[Rhodes22-list] Trailer Measurements

[Steve Alm]

Bill,

Here's my situation at this point:  When landing Fandango, I can't get it
far enough forward on the trailer.  Many attempts, various ramps,  various
depths,  etc. but always the same result.  At least it's consistent.  If
only the balance were right, it'd be nearly foolproof!  That part gives me
hope.

This spring I bought a pair of WM boat stands and a floor jack.  And I have
trailer jacks on the rear corners of the trailer, and together with the
tongue jack, I raise the trailer as high as it will go on its 3 jacks. This
raises the trailer wheels off the ground. Then I put the boat stands under
the stern quarters and can even raise the hull up some more by cranking the
screws on the boat stands.  Then I pull the tongue extension out of the way
and put the floor jack under the bow, jack it up as high as it will go.  At
this point, you can lower the trailer jacks and the boat is perched on the
floor jack at the bow and the two boat stands in the stern--a nice, sturdy
tripod. Even if one of those stands were to fail, the trailer bunks are only
inches below.  

Now I go to the trailer's bow winch clipped to the bow eye of the boat and,
with the boat on the hard, I winch the trailer backwards--farther under the
boat.  I have to lift the boat off the trailer in this way in order to
position the trailer under the boat at the correct balance point, i.e., to
get enough tongue weight.  Needless to say this is a royal PITA, albeit
doable.  

Roger's not the only one to modify a trailer.  Rik posted his changes too.
I saved their recommendations as well as Todd's dimensions,  and I'm just
gonna have to go for it.  But when it comes right down to it, I'm going to
have to guess at how far to move the axle back.  Is there a formula for
this?  I'm thinking about 6".

Slim


On 7/26/04 10:35 PM, "Bill Effros" <bill at effros.com> wrote:

> Slim,
> 
> If you can make a better trailer than the one Stan builds, Stan will give you
> his blessings.  You know that.  My comments were addressed only to the idea of
> copying what Stan built without either obtaining his permission, or paying him
> for doing so.  I know you, as a musician, are well acquainted with this
> concept.
> 
> With regard to trailers, you should probably convince Roger to build one for
> you to Roger's own specifications, or get Roger to send you a set of plans so
> you can duplicate his trailer which is a successful home-built of his own
> design.  (Personally I would avoid his glow-in-the-dark model, notwithstanding
> its possible nighttime safety advantages.)
> 
> I would like to see someone build a Rhodes trailer with on-board Jack Stands
> so the boat could easily be lifted off the bunks for painting and below
> waterline, off season chores.  If someone develops and tests that concept, I'd
> be a buyer, and I'd happily pay my share for all the dropped wrecked boats
> destroyed while trying to make this idea work.
> 
> Bill
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Steve Alm 
> To: Rhodes 
> Sent: Monday, July 26, 2004 10:19 PM
> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Trailer Measurements
> 
> 
> Bill,
> 
> So what's a guy to do?  Are you saying that I have no other options than to
> trailer my boat all the way to Edenton (there's the first problem--I'll
> probably kill myself or someone else in the process)  so that Stan can
> adjust my trailer to fit my boat--all boats being a little different?  If
> Stan himself doesn't do the work, I'm opening myself up to hellish
> consequences?  
> 
> Honestly, Bill, I'm not trying to be an argumentative PITA here--but I need
> to get my trailer fixed and I'm not going to pull it to GBI.  As much as I'd
> like to, that's just not an option.  I need to be able to put my faith in a
> reputable shop in MN with realistic specs and get this job done.  It can't
> be that hard--can it?
> 
> I bought the Rhodes because it's supposed to be a trailerable rig. At this
> point, mine is simply not, and I don't mind saying I'm more than a little
> disappointed.  I love sailing the R22 but if I can't solve this problem I
> don't want it.  It's not safe!
> 
> Slim
> 
> 
> On 7/26/04 8:30 PM, "Bill Effros" <bill at effros.com> wrote:
> 
>> Slim,
>> 
>> If you are reading these in order you saw Stan gave his blessing to those
>> repairing and building their trailers.  As always, he is very generous in
>> these matters.  Also I have dozens of postings wherein Stan has suggested
>> methods for moving the center of gravity to improve the trailer for
>> individual
>> boats.
>> 
>> My original reply to Herb was primarily for newer members of the list who may
>> not have thought through this matter, and its ramifications.  Herb responded
>> generously multiple times.  That was all I was asking.  Thank you, Herb.
>> 
>> With regard to using an engineer as a lawyer, I would strongly urge against
>> it.  If you honestly believe you can take a full set of plans for a Ford,
>> that
>> you received from a third party, and take them to Toyota, and have Toyota
>> build you just one Ford for your personal use and eventual sale to an
>> unwitting fourth party...you could wind up in jail before you get back to
>> Brazil.  Patent law would be the least of your problems--there are dozens of
>> laws on the books prohibiting this activity.
>> 
>> Bill Effros
>> 
>> 
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: Steve Alm 
>> To: Rhodes 
>> Sent: Monday, July 26, 2004 8:38 PM
>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Trailer Measurements
>> 
>> 
>> Bill,
>> 
>> I hope you don't feel badly of me for asking, but speaking as one of those
>> who has had a great deal of trouble with my trailer, just exactly how
>> intellectual is this property?  After all, mine is a lemon.
>> 
>> Having not purchased my boat and trailer from GBI, I have no certainty
>> whatsoever if Stan put his stamp of approval on my rig before it left the
>> shop so I know better than to point fingers--but the fact remains that I
>> have to rebuild my trailer.  Last year, when I posted my complaints, even
>> Stan said I need to have my axle moved.  This is no small modification.
>> 
>> Now, I'd like nothing more than to bring the boat and trailer to Stan and
>> ask him to fix it for me, but I live in MN.  There must be a better option.
>> If I had the correct specs, I'd take the rig to a qualified shop here at
>> home and have them do the work.  I'm not qualified to do this kind of work
>> myself so I need some help, i.e., specs to give to the shop that does the
>> work.
>> 
>> Thank you, Roger, for reminding us of the legalities of this.  If I have
>> this work done here in MN and then something goes dreadfully wrong, I won't
>> be liable--the shop that does the work will be the target of any litigation.
>> I'm certainly not going into production and sales of R22 trailers--I just
>> want mine to work.
>> 
>> Slim
>> 
>> On 7/26/04 11:31 AM, "Bill Effros" <bill at effros.com> wrote:
>> 
>>> Herb,
>>> 
>>> I'm an author who earns a living off my intellectual property.  I think it's
>>> wrong for people to buy what I've written, make a copy, and send the copy to
>>> their friends without paying me for my work.
>>> 
>>> Stan spent a lot of time and money developing these trailers.  Anyone can
>>> look
>>> at them, say "that's a good idea" and copy the concept, and modify their own
>>> trailer, or have someone else build one--to their own specifications.
>>> 
>>> But to ask people on the list to measure the trailers they have bought from
>>> Stan, and to send you the measurements, so you can build your own trailer,
>>> or
>>> teach someone else how to build these trailers, without paying Stan for his
>>> intellectual property, is wrong, in my view.
>>> 
>>> I'm sure that is not what you were thinking when you asked the question, and
>>> I
>>> do not think badly of you for asking it.  This has come up many times
>>> before,
>>> and I only sometimes respond in this way.
>>> 
>>> But I do think it's wrong, and I haven't said anything about it for a while.
>>> 
>>> By the way,  there have been people who extended your idea of "send me the
>>> trailer measurements," to "why not copy and sell the whole boat"--let me
>>> borrow your boat, I'll make molds from it, we'll make our own exact copies
>>> of
>>> the boat, we'll sell them and split the profit--if we don't have to pay
>>> anything for R&D we can easily sell them for less than Stan can sell them
>>> for.
>>> 
>>> Essentially that's what you're trying to do in the trailer department, in my
>>> view.
>>> 
>>> Bill Effros
>>> 
>>> 
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: Herb Parsons
>>> To: The Rhodes 22 mail list
>>> Cc: bill at parsonsys.net
>>> Sent: Monday, July 26, 2004 10:44 AM
>>> Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Trailer Measurements
>>> 
>>> 
>>> I saw on here that someone had posted information about the trailer
>>> measurements for a Rhodes 22. I assume this was bunkboard settings and such.
>>> I
>>> thought I had saved the original email, but could not find it. If someone
>>> has
>>> that information, I would be grateful if you could pass it on to me. The
>>> Rhodes 22 we are trying to set up a trailer for is a 1983 model. Thanks in
>>> advance.
>>> __________________________________________________
>>> Use Rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org, Help? www.rhodes22.org/list
>>> __________________________________________________
>>> Use Rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org, Help? www.rhodes22.org/list
>> 
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> 
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