[Rhodes22-list] Michael Meltzer & Herb - Masthead lights (anchor & steaming) - Question and clar
Herb Parsons
hparsons at parsonsys.com
Thu Apr 17 13:29:29 EDT 2008
Yes Michael, it's an official web site. But it's NOT the regs. Take the
test, trust me, they don't ask any questions about what's on the web
site. They ask specific questions about the regulations, and the source
is the printed manual, not their website.
Here's an example: The web site says that "If your power-driven vessel
is less than 65.5 feet/20 meters in length, then it must display
navigation lights per Figure 1." Figure 1 then shows a picture of a
sailboat and a powerboat. The sailboat has a steaming light mounted on
the very top of the mast. That's OK, but that's NOT what the regs say.
What the regs say specifically are:
RULE 23:
POWER-DRIVEN VESSELS UNDERWAY
(a) A power-driven vessel <../pops/def3b_PDV.htm> underway shall
exhibit (picture <../pops/nr_23a.htm>):
1. a masthead light <../pops/def21a_masthead.htm> forward;
2. a second masthead light abaft of and higher than the forward
one; except that a vessel of less than 50 meters
<../pops/nr_23aii.htm> in length shall not be obliged to
exhibit such a light but may do so;
3. sidelights <../pops/def21b_side.htm>: and
4. a sternlight <../pops/def21c_stern.htm>.
But that's not the end of the story, there are the different size
exceptions (which the website you mentioned have included in its recap);
but, you must know the definition of some of these terms. For instance
"masthead light":
=====
Rule 21 - Definitions
1.
"Masthead light" means a white light placed over the fore and aft
centerline of the vessel showing an unbroken light over an arc of
the horizon of 225 degrees and so fixed as to show the light from
right ahead to 22.5 degrees abaft the beam on either side of the
vessel, /except that on a vessel of less than 12 meters in length
the masthead light shall be placed as nearly as practicable to the
fore and aft centerline of the vessel./
=====
(which, by the way, means my memory was wrong, it wasn't 270 degrees, it
was 225, my test was a long time ago). It does NOT have to be on the top
of the mast as pictured, it can be anywhere on the boat, as long as it
fits the above definition.
The picture given in the web site your provided just makes it easier to
understand the jargon of the office regs. It may be an official web
site, but it's NOT the official regs. It's a recap of them.
The office regs can be found here -
http://www.navcen.uscg.gov/mwv/navrules/rotr_online.htm. They're harder
to understand, but much more specific.
Your statement about "some guy on the internet" is the same as mine;
however, the site you gave isn't the "primary", it's better than a guy
on the internet, but it's still not the regs.
Wouldn't I hate it if some bozo took that picture and told me that my
steaming light that's not mounted on the top of the mast is not legal
because the website shows a picture of the masthead light on top of the
mast, and mine is about a few feet down from the top (as are most small
boat masthead lights)?
That's what I meant, it's a recap. Better than advice from me, but still
not the official regs.
Michael D. Weisner wrote:
> Herb,
>
> What exactly do you mean by your comment: "it's still a recap of the
> 'official regs'"? USCGBoating.org is an official CG site (Registrant:US
> Coast Guard, Office of Boating Safety) and it contains the federal and state
> regs. In addition, it contains illustrations that graphically represent the
> regs that have been reviewed by the CG. It is most certainly better than
> "some guy on the internet."
>
> Whenever possible, I appreciate a "primary" information source.
>
> Mike
> s/v Shanghaid'd Summer ('81)
> Nissequogue River, NY
>
> From: "Herb Parsons" <hparsons at parsonsys.com>Sent: Wednesday, April 16, 2008
> 3:31 PM
>
>> Gotcha. However, you DO realize that's not the regs. It's a better
>> source for an interpretation of the regs than "some guy on the
>> internet", but it's still a recap of the "official regs".
>>
>> Michael D. Weisner wrote:
>>
>>> Herb,
>>>
>>> It isn't that you stated anything wrong, it is simply the original USCG
>>> source of the information in a somewhat easier to read and understand
>>> format
>>> (including pictures.)
>>>
>>> Mike
>>> s/v Shanghai'd Summer ('81)
>>> Nissequogue River, NY
>>>
>>> From: "Herb Parsons" <hparsons at parsonsys.com>Sent: Wednesday, April 16,
>>> 2008
>>> 2:12 PM
>>>
>>>
>>>> What part of that did I state incorrectly? Looks like the page (which is
>>>> a recap of the original regs) says different than what I stated?
>>>>
>>>> Michael D. Weisner wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Herb, Bob, etc.,
>>>>>
>>>>> Please read rules on USCG site:
>>>>> http://www.uscgboating.org/SAFETY/fedreqs/equ_nav.htm
>>>>> This page is very easy to read and understand.
>>>>>
>>>>> Mike
>>>>> s/v Shanghai'd Summer ('81)
>>>>> Nissequogue River, NY
>>>>>
>>>>> From: "Herb Parsons" <hparsons at parsonsys.com>Sent: Tuesday, April 15,
>>>>> 2008
>>>>> 10:41 PM
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> Sorry Bob, but I think you mis-read the regs.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> A sailboat under power is a powerboat.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> A powerboat between 12 meters and 20 meters has to display a separate
>>>>>> stern light (90 degrees, 45 degrees each direction) and steaming light
>>>>>> (270 degrees, 135 each direction)
>>>>>>
>>>>>> A sailboat between 7 meters and 20 meters can use a single 360 degree
>>>>>> light as a combination steaming/stern light.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> A sailboat under 7 meters (the Rhodes 22 fits that) can use a
>>>>>> flashlight
>>>>>> shining on the sail as your steaming light, but how un-cool is THAT?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> However, if it's under power, it's a powerboat. If it's a powerboat,
>>>>>> it
>>>>>> has to have a steaming light.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Bob Keller wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Ed,
>>>>>>> I think the 360 as an anchor light is required but the 360 as a
>>>>>>> steaming
>>>>>>> light is optional/overkill. The R-22 only needs the port, starboard
>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>> stern lights while underway, doesn't need anything on the mast...
>>>>>>> The
>>>>>>> CG
>>>>>>> link confirmed that. Of course, the rules might be different on Lake
>>>>>>> Hartwell since even Y-valves are not allowed there.
>>>>>>> Bob K
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Date: Sun, 13 Apr 2008 04:38:02 -0700> From: ekroposki at charter.net>
>>>>>>>> To:
>>>>>>>> rhodes22-list at rhodes22.org> Subject: [Rhodes22-list] Michael Meltzer
>>>>>>>> &
>>>>>>>> Herb - Masthead lights (anchor & steaming) - Question and
>>>>>>>> clarification>
>>>>>>>> > > Bob Keller and Dana...> > Michael Meltzer is our resident
>>>>>>>> expert
>>>>>>>> on
>>>>>>>> what is legal regarding lights. > So 'USCG Captain' Meltzer what are
>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>> correct answers to Bob and Dana's> questions?> > This much I know,
>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>> lighting pattern is different for different length> boats. Why? so
>>>>>>>> knowledgeable 'Captains' can tell what kind of boat it is. > Herb,
>>>>>>>> isn't
>>>>>>>> that a question for the 'Captain's' exam.> > As to Anchor light
>>>>>>>> being
>>>>>>>> visible on a 22 foot boat for 360 degrees, I do not> think that it
>>>>>>>> has
>>>>>>>> to be a single light. On the R22 there is a light on the> 'stern'
>>>>>>>> when
>>>>>>>> added to the light up the mast, together they qualify as 360>
>>>>>>>> degrees
>>>>>>>> of
>>>>>>>> white light. Is that how the R22 is legal? I suspect that Stan> just
>>>>>>>> might know what qualifies as legal lights.> > Now Bob K. has
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>> t
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> o find out if his 360 degrees of masthead light on a 22 foot> boat
>>>>>>> screws up the Coast Guard's intent in lighting( I already know the>
>>>>>>> correct answer, but does he?). The Coast Guard does publish a small
>>>>>>> booklet> on lighting, just do not know where my copy is quickly.
>>>>>>> Also,
>>>>>>> I
>>>>>>> believe> these questions are answered in 'Chapman's'. When I find my
>>>>>>> copies, I will> seek yea answers. This is comes up every so often on
>>>>>>> this
>>>>>>> forum so the> answers are probably in the archives. > > Ed K>
>>>>>>> Greenville,
>>>>>>> SC, USA> attachment for Slim:> >
>>>>>>> http://www.nabble.com/file/p16656988/approve.gif approve.gif > > > >
>>>>>>> Hi
>>>>>>> there, I bought an 87 R22 last year and absolutely love it. I'm>
>>>>>>> currently working on getting it ready for the season. The mast is
>>>>>>> wired
>>>>>>> for> an anchor light, but whatever was there must have busted off
>>>>>>> before
>>>>>>> I got> the boat. There is also a light fixture facing forward about a
>>>>>>> foot from> the top of the mast, but it wasn't working last year
>>>>>>> either.>
>>>>>>> > I have two questions:> > 1. The an
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> ch
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> or light and steaming are separate lights, right? My> understanding
>>>>>>> is
>>>>>>> that an anchor light has to be visible from all directions,> and the
>>>>>>> steaming light is the light facing forward that must be on when>
>>>>>>> motoring.> > 2. Any recommendations on new lighting? Is there a
>>>>>>> combined
>>>>>>> LED light that> will serve both purposes?> > Thanks,> Dana> > > >
>>>>>>> http://www.nabble.com/file/p16656988/approve.gif approve.gif > -- >
>>>>>>> View
>>>>>>> this message in context:
>>>>>>> http://www.nabble.com/Masthead-lights-%28anchor---steaming%29-tp16655218p16656988.html>
>>>>>>> Sent from the Rhodes 22 mailing list archive at Nabble.com.> >
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>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
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