[Rhodes22-list] Battteries

TN Rhodey tnrhodey at hotmail.com
Sun Apr 15 11:33:42 EDT 2007 

Brad, I am not sure what is going on here...list seems to be stripping 
attachments. - wally


>From: "TN Rhodey" <tnrhodey at hotmail.com>
>Reply-To: The Rhodes 22 mail list <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
>To: rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org
>Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Battteries
>Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2007 11:29:27 -0400
>
>Well ...hopefully attachments get through. This is a second home. He also
>has a blueberry farm for second income. Located near Clinch Mountain about
>40 minutes from Knoxville.
>
>! - pic of cabin, note solar panel lower left
>
>2 -pic of inside showing wood burning stove
>
>3 -pic of inside showing loft and kitchen. He has an on demand propane hot
>water system heating collected rainwater.
>
>4 pic of me standing above wood burning hot tub...you can see chimney to my
>left. I wish I had a better shot of tub set up. There is a wooden grate 
>that
>seperates fire box from soaking side of tub. It is pretty neat.
>
>Wally
>
> >From: "Brad Haslett" <flybrad at gmail.com>
> >Reply-To: The Rhodes 22 mail list <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
> >To: "The Rhodes 22 mail list" <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
> >Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Battteries
> >Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2007 08:33:45 -0600
> >
> >Wally,
> >
> >I found the book in my library (thought it was in Gulfport).  "Living on 
>12
> >Volts with Ample Power" by David Smith and Ruth Ishihara.  We just bought 
>a
> >1.7 acre commercial property for a permanent home for our business and 
>had
> >to jump through all kinds of hoops to get power.  Eventually we told 
>zoning
> >and the power company we were in the nursery business and have actually
> >decided to follow up on our "joke" by actually doing it!  For a while it
> >looked like we might have to live off grid ourselves.  Get a Northern 
>Tool
> >catalog or go to their site, NorthernTool.com to look at solar panels, 
>wind
> >generators, etc.  You can beat their prices on the web but it's a good 
>one
> >stop shopping point to start. We too have a need for a cistern system.  
>You
> >have to go about 400 feet deep for good water and city water won't be
> >available for a few more years.  When it does come we hope to be in on
> >installing some of the pipe (our speciality).  In the meantime I
> >researching
> >cistern systems to collect water off the two shop buildings (once the
> >hurricane damaged roofs are replaced).
> >
> >The photo didn't come through.  I'm anxious to see your friends place.  
>It
> >sounds nice.
> >
> >Brad
> >
> >On 4/15/07, TN Rhodey <tnrhodey at hotmail.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > Brad,
> > >
> > > If I ever leave for extended cruising I will need to do some reading 
>and
> > > will look into the book you mention. I have 2 close friends (both 
>sail)
> > > who
> > > have cabins/homes that are 100% solar and genrator powered. One buddy
> >has
> > > been doing it for over 20 years. He has a small cabin in the foothills
> >he
> > > uses as second home and commercial blueberry farm. Photo attached. He
> >has
> > > sisterns for rainwater collection and propane for heat. He even has a
> >wood
> > > fired hot tub.
> > >
> > > I also have another firiend who is married and has 2 kids. They are
> > > totally
> > > off the grid. The primary residence is 100% 12 volt. So I have some 
>good
> > > sources. Both swear by Trojan batteries. Room is not an issue so they
> >use
> > > 12
> > > volt. I don't know all of the details but it works well for them.
> > >
> > > Wally
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > >From: "Brad Haslett" <flybrad at gmail.com>
> > > >Reply-To: The Rhodes 22 mail list <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
> > > >To: "The Rhodes 22 mail list" <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
> > > >Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Battteries
> > > >Date: Sun, 15 Apr 2007 07:57:58 -0600
> > > >
> > > >Wally,
> > > >
> > > >For a good read on the subject pick up a copy of "Living on 12 Volts"
> >by,
> > > >um, I forget.  When we landed on the beach after Katrina we lived off
> >of
> > > a
> > > >generator and batteries for three months.  After moving inland we 
>lived
> > > off
> > > >of batteries for another three months until electricity made it to 
>our
> > > >rented spot.  We bought two huge 12 volt marine batteries that ran an
> > > >inverter for our computer and answering machine.  Eventually we 
>figured
> > > out
> > > >how to live on about two hours of generator time per day.  There are
> >two
> > > >schools of thought.  One is two hook up multible batteries in 
>paralell
> >so
> > > >you have more use time before you get to the crucial 50% discharge
> >stage.
> > > >The other school says to alternate between batteries.  For my boat,
> > > >alternating makes more sense so one is always in reserve for engine
> > > >starting.
> > > >
> > > >Brad
> > > >
> > > >On 4/15/07, TN Rhodey <tnrhodey at hotmail.com> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > Bill,
> > > > >
> > > > > We are not reading the same sources...you mention you have done 
>your
> > > own
> > > > > testing. Did you test golf cart batteries? If not I will stick 
>with
> > > >advice
> > > > > of those that have.
> > > > >
> > > > > Wally
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > >From: Bill Effros <bill at effros.com>
> > > > > >Reply-To: The Rhodes 22 mail list <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
> > > > > >To: The Rhodes 22 mail list <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
> > > > > >Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Battteries
> > > > > >Date: Sat, 14 Apr 2007 17:52:37 -0300
> > > > > >
> > > > > >Wally,
> > > > > >
> > > > > >You're just picking fights without reading.
> > > > > >
> > > > > >Golf cart batteries make sense for golf carts.  They are a
> >different
> > > > > >size and voltage than batteries used for other purposes.   
>Banding
> > > them
> > > > > >together and putting them into boats is ridiculous.
> > > > > >
> > > > > >Bill Effros
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >TN Rhodey wrote:
> > > > > > > Bill, So you know better than the entire Golf industry? Maybe
> > > green
> > > > > fees
> > > > > > > could be lowered if they knew what you knew.....I got to 
>believe
> > > the
> > > > > >golf
> > > > > > > course industry has not been duped. I suspect they pay the 
>extra
> > > >bucks
> > > > > > > because there is a difference. In any case... I said in my
> >orignal
> > > > > post
> > > > > >for
> > > > > > > my use they are not worth the cost. Wally
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >> From: Bill Effros <bill at effros.com>
> > > > > > >> Reply-To: The Rhodes 22 mail list 
><rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
> > > > > > >> To: The Rhodes 22 mail list <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
> > > > > > >> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Battteries
> > > > > > >> Date: Sat, 14 Apr 2007 13:30:05 -0300
> > > > > > >>
> > > > > > >> Wally,
> > > > > > >>
> > > > > > >> They do make 12 volt Golf Cart Batteries.
> > > > > > >>
> > > > > > >> Golf Cart Batteries are designed similarly to "Deep Cycle
> >Marine
> > > > > > >> Batteries".
> > > > > > >>
> > > > > > >> Nobody uses the batteries on sailboats the same way golf 
>carts
> > > use
> > > > > >their
> > > > > > >> batteries--nor do we recharge them the same way for fear of
> > > blowing
> > > > > out
> > > > > > >> the electrical circuits on our boats at the same time.
> > > > > > >>
> > > > > > >> Trojan, 6 volt golf cart, and other high end batteries are 
>not
> > > >worth
> > > > > >the
> > > > > > >> extra cost to anybody with a Rhodes-22.
> > > > > > >>
> > > > > > >> I read the same stuff you read.  It doesn't cost that much to
> > > test
> > > > > out
> > > > > > >> the theories, and I did so for years.  I have been swapping 
>out
> > > > > > >> batteries of all different types and costs, and I have the
> > > >electrical
> > > > > > >> monitoring equipment on board to compare one battery set with
> > > > > another.
> > > > > > >>
> > > > > > >> The best batteries I have ever had in the boat are the 
>Kirkland
> > > > > > >> batteries that Stan originally installed.  They were better
> > > > > > >> electrically, and obviously they cost less than the West
> >Marine,
> > > >AGM,
> > > > > >or
> > > > > > >> any other brand or type I tried.
> > > > > > >>
> > > > > > >> 1 12 volt is more than enough.
> > > > > > >>
> > > > > > >> 2 is complete redundancy.
> > > > > > >>
> > > > > > >> I have 2 -- at $50 each--so for $100 I have 0 electrical
> >anxiety
> > > >for
> > > > > 6
> > > > > > >> years at a time.  Cheap at the price.
> > > > > > >>
> > > > > > >> I never have to recharge my batteries using shore power.  I
> >burn
> > > >less
> > > > > > >> than 10 gallons of gas a year.  My batteries stay on board,
> > > summer
> > > > > and
> > > > > > >> winter, hooked up and ready to go.
> > > > > > >>
> > > > > > >> My batteries are hooked up in parallel with no switch.  If 
>one
> > > >starts
> > > > > >to
> > > > > > >> fail, the other brings it back up.  A dead short on one will
> >not
> > > > > short
> > > > > > >> out the other.  (yes, I tried)
> > > > > > >>
> > > > > > >> Most of these world cruisers have more dollars than sense.
> >They
> > > > > don't
> > > > > > >> know what they're talking about 9/10s of the time.
> > > > > > >>
> > > > > > >> Golf cart batteries on boats are just plain silly.  The
> > > monstrously
> > > > > > >> expensive boat batteries are not inherently more reliable 
>than
> > > > > > >> "ordinary" batteries.
> > > > > > >>
> > > > > > >> When R-22 newbies ask about batteries, the best advise to 
>give
> > > them
> > > > > is
> > > > > > >> to take what Stan provides.  2 is more than you'll ever need.
> > > > > > >>
> > > > > > >> Bill Effros
> > > > > > >>
> > > > > > >>
> > > > > > >>
> > > > > > >> TN Rhodey wrote:
> > > > > > >>
> > > > > > >>> Bill,
> > > > > > >>>
> > > > > > >>> Your post has several errors. I don't know enough about
> >battery
> > > > > design
> > > > > > >>>
> > > > > > >> to
> > > > > > >>
> > > > > > >>> explain in detail. Golf Carts usage runs down the battery
> >almost
> > > > > every
> > > > > > >>>
> > > > > > >> day.
> > > > > > >>
> > > > > > >>> They are designed to run down to low levels and then quickly
> > > > > >recharged.
> > > > > > >>>
> > > > > > >> I am
> > > > > > >>
> > > > > > >>> not saying they are lighter or cheaper. I am saying they can
> >be
> > > >run
> > > > > >down
> > > > > > >>>
> > > > > > >> and
> > > > > > >>
> > > > > > >>> recharged (more times) and still live a long life. As you
> >point
> > > >out
> > > > > >they
> > > > > > >>>
> > > > > > >> are
> > > > > > >>
> > > > > > >>> expensive. There is a reason Golf Courses buy these 
>expensive
> > > > > >batteries
> > > > > > >>>
> > > > > > >> and
> > > > > > >>
> > > > > > >>> it is not just size. Most 12-volt batteries are not built to
> >the
> > > > > same
> > > > > > >>> specifications as 6-volt Golf Cart batteries. There are 
>other
> > > >types
> > > > > of
> > > > > >6
> > > > > > >>> volts batteries (motorcycle, old VW) that are dirt-cheap.
> >There
> > > is
> > > >a
> > > > > > >>>
> > > > > > >> reason.
> > > > > > >>
> > > > > > >>> The durability is why world cruisers like them. They may not
> >be
> > > >able
> > > > > >to
> > > > > > >>>
> > > > > > >> run
> > > > > > >>
> > > > > > >>> to Walmart when the battery dies. You ask why don't they 
>make
> > > > > 12-volt
> > > > > > >>>
> > > > > > >> Golf
> > > > > > >>
> > > > > > >>> Cart batteries? If they used the same technology they would 
>be
> > > too
> > > > > big
> > > > > > >>>
> > > > > > >> and
> > > > > > >>
> > > > > > >>> heavy for Golf Cart. Many cruisers will tell you that Trojan
> > > > > Batteries
> > > > > > >>>
> > > > > > >> (6
> > > > > > >>
> > > > > > >>> or12 volt) are the absolute best. They have a price tag 
>quite
> >a
> > > >bit
> > > > > > >>> different then Walmart. They are hundreds per and they are 
>not
> > > >your
> > > > > > >>>
> > > > > > >> average
> > > > > > >>
> > > > > > >>> battery. My buddy has a solar powered cabin and he swears by
> > > them.
> > > > > > >>>
> > > > > > >>> For my use the Walmart Marine batteries made sense. If I 
>were
> > > > > cruising
> > > > > > >>> around the world I would have something different.
> > > > > > >>>
> > > > > > >>> Wally
> > > > > > >>>
> > > > > > >>>
> > > > > > >>>
> > > > > > >>>
> > > > > > >>>> From: Bill Effros <bill at effros.com>
> > > > > > >>>> Reply-To: The Rhodes 22 mail list
> ><rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
> > > > > > >>>> To: The Rhodes 22 mail list <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
> > > > > > >>>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Battteries
> > > > > > >>>> Date: Fri, 13 Apr 2007 15:32:01 -0300
> > > > > > >>>>
> > > > > > >>>> Wally,
> > > > > > >>>>
> > > > > > >>>> The benefits of 6 volt golf cart batteries don't apply to
> > > >sailboats
> > > > > > >>>>
> > > > > > >> either.
> > > > > > >>
> > > > > > >>>> 12 Volt batteries can be built to the same specifications,
> >and
> > > >they
> > > > > > >>>>
> > > > > > >> are.
> > > > > > >>
> > > > > > >>>> Why not just get a 12 volt golf cart battery instead of 2 
>6s
> > > and
> > > > > >avoid
> > > > > > >>>> all the extra exposed wiring in a marine environment?
> > > > > > >>>>
> > > > > > >>>> Electric Golf carts can't put back the juice they use.  My
> >boat
> > > >has
> > > > > > >>>> never been externally charged--the electricity is self
> > > sustaining
> > > > > >with
> > > > > > >>>> solar and engine.  And I use just as much electricity as I
> > > want,
> > > > > > >>>> whenever I want.  It's a no-brainer.  As soon as you start
> > > really
> > > > > > >>>> looking into golf cart batteries you smack your head --
> > > > > > >>>>
> > > > > > >>>> They run $300 each!  Got to have 4 of them to replace $100
> > > worth
> > > >of
> > > > > >12
> > > > > > >>>> volts that will last for 5 years...
> > > > > > >>>>
> > > > > > >>>> now I'm really done with this topic.
> > > > > > >>>>
> > > > > > >>>> bill effros
> > > > > > >>>>
> > > > > > >>>>
> > > > > > >>>>
> > > > > > >>>> TN Rhodey wrote:
> > > > > > >>>>
> > > > > > >>>>
> > > > > > >>>>> Bill, You ask why don't cars have 2 6-volt batteries...
> >Cars
> > > > > have
> > > > > >a
> > > > > > >>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>
> > > > > > >>>> high
> > > > > > >>>>
> > > > > > >>>>
> > > > > > >>>>> output alternator. The benefits of 6 volt golf cart 
>battery
> > > >don't
> > > > > > >>>>>
> > > > > > >> apply.
> > > > > > >>
> > > > > > >>>>> Cars need high output for starting.
> > > > > > >>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>> If I had a live aboard I would consider using 6 volt
> > > batteries.
> > > > > The
> > > > > > >>>>>
> > > > > > >> big
> > > > > > >>
> > > > > > >>>>> advantage to the golf cart battery is that they hold up 
>much
> > > > > better
> > > > > > >>>>>
> > > > > > >> when
> > > > > > >>
> > > > > > >>>>> abused. They can be re-charged faster and last longer than
> >12
> > > > > volts.
> > > > > > >>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>
> > > > > > >>>> That is
> > > > > > >>>>
> > > > > > >>>>
> > > > > > >>>>> why cruisers love them.
> > > > > > >>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>> Wally
> > > > > > >>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>> From: Bill Effros <bill at effros.com>
> > > > > > >>>>>> Reply-To: The Rhodes 22 mail list
> ><rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org
> > > >
> > > > > > >>>>>> To: The Rhodes 22 mail list <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
> > > > > > >>>>>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Battteries
> > > > > > >>>>>> Date: Thu, 12 Apr 2007 13:36:10 -0300
> > > > > > >>>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>> Bob,
> > > > > > >>>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>> Stay away from this complexity.  It's simply not needed 
>in
> > > our
> > > > > >boats.
> > > > > > >>>>>> Nobody runs out of power on our boats.  The golf cart
> > > batteries
> > > > > >don't
> > > > > > >>>>>> fit anywhere.
> > > > > > >>>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>> If you are worried about this, get an outboard with
> >electric
> > > > > > >>>>>> start/generator.  If your battery runs out, you pull the
> > > >starter
> > > > > > >>>>>>
> > > > > > >> cord,
> > > > > > >>
> > > > > > >>>>>> start your motor, and it will provide you with enough
> > > >electricity
> > > > > >to
> > > > > > >>>>>> power your running lights.  That's all you need.  If it's
> > > > > daytime,
> > > > > > >>>>>>
> > > > > > >> you
> > > > > > >>
> > > > > > >>>>>> don't need any power at all.
> > > > > > >>>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>> When a golf cart battery is dead a golf cart can't move.
> >Not
> > > >so
> > > > > a
> > > > > > >>>>>> sailboat.
> > > > > > >>>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>> Your car doesn't have 2 golf cart batteries wired in
> >series.
> > > >Why
> > > > > > >>>>>>
> > > > > > >> not?
> > > > > > >>
> > > > > > >>>>>> The biggest draw most of us put on our batteries is the
> > > stereo
> > > > > > >>>>>>
> > > > > > >> system.
> > > > > > >>
> > > > > > >>>>>> I'm done.
> > > > > > >>>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>> Bill Effros
> > > > > > >>>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>> Bob Fletcher wrote:
> > > > > > >>>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>>> In his book "Sailboat Electonics Simplified" Don Casey 
>has
> > > an
> > > > > > >>>>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>>>
> > > > > > >>>> extensive
> > > > > > >>>>
> > > > > > >>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>>> discussin of battery types and configurations.  He seems
> >to
> > > > > >endorse
> > > > > > >>>>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>>>
> > > > > > >>>> the
> > > > > > >>>>
> > > > > > >>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>>> option of two 6 volt golf cart batteries wired in 
>series.
> > > > > > >>>>>>>
> > > > > > >> Apparently
> > > > > > >>
> > > > > > >>>>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>> they
> > > > > > >>>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>>> are rugged and much more affordable than "dedicated"
> >marine
> > > > > > >>>>>>>
> > > > > > >> batteries.
> > > > > > >>
> > > > > > >>>>>>> Bob Fletcher
> > > > > > >>>>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
> > > > > > >>>>>>> From: "John Lock" <jlock at relevantarts.com>
> > > > > > >>>>>>> To: "The Rhodes 22 mail list" 
><rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
> > > > > > >>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, April 11, 2007 10:32 AM
> > > > > > >>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Battteries
> > > > > > >>>>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>>>> At 11:57 AM 4/11/2007 -0400,
> >CORLEYMICHAELSIX at aol.comwrote:
> > > > > > >>>>>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Got to buy new battery(s) for my 99 Rhodes.  It is set
> >up
> > > >for
> > > > > >and
> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>
> > > > > > >>>> had
> > > > > > >>>>
> > > > > > >>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>> 2
> > > > > > >>>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>>>>> batteries before I put it in storage.  Intending to 
>buy
> > > deep
> > > > > >cycle
> > > > > > >>>>>>>>> wet  cells,
> > > > > > >>>>>>>>> debating weather to buy one Group 27 or 2 Group 24s or 
>2
> > > >Group
> > > > > > >>>>>>>>> 27s.   Have solar
> > > > > > >>>>>>>>> panels, VHF, digital depth gauge and knot meter,
> > > pull  start
> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>
> > > > > > >>>> outboard.
> > > > > > >>>>
> > > > > > >>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>>>>> Need
> > > > > > >>>>>>>>> advice.
> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>>>> Strangely enough, I was just reading an article about
> > > >batteries
> > > > > >the
> > > > > > >>>>>>>> other day!  This article was written from an RV
> > > perspective,
> > > > > but
> > > > > > >>>>>>>>
> > > > > > >> I'm
> > > > > > >>
> > > > > > >>>>>>>> guessing our boat usage is pretty similar.  One very
> > > >intriguing
> > > > > > >>>>>>>> alternative was using 2, 6-volt golf cart batteries in
> > > series
> > > > > to
> > > > > > >>>>>>>> produce 12 volts.  Apparently golf cart batteries offer
> > > some
> > > >of
> > > > > >the
> > > > > > >>>>>>>> highest amp-hour ratings available.
> > > > > > >>>>>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>>>> See article at
> > > > > > >>>>>>>> http://www.ccis.com/home/mnemeth/12volt/12volt.htm
> >Scroll
> > > > > down
> > > > > >to
> > > > > > >>>>>>>> "Selecting batteries".
> > > > > > >>>>>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>>>> Cheers!
> > > > > > >>>>>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>>>> John Lock
> > > > > > >>>>>>>> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> > > > > > >>>>>>>> s/v Pandion - '79 Rhodes 22
> > > > > > >>>>>>>> Lake Sinclair, GA
> > > > > > >>>>>>>> ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> > > > > > >>>>>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>>>> __________________________________________________
> > > > > > >>>>>>>> Use Rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org, Help?
> >www.rhodes22.org/list
> > > > > > >>>>>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>>> __________________________________________________
> > > > > > >>>>>>> Use Rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org, Help?
> >www.rhodes22.org/list
> > > > > > >>>>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>> __________________________________________________
> > > > > > >>>>>> Use Rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org, Help? 
>www.rhodes22.org/list
> > > > > > >>>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>
> > > >_________________________________________________________________
> > > > > > >>>>> Mortgage refinance is Hot. *Terms. Get a 5.375%* fix rate.
> > > Check
> > > > > > >>>>>
> > > > > > >> savings
> > > > > > >>
> > > > > > >>>>>
> > > > > > >>
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >https://www2.nextag.com/goto.jsp?product=100000035&url=%2fst.jsp&tm=y&search=mortgage_text_links_88_h2bbb&disc=y&vers=925&s=4056&p=5117
> > > > > > >>
> > > > > > >>>>> __________________________________________________
> > > > > > >>>>> Use Rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org, Help? 
>www.rhodes22.org/list
> > > > > > >>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>
> > > > > > >>>>>
> > > > > > >>>> __________________________________________________
> > > > > > >>>> Use Rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org, Help? www.rhodes22.org/list
> > > > > > >>>>
> > > > > > >>>>
> > > > > > >>>
> > > _________________________________________________________________
> > > > > > >>> Get a FREE Web site, company branded e-mail and more from
> > > >Microsoft
> > > > > > >>>
> > > > > > >> Office
> > > > > > >>
> > > > > > >>> Live!
> > > http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/mcrssaub0050001411mrt/direct/01/
> > > > > > >>>
> > > > > > >>> __________________________________________________
> > > > > > >>> Use Rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org, Help? www.rhodes22.org/list
> > > > > > >>>
> > > > > > >>>
> > > > > > >>>
> > > > > > >> __________________________________________________
> > > > > > >> Use Rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org, Help? www.rhodes22.org/list
> > > > > > >>
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> >_________________________________________________________________
> > > > > > > The average US Credit Score is 675. The cost to see yours: $0 
>by
> > > > > >Experian.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >http://www.freecreditreport.com/pm/default.aspx?sc=660600&bcd=EMAILFOOTERAVERAGE
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > __________________________________________________
> > > > > > > Use Rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org, Help? www.rhodes22.org/list
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > >__________________________________________________
> > > > > >Use Rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org, Help? www.rhodes22.org/list
> > > > >
> > > > > _________________________________________________________________
> > > > > MSN is giving away a trip to Vegas to see Elton John.� Enter to
> >win
> > > >today.
> > > > > http://msnconcertcontest.com?icid-nceltontagline
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > __________________________________________________
> > > > > Use Rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org, Help? www.rhodes22.org/list
> > > > >
> > > >__________________________________________________
> > > >Use Rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org, Help? www.rhodes22.org/list
> > >
> > > _________________________________________________________________
> > > Mortgage refinance is Hot. *Terms. Get a 5.375%* fix rate. Check 
>savings
> > >
> > >
> >https://www2.nextag.com/goto.jsp?product=100000035&url=%2fst.jsp&tm=y&search=mortgage_text_links_88_h2bbb&disc=y&vers=925&s=4056&p=5117
> > >
> > > __________________________________________________
> > > Use Rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org, Help? www.rhodes22.org/list
> > >
> >__________________________________________________
> >Use Rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org, Help? www.rhodes22.org/list
>
>_________________________________________________________________
>Get a FREE Web site, company branded e-mail and more from Microsoft Office
>Live! http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/mcrssaub0050001411mrt/direct/01/


>__________________________________________________
>Use Rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org, Help? www.rhodes22.org/list

_________________________________________________________________
The average US Credit Score is 675. The cost to see yours: $0 by Experian. 
http://www.freecreditreport.com/pm/default.aspx?sc=660600&bcd=EMAILFOOTERAVERAGE

More information about the Rhodes22-list mailing list