[Rhodes22-list] Politics: Misleading

Tue Sep 21 11:27:07 EDT 2004

Brad,

I also favored the ouster of Saddam Hussein, however, that does not give us
the right to enter a sovereign nation with guns blazing and kill countless
innocent people.  We should have sent in small group of elite special forces
to take out Saddam and his cronies.  Stephen Staum
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "brad haslett" <flybrad at yahoo.com>
To: "The Rhodes 22 mail list" <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
Sent: Tuesday, September 21, 2004 9:35 AM
Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Politics: Misleading


> Wally,
>
> I'm responding to your post out of convenience and not
> necessairly rebutting your points.  First, here's some
> quotes from John Kerry.
>
> "Saddam Hussein has already used these weapons and has
> made it clear that he has the intent to continue to
> try, by virtue of his duplicity and secrecy, to
> continue to do so.  That is a threat to the stability
> of the Middle East.  It is a threat with respect to
> the potential of terrorist activities on a global
> basis.  It is a threat even to regions near but not
> exactly in the Middle East." -  1998 Kerry press
> conference
>
> "I believe that everybody who has been involved with
> the issue of Iraq understands a day of reckoning has
> been a long time coming for Saddam Hussein."  1998
> -Kerry commenting on Clintons four-day bombing against
> Saddam Hussein
>
> "The President did not withdraw the UNSCOM inspectors.
>  And the President did not, obviously, cut a deal with
> Saddam Hussein to do this at this moment.  Saddam
> Hussein has not complied.  Saddam Hussein is pursuing
> a program to build weapons of mass destruction"  -
> 1998 Kerry press conference defending Clinton
>
> Regardless of what you believe about John Kerry voting
> for the war before he voted against it, he is clearly
> on record supporting the ouster of Saddam Hussein
> while his party held the White House.  For him to
> critisize it now is a bit disengenious at the least.
>
> For an excellent background on Afghanistan, read
> "Charlie Wilson's War" by George Crile.  The Soviets
> spent ten years there with a massive force and
> couldn't prevail.  We went in after 9/11 with a light
> and redily adaptable force, using local tribes to
> eliminate Al Quida training bases and remove the
> Taliban from power.  Given the terrain and difficulty
> of the Afghan/Pakistan border, it is not suprising
> that Bin Laden escaped.  It is unfortunate.  More
> troops might have prevented it but probably not.
> We'll get him eventually.
>
> Despite what all the talking head Generals say during
> their "armchair quarterbacking" on TV, a larger force
> in Iraq would not have made the task any easier.
> General Franks specifically delayed the arrival of the
> 4th ID because the docks at Kuwaitt were already
> backed up and the logistical supply line was stretched
> thin.  His plan to topple Saddam was in hindsight,
> brilliant! Read "American Soldier" by Tommy Franks.
>
> What was not so brilliant was the establishment of
> security after the Saddam government fell.  For a
> critical assessment of the current situation, read
> "What Went Wrong in Iraq" by Larry Diamond in the
> September/October 2004 Foreign Affairs magazine.  Part
> of our problem is that we have been hypersensitive to
> religious figures and shrines.  When the Iraqi's get
> their forces up to speed, that may change.  The place
> is a mess but not hopeless.
>
> I find it curious that so many who oppose the war in
> Iraq had very little to say about Clinton's record
> number of deployments while he was in office.  I AM a
> partisan, that is obvious, but that doesn't mean I
> un-conditionally support everything President Bush
> does.  However, regarding the war in Iraq, I have to
> agree with what the Democrats were saying in 1998.
> Saddam needed to go.
>
> Brad Haslett
> "CoraShen"
>
>
>
> --- Wally Buck <tnrhodey at hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Rik,
> >
> > You make some god points. I can't stand Bush but I
> > have a hard time getting
> > behind Kerry. Bush has a doulbe digit lead in TN.  I
> > have voted third party
> > many times in the past and will likely do so this
> > year
> >
> > Regarding your comment about Bush having the support
> > of Congress and the
> > people before attacking Iraq. All memebers of
> > Congress do not have access to
> > the same security infomration as the president.
> > This is a good thing, most
> > of these elected clowns couldn't be trusted with a
> > real secret. I think it
> > is fairly obvious that the President was provided a
> > bunch of infomration
> > that really wasn't true. They pitched their case to
> > Congress as well as the
> > UN.
> >
> > Remember the nifty PowerPoint showing exact
> > locations of terror training
> > camps. bomb plants and so on. We supposedly have
> > inside knowledge of what is
> > going on over there yet the inspectors can't find a
> > thing. I for one was
> > against attacking when we did even if Iraq did have
> > WMD. We could have
> > easily waited a little longer and seen how things
> > played out. We rushed into
> > this thing because of 911. In my minds our leaders
> > took advantage of the
> > mood of the country. I don't think we would have
> > attacked iraq when we did
> > without 911. When one studies the facts available
> > there is no link to Iraq
> > and 911.
> >
> > We played our hand too early, now we are stuck with
> > it. Now we are pleading
> > for UN support. It looks like everyone agrees that
> > we should send more
> > troops to help free Iraq. Bin Laden is still loose
> > and we are wasting
> > billions in Iraq.
> >
> > Wally
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > >From: Rik Sandberg <sanderico at earthlink.net>
> > >Reply-To: The Rhodes 22 mail list
> > <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
> > >To: The Rhodes 22 mail list
> > <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
> > >Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Politics: Misleading
> > >Date: Mon, 20 Sep 2004 16:35:28 -0500
> > >
> > >As long as we're on the subject of mis-leading, I
> > just gotta ask:
> > >
> > >How is it that someone can collect three Purple
> > Hearts in a forty day stint
> > >in Vietnam and spend no time in a hospital. I'll
> > bet his manicurist was
> > >really pissed.
> > >
> > >Myself, I'd be ashamed to accept a Purple Heart for
> > the "owies" Mr. Kerry
> > >must have incurred, considering the injuries of
> > some of the people over
> > >there that really deserved the medal. But then
> > again I wouldn't be caught
> > >dead hanging around with Hanoi Jane either. Just
> > for that fact alone, I
> > >wouldn't vote for John Kerry if his opposition was
> > Pat Paulson
> > >
> > >And wasn't Senator Kerry one of the vast majority
> > of the legislature that
> > >voted to go  to Iraq?? Seems to me, the President
> > had the backing of the
> > >majority of the American Public AND the blessing of
> > the legislature to
> > >boot, going into this thing. Is someone going to
> > try to tell me that
> > >Senators and Representatives are not privy to the
> > same intelligence
> > >information that the President is? .... Yeah right.
> > >
> > >I'd sure like to see the name of ONE politician
> > that hasn't done something
> > >that could be considered mis-leading. Mr Kerry,
> > IMHO is pretty close to the
> > >top of the list in this area.
> > >
> > >So Brad and Steve.....I'm with you :-)
> > >
> > >Rik
> > >
> > >
> > >At 01:33 PM 9/20/2004, you wrote:
> > >>Steve,
> > >>
> > >>I know it will amaze you to learn that just
> > because you say "End of story"
> > >>that doesn't make it the end of the story.
> > >>
> > >>On July 13, 2003 Secretary of Defense Donald
> > Rumsfeld, when asked whether
> > >>George W. Bush had misled the nation with regard
> > to the threat of Weapons
> > >>of Mass Destruction said "End of story."  But it
> > really wasn't, was it?
> > >>
> > >>Every weapons inspector who has tried to find the
> > weapons W. warned of in
> > >>his State of the Union Speech, and that Secretary
> > of State Colin Powell
> > >>warned of in his United Nations speech, has
> > reported back that there were
> > >>no Weapons of Mass Destruction.
> > >>
> > >>I call that misleading, and I believe that's what
> > this election is about.
> > >>
> > >>Even if he wins, I don't think that will be the
> > end of this story.
> > >>
> > >>Bill
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>----- Original Message -----
> > >>From: Steve
> > >>To: The Rhodes 22 mail list
> > >>Sent: Monday, September 20, 2004 1:07 PM
> > >>Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Politics: Misleading
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>Bill
> > >>Bush received a Honorable Discharge.  End of
> > story.
> > >>Last poll I heard was that only 1 in 5 even care
> > about
> > >>his guard service and then even its not an issue
> > for
> > >>voting on for President.
> > >>
> > >>As for a Kerry goes, we can debate Bush all day
> > long,
> > >>but there is nothing to debate about Kerry; he has
> > no
> > >>stance on anything.  His voting record clearing
> > shows
> > >>that he cannot be trusted to protect this country.
> > >>Again, End of Story.
> > >>Steve
> > >>
> > >>PS - Good attachment Brad.
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>--- brad haslett <flybrad at yahoo.com> wrote:
> > >>
> > >> > Bill,
> > >> >
> > >> > I respectfully disagree with most if not all of
> > your
> > >> > assessments, however, time does not permit me
> > to
> > >> > formulate a reasoned response this morning.  I
> > do
> > >> > have
> > >> > one, trust me.
> > >> >
> > >> > In the meantime, enjoy the attachment.
> > >> >
> > >> > Brad Haslett
> > >> > "CoraShen"
> > >> >
> > >> > --- Bill Effros <bill at effros.com> wrote:
> > >> >
> > >> > > Brad,
> > >> > >
> > >> > > The point of the National Guard issue is not
> > >> > > Vietnam, any more than the Clinton
> > Impeachment was
> > >> > > about sex.  Both hinge on the question of
> > >> > > Presidential misleading.  George W. Bush ran
> > for
> > >> > > President on this issue, saying repeatedly
> > that he
> > >> > > would not mislead the American people.  The
> > extent
> > >> > > to which he has misled the American people
> > about
> > >> > his
> > >> > > National Guard record is emblematic of the
> > way
> === message truncated ===
>
>
>
>
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