent from Mail for >>>> Windows 10 >>>> >>>> >>> -------------- next part -------------- >>> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... >>> Name: ATT00010.jpg >>> Type: image/jpeg >>> Size: 81236 bytes >>> Desc: not available >>> URL: > > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: 50e4fc946ccfda33104f307faad0d9f5.jpeg > Type: image/jpeg > Size: 75505 bytes > Desc: not available > URL: > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 17 > Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2021 11:08:05 -0400 > From: Peter Nyberg > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? > Message-ID: <6389A2B0-083D-4551-B944-694F552E4CCA at sunnybeeches.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 > > Small world. My wife and I took week-long cruises on the J&E Riggin for several years running back in the late 90?s. After some experience, we opted for dates in September, for cooler temperatures and better wind. > > This is how I first became aware of the Penobscot Bay area as a prime cruising location. > > ?Peter > >> On Mar 29, 2021, at 10:10 AM, Hank wrote: >> >> We'll be up there in July for a 6 day trip on the JE Riggin. >> Looking forward to seeing that part of the country. >> >> Hank >> >>> On Mon, Mar 29, 2021 at 9:48 AM Peter Nyberg wrote: >>> >>> My cruising plan for this year is for week-long excursions on the coast of >>> Maine launching from the public ramp in Rockland. >>> >>> There will be video. >>> >>> ?Peter > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 18 > Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2021 08:35:16 -0700 (MST) > From: Lee > To: rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? > Message-ID: <1617032116809-0.post at n5.nabble.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > > Chris, > > Milford? That's where I learned how to sail back in the mid-70s! Wow I'm > old. A friend took me out on a Sunfish. A few days later I went out by > myself so I would be confident in taking a girl along with me. Winds were > extremely high for a Rhodes so you can imagine a novice on a Sunfish. > Fortunately my friend showed me how to right the thing and after about a > dozen capsizes I got pretty good at it. Never did take a girl out on it. > > I believe I saw that your son teaches at my alma mater. Tuttle Creek Lake > also has some great sailing but an extremely rough road to get to the > "club." > > http://https://beaconmarineboats.com/boating-in-kansas/ > > > Lee > 1999 Rhodes22 TBD > Claytor Lake, VA > > > > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > > > ------------------------------ > > Subject: Digest Footer > > _______________________________________________ > Rhodes22-list mailing list > Rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org > http://rhodes22.org/mailman/listinfo/rhodes22-list > > > ------------------------------ > > End of Rhodes22-list Digest, Vol 4325, Issue 1 > ********************************************** > From jeffsmithphoto at gmail.com Mon Mar 29 17:40:36 2021 From: jeffsmithphoto at gmail.com (JeffSmith) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2021 14:40:36 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? In-Reply-To: References: <1617032116809-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <1617054036993-0.post@n5.nabble.com> We bought the Rhodes to visit other destinations without the long hauls up and down Long Island Sound (been there done that for 40 years) or down and up the Jersey Coast (ditto). This year we will plan on cruising the Eastern Shore of Maryland in late May or early June for a week or so. From what I understand the earlier the better. There may be a (long delayed) FamilyWedding Party on Lake Champlain in June, where we would trailer the boat and then perhaps join our daughter's family in a house in Maine as an extension of their East Coast vacation. If and when Canada opens up we would like to do The Thousand Islands, the Saguenay Fiord, Georgian Banks, etc. but at age 77 (In good health - knock wood)... ----- Jeff Smith 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor Atlantic Highlands, NJ -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From mweisner at ebsmed.com Mon Mar 29 17:52:20 2021 From: mweisner at ebsmed.com (Michael D. Weisner) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2021 17:52:20 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? In-Reply-To: References: <000601d723e6$c24a79f0$46df6dd0$@ebsmed.com> Message-ID: <022c01d724e5$cbe51e20$63af5a60$@ebsmed.com> Mitch, Thanks for the exhilarating video. At this point, I need a bit more time to stand up, even when beached. It's funny how easily I used to "bounce right out of the kayak." Not so easy to do, now. I still love kayaking in the nearby rivers and lakes, when not sailing. On the other hand, I should probably give away my windsurfer. Mike s/v Wind Lass ('91) Nissequogue River, NY I?d rather be sailing :~) -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of Mitch Mitchell Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2021 5:28 PM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? Mike, one of the easiest ways to get in a kayak from a boat is by using the swim ladder. It just needs to extend deep enough in the water so that you can put one foot on the bottom rung at least a foot below the water and then swing the other leg into the kayak - sit down and then bring the other leg in. I think I made a video on it a while back, I'll have to look and see. The other option is a seal launch. I did this seal launch video a long time ago. https://youtu.be/Em5bbFNsy6Y?t=50 Good luck! By the way, just kidding about the seal launch from the Rhodes - would scratch the boat too much. Mitch On Sun, Mar 28, 2021 at 11:26 AM Michael D. Weisner wrote: > Roger, > > As I have aged, my ability to enter and exit my Pamlico 145T from my > Rhodes > 22 has become more challenging. Dinghy transfers are not a problem but > the kayak has proven too unstable to access from the side of the > Rhodes or even the swim ladder. > > Maybe if I had a swim platform it would be easier. > > Do you have any tips? > > Mike > s/v Wind Lass ('91) > Nissequogue River, NY > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of > ROGER PIHLAJA > Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2021 10:50 AM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Summer 2021 Cruise Plans? > > Hi All, > > So, here we are on Palm Sunday, 2021. What are everyone's plans for a > summer cruise? > > My plan for a Great Circle Loop High Adventure Sailing/Sea Kayaking > Tour Of Apostle Islands National Lakeshore continues to move forward. > Last week, I was able to reserve a special campsite at Little Sand Bay > Campground on the tip of the Bayfield Peninsula for the beginning put-in and ending take-out. > After consultation with the campground manager, it turns out campsite > #40 has an unused grassy area next to the campsite where we can park > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium fully rigged on its trailer. Not only can we > use the boat as a pop top camper; but, site #40 has unobstructed > access to/from the launch ramp. So, we don't have to rig/unrig the > boat at the launch ramp. Little Sand Bay Campground will also let us > park 2 vehicles + the empty boat trailer in their parking lot while > we're out on the water. > > The National Park Service only reserves backcountry campsites out in > the Apostle Islands 1 month in advance. I will have to set my alarm > clock early on June 22-24, 2021 to make sure I get on-line and reserve > the campsites I want. > > I have the design for the kayak towing harness finished and I've > started accumulating pieces/parts. After doing some research and > modeling, I think a towing harness that lines the 4 boats up > side-by-side will tow the best, be the most seaworthy configuration, > and the easiest to deal with around the marina and on the beach. But, > I plan to do some tow testing with S/V Dynamic Equilibrium in late May > or early June in Ross Lake, about 12 miles from my house. I have > finished the 4 cockpit covers with their around the hull retaining > straps and verified fit/security on each of the kayaks. > Losing a cockpit cover and filling the cockpit with water on Lake > Superior might be the start of a bad day on the water! > > But, my biggest potential show stopper issue is me. As many of you > know, I am 67 years old with A-Fib and 2 arthritic knees. I have a > pacemaker and last month, I had my 2nd Cardiac Ablation procedure. > For those of you not familiar with a Cardiac Ablation, it involves > making an incision in your groin, snaking a catheter-like probe up the > big vein in your leg back into the heart, and then selectively > electrocuting the biological pacemaker cells that are causing the > A-Fib. It stops the A-Fib; but, you are left with electrical burns > and scar tissue inside the heart. 6 weeks after the Cardiac Ablation > procedure, I still tire easily and have very poor aerobic stamina. I > have a lot of rehab work to do in order to be ready for the High > Adventure Trip in July. > > So, what cruise trips are everyone else planning? > > Roger Pihlaja > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > > > > > Sent from Mail for > Windows > 10 > > From roger_pihlaja at msn.com Mon Mar 29 19:34:50 2021 From: roger_pihlaja at msn.com (ROGER PIHLAJA) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2021 23:34:50 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Estimated Cost Of A Harken Traveler System In-Reply-To: References: <011601d72249$f0e2ee80$d2a8cb80$@ca> <012101d7224d$97b44940$c71cdbc0$@ca> , Message-ID: Hi All, The only other system I?m aware of that sort of matches the GB 29 Traveler is the Harken Windward Sheeting Traveler System. For the sake of discussion, I have priced out the pieces/parts to build such a Harken system. Note: This estimate assumes you have the old 2nd generation traveler so you can mount the Harken track onto the bar, have the mounting sockets on the backstays, and you have the necessary tools and skills to do the assembly yourself. Part No # Reqd Units Description Price/Unit Total Price 2745 1 Each Small Boat Windward Sheeting Car, 22 mm $575.75 $575.75 2740 1 Pair Single Sheave Track End Controls, 22 mm $264.25 $264.25 2720.1.5M 1 Each 22 mm X 1.5 m Low-Beam Track $97.60 $97.60 446 1 Pair 22 mm Low-Beam Line Sheading End Stop $13.20 $13.20 2722 1 Pair 22 mm Low Beam Track Trim Caps $17.20 $17.20 Hardware 15 Each #10-24UNC X 1.25 316 SS, Flat Head Machine Screws $0.54 $8.10 Hardware 15 Each #10-24UNC Barrel Nuts $1.40 $21.00 Rope 20 Feet 5/16 Inch OD X 20 Ft Sta-Set Polyester Yacht Braid $1.21 $24.20 Total Not Including Tax, S&H, Or Assembly $1021.30 All of a sudden, Stan?s price of $495.00, fully assembled, for a GB 29 Traveler, starts to look pretty attractive! Roger Pihlaja S/V Dynamic Equilibrium Sent from Mail for Windows 10 From: stan Sent: Monday, March 29, 2021 10:55 AM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: [Rhodes22-list] GB Notice re the latest traveler system *Please note. Re the new Rhodes traveler, which is a holistic designed operational system that functions in conjunction with the new outhaul car configuration and the proprietary cut IMF mainsail:** ** **1. Per attachment: No knots. No Cleats. One simple continuous control line whose force needed to move it, is controllable with one simple adjustment.** ** **2. That the **_part number_**on the ROC parts site > is GB29 (there is no number or letter after the 'GB'.** ** **If you purchased this version traveler from General Boats and have any questions, please contact me direct at ** If you purchased your boat from another source that has had its traveler system "improved" by a prior owner, we are not in a position to be of help. If you have found another system, (i.e. Harken) that is*/less costly/*for its total needed parts and */simpler to install /and/handle/*, we would very much appreciate its part number and hearing your take on what makes it the better way to go, with an eye to using it with new and recycled Rhodes in place of our current system. ** **thanks, stan *** On 3/29/21 9:10 AM, ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: > Rick, > > It?s hard to tell for sure from this photo. But, I don?t think this is a GBI 29 Traveler. My control lines don?t have any knots in them. Do you have a close up picture of the traveler car? > > Roger Pihlaja > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > Sent from my iPhone > >> On Mar 28, 2021, at 12:42 PM, Rick Lange wrote: >> >> ?Roger, >> >> Here's some of it. You can see a cleat and the knot of the control line >> ends tied together. >> [image: ATT00010.jpg] >> >> Regards, >> >> Rick Lange >> >> >>> On Sat, Mar 27, 2021 at 9:00 PM ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: >>> >>> Rick, >>> >>> In all the dozens of posts in this thread, someone said they were busting >>> their knuckles on their traveler. I don?t remember who. I remember asking >>> what they were hitting their knuckles on. I don?t think I ever got a >>> response. >>> >>> Can you post a picture of your traveler? From your last post, it sounds >>> like you don?t have a GBI 29 Traveler. Rather, you have a 2nd generation >>> traveler modified with cam cleats replacing the OEM standard jam cleats. >>> >>> Roger Pihlaja >>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >>> >>> Sent from Mail for >>> Windows 10 >>> >>> >> -------------- next part -------------- >> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... >> Name: ATT00010.jpg >> Type: image/jpeg >> Size: 81236 bytes >> Desc: not available >> URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: 50e4fc946ccfda33104f307faad0d9f5.jpeg Type: image/jpeg Size: 75505 bytes Desc: not available URL: From tom.vanheule at intrinsicprograms.com Mon Mar 29 19:39:33 2021 From: tom.vanheule at intrinsicprograms.com (Tom Van Heule) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2021 18:39:33 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Estimated Cost Of A Harken Traveler System In-Reply-To: References: <011601d72249$f0e2ee80$d2a8cb80$@ca> <012101d7224d$97b44940$c71cdbc0$@ca> Message-ID: Fwiw.... I live like across the way from Harken. Within 10 min from HQ and their home. If people want to get a group buy I can probably arrange. I am happy with my current rig, but happy to champion. On Mon, Mar 29, 2021, 6:34 PM ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: > Hi All, > > The only other system I?m aware of that sort of matches the GB 29 Traveler > is the Harken Windward Sheeting Traveler System. For the sake of > discussion, I have priced out the pieces/parts to build such a Harken > system. Note: This estimate assumes you have the old 2nd generation > traveler so you can mount the Harken track onto the bar, have the mounting > sockets on the backstays, and you have the necessary tools and skills to do > the assembly yourself. > > Part No # Reqd Units Description > Price/Unit Total Price > 2745 1 Each Small Boat Windward Sheeting Car, 22 mm > $575.75 $575.75 > 2740 1 Pair Single Sheave Track End Controls, 22 > mm $264.25 $264.25 > 2720.1.5M 1 Each 22 mm X 1.5 m Low-Beam Track > $97.60 $97.60 > 446 1 Pair 22 mm Low-Beam Line Sheading End > Stop $13.20 $13.20 > 2722 1 Pair 22 mm Low Beam Track Trim Caps > $17.20 $17.20 > Hardware 15 Each #10-24UNC X 1.25 316 SS, Flat Head Machine > Screws $0.54 $8.10 > Hardware 15 Each #10-24UNC Barrel Nuts > $1.40 $21.00 > Rope 20 Feet 5/16 Inch OD X 20 Ft Sta-Set Polyester > Yacht Braid $1.21 $24.20 > > Total Not Including Tax, S&H, Or Assembly $1021.30 > > All of a sudden, Stan?s price of $495.00, fully assembled, for a GB 29 > Traveler, starts to look pretty attractive! > > Roger Pihlaja > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > Sent from Mail for > Windows 10 > > From: stan > Sent: Monday, March 29, 2021 10:55 AM > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List > Subject: [Rhodes22-list] GB Notice re the latest traveler system > > > *Please note. Re the new Rhodes traveler, which is a holistic designed > operational system that functions in conjunction with the new outhaul > car configuration and the proprietary cut IMF mainsail:** > ** > **1. Per attachment: No knots. No Cleats. One simple continuous > control line whose force needed to move it, is controllable with one > simple adjustment.** > ** > **2. That the **_part number_**on the ROC parts site > > is GB29 (there > is no number or letter after > the 'GB'.** > ** > **If you purchased this version traveler from General Boats and have any > questions, please contact me direct at ** If you > purchased your boat from another source that has had its traveler system > "improved" by a prior owner, we are not in a position to be of help. If > you have found another system, (i.e. Harken) that is*/less costly/*for > its total needed parts and */simpler to install /and/handle/*, we would > very much appreciate its part number and hearing your take on what makes > it the better way to go, with an eye to using it with new and recycled > Rhodes in place of our current system. > ** > **thanks, > > stan > > *** > On 3/29/21 9:10 AM, ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: > > Rick, > > > > It?s hard to tell for sure from this photo. But, I don?t think this is > a GBI 29 Traveler. My control lines don?t have any knots in them. Do you > have a close up picture of the traveler car? > > > > Roger Pihlaja > > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > > > > Sent from my iPhone > > > >> On Mar 28, 2021, at 12:42 PM, Rick Lange > wrote: > >> > >> ?Roger, > >> > >> Here's some of it. You can see a cleat and the knot of the control line > >> ends tied together. > >> [image: ATT00010.jpg] > >> > >> Regards, > >> > >> Rick Lange > >> > >> > >>> On Sat, Mar 27, 2021 at 9:00 PM ROGER PIHLAJA > wrote: > >>> > >>> Rick, > >>> > >>> In all the dozens of posts in this thread, someone said they were > busting > >>> their knuckles on their traveler. I don?t remember who. I remember > asking > >>> what they were hitting their knuckles on. I don?t think I ever got a > >>> response. > >>> > >>> Can you post a picture of your traveler? From your last post, it > sounds > >>> like you don?t have a GBI 29 Traveler. Rather, you have a 2nd > generation > >>> traveler modified with cam cleats replacing the OEM standard jam > cleats. > >>> > >>> Roger Pihlaja > >>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium > >>> > >>> Sent from Mail for > >>> Windows 10 > >>> > >>> > >> -------------- next part -------------- > >> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > >> Name: ATT00010.jpg > >> Type: image/jpeg > >> Size: 81236 bytes > >> Desc: not available > >> URL: < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210328/60dfe6c8/attachment.jpg > > > > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: 50e4fc946ccfda33104f307faad0d9f5.jpeg > Type: image/jpeg > Size: 75505 bytes > Desc: not available > URL: < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210329/081534be/attachment.jpeg > > > > From tom.vanheule at intrinsicprograms.com Mon Mar 29 20:24:57 2021 From: tom.vanheule at intrinsicprograms.com (Tom Van Heule) Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2021 19:24:57 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Estimated Cost Of A Harken Traveler System In-Reply-To: References: <011601d72249$f0e2ee80$d2a8cb80$@ca> <012101d7224d$97b44940$c71cdbc0$@ca> Message-ID: And I don't mean to be competitive or anything. I have the GB setup that Stan designed and I love it. On Mon, Mar 29, 2021, 6:39 PM Tom Van Heule < tom.vanheule at intrinsicprograms.com> wrote: > Fwiw.... I live like across the way from Harken. Within 10 min from HQ and > their home. > If people want to get a group buy I can probably arrange. > > I am happy with my current rig, but happy to champion. > > On Mon, Mar 29, 2021, 6:34 PM ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: > >> Hi All, >> >> The only other system I?m aware of that sort of matches the GB 29 >> Traveler is the Harken Windward Sheeting Traveler System. For the sake of >> discussion, I have priced out the pieces/parts to build such a Harken >> system. Note: This estimate assumes you have the old 2nd generation >> traveler so you can mount the Harken track onto the bar, have the mounting >> sockets on the backstays, and you have the necessary tools and skills to do >> the assembly yourself. >> >> Part No # Reqd Units Description >> Price/Unit Total Price >> 2745 1 Each Small Boat Windward Sheeting Car, 22 >> mm $575.75 $575.75 >> 2740 1 Pair Single Sheave Track End Controls, 22 >> mm $264.25 $264.25 >> 2720.1.5M 1 Each 22 mm X 1.5 m Low-Beam Track >> $97.60 $97.60 >> 446 1 Pair 22 mm Low-Beam Line Sheading End >> Stop $13.20 $13.20 >> 2722 1 Pair 22 mm Low Beam Track Trim Caps >> $17.20 $17.20 >> Hardware 15 Each #10-24UNC X 1.25 316 SS, Flat Head Machine >> Screws $0.54 $8.10 >> Hardware 15 Each #10-24UNC Barrel Nuts >> $1.40 $21.00 >> Rope 20 Feet 5/16 Inch OD X 20 Ft Sta-Set Polyester >> Yacht Braid $1.21 $24.20 >> >> Total Not Including Tax, S&H, Or Assembly $1021.30 >> >> All of a sudden, Stan?s price of $495.00, fully assembled, for a GB 29 >> Traveler, starts to look pretty attractive! >> >> Roger Pihlaja >> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >> >> Sent from Mail for >> Windows 10 >> >> From: stan >> Sent: Monday, March 29, 2021 10:55 AM >> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List >> Subject: [Rhodes22-list] GB Notice re the latest traveler system >> >> >> *Please note. Re the new Rhodes traveler, which is a holistic designed >> operational system that functions in conjunction with the new outhaul >> car configuration and the proprietary cut IMF mainsail:** >> ** >> **1. Per attachment: No knots. No Cleats. One simple continuous >> control line whose force needed to move it, is controllable with one >> simple adjustment.** >> ** >> **2. That the **_part number_**on the ROC parts site >> > is GB29 (there >> is no number or letter after >> the 'GB'.** >> ** >> **If you purchased this version traveler from General Boats and have any >> questions, please contact me direct at ** If you >> purchased your boat from another source that has had its traveler system >> "improved" by a prior owner, we are not in a position to be of help. If >> you have found another system, (i.e. Harken) that is*/less costly/*for >> its total needed parts and */simpler to install /and/handle/*, we would >> very much appreciate its part number and hearing your take on what makes >> it the better way to go, with an eye to using it with new and recycled >> Rhodes in place of our current system. >> ** >> **thanks, >> >> stan >> >> *** >> On 3/29/21 9:10 AM, ROGER PIHLAJA wrote: >> > Rick, >> > >> > It?s hard to tell for sure from this photo. But, I don?t think this is >> a GBI 29 Traveler. My control lines don?t have any knots in them. Do you >> have a close up picture of the traveler car? >> > >> > Roger Pihlaja >> > S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >> > >> > Sent from my iPhone >> > >> >> On Mar 28, 2021, at 12:42 PM, Rick Lange >> wrote: >> >> >> >> ?Roger, >> >> >> >> Here's some of it. You can see a cleat and the knot of the control >> line >> >> ends tied together. >> >> [image: ATT00010.jpg] >> >> >> >> Regards, >> >> >> >> Rick Lange >> >> >> >> >> >>> On Sat, Mar 27, 2021 at 9:00 PM ROGER PIHLAJA >> wrote: >> >>> >> >>> Rick, >> >>> >> >>> In all the dozens of posts in this thread, someone said they were >> busting >> >>> their knuckles on their traveler. I don?t remember who. I remember >> asking >> >>> what they were hitting their knuckles on. I don?t think I ever got a >> >>> response. >> >>> >> >>> Can you post a picture of your traveler? From your last post, it >> sounds >> >>> like you don?t have a GBI 29 Traveler. Rather, you have a 2nd >> generation >> >>> traveler modified with cam cleats replacing the OEM standard jam >> cleats. >> >>> >> >>> Roger Pihlaja >> >>> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium >> >>> >> >>> Sent from Mail for >> >>> Windows 10 >> >>> >> >>> >> >> -------------- next part -------------- >> >> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... >> >> Name: ATT00010.jpg >> >> Type: image/jpeg >> >> Size: 81236 bytes >> >> Desc: not available >> >> URL: < >> http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210328/60dfe6c8/attachment.jpg >> > >> >> -------------- next part -------------- >> A non-text attachment was scrubbed... >> Name: 50e4fc946ccfda33104f307faad0d9f5.jpeg >> Type: image/jpeg >> Size: 75505 bytes >> Desc: not available >> URL: < >> http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210329/081534be/attachment.jpeg >> > >> >> From allynb at adsne.com Mon Mar 29 23:23:22 2021 From: allynb at adsne.com (Allyn Baskerville) Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2021 03:23:22 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Crane question Message-ID: My boat, which was a tad over $2,000, didn?t come with a winch and cradle, and genuine ones are most unfortunately out of my budget. I have access to three 2? diameter x 6? length x .125? wall thickness aluminum tubes. I have a question though. Is a 1/8? wall thickness adequate for the crane? I?ve heard of people using their booms as gin poles to raise their masts, so this is definitely thicker. Thanks Allyn Sent from my iPhone From gstewart8 at cogeco.ca Tue Mar 30 01:04:34 2021 From: gstewart8 at cogeco.ca (Graham Stewart) Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2021 01:04:34 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Crane question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <002f01d72522$2e72f300$8b58d900$@ca> Allyn: I assume that you have the standard mas. These older boats raise their masts using the boom as you mentioned. I do that twice every year. I have attached the manual for these older boats that explains, in Stan's inimitable style, exactly how it is done. Graham Stewart Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 Kingston Ontario -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf Of Allyn Baskerville Sent: Monday, March 29, 2021 11:23 PM To: rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Crane question My boat, which was a tad over $2,000, didn?t come with a winch and cradle, and genuine ones are most unfortunately out of my budget. I have access to three 2? diameter x 6? length x .125? wall thickness aluminum tubes. I have a question though. Is a 1/8? wall thickness adequate for the crane? I?ve heard of people using their booms as gin poles to raise their masts, so this is definitely thicker. Thanks Allyn Sent from my iPhone -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Rhodes 22 Manual.pdf Type: application/pdf Size: 2853572 bytes Desc: not available URL: From tavares0947 at gmail.com Tue Mar 30 10:08:38 2021 From: tavares0947 at gmail.com (Todd Tavares) Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2021 10:08:38 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Crane question In-Reply-To: <002f01d72522$2e72f300$8b58d900$@ca> References: <002f01d72522$2e72f300$8b58d900$@ca> Message-ID: Allyn, The .125 wall thickness aluminum tubes should be adequate if the diameter is large enough > 1.5 or so. Raising from the stern raised cradle using the GB mast raising system pole is much easier and less risky than raising from the bow using the boom as the gin pole. There are plenty of pictures of the GB mast raising system on the web and this list if you have the skill and desire to make a clone for yourself. The GB system uses a winch with friction brake, mounted to the top of the capitol mounted gin/crane pole. I use the trailer winch. I can post some pics if I can dig them up. Todd T. On Tue, Mar 30, 2021, 1:04 AM Graham Stewart wrote: > Allyn: > > I assume that you have the standard mas. These older boats raise their > masts using the boom as you mentioned. I do that twice every year. > I have attached the manual for these older boats that explains, in Stan's > inimitable style, exactly how it is done. > > Graham Stewart > Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 > Kingston Ontario > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf > Of Allyn Baskerville > Sent: Monday, March 29, 2021 11:23 PM > To: rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org > Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Crane question > > My boat, which was a tad over $2,000, didn?t come with a winch and cradle, > and genuine ones are most unfortunately out of my budget. I have access to > three 2? diameter x 6? length x .125? wall thickness aluminum tubes. > > I have a question though. Is a 1/8? wall thickness adequate for the crane? > > I?ve heard of people using their booms as gin poles to raise their masts, > so this is definitely thicker. > > Thanks > Allyn > > Sent from my iPhone > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: Rhodes 22 Manual.pdf > Type: application/pdf > Size: 2853572 bytes > Desc: not available > URL: < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210330/7679325c/attachment.pdf > > > From mm.bizlist1 at gmail.com Tue Mar 30 13:48:15 2021 From: mm.bizlist1 at gmail.com (Mike McKay) Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2021 10:48:15 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] What is this part for? Message-ID: <1617126495120-0.post@n5.nabble.com> This is on my bow?not sure what it is intended for. -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From mweisner at ebsmed.com Tue Mar 30 13:56:00 2021 From: mweisner at ebsmed.com (Michael D. Weisner) Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2021 13:56:00 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] What is this part for? In-Reply-To: <1617126495120-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1617126495120-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <005501d7258d$f249ac90$d6dd05b0$@ebsmed.com> Mike, That is the lower attachment for the inverted Danforth style anchor that hangs from the bow pulpit rail. The fastpin goes through the slot in the shank and the chain hangs down. See http://rhodes22.org/pics/rumrnr.jpg Mike s/v Wind Lass ('91) Nissequogue River, NY I?d rather be sailing :~) -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of Mike McKay Sent: Tuesday, March 30, 2021 1:48 PM To: rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org Subject: [Rhodes22-list] What is this part for? This is on my bow?not sure what it is intended for. -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From mm.bizlist1 at gmail.com Tue Mar 30 14:12:36 2021 From: mm.bizlist1 at gmail.com (Mike McKay) Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2021 11:12:36 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] What is this part for? In-Reply-To: <1617126495120-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1617126495120-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <1617127956513-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Thanks Mike! -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From peter at sunnybeeches.com Tue Mar 30 17:01:04 2021 From: peter at sunnybeeches.com (Peter Nyberg) Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2021 17:01:04 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Mike, How did you do that? (was: What is this part for?) In-Reply-To: <005501d7258d$f249ac90$d6dd05b0$@ebsmed.com> References: <1617126495120-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <005501d7258d$f249ac90$d6dd05b0$@ebsmed.com> Message-ID: Mike, You?ve got a link to an image imbedded in the body of your post instead of being put at the bottom where mailman usually puts such things. How did you do that? ?Peter > On Mar 30, 2021, at 1:56 PM, Michael D. Weisner wrote: > > Mike, > > That is the lower attachment for the inverted Danforth style anchor that hangs from the bow pulpit rail. The fastpin goes through the slot in the shank and the chain hangs down. > > See http://rhodes22.org/pics/rumrnr.jpg > > Mike > s/v Wind Lass ('91) > Nissequogue River, NY > I?d rather be sailing :~) > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of Mike McKay > Sent: Tuesday, March 30, 2021 1:48 PM > To: rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org > Subject: [Rhodes22-list] What is this part for? > > This is on my bow?not sure what it is intended for. > > > > > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > From peter at sunnybeeches.com Tue Mar 30 17:08:21 2021 From: peter at sunnybeeches.com (Peter Nyberg) Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2021 17:08:21 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Mike, How did you do that? (was: What is this part for?) In-Reply-To: References: <1617126495120-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <005501d7258d$f249ac90$d6dd05b0$@ebsmed.com> Message-ID: <1046A069-48A0-4288-B622-48C1EBCBD73F@sunnybeeches.com> Oh, it?s just a link, not an attachment. Never mind. > On Mar 30, 2021, at 5:01 PM, Peter Nyberg wrote: > > Mike, > > You?ve got a link to an image imbedded in the body of your post instead of being put at the bottom where mailman usually puts such things. > > How did you do that? > > ?Peter > > >> On Mar 30, 2021, at 1:56 PM, Michael D. Weisner wrote: >> >> Mike, >> >> That is the lower attachment for the inverted Danforth style anchor that hangs from the bow pulpit rail. The fastpin goes through the slot in the shank and the chain hangs down. >> >> See http://rhodes22.org/pics/rumrnr.jpg >> >> Mike >> s/v Wind Lass ('91) >> Nissequogue River, NY >> I?d rather be sailing :~) >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of Mike McKay >> Sent: Tuesday, March 30, 2021 1:48 PM >> To: rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org >> Subject: [Rhodes22-list] What is this part for? >> >> This is on my bow?not sure what it is intended for. >> >> >> >> >> -- >> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ >> > From mweisner at ebsmed.com Tue Mar 30 17:33:13 2021 From: mweisner at ebsmed.com (Michael D. Weisner) Date: Tue, 30 Mar 2021 17:33:13 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Mike, How did you do that? (was: What is this part for?) In-Reply-To: <1046A069-48A0-4288-B622-48C1EBCBD73F@sunnybeeches.com> References: <1617126495120-0.post@n5.nabble.com> <005501d7258d$f249ac90$d6dd05b0$@ebsmed.com> <1046A069-48A0-4288-B622-48C1EBCBD73F@sunnybeeches.com> Message-ID: <007b01d725ac$4ac84340$e058c9c0$@ebsmed.com> Peter, You are correct! It's just a link to an image already on the Rhodes22.org site, not an attachment. It was easy to scan for a picture on the new website. The trick is to find the URL for the picture which was in the Picture Gallery (rhodes22.org/pictures-exterior.html to be exact). If you right click on the desired image (at least in Firefox) you can select from a context menu "Copy Image Location" and then just paste the link into the email. You built a pretty cool website. Mike s/v Wind Lass ('91) Nissequogue River, NY I?d rather be sailing :~) -----Original Message----- From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of Peter Nyberg Sent: Tuesday, March 30, 2021 5:08 PM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Mike, How did you do that? (was: What is this part for?) Oh, it?s just a link, not an attachment. Never mind. > On Mar 30, 2021, at 5:01 PM, Peter Nyberg wrote: > > Mike, > > You?ve got a link to an image imbedded in the body of your post instead of being put at the bottom where mailman usually puts such things. > > How did you do that? > > ?Peter > > >> On Mar 30, 2021, at 1:56 PM, Michael D. Weisner wrote: >> >> Mike, >> >> That is the lower attachment for the inverted Danforth style anchor that hangs from the bow pulpit rail. The fastpin goes through the slot in the shank and the chain hangs down. >> >> See http://rhodes22.org/pics/rumrnr.jpg >> >> Mike >> s/v Wind Lass ('91) >> Nissequogue River, NY >> I?d rather be sailing :~) >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Rhodes22-list On Behalf Of Mike McKay >> Sent: Tuesday, March 30, 2021 1:48 PM >> To: rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org >> Subject: [Rhodes22-list] What is this part for? >> >> This is on my bow?not sure what it is intended for. >> >> >> >> >> -- >> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ >> > From roger_pihlaja at msn.com Wed Mar 31 09:25:38 2021 From: roger_pihlaja at msn.com (ROGER PIHLAJA) Date: Wed, 31 Mar 2021 13:25:38 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Crane question In-Reply-To: References: <002f01d72522$2e72f300$8b58d900$@ca>, Message-ID: Hi Allyn, OK, I?m going to put on my engineer?s hat and do a safe load calculation for you. Assumptions: 1. Model the tube as if we were buckling a theoretical column with the bottom end fixed and the top end free to move out of column 2. The column can buckle in any direction 3. D = 2.00 inch, t = 0.125 inch, L = 6.00 feet = 72.0 inch, [Pi] = 3.14159 4. The MOC is 6061-T6 Al Alloy [Modulus of Elasticity] = E = 10000 ksi = 10000000 psi 5. [Safety Factor] = 3.0 6. [Moment Of Inertia] For A Tube = Ix = Iy = ([Pi] / 64) * (([D] ^ 4 ? ([D] ? (2 * t) ^ 4)) = 0.3250 inch ^ 4 7. Mast is moved slowly, so dynamic loads don?t need to be considered With all these assumptions, the [Critical Axial Compressive Load] = [Pcr] = [Pi] ^ 2 * E * I / (4 * (L ^ 2)) = 1547 lbs [Psafe] = [Pcr] / [Safety Factor] = 516 lbs in compression You would need to do a statics calculation to determine the worst case compressive load on the column. I don?t know your gin pole geometry, so I don?t have enough information to do that calculation. My guess is, this is probably OK; but, its close enough that, I would do the calculation before I tried it. Also, note that this is assuming failure by buckling under a pure compressive load. If the aluminum tube moves out of column even a little; then, things will start to go crocked in a hurry! I would want to see some sort of guy wires or a sacrificial assistant to hold the tube in column. Hope this helps, good luck! Roger Pihlaja S/V Dynamic Equilibrium From: Todd Tavares Sent: Tuesday, March 30, 2021 10:08 AM To: The Rhodes 22 Email List Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Crane question Allyn, The .125 wall thickness aluminum tubes should be adequate if the diameter is large enough > 1.5 or so. Raising from the stern raised cradle using the GB mast raising system pole is much easier and less risky than raising from the bow using the boom as the gin pole. There are plenty of pictures of the GB mast raising system on the web and this list if you have the skill and desire to make a clone for yourself. The GB system uses a winch with friction brake, mounted to the top of the capitol mounted gin/crane pole. I use the trailer winch. I can post some pics if I can dig them up. Todd T. On Tue, Mar 30, 2021, 1:04 AM Graham Stewart wrote: > Allyn: > > I assume that you have the standard mas. These older boats raise their > masts using the boom as you mentioned. I do that twice every year. > I have attached the manual for these older boats that explains, in Stan's > inimitable style, exactly how it is done. > > Graham Stewart > Agile, Rodes 22, 1976 > Kingston Ontario > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf > Of Allyn Baskerville > Sent: Monday, March 29, 2021 11:23 PM > To: rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org > Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Crane question > > My boat, which was a tad over $2,000, didn?t come with a winch and cradle, > and genuine ones are most unfortunately out of my budget. I have access to > three 2? diameter x 6? length x .125? wall thickness aluminum tubes. > > I have a question though. Is a 1/8? wall thickness adequate for the crane? > > I?ve heard of people using their booms as gin poles to raise their masts, > so this is definitely thicker. > > Thanks > Allyn > > Sent from my iPhone > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: Rhodes 22 Manual.pdf > Type: application/pdf > Size: 2853572 bytes > Desc: not available > URL: < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210330/7679325c/attachment.pdf > > > From jeffsmithphoto at gmail.com Wed Mar 31 14:21:10 2021 From: jeffsmithphoto at gmail.com (JeffSmith) Date: Wed, 31 Mar 2021 11:21:10 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Burgee Arrived Message-ID: <1617214870362-0.post@n5.nabble.com> It came in the mail today and looks great. Thanks Joe! ----- Jeff Smith 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor Atlantic Highlands, NJ -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From mm.bizlist1 at gmail.com Wed Mar 31 15:19:53 2021 From: mm.bizlist1 at gmail.com (Mike McKay) Date: Wed, 31 Mar 2021 12:19:53 -0700 (MST) Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Under seat storage Message-ID: <1617218393088-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Hi, I'm going to install aluminum retaining bars under my cockpit seats to secure my gas tank and containers as many Rhodies do. My question is how to best attach the HDPE brackets. It seems that others have used stainless screws into the single layer of fiberglass at each end as shown in the following picture. Is that the case, or was some other method of reinforcing the attachment holes used (e.g., epoxy). Thanks, Mike McKay s/v Liber 2006/2018 -- Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From sloopblueheron at gmail.com Wed Mar 31 16:48:27 2021 From: sloopblueheron at gmail.com (Rick Lange) Date: Wed, 31 Mar 2021 16:48:27 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Under seat storage In-Reply-To: <1617218393088-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1617218393088-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: Hi Mike, If they are going to extend the length of the cockpit, I question the rigidity of using metal bars. Regards, Rick Lange On Wed, Mar 31, 2021 at 3:19 PM Mike McKay wrote: > Hi, I'm going to install aluminum retaining bars under my cockpit seats to > secure my gas tank and containers as many Rhodies do. My question is how > to > best attach the HDPE brackets. It seems that others have used stainless > screws into the single layer of fiberglass at each end as shown in the > following picture. Is that the case, or was some other method of > reinforcing the attachment holes used (e.g., epoxy). > > > > Thanks, > > Mike McKay > s/v Liber 2006/2018 > > > > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > From goldsmith.cf at gmail.com Wed Mar 31 16:56:53 2021 From: goldsmith.cf at gmail.com (Frank Goldsmith) Date: Wed, 31 Mar 2021 16:56:53 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Burgee Arrived In-Reply-To: <1617214870362-0.post@n5.nabble.com> References: <1617214870362-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: <8B1F752F-0AFB-410C-A1B7-C3B65DE106D5@gmail.com> Ditto from me. Thanks a bunch for arranging this. Frank > On Mar 31, 2021, at 2:21 PM, JeffSmith wrote: > > It came in the mail today and looks great. Thanks Joe! > > > > ----- > Jeff Smith > 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT > Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor > Atlantic Highlands, NJ > > -- > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ From tom.vanheule at intrinsicprograms.com Wed Mar 31 16:57:28 2021 From: tom.vanheule at intrinsicprograms.com (Tom Van Heule) Date: Wed, 31 Mar 2021 15:57:28 -0500 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Destin, FL 3hr charter Message-ID: We took a drive and got some sailing action. Captn. Pam from "smile n' wave" us recommended. She let us sail and her and her son, mason, did the rest. Great time, highly recommended. Nothing fancy, nothing sketchy. Felt good to be on the water. We still had icy lakes -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: IMG_20210331_113500.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 3098853 bytes Desc: not available URL: From bobfcohen at gmail.com Wed Mar 31 18:07:55 2021 From: bobfcohen at gmail.com (Robert Cohen) Date: Wed, 31 Mar 2021 18:07:55 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Burgee Arrived In-Reply-To: <8B1F752F-0AFB-410C-A1B7-C3B65DE106D5@gmail.com> References: <8B1F752F-0AFB-410C-A1B7-C3B65DE106D5@gmail.com> Message-ID: Me too. Thank you Joe. Bob Sent from my iPhone > On Mar 31, 2021, at 4:57 PM, Frank Goldsmith wrote: > > ?Ditto from me. Thanks a bunch for arranging this. > > Frank > >> On Mar 31, 2021, at 2:21 PM, JeffSmith wrote: >> >> It came in the mail today and looks great. Thanks Joe! >> >> >> >> ----- >> Jeff Smith >> 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT >> Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor >> Atlantic Highlands, NJ >> >> -- >> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > From chrisgeankoplis at gmail.com Wed Mar 31 18:12:31 2021 From: chrisgeankoplis at gmail.com (Chris Geankoplis) Date: Wed, 31 Mar 2021 18:12:31 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Under seat storage In-Reply-To: References: <1617218393088-0.post@n5.nabble.com> Message-ID: Hey Mike, That is one of my old photos on Enosis I which is on the hard in Greece. I installed the brackets using 4 pan head screws. There is a socket bracket aft and a ?U? bracket forward. The installation was done about 15 years ago using some starboard. We have cruised Enosis for thousands of miles in the PNW, Sea of Cortez and the Med with no issues. You could use bolts rather than screws on the aft socket brackets and back them with large washers. The bars are either heavy duty alum closet rods used in RV?s or thick wall square stock. From experience, It is important to use thick starboard and locate the brackets after placing your gas tank and selected storage containers. Cut the bars just a tad long. You can also drill and fast pin the bar to the forward bracket for added security. The system has worked well for us and should be fine for your application. Contact me if you have any questions. Chris Geankoplis Enosis On Wed, Mar 31, 2021 at 4:49 PM Rick Lange wrote: > Hi Mike, > > If they are going to extend the length of the cockpit, I question the > rigidity of using metal bars. > > Regards, > > Rick Lange > > > On Wed, Mar 31, 2021 at 3:19 PM Mike McKay wrote: > > > Hi, I'm going to install aluminum retaining bars under my cockpit seats > to > > secure my gas tank and containers as many Rhodies do. My question is how > > to > > best attach the HDPE brackets. It seems that others have used stainless > > screws into the single layer of fiberglass at each end as shown in the > > following picture. Is that the case, or was some other method of > > reinforcing the attachment holes used (e.g., epoxy). > > > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > Mike McKay > > s/v Liber 2006/2018 > > > > > > > > -- > > Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ > > > From chrisgeankoplis at gmail.com Wed Mar 31 18:16:03 2021 From: chrisgeankoplis at gmail.com (Chris Geankoplis) Date: Wed, 31 Mar 2021 18:16:03 -0400 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Destin, FL 3hr charter In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: That looks like fun. Any time spent on any boat is better than sitting around waiting for the ice to melt. Chris Geankoplis Enosis On Wed, Mar 31, 2021 at 5:03 PM Tom Van Heule < tom.vanheule at intrinsicprograms.com> wrote: > We took a drive and got some sailing action. > Captn. Pam from "smile n' wave" us recommended. > She let us sail and her and her son, mason, did the rest. > Great time, highly recommended. > Nothing fancy, nothing sketchy. > Felt good to be on the water. We still had icy lakes > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: IMG_20210331_113500.jpg > Type: image/jpeg > Size: 3098853 bytes > Desc: not available > URL: < > http://rhodes22.org/pipermail/rhodes22-list/attachments/20210331/9dfd564b/attachment.jpg > > > From roger_pihlaja at msn.com Wed Mar 31 19:23:52 2021 From: roger_pihlaja at msn.com (ROGER PIHLAJA) Date: Wed, 31 Mar 2021 23:23:52 +0000 Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Burgee Arrived In-Reply-To: <8B1F752F-0AFB-410C-A1B7-C3B65DE106D5@gmail.com> References: <1617214870362-0.post@n5.nabble.com>, <8B1F752F-0AFB-410C-A1B7-C3B65DE106D5@gmail.com> Message-ID: Hi Joe, My R-22 Burgees arrived today via the USPS snail mail. They look nice except that the printing on one side is the mirror image of the other. When the printing on one side is displayed correctly, the printing on the other side is displayed backwards. I contacted Cindy about this issue and she said they were made that way on purpose. Otherwise, there will be visible stitching out of place. I?ve seen lots of burgees and you can read them from both sides without a mirror. I feel like I just wasted my money. Roger Pihlaja S/V Dynamic Equilibrium Sent from my iPhone > On Mar 31, 2021, at 4:57 PM, Frank Goldsmith wrote: > > ?Ditto from me. Thanks a bunch for arranging this. > > Frank > >> On Mar 31, 2021, at 2:21 PM, JeffSmith wrote: >> >> It came in the mail today and looks great. Thanks Joe! >> >> >> >> ----- >> Jeff Smith >> 2009 R22 #101 RADIANT >> Atlantic Highlands Municpal Harbor >> Atlantic Highlands, NJ >> >> -- >> Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/ >