[Rhodes22-list] Political:Off to Iraq re: Dave

Herb Parsons hparsons at parsonsys.com
Thu Oct 26 12:22:18 EDT 2006


"I think anyone who joins the armed forces in support of our disastrous foreign policy doesn't understand the current geopolitical situation very well."

EXACTLY the pompous, I'm right, anyone who disagrees with me is wrong attitude I was talking about.

Herb Parsons

S/V O'Jure
1976 O'Day 25
Lake Grapevine, N TX

S/V Reve de Papa
1971 Coronado 35
Lake Pontchartrain, Louisiana Coast 

>>> bill at effros.com 10/26/2006 8:52:31 am >>>
No, Brad,

Philip did not miss the point.  He and I disagree about many things, but 
he is intellectually honest, and reading his replies often increases the 
amount of accurate information available to people without first-hand 
knowledge of the current situation.

As I said previously, and I will say again: I think people should be 
well paid for their service in the armed forces.  I think it is wrong to 
hire outside contractors for more money than we pay people in uniform.  
I think anyone who joins the armed forces in support of our disastrous 
foreign policy doesn't understand the current geopolitical situation 
very well.  I get angry when I hear people urge others to sacrifice 
their sons and daughters for policies they would not sacrifice their own 
lives, or the lives of their own sons and daughters.

I have been very consistent in my views on this matter going all the way 
back to the Korean War.  Before Philip left for Iraq I stated those 
views on this list.  Philip made his decision, and that's his business.  
I certainly did not wish him ill, (as some have suggested) and felt 
relieved when he rejoined the list.  I look forward to reading his 
replies in the hope that they will add to the light and not just to the 
heat.

Bill Effros

Brad Haslett wrote:
> Phillip,
>
> You are missing the point.  Read between the lines. The implication is
> that our soldiers only fight for the money or they're too stupid to find
> employment in the private sector.  Don't even waste your time 
> defending the
> issue.  It's all a hangover from the Vietnam era but they'll never 
> admit it
> until their ass is on the line.
>
> Remember, "Good people sleep peaceably in their beds at night only 
> because
> rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf."
>
> Brad
>
> On 10/26/06, 3drecon at comcast.net <3drecon at comcast.net> wrote:
>>
>> Dave,
>>    Look, I've been doing this, active duty, USMC and Army, Army Reserves
>> and CT Army National Guard (I have an anniversary comming up) and I know
>> what is usual and not.  I also know what these guys get paid,
>> generally.  SPEC OPS Navy may have trouble recruiting officers.  They 
>> just
>> decided to create a "fighting" land battalion.  The Army may pay 
>> bonuses to
>> enlisted folks, but only for hard to recruit positions.  They will pay
>> reenlistment bonuses because a trained experienced Specialist 4 or 
>> Corporal
>> is more valuable to them than a raw recruit, though they too are 
>> necessary.
>>     The soldiers in the combat zone receive a tax break, recently 
>> updated
>> to keep up with the increased pay (it used to be full for enlisted 
>> and $500
>> for officers.  It has been increased to $7000 per month or so).  The 
>> break
>> seems to deliberately cover lower grades in full; those who would be 
>> more
>> likely to be in the "heat of battle" as opposed to the senior guys who
>> direct the battle.
>>     The extra pay includes combat pay, hazardous duty pay, overseas pay,
>> family separation pay, jump pay (if you are on jump status), flight pay,
>> submarine pay etc.  This is not all inclusive.  Some of these special 
>> pays
>> have only been recently increased.  I have known a few soldiers who 
>> would go
>> to the AOR just to collect the extra pay, but mostly it is a perk for 
>> those
>> in their regular rotation.  Many volunteer to go sooner than later to 
>> "get
>> it over with" and collect the extra pay to boot.  I've known a couple of
>> guys who went early so they could get a better assignment earlier and
>> wouldn't have to go again for two years or so.  It depends upon the
>> person.  None of these guys are trying to get rich in the service.  They
>> have so diminished the benefits and retirement that in a discussion with
>> several officers we observed that at one time, you could survey a 
>> group of
>> soldiers in a room and 60% to 70% would indicate they are in for a
>> career.  Now (this conversation was two y
>> ears a
>> go but holds up to-day) you would be lucky if 30% held the same
>> position.  It has more to do with the economy, the erosion of 
>> benefits and
>> health care that they don't see it as worth it.  I think Bill hit it
>> partially right too that sergeants will get out and triple their pay 
>> as a
>> contractor doing what they did on active duty.  That is part of the 
>> economy
>> element.
>>
>> Philip
>>
>> -------------- Original message --------------
>> From: DCLewis1 at aol.com 
>>
>> >
>> > Philip,
>> >
>> > $150/mo doesn't seem like a lot of $ to you or I, but to a young
>> Corporal
>> > it's a lot of beer.
>> >
>> > I personally know an Army wife who is quite happy to have her husband
>> posted
>> > to Afghanistan because of the additional $. Seems crazy to me (will 
>> this
>> > marriage last?), but it's true.
>> >
>> > Dave
>> > __________________________________________________
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