[ham] [Rhodes22-list] FW: A good idea

[Steve Alm]

Brad,

In principle, I couldn't agree more.  In a perfect world there would be no
discrimination.  Earlier I said, you can't keep a good man down, but I think
I'll amend that and change it to, You can't keep a good white man down.
Society has indeed found many ways to keep women and minorities down.  My
sister is a (retired) captain for United and may very well have been one of
those hired in the eighties you refer to.  Had it not been for some hiring
guidelines, her job would have no doubt gone to a white man.  I don't think
she was under qualified, but she was just fresh out of flight school at UND
and had no previous experience.  We were all very happy for her but I'd bet
there were a few experienced pilots that weren't.  Hiring women and
minorities just for the sake of hiring women and minorities doesn't seem
like a very good strategy, but without something in place to address this
issue, there would be nothing but white men employed, and that doesn't seem
appropriate either.  I'm glad you eventually landed (no pun intended) your
dream job and I bet you were hired on your merits and not because you're
white.  

BTW, how was the sailing in Florida?

Slim

On 2/27/03 6:51 PM, "brad haslett" <flybrad@yahoo.com> wrote:

> Slim,
> 
> Somewhat like the baseball player on Saturday Night
> Live used to say, "aviation has been berry berry good
> to me".  During the early 1980's only a few major
> airlines were hiring.  Of the 100 or so very well
> qualified pilots at the small commuter I flew for,
> only a handful got interviews during that period, all
> minorities.  The rest of us all eventually found our
> "dream" jobs but it took a few more years.  Even then,
> we would find ourselves in a hiring pool of qualified
> candidates who had "jumped all the hoops" only to have
> our class dates delayed while another minority hire
> came in off the street ahead of us.  In many cases,
> the street hire's qualifications were so far below the
> rest of us it was hard to ignore. In this profession,
> seniority is everything and two or three years of
> waiting can mean the difference between working or
> furlough in todays airline environment. I don't need
> your sympathy or anyone elses, thank you, but I fail
> to see the logic in addressing previous discrimination
> by establishing a whole new class of discrimination.
> If it is wrong in one direction, its wrong in the
> other.
> 
> Brad
> --- Steve Alm <salm@mn.rr.com> wrote:
>> Brad,
>> 
>> Exactly how was it that you were "victimized" by
>> reverse discrimination?
>> Aren't you now a successful pilot and gainfully
>> employed?  2nd home in
>> China?  Sailing vacations in Florida?
>> 
>> It doesn't sound like you're a victim.  I sure don't
>> feel sorry for you.
>> 
>> Slim
>> 
>> On 2/24/03 7:08 AM, "brad haslett"
>> <flybrad@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> 
>>> Stan,
>>> 
>>> To everyone's relief (especially my family) I'm
>>> leaving today for Florida to go sailing for a few
>>> days.  It will be up to you to solve the worlds
>>> problems.  With that in mind, let me leave you
>> with a
>>> few thoughts.
>>> 
>>> As was previously said on this list (Rummy I
>> think)
>>> you would have been successful with or with out
>>> whatever help you recieved with your education.
>> You
>>> would have succeeded without an education.  Talent
>> and
>>> ability combined with ambition is nearly always
>>> rewarded.  It may have taken longer but you would
>>> still have achieved your goals.
>>> 
>>> As a victim of blatant reverse discrimination I
>> have
>>> some pretty strong feelings about affirmative
>> action.
>>> Frankly, I think its served whatever good purpose,
>> if
>>> any, it can and is overdue to eliminated.
>>> 
>>> The following are all quoted from a Wall Street
>>> Journal letter titled "Wonder Land" by Daniel
>>> Henninger last January (sorry, I clipped the
>> article
>>> but cut off the date, it was a Friday).
>>> "Three years ago in New York, the percentage of
>> black
>>> students who did NOT graduate from high school was
>>> 54%.  In California, 41%. In Tennessee, 54% didn't
>>> graduate.  And in Wisconsin, which is thought of
>> as a
>>> fairly normal place, the percentage of black kids
>> who
>>> didn't make it out of high school in the class of
>> 2000
>>> was a mind-boggling 59%....This data appears in
>>> Education Week's annual report, "Quality
>>> Counts"....What we know and have known for a very
>> long
>>> time is that nearly half of America's black
>> teenagers
>>> haven't a hope of attending even the least-known
>>> two-year community college anywhere.  What is the
>> Rev.
>>> Jesse L. Jackson doing about this scandal?  He is
>>> calling Geooge W. Bush "the most anti-civil rights
>>> president in 50 years."  Given those shameful
>>> graduation rates, one wonders what the "pro-civil
>>> rights presidents were doing the past 50
>>> years.......It is remarkable how often the
>> combatants
>>> in the debate over college affirmative-action
>> default
>>> to the notion that nothing proves one's commitment
>> to
>>> "diversity" more than one's willingness to adjust
>> the
>>> entry requirements to a Harvard, Yale or Michigan.
>>> For instance, New Jersey Rep. Robert Menendez
>> ripped
>>> into Mr. Bush last week over his legacy admission
>>> "into the Ivy League."  Yale?  The average black
>> child
>>> attending high school in Newark, Camden, Paterson
>> or
>>> Jersey City can barely hope of getting into, say,
>>> Rutgers......
>>> 
>>> The author's point, and mine, is that we have
>> bigger
>>> problems to deal with in education than worry
>> about a
>>> handful of super-achieving minorities who will
>> make it
>>> just fine with or without affirmative action.
>> Just
>>> like you Stan.  Discrimination is wrong.  Changing
>> it
>>> from one color to a different color doesn't make
>> it
>>> any less wrong.
>>> 
>>> Brad Haslett
>>> --- General Boats <wwrhodes@rhodes22.com> wrote:
>>>> Glad to see we are back to political bashing - I
>>>> agree with Brad, it
>>>> perks up the list.   I also agree with Brad that
>>>> Billy boy is smart.  IQ
>>>> is over 200.  Georgy boy's is under 100 .  I have
>>>> mixed feelings about
>>>> the affirmative action program since I would have
>>>> probably missed out if
>>>> this were in place in my day - but don't know why
>>>> George would be
>>>> against it since he got into Yale because of
>>>> Affirmative Action.
>>>> 
>>>> stan/gbi
>>>> 
>>>> brad haslett wrote:
>>>> 
>>>>> Steve,
>>>>> 
>>>>> The whole Lewensky thing was good for
>>>> entertainment
>>>>> value if nothing else.  If the press had done
>>>> their
>>>>> job in the late 80's and early 90's voters would
>>>> have
>>>>> known what a sleazeball Billy Boy was with his
>>>> pants
>>>>> up, much less down.  At least the congressional
>>>>> elections of 1994 kept his big spending social
>>>>> programs in check.  Billy Boy IS a smart guy.  I
>>>> would
>>>> 
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