[Rhodes22-list] hatch on foredeck

Tue Dec 3 11:37:14 EST 2019

James:

Sounds like a good strategy that will have a number of advantages to my approach. With adequate core material properly bonded to the deck skin there should be no need for the liner. In fact, I found that with my boat the core and liner was not bonded anywhere making the liner of little structural use anyway. 

The hard part is finding a way to work in such a confined area. I had to do that to join and fair the liner at the seam and that was a pain even though it was where I had the most room. Because I had removed the main bulkhead I was able to place a strip of plywood to bridge the space between the V-birth and a chair in the main cabin and then use that as a bed to lay on. But that would not help you get into the bow. Just getting into the bow area to replace deck hardware nuts and to fiberglass the hull-deck joint was difficult. 

Turning the boat over would make it easier to work with but would not give you more headroom. Actually I did that for another boat restoration I did so flipping the boat is quite feasible. I built a big crate for the boat that held it steady while I then turned the boat using come along winches and foam blocks to cushion the fall once the boat passed the balance point. I have pictures if you are interested.

I wonder if it wouldn't be more feasible to remove (and later replace) the flotation in the bow of the boat? You might then use some plywood for a platform to work from. Even a few inches would make a big difference. I think this would be the approach I would take if I were to lose my mind and do it again.

Good luck. Let us  know how it works out.

Graham Stewart
Agile 1976 Rhodes 22
Kingston Ontario

-----Original Message-----
From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf Of James Nichols via Rhodes22-list
Sent: Tuesday, December 3, 2019 10:45 AM
To: The Rhodes 22 Email List
Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] hatch on foredeck

Graham, 
I started a similar project on mine.  I've come close to deciding that it was best to abandon it a few times because of my lack of time to commit to the project,  but I'm sticking with it. 
I have the interior skin removed from the fore deck.  And the core material as well.  It was much the same as yours.  Barely attached,  but mine had much more water damage to the core as the forward hatch was badly deteriorated and allowed water in around the edges. 
I had considered removing the deck,  turning it over and working on it upside down,  but then I saw some videos of reinstalling a deck and the amount of work it took to get the hull and deck back into the same alignment as before and decided I didn't have the equipment for that. 
So,  I'm working on mine still together. Considering turning the entire boat upside down right now. I'm going back with 1/4 × 1/2" strips of oak,  building it back from the inside.  Pretty certain I'm going to leave the oak exposed and give it a nice stained finish.  In the end,  I expect mine with pierce that same concrete wall right next to yours. 
James

  On Tue, Dec 3, 2019 at 8:30 AM, Graham Stewart<gstewart8 at cogeco.ca> wrote:   Jesse:
Yes, I did some major restoration work which showed in part in the photo of
the foredeck being removed. I literally cut the deck in front of the cabin
roof and removed it. I then separated the liner, removed the core material,
replaced the core with multiple layers of epoxy-coated marine plywood, and
then reinstalled the deck. It might sound like a simple 4-step process but
it took me all summer just to do that. Refinishing the boat was another big
project.

Had I know then what I know now I would have realized that all that was
unnecessary. I thought that the core was in very poor condition as I knew
there had been a water leak into the core, the deck was very soft when I
stood on I, and I had a nest of flying ants above the liner that I assumed
was an indication of severe core damage. 

At the time was encouraged to be so adventurous because I thought that there
was a very good chance that I would end up taking the boat to the dump as
being unsalvageable. I was just curious to see what was happening between
the deck skin and liner.

As it turned out, there was very little damage to the core. The wet spot was
relatively small with no sign of rot and there was no trace of damage from
the flying ants. However, the core was made of regular indoor plywood that
had dried out and delaminated from the deck and liner. It had only been
attached with very little strands of sealant that in most areas hadn't even
touched the skins. Hence it came apart and was removed mostly with my bare
hands. The individual layers of the plywood had also separated. As a result
the deck had lost virtually all of its rigidity.

It would have been much, much, much less trouble and probably just as
effective to have dried out the wet spot and then injected thickened epoxy
into the entire core and between the core and the deck skin, but without
being able to see what was happening I had no idea that epoxy injection
would be effective. In fact, for the side decks I used this method of epoxy
injection and got very good results. There are a few tricks to getting the
epoxy into the right places and being able to see the core from the cut edge
was essential to that process. I posted this work and my conclusions to the
list so that all those contemplating the removal of their deck might avoid a
lot of work. As it turned out there were not  a lot of people contemplating
doing that. However, It I think it might have been useful to some to be able
to see what I discovered inside the deck.

Getting the deck pack on and aligned turned out to be a very difficult
process - for a complete novice like me. I had made a frame to hold the
foredeck in its original shape while I replaced the core but, while it
helped, it didn't work very well and the new deck did not align well with
the rest of the boat. (The deck is much less symmetrical than I had expected
it to be.) So fitting it back on the boat was very time-consuming and
required a LOT of fairing and reinforcement. In the end, however, the
surgery is not visible either on the inside or outside and I have a foredeck
that could puncture a concrete wall. 

To finish the deck I had to grind off all of the non-skid gel coat on the
foredeck and side decks, apply several layers of glass and endless fairing
to the entire area, paint the entire deck and cockpit, and apply a new
nonskid. All in all a ridiculous amount of work. It took about four years of
summer work just to this repair - although I was doing a plethora of other
repairs as well. The total restoration took seven years.

I note that somewhere along the line Stan stopped using plywood as the core
material for the R22 and as a result the problems I had would be avoided. My
advice to anyone purchasing an older R22 would be to determine what the core
material is before the purchase.

Graham Stewart
Agile 1976 Rhodes 22
Kingston Ontario

-----Original Message-----
From: Rhodes22-list [mailto:rhodes22-list-bounces at rhodes22.org] On Behalf Of
Jesse Shumaker
Sent: Monday, December 2, 2019 9:58 AM
To: rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org
Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] hatch on foredeck

Thanks for the replies and tips.  I will proceed with adding chocks as
suggested since that should address my concerns. I'll post a photo of the
finished results on a related post (at the link below) about adding the
solar vent.  I've got one minor tweak to make and the solar vent
installation will be done.

http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/gasket-for-mounting-solar-vent-td5621
9.html

Graham, your photos illustrate some major projects.  Did you replace the
foredeck yourself?  If so, did you end up ordering a replacement foredeck
from GB for the installation?

--
Sent from: http://rhodes-22.1065344.n5.nabble.com/