[Rhodes22-list] Political reply to Ben C - you are kidding?

Sat Oct 25 17:04:27 EDT 2008

You know Brad,Herb and Ed, I have been trying to think of a way to express my
biggest problem with Palin. I think I may have the germ of an idea, not
fully formed yet but I'd be interested in your reaction. Ross Perot, crazy
little bugger that he was, did have a point when he said that one of the
most important jobs of the President was to make use of the "bully pulpit"
that the office provides.  The Pres has no legislative or judicial power but
it is the power of inspiration and advocacy, and the power to make Americans
feel good about themselves, and/or become motivated to meet great challenges
as a nation that makes the office so important.

Think about listening to FDR, Kennedy, Reagan and Bush Sr.  These men moved
us to handle the challenges of their times. Clinton was such a man as well. 
When we listen to Barak Obama speak, I believe most Americans hear similar
inspiration.  Even you men, if you could forget what you think you know
about his past, if you just LISTEN to the words, he makes everybody who
listens to him want to be and do great.  

When people listen to Ms Palin, half are inspired to hate the other half. 
In the words of "W", she's a divider not a uniter.  Her sarcastic and mean
spirited references to real Americans vs. THE OTHERS, is a call to the worst
in each of us, a call to blame  THEM for our troubles. 

Do you see? Do you hear it? Am I on to something here? 

Ben C.

TN Rhodey-2 wrote:
> 
> Herb, I do see the difference. I also understand the scholarship is not
> for
> raising your kids. Do you see that? You ignored that part of my post. I
> wonder why?
> 
> My definition would includes the most prestigious scholarship i am aware
> of.
> Can you name a more prestigious academic scholarship? You respond to my
> post
> but never answered the question.  I do agree that more people seek a HS
> diploma than a Rhodes Scholarship. You will argue the silliest things.
> 
> Anyway iyou agreed with main point....a Rhodes Scholarship does not make
> one
> a good person or president.
> 
> Wally
> 
> On Sat, Oct 25, 2008 at 1:46 PM, Herb Parsons
> <hparsons at parsonsys.com>wrote:
> 
>> Ben's Definition - "single most prestigious, competitive, sought after,
>> challenging, and rewarding academic honor…"
>> Wally's Definition - "a highly sought after ACADEMIC scholarship"
>>
>> I do hope you see the difference between the two. I'd be willing to make
>> a bet with anyone on here, ANYONE. I'd be willing to bet that there are
>> more people seeking a high school diploma in any one year than there are
>> seeking Rhodes scholarships. I think a HS diploma would be a much more
>> sought after honor.
>>
>> That's the problem with hyperbole. People get so caught up in saying
>> things that they quickly lose track of what they are saying.
>>
>> However, the real point to this is:
>>
>> Does having gaining a Rhodes scholarship make on more qualified for the
>> white house? I don't think so.
>>
>>
>>
>> TN Rhodey wrote:
>> > Ed, Perhaps you are letting your opinion of Clinton tarnish the
>> achievement
>> > of a Rhodes Scholarship. As Ben mentioned it is a highly sought
>> > after ACADEMIC scholarship. This is not his definition this is reality.
>> Is
>> > there a more prestigious post graduate scholarship offered?
>> >
>> > A Rhodes scholarship is not awarded for raising a family or imparting
>> your
>> > approved values.  It is nothing like Mormons sent abroad.....they were
>> not
>> > selected for their mission based on academics. Many who achieve the
>> academic
>> > honors you mention are later selected for a Rhodes Scholarship.
>> >
>> > Most seem to recognize that a Rhodes Scholarship is awarded to the
>> cream
>> of
>> > the academic crop. Beings a Rhodes Scholar does not guarantee high
>> morals,
>> > post graduate achievement, or groom one for future presidency. I wonder
>> how
>> > many Rhodes scholars own Rhodes sailboats?
>> >
>> > Wally
>> >
>> >
>> > On Sat, Oct 25, 2008 at 7:51 AM, Tootle <ekroposki at charter.net> wrote:
>> >
>> >
>> >> "Bill Clinton was a Rhodes Scholar…"  "Surely you realize this post
>> >> graduate
>> >> grant is the single most prestigious, competitive, sought after,
>> >> challenging, and rewarding academic honor that a college graduate can
>> >> receive. Please tell me you accept that fact."
>> >>
>> >> Ben in American it is acceptable to have people with other opinions. 
>> It
>> is
>> >> understood that one opinion is not necessarily the absolute epiphany.
>> >>
>> >> So as to your statement, I will accept what you said about 'a Rhodes
>> >> Scholar' as fact to you.  And that is your opinion.
>> >>
>> >> My opinion is not the same and my values are not the same.  And I know
>> >> other
>> >> Americans who share my opinion, and may know some who share yours.
>> >>
>> >> As for the part that part that says, "single most prestigious,
>> competitive,
>> >> sought after, challenging, and rewarding academic honor…"  I suggest
>> that
>> >> may be true, but only to those who seek that specific type
>> recognition.
>> >>
>> >> Your definition does not include 'Scientific Achievements' of an
>> academic
>> >> nature.  Your definition does not include 'Achievements' of economic,
>> >> religious, social (to include community) and a plethora of
>> achievements
>> >> that
>> >> may have other or different academic measurements.
>> >>
>> >> So I give the Rhodes Scholar the same or equal weight as cum laude or
>> summa
>> >> cum laude, or other academic honors.
>> >>
>> >> In summary, while it is nice to have some who go to another country to
>> >> study
>> >> for a year or two, I do not limit my recognition of important
>> achievement
>> >> to
>> >> that group.  I am not a Mormon, but their practice of sending young
>> men
>> on
>> >> missions to different parts of this country or other countries
>> accomplishes
>> >> a similar education.
>> >>
>> >> A researcher who finds important medical facts about diseases to me is
>> an
>> >> equal or greater achievement. than a Rhodes Scholar.  And, note that
>> this
>> >> can be accomplished in an Academic laboratory.
>> >>
>> >> A young lady who finds a husband and has several children and imparts
>> into
>> >> those children important societal values to me is a higher achievement
>> than
>> >> your Rhodes Scholar.
>> >>
>> >> So, we do not agree.  Others are free to agree with you.  What we are
>> >> talking about is the difference between 'Conservative' values and
>> >> liberalism.
>> >>
>> >> Ed K
>> >> addendum, ""A strict observance of the written laws is doubtless one
>> of
>> the
>> >> high virtues of a good citizen, but it is not the highest. The laws of
>> >> necessity, of self-preservation, of saving our country when in danger,
>> are
>> >> of higher obligation."    Thomas Jefferson
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Benjamin Cittadino wrote:
>> >>
>> >>> Tootle;
>> >>> I recently called Bill Clinton a genius in defending my position that
>> it
>> >>> is not her accent that makes Sarah Palin a moron. Clinton has a
>> >>>
>> >> pronounced
>> >>
>> >>> accent.
>> >>>
>> >>> As you must have known , but perhaps have blocked from your memory,
>> Bill
>> >>> Clinton was a Rhodes Scholar.  Surely you realize this post graduate
>> >>>
>> >> grant
>> >>
>> >>> is the single most prestigious, competitive, sought after,
>> challenging,
>> >>> and rewarding academic honor that a college graduate can receive.
>> Please
>> >>> tell me you accept that fact.
>> >>>
>> >>> Bill Clinton speaks in complete, gramatically correct, coherant
>> English
>> >>> sentences.  His paragraphs have a beginning, a middle and an end that
>> >>>
>> >> hang
>> >>
>> >>> together as eloquent expressions of a complete thought.
>> >>>
>> >>> Bill Clinton can talk for hours on esoteric subjects of foreign and
>> >>> domestic policy, without notes.
>> >>>
>> >>> He is spontaneously witty, charming, quick, and isn't afraid to
>> appear
>> >>> "intellectual". He is utterly unafraid to be challenged on any
>> subject
>> by
>> >>> anyone, and is a persuasive advocate for his point of view.
>> >>>
>> >>> Sarah Palin spouts transparently canned lines, which almost always
>> >>>
>> >> include
>> >>
>> >>> the words, "maverick, soccar Mom, pit bull, Joe six-pack, hockey mom,
>> >>>
>> >> real
>> >>
>> >>> americans, and/or you betcha" over and over.  She has one talent,
>> >>>
>> >> sarcasm,
>> >>
>> >>> and it is no wonder to me why she is so popular with some of the
>> folks
>> on
>> >>> this forum.
>> >>>
>> >>> She wants to be VP to a man who has had multiple bouts with serious
>> >>>
>> >> cancer
>> >>
>> >>> and is of advanced age.
>> >>>
>> >>> I am not alone in my assessment of this person.  David Brooks and
>> other
>> >>> right of center writers like Peggy Noonan and others feel exactly the
>> >>>
>> >> same
>> >>
>> >>> way.  I'm in good company in my assessment.
>> >>>
>> >>> Who thinks she is not a moron?  As far as I can tell, only afew hardy
>> >>> souls on this forum.  Well, good luck with that.
>> >>>
>> >>> Ben C.
>> >>>
>> >>> PS- for purposes of this discussion I define moron as a person of
>> obvious
>> >>> intellectual incapacity who is also mean, nasty, sarcastic and adds
>> >>> nothing to the public discourse. It is a function of both attitude
>> AND
>> >>> aptitude.
>> >>>
>> >>> PPS-Yes Tootle I know that makes me a moron in your eyes. I can live
>> with
>> >>> that.
>> >>>
>> >>> Tootle wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>>> Is he getting the thirst for 'politics'?  Maybe the governorship of
>> say,
>> >>>> Illinois, Pennsylvania, Virginia ... sounds like he as an audience
>> >>>> waiting...
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Ed K
>> >>>>  http://www.nabble.com/file/p20149918/WigeeBoard.jpg WigeeBoard.jpg
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>
>> >> --
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>> >>
>> >>
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