[Rhodes22-list] Speaking of politicians.

TN Rhodey tnrhodey at hotmail.com
Thu Apr 5 09:30:05 EDT 2007 

Brad, I am with you on Speaker's recent trip. This was not a good thing. - 
Wally

>From: "Brad Haslett" <flybrad at gmail.com>
>Reply-To: The Rhodes 22 mail list <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
>To: "The Rhodes 22 mail list" <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
>Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Speaking of politicians.
>Date: Thu, 5 Apr 2007 04:02:22 -0600
>
>Bill,
>
>I'm really to busy to fool with this right now but some of your
>misstatements shouldn't go unchallenged.  You are wrong, "they", at least 
>in
>the modern sense of the Presidency, didn't "all" fire Federal Attorneys at
>once.  Nixon, Ford, Carter, Reagan, Bush 41, all replaced Federal Attorneys
>as their appointments expired, and fired a handful midterm for various
>reasons, but none fired all, as in every single one like Clinton did.  No
>one paid any attention to what Janet Reno did at the time because it was
>legal - Federal Attorneys serve at the discretion of the President and, oh,
>shock of shocks!, they are political appointees.  Does any of this matter
>now?  No, Clinton is not the President, but his wife IS running for the job
>and for her to express shock that Bush should replace less than 10% of the
>Federal Attorneys is the height of hypocrisy. But by all means, let's
>investigate fully!  As long as Congress is tied down in hearings, mentally
>masturbating over nothing, they'll probably be to busy to cause other harm.
>
>If you want to go looking for unprecentented events, when in the history of
>the US has a Speaker of the House made an unauthorized trip to visit 
>foreign
>dignitaries, specifically against the wishes of the State Department and
>Whitehouse?  This is a dangerous slope we're sliding down folks.  Go ahead
>and weaken the Executive branch because you don't like the current
>President.  He'll be gone in two years but the damage being done here will
>come back and bite us in the ass.  The next time we have a crisis, say 
>China
>shoots down another airplane, who should they negotiate with - cherry pick
>the three branches of government and choose wichever one will give them the
>best deal?
>
>Brad
>
>On 4/4/07, Bill Effros <bill at effros.com> wrote:
> >
> > Wally,
> >
> > They all fired Federal Attorneys...at the beginning of their terms...to
> > get their own guys in.  Fair enough.  But Bush then fired his own guys
> > after getting re-elected and claimed the White House had nothing to do
> > with the decisions because the fired attorneys were fired for
> > incompetence.
> >
> > Turned out it wasn't even borderline true.  Bush ruined the reputations
> > of Republican Federal Attorneys.  Gonzales blamed his deputy.  etc.
> >
> > The people who wanted to impeach a President over a blow job have become
> > the new arbiters of tempests and teapots; mountains and mole hills.
> >
> > The American Public is doing a little fact checking, and they're no
> > longer buying the press releases from the White House.
> >
> > Rummy,
> >
> > Nobody believes that stuff anymore, they're just trying to rattle cages
> > for old time's sake.
> >
> > Bill Effros
> >
> >
> >
> > TN Rhodey wrote:
> > > Brad,
> > >
> > > What?.....This editorial really doesn't address the coment in my
> > email.....I
> > > will do some checking but I think you are wrong about this starting 
>with
> > > Clinton. I don't think anyone is saying that Clinto did not fire AGs. 
>I
> > just
> > > don't think it started with the Clinton's. You post doesn't shed any
> > light
> > > in either direction. - Wally
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >> From: "Brad Haslett" <flybrad at gmail.com>
> > >> Reply-To: The Rhodes 22 mail list <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
> > >> To: "The Rhodes 22 mail list" <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
> > >> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Speaking of politicians.
> > >> Date: Wed, 4 Apr 2007 12:08:47 -0500
> > >>
> > >> Wally,
> > >>
> > >> This is a 'tempest in a teapot', something, anything, to run
> > interference
> > >> during the last two years of a lame duck Presidency.  Here is an
> > editorial
> > >>
> > > >from the WSJ on the subject.
> > >
> > >> Brad
> > >>
> > >> ---------------
> > >>
> > >> *The Hubbell Standard*
> > >> Hillary Clinton knows all about sacking U.S. Attorneys.
> > >>
> > >> *Wednesday, March 14, 2007 12:01 a.m.*
> > >>
> > >> Congressional Democrats are in full cry over the news this week that
> > the
> > >> Administration's decision to fire eight U.S. Attorneys originated
> > >> from--gasp--the White House. Senator Hillary Clinton joined the fun
> > >> yesterday, blaming President Bush for "the politicization of our
> > >> prosecutorial system." Oh, my.
> > >>
> > >> As it happens, Mrs. Clinton is just the Senator to walk point on this
> > issue
> > >> of dismissing U.S. attorneys because she has direct personal
> > experience. In
> > >> any Congressional probe of the matter, we'd suggest she call herself 
>as
> > the
> > >> first witness--and bring along Webster Hubbell as her chief counsel.
> > >>
> > >> As everyone once knew but has tried to forget, Mr. Hubbell was a 
>former
> > >> partner of Mrs. Clinton at the Rose Law Firm in Little Rock who later
> > went
> > >> to jail for mail fraud and tax evasion. He was also Bill and Hillary
> > >> Clinton's choice as Associate Attorney General in the Justice
> > Department
> > >> when Janet Reno, his nominal superior, simultaneously fired all 93 
>U.S.
> > >> Attorneys in March 1993. Ms. Reno--or Mr. Hubbell--gave them 10 days 
>to
> > >> move
> > >> out of their offices.
> > >>
> > >> At the time, President Clinton presented the move as something
> > perfectly
> > >> ordinary: "All those people are routinely replaced," he told 
>reporters,
> > >> "and
> > >> I have not done anything differently." In fact, the dismissals were
> > >> unprecedented: Previous Presidents, including Ronald Reagan and Jimmy
> > >> Carter, had both retained holdovers from the previous Administration
> > and
> > >> only replaced them gradually as their tenures expired. This allowed
> > >> continuity of leadership within the U.S. Attorney offices during the
> > >> transition.
> > >>
> > >> Equally extraordinary were the politics at play in the firings. At 
>the
> > >> time,
> > >> Jay Stephens, then U.S. Attorney in the District of Columbia, was
> > >> investigating then Ways and Means Chairman Dan Rostenkowski, and was
> > >> "within
> > >> 30 days" of making a decision on an indictment. Mr. Rostenkowski, who
> > was
> > >> shepherding the Clinton's economic program through Congress, 
>eventually
> > >> went
> > >> to jail on mail fraud charges and was later pardoned by Mr. Clinton.
> > >>
> > >> Also at the time, allegations concerning some of the Clintons'
> > Whitewater
> > >> dealings were coming to a head. By dismissing all 93 U.S. Attorneys 
>at
> > >> once,
> > >> the Clintons conveniently cleared the decks to appoint "Friend of 
>Bill"
> > >> Paula Casey as the U.S. Attorney for Little Rock. Ms. Casey never did
> > bring
> > >> any big Whitewater indictments, and she rejected information from
> > another
> > >> FOB, David Hale, on the business practices of the Arkansas elite
> > including
> > >> Mr. Clinton. When it comes to "politicizing" Justice, in short, the
> > Bush
> > >> White House is full of amateurs compared to the Clintons.
> > >>
> > >>  And it may be this very amateurism that explains how the current
> > >> Administration has managed to turn this routine issue of replacing
> > >> Presidential appointees into a political fiasco. There was nothing
> > wrong
> > >> with replacing the eight Attorneys, all of whom serve at the
> > President's
> > >> pleasure. Prosecutors deserve supervision like any other executive
> > branch
> > >> appointees.
> > >>
> > >> The supposed scandal this week is that Mr. Bush had been informed 
>last
> > fall
> > >> that some U.S. Attorneys had been less than vigorous in pursuing
> > >> voter-fraud
> > >> cases and that the President had made the point to Attorney General
> > Alberto
> > >> Gonzales. Voter fraud strikes at the heart of democratic 
>institutions,
> > and
> > >> it was entirely appropriate for Mr. Bush--or any President--to insist
> > that
> > >> his appointees act energetically against it.
> > >>
> > >> Take sacked U.S. Attorney John McKay from Washington state. In 2004,
> > the
> > >> Governor's race was decided in favor of Democrat Christine Gregoire 
>by
> > 129
> > >> votes on a third recount. As the Seattle Post-Intelligencer and other
> > media
> > >> outlets reported, some of the "voters" were deceased, others were
> > >> registered
> > >> in storage-rental facilities, and still others were convicted felons.
> > More
> > >> than 100 ballots were "discovered" in a Seattle warehouse. None of 
>this
> > >> constitutes proof that the election was stolen. But it should have 
>been
> > >> enough to prompt Mr. McKay, a Democrat, to investigate, something he
> > >> declined to do, apparently on grounds that he had better things to 
>do.
> > >>
> > >> In New Mexico, another state in which recent elections have been
> > decided by
> > >> razor thin margins, U.S. Attorney David Iglesias did establish a 
>voter
> > >> fraud
> > >> task force in 2004. But it lasted all of 10 weeks before closing its
> > doors,
> > >> despite evidence of irregularities by the likes of the Association of
> > >> Community Organizations for Reform Now, or Acorn. As our John Fund
> > reported
> > >> at the time, Acorn's director Matt Henderson refused to answer
> > questions in
> > >> court about whether his group had illegally made copies of voter
> > >> registration cards in the run-up to the 2004 election.
> > >>
> > >>  As for some of the other fired Attorneys, at least one of their
> > >> dismissals
> > >> seemed to owe to differences with the Administration about the death
> > >> penalty, another to questions about the Attorney's managerial skills.
> > Not
> > >> surprisingly, the dismissed Attorneys are insisting their dismissals
> > were
> > >> unfair, and perhaps in some cases they were. It would not be the 
>first
> > time
> > >> in history that a dismissed employee did not take kindly to his 
>firing,
> > nor
> > >> would it be the first in which an employer sacked the wrong person. 
>No
> > >> question, the Justice Department and White House have botched the
> > handling
> > >> of this issue from start to finish. But what we don't have here is 
>any
> > >> serious evidence that the Administration has acted improperly or to
> > protect
> > >> some of its friends. If Democrats want to understand what a real 
>abuse
> > of
> > >> power looks like, they can always ask the junior Senator from New 
>York.
> > >>
> > >> On 4/4/07, TN Rhodey <tnrhodey at hotmail.com> wrote:
> > >>
> > >>> Brad,
> > >>>
> > >>> Of course the AGs serve at the President's descrection however I 
>think
> > >>>
> > >> you
> > >>
> > >>> might be wrong about the firings/replacement starting with Clinton. 
>I
> > >>> thought the AG firings started at least as far back as Reagan and 
>was
> > >>>
> > >> then
> > >>
> > >>> followed by Bush and Clinton. I thought W's issues have more to do
> > with
> > >>> the
> > >>> timing....if he would of done this in the first year or so it would
> > have
> > >>> merely followed precedent ...by waiting he left the door open to
> > >>> criticism.
> > >>>
> > >>> Wally
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>>> From: "Brad Haslett" <flybrad at gmail.com>
> > >>>> Reply-To: The Rhodes 22 mail list <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
> > >>>> To: "The Rhodes 22 mail list" <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
> > >>>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Speaking of politicians.
> > >>>> Date: Wed, 4 Apr 2007 08:26:04 -0600
> > >>>>
> > >>>> Wally,
> > >>>>
> > >>>> AG's serve at the President's discretion.  Clinton wholesale
> > replacing
> > >>>>
> > >>> ALL
> > >>>
> > >>>> of them at once was a first. The press at the time barely mentioned
> > it.
> > >>>> Bush
> > >>>> replaced 8 out of almost 100.  Big deal.  This is a huge non-story
> > that
> > >>>> ranks right up there with the one about whats-her-name dying, you
> > know
> > >>>>
> > >>> the
> > >>>
> > >>>> one, that blonde chick with the big hooters.
> > >>>>
> > >>>> I've been tied down with airplane hangar issues and taxes but plan 
>to
> > >>>>
> > >> get
> > >>
> > >>>> on
> > >>>> the lake soon.  I haven't bothered to look and see if the front 
>that
> > >>>>
> > >>> passed
> > >>>
> > >>>> here last night has made it past you, but it is chilly this 
>morning.
> > >>>>
> > >> At
> > >>
> > >>>> least there's some wind.
> > >>>>
> > >>>> Brad
> > >>>>
> > >>>> On 4/4/07, TN Rhodey <tnrhodey at hotmail.com> wrote:
> > >>>>
> > >>>>> The sailing here has been great the last few days!!!  I have been
> > >>>>>
> > >>> trying
> > >>>
> > >>>>> NOT
> > >>>>> to follow the AG firings but doesn't every President do the same
> > >>>>>
> > >> thing
> > >>
> > >>>>> Clinton did? I thought this was pretty standard when a new pres 
>came
> > >>>>> in.....this may be a matter of bad timing? Wally
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>>> From: "Brad Haslett" <flybrad at gmail.com>
> > >>>>>> Reply-To: The Rhodes 22 mail list <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
> > >>>>>> To: "The Rhodes 22 mail list" <rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org>
> > >>>>>> Subject: Re: [Rhodes22-list] Speaking of politicians.
> > >>>>>> Date: Wed, 4 Apr 2007 07:29:24 -0600
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>> Rummy,
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>> Speaking of amnesia, last Sunday we had George Stephanopoulos on
> > >>>>>>
> > >> his
> > >>
> > >>>> ABC
> > >>>>
> > >>>>>> news show discussing the firing of eight Attorney Generals, a
> > >>>>>>
> > >>> non-event
> > >>>
> > >>>>> if
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>>> there ever was one, and little Georgie keeps a straight face
> > >>>>>>
> > >> through
> > >>
> > >>>> the
> > >>>>
> > >>>>>> whole thing.  What a fine piece of acting.  Did George share his
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>> experience
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>>> as spokesperson for the Clinton administration explaining the
> > >>>>>>
> > >> firing
> > >>
> > >>> of
> > >>>
> > >>>>>> all,
> > >>>>>> every single friggin' AG in the US, including the one in Little
> > >>>>>>
> > >> Rock
> > >>
> > >>>>>> investigating Whitewater?  No, he continued on, sure that most of
> > >>>>>>
> > >> the
> > >>
> > >>>>>> country is too stupid to know or care. He was right. Want to know
> > >>>>>>
> > >> how
> > >>
> > >>>>> much
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>>> press coverage that got when it happened?  About 20 seconds on 
>one
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>> network.
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>>> Fair and balanced?
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>> Brad
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>> On 4/4/07, R22RumRunner at aol.com <R22RumRunner at aol.com> wrote:
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>> Breaking News
> > >>>>>>> Scientists Study Memory Loss Among Politicians
> > >>>>>>> Near-amnesia Reaching Epidemic Proportions, Experts  Say
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>> An "unprecedented epidemic of memory loss" is
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>> afflicting  America's
> > >>>
> > >>>>>>> politicians, making it virtually impossible for them to
> > >>>>>>>
> > >> remember
> > >>
> > >>>> key
> > >>>>
> > >>>>>>> phone
> > >>>>>>> conversations, meetings, and memos, a spokesman  for the world's
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>> leading
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>>>> brain
> > >>>>>>> scientists said today.
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>> The  spokesman, Dr. Hiroshi Kyosuke of the University of Tokyo,
> > >>>>>>>
> > >> is
> > >>
> > >>>> one
> > >>>>
> > >>>>>> of
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>>> over four hundred eminent brain scientists who have gathered in
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>> Oslo,
> > >>>>
> > >>>>>>> Norway
> > >>>>>>> this week for a high-level research conference to probe  the
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>> recent
> > >>>
> > >>>>>>> phenomenon
> > >>>>>>> of memory loss that has plagued the nation's  politicians.
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>> "The question at hand is this: why are  politicians so good at
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>> remembering
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>>> contributors' names and phone  numbers but so bad at remembering
> > >>>>>>> everything else?
> > >>>>>>> " Dr. Kyosuke  said.
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>> Over the course of the conference, brain scientists  have
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>> presented
> > >>>
> > >>>>>>> research
> > >>>>>>> papers on a variety of subjects related to  memory loss, such as
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>> former
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>>>> New
> > >>>>>>> York mayor Rudolph Giuliani's  inability to remember a briefing
> > >>>>>>>
> > >> he
> > >>
> > >>>>>>> received
> > >>>>>>> about former police  commissioner Bernard Kerik's possible ties
> > >>>>>>>
> > >> to
> > >>
> > >>>>>>> organized
> > >>>>>>> crime.
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>> "That seems like the sort of thing that a normal human
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>> brain  would
> > >>>
> > >>>>> have
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>>>> no
> > >>>>>>> difficulty remembering," Dr. Kyosuke said. "What we  are
> > >>>>>>>
> > >> learning
> > >>
> > >>> at
> > >>>
> > >>>>>> this
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>>> conference is that when it comes to  politicians' brains, we
> > >>>>>>>
> > >> have
> > >>
> > >>> so
> > >>>
> > >>>>>> much
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>>> more to
> > >>>>>>> learn."
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>> On  Monday, a full day of the conference was devoted to a paper
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>> entitled,
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>>> "
> > >>>>>>> The Neuroscience of Scooter Libby," followed by a keynote
> > >>>>>>>
> > >> address
> > >>
> > >>>>> given
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>>>> by
> > >>>>>>> Attorney General Alberto Gonzales.
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>> While  many attendees considered Mr. Gonzales' speech a
> > >>>>>>>
> > >> highpoint
> > >>
> > >>> of
> > >>>
> > >>>>> the
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>>>> conference, the Attorney General offered a different assessment:
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>> "I
> > >>>
> > >>>>>> have
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>>> no
> > >>>>>>> recollection of it."
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>> Elsewhere, President Bush said  he would devote the remainder of
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>> his
> > >>>
> > >>>>>> term
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>>> to
> > >>>>>>> fighting global  warming, adding, "April  Fools!"
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>> ************************************** See what's free at
> > >>>>>>> http://www.aol.com.
> > >>>>>>> __________________________________________________
> > >>>>>>> Use Rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org, Help? www.rhodes22.org/list
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>> __________________________________________________
> > >>>>>> Use Rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org, Help? www.rhodes22.org/list
> > >>>>>>
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> > >>>>>
> > >>>>> __________________________________________________
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> > >>>>>
> > >>>>>
> > >>>> __________________________________________________
> > >>>> Use Rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org, Help? www.rhodes22.org/list
> > >>>>
> > >>> _________________________________________________________________
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> > >>
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> > >>>
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> > >
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