[Rhodes22-list] How to improve Rhodes 22 upwind performance?

Sun Mar 20 11:51:20 EDT 2022

Salute Stephen - 
I'm on an island in the Detroit River - in Gibraltar, Michigan. I really enjoyed my Rhodes 22, but then I met a lady who didn't deal well with the boat when heeling - so now we have a trawler and I sail a pair of Detroit Diesels. A bit of a bummer, but I'm still out on the water, and she's happy with it!
Dennis McNeely

-----Original Message-----
From: Rhodes22-list <rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org> On Behalf Of Stephen Staum
Sent: Sunday, March 20, 2022 11:15 AM
To: The Rhodes 22 Email List <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] How to improve Rhodes 22 upwind performance?

Dennis that was a great comment.  In addition to performance, I noticed years ago that my lazerette would fill with water when the boat sat stern low on the trailer in my yard (it is a slight hill causing the bow low condition).  It never filled on the mooring as the boat normally sits with the bow lower.
Where are you from Dennis?

*Thanks and Stay Well,*

*Stephen Staum*
*s/v Pinafore*

*Needham, MA*

On Sun, Mar 20, 2022 at 10:36 AM Dennis McNeely <mcneelyd at site-solutions.com>
wrote:

> Greetings all -
> One other thought... if you don't have enough weight forward, the bow 
> of the boat can't provide enough lateral resistance to counter the 
> force of the sails.
> Put differently, if too much weight is aft, the wind will push the 
> sail, mast, and boat forward - but it will also push it sideways. That 
> lateral push is countered by your rudder and centerboard, but it's 
> also countered by the submerged bow of the boat. If the bow is too far 
> out of the water or the stern is submerged too much, trying to balance 
> your rig is a non-starter.
> Stated differently, if the stern is weighted down and the bow is 
> riding high, you'll be continually pushed off the wind, because you 
> won't be able to get the center of effort (the place where the force 
> of the wind pushes your boat) over the center of resistance (the spot 
> on the keel where the water resists force from the wind).
> The tighter you sail to the wind, the worse the effect will become.
> Having said all the above, I'm back to lurking :) Dennis McNeely
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Rhodes22-list <rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org> On Behalf Of 
> ROGER PIHLAJA
> Sent: Sunday, March 20, 2022 8:47 AM
> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] How to improve Rhodes 22 upwind performance?
>
> Mike,
>
> Here’s an experiment to determine if you have too much mast rake.
> Assuming light to moderate wind so you can put up full sail, establish 
> a close hauled point of sail, and trim both sails as good as possible.  
> Take note of how much weather helm you have.  Assuming you have the 
> IMF mainsail, reef the mainsail a small amount, say 6 inches.  
> Reestablish a close hauled point of sail and trim the sails as good as 
> possible.  You should now have less weather helm or maybe neutral or 
> even lee helm.  Keep reducing mainsail area until you have eliminated all the weather helm.
>
> By shortening the forestay, the weather helm can be tuned out of the rig.
> I like the helm to be neutral to very slight lee helm in light air.  
> As the wind strength builds, the hull is going to heel over no matter 
> how much rail meat you pile onto the windward rail.  I won’t go into 
> the physics of why and how; but, the asymmetric wetted shape of the 
> heeled over hull just naturally generates weather helm.  You counter 
> this tendency towards weather helm by reducing mainsail area.  This 
> moves the rig’s center of effort forward and reduces weather helm.  
> You want to leave the foresail at full area as long as you can keep 
> the boat sailing on her lines and use the mainsail area to balance the helm.
>
> In light air, there is very little feel to the helm no matter how the 
> rig is tuned.  The easiest point of reference is to have the rig tuned 
> for neutral helm, especially for a novice helmsman.  So, even though 
> the helmsman isn’t getting any feedback thru the tiller, he/she knows 
> to simply center the tiller, and the boat will go straight.  As the 
> wind strength builds and sail area is not reduced, the hull will begin 
> to heel over, and weather helm will build.  The helmsman is now 
> getting plenty of feedback thru the tiller.  If the weather helm gets 
> to be tiresome; then, the mainsail area can always be reduced to take the pressure off the tiller.
> Even a few degrees of rudder angle off center develops an amazing 
> amount of drag.  This slows the boat down and reduces pointing 
> ability.  Remember, the boat is making leeway even when the tiller is 
> centered, and this leeway is enough for the shoal draft keel, 
> centerboard, and rudder blade to work together to develop the required lift for the boat to be able to point.
>
> Roger Pihlaja
> S/V Dynamic Equilbrium
>
> Sent from Mail<https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986> for 
> Windows
>
> From: ROGER PIHLAJA<mailto:roger_pihlaja at msn.com>
> Sent: Friday, March 18, 2022 7:32 PM
> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List<mailto:rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] How to improve Rhodes 22 upwind performance?
>
> Mike,
>
> A couple of things to check:
>
> 1.   Is your centerboard all the way down?
>
> 2.  Is your rudder blade all the way down?
>
> 3.  In 5-15 knots of wind, you should use the mainsheet and traveler 
> to center the boom.  Make certain the boom is not rising up and there 
> isn’t too much curl on the leech.  Make certain the mainsail foot out 
> haul is tight.  Without battens, there is only so much you can do with 
> mainsail shape; but, this will set you up to do the best that is possible.
>
> 4.  Use your backstay adjuster to get the sag out of the forestay.  It 
> takes quite a lot of tension on the backstays to remove the forestay sag.
> Don’t be afraid of cranking on the backstay adjuster.  A mast head rig 
> needs the forestay to have little sag in order to properly form an 
> efficient slot with the mainsail.
>
> 5.  Refer to my rig tuning procedure in the archives to adjust the 
> tension in the standing rigging.
>
> The Rhodes 22 sails best to weather if it is regarded like a big 
> sailing dingy, as upright as possible.  There should be zero to very 
> slight weather helm.  If you have too much weather helm; then reduce the mast rake angle.
> ie Make the mast rake more perpendicular to the deck.
>
> My guess is you have too much mast rake, which is giving you a lot of 
> weather helm, and killing your ability to point to weather.
>
> Hopefully, these suggestions help.
>
> Roger Pihlaja
> S/V Dynamic Equilibrium
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> > On Mar 18, 2022, at 1:49 PM, mm.bizlist1 at gmail.com wrote:
> >
> > Hi All,
> >
> > Now that I've been sailing my Rhodes for about a year, I'm starting 
> > to focus on getting the best performance out of her.  While I mostly 
> > sail for fun, I do race every couple of weeks and want to be more 
> > competitive.  In particular, I have found that she does not go to
> windward very well for me.
> >
> >
> > I have a 130 genoa and the IMF mainsail.  Until very recently, I 
> > have been routing the jib sheets outside of the outer shrouds and 
> > handrails. That limits how much I can trim the genoa. Consequently, 
> > I can only tack through about 100-120o.
> >
> > Recently, I tried running the jib sheets between the outer shrouds 
> > and the inner shrouds.  That definitely improved my pointing ability 
> > significantly at the expense of less than optimal headsail shape on 
> > some off wind points of sail.  However, this configuration lets me 
> > use my jib cars to adapt to wind strength and whether or not I am 
> > partially reefed.  I think this will retain the ability to use a 
> > whisker
> pole on downwind legs.
> >
> > I did briefly try both of the inboard jib sheet fairlead/cleat 
> > alternatives but using those would seem to require having a second 
> > set of jib sheets and probably going on the foredeck to switch 
> > between them after rounding a mark (I often race solo).  Also, those 
> > options eliminate the ability to control the sheeting angle to the 
> > clew with the
> jib cars.
> >
> > I'd greatly appreciate your thoughts and comments about what you 
> > have learned about how to optimize your boat's performance.
> >
> > Thanks,
> >
> >
> > Mike McKay
> > s/v Liber (2006/2018)
> > Allatoona Lake
> > Acworth, GA
> >
> >
>
>
>