[Rhodes22-list] General Boats (Rose & Stan's) position paper

Mon Dec 28 09:11:30 EST 2009

Stan,
No one totally wins in a disagreement, so this sounds like a reasonable compromise.  Sounds like you both gain something.  Apparently, with the PTE you have an inventory of them at the plant so any outside sales hurts GB.

Haven't read Cindy's books, but I'll have to look for them.  - Rob

a)    Art continues his Boom Room business and reimburses General Boats for
its monies laid out for his business and has commissions brought up to date
and forthcoming on future sales.

b)    Art agrees that, supporting his claims of supporting the welfare of
General Boats, he will not build or sell Rhodes pop top enclosures or,
alternatively, will contract with GB to make pop top enclosures exclusively
for General Boats.

c)    Art, whose claim for sympathy is that he has made an investment in
equipment for his sewing business, contracts to sew interior and exterior
cushion covers sets for GB where General Boats will supply the fabric and
General Boats will use its own in-plant cut to shape foam to install in said
contracted covers.

d)    With a working agreement that Art will stay with, and the supply to GB
of products that meet GB's high standards, General Boats will have no
objection to Art manufacturing and selling-direct, other boat items from
boat and tiller weather protective covers to interior window curtains.

And while the List majority seems to have approved List advertising, I have
to add that Cindy's book "America's Bubble Economy", that came out late 06
and turned out to be right on, prompted Wiley and Sons to ask for another
one.  "After Shock", at Amazon, Barnes and Noble, etc. has gone from
obscurity to the top of the financial books seller's list in just a few days
before running out and waiting for the second printing.  I read the galleys
and I hope this one is dead wrong.

And that is all I have to say. (For now.)    If anyone does not like it, six
of you, better make that three, can meet me 3/11 at the OK Coral at High
Noon.  Since I will probably be 85, it will make a fair fight.

stan

----- Original Message -----
From: "Michael D. Weisner" <mweisner at ebsmed.com>
To: "The Rhodes 22 Email List" <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
Sent: Wednesday, December 23, 2009 7:56 AM
Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Communication on da Rhodes list

> Todd,
>
> "... if you want to ban commercial advertisement, it will have to apply to
> everyone."
> Why? Why is this statement assumed to be true?  You are quite correct in
> stating that this is a Rhodes 22 "Owners" list but one cannot equate
> participation by the Rhodes 22 manufacturer with that of aftermarket
> manufacturers.
>
> That said, I am NOT in favor of a ban on commercial posts at all.   Please
> keep them simple, occassional and not directed towards a particular
> individual (do not chases leads on da list) and we will be fine.  If Stan
> announces that he is building a Catalina Conversion available at a
> particular price to those who might be interested, or Art has a boom room
> for sale, that's fine by me.  I think that the problem was that Stan and
> Art
> were using da list to fuel their feud.
>
> I would still appreciate a simple website for reference, pictures and
> pricing.  Art, if you need help setting it up, just ask.  They're not
> difficult or expensive ($5/month or so at
> http://www.netfirms.com/web-hosting/index.php including Sitebuilder.)
> See,
> commercial posting, no problem (NB: I am not affiliated with netfirms.)
>
> Mike
> s/v Shanghai'd Summer ('81)
> Nissequogue River, NY
>
> From: "Todd Tavares": Wednesday, December 23, 2009 5:22 AM
>>
>> Rik, and Michael,
>>
>>    No disrespect meant to anyone here, but this is the Rhodes 22 "OWNERS"
>> list.  Not the General
>> Boats list, Art's canvas list, etc. No one had a problem with Stan
>> participating, posting ads, and
>> even most agreed with his insane 5% commission for listed here for sale
>> until a bunch of guys jumped on Art.
>> But Stan has a website too.
>> Maybe some of the more computer savvy guys here should help MJM re-do the
>> GB website and literature
>> so it is up to date and flashy.
>>
>> We are 99.9% loyal to Stan and the future of GB, but the bottom line is
>> that this is the owners
>> group list and if you want to ban commercial advertisement, it will have
>> to apply to everyone.
>> Let us not confuse the issues.
>>
>> Todd T
>>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Rik Sandberg <sanderico1 at gmail.com>
>> To: The Rhodes 22 Email List <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
>> Sent: Wed, Dec 23, 2009 12:20 am
>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Communication on da Rhodes list
>>>
>> Art,
>>
>> "Know that I am the manufacturer,  also the designer, and also the worker
>> bee.  I am also the risk taker - in a game with loaded dice"
>>
>> Yeah, so??? Is this the Art's boom room and pop-top enclosure list??
>>
>> In the almost 11 years I have been on this list, nobody has ever had a
>> problem doing their business business back channel until you came along.
>>
>> Websites are cheap. Make one up, put a link in your sig.
>>
>> But please, stop whining about it.
>>
>> Rik
>>
>> On Tue, Dec 22, 2009 at 6:02 PM, Art Czerwonky
>> <a_czerwonky at yahoo.com>wrote:
>>
>>> Michael,
>>>
>>> I defer to Stan and GBI on the credibility and quality of this boat we
>>> all
>>> own.  Unknown to him I referred two credible prospects directly to him
>>> at
>>> the St Pete show earlier this month.  I don't expect letters, candy, or
>>> flowers for my honest attempt to help prosper his boat efforts.  I will
>>> not,
>>> however, defer to him on the credibility and quality of the cockpit
>>> enclosure or the boat cover or even the PTE.
>>>
>>> Michael, with all due respect, you accord special status to the
>>> manufacturer of a product.  Know that I am the manufacturer,  also the
>>> designer, and also the worker bee.  I am also the risk taker - in a game
>>> with loaded dice.  Stan does not manufacture canvas, and he is, no doubt
>>> very thankful for that.  Sometimes it helps to put yourself in someone
>>> else's shoes.  I need the opportunity to survive this business just like
>>> he
>>> does, for the good of a fleet that wants choices and viable options.
>>>
>>> Art
>>>
>>> --- On Tue, 12/22/09, Michael D. Weisner <mweisner at ebsmed.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> > From: Michael D. Weisner <mweisner at ebsmed.com>
>>> > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Commercial Ads on da Rhodes list
>>> > To: "The Rhodes 22 Email List" <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
>>> > Date: Tuesday, December 22, 2009, 6:12 PM
>>> > Todd,
>>> >
>>> > You have a good point and I don't disagree except (here it
>>> > comes) in the
>>> > case of GBI.  After all, this is called the Rhodes 22
>>> > list because it is
>>> > about the Rhodes 22 sailboat.  I believe that Stan
>>> > (GBI) has a slightly
>>> > different place on the list than Art or anyone else for
>>> > that matter.
>>> >
>>> > This list embodies a group of diverse individuals brought
>>> > together mostly
>>> > through the efforts of Stan, directly or indirectly.
>>> > It has been my
>>> > pleasure to provide information and assistance to other
>>> > Rhodies, in an
>>> > effort to help GBI.  This is not to say that I
>>> > wouldn't help Art succeed,
>>> > quite the contrary, but I do not treat the boat
>>> > manufacturer and an
>>> > aftermarket accessory maker in the same way.  I
>>> > believe that this is the
>>> > point of distinction.
>>> >
>>> > Mike
>>> > s/v Shanghai'd Summer ('81)
>>> > Nissequogue River, NY
>>>>
>>> >
>>> > From: "Todd Tavares" Tuesday, December 22, 2009 5:33 PM
>>> > >
>>> > > Michael,
>>> > >
>>> > >     I think you are looking at
>>> > that old discussion through Rose (and Stan)
>>> > > colored glasses. Art has a valid point, regardless of
>>> > the sour grapes
>>> > > which went on between him and Stan.  Commercial
>>> > advertisement is
>>> > > commercial advertisement.  If you think Art
>>> > should only be allowed to
>>> > > direct Rhodes listers to a website, then the rules
>>> > should apply across the
>>> > > board---Art,Stan, myself, or anyone else.
>>> > > IMHO
>>> > >
>>> > > Todd T
>>>
>>> > > -----Original Message-----
>>> > > From: Michael D. Weisner <mweisner at ebsmed.com>
>>> > > To: The Rhodes 22 Email List <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
>>> > > Sent: Tue, Dec 22, 2009 3:00 pm
>>> > > Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Commercial Ads on da Rhodes
>>> > list
>>>
>>> > > ----- Original Message -----
>>> > > From: "Arthur H. Czerwonky" <czerwonky at earthlink.net>
>>> > > To: "The Rhodes 22 Email List" <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
>>> > > Sent: Tuesday, December 22, 2009 11:02 AM
>>> > > Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Babes on Boats
>>>>>> > >
>>> > >> All,
>>> > >>
>>> > >> I think this is an excellent suggestion.  As
>>> > I produce BR, PT, and cover
>>> > >> options as a service to the fleet, MJM has
>>> > suggested that it is somehow
>>> > >> slacking ethic to make this knowledge available to
>>> > the skippers who want
>>> > >> and need it.  An interesting and apparently
>>> > biased slant considering that
>>> > >> Stan has freely taken the perogative with the
>>> > Catalina 25 conversion,
>>> > >> which he has openly announced and advertised on
>>> > our list, with price and
>>> > >> all.
>>> > >>
>>> > >> Understand that I have no objection at all to
>>> > Stan's placement of his
>>> > >> notice/ad.  The playing field should be
>>> > level, however.  Any double
>>> > >> standard is a disservice to our fleet skippers and
>>> > owners.  Our objective
>>> > >> should be to provide the very best information and
>>> > service to a very
>>> > >> deserving and intelligent fleet market.
>>> > >>
>>> > >> Art
>>> > >> s/v Mary Jane
>>> > >> Lake Hartwell/St Pete

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