[Rhodes22-list] political philosophy- "moral equivalence" (There is no fundamental right or wrong?)
Herb Parsons
hparsons at parsonsys.com
Tue Dec 16 19:38:32 EST 2008
Sure you'll get a response. Cite the law that says differently.
Ben Cittadino wrote:
> Herb;
>
> Through all your "wailing and gnashing of teeth" you made an important
> admission. You said, it's an employers right to fire someone for the reason
> of "not liking their politics". I disagree.
>
> What are the odds that you will reply to this post? Will I get the last
> word?
>
> Ben C.
>
>
>
> hparsons wrote:
>
>> And Ben, I will repeat.
>>
>> It's not evil.
>>
>> It may be stupid
>>
>> It may be a goofy thing to do (which was why it was a JOKE).
>>
>> But it's not evil
>>
>> I believe it was you (but very well could have been someone else), who
>> asked if I would quit by job if they sold bumper stickers that made
>> jokes about shooting Obama. I said I would. It's a bumper sticker
>> sellers right to sell anything they want, and it's my right to not
>> purchase from them if I'm a shopper, and not work for them if I'm a buyer.
>>
>> Similarly, it's an employer's right to fire someone for just about
>> anything, including not liking their politics. Again, just some I'm
>> clear, It would be stupid, and it would be goofy, and I don't think a
>> person doing so would be successful in the long run.
>>
>> But it's not evil.
>>
>> As for me calling your nonsense "shit", it is. You've chosen to make
>> this a personal attack on both Bill, and now myself. You've totally
>> mis-characterized what I wrote to fit your neat little (false) bundle,
>> and yes, I find that offensive.
>>
>> Futher, you accuse me of being "dishonest about the subject" when in
>> fact I've remained consistent in what I've said (unlike you're "fuuqa
>> bs"), and then after accusing me of such, say you're done.
>>
>> I suspect you are.; You've been revealed for what you are, pretty
>> consistently, and I have no doubt you want no more of it. Go take your
>> hypocrisy and attacks elsewhere if you wish, I'm sure the break will be
>> a welcome one.
>>
>>
>> Ben Cittadino wrote:
>>
>>> Herb;
>>>
>>> Come on now. I'm perfectly happy to have an argument with you, but you
>>> can't
>>> be dishonest about the subject and expect people to listen. The evil we
>>> were both talking about had nothing to do with laying people off in the
>>> abstract. It had to do with the POINT of the JOKE which as you very well
>>> know was laying people off BECAUSE THEY HAD OBAMA BUMPER STICKERS. That's
>>> what made it funny to you and offensive to me. "They wanted change and I
>>> gave it to them". Remember?
>>>
>>> Apparently I have somehow managed to hurt your feelings, because is is
>>> usually not your style to use vulgar expressions, except when you are
>>> feeling attacked, so I must have provoked you in some way to cause your
>>> "do
>>> you really believe the **** you write?" line. I do think we ought not to
>>> use
>>> such profanity on this list and would request that you not do so.
>>> Remember,
>>> you and I are not the only people who see this stuff.
>>>
>>> In fact, my posts do reflect my beliefs, and for those who wonder why I
>>> waste my time with you, it is because your beliefs reflect those of a
>>> (thankfully small) number of people I have met and dealt with in my life.
>>> In
>>> short, understanding the likes of you helps me. Thanks for your
>>> contribution
>>> to my education on human nature.
>>>
>>> Be well, Herb. Have a truly joyous Holiday Season. I think we're done
>>> here.
>>>
>>> Ben C.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> hparsons wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>> Sorry Ben, you are under a misconception.
>>>>
>>>> There IS no "evil" in laying off workers. You may choose to call it
>>>> "throwing workers out in the street', but the truth of the matter is it
>>>> is a person (or a group of people) choosing to no longer employ an
>>>> individual, and that is their RIGHT. It's not an evil, it's not even
>>>> wrong, unless they are doing something contrary to what they've
>>>> promised.
>>>>
>>>> If they've signed a contract, they should honor it. If they've made
>>>> promises, they should honor those. But workers leave (often without
>>>> notice), simply because they find something better, decide not to work
>>>> anymore, whatever. Employers have that same right.
>>>>
>>>> As for the rest of your drivel, you completely mis read what I wrote.
>>>> Might I suggest you go back and look at what I actually said:
>>>>
>>>> "... is not only wrong, but worthy of disdain ..." Is a clue, but
>>>> frankly, I think you're clueless. You see what you want to see, and
>>>> anyone that doesn't see it is wrong.
>>>>
>>>> And what in the WORLD are you talking about "covering for each other". I
>>>> said nothing in support of Ed, nor did I speak of Marxism.
>>>>
>>>> Do you REALLY believe the shit you write?
>>>>
>>>> Ben Cittadino wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Ed and Herb;
>>>>>
>>>>> Herb said,
>>>>> "You know something Ben, that you totally miss - EVERYONE thinks their
>>>>> cause is worthy, and EVERYONE thinks those causes 180 degrees opposite
>>>>> are wrong.
>>>>>
>>>>> The difference between you, and others of your ilk, is the arrogance
>>>>> that says "Not only is my cause the worthy one, but anyone that sees
>>>>> things differently is not only wrong, but worthy of disdain, because I
>>>>> am so obviously right that anyone that differs that strongly from me is
>>>>> unAmerican and wrong."
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Ed said,
>>>>> "Your thought of arrogance is correct. Arrogance is especially
>>>>> noticeable
>>>>> in
>>>>> those who have loss touch with ordinary people. Arrogance is often
>>>>> evident
>>>>> in those of self appointed elites, many of higher formal education."
>>>>>
>>>>> So let me get this straight. A strong opinion as to the fundamental
>>>>> "rightness" of one's position on an issue (such as the evil of throwing
>>>>> workers into the street and out of their jobs, joking or not), equates
>>>>> with
>>>>> "arrogance". That is exactly what you both have said . So since
>>>>> EVERYONE
>>>>> feels that way (that their cause is right and the other guy's is wrong)
>>>>> I
>>>>> assume there must not be any absolute Right or Wrong according to your
>>>>> philosophical outlook. Therefor, in your view, all morality is relative
>>>>> only
>>>>> to the person making the judgment. Thus MY morality (fairness to
>>>>> workers
>>>>> and
>>>>> disapproval of jokes celebrating the hurting of workers) represents
>>>>> arrogance to you Herb and you Ed. My recollection is that both of you
>>>>> claim
>>>>> to hold Christian values. Does this mean that your strong opinions on,
>>>>> say,
>>>>> abortion or stem cell research are arrogant? If there is no fundamental
>>>>> Right or Wrong how are we to make judgments? I would offer that some
>>>>> things
>>>>> are Right and some things are Wrong, and that there are Good guys and
>>>>> Bad
>>>>> guys, and the difficulty of confronting evil does not excuse us from
>>>>> the
>>>>> duty to do so. So yes, I believe Bill's joke of several weeks ago was a
>>>>> manifestation of a depraved heart, and was not the least bit funny. And
>>>>> yes,I think the two of you ought to give more thought to what it means
>>>>> to
>>>>> be
>>>>> an American and less to the marxists hiding under your beds. I won't
>>>>> hold
>>>>> my
>>>>> breath waiting for you to engage in any self examination however.
>>>>> You're
>>>>> too
>>>>> busy covering for each other to think for yourselves.
>>>>>
>>>>> Merry Christmas
>>>>>
>>>>> Ben C.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Tootle wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> Rummy,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Somebody that comes on once every 3 or 4 months ought to consider
>>>>>> making
>>>>>> sure others can clearly i.d. who is making the comments. I do not
>>>>>> have
>>>>>> your infallible memory. However, I do remember various trolls in the
>>>>>> past.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Herb,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Study these web sites:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> http://www.facesoflawsuitabuse.org/facts/
>>>>>>
>>>>>> http://www.instituteforlegalreform.org/
>>>>>>
>>>>>> It is important to remember that one aspect of Marxism is control of
>>>>>> the
>>>>>> people. Remember that Marxism seeks to create a 'Dictatorship of the
>>>>>> Proletariat’. An important aspect of control is control descent and
>>>>>> free
>>>>>> thought. An element of dictatorship is for the dictator making his
>>>>>> opinions the correct and only view.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> A Marxist dictator will claim that he is speaking for the little guy.
>>>>>> There is glossing over the fact that the little guy can speak for
>>>>>> himself.
>>>>>> He pretends the little guy incapable of self defense when in fact that
>>>>>> is
>>>>>> not true. He believes only the Marxist knows the truth.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Your thought of arrogance is correct. Arrogance is especially
>>>>>> noticeable
>>>>>> in those who have loss touch with ordinary people. Arrogance is often
>>>>>> evident in those of self appointed elites, many of higher formal
>>>>>> education.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I recall pictures and news reports of a ceremony in the Roman Catholic
>>>>>> Church in Rome where the Pope washes the feet of a group of Cardinals.
>>>>>> What is the purpose of that ceremony?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> In 1936 Major General J. F. C. Fuller wrote a booklet for the U. S.
>>>>>> Army
>>>>>> entitled, Generalship: Its diseases and Their Cure. Therein he
>>>>>> discussed
>>>>>> the arrogance of power and one of its cause as disassociation from
>>>>>> reality. This affliction is evident in the U. S. national media and
>>>>>> its
>>>>>> acolytes and some members of this forum.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Ed K
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Herb Parsons
>>>>
>>>> __________________________________________________
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>>>> __________________________________________________
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>> --
>> Herb Parsons
>>
>> __________________________________________________
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>>
>>
>
>
--
Herb Parsons
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